Xotchiltl - 12/08/00 03:21:20
My Email:kid4ever26@aol.com
Color Question:: What determines the coat color of palomino horses?
- 12/24/00 22:57:57
Comments:
Xotchiltl - 12/08/00 03:21:20
My Email:kid4ever26@aol.com
Color Question:: What determines the coat color of palomino horses?
Comments:
Sarah Goodwin - 11/30/00 19:06:35
My Email:iagoat@yahoo.com
Comments:
Thank you so much for this page! I had a color genetics assignment for my Equine Science class, and you really helped explain how certain groups produce certain combos! Thank you for your help.
Carole Sharp - 11/25/00 19:21:53
My Email:cjsharp@marktwain.net
Color Question:: Black roan or Gray?
Comments:
Very much enjoyed your site. But could not get the picture of the blue roan to come up. only mountains and fence. I have a filly that was born solid black, At about 3 months she had white hairs showing up first around coronet now all over. Can you tell
me will she be considered gray or black roan??
Gayle Riggins - 11/23/00 02:52:52
My URL:http://www.alltel.net/~brylin17
My Email:brylin17@alltel.net
Comments:
Read your article on color genetics and found it very interesting. We have been on a discovery process to understand more about the color genetics puzzle because we are starting a foundation to poroduce black and white paint stock.
We are breeding a bay thouroughbred with a black & white QH that is tested homozygous tobiano and homozygous for the black gene (EE). Our goal is to produce B&W. what are the coat color variations that are possible from this union?
Linda Hedges - 10/18/00 14:52:37
My Email:kb0rkw@juno.com
Comments:
Really nice site, some good examples of the difference in colors.
Liz Oldham - 10/17/00 10:36:04
My Email:lizold@aol.com
Color Question:: yes
Comments:
I have a bright(reddy)bay mare (goes lighter in summer sort of bambi brown) who is by a dappled mahogany bay out of a chestnut. Last year I put her to a grey(pinky)roan and got her same colour- this year I want to put her to a palomino - any chance of a d
n there ?
Goody - 10/16/00 16:57:37
My Email:goody2shoesgal@yahoo.com
Color Question:: Do you have any info. on Paint horses in General??
Comments:
For instance, where they originated from, information on their coat, patterns, ect. Please email me!!!
Pam Tiedemann - 10/01/00 03:14:41
My Email:tiedeman@telusplanet.net
Color Question:: Mare-Blue Roan-Stud-Palimino-Filly Red Roan- Does this mean the mares genes are more dominant?
Comments:
I have searched for this answer for two weeks, I am glad to have found your sight.
Michelle - 09/18/00 06:42:14
My URL:http://fjorab.tripod.com
My Email:fjorab@hotmail.com
Color Question:: None...I love bay & black dilutes!!
Comments:
Wow...awesome page!! I hope to someday come about my own page about color genetics, but you have soundly beat me to a nice one! I have "names" for colors myself, but I agree with you on most of them. My big turnoff is people saying buckskins are all du
s. Oh well...I like duns, but I like "cremed bays" better. And I would love to see more research done on brindles. Keep up the good work! --Michelle
Cherie - 08/15/00 21:27:11
My Email:grullotobi@yahoo.com
Color Question:: Apollogies...
Comments:
I am sorry you mare died, that is always a hard thing to have happen. Very true I have been missing in action for a while, my personal life has been disrupted and I won't bore you all with the details.
I will respond to every one here, and then close this down and redirect everyone to the www.nhdid.com/forums board where I check in ALOT, if you post there, you will be answered, and not nessasarily by me, there are a bunch of good people there.
Thanks for the wakeup.
Cherie
Billie - 08/14/00 21:58:11
My Email:bcallendar@hotmail.com
Color Question:: Too Late Now!
Comments:
Did you die or what? My mare died while I was waiting for your answer to a breeding question! My color question to you is on your list, and was dated in March. You haven't answered any of the questions sent you since your February 4th reply!
Oh, well; too late now. The color of the anticipated foal is a moot point now.
Your sister - 08/13/00 17:42:34
My Email:Nwasson@ukans.edu
Color Question:: What color are you?
Comments:
Just testing your web site for you. The angel fire site is very good!!
Jess - 08/01/00 13:27:24
My URL:http://www.horsedesigns.com/users/saltcreek
My Email:saltcreekqh@hotmail.com
Comments:
I won't bore you with all my color questions! LOL! One of these days I will have the time to sit down and figure it all out. We may create a new color for you, we just picked up a 100% foundation grullo mare, should be interesting crossed onto the roan
! Just wanted to let you know that your link is now up on my page...and the link to mine is the old site, so you may want to change that when you get time. Great site!
Nuria - 07/25/00 14:49:23
My Email:nlucas@grasshoppernet.com
Color Question:: I have a 10 wk old black QH filly (both parents black with brown eyes) that has blue-grey eyes. I know any color horse CAN have blue eyes,
but at what age do you know that your colts eye color is done "changing" and will remain that color? I can't find any literature on eye color. Have you come across any information or do you know the answer to this? Thanks!
Comments:
Love your site....I've got a 2 yr old black & white TOB filly out of Easy Bucks, so I like to see the pics of her relatives on your farm!
Rita - 07/23/00 23:40:52
My Email:Jsab4000@AOL.com
Color Question:: I have been told that the only way you can get a homozygous foal off a homozygous stallion was to breed your stallion with a tobiano. Is this so? If I were
to keep a non-homozygous filly off a homozygous stallion and eventually breed her to an unrelated homozygous stallion, would this result in the "death gene"? How far can you go with the homozygous genes? Also, if my homozygous stallion is overo, will a
l his offspring be overo?
Comments:
Misty - 07/19/00 22:50:40
My Email:misty_valley@joymail.com
Color Question:: I want to get a Quarter Horse fily for breeding, I mainly want one that can have color (palomino, buckskin, dun...) what color would be best
o get these colors?
Comments:
You site is very imformative! I just would like it if oyu had a page saying what is the most likely outcome of different colors bred together... I'm gettting into breeding for color but i have little knowledge on this certian equine subject. I know that s
me colors are more dominant than others and Sorrel is one of the dominant ones... I think.... But I am looking for a god resource :-)
Edona Miller - 07/17/00 18:01:12
My Email:bewildranch@aol.com
Color Question:: Sabino?
Comments:
I have a gray/white pinto Arab/Quarter gelding. Could this be considered a Sabino? The graying is on his flanks, neck and some on his shoulders. How rare is this? He looks simular to "Cassy".
Thank you for your time to answer my stupid question.
Heather - 06/20/00 20:41:23
My Email:NoWhoa@Hotmail.com
Color Question:: Perlino x Buckskin
Comments:
I have a perlino colt that is out of a Buckskin mare and a Buckskin/Overo colt.( both these buckskins are what I call butterscotch in color and both the sire and dam on each side were bay x Palamino) He has great confirmation and would like to cross him o
a Buckskin mare that I currently and riding. What color cross would this produce? The buckskin mare I want to cross on him is out of a black and a Palamino. She is a butterscotch color also. Perlino to butterscotch buckin. Would I get another buckskin or
perlino?
Heather - 06/16/00 14:26:12
My Email:wolfgirlheather@netscap.net
Color Question:: What color will you get when you bred a black stallion to a sorrel mare and a buckskin mare?
Comments:
Please yelp me find the anwser to my color question.
Cindy Rawlings - 05/17/00 21:34:44
My Email:rawlings@EMAIL.MSN.COM
Color Question:: I have a black and white tobiano mare. What color foal would I get if I breed to a palamino-dun stud?
Comments:
Please let me know A.S.A.P thank you.
Lee - 05/08/00 20:18:39
My Email:paisleydog@aol.com
Color Question:: bay/black/grey and leg markings
Comments:
Hello!! I recently found you site and am still in the process of going through it. I have learned so much already!!! I do have a few questions that I am hoping you can help me with, when you get a chance. First, my close friend has a liver chestnut ar
bian mare. Her father was a grey and her mother was a liver chestnut as well. I am not sure about her grandparents, but there is a lot of bay and grey in her family. She was recently bred to a black stallion who's parents are bay and black. From what
have read, I am assuming that she will either have a bay, chestnut or black baby, but I am totally confused by the grey genetics. Is there a chance that she will throw a grey baby as well??? A grey mare down the street, bred to the same stallion, threw
a black baby. How much of a chance is there that this baby will go grey?? They are saying that because there is no evidence of white in it's coat now, it will stay black, but from what I understand, this is not necessarily the case (actually, as it loos
s it's fuzzy baby coat, it is looking more like a chestnut to me!! LOL!) They are very confused on their beliefs on the way color genetics works, as they bred their bay mare (bay on both sides) to a palomino and were very disappointed when they got a buc
skin. They still insist that the mane and tail could lighten as it gets older! Also, the chestnut mare has a large blaze that extends down over the entire nose, mouth and chin. She has four stockings that extend to her hocks and knees or past. They ar
somewhat erratic, going higher in some places. The egdes are not clean, but spotted (if that makes any sense) and there is a "shadow" where the white hairs extend into the dark around the top edge. I am wondering how strong the chances of her passing w
ite markings on to her offspring are?? The stallion has no markings. I was thinking that this mare might even be showing Sabiano traits? But I am not sure. My friend, who owns the mare (bless her heart) insists that arabians can not have sabiano characte
istics, just because the registry does not recognize them. She also insists that bay horses can not have leg markings. From what I have read, I do not think this is true, but I could always be wrong? Any light you may be able to shed on these thoughts w
uld help greatly!!! Thank you! Lee
Jen Rowe - 04/25/00 19:03:20
My Email:ALEADINGEDGE@AOL.com
Comments:
Thank you for such a great site. I do custom repaints of model horses and it will be an invaluable source of info for me.
Suzette Thibodeau - 04/19/00 18:42:46
My Email:thibodas@gov.ns.ca
Color Question:: Palomino x Grey
Comments:
What color will my foal be if I breed my Palomino QH mare to a Grey TB stallion?
- 04/19/00 12:04:58
Comments:
Beverly - 04/18/00 20:22:57
My Email:OnixStables@webtv.net
Color Question:: Colors from Sorrel/Chestnut mares & black stallion
Comments:
I have several questions.
1. I have a sorrel mare & both of her parents are black. Our stallion is also black & so far they have produced two black foals. Is there a chance I'lll get any other color from these two horses?
2. I have another mare that is chestnut, the foal from er & the above black stallion is black down the middle of his face & back & lighter on the rest of his body. Is there any chance he could shed to a grulla? His dam has 3 palominos up close in her pedi
ree.
3. Why do I get bays when our black stallion is crossed with some sorrel/chestnut mares & black/brown crossed with other sorrel/chestnut mares?
4. How can a horse be black when his sire is chestnut & his dam is red roan & there's no black horses in his pedigree 3 generations back?
rachael - 04/14/00 16:40:37
My Email:lilcwgrl@hotmail.com
Color Question:: red roan
Comments:
i have a red roan overo that is out of a red roan overo and a red dun overo. he doenst have a darker head (its acutally lighter) and his legs arnt darker. he is a very light color and has a dorsal stripe, not a wide one though. is butt is a darker colo
. he almost looks like a rose grey color, but has no grey in his background and is not roaning out anymore than he already is. my question is: what color is he? is he still concidered red roan if his head is lighter than his body?
thank you
Heidi Olson - 04/09/00 21:56:45
My Email:olsonh@mrs.umn.edu
Color Question:: palomino x black
Comments:
Could you please tell me what colors a foal could be if the dam was palomino and the sire was black? (both quarter horses) Also, what would you breed a palomino mare to if you wanted to try for a buckskin? Thanks for your time.
monique - 04/02/00 18:30:49
My Email:mtararatfarm@aol.com
Color Question:: cremellos
Comments:
What possible color would you get between a black and white overo, heterozygous, and a cremello mare, both have blue eyes is that ok?
Lorrie - 03/25/00 01:45:52
My Email:horsinaround@sprint.ca
Color Question:: Is it possible to figure out what variations of colour you can get from a b/w tobiano stallion and a mahogany bay mare? I started to list all my
colour "letters" and then got lost.
Comments:
I just thought I would let you know that I have found your site extremely interesting and would like to thank you for taking the time to put all this info together.
However, I couldn't help but notice you have a reference to a KMKpaints. I thought you might be interested in knowing that while this person, Lori, comes across as being a very carrying and knowledgeable breeder, you might want to visit our site at Yahoo
Equine Info Exchange to see some of the posts there from both our members and Lori. We were ALL very distraught and upset when we found out she not only was breeding a stallion that carried the gene of OLW, but she is now continuing to breed her current s
allion who is carrying a gene for the dreaded HYPP. Apparently she feels that this syndrom is more forgiving or.......something because while she is supposedly on a crusade to save the OLW foals, she is breeding HYPP into the industry. It would appear t
rough several other sites that Lori is digging herself into a very dark and uncomfortable hole and I thought you might like to know this since you are advertising her on your own page. In my opinion, you have put way to much work into this site to have i
tainted by an individual who doesn't necessarily practice what she preaches. Once again, a wonderful place to visit and thank you for your time. Lorrie
Kathy - 03/21/00 19:46:04
My Email:mkspa@hotmail.com
Color Question:: Dark bay bred to Black Homozgous Paint
Comments:
Have you every heard of a foal born a deep red color turn black. This foal has a dark bay breeding stock paint dam and a black and white homozygous sire. The dam is out of a red dun mare and a black overo stud. The sire is out of a sorrel mare and a black
homozygous stud. The foal's one leg is a mousey grey color along with the side of her face. I've always thought that red is red and it doesn't change. I was told to check this out. What do you think?
Cherye Mcdonald - 03/21/00 05:57:15
My Email:bobandcherye@cs.com
Color Question:: Roans
Comments:
I have a bay stud whos sire was a blue Roan and Dam was a Brown, and I bred him to a dun mare is there any chance of getting a roan colt, I also have a brown stud whos sire was a blue roan and dam was a red roan does he have a chance of producing roan foa
s on non roan mares, your answers would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks, Cherye
Allae Dorion - 03/18/00 15:12:45
My Email:rdorion@ulster.net
Color Question:: Bay with dorsal stripe to Cremello stallion
Comments:
So,if I understand all that you have said (and you said a lot!thank-you)My mare is a solid bay with a dorsal stripe,the stallion is a cremello who is very homozygous for his body build and color.Is it true then that I could never get a palomino cross from
the two of them.Going back 3 generations I think that they mares side are all bays and blacks.What colors might I get?Thanks for your time! Allae
holly - 03/18/00 04:02:27
My Email:hjohnson77@hotmail.com
Color Question:: grey
Comments:
What do you call a dapple grey (registered color=grey) with a black mane and tail (with red hairs here and there)- red roan looking flanks and ventral body- two silver dollar sized red spots (one on the chest and one on the croup)- and dark legs, then the
horse at four years old, gets big white spots, then starts to look "flea bitten" (red specks) in those white spots and the mane starts to get white whispy hairs on the outside only? Please e-mail me back with your response.
Billie Callendar - 03/12/00 22:49:28
My Email:bcallendar@hotmail.com
Color Question:: I understand that the A allele restricts black hair to points. Also understand that it has no effect on sorrel/chestnut as they have no black ha
r. Question: Do the sorrel/chestnut horses have this A allele to pass on to offspring? I am breeding my sorrel mare to a homozygous black & white tobiano, homozygous for both black and tobiano. I assume that will guarantee me a black and white tobiano
foal, unless a sorrel can pass on the A allele to EE genes from the tobiano. Please advise.
Comments:
Karen Smith - 03/09/00 21:43:33
My Email:rebelpride@intermediatn.net
Color Question:: My question is somewhat extensive but I would like to know the possible coat colors and the chances of these colors occurring in a mare
that we own. She is a racking mare, black and white tobiano. Her sire is Bay and her dam is black and white tobiano. She has had 4 foals, the first time bred to a grey stud and produced a black and white colt. The next 3 times she was bred to our Palom
no stud, whose sire is Palomino and dam is red roan. The first foal from this breeding was a solid buckskin stud. The second foal was a Palomino tri-color spotted filly, the third foal was a buckskin spotted filly. We have bred this mare to the sire of
our Palomino, who is also Palomino but darker, and this mare is due to foal in May, Just wondering what is the likelihood of what colors or chances of being spotted. Thanks!
Comments:
Karan - 03/06/00 22:46:57
My Email:haygoodpaints@yahoo.com
Color Question:: dunalino
Comments:
I was so very happy to find your web page. I have been looking for anything on color. I called A.P.H.A. and they kept sending me things on leathal whites. I would like to find more about the % of what you would get if you breed a palomino with a bay or
a bay to black and so on.
Also I have never heard of the dunalino, is A.P.H.A. going to start to recognize this as a
color? I believe I own one, he looks a lot like the filly but deeper gold and his strip does not go all the way down his back. He is reg. palomino but that does not help when people do study's on colors. I would also like more info on cremellos and perl
no such as what would happen if you breed a grey? And why in the Jan. P.H. journal did the one mare(who was either cremello or perlino) had a sorrel foal?
Thank you Karan
Lynae - 03/04/00 06:03:29
My URL:http://www.empnet.com/celebrity
My Email:Ireland@empnet.com
Color Question:: Who contributed the dun coloring?
Comments:
I own a copper red chestnut Morgan stallion who I bred to an Arab mare who was white with little brown flecks throughout her coat. The resulting foal was a dun, complete with dorsal stripe, shoulder bars and striped legs. Could my Morgan have the dun gene
He has a definite dorsal but no leg bars and has thrown a filly with the same dorsal, no leg bars. My stud's dam was bay and his sire was chestnut. Also, he has thrown foals with patches on their rumps that show as white hairs mixed in with the body col
r. What is that all about?
SammyJoe - 03/02/00 04:00:30
My Email:kidscorral1@altavista.net
Color Question:: Paint coat colors
Comments:
I have several. I found your site very informative
and I have apparantly been misinformed before. But I'm still not sure of what absolutely defines a tobiano vs. overo in relation to coloring and the topline. 1) Am I correct that for defining purposes the topline is calculated from the midpoint of the w
ithers to the dock of the tail & not from the poll to dock? 2) An overo is defined as one solid color along this topline ( whether it be the white or dark color) as long as no 2 colors cross sect it? or it may be that both colors may actually meet there
running all the way along it) as long as neither one crosses it? I'll start with these and send more later. thank you.
LAUREN - 02/27/00 23:09:44
My Email:CHIKLET523@AOL.COM
Color Question:: DO YOU HAVE ALL OF THE GENETIC FORMULAS AND COLOR DEFINITIONS FOR HORSES? IF YOU DO I WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU SENT THEM TO ME BECAUSE I AM DONIG MY SCIENCE
REPOT ON "THE GENETICS OF HORSES. THANKS!!
Comments:
Val Walker - 02/27/00 22:00:02
My Email:trvnknls@aol.com
Color Question:: bay x cremello x
Comments:
We bred a bay mare to our cremello stud, and she
produced a black colt. I realize he is a "smokey"
black, since black can hide the dilute. But how
is be BLACK? Does it mean that the cremello stud
must carry the black gene, as black is recessive
to bay ? Any clarification would be appreciated,
thanks ! Val
Dave - 02/23/00 15:50:17
My Email:dxd10@psu.edu
Color Question:: I crossed a heterozygous gray welsh pony with a heterozygous tabanio welsh stud. What will be the chances for color.
Comments:
- 02/20/00 07:45:48
Comments:
CJones - 02/18/00 00:09:00
My URL:www.knownet.net
My Email:djcjkj@knownet.net
Color Question:: best color for producing pinto?
Comments:
I am looking for a mare to breed to a Pinto Warmblood. I have read over alot of this stuff. Would I have a greater chance of producing color if the mare has more white. Such as four socks and a blaze? I found a gray mare that I like but from everything I'
e read that is the riskiest choice. Am I right? Please help me:0)
Jackie Mahoney - 02/17/00 22:15:27
My Email:jmahoney@northnet.org
Color Question:: What possible colors can I expect from breeding my palamino mare to a red roan stallion, both are Quarter Horses?
Comments:
Lisa Culbertson - 02/17/00 17:36:39
My Email:shudabeenacowgirl@email.com
Color Question:: Is there a way to predict color of foal from leopard appy/liver chestnut cross?
Comments:
My liver Chestnut mare had a colt of the same color with no markings. She had been bred to a leopard appy before I bought her. I would consider this same breeding again because of the excellent disposition and conformation. Just curious about possible
oat color. Any chance for a fancy coat?
trish brotherton - 02/10/00 19:23:26
My Email:tbrotherton2@yahoo.com
Color Question:: tobiano markers
Comments:
we own a black and white tobiano stallion who has
4 white socks and an off center hind spot,on the
papers which we got from portland state u it states that he has BB markers, what does that mean?I hope you can help as I called them several times and they won't answer.
thanks trish
Janice Denney - 02/09/00 17:19:58
My Email:ndenney@compusmart.ab.ca
Color Question:: lethal white frame overo identification
Comments:
GREAT SITE! I have a mare bred to a stallion and both look like the Sabino stallion that you say is not a carrier of the lethal allel. The stallion...now gelding.. does have a bald face and has no blue eyes, has the 4 stockings which go to the gaskins,
large distinct belly spot, roaning at the flanks and two bars of white hairs on his tail. His sire produced two completely white foals..UC Davis tested...which are not lethal. His mother was a QH with a quarter size white spot on her belly. His sire wa
a loud frame overo. The mare has less white and looks like a typical Sabino with the Apron face and long white sox with no blue eyes but her sire has produced lethals. Is there any other way other than testing I can determine if the resulting foal if a
l white is lethal, other than watching it die? Oh yes he had one other foal from a breeding stock paint mare and the colt looks identical to him except he has two blue eyes and neither parent had blue eyes...and I know 3 out of 4 grandparents did not hav
blue eyes. What do you think, I can send pictures.
Thank you.
Janice Denney
Becky - 02/09/00 01:31:12
My URL:don't have one
My Email:sugarripe6913@yahoo.com
Color Question:: i bred my mare, a flea- bitten grey, with a buckskin stud? what will i get?
Comments:
I need to know for a biology class that i am currently in please help soon
Adriane Krug - 02/05/00 13:53:35
My Email:elkene@aol.com
Comments:
I like your website, very informative. I'm breeding my maiden mare this year and have been asking around about what color foal, but I think I've determined 50% chance chestnut, 50% chance bay. She's chestnut, the sire is dark bay/brown and has at least
ne chestnut foal on the ground.
Cherie - 02/04/00 17:52:15
Color Question:: answers....
Comments:
Ok, playing 'ketchup' here.... :o)
Color Question:: A/B informative
Answer: Thanks, I will be revamping the site soon, so come back and check in a month.
A/B informative just means you have a way of seeing if the foal recieved a tobiano gene from the parent... obvious in a solid vs tobiano foal, but the key is when you have homo and heterozygous foals... having two informative parents will tell you which f
al is which by the markers. The ink spots do not always show up in homozygous foals, and do show up on heterozygous foals. A/B informative horses will still only produce 50% tobiano foals when bred to solid horses. When breeding a hetero tobiano to a het
ro tobiano or an overo paint, you should get 75% colored foals (tobi, and tovero) and 25% solid foals (not enough white) bear in mind this is ON AVERAGE.... and if not other white genes are involved.
************************************************
:flyingf@wizard.com
Color Question:: common crosses to achieve colors
Answer:
For my definition of 'Grullo/Grulla', yes they must have a dun gene, and they must have 'true' dun factor. For your colt, the dam is palomino, the sire, black so there is no dun factor involved, so your colt is probably either a bay, buckskin or golden bl
ck horse (black with creme gene) There are some other possibilities, but without a picture, I really can't give a better guess.
Dun factor is sometimes confused with 'counter shading' there are some modifiers that make what looks like a dorsal on a horse, but there really isn't a dun gene... takes practice to be sure, just like figuring out the different color patterns... lots of
ractice sometimes, and even then there will be cases you can be sure. Yes, very often a foal looks to have dun factor and then looses it... I call this the '
'baby dorsal' and many people get this confused, part of the reason why I am buiding a picture base of dun factor foals.
Breed red dun to sorrel or red dun for the best chance at red dun.
chestnut to sorrel or black for the liver chestnut (or go liver to liver... best way!)
I think chocolate palomino is best achieved by chocolate palomino to liver, (50% chance) or to black. (25%)
grullo is best by breeding grullo to grullo or to black.
and the 100% way to get the color you want... go to the breeders and pic out the foal with the correct color!! :o)
***********************************************
not really a color question- is there ANY way that a lethal white foal can survive?
Comments:
NO a true lethal foal that is homozygous for the frame gene will not survive. The rumors that say they have one are not verified/true as far as I have found. sometimes they are from a cremello foal that is not a true lethal, or from a tovero foal that jus
ended up with no base coat color showing.. this does happen.
True homozygous frame overo foals do not survive even if they had colic surgery because there are nerve endings that control moving food thru the colon... and they just don't develop in a lethal foal so they would die anyway. I would think if UC Davis or
niv. Of Minnisota had one they had 'saved' they would plaster it all over their web sites and show them off... it would be quite an accomplishment.
************************************************
:dulcinea34@hotmail.com
Color Question:: Bay or Dun?
Answer:
Bay. She would have some other dun-factor characteristics if she was a true dun horse... It sounds like she may have the combo of the bay base coat with a panagre~ and smutty gene, giving her the countershading that produces a fake 'dorsal'. I am still wo
king on how to tell 'For Sure 'on the dun-factor vs counter shading... check back on the web site in a month or so.
Having a dorsal just doesn't always mean they are dun. But on an interesting note I have seen a dun that even 7 feet away looked bay... but she had leg bars, ear tips, ear bars, etc... and a dun parent.
************************************************
:Zorrah@gis.net
Color Question:: Breeding a grey
I'm not sure which you mean by 'colored foal' I'm going to guess you want a paint foal... best bet would be to breed the grey mare to a homozygous tobi stallion of any color.
The mare should be a heterozygous grey... so 50% of the time (ON AVERAGE now) throw the grey gene to the foal... no matter what the base coat or white genes the foal has. (some darn grey mares throw grey every time, some only once out of 10 foals... you j
st have to roll the dice) You can have any color for a base coat and still have the grey gene dominate over time. (I've seen grullo, roan, dun and buckskin horses all go grey if they have the grey gene.)
***********************************************8
If anyone has more questions, please feel free to drop a line,... I am slow sometimes, but I do make the effort to answer all questions.
thanks! and check back in a month or so for the revamped site.
Cherie :o)
- 02/03/00 03:17:15
My Email:grullaAQHAhorses@aol.com
Comments:
forgot to put my email on previous one
Darla Bell - 02/03/00 03:16:17
My URL:http://bellquarterhorses.SEEUS.nu
My Email:grullaAQHAhorses
Comments:
Just happy to find info I could understand. One of my Grulla stallions is out of a grulla and by a grulla. Haven't had the black gene test done yet...but anxious to see what his foal is that is due this year.
Zorrah - 01/24/00 02:49:12
My Email:Zorrah@gis.net
Color Question:: Breeding a grey
Comments:
What is the best genetic make-up for a stallion to be bred to a Grey mare for a colored foal?
The grey mare's dam is also grey, and her sire is chestnut w/minimal white. PLEASE HELP!
Marquetta - 01/19/00 17:43:16
My Email:dulcinea34@hotmail.com
Color Question:: Bay or Dun?
Comments:
I have a QH mare that is registered as a bay, but has a distinct dorsal stripe down her back all year long (it doesn't fade in summer or winter). She also gets very light (fawn colored) around her utter and upper legs (where the black points end).
I was wondering: is she a bay or a dun as some horsemen have suggested to me?
Both of her parents are bays, with some dun, palomino, & roans on her mother's side, and sold Bay/Dun on her father's side.
What color would she be classified as?
- 01/18/00 03:42:45
Color Question:: not really a color question- is there ANY way that a lethal white foal can survive?
Comments:
- 01/12/00 13:35:34
Comments:
Lauri Miller - 01/11/00 05:33:31
My Email:jloutdoors@aol.com
Color Question:: applaoosa genitics
Comments:
Cindy - 01/10/00 17:32:58
My Email:flyingf@wizard.com
Color Question:: common crosses to achieve colors
Comments:
Hi, can you tell me the common cross(without using cremello and perlino,because of registration purposes) to result in a red dun?liver chestnut?chocolate palimino?
grulla?To be a dun,the foal must have a dun parent,is that correct?If a buckskin has no dorsal stripe,then does a foal sometimes have the appearence of a dorsal stripe and then later loose it.I have heard of foals appearing to be bay and shedding out a da
k buckskin,but if there is a dorsal stripe could this be possible?Also, I have a APHA stud colt he is registered as a buckskin,but he seems to me to be more of a tri colored,with grullo color also,since he is a tobiano,there is no color crossing his back,
oes a grulla have a dorsal stripe?He is much darker on his face,but does have buckskin markings also,his dam is a AQHA palimino,his sire black and white.Is there tri colored buckskins?
Thanks for your help.
Letitia Canty - 12/31/99 02:56:53
My Email:lgc@inu.net
Color Question:: A/B informative
Comments:
I have a A/B informative stallion whom I have not bred and will be breeding in the spring. What exactly does this mean as to when bred to solid mares. Is it higher to get a tobiano than 50% or less. Also what if I breed to another tobiano or overo and
rop out. Thank You for this wonderful site. It has really helped me. LGC
Cherie - 12/21/99 23:10:14
Color Question:: Grey on Pelino..
Comments:
I'm not realy sure what you mean by BEC but I'll just go with the mare is a perlino out of two grey parents and go from there.
First off, a perlino (my definition) has two cremello genes and a black gene... the bay modifier (agouti) is optional. and it is possible for this horse to also have a grey gene that would not show up in an obvious way.
the grey gene is dominient, yes... but in an additive way... horses can be all maner of colors under that grey gene... bay, palomino, buckskin, red roan, dun etc... ANY color of horse can go grey if the grey gene is present.
So I am assuming the filly started out smokey black or buckskin or palomino and then turned grey... a very real possiblity for a perlino mare with two grey parents. What will be interesting in the future is whether the mare throws a grey gene every time,
he had that possiblity of being double gened grey by having two grey parents.
So you are both right, as long as you have a true perlino mare on your hands... she can have the grey gene and not really show it except maybe when she sheds in the spring... but the friend is right... she should eventually loose her ivory cast and end up
a very white looking creature...
I just had a thought, if she truly is a perlino with a grey gene, then if you flip her mane over to the wrong side and check the roots, they should be much darker with 'grey' hairs mixed in... My two perlino mares do not have any grey hairs and are dark r
oted ( you may want to get some grey mane samples and hold them up next to her...and compare)
Good luck, and let me know what you find on the other side of that mane!
Cherie
Gerd Eriksson - 12/18/99 08:42:26
My Email:yhe981k@tninet.se
Color Question:: BEC + BAY = GREY?
Comments:
I have a BEC (perlino) mare by heterocygot grey parents. She has a grey filly by a bay stallion. My friends says this is impoosible - a grey gene can never be hidden. is always dominant even on dilution. So a grey filly means that my BEC mare is not a BEC
she´s a grey???? BUT!!! Is grey really a color?? I thought it was a modifier?, so if a BEC it doesn´t matter, it is spreading white hair in an already white/cream body, and the result? For me it is a BEC carrying a grey gene, as well as a perlino is carr
ing (dilutet) bay genes. Am I right or wrong?
Gerd Eriksson - 12/18/99 08:42:01
My Email:yhe981k@tninet.se
Color Question:: BEC + BAY = GREY?
Comments:
I have a BEC (perlino) mare by heterocygot grey parents. She has a grey filly by a bay stallion. My friends says this is impoosible - a grey gene can never be hidden. is always dominant even on dilution. So a grey filly means that my BEC mare is not a BEC
she´s a grey???? BUT!!! Is grey really a color?? I thought it was a modifier?, so if a BEC it doesn´t matter, it is spreading white hair in an already white/cream body, and the result? For me it is a BEC carrying a grey gene, as well as a perlino is carr
ing (dilutet) bay genes. Am I right or wrong?
cherie - 12/10/99 18:41:40
Color Question:: response to prior two ???'s
Comments:
Thank you both for visiting my Horse Color Site.. You both had questions,
I would love to see if the one horse is a tovero or not, can you e-mail pics in a JPG format?? Kinko's has computers and scanners you can borrow to get pics scanned in... you need to be sure and get the size down to 100K or under.
The testing so far is only for the frame overo gene.. so I would have to venture a guess based on pictures, if you have pictures of sire and dam that would help.
On the brownish horse, send me the addy and I will venture an opinion... or send the pics! If you can include sire and dam color that is a big help.
Thanks again for visiting..
Cherie
---
gabrielle delyse - 12/09/99 13:22:52
My URL:http://members.icq.com/47530922
My Email:gabyd@ihug.co.nz
Color Question:: Tovero or Tobiano
Comments:
Hi this is Gabrielle I hav ejust purchased a colt with blue eyes they said he is a pinto Tobiano I have been studing the pages and patterns and thinkhe is more like a Tovero ,He is almost identical to the Tovero pictured on your website He is a miniature
5 month old colt, What organisations in New Zealand could test him for the genetics he is carrying.. Please could you help. I could send photo's of him ? if you would like and he has a medicine hat pattern on his head - I would like to know if he has thi
pattern or not as the previous owners are unsure? Many thanks . Gabrielle
Cathy Hill - 11/20/99 04:00:49
My Email:chill253@ipa.net
Color Question:: What color is this horse?
Comments:
On our email community we are trying to guess the color of a horse posted. He is a reddish chocolate color with red mane & tail. Email me and I will send a picture. He's gorgeous!
Cherie - 11/12/99 20:18:42
Color Question:: answers...
Comments:
Hi all, catching up again... answers to the last two questions... Here we go...
Color Question:: Do you have more information about the Rubicano and Champange genes?
********
I have an excellent site for a link:
http://www.kpmcornerstone.com/khal2.htm
This lady did an outstanding job of documenting the color change of her amber (bay with champagne) foal. check it out for more info.
On the rubicano... all I can say is that i am working on getting pictures on the variations of this gene expression. It is very minimal to very loud.
********
Color Question:: I have a roan mare with black points, is there a colored stallion I can breed to to gain color other than roan or bay? I also have a dun mare, what color should I breed to for hopes of a grullo.
********
On the bay-roan mare... buckskin, black, dun studs may all give a 'different' color.. but she can still throw sorrel, red roan, bay, bay roan when bred to any of these studs.. but you could also get the stud color.
On the dun mare...breeding to a homozygous for black stud that is either black or grullo gives the best chance at a grullo foal.
*******
When I finally get the chance for my revamp, I will have a ton of expansion on all three dilute genes (dun, cremello and champagne) as well as a reorganized 'white pages (tobiano/overo) section.
Thanks, glad you all liked the site.
Cherie :o)
Bevin Hathcock - 11/09/99 17:39:28
My Email:bhorsenut@hotmail.com
Comments:
So delighted to find his site!! I have a cremello mare and have had no luck in determining color of her offspring when bred to black and white stud. Thank you very much for the tremendous work that was put into this site. What great information and ref
rence site!
Leslie Witt - 11/07/99 16:22:59
My Email:wittsmudbugs@msn.com
Color Question:: I have a roan mare with black points, is there a colored stallion I can breed to to gain color other than roan or bay? I also have a dun mare, what
olor should I breed to for hopes of a grullo.
Comments:
Thank Tou so very much for this site and the information. I have 3 mares I will be breeding this next year and REALLY want to make sound decisions.
Cindy Bachman - 11/07/99 02:50:05
My Email:cbachman@micron.net
Color Question:: Do you have more information about the Rubicano and Champange genes?
Comments:
My daughter has a sorrel/chestnut?? May 1999 quarter horse filly that has the white hairs ('coon tail')at the tail head of her sorrel/flaxy tail. She also has mottled white spots between her hind legs and groups of white hair on her withers and back. He
flanks have a lot of speckled white hairs. Her mane is sorrel. When she was born the skin color of her eyelids, nose and under her tail was a mauve color, but has turned normal.
Our quarter horses are line-bred Weiscamp horses. The sorrels have white hairs flecked through their coats and the chestnuts get spots of dark hairs (almost black) as they get older. There are greys, bays, browns, light palaminos, buckskins with whi
e socks, and we have a dun 3-yr old stallion that I would call a grullo/buckskin with 3 white stockings.
Thank you so much for shedding a lot of light on the colors of our horses!!!
Sincerely,
Cindy Bachman
Bruneau, Idaho
Cherie - 10/22/99 21:33:30
Color Question:: WW and Lethal White....
Comments:
I am sorry for the confusion. the lethal white gene is tied to the O gene (frame overo) and both parents have one copy of the frame overo gene that is given to the foal resulting in an OO or lethal white condiditon. the WW is something totaly different in
my understanding, the white gene is completely separate... those horses that are Ww do have white hair and pink skin... but the apparently have 'normal' colored eyes... and they are white ALL over... not like the frame overo gene that has a variety of exp
essions (or no expression that can happen and look like a breeding stock) I have no first hand observations of the W or White gene... My understanding is that it is lethal in the WW combination... but no foal is produced at all... so no lethal whites with
those horses... I would guess the embryo just doesn't take and the mare comes back in.
There is no true 'Albino' in the horse world to my knowledge.... because even a tovero that is 100% white with no dark skin/hair still has blue eyes...and the definition of an albino has pink eyes.... I think. And those the AQHA calls 'albino' are really
cremellos/perlinos and also are not really white...the are off white (cremello) to a lite looking palomino with cinamon manes and tails in the perlino.
The W gene was documented on a ranch in Nevada or Nebraska or somewhere and they did find that white to white never produced a foal that went on to only sire white foals so that is how they figured it must be a lethal condidion in utero... but they never
ad an 'lethal' foal like the frame overos have. Hope that helps.
katie - 10/21/99 22:11:01
My Email:katiecat220@hotmail.com
Color Question:: Hi- I have another question.... I find this all very interesting! I was wondering what the difference between the a lethal white foal and an al
ino is. You seem to have lethal white as being "WW" but I thought this would be albino, and the lethal white would be another gene entirely.... thanks for your help!
Comments:
Cherie - 10/21/99 17:30:27
Color Question:: RE: APPY and White mark question
Comments:
I will profess I have not checked into appy's much, I do have a breeder down the road, but they got out of it pretty much and don't get many foals a year.
There seems (to me) to be several factors involved with appys... 1. the appy gene 2. the 'varnished roan' version that is either a separate gene action linked with the appy gene, or a modifier that codominates and changes the appy gene expression, 3. gre
genes that mess up both of the above, and then 4. the variations of butt only, blanket, leppoard and few spot leppards. (and we haven't even touched those with mottling only or a few 'flakes')
I know that few spot leppards are suppose to be 100% color producers... but that is about it. That would be a good reason to search other breeder sites, and the main appy organization site for more info. I'm still trying to get the rest of the colors stra
t... so that is on the back burner for quiet a while.
On blazes, socks, and 'normal' body white... well, I'm not sure what I can really say about that. I've seen two 'solid' horses produce a foal with white in several places and then two parents with quiet a bit of white end up producing a comepletely solid
oal.
I have a mare I call sally. She has a medium blaze down her face, star, strip, snip all about 3-4" wide, plus lower lip white. Bred to a small (1-2") blazed TB stud she threw a huge star, and a snip with a top like a mountain, few bridge hairs, lower lip
hite. 2 time I bred her to a paint tobi with the same type of blaze she had... Got the same star, no bridg white and small snip with lower lip white. Third stud, Medium star, no strip, BIG nose snip, tiny lower lip white. Foal has NO WHITE HAIRS on the fa
e, tiny lower lip white. Forth stud, small star, small strip, small snip (thin blaze) with small lower lib white. Foal has Large blaze on one side, other side looks like a 1/2 bald face on the other, just missing being an overo foal. (and yes, lower lip w
ite) Fith stud, small star. thats it. Foal ends up with markings almost identical to sally's. The only consistancy I can find is the lower lip white. go figure.
The only other thing I can say about 'regular' white markings... twins that were produced thru embryo spliting (identical genetics) end up with different white markings... one has 4 socks, the other only three... so there may be environmental things in pl
y here as well.
Ok, a long winded way of saying I don't have a clue, I think there is a main gene, or several genes that are 'additive' and in a highly variable part of the dna and do what they darn well please, much to our consternation. I think there are also 'limiting
expression genes... but that is pure theory.
katie - 10/21/99 04:30:01
My Email:katiecat220@hotmail.com
Color Question:: appaloosas?
Comments:
I found your web page EXTREMELY informative, however I do still have two questions about coat colorings: how do the genetics of appaloosa coat coloring work? and how do we get white markings such as socks, stars, blazes, etc. on horses that are strictly c
estnut or bay?
Cherie - 10/19/99 19:00:59
Color Question:: Catching up on answering...
Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments: Comments:
Sorry guys, I have not kept up on the color questions like I ment too, so I am doing one big answer instead of a bunch of little ones...
rocknk@dave-world.net:
asks on breeding a bs bay with to overo parents to a tobi stud with one tobi and one quarter parent.
The bs bay may still have a frame overo gene or a sabino gene... the sabino would be expressed minimaly in two or more tall socks and a full blaze face, the frame may not have any white on them at all! Basically it is possible to end up with an overo foal
out of this mare... but the possibility is not high, like 15% or less... you can find out if the mare has an frame gene that is hidden thru testing (see the genetic lab page for info) If the mare doesn't have any hidden overo genes (as is likely) then the
'paint' must come from the sire, a tobiano. odds are 50/50 on a tobi foal vs a solid foal. The colors you could get from a bay to black cross are sorrel, bay and black, and the same for a bay to sorrel cross.. but there is more chance for sorrel on the so
rel cross, and more bay/black foals on the bay to black cross.
spike@intellex.com
gina kline - 10/14/99 03:43:43
My Email:rocknk@dave-world.net
Color Question:: What would the possible outcomes be of crossing a Bay BS mare w/ two overo parents to a tobiano stud w/ one tobi parent and one QH parent??Thanks
Barbara - 09/27/99 04:38:13
My URL:http://members.xoom.com/southcreek/
My Email:spike@intellex.com
Color Question:: white or cremello?
We just bought a Shetland pony stallion. He is either white or cremello, right now he's so dirty I'm not sure. (bath tomorrow!!) =P He has blue eyes and clearly pink skin. I think his parents were both palamino, but I'm not positive. I'm writing to h
s breeders to see if they can give me any information. If we breed him to a blue roan what do you think we might get? also red roan? I think if I understand it right we should get palimino out of sorrel mares and buckskin out of bay mares, right? My we
page will be updated soon (badly out of date right now) When I can get some pictures of him you are welcome to use them. =) I also have a white pony mare if you need pictures of her. also blue roan, red roan, sorrel & white tobiano, black & white tobia
o, blue roan & white tobiano and buckskin. sorry for so long comments =)
- 09/27/99 03:58:23
Elsie M. Darrah - 09/23/99 15:21:16
My Email:darrahe@hotmail
Color Question:: Champagne
I would like to know a bit about the dilution factors of the ivory champagne. Is this color similiar to cremelo in that bred to certain colors will produce a predicted color foal? I am doing some research and trying to identify champagnes registered as
alking horses and do have the TWHBEA pedigree data base, but the champagnes are shown as champagne with no distinction between the various champagne colors.
Thanks for your help.
Elsie
Bobbi - 08/27/99 00:46:36
My URL:http://www.SanSiemonBars.com
My Email:gharlan@cts.com
Hi Cherie,
I love your site!
I've been here before but never noticed your guest book. Keep up the good work! You need your own B.B.! I refer people to your site all the time,I think it is the most informative on the web! and in terms that "normal" people can understand!LOL. Thanks Ag
in
Kim Cook - 08/26/99 04:42:55
My URL:http://www.sweetcandles.com
My Email:kim@sweetcandles.com
Color Question:: Blue Roan/palomino
If I cross blue roan with a horse I believe has "dun" factor, what color may i get? The Palomino is on the bottom of my site, but also have a Dark Bay mare who has thrown a dun, previous owner bred her, cant remember what color she bred to. I am confused
about dun factor, does a bay have it? The palomino has many duns in her background, so it is possible for her to have the dun factor? Do most palominos have the dun factor? Sorry these questions are confusing, as I am a bit confused on what colors I may
et with crossing the Dark bay with blue roan, and palomino with blue roan. Can you help me? Thanks, I love your site and come here often!
Kim Pinta - 08/25/99 14:37:31
My Email:www.kpinta@aap.org
Kim Kaiser - 08/09/99 19:15:33
My Email:RPaintedAcres@yahoo.com
Color Question:: Grullos
First of all I have two grullo & white Tobiano paint horses (a 5 year old mare and her yearling son) that have all the true characteristics and coloring of the grullo color. I thought you might be interested in using thier pictures because everying is so
ell defined on them especially her son where he has the white that goes over the withers then the dorsal stripe starts then stops again because of a white spot and then the dorsal stripe starts again.
I also thought you might be able to help me figure out what color the filly is that this same grullo & white mare had this year. This is Jewelee May's (the 5 year old grullo & white Tobiano mare) second foal by the same black & white Tobiano stallion. She
was born on April 26, 1999, steel gray (& white because she is a Tobiano) in color. She is now a little over 3 months old and her face, chest and the front of her neck (above her chest) has lost its baby fuzz. Around her eyes she is a brown in color the s
me color you would see on a wild rabbit, the front part of her neck is a darker brown than around her eyes but has several darker stripes horizontally (she looks like she is part zebra!) she has the dark points over her knees and a black mane and tail, th
baby fuzz she has remaining on her body is too dark to be able to tell if she has a dorsal stripe or not.
I have had numerous horse breeders and 2 vets etc. look at her to see if they would have any idea what color she is but nobody has any idea.
Please if you can I need help!
You can also call me by phone if you would like
760-788-0285
Kim Kaiser
lori - 08/04/99 02:23:29
My Email:loris@mail.riverview.net
Color Question:: what would one get breeding a cremello to a chestnut ?
I received your info on your website from a freind You had a homozygous colt for sale do you still have him?
karyn - 08/02/99 09:06:18
My Email:SSlilbrat@aol.com
Color Question:: ???
I have a horse and want to know his color it is very unusual. Kinda like a palamino but very orangy with a flaxen mane and tail.Can you help me??
O. Xavier Alvarez - 07/31/99 06:23:48
My Email:xalvarez@interconnect.net
Color Question:: True Black
I say True Black because I have a filly that was born jet black, but during the summer she fades. I knew a black horse that was out in pasture 365 days of the year, and he never faded. How does one breed to obtain the nerver-fading True Black color? I
ould like to buy a 6month old True Black QH Filly. Do you know of anyone that has any? Your response will be appreciated. Thanks.
Belinda Merritt - 07/29/99 18:50:07
My Email:bjm@ipa.net
Color Question:: DNA and coat color
I just recieved a copy of my stallion's DNA test. I'm unaware of how to read this, it list genetic markers. Is there a way to tell what this stallion's color genes are? What we feel we know is: he's Gray and carries a cremello gene. When bred to our
alomino mare, they produced a cremello filly, white/cream coat with pink skin and blue eyes. What I want to know is whether or not he also carries the black gene and the bay modifer or not. His parentage shows alot of chestnut/sorrel and palomino recent
y with some bay a couple generations back. He is Gray, with black mane and tale but I don't know what his color was at birth.
Mary - 07/12/99 12:52:52
My Email:OshPosh8@aol.com
Color Question:: My foal???
What I am trying to do is predict wich coat color my horse's baby will be. The father of the baby is a black, and the mother is a fleabitten gray. Someone told me i would need to have information on both of the horse's parents...Is this true? Also, how
can I make predictions on what color the baby will be...Is one of these colors dominant? Please send me any information you have regarding horse color prediction in new borns. Also if you could answer my questions it would be great...thanks for your tim
Ü
- 06/22/99 04:20:03
Great website! very informative. Thanks!
Cherie - 06/21/99 21:46:59
Color Question:: Michelle -- sabino's
Hi Michelle,
Here is what I can tell you about the sabino pattern. It typically is a roany pattern, but not always. Tall socks on at least two legs are the norm with spotting occuring on the bottom of the barrel. That said, there are times it is VERY dificult to tell
he patterns apart, and probably times when both genes are present. I do not believe the sabino gene in and of itself will ever cause lethals.... Clydesdales don't have lethal white foals, but they most definitly express a sabino pattern frequently. And th
re are times the Frame overo gene doesn't express and you still get a lethal foal. I don't know about the Audios Amigos line for sure, but the Buck McCue line of horses are frame overo paints for the most part and have thrown lethals.
Quite honestly I can't tell from just the pictures and I wouldn't hazzard a guess on your colt, he could be either or both in a minimal expression. I would have him tested for the lethal gene, it is $35 - $50 bucks well spent if you are wanting to market
im as a stallion prospect. I have seen a mare I would have swore was sabino, but she had a lethal, so on horses that have high socks and low belly white, I would just have the test done and take the guess work out of it.
Hope this helps, and good luck! Cherie :0)
Michelle - 06/20/99 01:50:17
My URL:http://geocities.datacellar.net/Petsburgh/Farm/3580
My Email:rocky_roads@hotmail.com
Color Question:: Colt with TB dam, chestnut Sire bs grullo of overo breeding. Colt born chestnut 2high socks behind big blaze face. Gets full Paint papers bas
d on face white. Sheds winter coat now has a few white hairs on his flank. Now a few months short of yearling and has lots of white hairs starting behind shoulder going over rump. His rear socks each have little whisp of white thru the center of his ho
k but not the "motteling" normally associated with sabino clydsdale type leg markings. What do you think??? Can e-mail photos if interested. Thanks M~
Nice site
cherie - 06/16/99 17:41:12
Color Question:: Champagne...
This gene has been recognized for quiet a while by Saddle Bred and Tenn. Walker breeders, as well as foxtrotters. I feel it is pretty rare in the quarter and paint breeds, probably rarer than dunfactor which is the rarest color gene that we can have a sem
accurate tracking of. There is a stallion on the stallion owners/list page with a link that can be clicked on, and I have pictures that need to be scanned for this web site. I was only recently made aware of this gene, many of the gentic books still refe
to it as a cremello gene with a gene for pink skin, which is inaccurate. Value of these animals may increase with more education of the public, but for now it is dependent on the quality of the animal. Good luck with yours!! Cherie :0)
Shari Beymer - 06/16/99 14:23:43
My Email:rsbeymer@netins.net
Color Question:: Champagne Gene
If you know anything about this gene I would love to hear from you. I found the champagne site on the net but what I really want to know is if there are alot of horses with this gene and are they of any greater value than other horses. I have a yearling
illy and a weanling stud colt that are beautiful but I need to sell them. Too many horses (20) but I would love to sell to someone that wants this gene. Any sugestions?
Cherie - 06/15/99 18:20:21
Color Question:: Cropouts....
Hi Leigh!
Well, this is an interesting application of words, so I will set out the two ways I here this term used and let you decide...
When a horse has two quarter parents and the resulting foal has a lot of white, or at least enough that bars it from AQHA registration, most people call those 'crop outs'.
On the other hand, I have heard of people that breed two loud paints to gether call a resulting solid foal (aka breeding stock) a 'crop out' because of the LACK of color.
So, find out what the parents are, or alternatively, just if the paint is 'regular' (colored) registry or the 'breeding stock' registry (it will say at the top of the papers, and where the color is listed it will say 'Sorrel/Solid' instead of a regular re
istry horse that is more like 'Sorrel tobiano'.
Hope this helps, please let me know if I need to be clearer.
Cherie :0)
Leigh - 06/07/99 22:49:27
My Email:Rduck99@aol.com
Color Question:: Crop out???
What is a crop out paint? I'm interested in a horse and that is what kind she said he was. If you can help please do so.....
cherie - 06/02/99 17:52:06
Color Question:: To: Sabino or overo
The absolute best way on such a 'loud' overo pattern is to go ahead and have her tested with one of the genetic labs listed on the main page of this site. I wouldn't even hazzard a guess even if I had a picture, she could be either with as loud as she is,
or even both!
Good luck!
cherie - 06/02/99 17:51:04
Color Question:: Sabiano or overo....
The absolute best way on such a 'loud' overo pattern is to go ahead and have her tested with one of the genetic labs listed on the main page of this site. I wouldn't even hazzard a guess even if I had a picture, she could be either with as loud as she is,
or even both!
Good luck!
Danielle Williammee - 06/02/99 15:06:01
My Email:daniellecat@webtv.net
Color Question:: overo or sabino?
I recently bought a very nice paint mare. Her
papers have her down as a palomino overo. Her dam
is a palomino and white frame overo and her sire
is a chesnut and white overo.(although he looks
identical in coloring to one of the sabinos on
your site). I plan to breed my mare next year.I
think she might be a sabino also. Can I breed her
to a frame overo without the chance of a LWO foal?
And how do I know for certain if she is indeed a
sabino or a very, very white frame overo? My mare
is almost completly white 2 blue eyes, with a
medicine hat, and color down her throat and chest.
Coler down her back, extending to her tail and to
either side of her tail on her but. She has a lot
of black almost mottled skin on her body, But a
bunch of it doesn't evan color out. She also has
black mottled skin on her mane crest and on her
tail bone. Her mane and tail are completely white.
The coler that she does have isn't solid, but
looks like lots of speckles all crammed together,
and seems to be fading, as if its roaning.
Thank you for your time. Any information at all
would be greatly appreciated.
Sincerely,
Danielle Williammee
daniellecat@webtv.net
I can send pictures if you'd like.
Danielle Williammee - 06/02/99 15:05:10
My Email:daniellecat@webtv.net
Color Question:: overo or sabino?
I recently bought a very nice paint mare. Her
papers have her down as a palomino overo. Her dam
is a palomino and white frame overo and her sire
is a chesnut and white overo.(although he looks
identical in coloring to one of the sabinos on
your site). I plan to breed my mare next year.I
think she might be a sabino also. Can I breed her
to a frame overo without the chance of a LWO foal?
And how do I know for certain if she is indeed a
sabino or a very, very white frame overo? My mare
is almost completly white 2 blue eyes, with a
medicine hat, and color down her throat and chest.
Coler down her back, extending to her tail and to
either side of her tail on her but. She has a lot
of black almost mottled skin on her body, But a
bunch of it doesn't evan color out. She also has
black mottled skin on her mane crest and on her
tail bone. Her mane and tail are completely white.
The coler that she does have isn't solid, but
looks like lots of speckles all crammed together,
and seems to be fading, as if its roaning.
Thank you for your time. Any information at all
would be greatly appreciated.
Sincerely,
Danielle Williammee
daniellecat@webtv.net
I can send pictures if you'd like.
Danielle Williammee - 06/02/99 15:04:20
My Email:daniellecat@webtv.net
Color Question:: overo or sabino?
I recently bought a very nice paint mare. Her
papers have her down as a palomino overo. Her dam
is a palomino and white frame overo and her sire
is a chesnut and white overo.(although he looks
identical in coloring to one of the sabinos on
your site). I plan to breed my mare next year.I
think she might be a sabino also. Can I breed her
to a frame overo without the chance of a LWO foal?
And how do I know for certain if she is indeed a
sabino or a very, very white frame overo? My mare
is almost completly white 2 blue eyes, with a
medicine hat, and color down her throat and chest.
Coler down her back, extending to her tail and to
either side of her tail on her but. She has a lot
of black almost mottled skin on her body, But a
bunch of it doesn't evan color out. She also has
black mottled skin on her mane crest and on her
tail bone. Her mane and tail are completely white.
The coler that she does have isn't solid, but
looks like lots of speckles all crammed together,
and seems to be fading, as if its roaning.
Thank you for your time. Any information at all
would be greatly appreciated.
Sincerely,
Danielle Williammee
daniellecat@webtv.net
I can send pictures if you'd like.
Danielle Williammee - 06/02/99 15:02:36
My Email:daniellecat@webtv.net
Color Question:: overo or sabino?
I recently bought a very nice paint mare. Her
papers have her down as a palomino overo. Her dam
is a palomino and white frame overo and her sire
is a chesnut and white overo.(although he looks
identical in coloring to one of the sabinos on
your site). I plan to breed my mare next year.I
think she might be a sabino also. Can I breed her
to a frame overo without the chance of a LWO foal?
And how do I know for certain if she is indeed a
sabino or a very, very white frame overo? My mare
is almost completly white 2 blue eyes, with a
medicine hat, and color down her throat and chest.
Coler down her back, extending to her tail and to
either side of her tail on her but. She has a lot
of black almost mottled skin on her body, But a
bunch of it doesn't evan color out. She also has
black mottled skin on her mane crest and on her
tail bone. Her mane and tail are completely white.
The coler that she does have isn't solid, but
looks like lots of speckles all crammed together,
and seems to be fading, as if its roaning.
Thank you for your time. Any information at all
would be greatly appreciated.
Sincerely,
Danielle Williammee
daniellecat@webtv.net
I can send pictures if you'd like.
Danielle Williammee - 06/02/99 14:59:57
My Email:daniellecat@webtv.net
Color Question:: overo or sabino?
I recently bought a very nice paint mare. Her papers have her down as a palomino overo. Her dam is a palomino and white frame overo and her sire is a chesnut and white overo.(although he looks identical in coloring to one of the sabinos on your site). I
lan to breed my mare next year.I think she might be a sabino also. Can I breed her to a frame overo without the chance of a LWO foal? And how do I know for certain if she is indeed a sabino or a very, very white frame overo? My mare is almost completly w
ite 2 blue eyes, with a medicine hat, and color down her throat and chest. Coler down her back, extending to her tail and to either side of her tail on her but. She has a lot of black almost mottled skin on her body, But a bunch of it doesn't evan color
out. She also has black mottled skin on her mane crest and on her tail bone. Her mane and tail are completely white. The coler that she does have isn't solid, but looks like lots of speckles all crammed together, and seems to be fading, as if its roaning.
Thank you for your time. Any information at all would be greatly appreciated.
Sincerely,
Danielle Williammee
daniellecat@webtv.net
I can send pictures if you'd like.
Cherie - 05/26/99 17:55:05
Color Question:: To: Zynyth....
First we need to know a little about the mare and stallion color, if either of them is sorrel, then you don't have a cremello, I am going to guess you have one of the rare frame overo's that come out completely white, or you have a Frame/Sabino cross that
had a bonnet head with two blue eyes. If it is the first, then there are probably little or no spots of pigment, but should be some by the tail and top of the head/ears, in the second case there should be mottled skin under the white hair all over the bod
(pics soon on the web site of this type of horse) I believe the APHA does have a 'white, breeding stock' catagory, so the horse would be registered this way if all the requirements fit. You could have him tested by one of the genetic labs to see if he ca
ries the overo gene (making him a really loud overo) and if he doesn't, then he is a really loud sabino. At any rate, I see no problem with breeding him to a quarter horse mare, as long as she doesn't have bloodlines known for crop outs, (such as the sonn
dee bars) or you can have her tested for the frame overo gene just to be sure. It would be interesting to see if he throws a solid or not, geneticly it should be possible.
I agree, even an all white frame overo is not really an albino. Just to be on the safe side, please let me know the color of his sire and dam, and I can tell you if he is cremello or not.
Thanks! :0)
Cherie - 05/26/99 17:41:41
Color Question:: to: 3 M Ranch....
All buckskins have a black gene, shown by the black mane and tail, otherwise they would be palomino! Picture of her would be great if the coon tail is very obvious on her, some buckskins have 'frosting' on their mane and tails, very pretty, but is not rel
ted to the coon tail gene.
Terri - 05/19/99 15:48:47
My Email:3mranch@gateway.net
Color Question:: Cremello
If you would like a picture of a Cremello stallion registered a paint breeding stock, I'll be glad to supply one. You've done a excellent job on the color definations. I have a golden buckskin AQHA yearling filly that has white hairs (raccoon tail) at t
e base of her tail and in her mane. Does she still express the black gene? Manythanks!
Donna - 05/17/99 15:54:15
My Email:zynyth@prodigy.net
Color Question:: Pure White/blue eyes
I am convinced from the research I have done, the articles I have read and the pictures I have seen that my yearling colt should've been a lethal white. The Stallion ( an Overo Skip Stallion) fits the description and the mare although QH, I was told she w
s paint breedstock.
It is hard to refer to them as Albinos b/c although the iris is blue the pupil is not deep red.The skin is not milky or translucent but pink.Why is there not a classification that states these horses are just white?? What would happen if I bred him to a b
ack QH mare? Would this be dangerous?? I belive my horse is just a blessing,no one can explain it to me, one Vet says he is White, another says he is a Creamolla, he is clearly white though.
Any input would be appreciated.
Thanks
Cherie - 05/12/99 22:18:41
My Email:cherielynn@rocketmail.com
Color Question:: What Color will my foal be?
That is the most commonly asked question, we will see if I can keep up with them, I may have to bone up on how these guest books work, or link a free buliton board site to this page for future use. I only get to work on my site about once a week, so pleas
be patient.