Posted 12-22-00
Thank you Marilyn for three years of blessed insights through your books and web sites. Many fires have been lit in the hearts of people around the world regarding the raptures and the fine tuning you give to these last days before He catches us away. More and more has been revealed since Hal Lindsey's "Late Great Planet Earth" and you have put things into perspective more than any other in the time that I have been reading your life's work. No one has put forth so much information with so much love and grace as you. Your encouragement has been a true blessing to many true believers and both the unsaved and newly saved a well.
One question still perplexes me. That is in regards to the 144,000 of the tribes of Israel. When do they come on the scene? What is their purpose on earth? How long are they here? And are they the only ones in the pre-wrath rapture that becomes part of the Bride? Also are they then separated into those who worship God day and night in His temple? Is this an earthly or heavenly temple? And do you see both 144K groups mentioned in Revelation as the same group?
Again thank you and Ed and your family. And happy birthday. The most exciting days are yet to come. Can you stand much more excitement? Stay true to the Word of God as you receive it. We all pray for your health and welfare. God is working a mighty thing through you. It is such a blessing to read your P/Cs which are so full of our Great Hope.
I still have a strong vision in my memory of that hole in the clouds that I saw on May 29, 1998. I hope to see it again soon with all the raptured believers floating up as Jesus did when he was received into the clouds. Great blessings to you
I'm so thankful. No wonder the elders, our Representatives, "cast their crowns before the throne, saying, Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created" (Rev. 4:10,11). I'm so glad that "The LORD taketh pleasure in them that fear him, in those that hope in his mercy" (Psa. 147:11). "For the LORD taketh pleasure in his people: he will beautify the meek with salvation" (Psa. 149:4). "Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure" (Isa. 46:10). Through his pleasure, we pleasure. We are so lucky to have a good God that we should do everything we can to be the sheep of his pasture, his little flock.
I don't know how Y'shua/Jesus managed to get through all he had to do for our sakes. "Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand" (Isa. 53:10). Thank you LORD. Thank you that Eze. 18:32 is true: "I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye."
The 144,000. Rev. 7:4 says, "I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel." People often say that these are sealed at the beginning of the Tribulation and assume that they witness for the Lord throughout that whole time. I'm not sure that is entirely true. Maybe some do from the beginning and others come into the fold later on. The sealing seems to be at the end, at the time of the Pre-Wrath Rapture and just before the catastrophe hits Earth on the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord.
That first day of the Millennium seems to be called the Day of God. II Peter 3:12 says, "Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the DAY OF GOD, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?" Rev. 16:14 says, "For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great DAY OF GOD ALMIGHTY." The united nations' army led by Gog attacks Israel on the last day of this age and the battle continues into the 1st day of the Millennium--until the asteroids impact Earth at noon (Zeph. 2:4,5).
Eze. 7:5-8 says, "Thus saith the Lord GOD; An evil, AN ONLY EVIL, behold, is come. An end is come, THE END IS COME: it watcheth for thee; behold, it is come. The morning is come unto thee, O thou that dwellest in the land: the time is come, THE DAY OF TROUBLE IS NEAR (this is the last day of this age; the next day is the 1st of the Millennium), and not the sounding again of the mountains (nations). Now will I shortly (at noon on the Feast of Trumpets) pour out MY FURY upon thee, and accomplish MINE ANGER upon thee: and I will judge thee (at the Judgment Seat of Christ) according to thy ways, and will recompense thee for all thine abominations." The time is the end of this age. The Day of God's Wrath starts at 6 PM.
Eze. 8 shows why this will happen. Verses 17 and 18 say, "Is it a light thing to the house of Judah that they commit the abominations which they commit here? for they have filled the land with violence, and have returned (to the land of Israel) to provoke me to anger: and, lo, they put the branch to their nose. Therefore will I also deal in FURY."
Then Eze. 9 tells us about the "mark" (or seal). It says, "He cried also in mine ears with a loud voice, saying, Cause them that have charge over the city to draw near, even every man with his DESTROYING WEAPON in his hand. And, behold, six men came from the way of the higher gate, which lieth toward the north, and every man a SLAUGHTER WEAPON in his hand; and one man among them was clothed with linen, with a writer's inkhorn by his side: and they went in, and stood beside the brasen altar. And the glory of the God of Israel was gone up from the cherub, whereupon he was, to the threshold of the house. And he called to the man clothed with linen, which had the writer's inkhorn by his side; And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and SET A MARK upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done in the midst thereof. And to the others he said in mine hearing, GO YE AFTER HIM through the city, AND SMITE: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity: Slay utterly old and young...but come not near any man upon whom is the MARK; and begin at my sanctuary."
This leads me to think that some of the marked, or sealed, ones may have come into the fold later than the first day of the Tribulation. How do we know that they preached, either? I don't think we are told that directly. What we can be sure of is that this same 144,000 are included in the firstfruits and are without fault before the throne of God in Heaven before the Wrath of God hits Earth. Rev. 14:1-5 says, "I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion (the heavenly one), and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: And they sung as it were a NEW SONG (as at the 1st Rapture) before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and NO MAN could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand (the Gentiles had their chance for Bridehood at the Pre-Trib Rapture; Israel at the Pre-Wrath Rapture), which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women (symbol of false religions, i.e., the world church); for they are VIRGINS. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These WERE REDEEMED (at the Pre-Wrath Rapture) from among men, being the FIRSTFRUITS unto God and to the Lamb. And in their mouth was found NO GUILE: for they are WITHOUT FAULT before the throne of God."
> > When do they come on the scene? What is their purpose on earth?
I don't know when some of them come on the scene. They may come at different times during the Tribulation. Their purpose is to ensure that Israel also becomes part of the Bride of Christ. She was espoused at Sinai. Jer. 2:2 says, "Go and cry in the ears of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; I remember thee, the kindness of thy youth, the love of thine espousals, when thou wentest after me in the wilderness, in a land that was not sown." Nu. 25:3 says, "Israel joined himself unto Baalpeor: and the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel." Yet, the Lord did not forget Israel. The faithful will make it, just as the faithful Gentiles will. Abraham was born a Gentile. There is no discrimination. All faithful will be rewarded with what they deserve.
> > How long are they here? And are they the only ones in the pre-wrath rapture that becomes part of the Bride?
How long? probably the whole Tribulation. I do think the 144,000 are added to the Bride group, but the rest of the great multitude caught up out of the Great Tribulation seem to just be members of the Body of Christ. However, the Lord is fair, and every single person will get exactly what they deserve. We may not be given the whole picture, but part of it. Far be it from me to say that all others are shut out of the Bride group, but what I can say with certainty is that there will be 144,000 Israelites counted as virgins. They must be wise virgins, because they will stand without fault before the throne of God. That shows us that we should also be able to stand there without fault. Since we also need to be counted as without fault, it shows us how important I Jn. 1:9 is. We need to bring all sins under the blood of Christ.
We can learn that lesson the easy way now, or the hard way during the Tribulation, but we will learn. Our Father shows us the way that we should go. Rev. 7:14 says, "These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." The Philadelphians are not told to repent (i.e., change their mind, turn around), they already have. We want to be Philadelphians with a right standing with God.
> > Also are they then separated into those who worship God day and night in His temple? Is this an earthly or heavenly temple? And do you see both 144K groups mentioned in Revelation as the same group?
The temple is the heavenly one, and the Tribulation saints are "before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple" (Rev. 7:15). Contrast this with Rev. 5:10. Those of the 1st Rapture say that he "hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on (epi, over) the earth."
I know that we will come to Earth with Christ (Rev. 19:14) and do his bidding in setting up the Millennial government. However, I don't think we will stay on Earth for 1000 years, as some think. Jn. 14:3 says, "if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also."
David will be put back on the throne. He will be a prince under Christ the King of kings and Lord of lords. Jer. 30:9 says, "they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them." Amos 9:11 says, "In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old." Eze. 34:23,24 says, "And I will set up ONE SHEPHERD over them, and he shall feed them, even my servant David; he shall feed them, and he shall be their shepherd. And I the LORD will be their God, and my servant David a prince among them; I the LORD have spoken it."
Doesn't that sound like we go back to Heaven? I can't see that we would be here 1000 years when we are promised Heaven for our home. Mt. 6:19,20 says, "Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal. But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal."
Rev. 21:1,2 seems to show us how our reigning with Christ will be accomplished. It says. "I saw a new heaven (refreshed atmosphere) and a new earth (refreshed land): for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea (wicked, for 'the wicked are like the troubled sea,' Isa. 57:20). And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." It looks like we will be able to travel back and forth from this home to our work on Earth during the Millennium.
Happy holidays to all, but amid the festivities, we who are close to him do remember Christ, "In whom are hid ALL the treasures of wisdom and knowledge" (Col. 2:3). We would be lost without him. Blessings and agape
Then 1) Year 2001 has to be the year for the beginning of 70th week.
2) Year 2001 has to be year of catching away of the bride of Christ.
3) Year 2001 has to year that Antichrist is revealed.
4) Year 2001 has to be the year of The Great Event that makes a place/need for the Antichrist.(Maybe Year 2000, not much of it left)
5) Year 2001 has to be the year of the signing of agreement Antichrist/Israel.
I believe this is what you are saying? I believe this to be true also. We should start seeing something soon. Thanks for your site
I was listening to Hank Hannagraf the other night and he, in the course of discussing the subject, let fly with a zinger. To wit, he stated that the Gospel in the Stars violated the principle of Sola Scriptura.
Would you comment on this, please? You and Ed are always in my prayers. God bless
Thuban, Alpha Draconis, was the Pole Star about 4500 years ago. Now, through precession, wobbling of the Earth's axis, Polaris has become the Pole Star. Cepheus, the great King, has his right foot on Polaris, showing that he is about to take dominion away from Draco, i.e., Satan the dragon.
The picture book was never taken away. It helps us understand Scripture if we stay away from the forbidden Satanic perversions in Astrology. In Gen. 1:16, we find "he made the stars also." Psa. 147:4 says, "He telleth the number of the stars; he calleth them all by their names." Lu. 21:25 says, "there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars (lit., constellations); and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring" Verse 28 says, "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." Like the wise men, we are to watch for these signs to know when the Rapture is drawing near.
I have so much pain in my upper R back and R arm that I am typing this in short stages. I appreciate your prayers. Agape
Here is the way I see it. The prophecies in this section of Isaiah blend both the past Assyrian invasion with the future united nation's invasion (Eze. 38) ordered by the False Prophet headquartered in Babylon. It is the double reference that we see in many prophecies. What has taken place in the past is a type of what will take place in the future. It is like looking at a map where one section is enlarged. One can describe what he sees in the near view or the far view.
The prophecies of Isa. 8 start with the Assyrian invasion of the past. Before the child, Maher-shlal-hash-baz (haste ye, haste ye to the spoil) "shall have knowledge to cry, My father, and my mother, the riches of Damascus and the spoil of Samaria shall be taken away before the king of Assyria" (Isa. 8:4). Verse 9 says, "Associate yourselves, O ye people, and ye shall be broken in pieces." That applies to the past and then the verse blends the past and looks to the future. Isa. 8:9b-13 says, "AND GIVE EAR, ALL YE OF FAR COUNTRIES: gird yourselves, and ye shall be broken in pieces; gird yourselves, and ye shall be broken in pieces. Take counsel together, and it shall come to nought; speak the word, and it shall not stand: for God is with us. For the LORD spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me that I should not walk in the way of this people, saying, Say ye not, A confederacy, to all them to whom this people shall say, A confederacy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be afraid. Sanctify the LORD of hosts himself; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread." This should be Israel's stance today, but sadly, it is not.
Isa. 9:13-15 concerns the 2300th day of the Tribulation. It says, "the people turneth not unto him that smiteth them, neither do they seek the LORD of hosts. Therefore the LORD will cut off from Israel head and tail, branch and rush, in one day (1st day of the millennial Day of the Lord). The ancient and honourable (the Beast, the Tribulation Pope), he is the head (of the great red dragon); and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail" (of the great red dragon).
The "wrath of the LORD of hosts" (Christ, Isa. 44:6) is mentioned in 9:19. Isa. 10:3 starts out with "Woe." That takes us to the end, and still applies to the past. Then verse 3 says, "what will ye do in the day of visitation, and in the desolation which shall come from far (i.e., the heavens)?" This is talking about the asteroid impacts of Rev. 8:8,10.
Verse 5 mentions the Assyrian. Verse 6 says, "I will send him against an hypocritical nation (referring to Israel of the past), AND (referring to Israel of the future) against the people of MY WRATH will I give him a charge, to take the spoil, and to take the prey." This reminds us of Gog's army and Eze. 38:13: "Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey?"
Then, after speaking some more about the past, Isa. 10:12 jumps to the future. It says, "Wherefore it shall come to pass, that when the Lord hath performed his WHOLE WORK upon mount Zion and on Jerusalem, I will punish the fruit of the stout heart of the king of Assyria (i.e., the False Prophet headquartered in Babylon), and the glory of his high looks."
Why? Isa. 10:13,14 answers, "For he saith, By the strength of my hand I have done it, and by my wisdom; for I am prudent: and I have removed the bounds of the people, and have robbed their treasures, and I have put down the inhabitants like a valiant man: And my hand hath found as a nest the riches of the people (he takes the bank accounts of those who will not take the Mark of the Beast): and as one gathereth eggs that are left, have I GATHERED ALL THE EARTH (he is head of the OWG, or UN); and there was none that moved the wing, or opened the mouth, or peeped."
Isa. 10:16-20 concerns the 1st day of the millennial Day of the Lord: "Therefore shall the Lord, the Lord of hosts (Christ, Isa. 44:6), send among his fat ones leanness; and under his glory (i.e., lower in space than the rings of Saturn, Eze. 1:28, which are above the 4 terrestrial planets, Eze. 10:19) he shall kindle a burning like the burning of a fire (this is the asteroid, a broken shard of Satan's planet Rahab). And the light of Israel shall be for a fire, and his Holy One for a flame: and it (the asteroid) shall burn and devour his thorns and his briers in one day; And shall consume the glory of his forest, and of his fruitful field, both soul and body: and they shall be as when a standard-bearer fainteth. And the rest of the trees (i.e., men) of his forest shall be few, that a child may write them. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, in truth." This is when Israel will be saved in a day (Isa. 66:8).
Isa. 10:26 says, "the LORD of hosts shall stir up a scourge for him according to the slaughter of Midian at the rock of Oreb." Ju. 7:20 says, "the three companies (300 men) blew the trumpets, and brake the pitchers (probably made of clay), and held the lamps in their left hands, and the trumpets in their right hands to blow withal: and they cried, The sword of the LORD, and of Gideon." This portrays the breaking of the asteroid that is called "The sword of the LORD." It will impact Earth on the Feast of Trumpets. Verse 21 says, "And they stood every man in his place round about the camp; and all the host ran, and cried, and fled." In the latter days, they will hide "in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And...(say) to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?" (Rev. 6:15-17). Agape
Phil thinks the Rapture will not happen on a Jewish Feast, but might on Hanukkah, as if Hanukkah was a Gentile celebration. :-)
I think the Rapture will be on a Jewish feast, Pentecost. To me, Song of Solomon 2:10-14 makes winter and the times of the former and latter rains (Tishri and Nisan) unlikely. It makes the time of green figs and firstripe grapes likely. If the Rapture is not to come in either Tishri (month of the latter rain) or Nisan (month of the former rain), that eliminates 6 feasts. Only Pentecost, on Sivan 6,7 is left, and it just happens to be the time of green figs and the firstripe grapes.
Pentecost is the feast of harvest. It is the beginning of wheat harvest. Ex. 23:15-17 speaks of 3 feasts. It says,
(1) "Thou shalt keep the feast of unleavened bread: (thou shalt eat unleavened bread seven days, as I commanded thee, in the time appointed of the month Abib (Nisan); for in it thou camest out from Egypt:
(2) and none shall APPEAR BEFORE ME (i.e., at the Rapture) EMPTY (i.e., of the Holy Spirit):) And the FEAST OF HARVEST, the FIRSTFRUITS of thy labours, which thou hast sown in the field (world):
(3) and the feast of ingathering, which is in the end of the year, when thou HAST gathered (in the past) in thy labours out of the field. Three times in the year all thy males shall appear before the LORD God."
Lately, I discovered a clue that the Rapture is likely to fall on a feast. Heb. 12:23 says that we are gathered, "To the GENERAL ASSEMBLY and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect." "GENERAL ASSEMBLY" is panegurei, a festal assembly (Thayer). It is translated as such in these versions: NAB, Berkeley, RSV and Phillips.
Phil wrote:
> > Hosea is saying that in the "Latter days", God will return the children of Israel, seeking the Messiah their King. Along with seeking of the Messiah-King, will be their seeking the image (Temple) and the restoration of sacrifice and the priesthood!
> > In Hosea 6:1+2, he gives the length of time that the "many days" are referring to.
> > (Hosea 6:1 KJV) "Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up."6:2 KJV) "After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.")
In verse one, is the reference of Israel's "return" to the Lord. But in verse 2, it is given that of 2 day's! Remember that this was prophesied before the Assyrian- Babylonian captivity began.
Furthermore, it is indirectly referred to as being in the "Days"! This is obviously referring to the time that we are now living. For receiving God has revived Israel. Now with the two days cannot be referring to 2-24 holidays. Since the Temple and the sacrifice was disposed of, for longer than that. The Temple was rebuilt under Nehemiah and others. So the "Many days" and the "Two days" are referring to 2 thousand years (Psalms 90:4 & 2nd Peter 3:8)
> > How long then, has Israel been without a Temple and sacrifice? From the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. Up to now, it has been 1930 years. But that is not all of the "Time" that Israel has been without a temple. Add to the 1930 years, the 70 years of the Babylonian captivity, and we have exactly two days or two thousand years (1930+70= 2000).
This adding up to 2000 is interesting. If I ever heard this, I forgot it. If "After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up" applies to us, we could think the Rapture would be "After" the 2000 years. It primarily applies to Israel, who was raised up in the 3rd millennium after being taken captive, but might have a double reference. Pentecost, 2001 will be AFTER the 2000 years.
In Hos. 5:15, Christ is talking. He says, "I will go and return to my place, till they (the Jews) acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction (the day of Jacob's trouble, the Day of God's Wrath) they will seek me early." The nation will be saved in a day, that day (Isa. 66:8).
Then Israel speaks. Hos. 6:1-3 says, "Come, and let us (the Jews) return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up. After two days (2000 years) will he revive us: in the third day (3rd millennium) he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight (fulfilled in 1948). Then (after 1948) shall we KNOW, if we follow on to know the LORD (the Sign of the End of the Age appeared in 1967, and other signs have followed): his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter (rain of Nisan, the Second Advent) and former rain (of Tishri, the First Advent) unto the earth."
The problem is, does it also apply to us? It could, for Hos. 6:10,11 says, "Israel is defiled. Also, O Judah, he hath set an HARVEST for thee, WHEN I RETURNED the captivity of my people" (in 1948). Pentecost is the feast of harvest. If the Rapture is on Pentecost, 2001, that is 53 years since Israel declared her independence. 1948 + 50 = 1998, which I figured was the 6000th year since Adam was cast out of the Garden of Eden. If the 4 years of the parable of the barren fig tree of Lu. 13:6-9 started in 1998, 2001 is the 3rd year. Someone wisely pointed out to me that the Lord only speaks in the 3rd year of that parable. Since he must speak and say, "Come up hither" at the Rapture, the 3rd year is the only year of the 4 that seems likely to be the Rapture.
Maybe this is a clue we should consider. Hosea did say, "Then (after 1948) shall we KNOW, if we follow on to know the LORD." We have followed on. We know the LORD. We have seen the Oslo Accords signed on Sept. 13, 1993. The 7 good years would have ended Sept. 13, 2000. We have seen the Anchor-Cross signs in the heavens. Lu. 21:28 says, "when these things (signs in the Sun, Moon and constellations) begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh." It now looks even more promising for the Rapture to take place on Pentecost, 2001.
Pro and Con 661 Or Return
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Updated 12-22-00