TC: Was the physical decline obvious to you in the period you were around him?

DB: Oh, absolutely. You could tell that he wasn't healthy. I understand that part of his problem was a liver disorder and that was causing some of the bloating. There was so much speculation about what was wrong with him when he died; I heard so many stories. But I know his mama died of a liver ailment and apparently he had some genetic inclinations towards that himself. When the liver's not functioning properly it has a tendency to swell and bloat the person. I think it was a combination of many things with him but the thing that I missed the most is that you didn't see any vitality in him. He could get out there and he could hammer it, he could sing and he'd do his best, but everthing was going wrong for him. It was excruciatingly painful to watch his behavior and to see that he was not maintaining any good health.

As a result of that I think my tolerance of who I called the 'good ol' boys', his 'Memphis Mafia' group, was pretty low. Charlie Hodge seemed to be the real loyal one to me because he was really the whipping boy and yet he stayed loyal to Elvis 100%. I wasn't really around many of those guys too much. I thought Lamar Fike was like a big ol' goofy guy - he was always the brunt of a lot of fat jokes. They always seemed to make fun of him and not take him too seriously. It was really hard to tell the depth and intelligence of any of those people at the time it was all goin' on, because just from an observation standpoint they didn't seem to be a very smart group. We always just saw'em doin' their good-ol'-boy- yahoo- takin'-themselves-seriously-Memphis-Mafia bullshit, and never really got to know any of them at all as individuals. I thought that Jerry Schilling was a pretty nice guy and there was perhaps a couple of other ones. But I didn't really have much respect for those guys.

I never got along with Red West right from the beginning, and I think that 'Elvis: What Happened?' book that he wrote with Sonny West and Dave Hebler pretty much typified them, but of course they were pissed off because he fired 'em. But I think comin' out with that book was a chicken-shit thing to do and it made me believe I'd been even more accurate in my summation of who they were and how they were. But then I read that interview you did with Red in your magazine and perhaps I've had the wrong idea of him. After reading that I can see there was a lot more to Red than I ever gave him credit for. I realize that those guys had their feelings hurt and all that kind of stuff, but I mean he poked fun at me on stage way more than I would like. He actually embarrassed me very, very much a couple of times to where he obviously was just makin' fun of me to be mean. But I still always tried to remain loyal to the man that I knew and loved, because I felt like he was ill and I felt like his mental state wasn't healthy and certainly his physical state was not healthy. And I don't believe that all those people he had around him had his best interests at heart at all - only their own. They had nothing else in life than to be one of Elvis' cronies. The whole thing just got real depressing to me.

TC: You were there right through 1974 - one of the few years he made no proper studio recordings, but he toured a lot and I've worked out, as best as I can figure it, you played around 181 shows with him - that's including matinee and evening shows and all the ones in Vegas...

DB: Boy, you certainly know all there is to know, don't you! 181 shows? I know that we were real, real busy that first year. Somebody told me that '74 might have been his busiest touring year.

TC: You mentioned Houston was your favourite gig. Do any of the others stand out in particular?

DB: Yeah, when we played my hometown of Baton Rouge. That was fun to be able to go to my hometown playin' bass in Elvis Presley's band - shit, it don't come no better than that! It was like...Good God Almighty! That was one of the major highlights for me, that show in Baton Rouge. And going back to Memphis with him after 13 years to record that live album, and of course the deal in Houston. Those are what I consider to be the highlights of my time with him. Of course I'll never forget being pulled out to sing that song in Lake Tahoe, but that was a real freak thing to happen. I guess the thing I enjoyed the most and something I never got tired of was the way he came out on stage. After the big introduction then us going into 'See See Rider' and him walkin' on stage and those people goin' nuts when they'd see him for the first time, it never failed to amaze me the total, absolute support and adoration the fans had for him. Even as they saw him going down and screwing up and maybe not liking his behaviour and stuff like that, when it came down to lovin' Elvis they just couldn't help it; they loved him no matter what he did.

TC: Shortly before you left you played on the 'Elvis Today' sessions. What are your memories of those sessions?

DB: It was done live in the studio - that's the way he liked to do it. He wanted it to be as much like a live show as possible. As best as I can remember it, we had been off a little while and we went into the studio and it was like a rehearsal recording. I had got pretty comfortable on bass by this point, but from what I understand they went back in later and someone else overdubbed bass over my playing.

TC: Yes. Two other bass players, Norbert Putnam and Mike Leech, put down new bass lines on all the tracks apart from 'T-R-O-U-B-L-E (audio file)' - that's what the session files say.

DB: I don't know whether they didn't like what I played - perhaps my parts were horrible, I don't know. But I was gone not too long after that and don't know whether they took me off the album just to be mean or not. I don't know. I understand from speakng to Joe Tunzi that there are some tapes around with my playing still on 'em - the original session tapes, before they were overdubbed for release. I thought 'T-R-O-U-B-L-E' was great. I loved that. He was so good at that syncopated funky stuff and always had lots of fun with it. That's my kinda' thing, and I was amazed he wasn't doing more of that stuff. But he so enjoyed doing all those big ballads like 'You Gave Me A Mountain' and 'My Way' - that shit just bored me to death. I hated to see him out there doin' that when he could've been really shakin' it.

TC: A great out take of'Tiger Man' cut at those sessions emerged recently...

DB: Yeah, that was on that tape you sent me, I honestly don't specifically remember that because we would go off - constantly in just the weirdest directions. It's like whatever he would have a whim to do, that's what we ended up doing. That's what used to terrify me on the shows. Somebody would call a song out from the audience and he'd turn around and say it to the band and I didn't have a clue what the hell we were doing'. He'd just bounce off into an idea that came into his head and we'd run off after him real quick. I don't know how many times Glen D saved my ass by showing me the chord changes'.

TC: After the March '75 'Elvis Today' sessions you went out to do another season in Vegas, and that was the last time you worked with him ...

DB: Yes it was.

TC: Did you know it would be your last job with him at that time?

DB: I was about ready to quit.

TC: Had somebody mentioned to you that Jerry Scheff was wanting to come back?

DB: No, not at all. Ronnie Tutt knew that I was not happy, but I just couldn't understand how the whole organization was the way it was. I didn't understand why he was pickin' on me on stage the way he was, and I told Ronnie, "if they don't like the way I play then let them get somebody else". Well I had been workin' with Fender, field-testing amplifiers and stuff for 'em, and on the last night of the show one of the people from the company was there..and it's really funny how I kinda' got my last lick in on my way out. They guy came in with some water pistols and ended up givin' Elvis a water gun. Well man, you don't do that - that can cause all sorts of trouble. And you never knew about Elvis on stage with water, y'know. He'd be takin' a drink from a cup of water and then he'd just turn around and throw it on somebody. He thought that was a big laugh. He would nearly always do it to Glen D., but Glen D had his eye on him and he'd duck behind the piano and the water would go right on by him.

He threw water on me one time and I asked him not to ever do it again. He tried to throw it on my crotch to make it look like I'd pissed on myself. Just throwing the water would've been bad enough, but it was an insult - he wanted to see me standing there like I'd pissed down my leg, except it hit my bass. You're talkin' about water directly on my electric bass, and boy that's dangerous. After he did that something else was goin' on, I think somebody else was singin' and as he stood there on the riser I leaned forward to him and I said, "Man, I'd really appreciate it if you kept the water off my instrument" and he never acknowledged that I had said anything, but I was furious about it. He could've fried my ass up there, and if he didn't care anymore about the whole thing then the writing was on the wall for me.

This was not bein' fun anymore. But anyway on that last show this guy gives him a goddamned water pistol, and you know how he became with the introductions - everybody had to play a solo now. And I am not a solo player, but I tried because that's what he wanted us to do, but he was never satisfied with it. On one show he even said, "Now this guy, I could play bass better than him when I was a kid with a broom. Take it, Duke." So you could see the writing was on the wall. I played for him as good as I could possibly know how and Ronnie Tutt made me play better than I ever really was. Jerry Scheff was a 'busy' bass player and they liked that, so I became a 'busy' bass player - I played a lot of notes because evidently that's what he liked. But he started getting a little abusive and that wasn't right, it wasn't necessary. But anyway, I'm rambling on here and I'm supposed to be tellin' you about the water gun thing.

This was the last night, the last show I did with him in Vegas. Now he's arrived with a friggin' water pistol and he's comin' down the line startin' the introductions, and I know he's just gonna humiliate me with that goddamned gun. And I look at the guy I know from Fender and I flipped him the bird, like "You son-of-a-bitch, I can't believe you did this'. And he smiled, he reached into his pocket and he pulled out one that was twice as big as the one he gave Elvis. Everybody on stage knew he was gonna be abusive with that thing he'd already started squirtin' The Stamps - and it was obvious that when he got down to me he was gonna have a big time with my ass. Well the guy from Fender slid the pistol across the stage behind his back over into the corner where Kathy Westmoreland was standing. Kathy knew he was gonna get me, and as Elvis turned his back on us to say something to the audience, Kathy just heaved it across the stage to me. I was still playin' this point, but I laid my right hand out and it landed right in my hand - boy, it was like somethin' out of a movie. So I hid it behind my back, stuck it in my waistband, and never missed a beat - he never suspected a thing! So he goes through the whole introduction thing, dragging it all out and making everybody play a solo. I had to follow Ronnie every damn time and, jesus, how do you follow something like that? The man's just a monster drummer.

But Elvis comes up to me and he has the gun and he says, "and this guy..." and he's pointing the gun at me. He says. "And this guy.", and I stop playing, reach behind me and pull my gun out. Well his face just dropped and he said, "Oh, that's the way it's gonna be, is it?" I said, "Yeah, that's the way it's gonna be". So he put his gun down by his side and I put my gun down, and he's still got the microphone - he never knew when to take that microphone away from his mouth, that's why so much odd stuff would get picked up every now and then. He starts to count, he's obviously gonna count to three and then we're gonna draw. Well as soon as he got to two, I picked up my gun and I squirted his ass. I had him all in the face, all in the eyes took him by complete surprise. Over the microphone he's sayin'. "You son-of-a-bitch!" I just kept squirtin' him and it was wonderful! He could've dumped water on me, he could've come and karate-plucked my eyes out or anything, but I had my moment. I fought dirty, I didn't wait for him to get to three, but I was always taught to get the first punch in!

TC: After that last show did someone tell you that they wouldn't be using you again?

DB: Actually they didn't. But I think all of us pretty much knew it was over. I went to the last little gathering at the end of the show and everybody was real quiet. I had already let go of my TCB. Ronnie Tutt told me that Gerald, the bass player with The Sweet Inspirations, had lost his TCB. He was no longer with them by this point, but he treasured his TCB and wore it everywhere he went. Well he lost it when he was playing football and it broke his heart because he was so proud of it. He wanted another one but they wouldn't give him one, so Ronnie Tutt gave him his. Ronnie had asked for one on his behalf but there was no way they were gonna give him one. I couldn't believe it. The blood and guts that Ronnie Tutt had pumped into that show. If that wasn't worth another chain and a TCB then I don't know what was.

It made me realize that they were not a good thinking, kind group of people. So that last night in the dressing-room, as I was packing up I took my TCB off and gave it to Ronnie. I said. "Take this, I don't want it. I never was good in fraternities. Every time I tried to join a club, an organization or something like that, I never fit in." I never fit in this time - that's the way it felt. After that I went on upstairs to see everybody and say goodbye, and I guess it'd already been mentioned that my contract wasn't gonna be renewed, 'cause everybody was real quiet. I just hugged everybody, shook hands and walked out of there, and that was the end of it.

TC: Did you ever see Elvis again?

DB: Never did. I wish I had've called up Diskin's office and quit, but I didn't. I should have and I wanted to, but they got word to me that Jerry Scheff was comin' back and that my services were no longer needed.

TC: Have you ever seen any of the guys in the band since then?

DB: I saw Ronnie and Glen D with John Denver or Neil Diamond - somebody like that. I saw Joe Guercio with Diana Ross when she came through Baton Rouge. I got to meet Jerry Scheff and what a tremendous guy he is. I had a ball with him. He was just as fine as he could be. But I'd like everyone to know that I love Glen D. Hardin. I'm not kiddin' you, that ol' boy was my saviour so many, many times. He knew I was out of my league but he was always a real cool hand about how one should deal with all that kind of thing. It's probably been around 12 years since I've seen any of the guys.

But I spoke to James Burton on the phone a while back - he's just gettin' over an accident he had and he's feelin' much better. What I did not enjoy within the organization and the way the people were, it was made up for by the band and the singers - the show people were some of the finest people I've ever been around in my life. They were just fine, fine people. I loved playin' in that rhythm section - my God, what a treat' to have been able to participate in something like that was like a dream come true.

TC: Can you remember where you were when you heard he'd died?

DB: Yes I can. I was still livin' in L.A and we were waitin' for our second child to be born. We had both our children at the house with midwives. I had taken a job with some friends of mine who paint houses, and I got home that afternoon and my wife met me and told me the news. I couldn't believe it. Even knowing that he was sick and that things were not well with him, you couldn't imagine him dead. I don't know, it thunderstruck me.

There was a high school down the road where I used to go runnin' on their track, so I threw my clothes off, I put my shorts on and didn't even put on any runnin' shoes. I just took off and ran barefoot all the way down the road. And I remember my ears were ringing - my throat was just a big solid lump and my ears were ringing, I just ran and ran and ran, and the sprinkler systems came on, I was runnin' through all the sprinklers and finally I just broke down, fell on my knees and cried like a baby. I don't remember, I don't know why I was crying I think it was because first of all I was happy for him 'cause that was gonna be his only release. He would never be able to get out of his cage, he would never be able to do anything that had any peace connected to it..that was his only way out. And I was crying for all of us too, because we weren't gonna have him anymore. Yeah, I remember that day.

TC: Do you get many people calling you up wanting to talk about Elvis?

DB: Not really A couple of the local papers have done little things over the years. There's one young man in South Carolina and he found me a couple of years ago through my brother. He's one of these totally devoted fans and wants to know everything about everything. About once every two or three months he'll call me up with a list of questions and he's a real nice guy - a real devoted fan But this is the first time I've ever done an interview like this about it, and I've enjoyed talking about it. I don't want anyone to think that by telling you what I've told you that I'm trying to make him look bad or anything, but you wanted the truth and I've told you things as they appeared to me and as I best remember them. I don't want to say anything bad about him because I think he was a product of his environment, and his environment was one of the main problems that he had.

I still love him to this day and I just wanted to tell it to you the way that it was from my point of view. Those little magazines you put together are good - there's no bullshit, just factual, straight shooting articles. I really enjoyed the bunch you sent me. I just hope I've given you something that's of interest and something you can use. I've really enjoyed talking about it.

TC: Thank you very much for your time.

DB: It's been my pleasure, Trevor. Long live The King!

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