Volume IV: Document Supplement, Part B

701

Monica S. Lewinsky Statements

702

REFERRAL TOTHE

UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

PURSUANTTO TITLE 28, UNITEDSTATES CODE,§ 595( c)

DQCUMENT SUPPLEMENT B

SUBMITTEDBY THEOFFICEOFTHEINDEPENDENTCOUNSEL

SEPTEMBER 9,1998

703

Table of Contents

704

705

595( c) REPORT DOCUMENT SUPPLEMENT B - LEWINSKY STATEMENTS

INDEX

I TAB I DESCRIPTION

I 1. I 2/ l /98 Handwritten Proffer of Monica Lewinsky I

1 5. /

1 7. I 8. t

9. 10. L 11.

12.

I 13. 8/ 6/ 98 Grand Jury Testimony of Monica S. Lewinsky

8/ 20/ 98 Grand Jury Testimony of Monica S. Lewinsky Grand Jury Exhibit ML- l - 2/ l/ 98 Handwritten Proffer of Monica Lewinsky Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 2 - 7/ 28/ 98 Agreement between the United States and Monica Lewinsky

Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 3 - Draft Jane Doe Affidavit Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 4 - Affidavit of Jane Doe #6 signed by Monica S. Lewinsky on l/ 7/ 98

Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 5 - points to make in affidavit Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 6 - Definition of Sexual Relations Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 7 - Chart of Contacts between the President and Monica Lewinsky

Grand Jury E, xhibit ML- 8 - Photograph of Clinton Family taken 6/ 24/ 98 Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 9 - Photograph of President Clinton taken 7/ 6/ 98 Grand Jury Exhibit ML- l 0 - Photograph of President Clinton taken 7/ 9/ 98 14. Grand Jury Exhibit ML- l 1 - Photocopy of video tape dated 8/ 6/ 98 entitled “WJC

Rose Garden Speech - Gun Control TIE” 15. 8/ 26/ 98 OIC Deposition of Monica Lewinsky 16. l/ 16/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 17. 5/ 28/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky

I 18. I 7/ 27/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky -~--- l

I 19. I 7129198 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky ~---- I

20. 7/ 30/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky

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TAB DESC~ PTION 21. 7/ 3 l/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 22. 8/ l/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 23. 8/ 2/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 24. 8/ 3/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 25. 814198 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 26. 8/ S/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 27. 8/ l l/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 28. 8/ l 3/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 29. 8/ l 9/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 30. 8124198 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 31. 8126198 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 32. 913 - 916198 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 33. 9/ 3/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 34. 9/ 5/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 35. 9/ 6/ 98 OIC- 302 of Monica Lewinsky 36. Tape Transcript of Search. 001 (Lewinsky’s Apartment) 37. Lewinsky Apt. - Tape 002 - Search Want

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Tab 2

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Q Okay. Did you ever have sexual intercourse with the President?

A No.

Q Was there ever a time when your genitals actually touched each other?

A Grazed each other, yes.

Q And do you remember when that occurred? A Yes. February 28, 1997. Oh, no. I'm sorry. March 29th, not February 28th. Sorry.

Q Okay. And could you explain why you didn't have sexual intercourse with him?

A He didn't want to. The President said that he -- that at his age, that there was too much of a consequence in doing that and that when I got to be his age I would understand. But I wasn't happy with that.

Q Okay. I want to move away from that now. A Okay.

Q And ask you whether or not you've ever spoken to the President on the telephone.

since the spoken to

Yes.

And can you estimate approximately how many times beginning of your relationship with him that you've him on the phone? Over 50, probably. And has he initiated any of those calls?

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22 A Yes.

Q Do you have any sort of idea how many times he's called you?

A Most of those phone calls were calls that he placed to me directly.

Q Okay. Did he ever leave any messages for you at your home?

A Yes.

Q And you remember about how many times he left messages?

A I think about four.

Q Did you save any of those messages? A Yes, I did.

Q And have you provided any cassette tape of those messages to the OIC?

A Yes, I have.

Q Do you remember any particular messages that he left you?

A I remember them all.

Q Okay. Why don't you just tell the grand jury what they say. -.

A They're pretty innocuous. Sometimes -- or one time, it was, you know, "Sorry I missed you." One time, it was just "Hello." And then one time he called really late at night when I was not at home and it was whispered kind of

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loudly, you know, "Come on. It's me." Something like thaz. It was always nice to hear his voice.

Q Okay. Did he ever tell you how he felt about leaving messages on your home machine?

A Yes.

Q What did he tell you about that? A I believe it was the beginning of 1996, at some point, he just remarked that he didn't like to do that, he just -- 1 think felt it was a little unsafe.

Q Okay. Did he ever call you late at night? A Yes.

Q Can you tell us a little bit about that? Did that happen on many occasions?

A Yes. He's a night owl, so it would be customary for him to call sometimes 2: 00 in the morning, 2: 30 in the morning.

Q Okay. What sorts of things did you- discuss with - him generally of a non- sexual nature on your telephone calls with him?

A Similar to what we discussed in person, just how we were doing. A lot of discussions about my job, when I was

. . trying to come back to the White House and then once

I decided to move to New York. We told jokes. We talked about everything under the sun.

Q Okay. Was there ever a time that you began to

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engage in A

phone sex on the telephone? Mm- hmm. Yes. And do you remember when that started to occur? In the beginning of 1996. Okay. Did he participate in that?

Yes.

Okay. And about how many times did you have phone sex with him, if you know?

A Oh, maybe 10, 15

sure. I'm not really -- I'm not really

Q Okay. We can look at the chart after to refresh your recollection, but that sounds sort of ballpark?

A I think so.

Q More than 10, about? In your view? A Yes, I think so.

Q Did the President ever tell you that he wanted to end the sexual relationship with you? ._

A Yes.

Q And did he tell you that more than once? A Yes.

Q Could you tell us when he told you that? ,.

A February -- it was Presidents Day of 1996. I think that's February 19th. And also on May 24, 1996 -- no, 1997. I'm sorry.

Q And just for the grand jury's information, on the

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25 chart that we're going to show them in a little bit, how do you list -- do you have a term that you refer to the May 24, 1997 meeting with him?

A D- day.

Q And what does that stand for? A Dump day.

Q And on those two occasions, what did he tell you about wanting to end the relationship? Just generally.

A Both were, I think, motivated sort of by guilt and just not wanting to -- more I think on the 24th of May in '97, just really wanting to do the right thing in God's eyes and do the right thing for his family and he just -- he didn't feel right about it.

Q Did you engage in sexual contact with him after those times?

A Yes. Kissing.

Q Okay. After the -- well, after the-- February 19, - 1996 time?

A Yes. Yes.

Q And what about after the May 24, 1997 time? A Just kissing. . . Q Did your relationship involve giving gifts to each other?

A Mm- hmm. Yes. I'm sorry.

Q And did you give any gifts to him?

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A Yes.

Q Do you have any sort of ballpark figure of how many gifts you've given to him since you've known him?

A About 30.

Q And what about him to you? Do you have any estimate of how many gifts he gave you?

A I think about 18.

Q Did you ever write him any notes or letters or cards?

A Yes.

Q And what sort of cards or letters or notes would you write to him?

A It varied on the occasion. It could be a funny card that I saw or a Halloween card. If I was angry, it could be an angry letter. If I was missing him, it was a missing him letter.

Q Okay. So were some of them -- is it fair to say some of them were romantic in nature?

A Yes.

I ~ Q

And when they were angry, what would you be angry about in your letters or cards? ._

A Either job- related issues or him not paying enough attention to me.

Q Okay. Did he write you any letters or notes? A No.

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Q Did he ever say why he wasn't writing you any letters or notes?

A No. MS. IMMERGUT: I'd now like to show you what I had previously marked as Exhibit 7, I believe. Perhaps somebody has the other original version.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. k- 7 was marked for identification.) BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q I'm going to place this before you and ask if you recognize that chart.

A Yes, I do.

Q And have you seen that chart before? A Yes, I have.

Q Did you assist the Office of Independent Counsel in preparing that chart?

A Yes.

Q Did you provide all of the information that's listed on that chart?

A Yes.

Q Could you describe for the grand jury just generally what is described by that chart?

A I think it's a chronology that marks some of the highlights of my relationship with the President. It definitely includes the visits that I had with him and

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25 most of the gifts that we exchanged. It reflects most of I

the phone calls that I remember.

Q And to the best of your knowledge, is the chart I

accurate? A Yes.

Q Have you noticed anything that you would add or _- delete from the chart since you've reviewed it?

A Yes. On page -- MS. IMMERGUT: Do the grand jurors have the chart? MR. EMMICK: They do. Yes.

THE WITNESS: On page 5, the last entry in the

chart, on 10/ 23, I attended a Democratic fundraiser that you guys have all probably seen on T. V. lately.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Okay. Anything else that you've noticed? A No.

Q Okay. Otherwise, would you say that the chart is a pretty accurate rendition or description of your memory of all of the events?

A Yes.

Q How is it that you remember all the events in such detail over really sort of what is a few years?

A I've always been a date- oriented person and I had a -- probably a habit of circling dates in my Filofax when I either talked to the President or saw him.

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Q And did you provide those Filofax sheets to the Office of Independent Counsel?

A Yes.

Q And did that assist you in remembering the dates? A Yes, it did.

Q And were these encounters important to you? A Very.

Q And, again, on that chart there are various categories. In the visit category -- or descriptions in the visit category area that are described as physical intimacy. And with respect to all of those, do they fall within the definition of sexual relations that I've presented as Exhibit 6 to the grand jury?

A Yes.

Q So anywhere physical intimacy is listed on the chart, it falls within that definition. Is that correct?

A Right. I think the only thing that- might be missing is kissing.

chart, is A

A Okay. And kissing is separately described on the

it not? No, not necessarily.

. . Okay.

I mean, because the physical intimacy -- wherever there's physical intimacy, there was always -- there was always kissing.

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Q Okay. But where there's physical intimacy, there I

was also then more than kissing. A Correct.

Q Okay. So physical intimacy is never on the chart to describe only kissing.

A Correct.

Q Okay. There's one particular date also that I wanted to cover with you which is February 28, 1997.

A Okay _ Q Because at that time, as the chart demonstrates, you haven't really seen the President since April of the year before. Could you describe what the circumstances were leading up to your visit with him on February 28, 1997?

A The President had told me in December that he had a Christmas present for me and I ended up not getting it until the end of February. Ms. Currie called me at work during that week to -- or I guess it was that day, I. '- m sorry, that -- Friday, to invite me to a radio address that evening.

I went to the radio address and when I went to take my picture with the President, he said to go see Betty because he had something to give me after. So I waited a little while for him and then Betty and the President and I went into the back office.

Q Okay. Anti why did Betty come in the back office with you?

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31 A I later found out that -- I believe it was Stephen oodin who said to Ms. Currie and the President that the resident couldn't be alone with me, so Ms. Currie came back nto the back office with us.

Q And then what? A And then left.

Q Okay. She left? And do you know where she went? A I came to learn later, I believe she was in the antry. In the back pantry.

Q Okay. And how did you learn that later? A I think that Mr. Nelvis told me. Or Ms. Currie old me.

Q Okay. What happened when she went to the back antry? Did you remain with the President?

A Yes, I did.

Q And could you describe what you and the President id? . _

A Mm- hmm. He gave me my hat pin and the book Leaves of Grass" and I was pestering him to kiss me and so e moved -- that was in the back study and then we moved over o the back hallway by the bathroom and we were physically . .

ntimate.

Q Okay. And did you perform oral sex on that ccasion?

A Yes.

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Q And how did you -- do you remember what dress you were wearing on that occasion?

A Yes.

Q What dress was it? A The navy blue dress from The Gap.

Q And after that incident, did you ever tell Linda Tripp that there might be the President's semen on that dress?

A Yes, I did.

Q And why did you tell her that? Or did you believe that that could be true?

A I thought it was possible.

Q Were you positive it was true? A No.

Q Back to the incident with the President, how did you leave it with him on that occasion? Sort of once you finished the visit, what happened? -_

A Betty came back into the back study and then I think Ms. Currie walked me out.

Q Okay. How much about your relationship with the President did you tell Linda Tripp?

A A lot. Most everything.

Q Okay. And did you tell her about the sexual encounters that you had with him?

A Yes.

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753 Q Did you also tell her about the emotional encounters and the gifts?

A Yes. Q Were you truthful about the relationship when you told Linda Tripp about it?

A Most of the time, but sometimes -- there were occasions when I wasn't truthful.

Q Were you truthful about the sexual parts of the relationship with her?

A Yes.

Q And what about the emotional component, when you would tell her -- and why don't I 1997, were you truthful about the relationship?

A Yes. say before December of

emotional components of the

Q I'm actually done with my questioning on that. Do you want to break now or continue to different subjects? -

A A five- minute break? could I -- THE MS. MR. MS. THE MR.

FOREPERSON: We can take a ten- minute break. IMMERGUT: Okay. A ten- minute break. EMMICK: A ten- minute break. .

IMMERGUT: Would that be all right? WITNESS: Okay. EMMICK: That's fine. (Witness excused. Witness recalled.)

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34 MS. IMMERGUT: Madam Foreperson, are there any unauthorized persons present?

THE FOREPERSON: No, there are none. MS. IMMERGUT: Do we have a quorum? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we do. Ms. Lewinsky, I would like to remind you that you are still under oath.

THE WITNESS: Thank you. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Ms. Lewinsky, the grand jurors had a few follow- up questions --

A Sure.

Q -- for you that I wanted to ask you before we move on to other topics. You mentioned that on the occasions where you had sexual contact with that were described, sexual contact with the President, that it occurred in the hallway, as you described, or sometimes in the back study. -

A Mm- hmm.

Q Why did -- A JUROR: Pardon me. BY MS. IMMERGUT: . Q Oh, excuse me. Why did you choose the hallway? A Because I believe it was -- it was really more the President choosing the hallway, I think, and it was -- there weren't any windows there. It was the most secluded of all

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35 the places in the back office. Well, that's not true. The bathroom is the most secluded, I guess, because you can close the door.

Q And did you sometimes have sexual encounters in the bathroom?

A Mm- hmm.

Q And then next to the bathroom, would you say that the hallway is --

A Right.

Q __ off the study is the next most -- A He has a bad back and so I think a lot of times we ended up just sort of standing there and talking there because he could close the door to the bathroom and lean up against the bathroom and then he was -- I guess it made his back feel better and also made him a little shorter. So --

Q Did the President ever tell you he was concerned about being seen? .

A I'm sure that came up in conversation. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Did he ever indicate to you looking outside that he might be concerned, for example?

A Yes, yes. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Can you describe that? A Sure. I think the one that comes to mind was

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actually December 28th of last year when I was gettin? ny Christmas kiss. And he was kissing me in the doorway between the back study, or the office, and the hallway, and I sort of opened my eyes and he was looking out the window with his eyes wide open while he was kissing me and then I got mad because it wasn't very romantic. And then so then he said, "Well, I was just looking to see to make sure no one was out there .I’

Q Can you generalize about the locations where you had your sexual encounters with the President?

A I'd say they mainly took place in that hallway, but there were occasions on which we were intimate in the office and then also in the bathroom.

Q Okay. And when you say the office, do you mean the back study?

A Right.

Q So not the Oval Office? . . A No, no, we were never physically intimate in the Oval Office.

Q Okay. Did you notice whether doors when you were physically intimate with him in or hallway?

A No, he always -- well, I'm not going in the dining room but I know that from the back hallway to the -- into the

sure the door leading Oval Office was

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always kept ajar so that he could hear if someone was coming. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q How ajar? How much ajar? A Maybe this much (indicating).

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q You're indicating six to eight inches, something like that?

A I'm not very good with that. Q A foot or less, something like that? A A foot or less. I guess that's -- I would assume that's --

Q Enough so that one could hear more easily what was going on in the next room?

A Mm- hmm. Right, or if someone came in to holler for him.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Now directing your attention back to February 28th, -- 1997, the day that you wore the blue cocktail dress --

A It's not a cocktail dress.

Q Okay, I'm sorry. A No, that's okay. I'm a little defensive about this subject. I'm sorry.

Q How would you describe the dress? A It's a dress from the Gap. It's a work. dress. It's a casual dress.

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Q With respect to that dress -- A Right, I'm sorry. Q _- you mentioned that you believe that there could be semen on it. Could you describe what you did with the President that led you to believe that?

A We were in the bathroom and -- can I close my eyes so I don't have to --

Q Well, you have to speak up. That's the only -- A Okay. We were in the bathroom and I was performing oral sex. I'm sorry, this is embarrassing. And usually he doesn't want to -- he didn't want to come to completion.

Q Ejaculate? A Yes. And this has sort of been a subject that we had talked about many times before and he was always saying it had issues to do with trust and not knowing me well enough at first and then not feeling right about things, and not that he said this but I took away from that to sort of mean - that maybe in his mind if he didn't come then maybe it wasn't __ he didn't need to feel guilty about that, that maybe with it not coming to completion that that was easier for him to rationalize.

And it was on this occasion that since we hadn't been alone together since April 7th of '96 that after we had engaged in oral sex for a while and he stopped me .as he normally did, I said to him, you know -- this is so

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embarrassing, I'm sorry. I said to him, you know, I really - - I want to make you come. I mean, this is --

Q -Okay. Why don't you just describe the position that you were in once he had tried to stop you. What did you do that led you to believe there might get semen on your dress?

A I told him that I really cared about him and he told me that he didn't want to get addicted to me and he didn't want me to get addicted to him, and we embraced at that point and that's -- I mean, it was -- it's just a little tiny spot

Q here, you

A or left,

that you A

continue A

semen on A

down here and a little tiny spot up here and -- Okay. And to get -- when you're pointing down mean sort of your right lower hip area? Well, one of my -- 1 don't know if it was my right but lower hip area.

Okay. And the chest area would be the second place thought you might have gotten some? .. Mm- hmm. And is that from when you -- when you did actually to perform oral sex on him later?

I believe so. .

Did you ever see something that you thought was the dress that led you to conclude that?

The next time I went to wear the dress.. So at the time you didn't notice anything on the

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dress? A I don't believe so.

Q Okay. What happened then the next time you wore the dress that led you to conclude that?

A Well, I also -- can I say here? I also -- I think I wore the dress out to dinner that night, so which is why I'm not sure that that's what it is.

Q Okay. A So it could be spinach dip or something. I don't know. I'm sorry, could you repeat the question?

Q Sure. When was the -- when was it that you at least began to believe that maybe there was semen on the dress?

A I really don't remember when it was the next time I went to wear the dress, but I gained weight so I couldn't wear the dress and it didn't fit. And I'm not a very organized person. I don't clean my clothes until I'm going to wear them again.

Q Did you notice there was something on the dress? A Yes. And at that point I noticed it and I kind of thought, oh, this is dirty, it needs to get cleaned. And then I remembered that I had worn it the last time I saw the President, and I believe it was at that point that I thought to myself, oh, no. And it was -- it --

Q So at that point, you weren't positive what it was.

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And why did you tell Linda that you thought there was semen on the dress?

A I think it just sort of came up in conversation somehow and then -- as kind of this funny, gross thing. And then the next time she was at my house I still couldn't fit into the dress and believe that I said to her, oh, look, you want to see this? You know, this is what I was talking about.

And but I just want to say because I know everybody here reads the newspapers and listens to TV that I didn't keep this dress as a souvenir. I was going to wear it on Thanksgiving and my cousins, who I always try to look skinny for because they are all skinny -- and I know it sounds stupid. And when I told Linda I was thinking about wearing the dress, she discouraged me. She brought me one of her jackets from her thinner closet. And so it wasn't a souvenir. I was going to clean it. I was going to wear it again.

Q Different topic. Where was Nel when you were -- or do you have any idea where Nel was when you were in the hallway or the study with the President?

A On which --

Q On any of the occasions. I mean, would Nel be around generally? .

A There were some occasions that -- very few

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occasions, I think, that Nel was there -- was at the White House. And I don't know where he would have necessarily -- I think he was in the pantry on the 28th of February.

Q Do you know where he was on any, of the other occasions? And, again, where you had sexual contact with the President.

A I don't think so.

Q Did you ever use hand towels in the bathroom to wipe your lipstick?

A Hand towels, no.

Q What about tissues? A I believe I used a tissue sometimes to wipe off my lipstick.

MR. WISENBERG: Karen, can I ask something really quick?

MS. IMMERGUT: Sure. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q How about, do you think Nel would have been around on renaissance -- right before the departure for renaissance weekend?

A New Year's Eve '95? - . Q Yeah. A Yes, he was.

Q Also, did you ever show -- did -- I don't -- it's my bad. Did you ever show the dress to Linda Tripp?

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number of sex. Did calls?

he was? A

A from the

the Oval A

A office.

Yes.

MR. EMMICK: You mentioned that the President called you on a occasions. Some of those occasions included phone he indicate where he was when he was placing those

Not always, but sometimes. And where did he say he was when he did say where

At home. Meaning the White House residence? Yes. Where else might he have placed calls from? There were, I think, two times that he placed calls zampaign term, from Florida I think. Do you know whether he sometimes placed calls from >ffice or other places? Yes, yes. How do you know that? Sometimes he would mention it and say he was in the

: know one time I said -- I knew he was in the office and I asked him if he was in the back or could he go in the back.

Q Did he not only call you, what, at your home but also call you at your office?

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A When I was working at the White House, yes.

Q But not while you were working at the Pentagon? A He never directly called me when I was working at the Pentagon.

Q When you say didn't directly call, what do you mean?

A I mean he -- there were, I think, maybe two occasions when I was working at the Pentagon when Betty placed a call for him, and when that didn't occur he picked up the phone and dialed the phone number himself.

Q When he placed calls to you when you were at Leg Affairs, or Legislative Affairs, excuse me, was there anything that indicated on your caller ID?

A Yes. When he called from the Oval Office, the phones have a caller ID up at the top, and when he calls from the Oval Office it says POTUS and when he calls from the residence it has an asterisk.

Q And did you ever discuss with him the fact that you had POTUS on your ID?

A Yeah.

Q Tell us about that.

. .

A I think one time when he called and I picked up the phone I said something that indicated to him that I knew who it was. And he said, ." Well, how did you know it was me?" And I told him, "Well, don't you know that it lights up POTUS

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when you call from the Oval Office?" And he said, "No, I didn't know that." So I thought that was funny.

A residence

When you -- And he made an effort one time to call me from the on a line and called and said, "Did it show up a phone number instead of -- I1 So it had. He seemed proud of himself.

Q All right. You had mentioned earlier that on, I think it was February 28th, Steve Goodin spoke with Betty and the President about being -- about him being alone with you.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Could you give us a little more detail about what you saw and what you later learned and where you later learned it so that we can figure out what you know from personal knowledge?

A Okay. What I saw was Steve Goodin and Ms. Currie going into the Oval Office. I think --

Q Where are you at this time? A Oh, I'm sorry. I was in Ms. Currie's office and I was waiting with Ms. Currie. And I believe Stephen was there at some point and he might have gone into

. .

first and then called Ms. Currie in a few maybe the President called her in after. of --

A JUROR: (Coughing.) the Oval Office

minutes after or And they spoke sort

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THE WITNESS: Do you want some water? Oh, okay

so -- Q

you know? A

BY MR. EMMICK: Was there anyone else in the Oval Office, as far as

It's possible I think I might have seen Rahm Emanuel in there at some point, but I'm not really sure that he was included in this conversation.

Q So they go into next see or hear?

A I believe Betty the Oval Office, and what do you

came out to get me. I was really nervous because I hadn't been alone with the President since the elections so I was focused -- I was kind of internal, focused on being nervous.

Q Betty came out to get you and what did the two of you do?

A The three of us went into the back office.

Q You had mentioned earlier that you later came to learn that there was a discussion between them, between them, about you and the President and whether you should be alone. Tell us when you learned that approximately

. .

learned. and what you

A I think I learned it, I believe, maybe shortly after -- not on that day, maybe within the next few weeks, guess -- that Stephen had said to the President or maybe had

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said to Betty, you and I don't recall Nel.

47 know, she can't be alone with him. So, if I learned that from Ms. Currie or from

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q But it -- was it when, based on what you were told, it was a conversation between -- it was a conversation which Goodin, Ms. Currie and the President were there?

A Correct. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Let's focus a little bit about the Presidential aides. You mentioned Steve Goodin. Where are the aides at the time you are having your encounters, if we can call that, with the President?

A Most of the time they weren't -- they weren't there. They weren't at the White House.

Q And how was that arranged? them

A When I was working in Legislative Affairs, I don't think -- 1 don't know if it was ever verbally spoken but it was understood between the President and myself that most of the -- most people weren't in on the weekends so there was -- it would be safer to do that then.

And then after I left the White House, that was sort of always a concern that Betty and I had just because she knew and I knew that a lot of people there didn't like me.

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768 Q So is it fair to say then that the Presidential aides, whether they be Steve Goodin or Andrew Friendly or whoever it might be, were not around at the time?

A Correct. They may have been but --

Q Mm- hmm. I wonder if you could expand a little bit on the nature of your relationship with Betty and then the nature of your relationship with Nel, and specifically what we mean to ask is to what extent were these relationships genuine relationships and to what extent were they, in part, based on an interest in cultivating their friendship because of your relationship with the President?

A I think that they -- both of them started out probably at the latter of what you said, as maybe a function of making my relationship with the President easier, or for me, I guess, getting information, but that they both came to have a very genuine component to them. I still care very deeply about Betty.

Q When you talk about getting information, could you expand on what you mean by that?

A I think sometimes if it was from Ms. Currie finding out what the President's schedule was, when he might be

. .

around, what might be a good time to come to talk to him to let him know something.

With Nel, Nel and I developed a started during the furlough and I thought

by or maybe for her friendship that he was a really

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nice guy and didn't get trea ted correctly or properly, I guess. And the kind of information, he sort of just would give me information about the President. I mean, I don't think that was the only -- that wasn't the only component of the friendship, but that was a component of it.

Q You have discussed how Betty helped arrange for you to come visit the President, especially in 1997, I think it would be fair to say.

A Yes.

Q When those arrangements were made, who initiated the arrangements? How did they start off? Did you ask? Did the President ask? Did Betty ask?

A I'd say most of the time it was probably me asking -- either asking the President directly or asking him through Betty or through sending a note of some sort. And there were occasions that he initiated, so it would come through Betty.

Q All right. Let me ask you the following question. You have described the ways that Betty helped let you in --

A Mm- hmm.

Q -- facilitate the relationship, if you will. Do . .

you think Betty Currie knew about your relationship with the President?

A I don't know. It's possible she could have gleaned that from witnessing that the -- you know, that the President

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was having a relationship that caused -- with a 25 year- old woman or, at the time, younger -- you know, that made me

emotional. But I really can't answer that question.

Q She saw you under circumstances where she realized you and the President had an emotional tie.

A I believe so. I'm not really -- I'm not really comfortable sort of answering questions about what -- you know, what Betty knew because --

Q Well, then let me focus more on what Betty was in a position to see.

A Okay.

Q Was Betty in a position to see that you and the President visited frequently and had a strong emotional attachment?

A I believe so, yes.

Q Did you ever expressly tell Betty about the relationship?

emotional A

aspect of What aspect of the relationship?

Well, let me separate it out for you. Okay. Did you ever expressly tell Betty about the aspect of the relationship? I believe I characterized that to her. Did you ever expressly tell Betty about- the sexual the relationship?

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A No, I don't believe so.

Q Let me ask the question, why not? A Because it's not appropriate. I mean, I think -- I don't think people necessarily talk about these things. I mean, there is a difference between a relationship that you have with someone who is sort of involved in a situation, and then the kind of relationship you have with a friend whom you talk to. I think with -- a little bit with Betty's age and it wasn't clear to me that the -- you know, the President didn't tell her so, if he didn't tell her, why should I tell her.

Q Let me ask similar questions about Nel. Do you think Nel knew?

A Nel knew --

Q About the emotional aspect of the relationship? A Yes, I think so.

Q Is that based on what you told him or what you think he must have seen, or both?

A I think probably based more on what I told him.

Q Do you think Nel knew about the sexual aspect of the relationship?

A We never directly discussed it, so I don't know if -- I don't know how to answer that.

Q Did he ever say things to you that made you think that he must know about the sexual aspect of the

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relationship? A Not that I remember. Q You mentioned earlier, perhaps an obvious thing, that you were alone with the President on the times that you had sexual contact with the President.

A Yes.

Q Were there also times President that you did not have President?

A Mm- hmm, yes. when you were alone with the

sexual contact with the

Q Can you give us sort of a general description about how those encounters occurred and where they occurred?

A Okay. There were numerous that ranged from the beginning of our relationship till the end of our relationship.

Q Were some of them brief? Were some of them substantial in length?

A Mm- hmm, yes.

Q Where within the White House would those have occurred?

A One occurred in the Oval Office and then the others occurred -- oh, that's not true. Two occurred in the Oval Office and the others were in the back study area.

I should also just -- maybe I could just add right now that every -- that every time I had a visit with the

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President when I was working there -- not after, but when 1 was working there -- we usually would -- we'd start in the back and we'd talk and that was where we were physically intimate, and we'd usually end up, kind of the pillow talk of it, I guess, was sitting in the Oval Office talking. So there's --

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q And, again, when you say when you started in the back, that could either be the hallway or the back?

A Correct, yes. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q I would like to ask you some questions about any steps you took to try to keep your relationship with the President secret.

A A lot.

Q All right. Well, why don't we just ask the question open- endedly and we'll follow up.

A Okay. I'm sure, as everyone can imagine, that this is a kind of relationship that you keep quiet, and we both wanted to be careful being in the White House. Whenever I would visit him during -- when -- during my tenure at the White House, we always -- unless it was sort of a chance meeting on a weekend and then we ended up back in the office, we would usually plan that I would either bring papers, or one time we had actually accidentally bumped into each other 4

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in the hall and went from that way, so then we planned to do that again because that seemed to work well. But we always - - there was always some sort of a cover.

Q When you say that you planned to bring papers, did you ever discuss with the President the fact that you would try to use that as a cover?

A Yes.

Q Okay. What did the two of you say in those conversations?

A I don't remember exactly. I mean, in general, it might have been something like me saying, well, maybe once I got there kind of saying, "Oh, gee, here are your letters," wink, wink, wink, and him saying, "Okay, that's good," or --

Q And as part of this concealment, if you will, did you carry around papers when you went to the visit the President while you worked at Legislative Affairs?

A Yes, I did.

Q Did you ever actually bring him papers to sign as part of business?

A No.

Q Did you actually bring him papers at all? A Yes.

Q All right. And tell us a little about that. A It varied. Sometimes it was just actual- copies of letters. One time I wrote a really stupid poem. Sometimes I

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put gifts in the foider which I brought.

Q And even on those occasions, was there a legitimate business purpose to that?

A No.

Q Did you have any discussions with the President about what you would say about your frequent visits with him after you had left Legislative Affairs?

A Yes.

Q Yes. What was that about? A I think we -- we discussed backwards route of it was that Betty

that -- you know, the always needed to be the one to clear me in so that, you know, I could always say I was coming to see Betty.

Q And is there some truth in the notion that you were coming to see Betty?

A Coming to see Betty, I don't know. Did I -- I saw Betty on every time that I was there.

Q What was your purpose though in going -- A My purpose was -- most of the time my purpose was to see the President, but there were some times when I did just go see Betty but the President wasn't in the office.

Q When the President was in the office, was your purpose in going there to see the President?

A Yes.

Q What about the writing of things down on paper?

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Was there any discussion between you and the President about the risks of writing things down and whether you should write things down?

A Yes.

Q All right. Tell us about that. A There were on some occasions when I sent him cards or notes that I wrote things that he deemed too personal to put on paper just in case something ever happened, if it got lost getting there or someone else opened it. So there were several times when he remarked to me, you know, you shouldn't put that on paper.

Q We'll have occasion to get into some details about that in a bit. I don't know how to ask this question more delicately, so I'll just ask you. Did you take any steps to try to be careful with how loud you might be in sexual matters?

A Yes.

Q All right. Can you tell us, as discreetly as you can and as -- about that?

A I think we were both aware of the volume and sometimes I'd use my hand -- 1 bit my hand -- so that I wouldn't make any noise.

Q All right, that's fine. Let me ask another question. Did you try’ to take -- are you okay?

A Yeah, this is just embarrassing.

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777 1 Q Did you try to take different routes in and out of 2 the Oval Office area as part of your way of concealing the 3 relationship? 4 A Yes, I did. 5 Q Could you tell us about that? 6 A I made an effort on my own to go out a different 7 door than the door that I came in so that if there was a 8 guard that was on duty in the front of the Oval Office he 9 might see me going in but a different guard would see me 10 leave, so no one would know exactly how long I had been in 11 there. 12 Q Did you try to do that most of the time, all of the 13 time? 14 A I'd say 90 percent of the time. I mean, I can't 15 really recall a time that I didn't do that, but it's 16 possible. That was the pattern. 17 Q Were there some people that you tried to 18 specifically avoid when you were visiting with the President? 19 A Yes. 20 Q All right. Who were they, please? 21 A Pretty much everybody but Betty.

2- 2 Q Okay. What about, for example, Nancy Hernreich? 23 A Yes. 24 Q All right. And how would you take steps-. to avoid 25 Nancy Hernreich?

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58 A Generally, coming in on the weekend. This is after I left?

Q Yes.

A Okay. After I left the White House it was coming in on the weekend or sometimes we -- 1 tried to see him but I don't think it actually ever occurred on Tuesday nights because Ms. Hernreich has yoga, I think -- I believe.

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q Who told you that she had yoga? A Ms. Currie.

BY MR. EMMICK: Q Any discussion with the President about trying to make sure that there are fewer people around when you were to visit?

A When I worked in Legislative Affairs, I think that was sort of the understanding that the weekend was the -- there weren't a lot of people around. And there were times - when I think that the President might have said, oh, there are too many people here because there was some big issue or some big event happening maybe.

Q Were there any occasions when you tried to make .

arrangements to see the President but for some reason or another Betty was not in a position to let you in?

A Sure, I think so. Q Any occasions when you had actually planned to

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visit and then for some reason or another she wasn't there, that you remember?

A No, not that I remember.

Q What about throwing away notes that you had written to the President? Was there any discussion of throwing out the notes or any notations that you would write on the notes to remind him to throw them out?

A Yes, I think that I may have had a discussion with the President about him throwing things away, I think, or making sure that they're not there. I know one specific occasion in one of the notes that I sent him I made a joke that really was reminding him not to -- to make sure he threw the -- make sure he threw it away.

Q I've asked you a number of questions having to do with how you tried to keep the relationship secret. Let me ask, did you tell some people about the relationship?

A Unfortunately, yes. -_ - Q All right. Could you tell us some of the people that you've told about the relationship?

A Linda Tripp, Catherine Davis, Neysa Erbland, Dale Young, Ashley Raines, and my mom and my aunt. Everybody knew

. .

a different amount of -- had a different amount of information.

Q Natalie Ung- vari? A Oh, Natalie Ungvari, yes.

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Q Did you tell any of your -- any counselors or therapists of any kind about your relationship?

A Yes, I did.

Q All right. Would you tell us who they would be? A Dr. Irene Kassorla, and I believe it's Dr. Kathy Estep.

Q When you talked about your relationship with the President with these people, did you lie about your relationship?

A No. I may have not told them every detail, but I don't believe I ever lied. Oh, about the -- oh, wait, do you mean the doctors or was that in general?

Q I meant in general. A Well, there were -- about my relationships -- I'm sorry, could you be more specific?

Q Sure. You listed a number of people that you had told about your relationship with the President.

A Right.

Q I'm just trying to figure out if you told the truth to those people when you described the relationship.

A Yes. There were some occasions when I wasn't . .

truthful about certain things, but not having to do with, I think, the general relationship. Does that make sense?

Q Expand on that just a little. I'm just not sure. A Well, I think with Linda Tripp, I mean there were

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times that I was not truthful with her. I mean, I didn't know if that's what you were encompassing by saying relationship or not.

Q Let's put Linda Tripp aside for a bit because I

think I know what you have in mind. A Right.

Q Put Linda Tripp aside for a bit. Were you truthful with the others about your description of the relationship?

A Yes.

Q And since you mentioned Linda Tripp, were there occasions toward the end of, I guess it would be December or January, when you said some things to Linda Tripp that were not true?

A Yes.

Q All right. We'll have a chance to get to that in a bit.

A Okay.

Q What I would like to turn to next is the -- is April of 1996 and your transfer from the White House to the Department of Defense. When were you first told about the fact that you were being terminated from Legislative Affairs?

. . A On the 5th -- 1 think it was the 5th of April,

Friday.

Q Did you later have a telephone conversation with the President about your being terminated?

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A Yes, I did.

Q When was that? A On the 7th, on Easter.

Q Easter Sunday, April 7th of 1996? A Correct.

Q Would you tell us first what your reaction was wher. you were told that you were going to be terminated from Legislative Affairs?

A My initial reaction was that I was never going to see the President again. I mean, my relationship with him would be over.

Q You did not want to go to the Pentagon? A No.

Q When you spoke with the President on April 7th, did you call him or did he call you?

A He called me.

Q Would you tell us how that telephone conversation - proceeded and then we'll talk about the meeting.

A Okay. I had asked him how -- if he was doing okay with Ron Brown's death, and then after we talked about that for a little bit I told him that my last day was Monday. And he was -- he seemed really upset and sort of asked me to tell him what had happened. So I did and I was crying and I asked him if I could come see him, and he said that that’was fine.

Q Did you go over to the White House?

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14 15 16 A He told me that he thought that my being

17 18 upset. He said, "Why do they have to take you away from me?

21 like that." 22 23 24 Q Right. I guess what I mean by that --. I- 'm sorry, I 25 didn't mean to be that specific.

A Yes, I did. Q About what time of day, if you remember? A I think it was around 6: 00 p. m.

Q Who let you in? A I had a pass at the time.

Q How long did you visit with the President that day? A Maybe a half an hour. I'm not very good with the time estimates.

Q You've already had occasion to talk a little bit about the sexual aspect of your encounter with the President at that time and the phone call that you -- that came in in the midst. I'm not going to ask you about that. What I am going to ask you about instead was your discussions with the President about the termination and about what the future would hold for you.

transferred had something to do with him and that he was I trust you." And then he told me -- he looked at me and he said, "1 promise you if I win in November I'll bring you back

Q How were things left at the end of that meeting? A I sort of ran out.

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A Okay.

Q At the end of the meeting, were you going to go to the Pentagon?

A Well, he was going to see what he could do.

Q I see. All right. A He said he'd try to see. He said he was going to ask -- try to find out what had happened. And I told him that I was going to be meeting with Ms. Hernreich the next day and he sort of said, "Let me see what I can do."

President A

A Did you later have a telephone call with the

where you discussed what he had learned? Yes. When was that? The following Friday. That would have been then April 12th? Yes, I think so. Did he call you or did you call him? He called me. Where were you? I was at home. How long was the telephone conversation? -_ Maybe about 20 minutes. Tell us what the two of you talked about. He told me that he had asked Nancy and Marsha Scott

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ome to learn was that Evelyn Lieberman had sort of

pearheaded the transfer, and that she thought he was paying oo much attention to me and I was paying too much attention o him and that she didn't necessarily care what happened fter the election but everyone needed to be careful before he election.

Q Did he offer any of his views about what you should o with respect to this Pentagon job?

A He told me that I should try it out and if I didn't ike it that he would get me a job on the campaign.

Q What was your reaction to that? A I think I was disappointed. I didn't want to go to he Pentagon and I didn't really see what the difference on he campaign was going to be -- why I couldn't work -- if I ould work at the campaign why I couldn't work at the White ouse. So --

Q Did you start working at the Pentagon? -- A Yes.

Q What position did you hold when you worked at the entagon?

A Confidential Assistant to Ken Bacon, who is the

. .

entagon spokesman.

Q Let's talk generally, if you will, about what sort f contact you had with the President during the rest of 996. Did you see him in person?

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A Yes, I did.

Q Okay. Did you see him in person very often? A No. I wasn't alone with him so when I saw him it

was in some sort of event or group setting.

Q Did you continue to have telephone contact with him?

A Yes.

Q And those telephone contacts are set out in the chart that we've put together --

A Mm- hmm.

Q -_ with your assistance? A I guess. Yes. I'm sorry.

Q Let's then just turn to the first part of 1997. The election is over. Did you talk with the President about getting you back to the White House?

A Yes.

Q All right. Would you tell us about- that? A I believe the first time I might have mentioned it to him was in January of '97 in a phone conversation, and he told me that he would talk to Bob Nash, who is the head of White House or Presidential Personnel, I think it is, about . .

bringing me back. In the next phone call he said he had spoken to Bob Nash and then -- do you want me to go as far as

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67 of what efforts you thought were being taken and whether you came to be disappointed with those efforts.

A Very disappointed. He -- my understanding at first was that the ball had sort of been passed to Bob Nash to bring me -- to find a position for me to come back to the White House. I then came to learn maybe in March or so that the ball had been passed from Bob Nash to Marsha Scott. And then Marsha Scott was supposed to help me find a position at the White House, which didn't work out, then she was going to detail me to her office in the White House and then she later rescinded that offer.

Keep going?

Q Were you frustrated with all that? A Very frustrated.

Q And did you communicate your frustration to the President?

A Yes, I did. - _ Q Tell us about how you communicated your frustration to the President.

A There were various occasions, different things that happened. Sometimes it was in our phone conversations, sometimes it was in a letter, sometimes it was in person.

Q Let me direct your attention to July 3rd of 1997. Did you cause some sort of a communication to be made to the

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Q Tell us about that. A I had been trying to get in touch with him maybe since the latter part of June to discuss some of my meetings with Marsha Scott that had not gone as I had hoped they would and -- excuse me -- the President wasn't responding to me and wasn't returning my calls and wasn't responding to my notes. And I got very upset so I sat down that morning actually and scribbled out a long letter to him that talked about my frustrations and that he had promised to bring me back; if he wasn't going to bring me back that I -- you know, then could be help me find a job -- at that point I said in New York at the United Nations, and that I sort of dangled in front of him to remind him that if I wasn't coming back to the White House I was going to need to explain to my parents exactly why that wasn't happening.

Q And what was your purpose in sending a letter of -- that kind to the President?

A I think it was sort of had a few purposes, in that towards the end of the letter I softened up again and was back to my mushy self, but the purpose was -- one of the purposes, I think, was to kind of remind him that I had left the White House like a good girl in April of '96. A lot of other people might have made a really big stink and said that they weren't going to lose their job and they didn't want to

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do that and would have talked about what kind of relationship they had with the President so they didn't lose their job, and that I had been patient and had waited and that all of this had gone on. So I was frustrated.

Q Did you -- how did you get this letter to the President?

A I gave it to Ms. Currie.

Q Did you meet with the President on the 3rd of July? A Mm- hmm. Yes, I'm sorry.

Q Did you meet with the President on the 4th of July? A Yes, I did.

Q Would you tell us how that was arranged? A I spoke with Ms. Currie later that afternoon on the 3rd and she told me to come to the White House at 9 o'clock the next morning.

Q You showed up at the White House? A (Nodding .) -. Q What I would like to do with respect to this meeting is just ask you to give a very general description of the meeting, whether it was emotional.

A It was very emotional. . .

Q I don't want to focus on the emotional aspect of that meeting. What I want to do is focus on the end of the meeting.

A Okay.

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Q And whether or not you said anything to the President about Kathleen Willey.

A Yes, I did.

Q Can you tell us what happened in that conversation? A Can I jump back a little to how I got the information or do you want me to just stick to what I told him?

Q Sure, why don't you. Okay, jump back to how you got the information and then we'll plug it in.

A Just so everyone understands. I believe it was in February or March of that year when I was friends with Linda, she had frantically come to me telling me that this reporter whom I had never heard of before that day, Michael Isikoff, had shown up in her office to question her about Kathleen Willey, who was this woman that you all know now but who was this woman who had -- that Linda had worked with in the White House and that I guess this woman had told Michael Isikoff - that the President had sexually harassed her and that Linda would corroborate that fact.

And Linda was -- she had said to me that she was nervous and she responded that no -- I think she had sort of . . tried to lead Michael Isikoff away from the fact that it had been sexual harassment but, at the same time, had sort of confirmed to Michael Isikoff that something might- have

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71 I'm sorry, I'm going too long.

Q It's all right. A Throughout the next couple months I had encouraged Linda to get in touch with someone at the White House to let them know that this was out here. Being a political appointee, I thought that was something that should be done.

Q Who at the White House did you encourage her to contact?

A Well, she said she would feel comfortable either getting in contact with Nancy Hernreich or Bruce Lindsey from her experiences at the White House. And I don't really remember how it came to be Bruce Lindsey but that -- I don't remember who encouraged what. She contacted Bruce, or she told me she contacted Bruce Lindsey and that Mr. Lindsey did not return her phone call or answer her page.

Q So jumping forward to July -- A Right. - . Q __ what were you trying to convey to the President and what did you say to him?

A Just let me add that I think right -- at some point before July 4th, soon before July 4th, Michael Isikoff had again contacted Linda and so the story was sort of bubbling

this was going on and that this woman was going to'be another Paula Jones and he didn't really need that.

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so --

Q This is another grand juror who has just walked ir.. A Okay.

Q So that you know. A Thanks. So I wanted to inform the President about what he should sort of be aware of. And at the end of our meeting -- it had been a really emotional meeting -- I told him that I wanted to talk to him about something serious and that while I didn't want to be the one to talk about this with him, I thought it was important he know.

And I told him that a woman whom I was friendly with at the Pentagon had been approached by Michael Isikoff and sort of informed her that Kathleen Willey was claiming -- I know I didn't use the term sexually harassed because I would have felt uncomfortable saying that to the President, so I think I said something or another that indicated what Kathleen Willey was claiming, and that this woman had known Kathleen Willey when she worked at the White House and she -- I think I may have indicated that she had -- did not corroborate Kathleen Willey's story.

Q Did you identify Ms. Tripp by name? A No, I did not.

Q Did the President ask who it was you were referring to?

A No, he did not.

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Q Continue. I think you were -- A At that point -- I don't know if it was at that point in the conversation, then the President informed me that Kathleen Willey had actually called Nancy Hernreich during the week earlier and had said -- excuse me, sorry -- and had said that this reporter was chasing after her trying to find out her relationship with the President.

And so to me, what that meant was that when -- I thought that meant that when Kathleen found out Linda wasn't going to corroborate her story that she was trying to cover her tracks with the White House so that they wouldn't then find out or think that she was trying to encourage Michael Isikoff.

So I thought everything was over with and I later told that to Linda.

Q Why did you want to say anything to the President at all about that? What did you think the President might do - to respond?

A I thought he -- I thought maybe, you know, my understanding from Linda was that Kathleen had been trying to get a job, and I could certainly understand the frustrations . . of being told someone is going to help you get a job and then you don't. And I thought at that point -- I didn't know too many details about what was going on. I don't think she was in the Paula Jones case and I thought, well, gee, maybe if

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74 you know someone who needs -- who would want to hire her you can make this go away for -- that's how I thought of it. Then I thought maybe there was something he could do to fix it or someone else could do to fix it, or just be aware of it.

Q He might get her a job, for example? A He might. I mean, I think that was one of the things that crossed my mind.

Q At that time, did the President ask you whether you had disclosed anything about your relationship to anyone else?

A Not at that time.

Q Did he at some other time? A Yes, he did.

Q When was that? A I think there might have been several times throughout the relationship, but he specifically asked me - about Linda Tripp on

Q All right. moment.

A Okay. July 14 th.

Then we'll get to that in just a

Q At the beginning of the meeting with the President on July 4th, you had sent him a letter in which you said that you were considering telling your parents. Did he- ever say

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the President or something like that? A Yes. Our meeting started out with a fight, so he sat down and we sat down and he lectured me and, you know, "First of all, it's illegal to threaten the President of the United States and, second of all -- 'I I mean, it was just -- and then I started crying so --

Q All right, fine. After the meeting on July 4th concluded, did you leave the country?

A Yes.

Q All right. Where did you go? A I think a few days after that. I went to Madrid.

Q When did you return, as best you can remember? A On the 14th of July.

Q All right. Then let's turn our attention to the 14th of July. You got back from overseas. Did you get a call from Betty?

A Yes, I iid. -_

Q Tell us about that. A She called around -- 1 think it might have been around 7: 30 -- I was already in bed because of jet lag and everything -- and told me that she thought the President either wanted to talk to me or see me later, and that I believe he was out golfing at the time, and that she'd call me back later to let me know what was going to happen. And she did. She called back maybe around 8: 30 or so, 8: 30, 9

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o'clock, and asked me to come over to the White House. so I did.

Q When you got to the White House, did you see the President?

A Yes, I did.

Q Could you tell us how that meeting went? A It was an unusual meeting, I mean, first because we -- he met me in Betty's office and we went into Nancy Hernreich's office, which is adjacent to Ms. Currie's office, and sat on the sofa and talked. It was very distant and very cold. And he asked me if the -- 1 don't remember the sequence of things necessarily, but at one point he asked me if the woman that I had mentioned on July 4th was Linda -

Tripp. And I hesitated and then answered yes, and he talked about that there was some issue Kathleen Willey and that, as he something on the sludge report, information.

with -- this had to do with called it, that there was that there had been some

And what his main concern seemed to be was that Kathleen Willey had called Nancy again that week and was upset because Michael Isikoff had told her that he knew she

. .

had called the White House saying he was pursuing her and her

story. Is that clear? A JUROR: No. THE WITNESS: Okay. Kathleen had called Nancy, and

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the President had told me that Kathleen had called Nancy. This was on July 4th. And then that following week when I was in Madrid, I believe -- I know I was in Madrid, I think it was that following week -- Kathleen called Nancy again. And Kathleen was upset because Michael Isikoff had told Kathleen that he knew that she had called Nancy the previous

Does that make a little more sense? A JUROR: Yes, thank you. THE WITNESS: So what the President's cbncern was that the only people who knew that Kathleen had called Nancy originally were Nancy, Bruce Lindsey, the President and myself, and Kathleen. So he was concerned and had asked me if I had told Linda the information he had shared with me, and I had said yes, I did because I thought that meant it was over, that Kathleen was trying to backtrack.

So that alarmed me because, obviously, someone had told Michael Isikoff. And he was concerned about Linda, and I reassured him. He asked me if I trusted her, and I said yes. And he -- we had talked about -- oh, I had -- I'm sorry, I'm sorry. On July 4th I had mentioned that -- to the

. .

President that this woman had tried to contact Bruce Lindsey and that Bruce Lindsey didn't return her phone call.

So on July I4th, the President asked me -if I thought Linda would call Bruce Lindsey again, and I told him

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that she is a really proud woman and that she was really offended that he didn't call her back and it was -- so I didn't think she would. And he asked me if I would just try to see if she would call, and so I said I would try.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Did he ask you whether you had told anything to Linda about your relationship with the President?

A Yes, he did.

Q All right. Tell us about that. A He asked me just that, and I said no.

Q Where was this conversation taking place with the President?

A In Nancy Hernreich's office.

Q Did there come a time when he left to take a conference call?

A Yes, he did.

Q All right. Did you know who the conference call -- was with?

A That's a little murky for me. I believe it might have been with his attorneys, but I don't remember how I know that. So it's possible it was with his attorneys.

. _

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q How would you know it? I mean, how would you know it?

A I don't know. That's just what sounds -- that's

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what came to my mind when I was recalling the event. And I don't recall how I knew that so I don't know if maybe that's just how I'm recalling it or that I knew it and I don't remember who told me.

Q Was there anybody there to tell you he was talking to his attorneys other than him that day?

A It could have been Betty. I sat with Betty when -- in her office when he was on the conference call in the Oval Office or in the back. I don't know where he was, actually.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Other than the President asking you to get a hold of Linda and have Linda call Bruce Lindsey, how were things left at the end of the meeting?

A He asked me to let Betty know the following day without getting into details with her, even mentioning names with her, if I had, you know, kind of mission accomplished sort of thing with Linda. -_

Q And did you? A Yes, I got in touch with Betty the next day and I told her that I needed to talk to the President having to do with what he had asked me. . .

Q And did you follow up with that? A Yes, he called me that evening.

Q Okay. And what did the two of you talk about? A We discussed the -- I guess that I had tried to

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8C talk to Linda and that she didn't seem very receptive to trying to get in touch with Bruce Lindsey again, but that I would continue to try. And I think I just gave him some more -- I think I gave him maybe the background information about what I knew when Linda worked there and gave him, I think, a fuller version of whatever it was I knew about this situation.

MR. EMMICK: I'm prepared to move on. Is this an appropriate time for another break?

THE FOREPERSON: Most appropriate. MR. EMMICK: Okay. Good timing. THE WITNESS: Me, too. Too much water.

MS. IMMERGUT: Ten minutes? MR. EMMICK: Let's just take ten minutes. THE FOREPERSON: Ten minutes, please. (Witness excused. Witness recalled.) THE WITNESS: So where are we? -- MR. EMMICK: In fact, I'll even walk up and show you where we are, but first we have to clarify that there are no unauthorized persons present and we have a quorum.

THE FOREPERSON: That's correct. And I need to remind you that you're still under oath.

THE WITNESS:. Thanks. MR. EMMICK: Just to make some reference here, we

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are here at the end of July, but there are some questions. I'm going to circle back to April 7th.

THE WITNESS: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: We're going to ask. some more detail on April 7th and we're going to talk a little bit about a call that you had from the President in -- I think it is April of '97 about some conversations that --

THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICK: A call in that time period. THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICK: There were also some -- let's call them sort of a laundry list of follow- up questions.

THE WITNESS: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: So we'll focus there and a little bit on the 14th and a little bit on that phone call.

THE WITNESS: I thought I -- I also might just say that if, as happened before, if I'm saying something and I'm - not clear, I'm not understanding, just let me know, because I do that a lot.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q All right. Let's start off with some questions. -.

First, let's focus on July 14th because the President wanted you to have Linda contact Lindsey. Why wouldn't Lindsey just contact Linda? Was there any discussion of that? -Why did it have to go one way rather than the other way?

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’ A I don't believe there was a discussion about it. I have my own thoughts on it, but there wasn't a discussion about it.

Q What were your own thoughts on it? A That it would just -- I -- I think I sort of thought that it would probably be more proper -- not in a chain of command, necessarily, but -- it just seemed more appropriate for Linda to call Bruce Lindsey.

Q Did it look -- do you think it would have looked inappropriate for Lindsey to contact Tripp?

A I think it would have been awkward because I think -- how would -- you know, how would Bruce Lindsey have known to call -- you know, to call Linda at that point? If -- you know, the President thought at that point that -- you know, that Linda didn't know anything, so if Linda didn't know anything, then how -- wouldn't it be odd for Bruce Lindsey to just call her back out of the blue?

Q Okay. A I mean, that was sort of how I thought of it.

Q But in either event, there wasn't any actual discussion about the strategy behind who would have to call . . whom?

A Not that I remember. No. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q Well, did you say to him anything like, "Hey, she

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A Right.

Q "She isn't going to anything like that?

A Yes. I think I had a3

call him this time." I mean, mentioned that before. I mean, that might have been -- you know, I think was sort of -- he was saying, "Well, just try to see."

Q Let me approach the question in just a little bit different way. When you talked to Linda and tried to

BY MR. EMMICK: convince Linda to talk to Bruce Lindsey, what did you say to her to try to convince her to talk to what I mean?

her? Do you understand A Right. Well, I didn't tell Linda that -- and this was unusual, I didn't tell Linda that I had seen the President on the 14th of July because I was somewhat wary of her, having learned that someone had told Michael Isikoff, and I knew it wasn't me, so sort of assuming that Linda had talked to Michael Isikoff and not really knowing where she was coming from on this, so I just kept encouraging her to call Bruce Lindsey again, that this was heating up more and

. . you really should call Bruce Lindsey.

Q All right. Let me go to another question. You made a reference earlier to the fact that you felt'that Nel hadn't been treated well or hadn't been treated respectfully.

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a And they just -- you know, they kind of come to

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ia they were affirmatively mistreating him, but they were

19 treating him as a non- person almost? Or is that --

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Could you tell us what you meant by that? A People in the White House -- I mean, Nel is stationed in the pantry, which is right -- I mean, which is even a part of the Oval Office area and he's always there and he takes very good care of the President and people just walk right past him, they don't say hi to him, a lot of people don't acknowledge him.

him when they need something, but aren't -- and I just -- 1 don't think people should be treated like that. I mean, I think anybody who -- and especially everyone who is working at the White House and who works -- I've always categorized people as people who are there to serve the President and people who are there to serve themselves through the President and I think Nel has a lot of loyalty to the President.

Q Would it be fair to say that it's no so much that - A I think that's a mistreatment. Q Yes. That's a mistreatment. Okay. That's a fair . . characterization.

A In my opinion. Q We had talked earlier about certain people that you wanted to avoid in order to help keep the relationship secret

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and you talked about Nancy Hernreich as being one of those

people. Can you tell us what other people you wanted to sort of avoid in that same vein?

A Stephen Goodin. Let's see. I guess it's different from when I was at the White House to after. When I was there, Evelyn Lieberman, Harold Ickes, anybody who knew who I was, certainly. And after I left, I think it was mainly anybody who knew me from before. So --

Q All right. A Does that -- does that answer it?

Q If that's the answer, then that's the best we can do.

A Okay.

Q We talked earlier about February 28th and about Steve Goodin going into the Oval Office with Betty and what you learned about that conversation they had.

A Mm- hmm. _. is after all just a presidential aide, why would he be in a position to be able to tell the President, "You can't be with Monica Lewinsky alone"?

._ A I don't know. And that was a question that I --

that I posed -- 1 don't think I posed it as a question, but I sort of made a comment, you know, who is -- and then -- 1 don't remember if it was to Betty or to Nel, you know, why

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18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 he would always sort of -- what's the word I'm looking for?

would -- you know, how inappropriate that was.

Q Right. A And maybe Stephen made the comment to Betty. Maybe just Betty. I -- I -- I -- you know, I wasn't in the room, so I don't know what the course of the conversation was. Maybe Stephen said it to Betty and Betty told the President that Stephen had said that to Betty. So I'm not sure, but I thought it was inappropriate, too.

MR. EMMICK: Any other follow- up on that? A JUROR: I think a point be is that did he feel that he had the authority do so because someone else was encouraging him to monitor that sort of activity, such as Evelyn Lieberman, for example?

THE WITNESS: That's a good thought. I don't know. I don't have any knowledge of that. I never thought of that.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q You mentioned that during 1997 especially you frequently complained to the President that although he said he could bring you back (snapping finger) like that, it wasn't happening. How did the President respond when you complained about these things?

. . A You know, I mean, it was the -- "Bob Nash is

handling it," "Marsha's going to handle it" and "We just sort of need to be careful." You know, and, "Oh, 'I'll -- I1

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Kind of validate what I was feeling by telling me something that I don't necessarily know is true. "Oh, I'll talk to her," "I'll -- you know, I'll see blah, blah, blah," and it was just "I'll do," "I'll do," ltI'll do." And didn't, didn't, didn't.

Q All right. You mentioned that in that July 3rd letter that you sent to the President through Betty you made a reference to the fact that you might have to explain things to your parents. What did you mean by that?

A If I was going to pick up and move from Washington -- first of all, I had told my -- well, my mom knew, you know, that I was having some sort of a relationship with the President. My dad had no idea. And I had told my dad that was I -- you know, I was told I could probably come back to the White House after the election, as Tim Keating had told me. And the President.

So I had sort of told him that course and I would -- have needed to explain to them why I was going to pick up and move to New York without -- what the point would be.

Q Were you meaning to threaten the President that you were going to tell, for example, your father about the sexual relationship with the President?

A Yes and no. I don't think I -- 1 know that I never would have done that. I think it was more -- the .way I felt

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been a good girl up until now. I mean, I kind of have -- that I think I tended to -- 1 know that I thought he tended to forget what I had gone through already and that -- and so that this wasn't an issue of, well, you know, "We can do this in a little while, this is maybe changing your job while you're in the White House," you know, if I had wanted to maybe do something different, it was a lot more significant. And I felt that he was giving me the runaround a bit, too.

Q IS it fair to say that it was in part an implied threat?

A Yes, but I think -- but I think if you want to look at it that way, it was a threat to him as a man and not a threat to him as president. Does that -- I mean --

Q What do you mean? A Well, I think when I hear you say, you know, "Was that an implied threat" that that letter- being sent to - any man who is having an illicit relationship with someone would be a threat, and so it was irrelevant, the fact that he was president.

Q I see. A So just because we had talked earlier about it and then that was what had upset me, when the President said, I'It's illegal to threaten the President of the United States."

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Q Right. A And I just thought, you know, "1 don't deal with you like the President, I deal with you as a person."

MR. EMMICK: All right.

MR. WISENBERG: Can I ask something about that? MR. EMMICK: Yes. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q But you had said your mother by that time knew there was some of kind of a relationship.

A Right. He didn't know that, though.

Q But you hadn't told -- he didn't know that. A I never told him that. No.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q A question about lipstick and tissues. A Okay.

Q You mentioned that a couple of times you used tissues to wipe lipstick off. Do you remember where you threw those tissues away and did it occur to you that somebody might see those tissues later and therefore might think of it as somehow evidencing the relationship?

A No, really the only -- the one time that

. .

I specifically remember doing that was on January 7th of '96. And -- no, I don't think that -- I mean, I had light lipstick on so I don't -- I think if it had been a darker colored

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thought about that, but

think people go through

Q Right. A I hope not.

Q Do you recall that occasion?

A It was in the

that didn't cross my mind. I don't the trash.

where you threw the tissue away on bathroom. I think there's a wastebasket right next to the sink.

Q All right. A question going back to the '96 period, because you had mentioned that on February 19th of '96 the President told you essentially we should break up, we shouldn't have any more of a sexual relationship, yet five or six weeks later, there was a continuation of the sexual relationship. How does that happen? How does it get broken off and then rekindled?

A Well, there continued to sort of be this flirtation that was -- when we'd see each other. And then one night, I -- don't -- 1 think it was maybe in the end of -- the end of February or maybe some time in March when he had -- I had seen him in the hall when I was leaving to go from work, and this was the night he was coming back from the Israeli

- .

embassy from something, and we didn't make any contact or anything because he was with Evelyn Lieberman. And I went home.

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me he had gone back to his office and had called my office because he wanted me to come over and visit with him, but I was home now, you know, and then he had gone back upstairs.

So that had sort of implied to me that he was interested in starting up again and then when I saw him on the 3Ist of March -- when he kissed me, that pretty much --

Q Just, basically, people got back together. A Yeah. There was never a discussion of, "Okay, now we're going to resume our relationship again." I didn't want to -- why bring up the memory of the guilt? So --

Q Okay. Then what I'd like to do next is turn our attention back to April 7th, which is the Easter Sunday, and we're going to ask some more detailed questions about that period. First, when you got to the White House, did you see a Secret Service agent and

A Yes.

Q All right. Tell you said to one another.

did the two of you talk? us who it was and what the two of - A It was John Muskett, I believe. And I had brought some papers with me from home and so I believe I said something, "Oh, the President asked me to bring these to

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him." And John Muskett said, "Oh, I'd better check with Evelyn Lieberman." And I don't remember exactly what the rest of the exchange was, but I talked him out of 'doing that and then I just went in.

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_ 9; Q Were you nervous when he said, "I've got to talk tb

Evelyn Lieberman"? A Oh, yeah. Yes. Also, it alarmed me that she was there. I didn't really expect her to be there on a Sunday evening.

Q You mentioned that a telephone call came in while you were with the President. Did you later come to believe you knew who that call was from?

A I made a speculation about who that call was from. I have no knowledge nor had no knowledge about who was on the phone call.

Q Let's take this a step at a time, then. A Okay.

Q First, what do you remember about the content of the call and then what was the reason that you drew conclusion you did later?

A The content was political in nature- and I whatever

drew, you -- know, the possibility that it was Dick Morris just based on -- that it was campaign stuff. And I think that how it even came up that it could possibly be Dick Morris was in a joking way with Linda on the phone.

. _ So I don't believe that I ever -- I don't think I

would have ever categorically stated that it was Dick Morris on the phone, because I didn't know that.

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draw the conclusion or develop the suspicion perhaps that it' was Dick Morris?

A I don't remember.

Q Okay. All right. At some point, did you hear a voice that you believed to be Harold Ickes' voice?

A Yes.

Q Okay. Tell us how that happened. A The President and I were in -- I believe it was the back study or the study and -- or we might have been in the hallway, I don't really remember, but I -- Harold Ickes has a very distinct voice and so he -- I heard him holler "Mr. President," and the President looked at me and I looked at him and he jetted out into the Oval Office and I panicked and didn't know that -- I thought that maybe because Harold was so close with the President that they might just wander

leave. So I went out the back way.

Q When you say you went out the back way -- A Through the dining room.

Q Where did you go? A I went through the dining room exit, to the left,

. .

past the Chief of Staff's office, to the right, down the stairs.

Q Were you in a hurry? A Yes.

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Q Ail right. Xr some point afterwards, did you get a call from the President?

A Yes.

Q All right. And what happened in that phone call? A He asked me why I left, so I told him that I didn't know if he was going to be coming back and so he -- he was a little upset with me that I left.

MR. EMMICK: All right. Before we move off that particular call, are there any follow- up questions that you have? Yes?

MR. WISENBERG: Yes. Yes. And I'll try to be delicate. I'm not known for delicacy.

THE WITNESS: I can see that everyone seems to agree with that.

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q First of all, Ms. Lewinsky, when you went out the dining room, did you go out through Nel's pantry door or through the main dining room door?

A I would have gone out the dining room door.

Q Okay. I want to make sure that I get the sequence right, because this is partly based on stuff we discussed

. .

Monday in New York and you correct me if I get anything wrong.

A Okay.

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is a -- you're back with the President that day and iez me ask first if you recall, the more intimate sexual moments that day, were they in the hallway or the back study?

A Both.

Q Okay. Now, as I understand it, you're with the President. It's an intimate moment. A call comes in.

A Correct.

Q All right. And the President leaves. A Mm- hmm.

Q You put your top back on. Your top had been off and you put your top back on.

A Mm- hmm.

Q And at some point he comes back. Is that correct? A Mm- hmm.

Q Okay. And what I'm trying to do is distinguish between the Ickes event and the call, if there is a distinction in your mind. In other words --

A Yes.

Q The call is something different, as far as you know, from the Ickes event.

A Correct.

. . Q Okay. The President comes back and it's at some

point later that you hear the voice of Harold Ickes. A I'm sorry --

Q The President comes back from the phone call that

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he takes -- A No. The -- someone came in to tell the President he had a phone call, so someone came in, hollered something, not Mr. Ickes.

Q Okay. A The President went out, came back in and I think then they sent the phone call in.

Q All right. He took that in -- A He took the phone call in the back study.

Q Okay. A Then we were -- and I think we had been in the hallway -- 1 know we had been in the hallway prior to that.

Q Okay. A And he came back in and then the phone rang and he took the phone call in the back study.

Q Okay. A Then it was much later in that same- day that he - heard the "Mr. President" voice.

Q Of Ickes. A Right. And I'm going to -- 1 think that we were in the back study at that point because that's why he jetted so - .

quickly, not wanting Harold, I think, to walk back there. That was --

Q Okay. Now, the voice you heard saying to the President that he had a call --

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A Mm- hmm. A No. And it wasn't a voice that was familiar to me.

Q Okay. And you never saw Ickes. Is that correct? When you later heard his voice, you didn't see him. You're just familiar with his voice.

A Correct.

Q As far as you know, did Ickes see you when you headed out the back way?

A He couldn't have.

Q Okay. Why do you say that? A Because he was in the office.

Q Okay. And you said that Ickes was much later. I mean, much later within the whole time you were there with the President that day?

A Right. Correct.

Q Okay. I mean, not like several hou- rs later. A No. No.

Q Okay. A Just much later within my visit.

MR. WISENBERG: Okay. Thank you.

. .

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q What I'd like to do is turn our attention to a call that you got from the President some time, I believe, in

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something about whether you had told your mother -- A Yes.

Q __ about the relationship. Let's first talk about -- can you place this in time as best you can?

A It was April. And this came about because -- 1 guess Marsha Scott, I think, had relayed some information to the President about her conversations, I think possibly with Walter Kaye, who is a friend of my family's, and that from that conversation, I think Marsha either directly said to the President or the President wondered from something Marsha said, if I had told my mom -- well, it must have been the President assuming from something that Marsha

The President asked me if I had told my my mom told -- and where that went was had my mom Kaye. And I said no.

Q What you're describing, is it all based President said in this phone call?

A I don't understand. said.

mom or had told Walter

on what the

Q Yes. You said that at some point it was based on the fact that Walter had spoken to Marsha Scott and I'm trying to figure out if you're learning that from a different

. .

source or if it's all from the President. A No, I was learning that from the phone call with the President.

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A You know, I'm thinking just now, I don't know if that was in April. It

MR. EMMICK: A JUROR: Of THB WITNESS:

could have been in May. Okay.

1997? Yes. Sorry. Okay. I don't know if the month

about the A

Q Do you know independently what, if any, time is important or not.

BY MR. EMMICK: In April or May, you have this discussion. Right. The President asks you if you've told your mother relationship. Right. What do you respond? "No. Of course not."

MR. EMMICK: Okay.

MFZ. WISENBERG: Mike?

MR. EMMICK: Yes?

MR. WISENBERG: Can I butt in?

MR. EMMICK: Yes. BY MR. WISENBERG:

conversation there was -- that is, whether -- did you later learn that Walter had said something to Marsha or that somebody had said something to Walter?

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100 I think Walter Kaye kind of comes in and out -- if you look at this whole few years, he comes in and out of this in a few ways, so -- did I learn independently that Walter had had a discussion with Marsha? No. Is that what you were asking me?

Q Well, that's one. How about with anybody else? I guess did you hear anything that struck you as this is kind of consistent with what the President had told me in that conversation or this fits together now? Walter had a conversation with somebody and could have actually talked to Marsha Scott and then that got relayed to the President.

A I don't think I'm following you 100 percent. I'm sorry.

Q Okay. Well, I'm not always very articulate. I'll just --

A It --

Q Do you recall -- let me be more specific. Are you - aware of your aunt ever having made a comment to Walter Kaye?

A I'm aware of Walter Kaye having made a comment to my aunt.

Q Okay. And what was that? A He remarked something to my aunt that he had heard from people that the reason I had left the White House or had been moved from the White House was because I had had this relationship with the President.

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Q Do you know what your aunt responded to Walter Kaye?

A My understanding was she got up and walked out. She was having lunch with him.

was the next time that you saw the President May 24th, I think, which you refer to as dump day?

A Yes. Either way, it would have been, whether it was in April or May.

Q Right. Because you didn't see him in April -- A Right.

Q -- and you only saw him once in May. A Right. Correct.

Q All right. And you had -- that's fine. All right. What I'd like to turn our attention to next is as we're - working down our outline here, we're finished up with the July 3rd, 4th and 4th period. I take it that you remained frustrated with the President's efforts to try to get you back to the White House.

. .

A Mm- hmm. I mean, it always -- and I did make this him in my life than to -- than to get the job, but- the job was something that was important to me.

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Q Did there come a time in about October when y~ x gave up, more or less, on your efforts to get back to the White House and you turned your attention more to New York City?

A Yes.

Q All right. Tell us how that happened. A Linda Tripp called me at work on October 6th and told me that her friend Kate in the NSC had heard from -- had heard rumors about me and that I would never work in the White House again and, if I did, I wouldn't have a blue pass and that her advice to me was "get out of town." So that meant to me that I wasn't going to be coming back to the White House and I was very upset by that.

Also, she, Linda, told me that Kate had said, 81~ ou know, they create jobs at the White House, you know, six days a week." And that Stephen Goodin's girlfriend had just gotten a job, so with these examples of how there had been - all these other people receiving jobs that I could have done and I didn't get it.

Q Did you communicate your additional frustration and disappointment to the President?

. .

A Yes, I did.

Q Tell us how and when. A I believe I sent him a short note telling him that I really needed to talk to him in person having to do with

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this subject matter and he and I had an argument in a conversation on the 9th of October.

Q And was that a telephone conversation? A Yes, it was.

Q Did he call you or did you call him? A He called me.

Q About what time, if you can remember? A I think it was around 2: 30, 3: 00 in the

Q Was it a long phone call? A Yes. Yes. 2: 00, 2: 30 maybe.

morning.

Q Is it fair to characterize involving an argument?

A Yes. And then we made up.

Q And then you made up. A It was half argument, half

Q Did the name Vernon Jordan that discussion?

A It's possible. the phone call as

making up. come up in the course of

Q What do you have in mind about the first time that Vernon Jordan's name would have come up in conversations with the President?

. .

A It was either in that phone call or on 11th.

Q And tell us whether it was in the

what was said phone call or

about Vernon on the 11th.

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104 A I don't remember. I know that I had discussed with Linda and either I had had the thought or she had suggested that Vernon Jordan would be a good person who is a close friend of the President and who has a lot of contacts in New York, so that that might be someone who might be able to help me secure a position in New York, to the U. N.

Q And what was the President's if I didn't want to go

response? A "1 think that was a good idea .I1 Q At some point, did you send the President something like a list of jobs or interests that you might have in New York?

A Yes. He asked me to prepare that on the 11th of October.

Q At some point, did you have an initial meeting with Vernon Jordan?

A Yes, I did. - . Q Can you tell us when that was, as best you can recall?

A The beginning of November of last year.

Q How was that meeting arranged?

. .

A Through conversations with the President and with Betty.

Q Without getting into a lot of detail about what happened there during the first meeting with Vernon Jordan,

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19 20 21 22 23 24 25 early November meeting with Mr. Jordan.

105 what did you think were your job prospects after that? Did it look like things were going to happen?

A Yes.

Q All right. And what happened with respect to the job situation from that meeting with Vernon Jordan until,

say, Thanksgiving? A Nothing, really.

Q Okay. Then let's turn our attention to the month of December. We'll have to relate back a little bit to November in order to complete things, but on December 5th, did you return to Washington from overseas?

A I did. You know -- the question you just asked me before about until Thanksgiving, I did have a conversation with him before Thanksgiving, I think it was the day before.

Q Okay. A so --

Q Then why don't you complete that, then. A Okay. I had spoken to Betty about -- about not being -- being able to get in touch with Mr. Jordan because he was in and out of town and then wasn't necessarily returning my call. He's a busy man. And so Betty arranged

. _

for me to speak with him again and I spoke with him when I was in Los Angeles before -- right before Thanksgiving.

Q Okay. Let's just go back, if we might, to that

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A Okay.

Q Did he say anything indicating to you that he tiad spoken with the President recently about you?

A Yes. I believe he mentioned he'd had a conversation with the Presider_:.

Q And what did he say about that or what did he say that indicated he may have spoken with the President?

A I believe he mentioned that in the course of the conversation and as I was leaving, he remarked to me that I came highly recommended.

Q Okay. Let's turn our attention to December 5th, then.

A Okay.

Q Having in mind that you had had a meeting with Vernon Jordan and a discussion and were trying to get a hold of him, when you got back from overseas, sort of what was the status of the Vernon Jordan jcb effort? - _ --

A When I had spoken with Mr. Jordan right before Thanksgiving, he had asked me to call him the next week, either, I think, Thursday or Friday. And because I was out of town, I called him on Friday when I got back, and it was my understanding from his secretary he had gone out of town that day, so we had missed each other.

Q All right. Did you try to arrange a meeting with President Clinton?

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Q Tell us what you did to try President Clinton.

A I sent a note to Betty much that I asked her to pass along to him

107

to arrange meeting with earlier in the week which in that letter requested of him that I could come have a visit that Saturday.

Q Did you follow up that note with a call to Ms. Currie?

A Yes.

Q When was that call, if you remember? A December 5th.

Q Okay. And what happened during the call? A Well, there were several calls, actually. And so at first, it was -- the first few, she still hadn't given him the note.

So then finally she gave him the note, just, I think, right after the radio address or right before his radio address, and then she told me that he was meeting with his lawyers all day Saturday, but that she was coming in in the morning to give a tour and she would check and see with . . him then, you know, if maybe I could come by, but that the prospects didn't look good.

Q Was she focused on Saturday because you had asked whether Saturday would be a good time?

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108 A Mm- hmm. Yes. I'm sorry. Maybe he was going out of town on Sunday. I'm not sure why I would have focused on Saturday versus Sunday.

Q In any event, what she said was he was busy with meetings with lawyers, something like that?

A Yes.

Q All right. Did you go to a Christmas party that night?

A Yes, I did.

Q Did you see the President? A Yes, I did.

Q Let's turn our attention to December 6th. A Okay.

Q Are you doing okay? A Yes.

Q _ All right. December 6th. Let me ask as a background question, had you previously purchased for the - President a Christmas present?

A Yes.

Q All right. What was that Christmas present? A It was a sterling silver antique standing cigar holder.

Q You had been unable to arrange an actual visit with the President to give him that present in person. "What did you do instead?

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A I had some other gifts for him as well that I had gotten on my trips and --

Q Tell us what those other gifts were, if you remember.

A A tie. A mug from Starbucks in Santa Monica. A little box that's called hugs and kisses and it's Xs and OS inside, it's really -- it's just a cute little chatchki. An antique book from the flea market in New York that was on Theodore Roosevelt. And -- I think that's it.

Q Okay. What did you try to do on the 6th in order to give those gifts to the President?

A Well, I had wanted to give them to him, if I was going to have a planned visit with him, and then through the -- just some course of events, I got upset and I decided that I was really tired of everything that was going on and I just -- it was clear to me that he was ignoring me and I just didn't want to deal with this anymore. --

So I decided -- I had purchased these presents for him and I'm very -- I spend a lot of time and am very particular about the presents I give to people, so I didn't want to give them to someone else and I wanted him to have

. . them, so I packaged them up with a note that I was going to

drop off to Betty.

Q And where did you go? A I went to the southwest gate.

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Q What happened at the southwest gate? A I paged Betty or I think I might have called her. I know I called her and she wasn't at her desk, so I paged her to let her know I was there. And then Marsha Scott drove

UP, so I ran away to the northwest gate because I didn't want Marsha to see me. Continue from there?

Q Yes. Did you have any trouble getting in at the northwest gate? What happened?

A Well, I wasn't trying to get in. I -- so --

Q What were you trying to do? A I was trying to wait for Betty. So I called Betty from the northwest gate and she wasn't at her desk and then I saw someone go into the -- it was under construction at the time, so it was a different little hut than normal, and I saw someone who went in who I thought was John Podesta, so I thought I would -- since I knew that Betty had talked to John Podesta about me, I thought I would ask him, you know, - maybe I would ask her -- I would give the gifts -- I would feel comfortable probably giving the gifts to John Podesta to give to Betty, just knowing that he knew I had a relationship with her.

So when I went in to ask this person who I thought was John Podesta -- it turned out to be Lanny -- I think Lanny Davis, and so then one of the guards said, "Dh, are you here to see Betty Currie?"

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And I said, "No. I'm not here to see her, I'm trying to get her.

And then that Eleanor -- do

Q Sure. She doesn't know I'm coming."

they told me she was giving a tour and you want me to go into this detail?

A Okay. That Eleanor Mondale had come recently and that she was giving a tour to Eleanor Mondale. Then I sort of -- wanting to know if the President was in the office, asked the guards, "Oh, well, is the President in the office? Because if he is, she's probably too busy to come out and get these gifts."

And they said, "Yes, he was."

Q What was you reaction to that? A Not good.

Q Okay. A Very upset. Hysterical.

Q Where did you go and what did you do? A I turned around and walked out and I was livid. I had -- well -- are the grand jurors aware of the rumors about Eleanor Mondale that had been out? I mean, because it doesn't make sense if --

-. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Well, why don't you say why you were upset.

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BY MR. WISEWBERG:

Q A question. Pardon me for interrupting. I just wanted to -- you said you were upset. Did you show your upsetness to any of the guards?

A No. MR. WISENBERG: Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Did you contact Betty? A Yes, I did.

Q Where did you contact her from? A I called her from the pay phone at the Corcoran Gallery.

Q Did you have a fight with her?

A I think so. . . Q Okay. You say you think so -- A I'm trying to remember if I -- if I actually got her on the phone, which I think I did. I'm pretty'sure I did.

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2 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 none of my business what -- you know, what he was doing and

1 -- -2 Q All right. Did you eventually come to talk to the President on the telephone?

A Through a much more circuitous route, yes, I did.

Q All right. And where were you at that time? A I was at home.

Q All right. And about what time of day was it? A Maybe around noon or so.

Q How did the two of you come to be speaking on the phone? Who placed the calls?

A Well, I believe maybe I had called Betty or maybe Betty called me, one of the two, but she put him on the phone _

Q All right. And what happened in the conversation with the President?

A Well, we had a fight. And he was very angry with me.

Q Why was he angry with you? - _

A Because I had gotten so upset and I had made a stink to Betty and I had -- you know -- I -- what I came to learn, I think, is that as a result of me being upset with Betty and mentioning that I knew Eleanor Mondale was there, Betty called the guards at the northwest gate and so it had just caused a whole big commotion.

And he was just angry at me and he told me it was

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9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 day to meet with my lawyers and, you know, I've got you

114 that -- you know, that -- that he had never been treated as poorly by anyone else as I treated him and that he spent more time with me than anyone else in the world, aside from his family, friends and staff, which I don't know exactly which category that put me in, but --

Q Okay. Was it a long phone call with the President? A Maybe half an hour, 45 minutes. Q Eventually, were arrangements made for you to visit him at the White House?

the White A

A fought on day.

Mm- hmm. Are you doing Yeah. Yes.

okay? Were you surprised that he would let you come to House? Yeah, I was -- yes, I was a little bit surprised. Why? Because none of the other times that we had really the phone did it end up resulting in a visit that

All right. What about the fact that he was supposedly meeting with his lawyers all day? Did he say anything about that?

A He had in the fight. When we were fighting, he said -- you know, he was angry because he said, "I-- have one

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115 messing things up and being upset and blah, blah, blah." so --

Q Did you go and did you meet with the President? A Yes, I did.

Q Did Betty wave you in? A Yes.

Q Can you describe for us in general terms how that meeting went? Did you give him the gifts, for example?

A I did. It was -- it was a really nice visit.

Q Okay. What do you mean by a "nice visit"? A It was just sweet. He liked his Christmas presents and we were very affectionate and it just -- it was just nice to be with him.

Q Did you discuss the job search? A I believe so.

Q At the time, how did you think the job search was going? . .

A Not very well. With respect to Mr. Jordan.

Q Right. And did you communicate that to the President?

A Yes. -. Q Can you give us a little more detail? What would you have said to one another?

A I think I said that I -- that I was supposed to get in touch with Mr. Jordan the previous week and that things

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didn't work out and that nothing had really happened yet.

Q Did the President say what he was going to do? A I think he said he would -- you know, this was sorz of typical of him, to sort of say, "Oh, 1'11 talk to him. I'll get on it."

Q Okay. Did he had a Christmas present

A Yes, he did. say anything to you about whether he

for you?

Q What did he say? A He told me that on the phone, actually.

Q All right. What did he say about that? A Well, I said to him, '* Well, how do you have a Christmas present? I haven't read that you've gone Christmas shopping yet." And he said that he had bought it in Vancouver.

Q Okay. Did he say at any time on the 6th anything about a witness list or your being on a witness list?

A No.

Q How were things left when you left him on the 6th? A That he would bring me -- oh, our meeting ended UP -- or was cut short by the fact that he had to have a neeting with Mr. Bowles, so he told me that he'd give me my Christmas present another time and that he wouldn't jerk me xound and abandon me.

You know, that -- because I think I remarked to

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him, "Well, at the rate we go, I won't get it 'til Christmas of '98." so --

MR. EMMICK: I have no more questions about this date and I look at the time and it looks like it's 12~ 30.

THE something.

MR. THE lunch?

MR. been here.

MR.

FOREPERSON: Sol, I think, went to check on EMMICK: Oh, all right. FOREPERSON: Did you check on something for

WISENBERG: I have checked. It is here. It's EMMICK: Okay. All right. Well, if this would be a good time to take a break for lunch --

THE FOREPERSON: It's fine with me. MR. EMMICK: Okay. Let's take an hour- long break for lunch.

taken. THE FOREPERSON: Hour- long.

MR. EMMICK: Okay. THE WITNESS: Okay. THE FOREPERSON: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: Thank you. -.

(Whereupon, at 12: 34 p. m., a luncheon recess was

1 * * * * *

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118

AFTERNOON SESSION Whereupon, (1: 38 p. m. 1

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was recalled as a witness and, after having been previously duly sworn by the Foreperson of the Grand Jury, was examined and testified further as follows:

THE MR. THE MR. present?

THE EXAMINATION (RESUMED)

WITNESS: Time for a nap? EMMICK: Madam Foreperson, do we have a quorum? FOREPERSON: Yes, we do. EMMICK: Are there any unauthorized persons

FOREPERSON: There are none. Monica, I'd like to remind you that you are still under oath.

THE WITNESS: Okay. Thanks. BY MR. EMMICK: - _ -a

Q Ms. Lewinsky, we just got through speaking about the December 6th meeting that you had with the President. What I'd like to do is turn our attention next to the date of December 11th.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Did you have a meeting with Vernon Jordan on that day?

A Yes, I did.

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A Around lunchtime.

Q And how was that meeting arranged? A By his secretary.

Q What was the purpose of the meeting? A For him to -- 1 learned after we had the meeting, for him to give me some contact names and some suggestion of what to do with these contact names.

Q When you say -- A For a job.

Q When you say "contact names," these are names of potential employers?

A Yes.

Q What else did the two of you talk about? A We talked about my -- the fact that my mom's fiance at the time knew Mr. Jordan. We talked about the President.

What else did we talk about? I think that's it. -

Q All right. Did he at some point make a comment to you about your being a friend of the President?

A Yes, he did.

Q Would you tell us how the conversation transpired . . from that point?

A I don't remember how we got to this point, but at some point, Mr. Jordan said something to me, "Well'; you're a friend of the President of the United States."

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2 3 and reacted to him more as a man and got angry at him like a 4 man and just a regular person. 5 -_.. 6 7

8 We were sort of bantering back and forth about

9 that and then he told me that I shouldn't get angry at the

10 President because he's got a lot of -- it sounds so stupid --

11 obviously, he has a lot of other more important things and 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 A Oh, yes. So after we had the conversation I was 21 just talking about with Mr. Jordan, he said to me, "Well, 22 you know what your problem is?" 23 And I said, '1What? 1t 24 8 ff 25

840

12: And I remarked that I didn't -- I didn't really look at him as the President, thaz I saw him more as a man

And Mr. Jordan asked me what I got angry at the President about, so I told him when he doesn't call me enough or see me enough.

difficult things to deal with than someone getting upset with him. And he suggested that if I was upset that I should call and take my frustrations out on Mr. Jordan instead of the President.

I mean, I think I should just say that it was all -- this was all sort of in a light tone. --

Q Is this a meeting during which the subject of your possibly being in love cropped up?

He said, "Don't deny it." And he said, -" You're in love, that's what your problem is."

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121 So I think I just -- probably blushed or giggled, something like that.

Q How did the meeting end? What were you going to do and what was he going to do?

A I was planning to send the letters that he had suggested I write to the list of people and he suggested that I cc him and keep in touch with him, keep him apprised of what was happening with my job search.

Q And did you send out those letters? A Yes, I did.

Q And make arrangements for some interviews? A Yes, I did.

Q What I want to do next, then, is direct your attention to a few days later, several days later, a week later, I guess. Did you come to have a telephone conversation with the President on December 17th?

A Yes. -. - Q Would you tell us how that telephone call was --

how that conversation took place? A Okay. The phone rang unexpectedly at about maybe 2: 00 or 2: 30 and --

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q In the morning? A Right. In the morning. And it was the. President and he called and said he had two things to tell me and then

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call me right back. So he called me right back. BY MR. EMMICK: Did he explain why he had to call and then call

I don't know. He just was very brief with me and nen he said, @'I'll call you right back." And he hung up and slled back about a minute later.

Q Before you get to the actual things that he says sxt, you mentioned that you unexpectedly go the call. Why ere you surprised by the call?

A Normally, the President wouldn't call me when

t- S. Clinton was in town, so -- and I usually was aware when ne was out of town, so I that I would sort of be expecting r hoping that he would call. And the call came as a lrprise to me.

Q He called you back?

A Right. . Q Then what happened? A And he told me that he had two things to tell me. he first was that Betty's brother had been killed in a lr accident and that -- so I reacted that and we talked oout that being -- that this was the same brother who had ten beaten up just a few months ago and she had lost her ister and her mom was ill. We talked about Betty for a ittle bit.

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123 And then he told me he had some more bad news, that he had seen the witness list for the Paula Jones case and my name was on it.

Q Did you get an impression from him about when he had found out your name was on the witness list?

A Yes. I mean, the impression I got based on the entire conversation was that he found out recently.

Q When he told you that, what did he say about having seen your name on the witness list?

A He told me it broke his heart.

Q Tell us how the conversation went from there. A I was -- I'm sure, as you can imagine, I was upset and shocked. He told me that it didn't necessarily mean that I would be subpoenaed, but that that was a possibility, and if I were to be subpoenaed, that I should contact Betty and let Betty know that I had received the subpoena.

I believe that I probably asked him; you know, what- should I do in the course of that and he suggested, he said, "Well, maybe you can sign an affidavit."

At some point in the conversation, and I don't know if it was before or after the subject of the affidavit came . . up, he sort of said, *You know, you can always say you were coming to see Betty or that you were bringing me 1etters. l' Which I understood was really a reminder of things. that we had discussed before.

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Q So when you say things you had discussed, sort of ruses that you had developed.

A Right. I mean, this was -- this was something that -- that was instantly familiar to me.

Q Right. A And I knew exactly what he meant.

Q Had you talked with him earlier about these false explanations about what you were doing visiting him on several occasions?

A Several occasions throughout the entire relationship. Yes. It was the pattern of the relationship, to sort of conceal it.

Q When he said that you might sign an affidavit, what did you understand it to mean at that time?

A I thought that signing an affidavit could range from anywhere -- the point of it would be to deter or to prevent me from being deposed and so that that could range from anywhere between maybe just somehow mentioning, you know, innocuous things or going as far as maybe having to deny any kind of a relationship.

Q At some point, did you talk with him about possibly settling the Paula Jones case?

A Yes. I had -- I had had a thought and then had a conversation with Linda about this and just a way that he could settle the case and I suggested it to him.

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125 Q And what was that way? Not in a lot of detail, but --

Mrs.

show

been that

A The gist cf it is, I thought that first Clinton should do something publicly, maybe on a T. V. or something, axd talk about how difficult the case had for her and on tier daughter and that she he would settle it and it would go away. President should unannounced and unexpectedly briefing room, make a brief statement that he to put this behind him, you know, against his advice, he was going to pay Ms. however much she wanted, and so with _

Q Did the two of you ta just wished

And then the go into the __ in an effort attorneys' Jones whatever it was, that this case would be over

lk about how much the settlement amount would be or might be?

A Yes. I believe at some point I had mentioned that I had recently read the -- I think she had lowered her -- - the amount that she wanted to $500,000 or something lower and he said, "1 thought it was a million or two million dollars."

And I thought that was very strange, that he wouldn't know she had -- you know, that her lawyers -- or his lawyers had not told him that she had lowered her request for money. Or I don't know how you say that legally, whatever it is that she did.

Q Right. Demand, probably.

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- A The demand was lower.

Q Right. A We also talked in this conversation about he entioned that -- he said he'd try and see if Betty could ome in on the weekend to give me my Christmas presents and told him that was out of the question, to -- you know, et Betty be.

Q Because her brother had just been killed, right? A Right.

Q All right. About how long was the entire phone all? Or I guess technically it would be the second phone all.

A Maybe a half an hour. Maybe I could just say since- ou asked me earlier that it was him suggesting that I would ontact Betty if I were subpoenaed that led me to believe he idn't think I would be subpoenaed that soon because he knew etty was going to be out, you know, he assumed obviously - hat Betty would be out for the week or two weeks with the nexpected loss of her brother.

Q Right. A So that was what led me to believe he had just ound out.

Q After the call was ended, did you call anyone else? A Yes. About a half an hour later, I called Linda.

Q What did the two of you talk about?

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A My conversation with the President. Q Right. It seems self- evident, but -- A I know. I'm sorry.

Q That's all right. What did you tell Linda? A Well, if I could just jump back --

Q Yes. A I mean, I had -- Linda had told me some time in -- I think the second week of December that she had been subpoenaed in the Paula Jones case and that she intended to rat on me, so up until this point, I had been trying to convince her not to tell, that it's not anybody's business.

So when I -- part of my telling her that the President had called; that I, too, may be pulled into this case was just sort of -- maybe assure her that if that happened, there would be someone else denying it, it wouldn't be just Linda out there alone saying "I don't know anything about any kind of relationship between the President and Monica .‘ I

Q Kind of a unified front or something like that? A Exactly.

Q All right. How was the conversation left with . . Linda?

A I think that we'd talk about it the next day.

Q Did you get subpoenaed? A Yes, I did.

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Q When did you get subpoenaed? A On Friday, the 19th of December.

Q Can you tell us about when you believe you were subpoenaed?

A I believe it was around 3: 00, 4: 00 in the afternoon. I think closer to 3: 00, 3: 30.

Q Okay. Where were you served? A At the Pentagon.

Q Could you tell us how it happened? Did someone call you?

A Yes. I received a call in my office from the gentleman who was to deliver the subpoena to me. He informed me he had a subpoena for me. I made a stink to him, asking him why I was being subpoenaed and I had no idea what was going on.

When he gave me the subpoena, he suggested I call Ms. Jones' attorneys, which I made a comment to him that that's not something I would do.

Q When you actually did get served, what was your real reaction inside?

A I burst into tears. It was -- it was very scary. I mean, it just -- sort of my worst nightmare, or I had thought until that point, was being subpoenaed in this case. So I was pretty upset.

Q You couldn't call Betty because Betty was --

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125 A Right.

Q -- in mourning herself. Who did you call? A I called Mr. Jordan.

Q From what phone did you call Mr. Jordan? A From a pay phone.

Q Close to where you were served, the nearest pay phone around?

A No, I think it was the pay phone which is down the hall from my office, which is kind of halfway between where I was served and my office.

Q And why did you use a pay phone? A Because I was crying and I -- I mean, I -- my office, the way my office is set up is my desk was in the same room with four or five other people, so I couldn't very well have any kind of a private discussion.

Q What did you tell Mr. Jordan? A Well, I don't remember what I told him. I was - crying and he didn't seem to understand me, so he just -- he just told me to come to his office around 5: OO.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Did you tell him you'd been subpoenaed? . . A I probably did. I just -- I mean, I don't -- 1 don't remember, I just remember being on the phone crying and him saying, UI can't understand you. I can't understand you."

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Q You got off the phone. What did you do next? Did you finally go to Vernon Jordan's office?

A Yes. I tried to compose myself and I went into the office. I told Mr. -- I believe I told Mr. Bacon or some other people in the office that I had an emergency and I needed to leave. I went home, sort of put myself together, and went to Mr. Jordan's office.

Q When you got to Mr. Jordan's office, did you have to wait outside for a bit?

A Yes.

Q In like a reception area? A I waited in the lobby, like I always did.

Q About how long did you wait in the lobby? A I don't really remember. Q At some point, I take it, you did actually meet with Mr. Jordan?

A Yes. -. - Q How did the conversation with Mr. Jordan progress? A First, I came in and I explained to him clearly that I had been subpoenaed and that I was upset and shortly after, I think maybe I said I didn't know what I was supposed to do, I didn't have an attorney, I think I was rambling.

Shortly after I had arrived at Mr. Jordan's office, he received a phone call and I stepped out of the office.

Q Did he ask you to step out of the office?

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131 A I think 1 may have offered. That was sort of par tar the course. And I waited for him while he was on the shone outside his office and when I came back in, he placed a :a11 to -- 1 don't know if it was right after I came back in, )ut at some point, when I came back in, he placed a call to Ir. Frank Carter.

Q NOW, when you stepped out, he took one call and :hen you stepped back in, did he tell you who he'd been on :he phone with?

A No.

Q All right. We places a call to Frank Carter. 10 you know whether he talked to Frank Carter in person x do you know whether he just left a message or do you recall?

A I don't really recall,

Q When --

A Oh, he said something about -- well; I know he referred to Mr. Carter as Mr. Carter, so I don't know if he ltas talking -- 1 don't really remember if he was talking to Ir. Carter or he was talking to someone else, but it scared ne because I thought for Mr. Jordan to be referring to someone else as Mr. something, that -- I sort of thought he nust be a big deal.

Q All right. When you went to the meeting with 4r. Jordan, did you bring the subpoena with you?

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A Yes, I did. Q Did you show it to Mr. Jordan? A I believe so.

Q What most troubled you about the language of the subpoena and what the subpoena had called for you to produce?

A The thing that alarmed me was that it asked for a hat pin.

Q Okay. And why did that alarm you? A Because I thought that was a very specific gift and in this list of gifts, everything else seemed to be somewhat generic and then it had hat pin, which screamed out at me because that was the first gift that the President had given me and it had some significance.

Q When you showed Mr. Jordan the subpoena, did he make any remark about any of the things that were called for?

A Yes. When I mentioned to him, I think, about the hat pin, he said, "Oh, don't worry about it. -- This is a - vanilla subpoena, this is a standard subpoena," something like that. Generic subpoena, maybe.

Q Did you know what he meant, a vanilla or standard subpoena that asks for hat pins?

A Well, what I understood that to mean was that -- that what he was trying to say is there was nothing out of the ordinary about this subpoena.

Q I see. I guess what I'm trying to get at is do you

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133 think he was trying to imply that all subpoenas ask for that or that all subpoenas in the Paula Jones case asked for that or all subpoenas -- what was he -- from your point of view, what was he trying to convey?

A I think what he -- I think what he was trying to convey was stop worrying, that this is not something out of the -- you know, out of the realm of possibility of what might be in a subpoena.

Q All right. Were you reassured by that? A A little. I -- I sort of felt that he wasn't -- 1 mean, he didn't really understand what I was saying.

Q All right. Did you have any discussion with him about letting the President know that you'd been subpoenaed?

A Yes. I asked Mr. Jordan to inform the President.

Q How did you ask? How often? How vigorously? A I -- I mean, I asked him to -- to please make sure that he told the President. He said he was going to see the President that night, so --

Q All right. Did the subject of a possible sexual relationship between you and the President come up in the conversation?

A Yes, it did.

Q Tell us how it came up. A Mr. Jordan said to me that there -- "There are

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two important questions" or "There are two important -- 'I I think, "Two important questions Cat are related to the case: Did you have sex with the President, you know, or did he ask?" And I said no to both of those.

Q What did you interpret him to be asking when he asked you those questions?

A Well, I thought he -- I guess -- can I step back for a minute?

Q Sure. Up until a point that we'll get to, which is December 31st, I sort of -- mainly, I think, from my discussions with Linda, I was under the impression that -- that Mr. Jordan kind of knew with a wink and a nod that I was having a relationship with the President, that it was never -- he and I never discussed it, but I thought it might be possible.

I'm, you know, a young woman, sort of coming to see him, the President's mentioned me. But I-- also was sort - of under this influence of Linda saying to me, "Of course he knows. Of course he knows. Of course he knows."

So when he asked me those questions, I thought he was asking me, saying essentially "What are you going to -. say?" not necessarily asking me directly what -- you know, "What are the answers to these questions?" More "What are you going to reply in regard to the case?"

Q Now, was your interpretation of his questions based

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135 entirely on your assumption about what he knew? Or was it based in part on how he asked the questions?

A I think it was based more in part on my assumptions of what he knew.

Q Was there anything unusual or suggestive about how he asked the questions?

A No. Q And how did you answer the questions? A No and no. Q Okay. Did you try to make it clear to him at all that there was more to the story than just no and no?

A Not at that point. Q At that time, did you make arrangements to meet with the attorney who you would get, Mr. Frank Carter?

A Yes. After Mr. Jordan made the arrangements with Mr. Carter, he told me to be at his office at -- I think 11: OO or lo: 30 on Monday. -

end? Was A Q A

AII right. How did the meeting with Mr. Jordan there any reference to a hug? Oh, yes. I'm sorry. That's okay. .

When I was leaving, I asked him if he would give the President a hug for me. I bugged him again about making sure he told the President. And so he said, "1 don't hug men." I said, "Well, okay."

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All right. But -- All right. Did you call Linda Tripp afterwards? Yes, I did. What was the purpose of your call? In a -- to let her know that I had been subpoenaed. Tell us how that conversation went. It probably would be impossible for anyone who didn't -- who has listened to that tape to follow. I was beyond paranoid.

I had no idea how I had gotten onto the witness list and then, of course, been subpoenaed and I was thinking at that point that maybe my phone was tapped or someone had read my e- mails or something. But in thinking that my phone might be tapped, I sort of tried to explain to this to Linda that I had been subpoenaed in a veiled fashion.

Q How did you do that? What do you mean? A I used different cover stories. I think like it was a movie or it was a book, trying to discuss things. I think I said something -- "1 received the flowers, 1* trying to intimate that I had received the subpoena. so -- . .

Q Eventually, did you drop the sort of disguised way of talking and just talk about the subpoena, or do you recall?

A I don't believe I did. I don't really remember,

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though.

Q How were things left with Linda? A She was having a party the next day, so we made plans that -- or I suggested that I come early and we could discuss this and that I would help her set up for her dumb party. I’m sorry.

Q Her dumb party? All right. Well, we'll skip the dumb party for now.

A I'm sorry. MR. BMMICK: That's all right. MR. WISENBERG: I have a quick question. MR. EMMICK: Okay. A dumb party question? MR. WISENBERG: Not about the dumb party. MR. EMMICK: All right. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q When you were doing the flowers bit, the book bit, how was she -- you're trying to speak in code- to her, how was -

she responding? A I don't really remember. I just sort of remember her not understanding and me being frustrated. "Hello? Understand. We just talked about this."

A JUROR: Excuse me. May I ask a question? MR. EMMICK: Sure. Absolutely. Yes. A JUROR: Did you ever find out how the Paula Jones lawyers knew about the hat pin, et cetera?

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138 THE WITNESS: I -- from what I've read in the press, yes.

A JUROR: But just from any other source? Did you ever suspect maybe Linda or --

THE WITNESS: I had -- I came to start to suspect her, but not in any way that -- that it really has turned out to be. Not to that degree.

A JUROR: Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Let's turn our attention, then, to December 22nd, which is the day that you met with Frank Carter and I think you had said that you were going to meet with Vernon earlier.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Tell us about that. The Vernon part. A Okay. With all the details?

Q Well, first, when were you supposed to meet with Vernon and then did you place another call to- him?

A Right. I -- I -- I asked -- I called on the morning of the 22nd to see if I could come to see Mr. Jordan earlier. And I was -- I was a little concerned. I thought maybe he didn't really understand or -- fully understand what it was that was happening here with me being subpoenaed and what this really meant. So I came to see Mr. Jordan earlier and I also wanted to find out if he had in fact told the President that I had been subpoenaed.

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Q Right. A Which I found out he did. so I -- so I told Mr. Jordan that -- I said I was concerned that maybe -- that someone had listened in on phone calls and Mr. Jordan said, "Well, you know, so what? The President's allowed to call people."

And I said, "Well, we've had phone sex." And so Mr. Jordan said, "Well, what's phone sex?" And so I said, "Well, you know what phone sex is." And he said, "No, I don't. I'm just an old man. I don't know what phone sex is."

And it was kind of this -- discussion that way.

Q Did you discuss the hat pin? A We didn't discuss the hat pin, but I brought -- I had put together sort of an assortment of things that I was planning to hand over to Mr. Carter as being in response to the subpoena, sort of things that I would -- considered -- gifts, being the Christmas cards that I had received from the White House, I had a copy of the President's book, "Hope and History," which he had signed to me which had a very innocuous sort of inscription. And I think brought some .

innocuous pictures with me. So I showed those to Mr. Jordan.

Q What did you say about those items? A I know that -- I think I was a little more specific in my proffer about what -- I mean, what I remember saying

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now was that -- you know, that I sort of showed him that this is what I was going to respond to for the subpoena.

Q Well, did you bring everything that could have responded to the subpoena that day?

A No. No.

Q Did you try to convey to Mr. Jordan the fact that it wasn't everything?

A I think I might have.

Q And do you remember how you would have conveyed it? Would it have been very expressly or would it have been more impliedly?

A More impliedly. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Did you tell Mr. Jordan that the President had indeed given you a hat pin?

A I did, but I had told him that on Friday and that was what prompted the sort of "this is a vanilla response." -

MR. EMMICR: Let me show you the written proffer -- THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICH: -- and see if that helps you recall or if you know whether or not when you wrote it it's accurate. . .

What we're looking at is the top of page 6 -- everyone else has a copy.

THE WITNESS: Okay. There's some spelling mistakes.

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141 MR. EMMICK: Why don't I just read out loud. This paragraph starts, "On the day Mr. Jordan drove Ms. Lewinsky to Mr. Carter's office, she showed Mr. Jordan the items she was producing in response to the subpoena. Ms. Lewinsky believes she made it clear this was not everything she had that could respond to the subpoena, but she thought it was enough to satisfy. Mr. Jordan made no comment about whether or not what Ms. Lewinsky brought was right or wrong. Mr. Jordan drove Ms. Lewinsky to Mr. Carter's office, introduced them and 1eft. l

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Now, having read that to you, does that refresh your recollection about what was said to him?

A I think I would have implied it.

Q Yes. A That this wasn't everything. I -- I don't really remember if I specifically said -- and from reading this, - it doesn't make me think I necessarily specifically said, "This isn't everything, but it's enough to satisfy," but I could have said that.

Q At the time you wrote this, were you trying to be . . completely truthful and accurate?

A I was trying to be completely -- yes, I was completely truthful and accurate. I'm just also while I'm reading this now, it doesn't necessarily indicate to me

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that -- that what I'm saying here is sort of a direct quote of what I said.

Q Do you remember what Mr. Jordan's reaction was? There it's written that he didn't indicate whether he thought it was right or wrong, but more generally, how did he react when you tried to convey to him that this may not be everything? '

A There were often times when I was with that he would have no reaction at all. He would this "Mmmph" thing.

Q I'm not sure how the court reporter is that. Is that a grunt?

Mr. Jordan kind of do

going to get A And so -- I remember feeling in general with Mr. Jordan and this sub: t matter, just not knowing. Do you understand what I'm trying to say? Is this clear? And not really ever getting much of a reaction from him.

Q Did you take from his lack of reaction that he did - understand or was it still ambiguous in your mind?

A I think sometimes I thought he understood and sometimes I thought it was ambiguous.

Q Okay. Did the subject of phone sex come up again -. in your conversation with Mr. Jordan?

A Aside from what I mentioned before?

Q Yes. Did you explain to him what phone sex was at some point?

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A I think it -- at -- I don't think I said it. He might have said -- know, is it -- uh -- this is embarrassing. Hmm. I think he -- it's hard. I think he -- uh -- might have given some suggestion as to what he thought phone sex was and I agreed. Is that --

Q That's fine. A -- fair?

Q That's fine. A By this time, had you expected the President to call you?

A Mm- hmm. Yes.

MR. EMMICK: I'm sorry? A JUROR: Before you go on, can you ask her what does that mean?

MR. EMMICK: What does phone sex -- A JUROR: No, what did he say? MR. EMMICK: I think the grand juror is asking for - more detail.

THE WITNESS: If I remember correctly, I believe that he said -- or maybe I said something like -- you know, "He's taking care of business on one end and I'm taking care ._ of business on another." Does that --

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q Do you remember which one of you said ii? A When I'm saying that now, I think I said it,

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because that sounds more familiar to me. Does that answer your question? A JUROR: (Nods affirmatively.) BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Did you expect the President to call you? A Yes, I did.

Q Is that why you were bugging or asking Vernon so much about whether he had told the President?

A I don't know. Maybe.

Q All right. A I think I just wanted to make sure the President knew.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q That you had been subpoenaed. A Right. Because I was supposed to call -- you know, in the event that I was subpoenaed, I was supposed to have called Betty and -- so -- __

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q I'm going to ask a question that will suggest what assumptions you were making about what Vernon knew or didn't. Why would you feel comfortable talking with Vernon Jordan . . about phone sex?

A I wasn't comfortable talking to Vernon Jordan about phone sex.

Q Okay.

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A I was scared. MR. EMMICK: Okay. MR. WISENBERG: Questions?

MR. EMMICK: Yes?

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q Did you say on the 22nd that you showed to Vernon Jordan the gifts you bringing to Frank Carter?

A Yes.

Q Okay. Was a hat pin among the things you showed to Vernon Jordan?

A No.

Q But you had indicated to him on the 19th that the President had given you a hat pin.

A Yes. MR. WISENBERG: Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q At some point, you went to Frank Carters's. A Mm- hmrn. Yes.

Q Tell us what happened when you got to Frank Carter's.

A We arrived at Mr. Carter's office and Mr. Jordan ._ and I sat down on the sofa. Mr. Carter came out. Mr. Jordan introduced us and left.

Q In your discussions with Mr. Carter, what was the major point that you were trying to make? What was the big

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146 thing you were trying to convey to Mr. Carter?

A That there was absolutely no reason why I should have been subpoenaed in this case.

Q Okay. And -- A And that I certainly did with the President.

Q You said that A I don't think

to him. not have a relationship

I said those words, but that was what I was trying to convey and certainly when asked those questions, that's what I answered.

Q Did you discuss with him how you could get out of the deposition?

A Yes.

Q Tell us what you talked about. Maybe that would be the easier way to go.

A Okay. I told Mr. Carter I really didn't want to be dragged into this, I didn't -- I thought Paula Jones' claim was bunk and I didn't want to be associated with the case. believe I suggested maybe that I could -- maybe I asked him if I could sign an affidavit or is that something to do.

He said that the first step -- to hold off on that . . and that the first step is he would try to talk to the attorneys for Paula Jones and find out what it is, why they're subpoenaing me and where it is that they're going

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arrange for them to interview me, just kind of do a brief interview, versus a deposition.

Q Did you discuss with him the subpoena insofar as it requested items? Did you, for example, go through and talk about what items were called for?

A Yes, we did. Yes. And I said no to everything until we got to the gifts and then I sort of turned over what it was that I had brought with me that I thought responded to the gifts. And that was it.

Q Was there any mention made by either of you of Bob Bennett?

A Yes.

Q Tell us what was said. A I requested of Mr. Carter that he get in touch with Mr. Bennett and just to be in touch with him and to let him know that I had been subpoenaed in this case and I didn't __ know why.

Q Why did you request that Mr. Carter contact Mr. Bennett?

A Because I thought in the -- how do I explain this? Sort of in the story or role, the story that I was giving . . to Mr. Carter and being a low level political appointee and, in general, even if I hadn't been a low level political appointee, I thought it was probably appropriate to align myself with the President's side, being that that's whose

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148 side I was on and there was no question in my mind.

Q Is another way of saying that you were trying to send a message to the President or to Mr. Bennett?

A Not to the President. He knew. I mean, the President knew, you know? So --

Q So it was more a message to Mr. Bennett? A I just -- to me, that seemed -- I mean, I think -- you have to look at this from the point of view that I was a political appointee. And so --

Q What does that imply for you? A For me, that means that the reason you're in this job is you work for this administration and that you're politically aligned with this administration and everything you do is in the best interests of the administration and, ultimately, the President. And that's where your goal and your focus should be.

Q How were things left? What was he going to do and what were you going to next?

A Mr. Carter was going to get in touch with attorneys for Paula Jones and get in touch with Mr. And he was going to send me a retainer letter. And in touch.

the Bennett. we'd be

Q Let me then ask you the following. You had earlier indicated that the President said that he had a Christmas present for you.

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A Mm- hmm. Yes.

Q Did you ever make contact with Betty Currie in order to make arrangements to pick up the present?

A Yes.

Q Tell us about that. A I called Betty after Christmas to see how she was doing and find out how her holiday was to let her know that the President had he had a Christmas present for me and, base with he -- what he wanted to do, if he wanted to

him to see if get together.

So she called me back and told me to come to the and to ask her -- or

mentioned to me that you know, to touch

White House at 8: 30 in the morning on Sunday, the 28th of December.

Q Did you? A Yes, I did.

Q All right. Betty waved you in? A Yes.

Q At about what time was it, if you can remember? A 8: 30.

Q When you got there, what happened? A I think the President was already there. He was just coming to the Oval Office and Betty and the President and I were in the Oval Office and this was the first time I got to meet Buddy.

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So we played with Buddy in the office and he was running around the carpet. And I had brought a small Christmas present for Buddy. And so the three of us were just talking and goofing off. And then the President and I went into the back study and he gave me my Christmas presents _

Q How long were you in the back study with the President?

A Maybe about 45 minutes to an hour.

Q What was the Christmas present or presents that he got for you?

A Everything was packaged in a big Black Dog -- or big canvass bag from the Black Dog store in Martha's Vineyard. And he got me a marble bear's head carving, sort of -- you know, a little sculpture, I guess, maybe.

Q Was that the item from Vancouver? A Yes. Then he got me a big Rockettes blanket from Christmas of '95 or '96, I think. He got me a Black Dog stuffed animal that had a little Black Dog T- shirt on it.

He got me a small little box of chocolates, cherry chocolates, and then he got me some sunglasses that were a joke because I had -- 1 had teased him for a long time about the different sunglasses that he was wearing in public.

And so then I bought him a normal pair of sunglasses, and so we had just sort of had -- this was a long

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running joke with us, so he bought me these really funny looking sunglasses and we both were putting them on and joking around goofing off.

So -- I'm trying to think what else. Can I look at the list?

MR. EMMICK: Sure. Feel free. THE WITNESS: Oh. He got me a pin that had the most of my Christmas presents were sort of New York themed, so he got me a pin that had the New York skyline on it. I think that's it. Well, it's a lot, so -- not just that's it.

BY MB. EMMICK:

Q Now, you had mentioned earlier that you were concerned about the fact that the subpoena covered this hat pin.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Did you discuss that concern with President Clinton?

A Yes. We -- we really spent maybe about five -- no more than ten minutes talking about the Paula Jones case on this day and -- do you want me to talk about the hat pin or that period of time?

Q The whole period of time, I suppose. A I brought up the subject of the case because I was concerned about how I had been brought into the case and been put on the witness list. So I asked him how he thought I got

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put on the witness list and he told me he thought that maybe it was that woman from the summer with Kathleen Willey, which I knew to be Linda Tripp, or maybe -- he said maybe some of the uniformed -- maybe the uniformed officers.

We talked about that. I mentioned that I had been concerned about the hat pin being on the subpoena and he said that that had sort of concerned him also and asked me if I had told anyone that he had given me this hat pin and I said no.

Q That was false. A Correct. Yes. When in fact I had told people about the hat pin.

Q Right. A Let's see. And then at some point I said to him, "Well, you know, should I -- maybe I should put the gifts away outside my house somewhere or give them to someone, maybe Betty." And he sort of said -- I think-- he responded, "1 don't know" or "Let me think about that." And left that topic.

Q When you said "the gifts, l what did you mean by "the gifts"?

A I meant all the gifts that he had given me.

Q All right. Do you think that you're the one who came up with Betty's name?

A I'm not 100 percent sure, but when I received the

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call from Betty, I wasn‘ t surprised that it was Betty calling, so that's what leads me to believe that I might have suggested it.

0 Okay. Did you discuss with the President the fact that you were planning to sign an affidavit?

A I might have mentioned it, but I don't think -- we really didn't spend very much time on this subject.

Q All right. So you walked in without many gifts, you were going to walk out with a bag of gifts.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Okay. Did it strike you as unusual that when you had a subpoena calling for you to produce gifts the President is giving you a bag of gifts?

A At the time, it didn't strike me as unusual.

Q Okay. And why is that? A I never thought about it. I mean, I was -- I was -- 1 had struggled for a long time before the 28th -- or I should just say -- I guess a few days before the 28th, that if I was going to see the President, if I should tell him or not that Linda knew. And I decided not to.

And so I -- I thought this might be the last time I saw him before I went to New York and I wanted it to be a really nice visit, so I was -- I -- having decided not to tell him about Linda, I kind of didn't even want to go too far there in getting mired down in the discussion of the case.

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visitor's pass. Betty escorted me out and I realized that I left the pass in the office, so Betty told me that she would call down to the guard station and let them know that I was fine and I had just left the pass somewhere.

Q Do you remember what gate you used when you left the White House?

A I believe it was the southwest gate.

Q Did you hear from Betty later that day? A Yes, I did.

Q Were you surprised to hear from her? A No. I mean, I wasn't surprised that I was hearing from Betty. I think I was a little surprised to sort of get the nature of this phone call when the President could have just said right then and there, "Well, yeah, I think, you know, why don't you give them to Betty, that's a good idea." But I wasn't terribly surprised. No.

Q What did she say?

Q All right. When you left the anything unusual happen with respect to

A Yes. Well, I had a visitor's

Q Visitor's E- pass, I guess. A Is that what --

Q A visitor's pass? A Visitor's -- I don't know. I

154 White House, did your E- pass? pass.

know it is a

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me.” Or, "The President said you have something to give me." Along those lines.

Q How long after you had left the White House did Betty call you?

A Several hours.

Q When she said something along the lines of ,rI understand you have something for me," or "The President says you have something for me," what did you understand her to mean?

A The gifts.

Q Okay. A Kind of -- what I was reminded of then a little bit was jumping all the way back to the July 14th incident where I was supposed to call Betty the next day but not really get into details with her, that this was maybe along those same lines.

Q That actually anticipates my next question. A Oh.

Q Did you feel any need to explain to her what was going to happen?

A No.

Q What arrangements did you make for transfer of the something?

A I think we discussed some things and Betty mentioned she was on the way to the hospital to visit her mom

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and she'd swing by and, you know, pick up whatever it was I was supposed to give her.

Q Now, at the time you had that conversation, were you already packing up the gifts at all?

A No. Q When was she going to come by, then? That day? A Yes. Q What did you do after the phone call ended? A I put all the gifts that he had given me on my bed and I got a big box from The Gap and went through each item and decided if I needed to give it to them or not.

Q Can you explain what you mean by that? A It sort of was a difficult -- I -- I wasn't sure if I was going to get this box back, so I didn't want to give everything in the event that I didn't get the box back for some reason.

And I kept out some innocuous things and I kept out- the -- really the most -- the most sentimental gift he had given me was the book, the "Leaves of Grass" book, so -- and it was just -- it's beautiful and it meant a lot to me, so I kept that out.

Q What other -- it sounds to me like you had one category of more sentimental gifts that you kept out of the box.

A Mm- hmm.

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Q And kept for yourself. What other items were in that category, other than the "Leaves of Grass"?

A Not necessarily sentimental ones, but just -- I think I kept out the marble bear head, the bag, the canvass bag, the blanket, the sunglasses, the chocolates. And I think that's it. Oh, wait. And I might have kept out some of the Martha's Vineyard stuff that I had gotten in the fall.

Q Those were items that you've recently turned over to our office.

A Yes.

Q Which items did you put into the box? If you remember.

A The hat pin, the pin that I had received that day for Christmas, a pin that h e had given me for my birthday, a picture that he had signed for me for my birthday that I had framed, a picture he had signed for me of him wearing the first tie I gave him.

Q Any other Black Dog items? A I think there was a Black Dog hat that I put in there. And I'm not -- I'm not really sure what else was in there. Oh, I also put the copies that I had left of the Valentine's Day ad that I had put in the paper for him.

Q The Romeo and Juliet quote? A Mm- hmm.

Q All right. Did Betty come by?

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158 A Yes, she did. I met her outside. Q How did you know when she was going to come by? Was there a prearranged time she was going to come by or did she call you from --

A I think she called me on her way out.

Q YOU met her outside, you had the box with you? A Mm- hmm. I had taped it up and I wrote "Please do not throw away" on it.

Q Were you concerned that she might throw it away? A Mm- hmm. Yes. Sorry.

Q Okay. Let me just ask you some questions. Did you ever discuss with her the contents of the box?

A I don't believe so.

Q Did she ever ask about the contents of the box? A No.

Q Did she ever say anything indicating that she knew from a prior discussion the contents of the box?

A Not -- no, not that I remember.

Q Sounds like it was a short conversation. A We talked about her mom a bit and Christmas. I think maybe I had elaborated on what I got for Christmas from him.

Q Now, you could have just thrown these items out, rather than putting them in a box. Why didn't you- just throw them out?

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A Because I -- they meant a lot to me. Q Okay. You could have given the items to someone else, a friend of yours, Ashley Raines, or to your mother or just hidden them somewhere. Why didn't you do that?

A I think -- I've come to sort of see this now. I don't know that I necessarily saw it then, but I feel now a little bit that me turning over some of these things was a little bit of an assurance to the President or reassurance that, you know, that everything was okay.

Q In your mind, then, were you giving these items not just to Betty, but really to the President as well, in a manner of speaking?

A I think that was even more directly what I thought it was. Not that they were going to be in his possession, but that he would understand whatever it was I gave to Betty and that that might make him feel a little bit better.

Q Did Betty say where she was going to put the box of gifts?

A I think she said she was going to keep them in a closet. Or, you know, she'd keep the box in a closet.

Q Right. A You asked me -- never mind.

Q The gifts. Right. I understood. I understood. All right. What I'd like to do now is ask a few questions --

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WISENBERG: Mike? EMMICK: Yes? WISENBERG: Before you leave that topic, I have a few on that. Do you mind?

MR. EMMICK: No. Not at all. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q You've said here today, Ms. Lewinsky, and I think you told us earlier in some of your sessions with us, that you were -- the non- innocuous items were going to go to Frank Carter and --

MR. MR. MR. MR. corrected,

EMMICK: You mean the innocuous items. WISENBERG: What did I say? EMMICK: The not innocuous items. WISENBERG: Boy. Thank you. I stand

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q The innocuous items were going to ge to Frank Carter, the non- innocuous items were not, but that one of the reasons, one of the criterion for stuff that didn't even go in the Betty Currie box that you would keep would be sentimental value.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Is that -- have I described that accurately? A Sort of.

Q Okay. How not sort of?

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A I didn't really give any gifts to Mr. Carter. Nothing that I turned over to Mr. Carter was a gift from the President. And I think the way you described the dividing of the actual gifts was sort of innocuous, you know, not innocuous -- sentimental value, I think that was more accurate.

Q well, as between the gifts you put in the box and the gifts you kept?

A Mm- hmm.

Q All right. How would you describe today the difference between the two? I just want to make sure I understand, between the ones you kept and the ones you put in the Betty box.

A You know, I don't have a perfect memory of what the criteria was at the time. I know I kept the book out because that was the most sentimental thing to me.

And I believe that the things I put- in the box - were -- also in the box was a dress he gave me from Martha's Vineyard, so the things that went into the box were, I think, more along the lines of some of the things that really complied with the subpoena, that were maybe specifically . . named, although I think books might have been specifically named in the subpoena, but I kept the "Leaves of Grass."

Q They complied with the subpoena, but they're going to Betty Currie.

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162 A Correct.

Q Now, my question is, and I've asked you this before, but I want to ask you in front of the grand jury, since you were basically trying to keep some sentimental things but you told us that the hat pin was sentimental to

you I why is the hat pin going into the Betty box? A Because the hat pin was the alarm of the subpoena, so -- I -- I -- to me, it seemed logical that putting the hat pin in the box -- I mean, it was what had been named in the subpoena.

MR. EMTUCK: All right. Should we take a break? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we should. THE WITNESS: Oh, thank goodness. MR. EMMICK: Okay. All right. Ten minutes. THE WITNESS: Okay. THE FOREPERSON: Ten minutes. (Witness excused. Witness recalled;)

MR. EMMICK: All right. Do we have a quorum? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we do. MR. EMMICK: Any unauthorized persons present? THE FOREPERSON: None at all. . . THE WITNESS: Let me guess. You're going to remind me I'm still under oath.

THE FOREPERSON: There you go. THE WITNESS: Fast learner.

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1 BY MR. EMMICK: 163 I

2 Q MS. Lewinsky, this is what we're going to do. 3 We're going to go over some questions that we'd like to ask 4 and then we're going to turn our attention to the December 5 31st meeting, the breakfast meeting with Vernon Jordan. 6 A Okay. 7 Q Let's go to questions first. One question is Betty 8 comes by and gets this box of gifts. Is there any other way 9 Betty would have known to call and pick up this box of gifts 10 except for the President asking her to?

11 A The only thing I can think of is if he had asked 12 someone else to ask Betty. 13 Q Do you have any reason to think that happened? 14 A No, but, I mean, I wasn't there, so I don't know --

15 I don't know what he said, how -- maybe he left her a note.

16 I mean, I don't know. so -- 17 Q Another way of asking it is did you- tell someone 18 else about this and they might have asked Betty? 19 A No. 20 BY MR. WISENBERG: 21 Q Did you think it as a coincidence that she called . . 22 you? 23 A No.

~. 24 BY MR. EMMICK:

25 Q Let me ask you a couple of questions about the

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December 20th dumb parzy. A Okay.

Q Okay? First, why is it a dumb party. A Oh. Really? You want me to answer that? Q Yes. A Well, because it was Linda Tripp's party and -- well, that should be enough, but just that I got there and I got stuck having to do all this stuff and I had really wanted to talk to her about the predicament we were in and -- I now look back on it and just -- she had spent all this money on food and a month before she had had no money for the bus and was trying to sell her clothes and somehow she had $500 to spend on food and had money to spend on presents underneath her tree and it was just dumb.

Q Let's focus on the discussions you had with Linda at the dumb party or before the dumb party about the situation. ._

A I really didn't sort of get into, I think, a full discussion with her until after -- well, until I was leaving and I asked her to walk me out to my car.

Q Let's talk first then about the efforts you made to . . talk with her about the subpoena in the house. Did you try to?

A Probably. It was -- I got there maybe -1 the -- I think the party was supposed to start around 7: 30 and I got

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there at 5: 00 and she had made no food, had done nothing. mean, she just had this fridge stuffed with food.

So I was trying to help prepare all this stuff. There was a lot more work to do than I thought there would be and then her daughter had this obsession with vacuuming that night, so there were just a lot of people and I don't really remember trying to get a chance.

I may have tried to or sort of said "1 need to talk to you," kind of a thing, but I don't recall having any discussions with her before the party.

Q Okay. And then you mentioned that you were able to talk to her a little bit outside, I think you said?

A Mm- hmm.

Q Tell us about that. A The main -- the main feeling point, once I had received my subpoena she didn't need to worry about denying about this relationship, because I was oath as well.

I had had at that was that -- that now that she knew anything - going to deny it under

And so sort of just -- 1 figured that conversation would kind of just be mapping out what our next steps would be. But it ended up being much shorter and I -- she looked at the subpoena -- excuse me -- sorry -- and I think she -- she kept talking about how weird, "Isn't the hat pin strange? Isn't it strange that they're asking about the hat pin?"

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And we talked about that. And I think that -- I -- I was -- I was -- I don't think that I was left with the feeling that she was going to continue on this path of insisting she would rat on me. So -- is that clear? I'm sorry -- no? Okay.

When I left that night, I felt a little more -- I think I felt a little more reassured that she and I would be saying the same thing in the Paula Jones case. Is that -- okay. But I wasn't 100 percent sure and I think that we left it that we'd have some more discussions about this.

Q Okay. One of the things we wanted to get back to was the whole situation on the 28th where there's a subpoena that calls for you to turn over gifts and the President is giving you gifts.

A Mm- hmm.

Q What do you think the President is thinking when he is giving you gifts when there's a subpoena covering the gifts? I mean, does he think in any way, shape or form that you're going to be turning these gifts over?

A You know, I can't answer what he was thinking, but to me, it was -- there was never a question in my mind and . . I -- from everything he said to me, I never questioned him, that we were ever going to do anything but keep this private, so that meant deny it and that meant do -- take whatever appropriate steps needed to be taken, you know, for that

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to happen, meaning that if I had turned over every gift he had given me -- first of all, the point of the affidavit and the point of everything was to try to avoid a deposition, so where I'd have to sort of -- you know, I wouldn't have to lie as much as I would necessarily in an affidavit, how I saw it.

So by turning over all these gifts, it would at least prompt them to want to question me about what kind of friendship I had with the President and they would want to speculate and they'd leak it and my name would be trashed and he would be in trouble. so --

Q So your impression, then, was in the same way that the two of you were going to deny the relationship, you would also deny or conceal the gifts that were personal that passed between you.

A And the phone call -- I mean, I think that it was everything. I think it was kind of -- at least for me, I - don't know what he did, for me, this had to be thought through. You know, I had to anticipate everything that might happen and make sure -- you know --

Q You did what was necessary. . . A Exactly.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Although, Ms. Lewinsky, I think what is -sort of -- it seems a little odd and, I guess, really the grand jurors

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anted your impression of it, was on the same day that you're iscussing basically getting the gifts to Betty to conceal

hem, he's giving you a new set of gifts. A You know, I have come recently to look at that as ort of a strange situation, I think, in the course of the ast few weeks, but at the time, I was -- you know, I was in ove with him, I was elated to get these he same time that I was so scared about hing, I was happy to be with him and -- bout that.

presents and -- at the Paula Jones I -- I didn't think

He had -- he had hesitated very briefly right efore I left that day in kind of packaging -- he packaged 11 my stuff back up and I just sort of -- you know, remember im kind of hesitating and thinking to myself -- I don't hink he said anything that indicated this to me, but I hought to myself, "1 wonder if he's thinking he shouldn't ive these to me to take out." But he did. --

Q And he had already told you he had some gifts for

DU for Christmas. A Correct.

BY MR. EMMICK: . .

Q You mentioned earlier when I asked who was on the ist in your mind of people who should be avoided like Nancy crnreich or Steve Goodin, you mentioned Mr. Ickes. 1

A Mm- hmm.

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1 Q That name came up. Why was Mr. Ickes on the avoid 2 list? 3 A He -- well, he -- he's just strange. And he -- 4 I'm sorry. He& would -- you know, you could be the only 5 person in the hall and you would pass Mr. Ickes in the hall 6 and he would just glare at you. You know. 7 And I'd say, "Hello," you know, as you would 8 imagine you're supposed to do and he'd just glare at you

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25 and walk past you. And I thought that was strange.

Call me weird.

Q Okay. And that's the reason that you mentioned him on the list of people to avoid?

A And I think just -- his name is sort of in my mind for having to do with things that we're discussing today and what's been in the press of it, but it really was most every senior person in the White House, I mean, except for Betty who knew who I was that would concern me.

Q Right. A I mean, I had -- you know, I had had a lot of interaction with these people during the furlough, so --

Q Let me ask you a question about Tim Keating. . . Did Tim Keating tell you or imply to you that you could come back after the election?

A He told me that I could probably come back after the election.

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Q Okay. Do you remember when he said that to you?

A Yes. On --

Q Go ahead. A I'm sorry. On the day that he informed me of the transfer.

Q So that would have been the 5th of April? Does that sound right? Friday, the 5th of April?

A Correct. It was Good Friday, I remember.

Q Did he say anything about any problem of an appearance of impropriety during that conversation with you? Something like doesn't matter

A No.

Q That there might be an appearance before but it

after the election, anything like that? No. No. subject didn't come up at all? A Not with Mr. Keating.

Q You mentioned that when -- oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead. Sure. -.

A JUROR: I'm sorry. What would have prompted him to make a comment like that, that you could come back after the election?

THE WITNESS: I was crying and I just kept telling . . him, I -- you know, I didn't really want to leave and why did I have to leave and wasn't there -- you know, weren't there other openings rather than me having to go to the Pentagon because he had --

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Do you want me to get into a little bit about what was said there?

MR. EMMICK: If it will help answer the question, sure.

A JUROR: Yes. Please. THE WITNESS: Okay. There had been problems with my supervisor, Jocelyn Jolley, and so when I was called in to Tim's office, I had thought he was -- he had just spoken with Jocelyn and I thought he was going to tell me they had fired Jocelyn and instead he told me that they were -- that for reasons having to do with some of the workload not -- things with the letters from the Office of Management and Budget, that they had to blow up -- quote- unquote, blow up the correspondence office and they were eliminating my position.

My transfer had nothing to do with my work, I shouldn't see this as a negative thing. He told me I was too sexy to be working in the East Wing and that this job at the - Pentagon where I'd be writing press releases was a sexier job.

And I was crying and -- BY MR. EMMICK:

Q What do you think he meant by "too sexy"? A I think he meant that -- he -- I think he was trying to -- you know, trying to conceal the fact that -- you know, that I now know, the real reason I was being

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172 ransferred. And so I think he was trying to not maybe anger e. And thought that somehow by -- maybe he thought I'd hink that was a complement.

A JUROR: Did you think he was patronizing you? THE WITNESS: A little bit. Yeah. That's a good ay to put it. I -- I just -- I just remember thinking that

was -- I was never going to see the President again and hat all of a sudden that this -- you know, the end of his -- this relationship.

And I kept -- I've always sort of -- I'm the kind f person that always thinks that I can fix everything and so t was kind of this -- feeling of wait, this train's going oo fast and I can't stop it and that it had already passed nd -- and -- so when Tim said that, I think he sort of said hat -- I don't think he meant to say that. I think that was robably more than he was supposed to say.

A JUROR: Thank you. .

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Going back again to the 17th of December when the resident called you and let you know about the witness list, ou said he used the phrase, "It broke my heart to see you on . .

he witness list." What was your reaction when he said that? A I believed him. I think I also --

Q You thought he was being sincere? A JUROR: Can I ask another follow- up question?

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173 MR. EMMICK: Sure. A JUROR: Because you had nothing to do with formulating this witness list, why do you think it breaks his heart, that your name was on there? Because you're innocent of having formulated this list. Do you have -- or in your opinion, what is it that hurt him?

THE WITNESS: I think it was the idea that -- that -- this was going to -- that this was going to be a bad thing for me. I mean, if you imagine what's happened now hadn't happened and let's just say the Paula Jones thing had gone ahead and I had somehow been dragged into that, just being associate with it and it being difficult and maybe he -- maybe it was going to seriously alter any kind of friendship or relationship that we had, you know?

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q I want to ask a question about computer e- mails or files. Did you arrange for the deletion of files or e- mails -- that might have related to you and the President?

A Did I arrange?

Q Or did you delete them. Sorry. A Yes, I did.

Q Okay. Did you ask Linda Tripp if she would delete e- mails relating to the President?

A Yes.

Q Did you speak with someone at the Department of

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Defense in order to learn something about those deletions or to make sure that they would be more longstanding?

A Not about deletions.

Q Okay. Well, what was it that you spoke with him about?

A I asked him -- I asked Floyd, I think it is, if -- if -- sort of how easily someone could break into the computers. And I couldn't imagine how I had come to this witness -- come to be on this witness list, so one of the things I thought was maybe someone had broken into my computer and was reading my e- mails. And he told me that that was really difficult.

And then I asked him about -- then with the thought in mind of getting rid of the e- mails, I asked him what the sort of saving procedure was with the e- mails. I know at the White House, they back them up and put them in the archive forever and he told me that at the Pentagon, they sort of stay on the server for four weeks and then they're dumped into e- mail heaven or something.

Q All right. Did you ever ask Catherine Allday Davis to delete e- mails that you had sent relating to the President?

A No.

Q At any time, did you create anything like a spreadsheet that contained on it information relating to your

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relationship with the President? A Yes.

Q Okay. Tell us about that. A Linda and I had been talking and she had been talking about she's really good at coming up with patterns of things or -- 1 think that was the word she used.

And so she was wanting to see -- you know, I think in an effort to aid her in trying to figure out what the pattern of my relationship with the President was, I made a stupid spreadsheet on Microsoft Excel that just had the -- the numbered days of the month and the months and determined on what day was there a phone call or did I see him or see him at an event or something like that. So --

Q Is that something that you ultimately printed out and showed to her?

A Yes.

Q I take it that was on the DOD computer? A Yes.

Q Were the entries that you made, would they have revealed that you were talking about Clinton?

A No.

Q Okay. Did you ever have an extra copy of that -- let's call it a spreadsheet?

A No.

Q Did you save the file of the spreadsheet?

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A No. I don't believe so.

Q All right. Going back also to the night of the 17th, December 17th, just so that we can get clear on the date of that, it was at 2: 30 in the morning. Is it literally on the 17th or is it --

A Nineteen -- eighteen -- it is literally the morning, 2: 30 in the morning of the 17th. So, yes.

Q Okay. Good. When the President gave you the Vancouver bear on the 28th, did he say anything about what it means?

A Mm- hmm.

Q What did he say? A I think he -- I believe he said that the bear is the -- maybe Indian symbol for strength, just -- you know, and to be strong like a bear.

Q And did you interpret that as be strong in your decision to continue to conceal the relationship?

A No. MR. EMMICK: All right. Any follow- up on that? MS. WIRTH: Can I ask one question? MR. EMMICK: Sure. .

BY MS. WIRTH:

Q Did he say something like "This is when you need to be strong," or "This is for when you need to be.. strong"? Beyond saying that it was a symbol of strength?

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A I think he -- he held it and he said, you know, "You can hold onto this when you need to be strong."

MS. WIRTH: Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q What I'd like to do is ask you about a passage frorr, the proffer and I'm looking at page 5.

A Okay.

, Q And you'll see at the bottom, and I'll read the

passage, this is relating to the meeting on the I9th, just after you've gotten the subpoena, meeting with Vernon Jordan, and what the passage says is "Possibly later in that meeting, but more probably the next meeting," I assume that's a reference to the 22nd?

A Correct.

Q "Ms. Lewinsky tried to make it clear to Mr. Jordan that she in fact did have a physically intimate relationship with the President." And then let's go to the next page. It says, "Ms. Lewinsky made it clear she intended to deny the sexual relationship with the President."

So I guess what I want to talk about is the portion of the passage on page 5.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Tell us how you tried to make it clear to Mr. Jordan that you had a physically intimate relationship with the President.

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i78 A I think by mentioning the phone sex.

Q I see. All right. Any other way that you tried to make it clear to him?

A Not that I remember.

Q All right. And then is it your recollection now that it was on the 22nd that you were trying to make this clear to Mr. Jordan?

A Yes.

Q As opposed to the 19th? A Yes.

MR. EMMICK: Any other follow- up on that? BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Ms. Lewinsky, how did you make it clear to him that you intended to deny the relationship with the President on the 23rd? Excuse me. The 22nd.

A This is, I think, as I mentioned to you guys before, this is -- I don't have a memory of this. I know when I wrote this I was telling the truth, so I'm sure I did do this, but I don't remember.

MR. WISENBERG: Ms. Lewinsky -- Mike, do you mind if I ask some questions? MR. EMMICK: Go right ahead. BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q I think, you can correct me if I'm wrong, you've done it previously today, so I'm sure you will again if I am,

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175 you told us when we first met with you in the proffer meeting that you couldn't specifically remember that item. Is that correct?

A Yes.

Q And I think you said you couldn't specifically remember any more of the item that Mike just read to you on the bottom of the previous page about the physically intimate relationship.

A Right.

Q But that you had no doubt that it's true. Is that correct?

A I was being truthful in my proffer. Yes.

Q And the proffer, written proffer, is accurate. Is that correct?

A Yes.

Q But -- and I think you also said you feel some -- 1 don't know if this is the reason you don't remember it, but you have expressed to us that you feel some guilt about Vernon Jordan. Is that correct?

A Mm- hmm.

Q That's a yes? . . A Yes.

Q Okay. Can you tell us why that is? A He was the only person who did what he said he was going to do for me and -- in getting me the job. And when I

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met with Linda on the 13th, when she was wearing a wire, and even in subsequent or previous conversations and subsequent conversations, I attributed things to Mr. Jordan that weren't true because I knew that it had leverage with Linda and that a lot of those things that I said got him into a lot of trouble and I just -- he's a good person and --

Q Is one example of -- and then I'll leave this topic, is one example of one of the things you told Linda that isn't true, nI told Vernon Jordan no job, no affidavitw? Something along those lines?

A Yes. Because Linda made me promise her that on the 9th.

Q Okay. Of January? A Of January.

MR. WISENBERG: Okay. THE FOREPERSON: Do you need a minute? THE WITNESS: I'm okay. Thanks. A JUROR: I'm a little confused. When you said that you said certain things because you know Linda had the mike, right?

THE WITNESS: Oh, I didn't know Linda had the mike. . . I now know that she was wearing a wire.

A JUROR: Okay. But so why would you say these things about Mr. Jordan that were not true? What was the reason?

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THE WITNESS: Because -- I had -- from some of my conversation with Linda, I started to think that she was a little bit jealous that Mr. Jordan was helping me get a job in New York and that I was leaving the Pentagon and that -- she had remarked one time that -- that, you know, Mr. Jordan who is the most powerful, you know, man in this city got me my attorney and she -- she thinks that she only had -- you know, this dinky attorney or something like that.

And I was -- 1 was so desperate for her to -- I was -- for her to not reveal anything about this relationship that I used anything and anybody that I could think of as leverage with her. I -- her, the President, my mom, everybody. I mean, not her, but Mr. Jordan, the President, my mom. Anybody that I thought would have any kind of influence on her, I used.

Does that answer your question? A JUROR: Well, it doesn't. I guess- what I'm trying to figure out, okay, is what was that going to accomplish? Was that going to make her -- what?

THE WITNESS: Well, specifically, with the statement about I won't sign the affidavit until I get the

job, is that I had a conversation with Linda, which we'll probably get to --

MR. EMMICK: I hope. THE WITNESS: Oh. On January 9th and in that

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182 conversation, she had told me she had changed her mind, she was going to be vague on the truth about Kathleen Willey and then she told me -- at that point, I had told her I hadn't signed an affidavit when I had and I told I didn't have a job yet and I knew I was probably going to be getting a job that day.

And she said, "Monica, promise me you won't sign the affidavit until you get the job. Tell Vernon you won't sign the affidavit until you get the job because if you sign the affidavit before you get the job, they're never going to give you the job."

And I didn't want her to think that I had gone ahead and done anything without her and that I was leaving her in the dark. I wanted her to feel that -- sort of Linda and myself against everyone else because I felt like I needed to hold her hand through this in order to try to get her to do what I wanted, essentially. - _

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q We can get into that in more detail when we talk about the 13th.

A Okay. . . Q Why don't we do the following. I wanted to ask some -- rather than just jumping into the 31st which is a

Vernon Jordan meeting, why don't we ask some questions about which of your gifts to the President you have ever seen in

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185 the White House itself, either in the dining room or the study or the Oval Office generally.

A Does that include gifts that I gave him that I've seen him wear?

Q All right. Well, let's just start with the things that you've seen in the area itself.

A Okay. Okay. I -- can I go through -- just go through the list?

Q Sure. A That would probably be easier. On page 6, I've seen the two little books.

Q Two little books? A The "Oy Vey" book, which is jokes and the little golf book.

A given him

A Do you remember when you saw those books?

Yes. On -- I think it was November 13th. Zadilla day? - .

Zadilla day. All right. I saw a copy of the Washington Post ad that I had in a book on his desk. . . You gave him a smallish copy of the -- 1 gave him an actual copy that I cut out from one of the papers and I glued it into a little cardboard thing.

Q And where did you see it on his desk.

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i84 A Yes.

MS. WIRTH: Mike, could I ask a question? BY MS. WIRTH:

Q Did you see the ad in a particular book? A Yes.

Q Which one? A "VOX . ” Q Okay. And was that on the desk in the study? A Yes.

Q And was "Oy Vey" on the desk in the study? A Yes.

Q What about the little golf book? A I think it was. I -- I -- I'm not 100 percent sure it was a golf book, I'm 99.9 percent sure.

Q And about how many books does the President have on - his desk in the study?

A He has maybe about 15 or 20 little books that are on his desk and he has more books over there and more books on the bookshelf.

MS. WIRTH: Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q How about the opener? A Right. The -- right. The wooden frog letter

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opener that I gave him. I'm just trying to go through this way, so --

Q All right. Go ahead. A I saw the -- well, I lent him the book "Disease and Misrepresentation."

Q And did you see it in the Oval Office somewhere? A No, I saw it in the back study.

Q The back study? And that would have been on page a, I believe?

A Right. And then the letter opener that I was

mentioning a moment ago was on page 9. I saw the antique paperweight.

Q Okay. Where is it that you saw the opener?

A It was on top of -- 1 think it's a cigar box on his desk in the back office. I saw the antique --

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q When did you see that, Monica? _- A Zadilla day. I saw the antique paperweight on his -- he has a collection of antique political memorabilia in the dining room on top of sort of a chest sort of thing, and I saw that there on -- I think on December 6th or December 28th.

BY MR. EMMICK: .

Q Okay. Do you remember which? A No. I saw the standing cigar holder, I think, it

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186 was on his Oval Office desk. Or it might have been in the back. I think it was on the Oval Office desk. On the 28th of December. And that's it.

Q All right. Let's turn our attention to the 31st of December. You had indicated earlier that at some point you started to get more and more concerned about Linda Tripp and whether she was going to rat on you, I think was the way you put it. What did you do with respect to Vernon Jordan in that concern?

A Since Linda had stopped returning my calls around the 24th of December, by the end of December, I realized I'd kind of better come up with some sort of strategy as to how -- if Linda Tripp comes out and says all these things where this is coming from and try to prepare the President.

And since I couldn't find it within myself to bring it up to him directly, I called Mr. Jordan and told him that I needed to talk to him, I had some concerns about something.

Q When did you call him? A I think it was the 30th of December.

Q Did you speak with him directly? . .

A I think I might have spoken with his -- with his secretary.

Q Do you remember her name? A Gail. There was another one, too, but I've forgot

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her name. And I met Mr. Jordan for breakfast on -- no, not Sunday but December 31st, the morning of the 31st, at the Park Hyatt Hotel.

And in the course of the conversation I told him that I had had this friend, Linda Tripp, who was sort of involved in the Paula Jones case with, I think, the Kathleen Willey stuff. I don't know if I went into that much detail, but I did tell him her name.

And I said that she was my friend, that I didn't really trust her -- 1 used to trust her, but I didn't trust her any more and I was a little bit concerned because she had spent the night at my home a few times and I thought -- I told Mr. Jordan, I said, well, maybe she's heard some -- you know -- I mean, maybe she saw some notes lying around.

And Mr. Jordan said, "Notes from the President to you?" And I said, "No, notes from me to the President." And he said, "Go home and make sure they're nut there." -

Q What did you understand him to mean when he said,

"Go home and make sure they're not there"? A I thought that meant that -- to go home and search around and if there are any copies of notes or anything that . . I sent or drafts, to throw them away.

Q Did you have any further discussions with Mr. Jordan about Mr. Clinton and the Clinton's marital status?

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188 A Yes. After breakfast, in the car, I asked Mr. Jordan if he thought the President would always be married to the First Lady and he said, "Yes, as he should be." And gave me a quote from the Bible. And a few -- maybe a minute or so later, he said, "Well, maybe you two will have an affair when he's out of office."

And at that point, I was shocked because I thought Mr. Jordan had known that we had already had this affair and I think I alluded to this earlier today when I saying until the 31st I didn't know, and I said, I'Well, we already had an affair. We just -- you know, we didn't have sex or did everything but sex," or something like that. And he just kind of went -- one of those "Mmmph." You know --

Q A grunt? A And didn't really respond to me. So I took that as my cue to drop the subject. But __ so --

MR. EMMICK: All right. -_ -

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q What did you eat for breakfast at the Hyatt? A I had an -- 1 had an egg white omelet.

BY MR. EMMICK: -.

Q What did he have? A I think he had cereal with yogurt.

BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q Do you remember who paid?

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A Mr. Jordan. He's a gentleman.

Q Do you remember how he paid? A No.

Q Has anyone or the FBI shown you to that breakfast?

from the Office of Independent any paperwork of any kind with

Counsel reference

A No.

January? A

MR. WISENBERG: Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK: Let's turn back to the topic of gifts. Okay. Did you give a gift to the President in early

Yes, I did. Well, I guess -- 1 gave it to Ms. Currie for the President.

Q What was the gift? A It was an antique book on the various presidents with sketchings. A history book.

Q Where did you buy the book? A At an antique bookstore in Georgetown.

Q Was there anything along with the book? ._ A A note.

Q Okay. What kind of a note? A An embarrassing mushy note.

Q Okay. Did you attach the note to the book in some

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way? A I don't really -- I might have put it inside the book or I may have put it outside. I wrapped the book.

Q And how did you try to get this book to the President?

A I called Betty over the weekend and asked her if I could drop it off so I didn't have to waste money on a courier.

Q And when you say "the weekend," are you talking about that first weekend in January?

A Yes.

Q Do you remember if it was Saturday, the 3rd, or Sunday, the 4th?

A I believe it was Sunday the 4th.

Q You called Betty and what again did you say to Betty?

A I don't -- I think I said something'--- you know, - "1 have something for him, could I drop it off to you so I don't have to waste money on a courier."

Q Okay. And what did you do? A So she said that was fine. So I went over to her home and --

Q Had you been to her home before? A Yes.

Q Had you ever dropped anything off at her home for

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the President before? A No.

Q What did you do when you got her home? A Well, she was sitting on the porch, so we sat on the porch and I gave her the package and we talked for a little while.

Q Did you talk at all about the gift that was for the President?

A We might have. I might have mentioned it. Probably did. I'm not --

Q Was there any discussion about the fact that the President was himself under subpoena and was going to be deposed in a couple of weeks?

A No.

Q Were you concerned about giving him a book, a gift, under those circumstances?

A No. . .

Q Okay. Did you ever talk to the President and learn whether he got the book and the note?

A Yes, I did.

Q All right. When did you talk with him and learn . . about that?

A On the 5th of January. I think it was the 5th of -. January. You know -- can I just --

Q Sure. Take a look.

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A Yes. It was the 5th of January.

Q And that would have been Monday? A Correct.

Q Why don't we try to proceed through Monday because Monday started with a meeting with you and Frank Carter and then there was the phone call afterwards, so let's go first to the meeting with Frank Carter.

A Okay.

Q Feel free. A I met with Mr. Carter to go over in more detail where we stood at that point with the Paula Jones case and he went over -- he went over what was going to happen if an affidavit wasn't going to satisfy the Paula Jones attorneys and I did have to get deposed and what the room looks like, what -- you know -- everything that happens in a deposition and he threw out a bunch of different questions.

You know, they'll probably ask you who your first - grade teacher was and they'll ask you -- you know, some things and then some of the questions that concerned me were questions like "How did you get your job at the Pentagon?" And how did -- you know, and he said, "They'll ask things . .

like did you find out about the opening on a bulletin board or did someone tell you about it? Who recommended you for the job? How did everything get facilitated for the transfer?"

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193 And that alarmed me because I didn't really know

how to necessarily answer that. I didn't express that to Mx. Carter, but --

Q Well, when you say you didn't know how to answer it, what do you mean, you didn't know how to answer it?

A Well, I was concerned that if I said in -- you know, if possibly that was going to come up in the affidavit which hadn't bee written yet or in a deposition, if I had said -- mentioned certain people that had been involved in helping me secure the position over at the Pentagon or forcing me to go there, really, that because these people didn't like me, if they were ever questioned by the Paula Jones attorneys, that they might say something contrary to what I said just because -- to get me in trouble because they didn't like me.

So I was concerned that -- I wanted to -- I wanted to have some sort of feeling of protection, that -- you know, - that I wouldn't be screwed over by these people.

Q Were you concerned that they were going to say nasty things about you or were you concerned that they were going to say things that might ultimately lead to the . . revealing of the relationship in some way?

A No, I was just concerned that they would purposefully say something different from whatever. 1 said just because they had the opportunity to screw me.

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194 I mean -- not -- never mind.

Q Okay. A To cause trouble for me. How's that?

Q Did you discuss with Mr. Carter the affidavit that you were considering?

A Yes.

Q What did you talk about? A I think he -- he said he would work on a draft and he'd get a draft of the affidavit to me.

Q Okay. At the time, did you want anyone else to review that affidavit before you ultimately signed it?

A At first, I didn't think about it, but then I did. I decided I wanted Mr. Jordan to look at it.

Q All right. Why did you want Mr. Jordan to look it?

A I think I felt that -- that he being the President's best friend and having a -- a clearer understanding of my relationship with the President than Mr. Carter did, that I just would feel that it sort of had been blessed.

MR. EMMICK: Okay. ._

BY MS. IMMERGUT: at

Q And would that be blessed by the President as well? A Yes, I that's what I -- I mean, I -- I think I felt

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195

something was okay, that I'm sure the President would think it was fine.

MS. IMMERGUT: Okay. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Did you discuss the subpoena and the items that might be responsive to the subpoena anymore? I think you had talked about it earlier.

A You know, there's been a little bit of confusion for me when I gave Mr. Carter those items, so it's possible.

Q All right. You mentioned that Mr. Carter asked you some hard questions about like how you got your job. Did you want to talk with anybody about that afterwards?

A Yes. I placed a call to Ms. Currie and asked her to let the President know I needed to speak to him and it was important.

Q Did you say anything to Ms. Currie about signing something? - .

A I think I might have sort of said, just, you know, hoping that she might pass that along, I think.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Do you remember saying that you wanted to or needed . .

to speak to the President before you signed something? A I think so.

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when you said that? A No.

Q Okay. A I'm pretty sure I did say that to Ms. Currie.

Q Did you finally get in contact or did you at some time shortly thereafter get in contact with Mr. Clinton?

A Yes.

Q How did that happen? A Ms. Currie called me back a few hours later and then she put the President on.

Q Before we talk about what the President and you talked about, as background, I guess, were you upset or in a mood that day from a photograph you had seen?

A Oh, you really want to embarrass me, don't you?

Q Well, I just want to get the mood right. A I had been peeved by the photo and the footage that was in the media from the President and First-- Lady being romantic on their holiday vacation. So I felt a little bit like -- I -- I was just annoyed.

I was jealous and it just seemed sort of something he had never -- an aspect of their relationship that he had . . never really revealed to me and it made me feel bad.

So I was -- I don't know if anyone here has ever done this, where you -- you're annoyed with someone so you kind of want to pick a fight with them and you want to be a

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22 And there was a lot of truth to that. I mean, it 23 was a generality, but that was -- I said, "Well, that's a 24 $ ff 25

little bit hostile so that -- you know, you just wrong way.

Q Okay. A So that was how I was feeling.

Q That's how you exhibited the annoyance whatever.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Okay. Tell us about your conversation President.

197

rub them the or anger or with the A Because of those feelings, I was a little bit curt with him and so I told him that I had had this meeting with Mr. Carter and that I was concerned, you know, from the questions he asked me that if, you know, if I at some point had to kind of -- under oath, answer the course of answering a question I White House who didn't like me, that getting -- they'd get me in trouble.

these questions and in mentioned people at the somehow I would end up

._ that the people in Legislative Affairs got it for you or helped you get it." . .

good idea. Okay."

Q Was there any discussion of the book?

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A Yes. I had asked him if he had gotten the book that I sent with Betty and he said he did, he really liked it, and then -- I had written him this -- this note that I had sort of -- wrote -- I think it was Sat. urday night when I got home from the movies and I had seen the Titanic that weekend and it just was -- just brought up a lot of feelings and thoughts for me that I put on -- that I put on paper.

And so I sort of said something about, "Oh, well, I shouldn't have written some of those things in the note." Because I was angry about seeing the picture with them romantic, it made me feel really stupid for having sent this letter.

And he said, "Yeah, you shouldn't have written some of those things." Kind of along the ways he had said before, about not writing particular things on paper, you know, putting things to paper. So --

Q About how long was your telephone call with the -: President?

A Maybe 15 minutes.

MR. EMMICK: Anything else on that? i THE WITNESS: I see you trying not to laugh. -.

i MR. EMMICK: What about break- wise? Where are we? j

Is this a good time for a break or do we want to keep going? j

THE FOREPERSON: Yes. Yes. t { MR. EMMICK: All right. 1

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199 THE FOREPERSON: I would say only five minutes. MR. EMMICK: All right. Five minutes it is. THE FOREPERSON: A five- minute break. I'm sorry, Okay.

(Witness excused. Witness recalled.)

MR. EMMICK: Madam Foreperson, do we have a quorum? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we do. MR. EMMICK: Are there any unauthorized persons present?

THE FOREPERSON: There are none. Monica, it's my responsibility -- THE WITNESS: I know. THE FOREPERSON: -- to remind you you're still under oath.

THE WITNESS: Okay. Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q We just finished talking about January 5th. Why don't we turn to January 6th. On January 6th, did you pick up a copy

Jordan to A

of the draft affidavit from Frank Carter? Yes, I did. You had mentioned earlier that you wanted Vernon -. look at it. Did you contact him? Yes, I did. Did you speak with him personally or did-- you speak

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A I don't really remember. Q And did you try to get a copy of the draft affidavit to Mr. Jordan?

A Yes. I dropped off a Xerox copy in his office.

Q In his office? A In the lobby of his -- of Akin Gump.

Q Did you make any arrangements to contact him in order to talk about the draft affidavit?

A I believe -- 1 think I remember Gail saying he was in a meeting and something about 4: OO, be out and he would call me at 4: O0.

Q Did you talk with him on the affidavit?

A Yes, I did.

Q All right. Tell us what the about.

A I had had some concerns from affidavit and addressed those concerns agreed.

that he was going to 6th about the draft

two of you talked looking at the draft - with him and he

Q What were the nature of the concerns, if you remember?

A I think that the general concern was that Mr. Carter had inserted some information about me having possibly been alone with the President for a few minutes, bringing him a letter in Legislative Affairs.

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Q Would it help you if I showed you a copy of the draft with some of your handwriting on it?

A Oh. Yes.

MR. EMMICK: I'm placing before the witness what is marked as Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 3.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- 3 was marked for identification.) BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Can you tell us what this is? A Sure. Do the grand jurors have a copy of this?

Q They do. A Okay. This is a draft of my affidavit that Mr. Carter drew up based on his conversations with me.

Q And the handwriting on it? Whose is that? A That's my handwriting.

Q There's also some underlining and some scratch-

outs.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Did you do all of that? A Yes.

Q Can you remember looking at that now what the two . . of you talked about?

A I think that -- 1 think that it was -- I think the two main things were this last sentence in paragraph 6 and the -- the concern was, for me at least, was not wanting to

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give the Paula Jones attorneys any thought about why they might need to want to talk to me. So if I had mentioned that I had been in there alone, it would kind of make them think, oh, well, what happened and did he proposition or blah, blah, blah.

And then the second thing was in the -- towards the end of paragraph 8 on page 2, the idea of with crowds of other people, I think to me was too far from the fake truth?

Q Okay. A Does that -- is that clear? Sort of -- that that seemed to be too out of the realm of possibility, so --

Q Too implausible? A Exactly. Thank you. So I believe that, you know, that this statement, "There were other people present on all of these occasions," was something that I discussed with Mr. Jordan.

Q Did he agree with the suggestions or thoughts that you had on those two passages?

A Yes, I believe so.

Q Was there any discussion with Mr. Jordan about the portion of paragraph 8 saying that there was no sexual . . relationship?

A No.

Q At any time, did Mr. Jordan say that he didn't want to speak to you about the affidavit?

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A No.

Q How long was your conversation with Mr. Jordan? A I don't remember. Not long. We may have also talked about job stuff, too. But --

Q All right, then. Let's turn our attention to the next day, which is the 7th. That's the day when you finalized and signed the affidavit. Is that right?

A Yes.

Q And you notarized it under penalty of perjury. A Yes.

MR. EMMICK: I believe you have -- this is the final version and it is Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 4.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- 4 was marked for identification.) BY MR. EMMICK:

Q I'm placing that before you. A Okay. -_ Q And it says "Affidavit of Jane Doe No. 6" at the top and it has your signature, right?

A Mm- hmm.

Q When you spoke with Frank Carter that morning in -_ order to finalize the affidavit, do you remember what changes were made?

A When I spoke with him before I arrived at' his office or in his office?

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Q Either time. A I believe that I sort of dictated to him the changes -- 1 think that's possible or I gave them to him in person, I don't really remember. Mr. Carter had prepared three different versions of the affidavit for the significant portion related to this case, I guess, they were all denying sexual relations, all three of them. And we discussed various things about it and eventually decided on this affidavit.

Q All right. Let me ask you a straightforward question. Paragraph 8 at the start says, "1 have never had a sexual relationship with the President." Is that true?

A No.

Q All right. The next logical follow- up is, and maybe it's self- evident, but why were you willing to say something that was false under penalty of perjury?

A. I don't think that it's anybody's business.

Q Okay. Let me turn the page for you. At the end of paragraph 8, the statement, "The occasions that I saw the President after I left my employment at the White House in April 1996 were official receptions, formal functions or _. events related to the U. S. Department of Defense, where I was working at the time. There were other people present on those occasions. n That's not correct either, is it?

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Q Okay. In what respect? A For me, at the time, I said -- well, it doesn't say the only occasions, but it's misleading in that one reading it would assume that the only occasions on which I saw the President were those listed.

Q Right. A But I did some justifying in signing the affidavit, so --

Q Justifying -- does the word l'rationalizinglt apply as well?

A Rationalize, yes.

Q All right. All right. On the 7th, after you signed the affidavit, did you keep a copy of the affidavit?

A of wanted

Yes, I did. Where did you go later on the 7th? To New York. Did you take a copy of the affidavit with you? Yes. Why? If I remember correctly, I was in a rush and I kind to have it, if I wanted to look it over again or -- ._ Why were you going to New York? A job interview. Did you have a job interview? Yes, I did.

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Q Was that the next day? A Yes.

Q All right. Let's turn our attention to the job interview on the morning of the 8th. Now, was that with McAndrews & Forbes?

A Yes. This is my -- I had -- I mean, just to remind everyone, I had had some job interviews on the 18th of December up in New York at McAndrews & Forbes and Burson- Marsteller. I also took a test on the 30th, I think, of December at Burson- Marsteller and this is now another interview at McAndrews & Forbes on the 8th.

Q Do you remember who you interviewed with that morning?

A Jamie Dernan.

Q How did the interview go? A Very poorly.

Q Okay. Tell us why it went poorly. -What do you - mean?

A I think it started off on the wrong foot because I was in a waiting room downstairs and I had thought they would let me know when he was available and I'd go to his office . . and instead he just walked in unannounced and the interview started, so I was -- I didn't have my wits together at the moment. And I was -- I just was sort of flustered“ from that moment on. I think everyone can relate to having a bad

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207' interview. Maybe.

Q How long was the interview? A Maybe 20 minutes.

Q Was that the only interview that morning? A Yes.

Q What was your reaction afterwards? A I was upset. I felt horrible. I might have even cried. I was embarrassed. I thought that I had sort of embarrassed Mr. Jordan, I think, in such a bad interview.

Q After having a bad interview like that, did you expect an offer?

A No, I didn't think so. My first interview with McAndrews & Forbes had been really, really good, so I wasn't sure exactly what was going to happen, but I didn't think it was --

Q Not a good sign. A Correct.

Q What did you do after you had that bad interview? A At some point, I called Mr. Jordan to just let him know that it had gone poorly.

Q Do you remember whether you placed one call or . . several calls to try to get a hold of him?

A I'm sure I placed several. It was -- he's difficult to get a hold of.

Q Did you eventually talk to him on the 8th?

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208* A Yes, I did.

Q What did you tell him? A I told him that it hadn't worked out and that I was asking his advice on whether I should contact Burson- Marsteller or not and that I was concerned that the McAndrews & Forbes hadn't gone well.

Q At the time you were talking to him, were you still upset about the interview?

A I don't really remember. I'm sure I was. It was kind of a depressing thing all day.

Q And did he say what he was going to do because the interview had not gone well?

A Yes:

Q What did he say? A He said he'd call the chairman. I thought he was kidding.

Q Okay. And did he call you back some time shortly thereafter?

A Yes, he did.

Q About how long after he called -- excuse me. About how long after he said he was going to call the chairman did . .

he call you back? If you remember. A I don't remember. I don't think it was very long after, but --

Q What did he say when he called back?

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A That not to worry -- you know, I don't remember the exact words that he used. The gist of the conversation was that, you know, the were going to call me and everything was going to be okay.

Q Did he say that he had gotten a hold of the chairman or did he mention that at all or --

A I don't remember.

Q Did Revlon or McAndrews & Forbes personnel get a hold of you later after Mr. Jordan called?

A Yes. They called to set up an interview for me with someone directly at Revlon for the next day.

Q Do you remember about when it was that you were called later on. the 8th?

A I think it was some time early evening.

Q Early evening? A Or evening.

Q Were you surprised by the call? -- A From having heard from Mr. Jordan, not 100 percent.

Q All right. They set up an interview for the next day?

A Yes.

Q Did you have an interview the next day? A Yes.

Q Who did you interview with? A Ellen Seidman.

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6 A It was a very good interview.

7 Q Did you interview with others at Revlon as well?

8 9 Q Do you remember about how many interviews there

11 A Two others, aside from Ms. Seidman's.

12 Q And you mentioned that the interviews went well.

13 After the interviews, did you give a call to Vernon to let

14 him know how things were going?

15 A I think so.

16 Q Later that day, did you have another call from

17 Revlon?

18 A From Revlon?

19 Q Mm- hmm.

20 21

22 23 24 8 2 25

21c

Q And what was the tone of that interview? A It went very well. It was --

Q Better than with Jamie Dernan? A Yes.

Q All right. A Yes.

were?

A Yes, I did.

Q Tell us about that. . .

A They sort of informally offered me a position and I informally accepted it.

Q Do you remember who it was you were speaking with at the time?

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211 A I believe it was Ellen Seidman.

Q Okay. You made a reference earlier in this grand jury appearance to a conversation you had with Linda Tripp on the 9th.

A Yes.

Q We're now on the 9th and I can tell you would like to talk about this conversation. Tell us about your conversation with Linda Tripp on the 9th. Let's start with when it happened.

A Well, I was returning Linda's call from earlier in the week and I think I made a couple of attempts to get a hold of her at her office and when I did get in touch with her, I told her I was on a pay phone because I was concerned about the phones.

And I just -- I -- I didn't -- I was very distrustful of her at this point, especially when I first got on the phone with her. I didn't really know why we were going to be in touch at this point, from what had happened the few weeks before.

So she started out the conversation, I think, asking me, you know, what was going on with my job stuff and _. everything and I told her I didn't have a job yet and that I hadn't heard from Betty, the President, or Mr. Jordan since December and I didn't know what was going on and so we were discussing that. And that was not true, obviously.

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22 really vague on the truth about Kathleen Willey. You know,

she really didn't know anything, she didn't really remember - much, and that -- you know, led me to -- and I believe she may have even said directly that she wasn't going to tell about me or that I was -- you know, my understanding of that was that she wasn't even going to mention me and that I was . . safe. 23 Q Did this come as a surprise to you? 24 g S 25

212”

And then she told me that she had gone up to New York over Christmas to be with -- I think Norma Asness is her name, and that while she was in New York during the holidays she was shopping with Ms. Asness and this other woman on Madison Avenue buying shoes and that this woman had told Linda she was really savvy and Linda should move to New York and get a PR job in New York. Which I thought was a little strange, since I was in the process of moving to New York for a PR job.

That was just one of the indications that made me think she was a little bit jealous of the help I was getting, that I was talking about earlier.

So when we started to discuss the case, she told me that -- that because of this experience she had had in New York, she decided that maybe it would be best for her to be

A Yes, it did.

Q In what way?

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A Because she had -- I mean, she had stopped returning my phone calls, we had left everything in a very lad note a few weeks prior to that. So --

In the course of this conversation, when we talked about my job, she said, "Well, Monica -- )t Oh. Oh. She isked me what I was going to do in the case and I told her :hat I was planning on signing an affidavit. Even though I lad already signed the affidavit, I didn't want Linda to :hink that I would have gone ahead and done such a bold thing without her approval.

So she made -- that's when, as I mentioned earlier, ;he made me promise her that I wouldn't sign the affidavit until I got the job. She also went into this whole long story about her friend --

Am I getting into too much detail? MR. EMMICK: Close. JURORS: No. No. __ - MR. EMMICK: Okay. THE WITNESS: Okay. All right. She told me about ler -- this friend, I don't remember her name, but she's :his -- she's an Indian woman who Linda goes to the gym ._ vith and that this Indian woman had gone to a psychic and :he psychic had essentially said that one of her friends was in imminent danger having to do with the words she would speak.

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214, So that that led Linda to believe, you know, along with this event in New York that she should -- you know, she's kind of going to go the good route -- well, what I considered the good route in the Paula Jones case. And it was really based on this conversation that I had with her and this sort of change that I agreed to meet with Linda on the 13th of January.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Then let's go to the 13th of January. Let me first cover some of the job- related items. On the 13th, did you get a formal offer from Revlon?

A Yes, I did.

Q And did you accept that offer? A Yes, I did.

Q How was the matter left about references or recommendations?

A Well, she -- 1 can't remember her name, something with a J, I think. The woman in human resources with whom I was dealing about the job offer said, you know, I needed to send her some references, so this had been in -- oh. so I called Betty to ask her to remind the President or to check . . out for me what Mr. Hilley would say to -- I'm not saying this clearly. I'm sorry.

Q That's all right. A One of the people that I needed to get a reference

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from was John Hilley, who was the head of Legislative Affairs and had been my boss when I was there the latter half of my tenure at the White House. I was concerned that if I put him down as a reference, he might not say flattering things about me.

So I asked -- 1 had mentioned this to the President on October 11th and he said he'd, you know, make sure everything was okay, so I wanted to -- so I checked with Betty to ask her to kind of find out what was happening, what the status of that was. So --

Q Did you get a message later from Betty on that subject?

A Yes, I did.

Q Okay. What was that message? A She had me page her and then later I came to find out from her that afternoon that it had been -- I think Mr. Podesta took care of it and that everything would be fine with Mr. Hilley.

Q Now, when the two of you were paging each other on this day, the name Kay was used rather than either Betty or Monica. Where did that name come from? . .

A This has sort of become a kind of strange area for me. I had not -- and I do not specifically remember discussing with Betty the fact that I had been subpoenaed in the Paula Jones case and anything surrounding that, but sort

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216a of I now know from -- from sort of things that I've been reminded of or shown that I must have. And one of them that indicates that to me is this notion that she -- I -- she and I had started -- 1 suggested that we use sort of the code name Kay in her paging me and in me paging her. And --

Q And where does the name Kay come from? A Because Betty and I, our first encounter and our first connection was through Walter Kaye.

Q Now, had you and Betty had earlier conversations about the fact that her message indicator, I guess it would be her beeper or her pager?

A Her pager.

Q Her pager. A Her text message pager.

Q Her text message pager on some occasion might have indicated Monica?

A Yes. There had been -- 1 think there had been at - least one time when Betty's pager had been sitting on her desk when she was in with the President or had stepped away and someone else had picked up her pager when it went off and there was a message from me. _.

And so from -- you know, Betty kind of covered it, I think, by saying -- or she did actually have another friend named Monica or something or another, but it was -L you know -- Rebecca Cameron was the person who picked up the

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217 pager and so it was sort of a -- not a good thing to happen.

Q Why use any fake names, Kay or any other name? What's the reason you've got to use fake names at this time?

A I was beyond paranoid. I mean, I -- and obviously in denial. I think the -- 1 could not understand how I had been dragged into the Paula Jones case and so I was very wary of everything.

Q What did Betty say, if you can remember, when you suggested that you refer to one another as Kay?

others? A

Linda? A

refer to A paged me

Okay. Okay. Did she ask why or -- 1 don't remember having this conversation with her. All right. Were you also using names to refer to For example, the name Mary? Yes. Who did Mary refer to? Linda. _ _

And why were you using the name Mary to refer to Because that's what she chose. And why were you using any name other than Linda to . _

Linda? Because Linda and Betty were the two people who that were involved -- you know, somehow i& l1 into

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2 ;Ea clear. I'm sorry. Okay.

Q When you were speaking with Linda about the President, did you sometimes refer to the President as "her" rather than "himtV?

A Linda? No. I don't believe so. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q So that was Betty? A Yes.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Okay. And why did you use "her" to refer to the President?

A I believe that that was only in pages to her and it was just -- you know, I knew that the WAVES -- from having worked at the White House, I knew that people had access to the WAVES pages, let alone that someone types them, so it just was another measure of caution that I used throughout.

Q All right. A I don't think I ever referred to the President on Betty's pages.

Q When we were talking earlier about your clarifying . . whether John Hilley would give you a recommendation, you indicated that you had a page from Betty. Does it refresh your recollection about what the page said if I were to read the following?

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8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I also met with Mr. Jordan.

219 We have a page indicating that it says, "Will know something soon, Kay." Does that remind you about any pages that you got from Betty?

A Yes, I think I mentioned earlier that she paged me and then I talked to her later that day and found out about John Hilley.

Q All right. Did you -- at some point, did you send to Revlon a letter giving them the two recommendations, one of which was John Hilley?

A Yes.

Q Do you remember when that was? A I believe I faxed it on the 14th

Q So that would be the next day. A Correct.

BY MR. WISENBERG: of January.

Q Pardon me. Were they recommendations or references? Just as a technical matter, in other words, were they names or were they actual letters of recommendation?

A Oh. They were references, then. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q All right. Let's go back to the 13th for just a moment because you met with Linda Tripp that day, I think you said, on the 9th you had --

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220 Q Okay. All right. Okay. Well, let's go back to Mr. Jordan, then.

A Well, I -- I mean, I was just thinking about the day. I'm sorry.

Q No, that's fine. That's fine. A Just I stopped in to see him for five minutes, to thank him for getting me the job, and I gave him a tie and a pocket square.

MR. EMMICK: Okay. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Did you ever provide Mr. Jordan with a signed copy of the affidavit?

A I did not provide him with a copy. No.

Q Do you know whether or not he ever received a copy? A I believe I showed him a copy. I don't know that he received a copy.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q On this same meeting on the 13th? A I __ I -- you know, I have to say I know I brought the copy with me to show him and I may have said, you know, "Do you want to see it?" And I think he may have not even -- _ .

I think he may have said, you know, IrI don't need to see it." Or -- I --

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

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him or even showing it to him specifically. A No.

Q But you brought it for him to -- A I did bring it.

MS. IMMERGUT: Correct. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q All right. So that's the Vernon Jordan part of the 13th.

A Right.

Q What about the meeting with Linda Tripp? A It was long. I was -- 1 was very nervous. I was wary of her. I actually thought she might have a tape recorder with her and had looked in her bag when she had gone up to the restroom. I told her a whole bunch of lies that day.

Q What were you trying to accomplish in meeting with her? -_

A I was trying to -- 1 was trying to make Linda continue to feel comfortable that she and I were sort of on the -- that we were on the same side, we were on the right side. . .

We -- and that -- when I had agreed to meet with her, I thought we were going to go over kind of her strategy for what she was going to do in the case and then once we got together, she kind of started wavering about what she wanted

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to do and then -- so I just was using everything I knew to try to convince her that -- that this is the right thing to do.

Q I think you mentioned earlier that you told her lies.

A Yes.

Q What lies do you have in mind? A I mean, I think -- throughout that month of December, after I knew she was subpoenaed, there were various things that I think I said that were untrue, but I specifically remember from this meeting the thing that I had -- what I said to Linda was, "Oh, you know, I told -- I told Mr. Jordan that I wasn't going to sign the affidavit until I got the job." Obviously, which wasn't true.

I told her I didn't yet have a job. That wasn't true. I told her I hadn't signed the affidavit. That wasn't true. I told her that some time over the holidays I had freaked out and my mom took me to Georgetown Hospital and they put me on Paxil. That wasn't true.

I think I told her that -- you know, at various times the President and Mr. Jordan had told me I had to lie. . . That wasn't true. That's just a small example. Probably some more things about my mom. Linda had an obsession with my mom, so she was a good leverage.

Q Let's turn our attention back to the 14th, then.

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On the 14th, the next day? A Okay.

Q Right. A Okay.

Q There's three pieces of paper that have come to be referred to as the talking points.

A Yes. MR. EMMICK: I think we have them marked as Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 5.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- 5 was marked for identification.) BY MR. EMMICK:

Q 1'11 place them in front of you. A Okay.

Q And they are three pages. I wonder if you would tell us how those came to be written and on what computer and the like.. __

A Okay. First of all, they're out of order.

Q Okay. A So the last page was actually the first page.

Q All right. Well, let's clarify. What is now the __ first page says 18Points to make in affidavit." And the second page says, "The first few paragraphs" at the top. And the third page says, "You're not sure you've been clear." The third page should be the first page?

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944 - _ -

A Yes.

Q All right. these got generated.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Were those A Yes.

224 Let's go to first the mechanics of how

printed from your printer?

Q Were they typed on your computer? A Yes.

Q Was anyone present with you when they were typed? A No.

Q When were they typed? A On the 14th.

Q Did you talk with anyone in an effort to get assistance editing or writing or getting approval for what is in the talking points?

A No.

Q How did the -- where did you get the- ideas that are reflected in the talking points?

A They were based on conversations I've had with Linda from the moment Kathleen Willey and Michael Isikoff ever entered into the picture until the conversations I had . . with her the morning of the 14th on the phone.

Q Tell me what you mean by that. A At various times, especially early on, around March

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225

talked about how -- you know, that -- that -- what Kathleen

was saying to Michael Isikoff was not true. And so, you know, we had had -- 1 remember having this discussion with her where we were saying, well, if -- you know, if she's lying to Michael Isikoff, how do you know she didn't lie to you?

Linda said, "Yeah, that's a good point. Maybe she did." You know?

And I said, "Yeah, sure. She could have, you know, smeared her own lipstick and untucked her own b1ouse. l'

And Linda said, "Yeah, it's true. l' That was very early on and throughout my discussions with Linda, especially when she was saying -- saying things about how to be vague on the Kathleen Willey issue in the Paula Jones case, discussions.

you relay A

copy? A attorney,

What did you do with the talking points? How did them to Linda Tripp?

we had these sorts of I took a copy of them to her. And how were the arrangements made to give her that

. .

She had told me she was going to go see her Kirby, that afternoon and was going to talk to him about signing an affidavit, which is why this was all

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could just talk on the way because we -- we had had some time to talk that morning, but not as much as I wanted.

Q Who was driving? A Yes.

Q And Linda has the You were driving?

talking points in her hands? A I handed them to her in the parking lot of the Pentagon.

Q Did she read them? A Yes, she did.

Q What was she saying or doing as she was reading them?

A She was going through it and she was sort of reading and going, "Yeah. Mm- hmm. Uh- huh. Well, that's true. Oh, good point."

I think she may have said, "Oh, these are -- this is really -- that's true." You know. "Did you write this?" Sort of a thing. -_

Q Okay. What did you think would happen after you dropped the talking points off to Linda and then you Linda off? How were things left, I guess is another ask that question. ._

A I believe that it was in the car ride home said -- made some comment to me about -- that, well,

dropped way to

that she she -- she feels okay -- and this might have been on the 13th when

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telling the truth or being vague on the truth when she talks to me, but then when she doesn't talk to me, she -- her mind starts to wander to different things, so I just remember feeling -- oh, like I had to hold her hand through everything and I constantly had to talk to her. So I may have said, "I'll call you tonight" or something like that.

Q Have you ever talked to Bruce Lindsey? A No. I may have said hello to him in the hall, but I __ but -- just in passing.

Q Did you ever talk with the President about the talking points?

A No.

Q Did you ever talk with anyone at Bob Bennett's firm about the talking points?

A No.

Q Did you ever talk with anyone associated with the White House in any way about the talking points? -

A No. And that would include Mr. Jordan.

Q Okay. Let's turn our attention, then, to the next day, which is January 15th. Did Betty call you that day about a call she had received from Mike Isikoff? _.

A Yes.

Q Okay. Tell us about that telephone call. A I had learned earlier from my attorney that the Paula Jones people had -- had -- well, I guess my attorney

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had asked me something about if I had ever received any courier packages from the White House and I hadn't, but I told him I did -- I did well, he had heard -- I Bennett's people -- Mr.

send things to Betty and he said, oh, think through -- maybe through Bennett's firm, the attorneys, I'm

sorry, I don't mean to be so informal, that there was some issue with these courier -- with a courier service.

So I called the courier service and was able to find out that the records could be subpoenaed and then I spoke with Betty later that day and she told me that -- that Michael Isikoff had called her or had called for her intern and Betty had answered the phone and in the course of that he had asked her about the courier, my sending things to her through a courier.

And that she sort of said she didn't really remember or know what he was talking about and that he'd get back to her. Or she'd get back to him. I'm sorry.

Q And then she called you and related this to you? A Yes. Yes.

Q What was your reaction to that? A I was very shocked and very -- feeling very strange, that somehow this was closing in more and I -- I didn't know how they could have gotten this information about the courier because there was -- the first person that I thought of that knew about the courier was Linda and the only

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Ither person I thought of was this gentleman in my office who 'as a Clinton hater, Mark Huffman. So I thought that laybe -- 1 thought, well, maybe he had been the one who had #art of turned me, trying to cause trouble.

Q All right. What did you and Betty talk about doing n response to the Isikoff calls?

A The President was out of town that day and so I hink she said she was going to try to get in touch with the 'resident and I believe that Betty and I may have discussed hat, you know, they were -- the courier packages were always ent to her and that some of the things were for her, you now.

Q Did Vernon Jordan come up? A Yes. I know later -- and I don't know if maybe she .entioned to me earlier in the day that she wanted to try to et in touch with Mr. Jordan, but I do know that -- that ater in the evening Betty called me and asked me if I could - ive her a ride to Mr. Jordan's office because Bob, her usband, had the car that day and it was raining. So --

Q So you drove her to Vernon Jordan's. A Yes.

Q Describe what happened when you drop her off. A Well, actually, I parked the car and I decided to ait for her downstairs in the restaurant. I think it's The ront Page. And she went up to Mr. Jordan's office and was

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there maybe 15, 20 minutes. I'm not very good with time. Q Why didn't she just take a taxi there? It's a three, four dollar taxi ride up there.

A I don't know.

Q Okay. How long did you wait? THE WITNESS: You know, I need to use the restroom. MR. EMMICK: Okay. THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. MR. EMMICK: The witness needs a break. THE FOREPERSON: Yes.

MR. EMMICK: Okay. Thank you. THE WITNESS: Two minutes.

MR. EMMICK: That's all right. (Witness excused. Witness recalled.)

MR. WISENBERG: Let the record reflect the witness has reentered the grand jury room.

Madam Foreperson, do we have a quorum? THE FOREPERSON: Yes. MR. WISENBERG: Any unauthorized persons present? THE FOREPERSON: None.

MR. WISENBERG: Anything you want to say? _ THE FOREPERSON: Monica Lewinsky, I just wanted to let you know that you are still under oath.

THE WITNESS: Really? THE FOREPERSON: Mm- hmm. Yes, I mean.

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BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q I have, I hope, just one or two questions about your proffer.

A Okay.

Q Your written proffer. Can you grab a hold of that? A Sure.

Q And what are we calling that? That is ML- l. A Okay.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- l was marked for identification.) BY MR. WISENBERG:

Q If you'll take a look at page 4, paragraph 4, that has to do with the President's call to you.

A Yes?

Q At two a. m. on the 17th of December telling you, among other things, that you're on the witness list, correct?

A Correct. -_ Q Going to the middle portion, starting with "When asked." "When asked what to do if she was subpoenaed, the President suggested she could sign an affidavit and try to satisfy their inquiry and not be deposed. 11 . .

A Mm- hmm.

Q The next sentence says, "In general, Ms. L. should -_ say she visited the White House to see Ms. Currie and, on

occasion, when working at the White House, she brought him

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tell the whole story of what you were doing when you visited the President.

A Yes.

16 Q Take a look at -- then I would like you to take a

17 18 19

22 A Right. 23 24 8' h 25

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letters when no one else was around." Have I read that correctly? Have I read that sentence correctly?

A Yes.

Q Okay. And I think you have earlier described that as a -- maybe not in these exact words, but you saw it as a continuation on his part of the pre- established pattern of things he had said in the past. Is that correct?

A Yes.

Q All right. And would you agree with me that that is -- that if you said that to the Jones people or to anybody else that that is misleading in a sense because it doesn't

look at page 10, I think it's page 10, it's paragraph 10, - whatever page it is.

A Okay.

Q Mine's cut off. It's the last -- I think it's the last page.

Q I'll read it. "MS. L. had a physically intimate relationship with the President. Neither the President nor Mr. Jordan or anyone on their behalf asked or encouraged

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Ms. L. to lie." I would like you for us to reconcile if you can that statement in your proffer with statements like the ones in paragraph 4 where you talk about specific things the President said or did that were kind of continuations of this pattern.

A Sure. Gosh. I think to me that if -- if the President had not said the Betty and letters cover, let's just say, if we refer to that, which I'm talking about in paragraph 4, page 4, I would have known to use that.

So to me, encouraging or asking me to lie would have -- you know, if the President had said, "NOW, listen. You better not say anything about this relationship, you better not tell them the truth, you better not -- II

For me, the best way to explain how I feel what happened was, you know, no one asked or encouraged me to lie, but no one discouraged me either.

Q Okay. So you said what you would have done if the - President hadn't said that, but he did say that, what you mentioned in paragraph 4, correct?

A Right.

Q And I guess -- and you had a conversation with him . . about what to do gifts that you both knew were under subpoena, then you get the call from Betty. Those things happened. When we discussed this on Monday in the'proffer session, I think you said something to the effect of or that

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234 in paragraph 10 you were being pretty literal. Is that accurate? When you say that no one encouraged you -- told you or encouraged you to lie?

A Yes and no. I mean, I think I also said that Monday that it wasn't as if the President called me and said, llYou know, Monica, you're on the witness list, this is going to be really hard for us, we're going to have to tell the truth and be humiliated in front of the entire world about what we've done," which I would have fought him on probably. That was different.

And by him not calling me and saying that, you know, I knew what that meant. so I -- I don't see any -- I don't see any disconnect between paragraph 10 and paragraph 4 on the page. Does that answer your question?

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Did you understand all along that he would deny the relationship also?

A Mm- hmm. Yes.

Q And when you say you understood what it meant when he didn't say, "Oh, you know, you must tell the truth," what did you understand that to mean? . .

A That -- that -- as we had on every other occasion and every other instance of this relationship, we would deny it.

MR. WISENBERG: That's all I have on that. And

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235 probably not anything else. Maybe.

Ms. IMMERGUT: I had a couple of quick questions. THE WITNESS: Sure. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Back for just a moment to January 15th with the

visit when you took Betty to Vernon Jordan after she had been called by Michael Isikoff.

A Mm- hmm.

Q Did you ever tell Ms. Currie that you had been called by Michael Isikoff?

A No.

Q Had you ever been called by Michael Isikoff before January 15th?

A No. I'm trying to remember now -- I know that I had seen the Newsweek thing light up on my caller ID, but I don't remember if that was around that time or if that was later, once the scandal started. -.

Q Do you recall any calls from Michael Xsikoff that you would have told Betty about, calling about gifts from the President?

A No. Absolutely not.

Q You mentioned, obviously, that you've given the President several gifts. Have you given him any ties?

A Yes.

Q How many ties have you given him, just

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approximately? A Six.

236

Q Have you had any conversations with the President about wearing your ties?

A Almost all of our conversations included something about my ties.

Q Could you just briefly describe what things that you've said to him and he to you about wearing the ties?

A I used to bug him about wearing one of my ties because then I knew I was close to his heart.

Q And did he ever say anything about -- after he had one of your ties or to alert you when he had worn any of your ties?

A Yes, there were several occasions.

Q And what kind of thing would he say to you? A '@ Did you see I wore your tie the other day?"

Q So was he aware based on things you-- had told him - that you would be looking out for when he would wear ties on various occasions?

A Yes. MS. IMMERGUT: I'd like to show you now what's . . marked as Grand Jury Exhibits ML- 8, 9 and 10.

(Grand Jury Exhibits No. ML- 8, ML- 9 and ML- 10 were marked for identification.)

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MS. IMMERGUT: And, unfortunately, I don't have copies yet for the grand jury because we got them at the last --

MR. WISENBERG: 1'11 pass them around afterwards. MS. IMMBRGUT: Okay. And I'll spread them out for you here.

THE WITNESS: Okay. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Directing your attention first to ML- 8, it's a photograph of the President, obviously. Do you recognize the tie that he's wearing in that photograph?

A Yes, I do.

Q Had you actually seen that on television on June 24, 1998?

A Yes, I did.

Q Do you recall what that's in relation to or what event is being depicted on that photograph? _-

A He was leaving for China.

Q And now directing your attention to Exhibit 9, do you know what that's a photograph of?

A I don't know where it's from, but it's the . . President wearing my tie.

Q And this one states it's Monday, July 6, 1998. Do you remember watching any of the media on that date?

A Yes, I do.

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8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 July 4th of '97. And then when he wore it a few days later,

Q And do you remember seeing that date?

A Yes, I do.

Q Do you remember what event date that he was wearing your tie?

A I don't, but I just saw it so --

238 him wearing your tie on

was taking place on that says "Medicare costsI1'

Q Okay. And then finally, ML- lo. Do you recognize what that's a photograph of?

A Yes.

Q And what is that? A The President wearing the same tie.

Q And do you know what date that is? A Date? It was a few days after, he wore the tie when he came back from China, so it's July 9th.

Q Okay. And what -- I guess -- did you reach any conclusions from the fact that he was wearing- your tie on those days?

A I -- I -- I think -- the first time he wore the tie, I thought maybe it was a coincidence, but I didn't really think so. from China on the July 4th, because

And then when he wore it when he came back 0. 6th, I thought maybe it was a reminder of that had been the first workday after

. . July 4th and we had had a really intense, emotional meeting

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1 I thought he's trying to say something. I mean, the 2 President doesn't wear the same tie twice in one week, so -- 3

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16 17 18 19 A I think it was on Nel's maybe third appearance or 20 his last appearance. He was wearing the first tie that I

22 23 tie to Mr. Nelvis? 24 P 25

239

1 didn't reminder

correct? A

know what it meant, but it was some sort of a to me. MS. IMMERGUT: Okay. Nothing further on that. BY MR. WISENBERG: This is well after

Yes. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

the scandal broke, is that This is this summer, right? Correct. BY MR. WISENBERG: You've told us something about seeing a picture of Nelvis, Bayani Nelvis, I think coming to the grand jury.

A Yes.

Q Can you tell us -- and you noticed something about some neckwear he was wearing?

ever gave to the President. . .

Q Did you know that the President had ever given that

A No.

Q And what is -- can you recall the last time the

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240 President had ever worn that tie?

A No. I didn't see him every day, so -- I mean, I know he -- I know some of the times he wore that tie, but I don't know the last time he wore the tie.

Q Okay. Is there any question in your mind that the President knew that both these ties, the one that we're putting around pictures of and the one that Nel wore to the grand jury, were ties you had given him?

A Not in my mind, but I can't -- I can't answer that. MR. WISENBERG: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: There's a question? Yes? A JUROR: Did you know the President after a while gave his ties to the people who worked for him? Did you know that?

THE WITNESS: Yes, I did know that. MR. WISENBERG: Pardon me just a minute. (Pause.)

MR. WISENBERG: I'm going to ask the witness to be excused very briefly and we'll possibly call you back in a couple of minutes.

(The witness was excused.) .

(Whereupon, at 4: 45 p. m., the taking of testimony in the presence of a full quorum of the Grand Jury was

concluded.)

*****

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CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER I, Amy K. Rose, the reporter for the United States Attorney's Office, do hereby certify that the witness whose testimony appears in the foregoing pages was first duly sworn by the foreperson or the deputy foreperson of the grand jury when there was a full quorum of the grand jury present; that the testimony of said witness was taken by me and, thereafter, reduced to typewritten form; and that the transcript is a true record of the testimony given by said witness.

Official Reporter

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THE FOLLOWING IS A COMPRESSED VERSION OF THE PRECEDING

DOCUMENT

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Thursday. August 6. 1998

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Page3, PROCEEDINGS -Poe*

MONICA S. LEWXNSKY araseallcd’ssawitacssami, aftmhavingbamfirstduly mvanbytheForqmon of the Grand Jury, was examined and taificd as follows:

A Q

EX& MTNATiON ,

BY MR. EMMJCK: Goodmorning. Goodmoming. Ms_ L4zwir+, thisisthegmndjuryappeamnee thatyou’llbemakingoratlcasttkfvstoftkgraudjmy ~iftbzwillbcanymom. Wbatweroutinelydo withwitnemsbeforetbegrandjuryisthatwcbeginthe aPpmmecbydisewhgyourri& tsandyourobligatioosanc OD that’s what nrc’ll do light now.

A Okay. Q WhatI’dlikctosayfrrstistbatyouhaveaFifth -t right. That Fifth Amaxheotrightistherightto rcfusto answcranyqoestionsthatmaytaAdtoin~ y=- Doyou -thatright?

A k, I.&. Q Now, ordimily, youyoUdrefktomswer qwtionstllatwouldtaxitoinaiminateyou. As Imhtandifhereyouhaveentacdintoanaggt

2 3 4

5 6 7 8 9 0 ,I ,2 .3 ‘4

5 6 7 88 19 !O !I !2 !3

!4 !5

Pas4 wili2tkjJovanmah ttbatprcwidcsyouwithimrnullity. in achangcforwIliehyoowillbecoopcraIingwithtbe &wuMmt. Is that right?

A Coma. MR. EMMIcJc: whtIwoukIlikctodoissbowyaua copyofwhathasbamrnarkcdasExbibitML- 2.

(Grand Jury Exhiiit No. ML- 2 was m8rkal for idmtifii.) BY MR. EMhUCK: DOyOUncagniZZthiS? Yes. I do. ontbclhifd~ ofIllatdoc- S~ ia

s@ mtelinelhBtsaysMonicaLcwinsky. kthatyotK OiplUtC?

A Yer. it is. Q Allright. Youakohcari& tmcamscl. wlmttbatmraasistbataltboughyolP~ cannattlciu lkcgnndjtuyroanhtitbyou, your~ canbc omsi& tkgrdjtuynxunanclwailabktomsvm *mu qtmionsyoumighthavc. DoyoutllKkmdtbntrigbt?

A Ycs. I&. Q Doyoubwcanauomcy? A Ycs. Ido. Q Wlmwuuldthatbc? ASWtd.

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966 In Re: G& d-& w Procadinm MUlti- PagCm Thursday, August 6.1998 s

pagc9 1 A In November of 1995.

2 Q Wkndidyouhtnotiatkhrsidmtoftk 3 Lhitedstatcs?

4 A tifvst aCoun_, I guess non- verbal alcountc?, 5 was Augrrd 9,199s. 6 Q Andcddyoudcsc. ribcwhatthataccmtcrwas? 7 A Yes. Itwasa& pattux axmonyontksouthLawn 8 and, askwasgoingbymtkmpelincshakingha& we 9 ma& eyecoatactanditwasmofeintaxeyecontacttlmn 0 Ihad~ bcfaewithhim. 1 Q Okay. Anddidyouhaveanyfurthersuchcuntxf 2 sortoflater, afterthatinitialtime? 3 A Yes. ‘Ibencxtdfiythehcsi~ t- Iguesstbt 4 staffhadabirthdaypartyforthePresidentontkSou& 5 IBvn# mdtheintcmsaaiIlvitedtothatlaterintkday. 6 Andatthatparty, tlnewassoxtofamoreinteas 7 tlirtationthatwrntonatadistamx. a Q Okay. Didyouf& lthatkwaslXrtingwithyuu 9 aswell? Orhowwouldyoudesaikthebehaviortktyou

0 bothexhibited? 1 A Itwasintcnsceyeumtactaadwhenkwentbythe 2 ropelinetoshakehandsitwas- Imcan, k- k’sa 3 charismaticpcrsooandso- justwhenkshookmyhand

4 and-- tkrewasanintawewnmxtim. 5 Q Okay. And could you sort of just summar& the

Page IO

1 early rrlationsbip that you had with tbt Rsi& nt bcfo= any 2 first sexual contact? 3 A Itbinkirwasintaucfkting. 4 Q Okay. Did you bavc convaxations with him? 5 A BricfconvusatiocstbatItbinkinpassing- if 6 Isawhimor- ara@ uttuc caunony, “Have a nice trip.”

7 I introduced myscIf at one point. 8 Q Okay. Andbowdidyoumaoagctorunintohimor 9 cvalsasbim? wastbata commonoccwKnccorbowwalkltbat 0 btaccomplisbed? 1 A BcfolE: tbct&& n& ipbqan, itwasmainlyat 2dcparturtceremmks ItbinktbacmFcafcw. andtknon 3 oncoccasionmybatfricndwasinrown~ shcwas~ a

4 touroftkWcstWingandIwaswsitingforkrintk 5 basananlobbyandmtbimtbatway. Thatwuvscvcral 6 otbcrpa$ ctbcrc. 7 Q Okay. Was tke mr a time that your relationship 8 boxunc mono of a romantic and sexual relationship? 9 A Yes. :0 Q findwkndidtimtoccur? :1 A On Novank IS, 1995. :2 Q Okay. And altbcqb as I’n told you. I’m not 3 goingtopintoabtofspccif~ dptg. thisisoTy 14 tbatIwantalyoutocxplainsottofbowitcamcabout. 15 A Itwasduritqthcfurlough. lwasupin

Page 11

1 Mr. Panttta’s West Wing off& answenng phones. TX 2 Resident came down several tunes dunng the day. 3 ‘Ihcrc was tk continued flirtation and around 4 8: oOinthtNcningorsoIwasinthehallwaygoingto~ 5 Ftstnmm, passing Mr. Stepknopoulos’ offtce, and k US In 6 tk hall aud invited me into Mr. Stcpknopoulos’ offs and 7 tknfromtkreinvitimebackintohisstudy. 8 Q Okay. AndwhathappcDcdthue?

9 A We talkd briefly and sort of acknowledged thz 0 thcrehadbaenachemistrythatwasthetrhefonzandtiz 1 wewexebothamac& dtoeachotherandtknkask& m: if 2 kcouldkissme. 3 Q AndwUdidyousay? 4 A Yes 5 Q Anddidyoukissonthatoccash? 6 A Yes. 7 Q Andwbueinthe- youmentionedyouwcnthxkto 8 thestudyanx. 9 AMm- hUXL

0 Q W- rrccxactlydidtkkissoccw? 1 A Rightoutsidehisbakoom, inthehallway,

2 insickz- adjaoznttothestudy, totheofftce. 3 Q Okay. Andhowdidyouendtkt- wasthere 4 anythingmorrthanammantickissonthatsortoffim 5 encQl. mtd!

page I2 1 A No. 2 Q Okay. Did you have any later axountcr with him on 3 thatsamedare? 4 A Yes, Idid. 5 Q Okay. Caldyoudcsuikkwthataxmcd?

6 A ThthsidattcamedowntoA4r. F’anuta’soff~ 7 Ithinkitmighthaveb& narotmd10pm, andtoldmcthat 8 ifIwantedtomeethimbackiuMr. stcphaaopoulos’officeit 9 fiveminutcs, thatthatwouldkfmc. AndIagxcd And 0 Imethimbacktbere. Wewentbacktohisofficcagaisin 1 tkbackstaxiyanz 2 Q Okay. Andwbathappazdintbcbrrckstudy~? 3 A WetahdandwcwrrcmorcpbysicaUyintimatc. 4 Q Okay. Andonthatoccasion, didyouperfotmaal 5 se. xonthePresideM? 6 A Yes. 7 Q With respect to physi@ intimacy, other than aal 8 sex, wasthcrcotkrphysicalintimacyperformed? 9 A Yes. Evetyth& up until oral 9cx. 0 MS. MIMERGUT: Okay. And just for the grand jury 1 purposes, IkvemarkcdasancxhibitML- 6andI’lljustread 2 it the grand jury and phx it kforc you. 3 (Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML.- 6 was 4 marked for idaMt& tion.)

1 MS. IMMERGUT: It states “Deftiti~ of scxpal /

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I RcIations. Forthepurposcsoftbisgrandjuryscssion, a

2 person engages in ‘.% xual t& tions’ wlm the person

3 knowingly engages or causes contact with tk gatitalia, anus,

4 groin, breast, itmerthigh, orbuttoclcsofmypcmnwithan

5 in~ tto~~ or~ fyth: stxualdtsirtofanypasoa.

6 contact means intentional touching¶ citkr directly or

I through clothing.”

8 BY MS. IMIvlERGUTz

9 Q Ms. Lcwinsky, doYou undermud tbat ddiition?

1 0 A Ycs, I&.

I 1 MS.~ G~ ~I~~~~ i~~~ out~

1 2 the grand jury.

1 3 BY MS. IMMERGUT:

I 4 Q wbn you described that you had otkr physid

1 5 intimacy during your contact with tbe Pmsidmt cm Novembcl

1 6 IS, 1995, did that include sexual relations within tkt

1 7 definition that I’ve just mad to you?

1 8 A Yes, itdoes. 1 9 Q hthat- a+ n, tbtsecondcontactwithhimm

2 0 November 15,1995, wlme exactly did the sexual contact that 2 1 you’ve described occur?

2 2 A ~~~~~ y,~~~~,~~ 2 3 also in his back Offlcc.

2 4 Q Okay. And the back office. would that be the study

2 ‘5 area?

Pa& IL

A Yes. Q Okay. Did you have any furtba sexual ~lccnmfcrs

witbhimaftcrtllatfmttimconthc15th? A Yes. Q Whcnwastbencxt~? A ~~ 17~ ofNo~~. Q And could you explain bow that congct occur&? A Wcwaeagainw& inghebaxuscitwasdming tht furiougb and Jamifcr Palmiai and I. who wns Mr. 1 Pafma’s arsistant. bed ordmd pizza along with Ms. Curric

1 and Ms. Hem& h.

1 AndwbaltbepizzaCximGIwaltdowltok

1 tbemknowthatthcpizfawastbaeloditasattbn~ point

1 wbal1w8lkCdintoMs. cuKi& offrcethattE*:~ t

I ~! B8ndhgttlaewitb! 4omcorhxpaJplc~

I Sm.

1 AndtbqaUcamcbackdomtotbcoffiasad

1 Mr.- IthinkitwasMr. Toiv. som& odyaccidCntlyknocked

1 pizzaarmyj6& t. soIwcnttogouscthc~ towash

2 itoff~ darI~ comingautofthcrstroaPfh: Rcsidmt

i ~S~~~~. C~ S~ Y~~~~~~

; out this way.”

i sowemntbackintohisbnckstudy~ wxwdiy.

; Itlli& intkbatbnmmorintbcbalhqrigfit~ thc

; 1

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Page 15 1 Q Okay. And& t thatpoint, what sortofintimacywa~ !

it? I

A I believe it was just kissing at that point. Q Okay, Andhowdidtbatcncmntcrcnd? A IsaidIneedcdtobackandhesaid,“ Well, why

~‘ ty~ b~~~ p~~ ~I~~ if~ w~~( vcgctabk or meat.

Q Okay. And, actuaIly, wbcredidthekissingoccur thattime?

A Itwas- IIitwasintbehathmomoritwas ~t~~~~~~~~~ y~ j~ t~~ hathmom.

Q Okay. Sodidyougobaclcandgcthimsomepim? A Yes, Idid.

BY MR. WISENBERG: Q Pardon me. !kmytointmipt. ‘I- h& the bathmmnadjacmttoththaIlwaytktkadsfromtk& al ofTioctotkdiningrooan. Istbatcomct?

9 A-

0 hm. WISENBERG: Sony for immupring.

1 BY hEL IMMERm:

2 Q Didyougobadtsndgetpizza? 3 A Yes, Idid 4 Q AnddidyoucvcrrcturntothcPresidentwiththe 5 pizza?

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Q CouIdyoudesaihcwhatlmppcncdwbmyoun% urncd? A Yes. I wmt back to Ms. Cunic’s off& and told herthePmideathada!& edxEtobringhim! mmcpizza.

sheopcncdthedoor8ndmid% ir, thegirl’s herewiththepizza.” Hetoldmetocmtxin. Ms. Cmie wentbaclciatohcroffi8ndtbulwcVmtintothcback !mdyamagain.

Q Okay. Andwhathqpcaxdintkbackstudyan=?

A weminthe- WC& WtaikdandthmWCwat physically intimate again_

Q okay. Aadwasthem~& xpafonnedmttrat OCCWiOn?

A Yes. Q okay. Andthatwouldbcyoupc? rfarm&~& xm hilt!?

A Mm- hnrm Q Okay. Ax& again-- 8ndIhavetosmtof~ you, you can’t llLIswcT q& u__” _

A 0h. V. Q Justyescxno, justfortkxasrd. Withmpect ~~ ph~~~~~~~ f~-~~ say “physical intimacy,” do yuu nmm sexual rclaticms within the &initial? I

A b, I&. I

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1 Q w~~~~ y~~~~~~~

2 0ff&. wbmetbuewasn0scxualcontactatall?

3 A Yes.

4 Q Was there sort of affc& mate umtact during sonx

5 oftbosetimcs?

6 A very. Yes.

7 Q Olaty. And how would you describe sort of

8 affectionate but non- sexual contact?

9 A A lot of hugging. hokbg hands sometimes.

1 0 Healwaysusedtopushthchairoutofmyface.

1 1 Q okay. ~y~~~~ y~ w~

1 2 mcaingswacsetuporbowtbosecacountcrswcrcsaually

1 3 SZtUpasagUSilmattCr?

18 4 A AftertkfvstfewincidaSsthatsof’tofhappaxd

1 5 drningthefurlou&, tbcywaesetup- wbcniwasworking

11 6 in Legislative Affairs, usually the Resickmt would call my

I’ 7 office on a wcdcend.

1: B Hehadtoldmcarlicrontbathewasusually

1’ 9 aroundontheur& kcndsandtbatitwasokaytocumesecbim

f 2 2 2 2

:O ont. l~ wccke& s. Sobewouldcallandwcwould~ !I eithcrtobumpintocachothainth: hall. or~ fwould 2 biingpapcrstotbeofftcc. 13 Doyouwantmetodoaf&

!4 Q Okay. ‘Ihatwhathqqcadafta? Y A 0nccIlefttheWhit~ Housc, h4s. Curri. eanan@

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Page l! tbc visits.

Q Okay. And how would she arrange those, typically? A Idoa’tundastand. I’mSorry. Q WhnyousayMs. Curriewouldarrangerbcm, how woulditconxabouttbatthcywouldbcsetup?

A u~ y~~~~~~~~~~ t priortoandtbcnbimtalk.@ toh4s. Cunieormcbugging Ms. Cunictoa!& tbePmsident.

Q Okay. Allright. Didthcmlationsbipaftcrtbe events YOU’VC &saibed of N~ vcmbcr 15th and 17tb, did it

~~~~~~ a~~~~ t?

A Ycs, itdid Q Aftcrthctwoiaci~ tsthatyou’vedcscribcd, did youhavcfunhcrsexualcontactwithbim?

A Yes. Q ~I’rn~~~ y~ j~~~ questionsaboutthat. Thegrandjuforskardthattbere’s achartandwz’llsortofgotbroughacbartafkrwa3dsin less detail. Approximately how many times do you recall pelfoxmingoralsexonthcPmsident?

A fthinkabou& ttinc. Q ~d~ ev~~~~~~~?

A No. Wchaddkusseditandthczcwattimsti italmostkppencd, butmotkrnaturewasintbcway.

Q Okay. Howmanytimcsdidhejaa& tcwbcr~ you

2 3 4 5 6 7 B 9 D 1 2 3 4 5 6 7

B 9

Page 20

In my prcsma?

~yourP==. Twice.

okay. AllddoyoumcalltbedatcsoftixBtimcs? Mm& mm. ~~ 28,1~ 7~~- 1~ it’s tbc 29fh 1997.

Q Didyoucngagc, othcrthanomlsex, inothcr physical intimacy that would fall witbin the d&& ion of sexual reiations that we’ve mad to you?

A Yes. Q WaeyouaiatcwiththePnsidattwbmyouhad thrx sexud cttcountas with him?

A Yes. Q Itscunslikeanobviousqtxstion, butIhaveto askit. ~~~~ te~~~~~~ e youwemactuallyalga& gwithoralacxwithbim?

A Twicz. Q ~*~ telephonccallsoccurn& didbc

0 evcrtalkol3thcpbalcwllikyouwaepcrformingaalsex?

1 A Yes. 2 Q I) oyoubavcanyrcdktionaboutwkn? bosc 3ctccmd? 4 A IbclicvconcwasNovamber 15,1995, inmysacand

5 visitwitbhim, andIknowApril7,1996.

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Q Okay. Did you everbave sexual intmxmrse with the Resident?

A No. Q WastherecveratimewbenyourgenitalsacXu& y touchedeach other?

A Grazedeachatha, ycS. Q Anddoyou raEmberwhenthataxxxmd?

A Yes. Febnmq Z& 1997. Oh, no. I’m smy. March 29th, not Fe. bn= ry 28th. Sorry.

Q Okay. And could you explain why you didn’t have surual intercourse with him?

A Hedidn’twantto. ‘IbeRcsidcntsaidthatk- thatathisage, thatthercwastoomuchofaem. zqucncrin doingthatandthat~ IgottokhisageIwould undemtand. But I wasn’t happy with that.

Q Okay. Iwanttomoveawayfmmthatnow. A okay. Q Andaskyouwktkrornotyou’veevcrspokento the Resident m tk telephone.

A Yes. Q Andeanyoucstimate approximately how many tinEs since the beginning of your relationship with him that you’ve spokeotohimontkphone?

A over 50, probably. Q Andhaskinitiataianyofthoseealls?

Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998

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Page 2: loudly, you know, “Come 011. It’s me.” Something like that It was always nia to hear his voice.

Q Okay. Didbeevertcllyoubowbefeltabout leaviugIIlcsgsorlyourhfmlemacfiine?

A Yes. Q Whatdidktellyouabouttbat? A I believe it was tbe begin& g of 1996, at some point, kjustxmarkedthatkdidn’tliketodotbat, k just- Ithinkfeltitwasalittleunsafe.

Q Okay. Didkevereallyoulateatnight?

A Yes. Q Canywtellusalittlebitabouttbat? Didthat bapp m many occasions?

A Yes. He’sanightowl, soitwouldkcustomary forhimtoeallscnnctims 2: 00 in the morning,, 2: 30 in the w

Q Okay. Whatsortsofthiqsdidyoudiseusswith himgcaadlyofanowsmalnahlrecmyonrtclephonecalls with him?

A Similartowhatwed& ussedin~ justhowwe wucdoing. Alotofd& ussimsaboutmyjob, wknIwas ttyingtoaImebacktotbeWhiteHouscandthenonee IckcickdtomovetoNewYork. Wetoldjokes. Wetalkal aboutcveq& ngundertbesun.

Q Okay. Wastbaeevaatimethatyoubeganto Pagt 22

1 A Yes. 2 Q Doyouhaveanysortofideahowmanytimesk’s 3 called you?

4 A Most of those phone calls were calls that k placed

5 to me directly. 6 Q Okay. Did k ever leave any mesqes for you at 7 your home? 8 A Yes. 9 Q And you remember about how many times k left 0 mtssages?

1 A Ithinkaboutfour. 2 Q Didyousaveanyofthostv? 3 A Yes, Idid

4 Q Andbavcyouprovidaianyeassetk tapeofthose

5 messqestothcOIc? 6 A Yes, Ihave. 7 Q Da you nmxmber any particular messages that k 8 left you? 9 A Iremembertkmall. 0 Q Okay. Why don’t you just tell the grand jury what 1 they say. 2 A ‘Ibey’reprcttyinnoeuous. somtimes- orone 3 tim, itwaqyouknow,“ SorryImissedyou.” One- it 4 was just “Hello.” And then one time k called really late at 5 nightwhenIwasaotatbomeanditwaswhispcrcdkindof

Page %

1 algagcmphonesexmrhet& phone? 2 A Mm- hmm_ Yes. 3 Q AadQyw rrmanbawbentbatstaftCdtooccUr? 4 A In the be& m@ of 1996. 5 Q Okay. Didkpartieipateinthat? 6 A Yes. 7 Q Okay. Andaboutbowmanytimcsdidyouhavephone 8 sexwithbim, ifyouknow? 9 A Oh, maybelO. 15. I’mnotreally- I’mnotxeally 0 sux. 1 Q Okay. Wewnlookattkdmrtafkrtorcfiesb 2 ywrrccdlection, butthatsouadsratofbal@ rk? 3 A Ithinkso. 4 6 Mortthml1o, about? Iayourvicw? 5 A Ycs, Ithinkso. 6 Q DidtkPresi~ tevertellyouthatkwantedto 7 end tk sexual r&& ship with you? 8 A Yes. 9 Q Anddidktellyouthatmorethanaxx? 10 A Yes. !I Q Couldyoutelluswhenktoldyouthat? 12 A Fcbruaq- itwasakDayof1996. Ithink 3 that’s Fcbnmq 19th. And also on May 24,1996 - no, 1997. 14 I’m Sony. 5 Q Andjustforthegmndjury’sinformation, onthe

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Page 25 1 chsrt~ twrc’regoingU,~ wtbaninaiittlebit,~ wdo 2 youList- Qyoukvca~ thatyou~~ totheMay24, 3 1997 meeting with him? 4 AD+ W 5 Q Andwktdoestktstandfor? 6 A DumPday. 7 Q Andontbosetwootxxhmgwktdidktellyou 8 about wanting to ad tk relationship? Just generally.

9 A Bothwtz, Ithink, motivatedsortofbyguiltand

0 justaot~~ to_ man: Ithinkonth: 24thofMayin 1 ‘97, j~~~~~~~~ t~~~‘ s~

2 anddotkziglsttbingforhisfamilyandkjust- k 3 didn’tfeelrightaboutit. 4 Q Didyouaqgqeinsexualamtactwithhimafter 5 thoEtimcs? 6 A Yes. I& six&- 7 Q Okay. After& c- Wx& aftertbethtruaq’I9, 8 1996time? 9 A Yes. Yes. !O Q Andwktabout~ tkIvIay24, l!#? time? !I A Justkissing. !2 Q Did your relationship involve giving sifts to each !3 otkr? !4 A Mm& mm. Yes. I’msony. !5 Q Anddidyougiveanygiftstohim?

Page 26 I A Yes.

2 Q Do you have any sort of ballpark fv of how many 3 gifts you’ve given to him sina you’ve kDown him? 4 A About 30. 5 Q Andwktabouthimtoyou? hyoukveany 6 estimate of how many gifts k gave you? 7 A I think about 18. 8 Q Did you mr write him any notes or letters or 9 cards?

0 A Yes. 1 Q ~~~ of~~~~~~~ d 2 youwritetohim? 3 A ItvariedontkocCWion. Itcouldkahmy 4 cardthatisaworaHallowecncarcl. IfIwasangry, it 5 couldkanangxylettcr. IfIwasmissinghim, itwasa 6~~~~. 7 Q Okay. Sowere~ oftbem- isitfairtosay 8 ~oftkmwaeromanticinnature? 9 A yes. !O Q Andwkntkywcxeqry, whatwouldyoukangry

il ~ut~ yo~~~~?

i2 A ~~ job-~~ or~~~~~ 3 attentiotl to me. 14 Q Okay. Did k write you any letters or notes? !S A No.

Page 27 i

1 Q ~k~~ y~ yk~ n’~~ ti~~ uany 2 Julcrsornotc! c 3 A No.

4 M! LIMMERGUT: I’dnowlikctoskwyouwktIkd 5 pxWioMlymaTkai8sExbiiit7. Ibelieve. Pcahpssomcbo& 6 bastbeothera@ elvasioa. 7 (Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- 7 was 8 markal for iduItification.)

9 BY Ms. JMMERGUI’:

I 0 Q I’m~~ toplaccthisbcfacyouandaskifyou J J rsognizedurtckrt. 1 2 A Yes, Ido.

1 3 Q Andkvcyousantktcknkfolc? J 4 A Yes. Ikvc. 1 5 Q DidyouhsttkOfWofkrdcpendentCounselin f 6Jxq~ riqtktcb~? 1 7 A Yes.

1 8 Q Didyouprwidealloftkiaformationthnt’s

1 9 lisredmtbat& art?

1 !a A Yes.

2 !1 Q &uldyoude& befortkgrandjuryjust 2 2 geraJlywJmtis& scribcdbytkt& azt?

2 !3 A Ithhkit’sachmc& qy$ atmarkssaucof

2 !4 tkhighl@ sofmyxelatimhipwithtkRcsi& nt,

2 Y It& fiitdyinch& stkvisitstktIkdwitbhimand

, Page 28

1 mostoftbegifUtbatwtexcknged. ItIeflec& mostof 2 tbephouecall. stktIrememkr. 3 Q Andtotkkstofyourknowiedge, istkckrt

4accurae? 5 A Yes. 6 Q Have you noticed anything that you would add or 7 delete from the chart sina you’ve reviewed it? 8 A Yes. Onpagt- 9 MS. IMMERGUF Dotkgrandjurorskvetkchart?

J 0 MR. Eh4MICK: Thy do. Yes. 1 J THEwRNESs: ~~ 5,~~~~~~ 1 2 chai& oa 10/ 23, IattaxWaDemochcfundrahtktyou

J 3 guyskveallpmbablysaasmT. V. lately.

J 4 BY MS. IMMERGU’E

J 5 Q Okay. Anything& etbatyou’veaoticed?

J 6 A No.

1 7 Q Okay. Othawisr, wouldyousaythattkcbartisa

1 8 pretty accurW edition or dclscription of your memory of

J 9 alloftbeevcnrs? 2 io A Yes. 2 :J Q H~~ it~ y~~~~~~~~~ 2 2 dctaiIovcrrc& lysortofwhatisafcwylcars? 2 2 2

3 A I’veahaysbeenada&- orientipersontmdI i ‘4 kda- probablyakbitofcirclingdatcsinmyF~ ax : 5 ~Ieitkrtal. kdtotkPlEsidentofsawbim. / II Rc: Grand Jury Procccdin~ s Thrsday, August 6, 1998

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Q And did you provide those Filofax sb& ts to the Office of Independent Counsel?

A Yes. Q Anddidtbatassistyouinrunembaingthedates? A Ye& itdid. Q Andwuetheseencountersiqoxtanttoyou? A vay. Q &d, a@ n, onthatcharttbereartvarious Wegories. Inthevisitcategoly- ordesaiptionsintk visitcategolyareathataredescribedaspbysicaliatinWy. Andwithrespecttoalloftboseqdotheyfallwithinthe definition of sexual relations that I’ve presaWd as Exhibit 6 to the grand jury?

A Yes. Q Soanywhe~ physicalintimacyislistcdonthe chart, it falls within that definition. Is that correct?

A Right. Ithinktheonlythingthatmightbe missingiskissing.

Q Okay. Andkissingissepara& lydscribedonthe chart, is it not?

A No, notnecessarily. Q O~ Y. A Imcan, becausethephysicalintimacy- whenzvcr there’sphysicalintimacy, thtzwasalways- themwas always l& sing.

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Page 31 A Ilaefcnmdouttlmt- IkkveitwasStcphar GoodinwksGdtoMs. CarricmdtkPrrsi& ntthattk

Rsi& atcodda’tbcakm. witbmc, soMs. Cumiecameback

intOtbcbMkOfECCWittlUS.

Q Andthwbat? A Anddu~ left Q Okay. shekfi? Anddoyimknowwbxsbcwnt?

A Iumc~ kamhrer, Ikl& eskwasintk plmtry. htk_ Wtry.

Q Okay. AndhmvdidyoukarntktlaW A IthinktktMr. NehGtoldmc. OrMs. C& c told me.

Q Okay. Wktkppumdwhmskwantcitkback paany? DidyouzuuaiawithtkPresi& lt?

A Ycs, Idid. Q AndcouklyoudcsaibcwImtyoumdtiacResideDt did?

A Mm- Hegavemcmylmtpinandtkbo& “LQvaofGrass” audIwmp& ainghimtoki¶ smcmtso mmoved- lktwasintkb8cksludyalxltlnlwcmovodow totkbackk~ bytkkthrarmandmrvatphysic@ intiln%~.

Q Okay. AnddidyouprzfonnQalsuontkt occa& o?

A Yes.

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Page 30

Q Okay. But where the& s physical intimacy, there wasalsothenmorethankissing.

A cxmect.

Q Okay. So physical intimacy is never on the chart to describe only kissing.

A ccmect.

Q Okay. There’s one particular date also that I wanted to cover with you which is February 28, 1997.

A Okay. Q Becauseatthattime, asthechartdaaoastratcs, you haven’t really seen the Resident sina April of the year before. Could you describe what the &cums& mces were leading up to your visit with him on February 28, 1997?

A TbcResidenthadtoldminDarmbathathehada Christmas present for me and I ended up not getting it until the end of February. Ms. Curtie called me at work during that~ to- orIgutssitwasthatday, I’msony, that Friday, toinvitemetoaradioaddressthatevening.

IweottotheradioaddressandwknIwentto !O talcemypicturewiththePresident, hesaidtogosceBetry !O Q Okay. HowmudiaboucyourrehUiooshipwiththe !1 becausehehadsomethingtogivemeafter. Solwaiteda !1 PrsideatdidyoutellLindaTripp? 12 littlewhileforhimandthtmBettyandthePresidentand !2 A Alot. Mostcwyth+.

!3 I went into the back Offlce. !3 QOkay. Aoddidywtdhaaboutfikscxud !4 Q Okay. AndwhydidBettycomeintbebackoffkze !4taxxmn~ tbatyollilItdwithllim?

!5 with you? !5 A Yes.

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Page 5. Q Andhowdidyou- doyou xmemberwhat& ssyoll watwtaringollthatoccasioa?

A Yes.

Q Whatdrcsswasit? A ‘IheoavybIuedmssfromTkGap. Q Andaf& thatinci& n~ didyouevcrtellLinda TrippthatthetemightbetbeResidmt’saemeoonthat drtss?

A Yes, Idid Q Andwhydidyoutellhcrthat? Ordidyoubelieve tbatthatcouldbetrue?

A Ithoqhtitwaspossible. Q Wcreyoupositiveitwastruc? A No.

Q BacktotheincideotwiththePFesidenfhowdid youleaveitwithhimoothatoccasion? Sottofooayou finishedthevi! 5it, whathappcnaI?

A Bettycamebackintothebackstudyandthm IthinkMs. curriewalLed~ ollt.

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Q ~~~~~~~ t~~ UlC0IlUt# Xs8DdtkgifIS?

A Yes. Q WaeyoutnMulabouttkrclatimshipwba~ you toldlhdaTeppabnutit?

A Mastofrbctime, butsoa& w -tkJemrc clccasiaLPh1wam’t~.

Q Waeyoutmhfulabantkmmlpmsoftk l& iohipwithbdl

A Yes. Q ~~~~~~~~ l! mddknbu- 8ndwhywiryQa’tIraybcfacaambuof 1997,~ yUUl& dillabOUtIkCthOMl~~ tSOftk KhtioMbip?

A Yes. Q I‘ rn~~~~ yq~~~~.

Doyouwanttobmknoworco&~ mc- Wf~~ subjccts?

A Afiveminu~ bmk? CouldI- THE FOREPERSON: We can take a tmminu~~ bnk. MS. IhihGRGUT: Okay. A rarminutt break. MR. FMh4XX Ammhttc bwk. MS. IkfMERGUE Would tkt k all fight? THEWI. mES: okay. MR. EMMIc& Tbcs fw. (Wiaxss occuscd. Witness mxlkd.)

Page 34

1 MS. IMMERGUT: Madam F- WthneallY 2 unauthorizd pfrsons present? 3 THE FOREPERSON: No, t. kre are none.

4 MS. IMMERGUT: Do we have a quorum? 5 THE FOREPERSONz Yes, we do. 6 ~.~, lw~ d~~~~~ ty~ 7 are!% illmderuatll. 8 THE wm+ JFSs: Thank you.

9 BY MS. I- MMERGUL 0 Q Ms. Lewhsky, the grand jurors had a few follow- up

1 questions -

2 A &c 3 Q -- for you that I wanted to ask you kforc we move

4 ontootkrtopics. Yoummlti~ thatontk~ omi 5 wklVyoulI8dscxualcQntactwithtktwucdescribcd,~ xual

6 ~~~~~~~~~ it~~~~~ y,

7 asyoudcscaiba& orscmxtime! sintbebackstudy. 8 A hhhmm. 9 Q Whydid- !O AmoR: hnhmc. !I BY MS. IMMERGVT: 2 Qoh, cxaxx me. Why did you choose tk ballway?

!3 A ~~ behVCitW8S-- itWaS~ y~ the !4 Presidcntchoo5ingthchallway, Ithinl, anditwas- thae !5 wcrcn%& nywindows~. Itwasthemostschdcdofall

P8gP Thursday, August 6, 1998

1 2 3 4

5 6 7 8 9 io ,1

I3 I4 IS 16 ;7 18 I9 !O !I !z !3 !4 !5

Page 35 the plaas in the back offke. Well, that’s not mlf. The bathmam is tk most secluded, I guess, because you can close tkdoor.

Q Anddidyousum& ncskvescxual cmxwntersinthe bathroam?

A h! h& nnm. Q Andthllncxttothebathxm, wouIdyousaythat tkblLLhyiS--

A_ Q -offtkstudyistbcncxtmost-

A ~~ 8~~~~ I~ al~ of~~ a& upjustsustofshmdingtkre8ndt& dngtkre becarrpckcouldclosctkdoortotkbat& wmandkanup againsttkbathamand~ kwas- Imitma& his backfcclhcrandalsoma& himalittlesba? cr. So-

Q Did? kRsidcatcvcrt& iyoukwascmcaned abwtkhg~?

A I’m sure that cmc up in cxmwxsation.

BY MR. EMMICK: Q Didkevcrindicatetoyoulookingoutsidcthatk might k umcuxd, for example?

A Ye& y= BY MS. IMMERGUI? Q Canyoudcscriktht?

A !hE. ~thinkthecmethatcomcstomindwas

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Page 3c ~~~~ 28~ of~ t~~~~~ rny clrismwkils. Andkwa! zkissingmintkdmwaykIwm tkbackmJdy. ortkoffiimdtkklhvay, zmdIsaRtof opa& myysandkwaskn& ingouttkwhdawwitbbis cycswidcqmwhSkwaskissingmcandthmIgotmari kmuscitwasn’tvuynmmic. A& tlmsotha! ks& i wcg1msjvstbdcingtosaatomakcswcwmcwasad tke.”

Q Chyau~ lize& outdrcbcahooswbucyau hdyolusucua1encounraswithtbc~~ t?

A ~d~ y~~~~ p~ a~~ t~. but

tberewen: OtXdkSionsOflWbiChwt~ intimntehtbcOfficc anddmalsointbcbathro0xn.

Q Okay. Andwlrnyounayd~~ offiidoyoumcantk Mmdy?

A_ Q SonottkOvalOffm? A No, no, mwuenevcrphysicaUyintimatcb, tk oval offii.

Q Olmy. Didyounotiawktkrdaorsmncbed ~~~ p~ si~~ y~~~~~~~~~ aklhway?

A Nakhvays- wcll, II’mootstncabouttkdocx goingiadzdiningmombutIknowli. lmtlkdoork& lg

fmmtkb8ckb8liw8ytotk- intotbeovaI~ wrrs I

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ahvayskptajarsothathecoutdharif -wasp.

BY MR. WISENBERG:

How ajar? How much ajar? Mayk this much (indicating). BY MR. EF& MICK: Youl~~~~~ t~~~

like that?

A I’mnotverygoodwiththat. Q Afootorlcss, somethinglikcthat?

A Afootorless. Igoesstbat’s- Iwouldassume_ that’s --

Q EnoughsothatonecouldkarmoreeasiIywhat~ goingollintkncxtroom?

A I&& mun. Righr, orifsomeone CameintohoIlerfor him.

BY MS. ~~ . Q Now dirahq your anCation bac4c to f% bruary 28th, 1997, thcdaythatyouworetkblueco& taildmss-

A It’snotawcktail dmss. Q Okay, I’m sony. A No, that’s okay. I’m a Iit’de &feo!$ ve about this subject. I’m sorry.

Q How would you descrik tk dress? A It’s a dress f& m the Gap. It’s a work dress. It’s a casual dress.

Page 38

1 Q With respect to that dress -- 2 A Right, I’m sorry. 3 Q -- you mentioned that you believe that tkre could

4 be semen on it. Could you describe what you did with tk 5 Pre5idcnt that ied you to klicve that? 6 A Wewczeintkbathomand- CanI& JsemyeyeS 7 soIdon’thaveto-- 8 Q Well, youhavetospeakup. That’sthconly- 9 A Okay. Wewaeintbebathmom andIwasperforming 0 oral sex. I’m sorry, this is emlxaz& ng. And usually k

1 doesn’t want to - k didn’t want to come to completion. 2 Q Ejaculate? 3 A Yes. Andthishassortofbumasubjectthatwe 4 hadtalkedaboutmaflytimcskforeandkwasalwayssaying S itbadi~ todowith~ andnot~~ m~ ll~~ 6 at fvst and tkn not fceliog right about things, and not 7 thatksaidthisbutItookawayfromtbatto~ ofmean B thatn* lybeinhismindifhedidn’tcome~ maybeitwasa’t 9 -kdidn’txKedtofeelguiltyaboutthat.$ thatmaybewitb 10 it not coming to completion that that was easier for him to

3 rationalim. 2 Anditwasonthisoccasiontbatsincewchadn’t 3 ~alonetogcthcrsinceApri17thof196~ tafterwehad ‘4 engagadinoralsurfora~ leandkstoppedmcask

:5 aonnallydi~ Isaidto~ youiarow-~ isso

11 1

1 1 14 1. 11 1’ 1: 1’ 2( 2 z 2: 24 2

1 /

( I (

I( 11 1: 1: 1’ l! l( 1: 11

IS 21 2 2 2 2, 2 &

0 A Yes. AndattktpointInoticeditandIldndof

1 ~~~~~~~, it~~~ c~ And 2 theaIzwnunbaedtbatIhadwomittkiasttimIsawtk 3 ReJident, aadIklimitwasattbatpointthatI~ t

4 tomyself, oh, no. Anditwas- it- 5 Q Soattbatpoint, youwuuPtpositivewhatitwas.

i- l ~

pd Thuschy, August 6,1998 I

Page 39 1 embarmhg, I’m sorry. I said to him, you know, I really 2 -1wanttomakeyoucome. Imcao, thisis-- 3 Q Okay. Why don’t you just &scrik the position 4 thatyouwatinoncekhadtiedtostopyou. Whatdidyou 5 ~~~~~ k~~~~ t~~~ yo~ 6drcss? 7 A ItoldhimtbatIreaIiycatrdabouthimandk 8 toldmcthukdidn’twaattogaaddictedtom: aadk 9 didn’twaatmetogtteddiasdtohim, andwe~ bracedat 0 tbatpointaodtbat‘ s- Imeaqitwas- it’sjustalittle

1 ~y~~~~ a~~~ y~ t~~~- 2 Q Okay. Andtoget- whayou’repointingdown 3 kxe, youmcansortofyourrightlowerhiparea? 4 A WeIl, oacofmy- Idoa’tknowifitwasmyright S orkft, butlowubiparea 6 Q Okay. ~~~~~ k~~ dpl~ 7 tbtyouthoughtyotlmi& lthavcgoaaisom? 8 A h’hn- h 9 Q Andistbatfromwknyou- wknyoudidactually Q cQntinuetoperformaralsexonhimla! er?

1 A fbdicvcso.

2 Q Didyoueversceaom& ingthatyouthou& twas 3 semeoontkdressthatIedyoutocoocludcthat? 4 A ‘hc~ ttimeIwCnttoweartkdxrss. 5 Q Soattktimcyoudidn’tnoti~ anythingootk

Page 4b

t dress?

2 A Idon’tbekveso.

3 Q Okay. Whathappawdtkotknexttimeyouwore 4 the& essthatIedyoutoumcllxktbat? 5 A We& Iah- axnfsaykze? Iaho- Ithink 5 r~~~~~~~~~~~~~ y 7 I’m not sure that that’s what it is. 3 Q okay. a A SoitcouIdkspinachdipor~ Idon’t

1 know. I’msony, could~ xqxattkqrstion?

Q Sum. ~-~-~~ it~~~ 1eastbcgmtoklibtlievctht~ tkIewaSseRXZlbntk dnss?

A ImaiIyh’tremembcrwbeDitwastknexttimeI wenttowwrtkdres$ butIg8inedMcightsoIcouIda’t ~~~~ dit~~‘ t~~ AndI’mnotavery organizdperson. Idoo’tcleanmyf& tksuntiiI’mgoing toweartkmagain.

Q Didyounotiathacvmssomhngmthdrcss?

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Page 41 1 AndwI3ydidyaldlLindatbtyoutimgilttbucmrsscmen 2 lmtbcdnss? 3 A 1thinkitjustatxtofcamcupincahersatian 4 soMhmWandth- 8skindoftbirflmny,@ osstbing. And 5 tkntknrxttimeskwas8tmykuleIuiucoiddtI’tiit 6 intotbndm. s~ dbdiwc~ 1s8idtoba, 4- b4you 7 wazltmsatbis? Y~~,~~~ tI~~ 88bout. 9 AndbutIjustwmnttosaybccaumIknowcvc@ ody IO haermdstbcamrprpnt ~~~~~ tx~* t II kJxptbisdxcasasascWulir. 1wasgoitigtoweariton 12 n8nksgiviugandmy ~*~ I~~~~~ y I3 forbccausetky6rcallskituty- aodIknuwitsounds 14 stupid. AndwhenIWldLindaIwasthinkhgaboutwcahg 15 tkdtcs% skdiscoW@ iocamgafme. Skbtwg? lttncoa: ofbu 16 jnckdsfranbatbint~ closU Aadsoitwasn’ta i- 7 souwmir. Iwssgoirrgtochait Iwasgoingtowcarit 18 again. 19 Q Differenttopic. WknwasNelwbmyouwue- a !O &3yulkvcanyidc% wbEzNclwaswbmyouwaeintk !I balhvayortkstltdywitbtkPrm* t7 !2 A Gnwhich- !3 Q Gnanyoftkoceashs. Imum, wouldNelk !4 arolmd~ uy? !5 A Tkmwuesomeoccahns tks- vctyfcw

Page 42 1 occasions, Xtbi& tktNdwasthuc- WasattbcWbie 2 House. AndIdon’tkmwwkmkwoukikvcness= i&- I 3 thinkkwasintkpantryontbc28thofFcbmary.

4 Q Doyouknowwkekwasonanyoftko& a 5 olxasions? An& agai% wkmyouhadsauaIcontactwitiI 6 tkPrcsida& 7 A Idan’tthinkso. 8 Q Didyouevcrugckndtowdsintbcbathmom~~ 9 wipcyouriipstick? ,O A Handtnwds. ao.

,l Q What about tissues? L2 A IbdicvcIusedationrt~ utwiptoff my .3 lipstick.

14 MR. WISENBERG: hum, c~ Iuksomtub@ rcaIly 15 quick? 16 Ms. IrvMERGur: sun!. 17 BY MR. WISfWBERG: 18 Q Howabout, QyoutbinkNeiwcukikvckmaround 19 on! eaaissftn~- ri(# ltkfaetkdepartlm: forreMissancc 20 wukad? 21 A New Year’s Eve ‘95? 22 Q Yeah. 23 A Ycs. kwas. 24 Q Also, didyoucvcrskw- did- Idon’t- it’s 25 mybad. DidyouevcrSb0wtkmeJstoLiWhTtipp?

i- Page% niurs~ y, August 6,1998 Page 43 I A Yrs. 2 MR. EMNICK: 3 Q YoumnlimcdtkttkRcsidcntcalkdyouona 4 nut& r of occasioos. Sane of tbasc occasicWU includal phone 5 LCX. ~k~~~ k~~ k~ p~~~ dcalls? 7 A Not always, but san& ncs. 8 Q Andwkzcdidksaykwaswhenkdidsaywhac 9 kwas? .O A Atkmc #l Q Mami~~ tkWhkHousensidaxx? ,2 A Ycr. #3 Q W& cdscmightkkvcpla&& Isfmm?

14 A Tke~ Itbi& twotimestbntkplaazdcalls s ~~~~~~~ 1~ ,6 Q Doyoukaowwiuhxksamuirm pkXdCl& ftUlI 7 tkGvaIofftn: orotbxphccs? r8 A Yes. ya. :9 Q Howdoyouk~~~ tbat? !O AC -’ kwarfdmcationitandmykwsfiatk !1 officc Iknowonctimlsaid- Iknewkwasintk 2 officeudIaskaihimifkwasiutkbackarcouldk~ !3 intkback. !4 Q DidkaotonlycaUyou, wha~ atymtrhartbut Y alsocnUyouatyouroffii?

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1 ~~~~~~ aiOff~~ Andksaid.% xI 1

2 didn’t know &at.” so I tbqbt tiw was funny. 2 3 Q- you- 3 4 A Andkma& mcffmtcmctitmtocailmhxntfrc 4 5 rcsidatam8limandcahiaudsaid+~ itskwup~ 3 6 pknc numkr ins- d of - 11 Soithad. Hcsmntdprcodof 6 7 himself. 7 8 Q AlIrigbt. Y~~~~~~~ t~ I 8 9 thinkitwasFcbn1azy28tti. S~ GoodinspokwitbBcuy~ d 9 0 tkPrcsidcataboutbe&- abouthimkiagaloncwithyou.- I 0 1 A h4m- bmm. 1 1 2 Q ~d~~~~ a~~~~~ 8~ t~ t 1 2 3 yousawandwktyoulatcrkamcdandwbatyouha 1 3 4 kwnaiitsotbatwecanfigurcoutwbatyouknowfran I 4

5 pcxsonai knowkd&? I 5

6 A Okay. Wbat~ sawwas&%‘ ct- hodinfuxthfs. Guric 1 6

7 goingintoth: OvalOffh Ithhk- I 7

8 Q Wksrpeyouatthistime? 1 8

9 A OhI’mswry. IwasinMs. Currie’soffiiand1 1 9

0 waswaitingwitbh5s. curric. And1klievestcpknwastb% c 2 ,O

1 atsomcpointandkmighthavcgoacintotkOvalOfficc 2 1

2 ~~~~~.~~ a~~~~~ 2 2

3 mayktkPrcs~ t~ krinaftu. Arldtkyspoksoft 2 3

4 of - 2 4

5 AJUROR: (Cou& ing.) 2 5

Page 46 1 THE WlTNESS: Do you wattt some wattz? Oh, okay. 2 So-- 3 BY MR. Eh4MICK:

4 Q WasthcreanyomelseintheOvalOfft~, ffatas 5 you know? 6 A it’s possible I Shit& 1 mi& t have xcn bhm 7 Emanuel in tkm. at some point, but I’m not really sure that 8 k was inciti in this conversation. 9 Q SotheygointotbeOvalOfftw, andwhatQyou 0 nextSgorhcar?

1 A Ibelicve% tycameouttogctm. Iwasrcally 2 ttcfvousbeutuseIhadn’tbeznalonewithtbehsi& ntsince 3 tkelcctionssoIwasfocwed- Iwaslcindofhmai, 4 focusedonbdngncfvous. 5 Q Bcttyasmeouttogctyouandwhatdidtbctwoof 6 you do? 7 A ~~ of~~ t~~~~ offt~. a Q Youbadmentifmcdcahrthatyoulatcrciimcto

9 learntbat~ wasadiscussionbe~ than, between~ 0 about you and the President and whher you should be alone. 1 Tell us when you learned that approximately and what you 2 learned. 3 A Ithinkfleamedit, Ibclicve, maybcshortly

4 after- notarttrat& y, maybewitttinthcntxtfmrmeks, f 5 guess-- thatStcpbenhadsaidtotkrtzsidentormaybehad

Thursday, August 6,1998 Page j

said to Betty, you know, sbe can’t be alone with him. So, andIdoo’tneallifIltanvrttfrmnMs. Cumeorfrorr. I Neil.

BY MR. WISENBERG: Q But it - was it when, based cm what you wn~: told. itwasaomwsationbetwaen- itwasaconversltionin whichGoodia, Ms. cutTieandthePnsidaltwcrctherc?

ACorrat. BY MR. EMhBCK:

Q U’s fw a little bit about the Reside& al ai&!% Younx! zUiosXdstcveGoodin. Whuearetbeaidesr ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ that.+ with the mdent?

A Mostoftbetimetkywazn’t- thyweren’t them. Iby~‘ tattbeWbitcHouse.

Q Andhowwastbatarmngcgui? A WhenIwasworkinginLqislativeAffaits, Idon’t think- Ich’tktxnvifitwasevervcrballysp& enbutit w8suxks& odberwacntheRcsidcntalldmyselfth8tmostof the- mostpcoplcwcrcn’tintmthewedrendssothcrewas- itwouldbesaf~ todothattkn.

~~~ 1~~~~~~~

sortofahvaysa arncanthtBetlyandIhdjustbecsuse shekncwimdIkncwtbatalotofpcoplethczcdidn’tlike me.

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Page 49 1 niceguyanddidn’tgetueateda= ectlyorpluperly, I 2 gtxss. And the kind of information, k sort of just would 3 givemeinf~ onahoutthePmsident. IxnMn& Idon’t

4 tbinkthatwastheoQly- thatwasr’ttheonlycomponaltof 5 tkfriauUp, butthatwasacampoaentofit.

6 Q YouhavediscUSdhowBettvhe@ edatrar@ eforyou

7 tocomevisittkResi& n~ espe& llyin 1997, Ithinkit 8 woubikfairtosay. 9 A Yes. 0 QWb- tbo= anw1t. s were made, who initiated 1 theianangznts? How didtbeystartoff! Didyouask? Die

2 tkPrcsi& ntask? DidBettyask? 3 A I’dsaymostoftktinxitwaspmbablyme

4 Skiug- eitberask. ingtbeResidentdirectlyoraskinghim 5 throughBettyorthruugh~ anoteofsomesort. And

6thacwue occa& nsthatkinitiated, soitwouldconx 7 throughBctty*

8 Q ti right. ht lllc ask you the followin% qustion. 9 Youhavedesc& edthewaystbatB& tybelpedletyouin- ‘0 A Mm- hmm. 1 Q -facihtatethemkionship. ifyouwill. Do 2 youthinkBetlycunieknewaboutyour& tionshipwiththe

:3 Pnxident? 14 A I don’t know. It’s possible she could have gleaned Y thatfromwitneSingthatthe-- youknow, thattheResident

Page 50

1 waskvingarclationshpthatcauscd- witha25ymr- old

2 woman or, at the time, younger - you know, that made me

3 emotional. But Ireallycan’t m that question.

4 Q She saw you under -oeSWhereshediZCd 5 you and the President had an emotional tie.

6 A I believe so. I’m not really - I’m not really

7 unnfortablesortof answering questions about what - you

8 know, whatBettyknewbecause-

9 Q Well, tknletmtfocusmcn’ecmwhatBettywasina

0 position to sac.

1 A okay. 2 Q WasBettyinapositiontoseetbatyouandthe

3 Resicknt visited fieqtmzntly and had a strong emotional

4 auachnmmt? 5 A Iklieveso, yes.

6 Q Did you ever expressly tell Betty about the

7 relationship?

8 A what aspect Of the Idationship?

9 Q Well, let me sepamte it out for you. 10 A okay. !I Q DidyoueverexpresslytellBeuyabouttk 12 emotional aspect of the relationship?

!3 A ~bekve~ c- thattok. !4 Q Did you ever expressly tell Betty about the sexual !5 aspect of tk relationship?

976 nRedxandJuryProcaihgs MUlti- PagCm Thursday, August 6, 1998

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Page 51 1 A No, I dm’t klieve so.

2 Q La M ask the question, why not?

3 A ~~ XUIS it’s Dot appr~ piate. 1 man, 1 think - i

4 dtnI’tritinkpeoplc- ytalkaboutthesethings. I 5 men, tkreisadiffetuxebetwunat& tionshipthatyou 6 havewithsomeone who is sort of involved in a situau~~~. and

7 then the kind of relationship you have with a friend wkm yoc

8 talkto. Ithinkwith-- alittlebitwithBetty’segeand

9 itwasn’tcleartomethatthe- youknow, theResi& n: 0 didn’tttllhaso, ifkdidn’ttcllhcr, whysh~ dI~

1 kr.

2 Q ktmeasksimilarquestionsaboutNe1. Doya; 3 thi& Nelknew?

4 A klknew- 5 Q Abouttheanotionalaspectoftherelauonship? 6 A Yes, Ithinkso. 7 Q Isthatbascdoowhatyoutoldhimorwhatyou 8 thinkkmusthaveseen, orboth? 9 A IthinkprobablybasedmoreonwhatItoldhim. 0 Q DoyouthinkNellcncwahoutthe~ ualaspectof

1 tbcldath& ip? 2 A Wenevcrdircctlydidit, so~ h’tknow 3 if- Idrm’tknowhowtoanSverthat.

4 Q Didkeversaythingstoyoutktmadeyouthiak 5 thatkmustknowaboutthtsexualaspectofthe

PalIe 52

1 relatiooship?

2 A NotthatIremember. 3 Q You mentioned earlier, perhaps an obvious thing

4 thatyouwemalonewiththeResidaitontktimesthatyou 5 hadsexualcunactwiththePresident. 6 A Yes.

7 Q %retkeakotimeswhcnyou~ dantwithtk 8 Rsi& nttbatyoudidnothavesexualcontactwithtbe 9RSidaS 0 A ~bmm.~. 1 Q Canyougiveussortofageneraldescriptionakut

2 howthcseencountersoccurmdandwhemtheyoccurrS 3 A okay. Thertwerenlaaaous thatranpedfmmthe

4 kginmngofourmlationshiptilltkaldofour 5 lelatiooship.

6 Q Weresomeofthembriel? Weresomcoftbem

7 substantialinlength? 8 A bfm- hmn& ycs. 9 Q WkrewithintheWhiteHousewouldthosekve OocUZEd?

1 A OneoccurmdintheOvalofficeandtkntbeothers :2 occumxl- oh, that’snottnz TwooccurmdintkChal .3 Offiaandtheothaswereinthekckstudyarea.

‘4 Ishouldalsojust- maybeIcouldjustaddr@ ht :5 nowthatevery- thateverytimcIhadavisitwithtk

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In Rc: Grand Jury Procaxiings M Page 53 Resident wbm I was working thxe - not after, but whar I waswakingthar:- mususllywould- m’ds~ intbc back and we’d talk and that was when we wae physically intimae and m’d usually end up. kind of tbc pillow talk of it. Iguc5s, wassitlingintkCh1Officetalkiag. So tbac’s-

BY MR. WISENBERG:

1 1 1

1 I 1 1 1 1 1 2

Q Attd, agaia, wknyousaywknyoustattedintl= back. thfltcoukleitkrbetbchlhvayortbcback?

A CorracSycs. BY MR. Eh4MICKz Q Iwouldliketoaskyousomcqucstionsaboutany

StC$ WyoUtOdCtOpytOkCCpptXdStiOOShipwiubtbc Prcdalt Sarct.

A A lot. Q Allright. Wellwbydoo’twcjustasktbc question opaluxlcdly aIld m’ll folklw up.

A Okay. I’msurrascvayonc cao~ umtthis iaLiadof~~ tionship~ tyoukacpquia,~ mboth wantaltobccatefulbeingiothcWbiteHouse. WknevcrI wouldvisitbimdurhg- wh- duringmytenratattk WhitcHouse, malwa~- unlcssitwassortofacbancc m& tingonawackardandtbenwccndcdupbackintbcofflicc, w would usually plan that 1 wouki dtbcr bring papers. or oat time wc had actually achhtally bumped into each other

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iathehallandwcntfromthatway, sothcawtplannedtodo rhatagainbecausethatscemedtoworkwelI. Butwealways- -tberewasahayssomesortofaeover.

Q Whcnyousaythatyouplanncdtobringpapemdid you ever discuss with tk President the fact that you would trytousethatasacovcr?

A Yes. Q Okay. What did the two of you say in those conversations?

A Idon’t remember exactly. I mean, in general, it might have been something like me saying, well, maybe oncz 1

got there kind of saying, “Oh, gae, here are your lcttas,” wink, wink, wink, and him saying, “Okay, that’s good,” or -

Q Andaspartoftbis amt& ment, if you will, did you carry arotmd papers when you went to the visit the

President while you worked at Ixgislative Affairs? A Yes, I did. Q Did you ever actually bring him papers to sign as part of business?

A No.

Q Did you actually bring him papers at all?

A Yes. Q Allright. Andtellusalittleaboutthat.

A Itvaried. !hnethsitwasjustactualcopicsof letters. OnctimcIwroteaxmllystupidpocm. soaDaimcs1

m& y, August 6,1998 , 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18

Page 55 put gifts in the foldm which I brought.

Q Andevenontboseoccasions, wasthealegitimatc

busincssputpwtothat?

A No.

Q Didyouhaveanyd& ussionswiththePresi& nt about what you would say about your frequent visits with bin after you bad left Ixgislative Affairs?

A Yes. Q Yes. whatwasthatabout?

A 1thhkwe- u~ chCUSCdthat-- youknoW, thc

baclolrsrdsrouteofitwastbatBettyahvaysneededtobetbe oottocltarminsothat, youlonow, IcouldalwayssayI waseoiningtoseeFkt. ty.

Q Andistbaesometruthintbznotiontbatyouwere WmingtoSxEktty?

A &tmiqtoscc% tty, Idon’thow. DidI- Isaw BatyOntvaytiXllCtll& IwaStb%

Q ~~ youa~ urpostthougfi~ goiag- 19 A Myputposewas- mOStOftktiXtteIXtyptt! pOSewas 20 tosccthePresida&, buttkxewetesometimcswhenIdid

21 justgos& BectybuttbcPrcsidentwasn’tintbtoffict. 22 Q WbcntbcRtsidentwasintkoffra, wasyour

23 pttrposcingoingtbeietoseetheRcsideat? 24 A Yes. 25 Q Whatabouttbewtitingofthit& sdownonpapa?

Page 5cl 1 wastkzeaayllhassh~ yauaadtkResidmtabout 2 tkrisksofvhtiagtbiagsrklwaandwllcthuyoushmlldmit 3 thhgsdown? 4 A Yes. 5 Q All& bt. Tdlmabaxtthat. 6 A Thencwerraatomc occashswhI3eathimurds 7 ornotsUmtIwrotthiags& atkdcuaad~ paroaalto 8 putmpaperjustinunsaaetb@ ewkappa& ifitgat 9 lastgatiagtbaea8amJae dscopenaiit SotluewuC 10 sevealtims~ krunahdtomc, youknow, ycmrhaolda’t 11 puttktonpapu.

12 Q We’llba~ occasimmgetiatosamdd8ilsabaIt

13 thatirbit. IckaCtkauwbowtoaskUtisqucahmore 14 ddiasdy, sorlljustaskyal. Didyoumkulyrrprm

IS aytokcahlwitbkwkmdyoumigMbcinaaxual

16 HUlttC? S?

17 A Yes. I8 Q Allright. Canyoutdlus. asdisc=$‘ asyou I9 canaadas- abouttbat? 20 A Ithinkwcu& xebothawamoftkvohnaeand 21 somuhesI’duscmybend- Ibitmylmnd- rotbat 22 woulda’tmakeanylloisc. 23 Q Allri& t, tbat’rfiac Lumcaske 24 qtxath. DidyouttytDtak- a% yuuokay? 25 A Yah, tbisijustcmbmtring.

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Page 57 Page 59 1 Q Didyoutxytotakediff~ troutesinaadoutof 1 visit~ tbcnforDomc~ sonoranotbashcwasn’tthcrr. 2 theovalOfflceartaaspattofyourwayofcoMzLngthe 2 tktyoulumnbcz? 3 tclationsbip? 3 A No. not that I ruwmbcr. 4 A &s, Idid. 4 Q W& it shout thrmhg away noes that you had wrirrcn 5 Q Couldyoutellusaboutthat? 5 totkRaifMt? Wast& eanydiscussionof& mvingou~ 6 A ima& andfOItODIUyOWnttbgOOUtadiffaWQ 6 tknosesoranynotationsthatyouunntldmiteontknotcs 7 doortbfmtbedocrtbatIcamcinsothatiftbrzewasa 7 tosmlindhimtotlmJwthemout? 8 guardtbatwasmdutyintbefnmtoftheovaloffiik 8 A Yes, I~ tktImaykvckdadiscussionwitb 9 mightmcmegoinginbutadiffamtguardwoddsecm 9 tk~ tabouthim~ thingsaway. Itbi&. or

1 0 lea~!$ ouoonewouldknowexactlyhowlongIhadheenitl 10 ~stnetkttky? cwttbae. Iknowoncspccifii

1 1 tbeR. 11 acasiatinmcoftknotestktIrcnthimIma& ajokc

I 2 Q Didyoutrytodothatmostoftktime,~ ofthe 12 tktrallywastc& Kbnghimnotto- totn8kcrurektlxew

1 3time? 13 tk- maksurektlncwitaway.

1 4 A I’dsay9Operc. catofthetime. Imean, Ican’t 14 Q I’veaskalyouanumbczofquestimskvingtodo

1 5 really tecall a tim that I didn’t do that, but it’s 15 wi& bmuyouhicdtokceptkrdation& ipscetet. Lutz

1 6 possible. Tlmtwastbepatian. 16 e&& iyuudl~ peopkabouttktdatit&+?

1 7 Q Wenzthzesomeptopltthatyoutriedt. o 17 A unfonruurtety,.

1 8 specificalyavoidwbenyouwatViSit@ tithtkRtsidettt? I8 Q Allright. CouldyouteUussomeoftbepcoplc

1 9 A Yes. 19 tktyou% toldahouttkteMmship?

2 10 Q AIlsi@.. wbowuethey, pkase? 20 A LindaTripp, cItbaincD& s. NyrsErbland, Dak

2 !I A ReuymuchevaybodybutBetty. 21 Y~ AshkyRaincs. andmynunnandmyaunt. Evaytmdyh

2 !2 Q Okay. What about, for example, Nancy Hemreich? 22 aditimt amountof- hadadiffczntamountof

2 !3 A Yes. 23 infamation.

2 !4 Q All tight. And bow would you take steps to avoid 24 Q NatakUngvari?

2 Y Nancy Jzkmrcich? 25 A OhNatalkUogvarjyes.

Page 58 Page 60 1 A Gaxzally, cominginontk~. Thisislfocr 1 Q Didyoute~ aayofyour- anycoutts& o~ or 2 Ikft? 2 tbempists of any kind about your t& ions& p? 3 Q Yes. 3 A Yes, Idid

4 A Okay. AftcrIkfttkWhkHouscitwascaning 4 Q AIltight. Wouldyoutelluswhotheywouldhe? 5 inontkw& mdcuson& xswc- ItriaitosochimbutI 5 A Dr. Irene Kassorla, and I believe it’s Dr. Kathy 6 don’tthinkitaetua& cvaoccrnredonTucadaynigbts 6- e 7 becauseMs. Hcrnrddrksyoga, Ithink- Iklkvc. 7 Q Wknyoutalkedahoutyourrelatiottsh. ipwithtk 8 BY MR. WISENBERG: 8 Pnsi& ntwiththesepeople, didyouiieahoutyour 9 Q Wbotoldyouthatshekdyoga? 9 rc. Iatioslship? 0 A Ms. Currk. 10 A No. Imayhavenottoldthemevery& tail, butI

1 BY h4R. Eh4MIcK: 11 dM’tbelieveIeveriied. O~ ahoutthe-& wa& doyou 2 Q Any& cussionwithtkPrcsi& ntabouttryingto 12 -tbed& orsorwasthatitl~? 3 makesuretkttbxatcfewapcoplcaloundwhenyouwercto 13 Q Imeantingenaal. 4 visit? 14 A We& tbetewat- aboutmytelationships- I’m 5 A WhcnIworka. linLcgiskiveAffairs. Ithinktbabat 15 sony, could you be more specific?

6 wassonoftkun& rstandingthattkwcrka& wastk- 16 Q Sure. You listed a number of people that you had 7tbaz wuut’talotofpcopkarnund. Andthucwaclimcs 17 told about your relationship with the Pres& nt. 8 whtnIttlinktktthcPKsidcntmightkvesaid. olatkc 18 A Right. 9 arttoomanypcopkhertbccausctkzewassomcbigissucor 19 Q I’mjustcryiagtofigureoutifyoutoldthetruth 10 same big cvan happening maybe. 20 totbosepeoplewbenyoudgxrihedtbetelatiottship.

!I Q W~ tlr~ anyoccasionswbenyout+ dto~ 21 A Yes. ‘IhatwuesomcoaxianswbmIwasn’t 12 arraoganentrtosutkI4esi& tbutforsaneressooa 22 truMulaboutartainthings, butnothttvingtodowith, I 13 anotkxBettywasnotinaposi& ntoktyouin? 23 thi& thegatenlln? lationship. Doesthatmakescnst? 14 A Swe, Ithir& so. 24 Q Exptmdtmtbatjustalittie. I’mjustnotsure. !5 Q Anyoccas& swhenyuukdactuallyplanncdto 25 A Well, IthinkwithLindaTtipp, Imeantkzewc~ c

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Page 61

1 timcsthatJwasnotrrutllfulwithkr. Ilnean, Ididn’t

2 knowifthat’swbatyouwereeocmpashgbysaying 3 relationship or not. 4 Q I& s put Linda Tripp aside for a bit because I 5 thinlC1knowwhatyoukveinmiIKL 6 A Right. 7 Q Put Linda Tripp aside for a bit. Were you truthful 8 with tk otkrs about your description Of tk h&& ip? 9 A Yes. 0 Q And since you snentioned Linda Tripp. were tkx 1 occasionstowardtkendof. IgucssitwouldkIhccmkror 2 January, wko you said some things to Linda Tripp that wete

3 not true? 4 A Yes.

5 Q Allright. We’llhaveachancetogettotbatina 6 bit.

7 A okay. 8 Q WktIwouldliketotumtoacxtist. k- is 9 Aprilof1996andyourtransfafmmtbeWhitcHousttotht 10 DepamnmtofDefeme. Wkmwueyoufirsttoldabouttk :I factthatyouwelebeingtemlinatedfmmhgislativeAffairs?

12 A OntkSth- IthinkitwastkSthofApril, 3 Friday. 14 Q Did you later have a telephone cmversation with 15 tile President about your being temhami?

Page 62

1 A Yes. Idid. 2 Q Wknwastkt? 3 A Ontk7th. onEasra. 4 Q Easter Sunday, April 7rb of 1996? 5 A Gmw. 6 Q Would you tell us first what your rraction was when 7 youwcrrtoldthatyw~ goingroktcrminatcdfrom 8 L& hive Affairs? 9 A MyinitialrcactionwastktIwasncvagoingto 0 sa tk Presi& nt again. I mean. my selationship with him 1 wouldkow. 2 Q YoudidnotwanttogototkPamtgwn? 3 A No. 4 Q WhmyouspokcwithtkPrcsi~ kntonApril7thdid 5 youcallhimordidkcaIlyou? 6 A Hccakdmc. 7 Q WouldyoutcUushowtkttckpboncconvasation 8 ptvcaxhi aad tkn we’ll talk about the maczing. 9 A Okay. Ihadaskcdhimbow- ifkwasdoingokay 10 with Ron Brown’s death. and tkn after we ranted about that 11 forati~ bitItoldhimthatmylastdeywpsMooday. And 12 kwas- ksomaIrcalIyupsuandsortofaskdmetoti 3 himwktkdkppcnaL SoIdidandIwascryingandIaskcd !4 himifIcouldccnncs& him, andksaidtkttbatwa. sf~. is Q DidyougoovertotkWhitcHousc?

Thursday, August 6,1998 Pa. g 63

1 A YerIdid. 2 Q Alnmtwkttimcofday. ifyounmankr? 3 A Ithinkitwasuound6~ pm. 4 Q Wkldyouin? 5 A IImd~ passatth: timc. 6 Q HmvbagdidycuvisitwithtkRsidmtthatday? 7 A hbykalmlfankur. I’mnotvaygoodwitbtk

8 time *’ .s. 9 Q You’veahc+ hd occahmtDtalkal. i~ bit 0 abouttkexualaspexofyour cnc( Amta with tk Resident 1 attbattimcmdtbcpbmc~ llmatyou- tbatcamcinin 2 tkmidst. ~maotgoiugtoaskycmaboutthat. WbatIam 3 goingto8skycuaboutbsEBdwnsyaurdiscussionstiththc 4 Prh& uabarttk ~titmuxiaboutwkttkfuture

5 wauIdkldfayal. 6 A Hcmldmetbatktka@ thtmybheg 7 Qansfaxcdkd~ t0QwithhimaIKitktkwas 8 upset. Hcnid,“ Whydotkybwctomkyo~ awayfhnmc? 9 Itrust~” AndthenktoIdmc- kbokulatmcandk 0 said.“ Ijmaai~~ youifI* vininNovanbcrI’llbriagyouback

1 lilathat.” 2 Q How~ thingskftattkatdoftlmtmahg? 3 A Isattofraaout 4 Q Right IgucsswktI= bytkt- I’mtary. 1 5 didn’tmarntokthatspccific.

P* b

1 A Qb’. 2 Q Attkcadoftbcmcuing, wueyougoiqgtogoto 3 t. kRwgon? 4 A Well, kwasgoingtoacewhatkcoulddo. 5 Q Ixe. Allright. 6 A Hesaidk’dtxytosee. Hesaidkwasgoingto 7 ask- trytofiadoutwbatbadhappeoed. AndItoldhim

8 thatIwasgohgtokme& ngwithMs. Hamichthenat 9 dayaadksortofsai&“ LamcseewhatIcando.” 0 Q Didyoulaterhavea& lepknecallwiththe

1 Residatwhacyoudiscus& wktkkdIeamed?

2 A Yes

3 Q whenwasthat? 4 A ‘Ibe fobwiq Friday. 5 Q lbatwouldbavcbecnthcn April 12th?

6 A Yes, Ithhkso. 7 Q DidkcaIIyouordidyoucaIIhim? 8 A He- m. 9 Q whercwueyou? 0 A Iwasatham.

1 Q Howlongwastktelcphoaecmmsation? 2 A hykabout20minutcs.

3 Q Telluswhattktwoofyoutalkedabout.

4 A HctoIdmctktkhadmkcdNancyandh4arshaSam

5 tofiadoutwhyIhadkentransfcrrcd, aadthatwhatkkd

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ccmctolcaln~ thatEvelyn~ had~ ft0f ~~~~,~~~~ tk~~~ toomuchattmtiontomesudIwaspayingtoomuchattcntia tobimrmdthatskdidn’tllccB& ycarewktbappcncd afbrtk& ctiallbut~~& tokcanN, kf~ tkc! lc& m.

Q Didkoffamyofhisvicwsaboutwktyouskti dowithlspaxtothisRntagonj&?

A ~~ id~~ I~~~~ t~~ I~~‘ t likcit& atkwouldgctracajobmtkcampa& x

Q whatwasyourmactiontothat?

A I& idC~ waSdiSqq? Ohd. IdiddtWZQIttogOtO

tkPmagon8ndIdida’trcaIlyl? mwkttkdiff~~ on tkcalnpaignwasgoingtok-* Icouldn’twork- ifI couldworkattkcampa@ whyIcouldu’tworkattkWhitc House. So-

Q DidyoustanwohingatthcRptagon?

A Yes.

Q Wktpositiondidyouboldwbaryouworkdattk partagon?

A &ttfiCktt~& Si!@ Ettto~~, WhOiStk bwottw-

Q ~‘ s~~ y,~ y~~~ t~~ ofumtactyoukdwithtkPrcsidmt~ tkrcstof 1996. Didyouseehiminpcrson?

1 I

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1 A YaIdid. 2 Q Okay. Didyouscchiminpa~~~ vayo! icn? 3 A No. Iwasn’taioncwithhimw, arhm~ sawhimit 4 wasinsomcsortofcveatagroupsettiq. 5 Q Didyoucontinuctokvctckpkoccontsctwitb 6 him? 7 A Yes. 8 Q Andthoscmclqhmcconmctsm: raoutintk 9 chartthatwc’vcputl@ ctbu- i0 A Mm- hmm. II Q - witb your usist8ncc?

12 A Iguess. Yes. I’m sorry. 13 Q Lu’stknjusttutu. tothefPstpattof1997.

14 Tkckctimis0vc. r. ~~~~~~~~ ta~ t

15 gcttingyoubacktotkWhitcHousc? 16 A Yes. 17 Q Allright. Wouldyouellushutthat? ix A I~~ f~~ I~ k~~~ it 19 tahimwasinJanuuyof’97inapkmcon~~ andk

!O t& ImcthatkwouldmlktoBobNashwboistkkadof 22 White House or Presidahal ~I~ it~~ t 22 bringingmback. Intkncxtpbonccallksaidkkd 23 ~toBobNash~ d~-&~ anatmcu, goarf~~ 24 - 25 Q Justabitmaedceeisotktmcangcta~

m- y, August ii, 1998 1

Page 6: ofwktcffot=~ tku& twaek& takcnandwktkryou ~~ k~~~~~~.

A Vuydisqpohti He- myundcrsta& ugrtfPst wastbattkwbadsortofbcmpassedtoBobNashto b- me- toEadapwitiotiformcocancbacktotk WhitcHouS~ I& mcamctokmtrl8ybinM8rchorsothat tkbaIlkdbaapwedfromBobNashtoMarsk! hou. And tkttMarskScottwassupposcdtokipmcftiapositionat

~~~~ b~ t~~~~~~~

&MilttEtOk? 0ffiiilltkWhitcHOUSCUbdttKZlSkfakr tacin& d tlw off&.

KcepM? Q Watyoufttwrat~~& witbaIItkt? A Vayfrwmxi. Q Anddidyuucommtmicatcyourfntstrationtotk Rceidmt?

A Yes. Idid. Q Tcllus& ntthowyoucommtitcdyanfrustration torkPtesi& lt.

A lheuucvuknts occasion& diffau3t things that kppaml. !hn& nc5itwasinourpboncaxtvczmthw sa# nuiwit~ EnrIcrtr,~ itw8siIlpcnm.

Q ~~~~ a~~~ J~ 3~~ I~. DidyoucuuesaoEsort0f8comm~ tobemdEtotk Prcsidaltcmtimtday?

2 3 4 5 6 7

8 9 IO I1 12 13 14 IS t6 17 18 19 Hf 11 u !3 14 !s

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Page 68 A Yes. Q Tcllusabantbat. A Ihdbamtryiagtogcrinrmchwhhbimz~ ybc sitIMtklfitRp8ftofJtltletodiscusssmttcofmy~ widlMarsbasultttbatkdnotgoncasIbadhopcdtkywouId and-- cxcuscmc-- tkPKsidmtwasn’tm8pald@ tome8nd ~It~~~~~‘ t~~~~. AndIgotvcqupsusoIsatdowntkttntxegrtuallylud scribbkdoutrkqgkwtohimtktmlkcdhanmy ftustrationsandtktkbadprom& d~ bringntcback: ifk ~‘ t~~~~~~ tI-~ u~*~~ khslpmefind~ pb_~ tthatpoiatI~ irrNmYak~ t tkUnibxINatioas, andtkt1sortafdqkxlinhotof ~~~~~ t~ I~‘ t~~~~~ HouscIw8sgoiqItDnaxito@ xpiailttomypamtswctiy why that wnsn? kppaliog.

Q Andwbat~ yatxp~ insuxGngalepaof tktkittdtotk~ t?

A Ithinkitwassortofhadafcwputpoecs. intht towafdstkauloftkktluI! toftmt! dupagaiDaltdw8s 21 ~k~ rnym~~,~ t~ p~~-~~ f~ 22 purposcs. ithipLwastokiodofrrmiadhimtiD3tIhadleft 23 tkWhiteHowiikagoodgirlinAprilof’%. Alotof 24 otkrpmp~ mightbavcmadcarcafIybigstinkandsaid? ht 25 tkyux! S5’tgoitIgtobsctkirjobandtkydida’twMtto

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1 Q Ca~ tinw. Itbinkyouwar:- 1

2 A Attbatpoiot- Idoo’tkuowifitwasattbat 2 3 pointintkcotlvcrsatio& tkntkRcsidmtioformedmc 3 4 tbatKathkmWillybadactuaUycalkdNancyHunxi& 4 S duringtkvudCwl% uandkdsaid- cxcusem, sony- S 6 andkdsaidtJJatthistqxYwwascksingaficrhcruying 6 7 tofhdoutherrclatialsl+ witbtkRctidalt. 7 8 Aodsoto~ whattktlIrantwastbatwlnl- I 8 9 tboughttbat~ ttkt* KothLrnfoundoutLindawasn’t 9 0 goingto~ tcbastolytktskwastryingtocovcr IO 1 butmckswitIltkWhitcHousesotkttkywouldn’ttbm 11 2 f~ oUtathinktbatskwasbyiogtoaxoumgchGckcl 12 3 I& off. 13 4 soItbot@ C% ythgwasovuwithaodIlatc7 14 S toIdttlattoLioda. iS 6 Q Whydidycuwanttosaym@ ingtotkF’& dmt 16 7 atallaboutthat? WktdidyoutbinktkPmicht& btdo 17 8 to rspood? 18 9 A Itboqhtk- Itbot@ tmaybc, youknow, my 19 0 lmda% tandiug~ LitKlawastktKathkcnhadbaenuyiogto !O

1 gctajob. andIcouklcuhdytxxhtandtkfrustrations !l 2 ofbciogtoldsomcooc isgoiogtoklpyougctajobandthen !2 3 youdoo’t. AndItbougbtattktpoiot- Ididn’tknowroo !3 4 many duails about wkt was going 011. I don’t think sk was !4 S intkPaulaJoocscaseandItbough&~ ga, maykif !S

tbe Resident or something like that? A Yes. Our mcetiog started out with a fight. so he sat down and we sat down and he lectured me and, you knw ‘First of all, it’s illegal to thmtcn the President of the UnitedStatcsandsecondofall-“ Imean, itwasjust-- andtbenIsmedmyingso-

Q All right, fine. After the meeting on July 4th con&& d, did you leave the cmmuy?

A Yes. Q Allright.‘ Wkmiidyougo? A Ithinkafewdaysafterthat. IwenttoMadrid.

QhVbcndidyoumum, asbestyoucanremember? A On the 14th of July. Q AU right. Then let’s turn our attmtim to the 14th of July. You got back fmm om. Did you get a CallhmFMy?

A Yes, Idid.

Q Tcllusaboutthat. A Skealledaround- Ithinkitmightkveb& n aromd7: 30- Iwasalreadyinbedhamseofjetiagand emythiq- andtoldmethatshethoughttkPresident

eitkcwantedtotaUctomeorseemelatm, andt. hatI belieye k was out golfw at t& time, and that sbc’d call me back later to let me know what was going to happen. And

skdid Skcallcdbackmaykarouod8: 30orso. 8: 30,9

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Page 74 youknowsomoncwtronads- whowouldwanttohircbcryou can make this go away for - that’s bow I tkugbt of it. ThcnItboughtmaybctbaewasoornahingkcoulddotofix itorsomoMc~ could& tofuritorjustkawarrof it.

Q Hemightgahaajob, foruamplc? A Hemight. Imcan, Ithinktktwasoncoftk things tbat crossed my milld.

Q AttkttirxdidtkRcsidcntaskyouwbctkryou bad disclosed anything about your relationship to anyone Cl%?

A Not at that time. Q Didkatsomcotkrtimc? A Ys, kdid Q whcnwasthat? A Itbiuktkrcm. ightkvcb& nscvaaltimcs throughout tk relationship. but k specifically asked mc about Lii Tripp oo July 14tb.

Q Allright. ‘Ibenwc’llmtotktinjusta mament.

A Okay. Q AttkbqimingoftkmacingwitbthcRcsidcnt onJuly4t4youhadscnthima~ inwhicbyousaidlhat you~ considaingtcllingyourpamts. Didkevcrsay anytbingtoyouabout, youkmw, yousbouldn’tkthrcataCng

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Page 76

o’clo& andaskaimctocomeovatotkWhitcHousc. So1 did.

Q WkoyougottotkWhitcHouscdidyouscctk Raident?

A Yes. Idid. Q couldyoutcIluskwtktmahg~ t? A Itwasantmusual~ Iman, firstbccauscm -kmctmcinButy’sofficcandwcwmtintoNancy Ha- or& b’s ofI& which is adjaant to Ms. Chic’s ofticc, andaatontksofaandtalkal. Itwasvaydistantandvuy cold. AndkasMmiftk- Idon’tmmmbutk scquarccofthingsncccsoarily. butatmcpoiotkasMmc iftkwomantbatIbadrnahzdooJuly4thwasLii Thpp. AndIksita~ andtbcnaaswuai ya, andktalkcd abouttktttucwassomcissucwitb- thishmdtodowith KathLenWiIkyandtkt, askcalkdit. tkttbacwas somubhgootksludgc~ tbatrhcrcbadbrmsomc iofofwition.

Andwkthismainconcansazr& tokwastkt KathkutWikykdcalkdNancyagaintbatwakandwas upsctbcca~ MckelIsikoffkdtoldhatktkknewsk hadcalledtkWhiteHouscsayingkwaspursuhgkrandkr story. Is that ckar?

A JUROR: No. THE- Okay. KathkmkdcalkdNancy, aod

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Page 77 the Resident had told me that Kathlam had called Nancy. This was on July 4th. And then that following w& k when I

wasinMadridIbclicve_ IlmowIwasinMadrid, Ithink it was that following week - Kathlea~ called Nancy again. And Kathleen was upst btcaust Michael I& off had told Kathleen that he knew that she had called Nancy the previous w& k.

Doesthatmakealittlemcresmse? A JUROR: Yes, thank you. THEWITNESS: SowhattheRcsi& nt’sconcemwas that the only people who knew that Kathleen had called Nanq origimlly war Nancy, Bruce Lindsey, the President and

myself, andKathleen. Sohewasumcernedandhada& edm ifIhadtoldLindatheinfo~ oahehadsharu! withme, andIhadsaid~ IdidbecauseI~~ tthatmantitwas over, that Kathleen was tlying to back& a&.

So that alarmed me because, obviously, somame had told Michael Isikoff. And hc- was conaxnai about Linda, and Idhim. HeaskedmeifItrustedher, andIsaid yes. Andhe- wehadtalkedabwt- oh, Ihad- I’m sorry, I’mxmy. OnJuly4thIhadmentionedthat- tothe PresidentthatthiswomanhadtriedtocontactBruccLindscy and that Bruce Lindsey didn’t return her phone call.

SoonJuly14th, theRcsidentaskcdmcifI thought Linda would call Bruce Lindsey again, and I told him

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Page 78 that she is a really proud woman and that she was mUy

offcndai that hc didn’t call bx back and it was - so I didn’t think sbc would. And he asked me if I would just try to sa if sbc would call. and so I said I would try.

BY MR. EMh4ICK: Q Didbcaskyouwkthyouhadtoldanythingto Linda about your relationship with the Resident?

A Yes. kdid. Q All right Tell us about hat. A He asked me just tbat and I said no. Q Wbar was this conversation taking place with the Rsideut?

A In Nancy Hem& h’s off=. Q DidthaccomcatimcwhmkltfttoIakca conference call?

A Yes. k did. Q AU right. Did you know wbo the confamcc call was with?

A Tbat’salittkmurkyforme. Ibckvcitmi& t have b& n with his attorneys. but I don’t lunallbcr how I know that. So it’s possibk it was with bis ammcys.

BY MR. WENBERG: Q How would you know it? I mew. bow would you know it?

A I don’t know. That’s just what sounds - that’s Page” Thursday, August 6.1998 ,

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Page 19 whatcametomymindwhmIwasrecall& theevent. And1 don’t recall how I knew that so I don’t know if maybe that’s

justhowI’mrccall@ itorthatIknewitandIdon’t remember who told me.

Q %sthczcq’hodytheretote~ youhewaStak@

tOhiS~ Othcrhhimtbat& p

A ItcouldhavebemBctty. IsatwithBettywhen-- inhaoffltawhenhewasontheconfercncecailintheOva1 Off& or in the back. I don’t know whar he was, actually.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q OtlxrthanthcRrsickntaskingyoutogetahold ofLindaandhaveLinda011B~ Lindsey, howwaethings leftattheaxloftbcm& ing?

A ~askedmetoktBctt’yknowtkfo~ ow& day withoutgem. ingintodetaikwithher, evexlmmtioningname3 withher, ifIhad, youkmw, kindofmissiooaccomplished sortofthingwithLinda.

Q Anddidyou? A &s, I~ otintouchwithBdtythemrtdaymdI toldhcrthatIneu3edtotalktotheF% i~ thavingtodo withwhathehadaskdm.

Q And did you folknv up with that? A k, hecakdmethatcvcniag. Q Okay. Andwhatdidthetwoofyoutalkabout? A wedismmdtk- IgWSSthatIhadkedto

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Page bU talktoLiidaandthatshcdidn’tsamvcrynqhvcto uyingtoguintouchwitbBruccLindsqagaiu. buttbatI wouIdccmtinucrouy. AndIthinkIjustgevcbimsomcmom -ItllinkIgwhimxuaybcthc~ infomhon about wbatIlcllcwwhmLindawakedtheandgavchim. Ith& a fuhvcrsionofwIm~ itw8sIknmabouttbis situatioa.

MR. EMMICKz I’mprcparedtomovcon. Is& an

appropriae time for motkr ImaW THE FOREPERSON: Most appropriaic. h4R. EMMICK: Okay. Good timing. THEWITNBSS: h+ lc, roo. Toomucbwatr. h4S. IMMERGUTz Ten minute? MR. EMMIClk U’sjusttakermmiuuks. THE POREPERSON: Ten minuca, pk. (Witness ad. Witncrs rccalkd) THEWITNESS: So~ arewc? MR. EMMICKz Infact, I’IIcvmwaIkupaudshow

you~ mIlrrbutfnstm~~ 0clarify~ ttbercarc nounautbokedpusonsprcsaxtandwebaveaqwrum.

THE POREPERSON: That’s conrct. tiInadIomniudyoutbatyou’rcstillmKiu oath.

THEWITNESS: Thanks. MR. EMMICK Justtomakesomcrcfacaccberc, m

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Page 81 1 archereattbccndofJuly. buttbat9t~ qrrstions. 2 I’mgoingtocirckbacktoApril7th 3 TEE WITNESS: Qloiy. 4 MR. EM. MICKz we’rego& tloasksomemc4cck& iloo 5 Aprit7tbandm’regoingtotalkalittkbitaboutacall 6 UmtyoubadfrmntkPrcai& sUin- ItbinkitisAprilof 7 ‘978boutunatconwTmuonsthat- 8 THEWITNESS: Okay. 9 MR. EMh4IcK: Acalliuthttimcpuiod.

1 0 THEuTrNEs: okay.

1 1 h4R. EMh4ICK: llmcwacalsosonm- ktlscall

1 2 t& nsortofalaundtyIistoffollowupqtkstions.

1 3 THE- Okay.

1 4 MR. Ehm4Icxz Eom’llfocusthertandelittkbit 1 5 ontk14tbandaIittkbitontbatplmnecall. I 6 THEWITNES: 1tbougbt1- Ialsomigbt+ tsay 1 7 tbatif, asbapprnaibef~ i. fI’msayingsometb& aodI’m 1 8 notckar, I’mootundarraading, juSkmcknow. bccausc 1 9 xdotbatalot.

2 0 BY h4R. EMKICK:

2 I Q All right. Let’s start offwitb scsnc questions.

2 2 First, kt’s focus on July 14th bauupc tbc Presideat wand 2 3 you to have Linda contact Lindsy. Wby wouldn’t Liadsy just

2 4 contact Linda? Was * any discussion of that? Wby did it

2 5 l. lavctogooIIcwaylathurhantkairrway?

Page 82

A I don’t believe tkxe was a discussion about it. I have my own tbougbts on it, but uberc wasn’t a discussion about it.

Q Wbatwacyourowntbougbtsonit?

A Tbatitwouldjust- I- ItbinkIsonof thought that it would probably bc nuuc proper - not in a chain of c ommand, necessarily, but - it just seemed more appropriate for Linda to call Bruce Liodsey.

Q Diditloolc- doyoutbinkitwouldbavelc& ed

1 inappropriate for Lindsey to contact Tripp?

1 A Itbinkitwouldbavebcmawkwardbccause

1 I& ink- bowwould- youknow. howwouldBruceLindsey

1 havclrnowntocall- youLnow. tocpllLin& aflbatpoint?

1 If - you know, tbe Rcsidcnt tbougbt 8t that point tbar -

1 you know, that Linda didn’t know anything, so if Linda didn’t

1 know anything, tbar bow - wouldn’t it be odd for Bruce

1 Lindsey to just call kr back out of tk blue?

I Q O~ Y. 1 A Imam. tbatwassortofbowItbougbtofit.

2 Q But in eitbcr evens tbac wasn’t any actual

2 discussion about the straw behind wbo would bavc to call

2 wban?

2 A Not tbat I mrunba. No.

2 BY MR. WISENBERG:

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Page $3 tried to call hm before.”

A Right. Q “Sbeisl’tgoingtoeaRhitnthistitne.” Itnean,

anythirrgliktht? A Yes. ~thinkIbdmcnticmaithatbcfore. Imean, j

thatmighthaxbeen- youknow, Ithinkwassonof-- he

was saw Well, just by to see.”

BY MR EMh4ICK: Q I& meapproachthequestiainjustaIittlebit different way. When you taIked to Linda and tried to I

convinceLintiatotalktoBntceLindsey, whatdidyousayto / lKrtotrytoanvincchertotalktokr? Doyouun~ j WhtImCan?

A Right We~ Idicb’tte~ Lindathat- andthis i

wustmusuaLididrl’tteIILindathatIhad~ tk I

Rtsidentonthe14thofJulybecauseIwassamewhatwaryofi iK! r, havingkamedthat someone had told Michael Is& off, I

andIkrtewitwasn’tme, sosortofassan& ng thatLindaha. d j

talkcdtoMicbaelIsilcoffandnotrcallyknowingwtmeshe waswmingfrumonthis, soIjustkeptesxouragiugherto /

caUBruceLi& cyagain, thatthiswaskatingupmmand youmllyshldcallBnuzLindsey_

Q Allright. Lctmgoto~ otkrqustion. You madearefereruxearliertotbefaetthatyoufelttbatNe1 1

badn’tbccnmat4xlwcllorhadn’tbcentxatedrespectfully. ;

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Couldyou~ nswbatyoumcaotbytJtat?

A PeopkiotbeWbiteHousc- Imcm, Nelis statiancdintbcpantry, whichisright- Imcan. whifbQ evcnapartoftkOvalOfEcc~ andk’sahvaysthacand bctakesvl! rygmdcareoftbeRsidmtandpeopkjustwalk rigbtpastbim& ydon’tsaybitobim. alotofpeopk don’t acknowkdge him.

Andtbyjust- youknow, tbeykkdofcomcto bimwbattbcyncalscane& gbutanm’t- andIjust- Idon’tthinkpcopksbnuldbctrcfrtailikctbut. Imrao, ItbillkaIlybodywbo- and~ pccially CVUptlCWlKliSWFXking atthcWhittHourtdwklworLP- I’vc8hvaysca* gorized

pcopkaspcopkwboamtbemtoservetkP& dentand poopkwboare~ tosuvetbcmselvzJtbro@ tbc PmsidattandItbinkNclbasalotofloyahytothc Prcsidcnt.

Q Wouldi3btfairtosaythatit’snosomucb~ t they wan affmrmtivdy mistmating him, but they = treatingbitnasroon- pcrsonalmoat7 Oristbat-

A Itbinktbat’samisttca~ t Q Yes. Tbat’samistteatmait. Okay. Tbat’oa fair

Charactcmatim

A Inmyapinion. Q WebadtalkedearlicraboutcertGnpeopletbatyou wan& ltoavoidinordutobelpkccptkmIation& ipacclu

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Page 85 1 and you talked about Nancy Hcrthch as bciag otx of tbosc 2 pa& e. canyoutelluswhatotberpaJpleyouwantcdtosort 3 ofavoidintbatsamcvcin? 4 A Srepbm Goodin. Let’s SQC. I guess it’s diffuuit 5 fromwhIwasatthcWhiteHousetoaftn. Wkr~ Iwe~ 6 th. EvelynL& mnan. HamldIckes. anybody~~~ 7 Iwa~. cataioly. AndaFtcrIkft, Ithinkitwasmainly 8 anybodywhknewmcfiumbeforc. So- 9 Q Ahright.

0 A Doesthat- docsthtanswcrit? 1 Q Ifthat’stbcanswu, tbartbat’stbzbestwccao 2 do. 3 A Okay. 4 Q We talked earlier about February 28th and about 5 steveGooding0ingintotkova1officewithRettyandwbst 6 you kama- l about that conversation tbcy had. 7 A Mm- lmun. 8 Q Tbc question is this: why would Steve Goodin. who 9 isafteralljustaprrs~ tiallidzwfiywouldbek: irra 0 position to bc abk to ti tbc F’rcsidcnt, ‘You can’t be with 1 Monica Lewinsky aloae? 2 A Idcm’tknow. AndthatwasaqucstiontbatI- 3 thatIpasai- Idon’tthinkIposoditasaqucstion, but 4 Isortofmadca commatt, youknow. wbois- andthdl- 5 Idon’t rcmcmbcrifitwastoBcnyortoNcl, youLnow. why

Page 86

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I would -- you know. how inappropriate that was. 2 Q Right. 3 A And maybe Stephen made the comment to Betty. 4 Maybe just Betty. I - I -- I - you know, I wasn’t in 5 theroom, soIdon’tknow~ tthecourseoftheconvasation 6 was. Maybe Stephen said it to Betty and Betty told the 7 President that Stepben had said that to Betty. So I’m not 8 sure, but I thought it was inappropriate, too. 9 MR. EMMICK: Any other follow- up on that? 0 A JUROR: I think a point be is that did he feel

1 thathehadthtauthoritydosobecausesomcoacelscwas 2 encouraging him to monitor that sort of activity, such as 3 Evelyn Lie- for example? 4 THE WITNESS: ‘hat’s a good thought. I don’t know 5 I don’t have any knowledge of that. 1 never thought of that. 6 BYMR. EMMICK:

7 Q You mentioned that during 1997 espcciaby you 8 frequently complained to the President that although he said 9 he could bring you back (mapping finger) like that, it 10 wasn’t happening. How did the President mspond when you !I complained about these things? 2 A You know, I mean, it was tbe -- “Bob Nash is 13 handling it” “Marsha’s going to handle it” and “We just !4 sort of need to be careful.” You know, and, “oh, I’ll - ” !5 he would always SOR of - what’s the word I’m lo& ing for?

Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998

Page 87 1 Kindofvalida~ whatIwasfcclingbytelliogmcsomcthing 2 thatIdcCI’t~ knowisuuc. “04I’llta! kto 3 ha.“~ R- yau~, I’Ilt& blabblah, blab” andit 4 was just “I’II do.” “1’I. l do,” “I’ll do.” And didn’t 5 didn’t. d& l?. 6 Q AIlright YoummtioocdtbatintbatJuly3rd 7 lettcrtbatyousalttotkPtcsidaltttKoughEkuyyoumadc 8 ardauxztotkfacttbatyarm. ightbavctoaplainthings 9 toyourpauits. Wbatdidyoumcanbytbat? 0 A IfIwasgoingtopickupandmovcfrom

1 Wasbitxgmo- fizstofa& Ibadtoldmy- wcllmymom 2 Imcw, youImaw. that1wasba~ somcsortofa~ tionship 3 WitbtbcRes~ t. Mydadlmdnoidea. AndIbadtoIdmy 4 dsdtharvaoI- you~, Iwas~ 1dIcouldprobablycomc 5 backrothc~~ Houscafrertbeclcction. asT~ Keating 6 hadtoldmc. Andthcf’resi&~ t. 7 soIhadstrtoftoldhimtbetcouKeandIwould 8 havemzkdtoaplahtutlnuwbyIwasgoingtopickupand 9 IxbovcbNewYorkwithout-* ttbepointwouJdbc. 10 Q Waeyoume+ mingtotlxca~ tkF’rctidatthatyou !I uue~ to&& foroumplc, yapfatkrabcuttbcscxual !2 xlatio& ipwiththeRcsident? 13 A Yesandoo. Idon’tthinkI- Iknowthttht~ 14 wottldhavedmtlm~ Ithinkitwasmore- tbeway1felt !5 was, youkno% youshould tununbcrtbatIsortof- I’vc

Page 80 I bumagoodgirlupuntilnow. 2 Inrau, Ikindofbave- thatIthinkIteuded 3 to- IknowthatIthoughtbetendedtofar@ whatIhad 4 gonethmughakadyandthat- andsotbatthiswasn’tan 5 isstxof, wcll, youknow,“ Wecandothisinalittlewhilq 6 thisismaybe& atgingyourjobwhiIeyou’teininWhite 7 House,‘ youknow, ifIhadwantedtomiiybedosome& hg 8 differut: itwasalotmotesignifiicaut. AndIfeItthathe 9 wasgivingmthenmamtmdabit, too. 0 Q Isitfairtosaytbatit’wesinpattanimpIied lthrtat? 2 A Yes, butIthink- butIthinkifyonwzmttolook 3 atittbatway, itwasatbreattohimasamanat4dnota 4 thresttohimas~& l~ Doestbat- I=- 5 Q whatdoyoumean? .6 A WeIl, IthinkwbenIbearyousay, yozlknow, 7 “Wastbatanimpliedthrcat” tbattbatlcttcrbcingscntto .8 anymrmwboishavinganiIlicit4ationshipwithsomame .9 WouldbcathnaSandsoit~ imlevanSthcfactthathe !O was prcsidmt. !I Q Isa. !2 A sOjustheuausewehadtakadcarbaraboutitand !3 tbcntb8twaswbathadtlpsetmc, wbcnthePKsidentsaid !4 “It’siIkgaltothmat4mt. bePmsidanoftkI. ktitai !5 States.”

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985

Pagt a4 1 Q Right.

2 A And I just thought, you know, “I don’t deal with 3 youlikethePmsi& znt, Idealwithyouasaperson.” 4 MR. EMMICK: Allright. 5 MR. WEENBERG: CzmIaskscnaethingaboutthat? 6 MR. EMMICK: Yes. 7 BY MR. WISENBERG:

8 Q Butyouhadsaidyourmotberbythattimeknew 9 tbaewassamofkindofamlationship. 1 0 A Right. He didn’t knOW that, though. 1 1 Q But you hadn’t told - k didn’t know that. 1 2 A InevertoIdhimtbas. No. 1 3 BY MIL EMMICK: 1 4 Q A questioo about lipstick and tissue. 1 5 A okay. 1 6 Q Youmentionedthatacuupleoftimesyouused 1 7 tissues to wipe lipstick off. Do you remem ber &em you 1 8 threwthosetissuesawayanddiditoccurtoyouthat 1 9 somebodymightsathosetissueslaterandthereforemight 2 0 thinkofitassomehowevi& n& gthex& tiooship? 2 1 A No, reaIlytheonly- theonetimethat 2 2 I specifieauy rtmcmbQ doing that was on January 7th of ‘96. 2 3 And- no, Idon’tthinkthat- Iman, IhadlightlipSick 2 4 onsoIdon’t- Ithinkifithadkenadarbzreolored 2 5 lipstick that maybe I would have been coneemed, I might have

Page 90

I thought about thaw but that didn’t cross my mind. I don’t 2 thinkpeoplegothroughthetmsh. 3 Q Right.

4 A I hope not. 5 Q Doyounxallwtnxeyouthrewthetissueawayon 6 that occasion? 7 A Itwasinthebathmom. Ithinkthere’sa 8 wastebasketrightnexttothesink. 9 Q All right. A question going back to the ‘96 11 0 period, becauseyouhadmentiooedthatonFebruary19thof 1 1 ‘96 the President told you essentially we should break up, 1 2 we shouldn’t have any more of a sexual relationship, yet 1 3 fiveorsixweeksLata, thawasacontinuationofthe 1 4 sexual relationship. How does that happen? How does it 1 5 get broken off and thaw rekindled? 1 6 A Well, there continued to sort of be this flirtation 1 7 that was -- when we’d see each other. And then one night, I 1 8 don’t-- Ithinkitwasmaybeintheendof- theendof 1’ 9 FebruaryormaybesometimeinMarchwhenhehad- Ihad 2, :O seenhimintbehallwhenIwasleavingtogofromwork, and 1 !I thiswastbznightkwascomingbackfromtheIsatli 2 !2 embassy from something, and we didn’t make any cxmtact or 1 !3 anything becau~ k was with Evelyn Lieberman. And I wenl 2 !4 home. 1 !S About 45 minutes later, k called me and had told L

In Rc: Grand Jury Proceedings Mutt . P. Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998

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Page 91 me k had gme back to his office and had called my off& baz. ause k wamal me to come over and visit with hrm. but I was born now. you know, and then k had gone back upstarrs.

Sotktkdsottofimplialtomctbstkwas

inoastediUnsrtiogup~ ElldthenwhcnISllWiliHl~

tk3lstofh4arch- whcnkkis# dmctktprettymucb- Q Just. basically. pa@ c got hack togctha. A Yeah. Tbac was IICYP’ a discussion of. “Okay, mw m’rc going to resllum? our &hxlsllip egain.” I didn’t wantto- whybringupthcmeuunyofthcguilt? So-

Q Okay. ‘ihcnwktI’dliktodoaextistumour atlention back to April 7tb. which is tk Easter Sunday. and we’re jJoing to ask smle marr: ckhkd questions about tbat paiod. Fir% wknyougottotbeWhiteHous~ didyousu asozetscwiccagmtllllddidtkwoofyxnltalk?

A Yes. Q Allright. Telluswkitwasandwkttbewoof yclusaidtomeanotbu.

A ItwashbnMuskr& Ibclicvc. AndIkdbro@ t saIlepapaSwitbmcfrolnbmleandsoIbelicveIsaid sazth@,“ Oh, tbeRGdanaskalmetobrhgtkscto him.” And John Musti said. “Oh I’d bettcz ch& k witb Evelyn Liebuman.” And I don’t lunemberuactlywhattk ~toftbt~ wsf. butItoiLedhimoutof& ingtbat 6ndtbcnIjustwattin.

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page 92

Q Wcrcyouna- vouswbcnksaid.“ I’vcgottotalkto EvelynLitkrman”? .

A Ohycah. Yes. A& italarmcdmetktskwas ttnc. Ididn’trcallyapectkrtokthuzonaSunday eV=@.

Q Youmcntionedtbatrtckphonecallcameinwhik youwcrewitbtkPrcsidalt. Didyoulatucomctob& eve youknewwbDtktcaIIw8shm7

A Imadeaspecu& ionaboutwktkteaUwasfrcm. IhwenoknowLdgcnorlmdnoknow~ aboutwbowasmtk phmd.

Q Let’smkethisanepata~ tkx~. A Okay. Q Fiit, whtdoyou Yunank about tk culrnt of tbccaIlandtbmwktwastbexeasontktyoudRwwktevu conclusion you did lapa?

A -hecontmtwaspohicalinnaturtaadIdrew. you know, tk possibility that it & Dick Monis just based on- thatitwascampaignstuff. AndItbinkthatbowit .O cwcameupthatitcouIdpossibIykDickMorri. swasinr !I joICingwaywitllLindamtkpbonc. !2 SoIdon’tbekvetbatIevu- Idon’tthiIlkI !3 wouldhweewcatcgoricallystataitbatitwasDi& MoniE !4 mtkphanChazause1didn’tknowthat. !5 Q Allright. AbmtbmvlmgafraApril7tbdidym

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I draw the conclusion or develop the suspicion perhaps that it

2 was Dick Morris?

3 A I don’t remember.

4 Q Okay. All right. At some point, did you hear a

5 voice that you believed to be Harold Ickes’ voice?

6 A Yes.

7 Q Okay. Tellushowthathappened.

8 A TkResidentandIwerein- Ibelieveitwas

9 tbebackstudyortbestudyand- orwcmightbaxbecnin

1 0 tbe ballway, I don’t really remember, but I - Harold I& es

1 1 hasaverydistinctvoiceandsohe- Ihcardhimhollcr

1 2 “Mr. Presideot_” and the President looked at me and I looked

1 3 at him and hc jetted out into the Oval Oflice and I panick4

1 4 and didn’t know that - I thought that may& bazause Harold

1 5 was so close with the President that they might just wan&

1 6 back there and the President would assume thatIknewto

1 7 leave. So I went out the back way.

1 8 Q Whcnyousayyouwentoutthebackway-

1 9 A ‘Ihrou& thedin& roOm.

2 0 Q Wlxxcdidyougo?

2 1 A I~ tthfmghthediningtDotneXiftothelefS

2 2 past the Chief of Staff’s off&, to the right, down the

2 3 !zairs.

2 4 Q Were you in a hurry?

2 5 A Yes. Page 94 Q All right. At some point afterwards, did you get a call from the President?

A Yes. Q All right. And what happened in that phone call?

A HeaskedmewhyIleft, soItoldhimthatIdido’t knowifhewasgoingtobecomingbackandsohe- Hera little upset with me that I left.

MR. EMMICK: All right. Before we move off that particular call, are there any follow- up questions that you

I have? Yes?

1 MR. WISENBERG: Yes. Yes. And I’ll try to be

1 delicate. I’m not known for delicacy.

1 THEWITNESS: Icansuthateveryonesumsto

1 agreewiththat.

1 BY MR. WISENBERG:

1 Q First of all, Ms. Lzwinsky, when you went out the

1 dining room, did you go out through Nel’s pantry door or

1 through the main dining room door?

1 A I would have gone out the dining room door.

2 Q Okay. IwanttomakesurethatIgetthesequznce

2 right, because this is partly based on stuff we discusxd

2 Monday in New York and you correct me if I get anything

2 wrong.

2 A okay. 2

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5 Q We'll do it that way. As I tmdexstmd it, tbue

i- l Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998 I

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Page 95 is a - you’re back with the President that day and let mc

ask first if you recall, tk more intimate sexual moments that day, were they in tht hallway or the back study?

Ahth.

Q Okay. Now, as I understand it, you’re with the

F? esi& nt_ It’s an intimate moxuznt. A call comes in.

ACOrlUX Q All right. And the Pxesidcnt leaves. A Mm- hmm. Q You put your top back on. Your top had been off and you put your top back on.

A hfm- b. Q And at some point he comes back. Is that correct? A h& n- b Q Okay. And what I’m trying to do is distinguish bctwuntkI& scventandthecall, iftkxeisa distinctioninyourmind. Inotkrwords-

A Yes. Q Thecallissomthingdifferen~ asfarasyou know, f? 7nntheIckesevcItt.

ACorrect. Q Okay. The Presi& nt comes back and it’s at some point later that you hear the voice of Harold I& es.

A I’m sorry - Q ThcPrtsidcntcomesbackfromthephonecalltb

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Page 90 hetakes-

A No. ‘Ibe- somoDcarmtintotell* Re! Xi& nt khadaphoneca& sognnrnc canE! in, hoUeIrXi som? thing, not Mr. Icke5.

Q Okay.

A ‘IbePresidentwentout, camebackinandItbink tbmtheyscntthephonecallin.

Q Allright. Hetmkthatin-

A Heta& tkplxme& lintkbackstudy.

Q Okay. A ‘Ihenwewat- andIthinkwthadheenir) the hallway- IlaIowwtIlFxlbemintbebauwayptiortothat.

.Q okay-

A Andkcameba& inandtkntkphm& angandk

tooktbepbrmccallintbstdcstudy. Q Okay.

A ‘IbenitwasmuchIaterinthatsamedaytbatk heard the “Mr. Resident” voice.

Q Of& es.

A Right. AndI’mgoingto- Ithidcthatmwuein

theba& st& yat& atpointbecausethat’swhykjcncdso quickIy, wtwaatingHarol~ Ithi& towaIkk? ektklx. Thatwas-

Q Okay. Now, thevoiceyoubeardsayiqtothe Pmickmtthatkhada& l-

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Page 9: 1 A hh- kmm. 2 Q YourxversawthePresidentattahdtothatvoice. 3 A No. Anditwasn’tavoiathatwasfamiliartome. 4 Q Okay. AadyounevcrsawIckes. Isthatcomct? 5 Wknyoularnbcardhisvoict, youdidn’tscehim. You’re 6 just familiar with his voice. 7 ACamct 8 Q Asfarasyouknow, didIckessuyouwknyou 9 llea& doultllebackway? 0 A He owlda’th’e. 1 Q Okay. whydoyousaythat? .2 A Btcaustbewasintkoffia. 3 Q Okay. Andyousaidthatkkcswasmuchlatcr.

4 I~ muchlaterwithintlxwholetimeyouwcretkrewitb 5 thePlr& knttbatday?

Tlmrsday, August 6, 1998

6 A 7 Q 8 A 9 Q

10 A

!2 13 Q

Page 99 1 A YOU know, I’m thinking just now, I don’t know if 2 that was in April. It could have been in May.

3 MR. EMMICK: Okay.

4 A JUROR: Of 1997? 5 THE WITNESS: Yes. Sony. Okay. I don’t know ii

6 the month tixre is important or not.

7 BY MR. EMMICK: 8 Q h April or May, you have this discussion. 9 A Right. 0 Q The Resident asks you if you’ve told your mother

1 abouttkrtlation& ip. 2 A Right.

3 Q

4 A 5

6 7 8 9 0

1 Q

wbatdoyourcspond?

“No. Of course not.” MR. EMMICK: okay.

MR. wIsENBERG: Mike? MR. EMMICK: Yes?

MR. WISENBERG: Can I butt in? MR. EMMICK: Yes. BY MR. WISENBERG: Do you know independently wm if any,

2 convcrsationtherewas- thatis, wbether- didyoulater

3 lcamtbatWaltcrhadsaidsomethingtoMarshaorthat 4 somebodyhadsaidsomezh& toWaltet? 5 A Inaway, that’stoobroadofaquestionbecause

Rigk-

okay. Imtan, notlikesevelalbornslater.

No. No.

Oltay-

Just much later within my visit. MR. WISENBERG: Okay. Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK: WhatI’dliketodoisturnourattahntoacall 14 that you got from the President some time, I believe, in 15 April, butcorrectmeifI’mwrong, wkreheaskedyou

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Page 98 somahing about wk& a you had told your motha -

A Yes. Q - about tk mlationship. Let’s fmt talk

about - c. anyouplacctbisirltimeasbc5bcFtyaUcaIl? A ItwasApril. Andthiscamaboutti-

IgucssMarshaSwl& Ith& hadxelaycdtrmcinformation to tbc Rsidcnt about her conversations, I think possibly withWaltaKayc. whoisafrieadofmyf~ sandthat fromthatconvlxatio& IthinkMalsbaeitbz7diR! ctlysaid b tbc President or tk hidmt wondered frmn somehing ManhassidifIhadtoldmymom- wclLitmusths~~ the Rsidcnt assuming from something that Marshn said.

TlzRsidcntaskaimcifIhadtoldmymomorhad rny~~~-_ aadwhar: thatwrntwashldmymolntaldWalta Kayc. AndIsaidno.

Q Wbatyou’rtdescribing, isitallbascdmwbatthc Prcsidcnt said in t& is pbonc call?

A Idon’tundcrsUmd. Q Yes. Yuusaidtbatatsomcpointitwasbascdon tbcfactthatWahcrhad~ toMarsbaScotlandI’m tryingrof~ outifyou’rtlcamingthathrmadiffcrr? lt sourccorifit’sallfnxntbc~ idcnt.

A No, Iwaskimiugtbatfmmthepbouccallwitb the RcsidulL

Q Allright. Howhgwastkp& ncaIl7 1

2 3 4 5 6 7 6 9 D 1 2 3 4 S 6 7

B 9 3 I

2 3 0 5

Page loo

IthinLWaltaKayekindofcamsinandout- ifyoubok atthiswfrokfmycan. hccamesinandoutofthisinafcw way& so- didIkaroirhpaMhtlytbatWalrl7hadllsdr discussion with hhsha? No. Is that what you nnx asking mC?

Q Well, that’s one. How about with anybody eke.? Igucssdidyoukaranythingtbntstruckyouasthisiskind ofconsistmtwithwbattbcPresi& xltbadtoIdmeintbat convasathatbisfitsIogctkrnow? WplPCrlmda conversation with somcbodyand could have actually talLcd to MarshaScoaandthcnthntgotrclaycdtorkResidat.

A Ido~‘ ttbinkI’mfoIbwingyou 1OOpcraax I’m =V.

Q Okay. Well I’m not ahvays vay articuhtc. just -

A It- Q DoyourecaU- ktmcbcmorcspccific. Arcyou aware of your aunt eve7 having made a mt to Walter Kfqe?

A I’m awax of Walta Kayo having ma& a commmt to my aunt

Q Okay. And what was that? A Hcmnarkalsomuhhgtomyauntthstkbadbavd fnnnpcopkthatthcxasonIbadkfttkWhitcHouscorbad bsenmmedfXUlltkWhitCHOllSCwpsbCXXUSCIhedhUdtbiS Ida~ witIltkRsida. lt.

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Page 101 1 Q Do you know what your aunt rcspondcd to Walter 2 Kayc? 3 A Myuncbtandi~ WaSSbCgotupandWdkCdoUt. 4 Skwasbavingltmcbwitbhim. 5 BY MR. EMMICK: 6 Q Aiiuyoulmdthistclqboac~ witl~ tk 7 Pr&& ttwbackaskcdyouwktbuyoukdtoldyourmom. 8 wa5tbcncxttimctbatyousawtkRc3idcntMay241h. 9 Itbi& whichyourcfcrtoasdumpday? 0 A Yes. Eitbm way. it wodd bavc baen. wbethm it I wasinAprilorh4ay. 2 Q Right. Bccausc you didn’t = him in April - 3 A Right.

4 Q -andyouonlysawhimonccinMay. 5 ARight_ Corrst 6 Q AIltight. Andyuukd- that’sfinc. AIlright. 7 WktI’dIikctotumourattmtiontoncxtisasm’m 8 workingdownotKoutlinclla% m’rcfini& cdupwitbtk 9 July3rd, 4tband4tbphod. Itakcittbatyoumnaincd 10 frustrataiwithtbcRr5idalt’scffortstowytogcfyou 11 backtotheWbitcHousc. 12 A Mm- lmm. Imcan. itahva~- andididmakcthis !3 cicaru, him, thatitwasalweysmorcimportanttomtohaK !4 himinmylifctbanto- lhantogctthcjob. butthcjob !5 wassomuhingtbatwasimportanttomc.

Page 102 I Q DidthccomcatiminaboutOctobuwknyou 2 ~avcup, m~ orkss. onyourdfofistogabacktothe 3 White House and you tumid your ancntion mono to New York 4 City? 5 A Yes. 6 Q AU right. -Ml us bow tbat bappatat. 7 A Linda Tripp called mc at work on Octokr 6th and 8 toldmctbathcrfricndKatcinthcNSChadheardfrom_ had 9 kardrumorsaboutmcandtbatIwouldacwworkintk IO WhitcHoustagainaadifIdi4I~‘ thavcablucpass 11 ~tbathcradvicctomcwas” Bctoutoftown.” Sotbat I2 nrcanttomtthatIwasn’tgoingtakcamingkcktotbt 13 WlhHo~ andIwasvuyupsabytbat. 14 Also, s& Linda. told mc tbat Kate bad said. 15 “You know. tky crattc jobs at tk White House, you know. six 16 days a wak.” And that Stcph Goodin’s girIfticnd bad just 17 ~ajob. sowithtksccxampksofbowthcrcbadb& n 18 allthcscotbapcopkrscivingpbstbatIMuldhavtdonc 19 andIdidn’tgait. LO Q Did you commtmicatc your additional frustratioo and 11 disappoinmt to tk Ptrsidatt? 12 A Yes. Idid. 13 Q Tell us bow and when. 14 A IkkvcIscotbimasbonnotctcIlinghimthat 25 Imllynaxkdtotalktohiminpmsonhwingtodowith

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Page 103 1 thissubjcctmattcrandkandIbadanaqumcntina 2 conversation oo tk 9th of octobcr. 3 Q And was that a depbute conversation? 4 A Yes, itwas. 5 Q DidkcallyatcxdidyoucaIlbht? 6 A HccalMmc. 7 Q Aboutwkttimcifyoucanrananbcr? 8 A 1thiakitwasatumd2: 30.3:~ intkmorning. 9 Q Wasitakmgpbar: caIl? .O A Yes. Yes. 2SXX 2: 3Omaybc. ,I Q Isitfairtocbamctcz+ ztkplxmccallas

,2 iovolving an P- It?

i3 A Yes. Andthenartmadcup. 14 Q Attdtknyoumadcttp. is A hwasbelfmgumm~ balf~ ttp. 16 Q DidtkzoamcVamoJo& ncmcupitttbccomcof 17 that di! mtssion? 18 A It’s possiilc. 19 Q Wltatdoyoubavcinmindabouttkf~ timctkt !O VunonJordan’snamcwouldlmvccomcupincoava. sationswitb 11 tkF% i& mt? U A ItwascitkrindmtpknccalloronOctokr !3 11th !4 Q AndtIluswimtwassaidaboutVanonJordao. !5 wkhritwasintkplKQccallorontbcllth

Page 109

1 A Idon’trunanbu. 1kDowtlXtt1huddiscUsalwitb 2 LindaandcitkrIkdbadtktkughtorskhadsuggcstal 3 thatVmtottJc& att~ kagoodpcrsoawhoisaclosc 4 ffhdoftkPtcsi& ttandwhobasalotofcontactsi 5 NewY& sotkttbatmi& tksomconc wkmigbtkabkto 6 kJpmcsecumaposithixtNmvY~ ifIdidn’twattttogo 7 totkU. N. 8 Q And what was tk P& dent’s rcqmsc? 9 A “Ithiuktktwasa@ ida.” IO Q Atsomcpoin~ didyutsatdtbeRcsidmtson@ hiq II likcalistofjobsainWcststhatyoumigbtkvcin I2 New York?

13 A Yes. Heahdmcto~ tbatmtklJthof 14 octobu. I5 Q Atsomcpoiot. didyoulmveaniaitial~ witb I6 Vanon Jotdan? I7 A Ycs, Idid. I8 Q Canyoutcllus~ tktwas, asbcstyoucan I9 KzalI? 20 A -lltobq+ iogofNovanbcroflastycar. 21 Q Howwasth. atzxru. iqamm@? 22 A -hou& coo~ tionswitlttkhai& zttandwitb 23 Buty. 24 Q Witboutgatingiatoalotof& ailaboutwkt 25 bappataitkrcduriogtk! htmahgwitbVanonJordan,

I Page 101 -Page 104

989 n Re: Grand Jury Prorndings Mull

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1 what did you think were your job prospects after that? Did 2 itlookiikethings~ goingtohappca? 3 A Yes. 4 Q ALlright. Andwhathappenedwithrcspezttothe 5 job situation from that m with Vanon Jordan until, 6 say, Thanks& v@? 7 A Nothing, rtally. 8 Q Okay. ‘Ihcnlet’stnmouraUcntiontotkmonth 9 ofDaxmhcc. We’IIkvctor& tcbackalittlcbitto 0 Novcmkrinordertoaunpk% ethiugs, butonDeaznkr5th, 1 didyourcturntoWa& ngtcmf~ ovuseas? 2 A Idid. Youknow- thequestionyoujustaskedmt 3 kfole about until Thanksgiving, I did have a convesation

4 withhimkfo~ T, Ithinkit~ thedaybcfore. 5 Q Okay. 6 A so-- 7 Q ‘Rten why don’t you complete that, then. 8 A Okay. IkdspokcntoBettyabout- aboutnot 9 being- beingabletogetintouchwithMr. Jordanbcxxusc 0 kwasinandoutoftownandtbcnwasn’tntassarily

I nsuningmycaU. He’sabusyman. AndsoBcttyananged 2 formetospeakwithhimagainandIspokewithhimwkn 3 1wasinLosAngeleskfolz- rightkforeThanks@ ving.

4 Q Okay. Let’sjustgoback, ifwemight, totkt s early Novemher meeting with h4r. Jordan.

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A Okay. Q Didksayenytbingindicatiogtoyoutktkbad spoken with tk P& dent rsmtly about you?

A Yes. IbekvckmcatiooaIk’dbeda conva- setion with tk Pt& datt

Q Andwbatdidkseyebouttbetorwktdidksay tkt indicated k may have spoken with tk Raidcnt?

A IkkvckmcntiomitItetintkcourscoftk convcrsetion and es I was Laving, k ~tomctbat I came bigbly lWxfmWldal.

Q Okey. Let’s turn our eflention to December 5th tkn.

A Okay. Q Havinginmindtbetyoubedbedaneztingwitb VcsnonJordanandadiscussionandwercoyingto~ akld of him, wbcn you got back from ovaseas, sortofwktwastk status of the vcnson Jardan@ cffott?

A WknIkdspokmwithh4r. Jordenrigbtbcfore Tbanksgiiving, khadaskalmtocallbimrbcncxtwc& citkr, Itbi& TbursdaycrWy. AndboxtscIwasout of town, I calM him on Friday when I got back, and it was mytmdastandingfrombissccrctatykbedgoacoutoftowo tbatday, sowckdmi! Wdcacbotbc?.

Q AIIrigbt. Didyoutrytoerrengeema% ingwitl~ Resident Clinton?

106

Pagem m- y, August 6,1998 1 ‘/ Page 10’

1 A Yes. 2 Q El1 us what you did to try to arrange mgttng ulth 3 PrMlatt Clinton. 4 A Iseixanoteto& tymuchearkrintkweek 5 thatIaskcdhcrtopassalongtohimwhichintktleacr 6 nquestedofhimthatlcouldcomehaveavisittbat 7 Saturday. 8 Q Didy0ufollowupthatmxewithacallt0 9 MLcutTie?

10 Ayes.

II Q Wknwast. hatca& ifyourcmcmbcr? L2 A- Dacanber 5th. :3 Q Okay. Andwhathappaxdduringthecall? 14 A Well, them wcx several calls, actually. And so ,5 atfirqitwas- thefirstfcw, sbestillhadn’tgi~ him .6 thenote. .7 !Sotbenfrnaliyshegavehimtbenote, ju4 .8 Ithink, rightaftcrthctadioaddrssorri& thcforchis 9 mdioaddmss, andtbmshctoldmetktkwasmeetingtith !o hisIawycsalIdaySanrday, butthatsbcwascominginin !l tkmomingtogiveatourandshewouldcheckandxcwitb !2 himtbat, youknow, ifmaybeIcouldcumcby, buttbatthe. 13 pr0spccts didn’t look go0CL !4 Q Wasskfocusedon& rdaybccauseyoubadskcd 15 wktkr !Satmday would k a good time?

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Page 108

A Mm- km. Yes. I’m sorry. Mayk k was going out 0ftownonSundey. I’mnotsurcwhyIwouIdhavcfoctt& m !UtJrdayvcrsus Sunday.

Q Inaayevcnfwbetsksaidwaskwasbusywitb mcuingswitblewyas,~ likctbat?

A Q night?

YCS.

Allright. .DidyougotoeCbristmaspartythet Yes. I did. Didyou! Ectbe& sidmt? Yes. I did. Let’datnt0urauaxiootoDomtba6th. Okay. A= youdoiog~ fl YCS. AlIrigbt. Damtbu6th. Letmaskasa backgrouadqucstion. badyouprcviousIyptKcksalfortk PIuSidcntaclt+ tmespnSalt?

A Yes. Q Allright. WhetwestbetChtistmasprcsamt? A It was. 8 srrrling sib/ a antique standing c* kldu.

Q YoukdkatunabktoarraagcanactueIvisitwitb tkPrcsidatttogivcItimtbetptWntinpusorl. whtdid yoUdO& UId?

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Page 111 1 And I said, “No. I’m not hat to see her. I’m

2 tqingtoepcthcr. Skdoesn’tknowI’mcoming.”

3 Andtkatkytoldmcsbcwasgivingatourand 4 thatElamaf- doyouwaotmetogointothisdetail? 5 Q Sun. 6 A Okay. ThatElcanorMondakhadcumcrccentlyand 7 thatsbewasgiviugatourtoElcanorMoodalc. ‘IhmIsort 8 of- wantingtoknowiftbcPresideat~ intheoffk 9 askcdthtguards,“ Oh, wcll, isthcRcsidcntintheoffia?

1 o ~ifheis, sht’sprobablytoobusytocamcoutand~ t

1 1 tblxgifts.” 1 2 Andtbqsai~ Tc!& hcwss.”

1 3 Q %‘ batwasyourcactiontothat?

1 4 ANtigood. 1 5 Q olcay. 1 .6 A Very upset. Hyst& al.

1 .I Q Whercdidyougoandwhatdidyoudo?

1 .8 A IturncdarouodaadwalkcdoutaadIwaslivid

1 ,9 Ihad- well- aretkgrandjurorsawafcofthcrumors

1 !O aboutElcanorMondalethathadbrmout? Imcan, ba! auseit

1 !I docdtmakcarptif- 1 !2 BY MS. IMMERGm

. i !3 Q Well, whydoa’tyw= ywhyyar== upad.

1 14 Am

Page 109

I A IhadsomcotbagiftsforhimaswelltbatIhad I gottenonmytripsand- 3 Q TelluswWthoscothcrgiftswat, ifyou 6 remcmba. 5 A Atk. AmugfmmStarb& inSantaMonk A 6 Iialeboxthat’scaklhugsandkisscsandit’sXsaadCk 7 insidt, it’sreaUy- it’sjustacutclittlecktchki. An B aatiqutbookfromthefkamarkctin~ Yarkthrt~~

9'IhcoQrt Rcmevclt. And - I think that’s it. D Q Okay. Whatdidyoubytodoonthc6tbiaorckr

1 togivctbosegiftstotbcPrcsidcnt? 2 A we~,~ had~ aat~ dtOgi~~ tb~ mt~ him, if~ waS 3 goingtohaveaplanncdvisitwithhim, aodthentbrough I tht- justscrmtcourscofmnts, IgotupsarmdIdccidtd 5 thatIwasreallytiredofcWythkgthat~ goiBgcmand

6 Ijust- itwascleartomethathcwasignoringnmzand1 7 justdidn’twanttodealwiththisanymorc. 6 soIdecided- IhadpWhasedthcsepmsaltsfor 9 himandI’mvay- Ispcndalotoftimcandamvcry 0 particularabwttbtprtsentsIgivetopeople, soIdidn’t

1 waattogivctkmtosomax clsesndIwantedhimtohavc

2 than, soIpacka@ themupwithanotcthatIwasgoingto

3 dropofftoBctty. 4 Q Andwkredidyougo? 5 A ~wcattot. hcsouthwst~.

Page IIC

1 Q whathap~ atthcsouth~ gate?

2 A IpagedBettyorIthinkIm@ hthavtcakdhcr. 3 IlcnowIcallaIbcrandshcwasn’tathcr& slc, soIpaged

4 hcrtoletherknowIwasthcre. AndthcnMarshaScottdrovc 5 up. soI~ awaytothc~ westgatebecaustIdida’twant 6 Marshatosccmc. Continucfromthcrc?

7 Q Yes. Didyouhavcanytroublegcttinginattbc 8 nofiwzstgate? whathappened? 9 A Wc& I~‘ tayingtO~ in. I- so-

0 Q Whatwereyouuyingtodo?

1 A IwasayingtowaitforBctty. ~IcakdBctty 2 frornthetxnthwestgateandshcwasn’tathcrdcskandtbco 3 Isawsomeonegointotk- itwasunderamstrudianatthc I tim, soitwasadifferentliftiehutthannormal, radIsaw 5 ~whourcntinwhoIthoughtwasJohnPodc% so 5 IthoughtIwould- sinceIkncwtbatBcayhadtalkaito 7 JohuPodcstaaboutme, IthoughtIwouldaskhim, youknow,

B maybeIwouldaskhcr- Iwouldgivcthegifts- Iwould 9 feelcomfortableprobablygivingthcgiftstoJobnPodcstato D givetoBctty~ justknowingthathclmcwIhadarclationship

1 tithkr.

2 sowbenIwultintoaskthispcrsfmwhoIthought 3 wasJohnPo& sta- ittumedouttobeLanuy- Ithiak I LamlyDav& andsotbcnoncoftbcguafdssaid$ ’Oh, areyou 5 haetosaBeuycluTie~

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6 L ‘- 8 BY MR. WI8ENBERa

9 Q Aqwaica. Pardoamcfor~ Ijust

I IO wantedto- yousaidyalwerellpsu. DidyuaslWyour

I I1 upDetncarwalyoftlle~ 7

I I2 A No.

I 13 MRWISENBER( i: lknkyou.

I 4 BYMR. EMMIcK: 1 5 Q ~you-- Bccry?

1 6 A Yes, Idid.

1 7 Q Wkacdklyoucawtbufmn?

1 8 A IalkdhafmntkpaypbLW8ttbecorcoM

1 9Gallay.

2 !O Q Dklyoulmvcafiebtwithbd)

1 !l A Irhinkso. 1 !2 Q Okay. Youssyyourhink#,- 1 !3 A I’mayisgtomnanbcrifI- ifIactudygot I 1 !4 krontkphoazwhi& IthinkIdid. I’myndlysure

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Q Allright. Didyoucvontuallycomototaktotk 1 messing things up and being upset and blah. blah, blah’ PI&& It m tk telcphm? 2so-

A Tbrot& amuchmaecircuitousroutc+ yes, Idid. 3 Q Did you 80 d did YOU mt with the Presidc& Q AIlright. Andwbcs~ youattkttime? 4 A Yes, Idid. A Iwasathanc 5 Q DidBeuywaveyouin? Q AIlright. Andabcutwkttimofdaywasit? 6 A Yes.

A h4aybcuoundnaanaso. 7 Q Canyoudesaikforusingencraltcrmshowthaz

Q Hmvdidtktwoofyoucomctobcrpcakingontk 8 meeting went? KXd you give him tk gifts, for example?

pbm? Whoplaadthec8lis? 9 A I did. It WBS - it was a really nice visit. A We& Ib&#~ Ihadcakd& ttyormayk 0 Q Okay. What do you mean by a “nice visit”? Eetycalkdnr, mofthctwo, butskputhimwtk 1 A Itwasjustswcst. HclikcdhisChrisanasprcsf# s pboot. 2 andwc~ vayafftctionatcanditjust_ itwasjUEtlllCC

Q Allri@ Andwk~ kppaelintkwmvasatio~~ 3 tokwithhim_ withtkRc3idaM 4 Q Didyoudiscusstkjobsearch?

A WeU, wcbada&@ t Andkwasvuyqq’with 5 A Ibekveso. me. 6 Q Attkti. nx, howdidyouthinIctkjobsearchwas *

Q Whywaskaqqywithyou? 7 going? A EkzauscIbad@ Su~ soupsctandIhadrn& a 8 A Not vczy well. With respect to Mr. Jordan. sti& rolWtyandIkd- youknmv- I- wbfIt1camcto 9 Q Right. Anddidyouwmmunicatetbattatk

)carn, Ithi& istbatasarcsultofmbcingupsctwith 0 Prcsiht?

J3atyandmultioningtktIknewEkanorMondakwastbac I A Yes. Batycakdtbcguardsattknortbwcstgateandsoitbad 2 Q Canyougiveusalitdemorederail? Whatwould jut caused a wbok. big camnotion. 3 youhavcsaidtooncanothcr?

Andkwasjustaugzyatmcandktoldmeitwas 4 A IthinkIsaidthatI- thatIwassupposedtogct nane of my business what - you know, what k was doing and 5 intouchwithMr. Jordantkpreviousweckandthatth& s

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Page 114 that-- you~ ow, that- thathehadneverbecneeatedas pooriybyanyoneelseasItreatedhimandthatkspcntmore time with me than anyone else in the world aside from his family, friends and staff, which I don’t know exactly which category that put m in, but -

Q Okay. Was it a lcmg phone caLl with the Resident? A Maybe half an hour, 45 minutes.

Q Eventually, m arrangements made for you to visit him at the White House?

A Mn~ hmm. Q Are you doing okay? A Yeah. Yes. Q Were you surprised that k would let you come to the White House?

A Yeah, I was - yes, I was a little bit surprised. Q MY?

A Becausenoneoftheothertimesthatwehadreally fought on the phone did it end up resulting in a visit that &Y.

Q Allright. Whataboutthefactthathevfas supposedly meeting with his lawyers all day? Did he say anything about that?

A Hehadinthefight. whenwewerefighting, he said-- you~ ow, hewasangrybccausehesaid,” Ihaveane day to meet with my lawyers and, you know, I’ve got you

PZigCrrc Thursday, August 6, I!? 98

Page 116 1 didn’tworkoutsmd~ nothinghadrtallyhappcncdya 2 Q DidthePrcsidentsaywhathewasgoingtodo? 3 A Ithinkhesaidhewould- youknow, thiswassort 4 oftypicalofhim, tosortofsay,“ Ob1’11talktohim. 5 I’ll get on it.” 6 Q Okay. Didhesayanythingtoyouaboutwhetlxzk 7 had a Chr& mas. prcsmt for you? 8 A Ycskdid

9 Q Whatdidksay? 0 A Hetoldmethatonthephonqactually. 1 Q Allright. Wktdidksayaboutthat? 2 A WeLl, Isaidtohim,“ WeU, howdoyouhavea 3 U& tubas preset? I haven’t read that you’ve gone Chr& mas 4 shoppingyet. ’ Andksaidthatkhadboughtitin 5 vancouvt! r. 6 Q Okay. Didksayatanytimeonthe6thanythiq 7 about a witness list or your king on a witness list? 8 A No. 9 Q Howwerethingsleftwhenyoulefthimontk6th? 0 A Thatkwouldbringm- oh, ourmaztingaxkd

I up-- orwascutshortbythefactthatkhadtokvea 2 meeting with h4r. Bowles, so k told me that k’d give E my 3 Chr& masprcsentanotkrtimeandthatkwouldn’tjakmc 4 aroundandabandmme.

5 Youknow, tbat-- becauseIthinkIrema& edto

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I him, “Well, at the fate we go, I won’t get it ‘til Christmas

2 of ‘98.” So -- 3 MR. EMMICK: I have no more questions about this 4 date and I look at the tim and it looks like it’s 12: 30. 5 THE FOREPERSON: Sol, I think, went to check on

6 smlcthing.

7 MR. EMMICK: Oh, all right. 8 THE FOREPERSON: Did you check on something fol 9 lunch? 1 .O MR. WISENBERG: I have checked. It is lxx. - It’s

I ,l txcnbuc. 1 .2 MR. EMMICK: Okay. AlI right. Well, if this would

I .3 bcagoodtimetotakeabreakforlunch-

1 4 THE FOREPERSON: It’s fine with me. J s MR. EMMICK: Okay. Let’s take an hour- long break

1 6 for lunch.

I 7 THE FOREPERSON: Hour- long.

I 8 MR. EMMICK: Okay. I 9 THE WITNESS: Okay. i !O THE FOREPERSON: Okay. ; !1 MR. EMMICY: Thank you.

II !2 . (Wheupon, at 12: 34 p- m., a luncheon remss was

. 13 . taken.)

; /4 l **** Page 118

1 AFTERNOON SESSION 2 Whazupon. (I: 38 pm.)

3 MONICA S. LEWlNSKY

4 wasrwxlkdasawitncssand, aficrhavingb& nprcviously 5 dulyswornbytbcFonpcrsonofth: GrandJury. rmsnamincd 6 and kstifii furtkr as follows: 7 EXAMINATION (RESUMED) 8 THE WlTNESS: Time for a nap? 9 MR. Eh4h4ICK: Madam F- on. do wc have a quorum? 0 THE FOREPERSON: Yes. we do. 1 MR. EMMICK: Arc that any unauthorized pcrsons 2 pmalt? 3 THE FOREPERSON: Rxc arc aone.

4 Monica, I’d like to ranind you tbat you arc still 5 undaoath.

6 THEwlTNEss: okay. Thanks. 7 BY MR. EMMICK: 8 Q Ms. Lcwinsky. wc just got through speak@ about 9 the Dccanbcr 6th meeting that you kd with the Prcsidmt. !O WhatI’dliintodoisturnours~ tionrocttotbcdatc !1 of Daccmbu 11th. !2 A Mm- hmm. !3 Q DidyouhavcamaringwithVanonJordanonthat !4 day? !5 A Yes, Idid.

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Pw 119!

1 Q W~ youtcUuswbartbatmcUingwas?

2 A Ararmd luachtim. 3 Q Andhowwasthetux& lganangcd? 4 A Byhis-. 5 Q Wbatwartbcpurpo= oftbcmccdag? 6 A Forhimto- Ikamalaftcrwchadtkmccting.

7 forhimtogivcmtsomccontact~ andsomcsugpationof 8 wlmtodowiththsccontactnams. 9 Q W~= YOU~ Y- IO A Fcuajob. II Q Whmyousay” contactnamcs,“ thcsearr: namcsof

12 potalr. ialaDpkl) ms? 13 A Yes.

14 Q Wimtelscdidthetwoofyoutakebout? I5 A Wetallrcdaboutmy- thcfact~ tmymrm’sfiancc 16 atthctimckrKwMr. Jordan. WetalkcdabouttkPx& knt. I7 Wktdscdidwctalkabout? Ithinkthat’sit. 18 Q Allright Didkattpointmakcacamneatto 19 youaboutyourbcingafximdoftkResidenn 10 A Ywkdib 21 Q Wouldyoutllushowtbccxx~ vasationtranspircd 22 frumthatpuint7 23 A Idon’tlanembahowmgottotbispoin~ butat 24 somcpoint, Mr. Jordansaidsoux% ngmmc,” Wcll. you’rca 25 friend of tk Rsidcnt of the United States.”

Page 12U

1 AndIImarkedthatIdidn’t- Ididn’treally

2 bokathimasthcResicknt, tbatIsawhimmofeasaman

3 andzractedtohimmoreasamanandgotangryatbimlikea 4 manandjustaregularpason. T AndMr. JordimaskedmewhatIgotangryattbe .d

6 7 8 9

0 ,l .2 .3 .4 I5 16 17 18 19 !O Ll !2 13 24 Is

Presi& ntabout, soItoldhimwhenhedoeso’tcaUmeeoough orseemceoough.

WewemsortofbanteringbackandforthaboUt thatandtbenbetoldmtbatIshouldn’tgdangxyatthe President because he’s got a iot of - it sounds so stupid - obviously, he has a lot of other more important things and diff1cultthingstodealwiththanaomeone gutingupsetwith him. Andhesugge& dthatifIwasups& tl3atIshouldcalI an& akemyfrusmtioosoutmMr. Jordantioftk Presi& lt.

Imean, ItbinkIshouldjustsaythatitwas all- thiswasallsortofinalighttooe.

Q Isthisameetingduringwhichtbesubjectofyour possibly being in love cropped up?

A %, yts. ~aftcr~ badtkamwsationIwaS justtalkingaboutwithMr. Jordan, besaidtome,” WelI, you know what your problem is?”

AndI~“ what?” He said, “Don’t deny it.” And he said, “You’re in I

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Page 121 So I think I just - probably blushed or giggled, sm& hinglikethat.

Q Howdidthcmcetiqcnd? Whatwcreyougoingtodo andwhatwashegoingtodo?

A IwaspIanniqtosendthelcttesthatkhad sugge& dIwritctothelistofpeopleandksuggestedthat 1cchimandkcepintou& withhin& kccphimappriscd0f wktwashappcningwithmyjobstarch.

Q Anddidyouseadoutthoselcttas? A Yes, Idid. Q- d arr~ tsforsomcintavicws?

A Yes, Idid Q WhatIwanttodoncxt, thcn, isdirectyour atimtiontoafewdayslatcr, fsvualdayslatcr, a wceklatcr, Iguss. Didyoucometohaveatelcphonc a7nvcrsation with the prcsi& nt on I% a! mber 17th?

A Yes.

Q Would you tclI us how that telephone call was how that convcrsat. ion took place?

A Okay. The phone rang unexpectedly at about maybe 2: 00 or 2: 30 and -

BY MS. IMMERGUT: Q Inthemoming? A Right. Inemoming. AnditwastheResident andhecalledsndsaidhchadtwothingstottllmeandthcn

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Page 122 khadtocalImerightback. Sokcalledmelightback.

BY MR. EMMJCK: Q Didheexplainwhyhehadtocallandthencall back?

A Idon’tknow. Hejustwasverybriefwithmeand then he said, WI call you right back.” And he hung up and called back about a minute later.

Q Beforeyougcttotbeactualthingsthathesays rMXt, you mentioned that you uncxpcctIXlly go the call. why were you surprised by the call?

A NormalIy, the Resident wouldn’t call me when Mrs. Clintonwasintown, so- andIusuallywasawarewhen she was out of town, so I that I would sort of be expecting or hoping that k would call. And the call came as a surprise to me.

Q He calIed you back? A Right. Q Thenwhathappcned? A Andktoldmethatkhadtwothingstotellme. ThefvstwastbatBctty’sbrothezhadbeenkiIledina caraccidentandthat- soIrcactedthatandwetalked aboutthatbeing- thatthiswasthesamcbrotberwhohad beenbeatcnupjustafeurmonthsagoandshehadlostha sisterandhermomwasill. WetalkcdaboutBctty’fora little bit.

PageTM Thursday, August 6, 1998

i And then he told me he bad some more bad news. that 2 he had seen the witness list for the Paula Jones case and m! 3 name was on it. 4 Q Did you get an impression from him about when he 5 had found out your name was on tk witness list? 6 A Yes. ImeaqtheimptionIgotbasedonthe 7 artire conversation was that he found out reamtly. 8 Q Wlnmhctoldyouth& wfiatdidbesayabouthaving 9 sznyournameonthewitnesslist? LO A Hetold& citbrolcehishcart. !I Q Tellushowtheconvcrsationwentfromtkre. 12 A Iwas- I’msuE, asyOUcanimagine, Iwasupset i3 andshocked. Hetoldmtbatitdidn’tnazzzuilymeanthat 14 Iwouldbesubpoenatd, butthattbatwasapossibility, and ’

IS ifIweretobesubpnamed, tbatIshouldamtactBettyand 16 letBettylcnowthatIhadnzceivalthesubpoena. 17 I believe that I probably asked him, you know, what 18 shouldIdointhecourseofthatandksuggestcdksaid. 19 “Well, maybe you can sign 8n affidavit.” !O At SOIIX point in the conversation, and I don’t know !I if it was kfoE or after the subject of the affidavit came !2 up, k sort of said, “You know, you can always say you were !3 aaningtoseeB& yorthatyquurcreb~ melctters.” !4 WhichIun& rstoodwasreallyarcmindaofthingsthatwe !S had discussed before.

Page 123

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Page 124 Q Sowhenyousaythingsyouhaddiscussed, sortof ruses that you had developed.

A Right. Imcaqthiswas- thiswassomthing that -- that was instantly familiar to me.

Q Right. A And I lcnew exactly what k meant. Q Hadyoutalkcdwithhimcarlieraboutthesefalse explanations about what you wcn doing visiting him on several ouzasions?

A stveral occasions throughout the entire relationship. Yes. It was the pancrn of the relationship, toso~ ofconcealit.

Q Wkn k said that you might sign an affidavit, what didyouundestandittomeanatthattim?

A I thought that signing an affidavit could range from anywhere - the point of it would k to deter or to pnvcntmefrombcing~ gsedandsothatthatcouldrange from anyhem ktween maybe just somcbow mentioning, you know, innocuous things or going as far as maybe having to deny any kind of a relationship.

Q At some point, did you talk with him about possibly sealing the Paula Jones case?

A Yes. Ihad- Ihadhadathoughtandtknhada conversation with Linda about this and just a way that k couIdsettlethecaseandIsuggscdittohim_

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1 Q Andwhatwasthatway? Notinalotofddail. I My amvusi3tion with tbe Resident. 2 bcr- 2 Right. It scc111s self- cvidcnt, but -- 3 A Thtgistofitis. Itkughtthatf~ t 3 I know. I’m sorry. 4 F& s. Clinton should do tamdhing publicly, mayk on a T. V. 4 That’s all wt. What did you tell Linda? 5 ~orsom& hg. andtaIkaboutbowdifEculttkcasckd 5 WclI, ifIcouldjustjumpback- 6 brmforhaandonkrdaughnzandtktskjustwisbcd 6 YCS. 7 tktkwouldscztkituxiitwouldgoaway. Andtbentk 7 Imcau, Ibad- Lindahadtoldmesometimein-- 8 Rai& lt should UlllIllylllDccd aadunapcctaGygointotk 8 ItIhlctbcsaxmdwzekofDecembertllatsbchadbexl 9 bridrngfwm+ mf& cabrSstatanaittktk- inancffurl 9 subpoaxelintbeF% ulaJcrncscaseendthatsheinten& dto

11 0 ~putthiskhindhim, youknow. againstbisattomcys’ 0 fatonme+ sou. puntilthispoin~ Ihadbant! yingto

1 1 &icekwasgoingtopayMs. Joncswbatcwritwa. s. 1 convince her not to tell, that it’s not anybody’s business.

1, 2 bmver much sbc waned. and so that this case would k OVCT 2 SowficnI- paItofmytcllingkrthattk

1 3 With 3 PrcsidalthadrallrA: ttlatI, too, maybepullcdintothis

1, 4 Q Did tk two of you talk about bow much tk 4 caswasjustscutof- maybeassureherthatifthat

1 5 5atkmaltamountwouklbcofmightbc? 5 happcncd, tkrcwouldbc somamc else denying i4 it wouldn’l

11 6 A Yes. IbclicvcatsomcpointIhadmahonaitbat 6 bejustIindaouttkeal~ saying” Idon’tknowanything

1 7 IkdIccaltiynzadtk- Itbinkskhadlowardkr- 7 about any kind of sclationship between the President and

1 8 tkanounttktskwmIcdtos500, ooooroomdhiagbwu~ 8 Monica 1’ 9 ksaid.“ Itboughtitw8samiIIionortwomiUondoIlars.” 9 Q Kindofaunificdfmntorsomctbglikethat?

21 0 AndIth& ttbatwasvays~ tbatk 0 A Exactly. 2 1 vmtddn’tknowsbcbad- youknow. tbathalawyers- or 1 Q Allright_ Howwastkconvc& ticmlcftwith 2 2 hishvyushadwttoldhimthatskhllowacdkrrcqucrt 2 Linda? 2 3 for money. Or I don’t know how you Say that kgally, 3 A Irhinktbatule’dtaIkaboutittbcncxtday. 2 4 ~$ atcvcr it is that sk did. 4 Q Didyougctsubpomaai? 2 5 Q Right. Demand. probably. 5 A Ycs, Idid

Page 126 Page 122

1 A Tk danand was lomr. I Q whcndidyougusubpomacd? 2 Q Right. 2 A OnFriday. tk1Qthofhcanbcr. 3 A We also talked in this conversation about k 3 Q Canyoudlusaboutwtutyoubdicvcyouwerc 4 nrnrioncdtbat- ksaidk’dtxyandsaifBenycould 4 sub&? 5 wmc in on tk wakcad to giivc me my Cluistmas~ prscnts and 5 A 1kIicvcitwasarmmd3: 00,4.$ 0intk 6 I told him that was out of tk question. to - you know. 6 aficmoal. I think cbsrr to 3zoO. 3: 30. 7 ktEknyk. 7 Q Okay. Wkrewa~ yuuscrvcd? 8 Q Bccausc kr brotkr bad just ban kilkd right? 8 A AttkPentagon. 9 A Right. 9 Q 0n~ Uyou& lIusbowitbappaxd? Didstmrooc 1 0 Q AU right. About bow long was tk entire phone 0 call you? 1 1 call? OrIgucsstshnicaUyitwouldktksccondpbone 1 A Yes. IrcchcdacalIinmyofficefrantk I 2 can. 2 galtk$ Imawhowastu* tksubpanabJmc. HciIlfanSd 1 3 A MaykahaIfmhour. MaykIcotddjustsaysiztcc 3 mkbadas~ farmc. Ima& asthktobim, asking 1 4 youaskcdmccarl& timtitwashimsuggcstingrbatIwwId 4 hhwlYyIwaSbCiUgNbpoavad and1kdnoideawktwas 1 5 cmtactBettyifIHasubpaaaadtbatledmctoklimk 5 goh3= 1 6 didn’tthinkIwouldknibpoenacdthstsoonbccausckknm, 6 Whenkgavcmtksubpoam, ksrrgges* dIcaIJ 1 7 scrty was going to k out mu know. k asstmxd obviously 7 Ms. Jones’ attornys. which I ma& a camnm ttohimthnt 1 8 tktBcttywouldbcoutfortkwcckortwowadrswithtk 8 that’srKusom& iagImnrlddo. 1 9 ~apcctcd loss of her brotkr. 9 Q WhenyuuactuaUydidgetetwktwasyour 2 10 Q Right. 0 nxll reettioa inside? 2 1 A Sothatwaswhatkdmctobcljevekbadjust I A Iburstintoears. Itwas- itwasvayscaty. 2 2: 2s 2.

‘I

2 folmd out.

3 Q AftutkcaIlwasaxkiLdidyoucallanyoneelse? 4 A Yes. About a half an hour later. I calkd Linda. 5 Q Wktdidtktwoofyoutalkabout?

2 Imca& itjust- tatoflnyworst~ aIkd 3 tho@ ltmltitktpoin: waskingsu~ in& isca. S I soIwasprcayllpe 5 Q Youcoukin’tcaUBcnykcaweButywas~

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I A Right.

z Q -inmouminghsdf. Wbodidyoucail? 3 A IcakdMr. John. I Q Fmmwktphatcdidyouc4lMr. Jordatt? 5 A bapayphm 6 Q Clasetowh~~ ya~ wercpavcdtbtnearat~~ 7 phKm8uorud’l B A No, 1thinkitwastkpayphewbichkdmvntk 9 kll~ myoliiiwbi& iskhdofklhvaybctwamwhxI D wasscrwdandmyofficc. 1 Q Andwhydidyouuseapaypkac? 2 A BacauseIwascryiugandI- Inran, I- my

3 offitkwaymyoffiiiSsaupismydc5kwasintk 4 samemanwithfourafivcotkrpalplc, soIcoulln’tvcry 5 wcllkveanykhdofaprivalcdiscus.+ xt. 6 Q WktdidyoukzUMr. Jordau? 7 A We& Idott’trat= b= tit1toldllim. I& 8 cryingandbcdidn’txan~ undastand~ sokjust- 9 kjusttoldmcto~ tohiroffiararnd~~. 0 BY Ms. IMMERciuT: 1 Q Did you tell him you’d baen rubpacllacd?

2 A Iprobablydid. Ijust~ ImauLIdon’t- 3 I don’t ranauk, I just rananherh& gonthephonecrying 4 and him saying, “I cap” u& rstand you I can’t understand 5 you.”

Page i3a

1 Q You got off the phone. What did you do next? 2 Did you finally go to Vexnon Jordan’s office?

3 A Yes. I tried to compose myself and I went into tk 4 offtee. I told Mr. - I believe I told Mr. Baum or some 5 OtherpeopleintheoffuzthatIhadan~ cyandI 6 needed to leave. I went home, sort of put myself together, 7 and went to Mr. Jordan’s office. 8 Q when you got to h4r. Jordan’s office, did you have 9 to wait outside for a bit? 3 A Yes 1 Q Inlikeareceptionarea? 2 A Iwaitedintbelobby, likeIalwaysdid. 3 Q About how long did you wait in tbe lobby? 4 A I don’t teally remember. 5 Q AtsomepoinfItakeit, youdidactuallymeet 6 with Mr. Jordan? 7 A Yes. 8 Q How did tk conversation with Mr. Jordan progress? 9 A First, IeameinandIexplainedtobimclearly 0 thatIhadbeensubpocnaedandthatIwasupsetandshortly

1 after, IthinkmaykIsaidIdidn’tknowwbatIwassupposed 2 todo, Ididn’tkveananorncy, IthinkIwasrambling. 3 shortly after I bad arrived at Mr. Jordan’s +fitx, 4 krec& vedaphoneeallandIsteppedoutoftkoffiee. :5 Q Didkaslcyoutostepoutoftbeofftce?

Page 131

1 A ItbinlcImaybaveoffered. Thatwassortofpar 2 for tk course. And I waited for him while k was on the 3 pboocoutsi& hisoffiioeandwtrenIcamebackin, kplaceOa 4 callto_ IQn’t~ owifitwasrightaftaIcamebackin, 5 buratsolnepoinfwhcnIcamebackin, kplaceda011to 6 Mr. FrankCattcr. 7 Q Now, wknyousteppcdout, ktookoneealland 8 tbcnyoustcppedbackin, didktellyou~ ok’dbecnon 9 tbephonewith? 0 A No.

1 Q Allright. HeplacesaealltoFrankCatter. 2 Do~ uknowwkdzrktalkedtoFmnkCarterinperson 3 ordoyouknowwbetkrkjustleftamessageordoyou 4recall? 5 A Idon’ttiyICCSdl. 6 Qh-

7 A Ob, ksaidsometl@ about- welI, Iknowk 8 refandtoMr. CartaasMr. Carter, soidon’tkaowifhe

9 wastalking- Idon’trcalIy rrmmbcrifkwas& ingto 10 Mr. Carterorkwastalkingtosomeone clst, but it scared 11 mbecawIthoughtforMr. Jordantokrcfcrringto

12 sameoneelseasMr. somthin& tbat- Isortoftbougbtk.

13 mrrstkabigdeal. 14 Q Allright. Whenyou& ttotbeme& ingwitb 15 Mr. Jordan, did you bring the subpoena with you?

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1 A Yes, Idid. 2 Q DidyoushowittoMr. Jordan? 3 A Ihclicveso. 4 Q Whatmosttroubbdyouahoutthelquageofthc 5 subpoena and wkt tk subpaxta bad cakd for you to produce? 6 A Thcthiagthatahnacdmcwasthatitaskaifora 7 hatpin.

8 Q Okay. Andwhydidtktalarmyou?

9 A BecauseIthoughtthatwasaveryrpccificgiftaod 0 inthislistofgifts.~ dsesmoedtok~ t

1 gcarricandtbcnithadhatpin. whichscrramcdoutatmc 2 kcausethatwastkf~ giftthattheRsidmthadgiva. l 3 meladithadoamG@ kance. 4 Q WknyoushowedMr. Jadanthcs& pama, didk 5 makcanyranarkahoutanyoftkthingstimtwueeaUedfdl 6 A Yes. WknImcntionedtohim. Ithink, ahotttthe 7 hat pin. k said. “Oh, don’t T ahout it. This is a 8 vanilla subpoaw this is a standard subpoam.” somhng 9 like that. Gamic subpoena maybe. 0 Q Didyouktunvwktk~ t, avaniUaorstandard 1 subpazta tkt asks for hat pins?

:2 A We& whatIun& astoodthattomeanwasthat- 3 thatwhatkvmshyiogtosayistbacwasnothiogoutof

thcordinatyabout this subpoena. 14

Is Q 1st~. IgusswtmtI’mtryingtoguatisdoyou

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Page 133 think k was trying to imply that all subpoenas ask for that or that all subpoenas in the Paula Jones case asked for that

or all subpoenas -- what was k - from your point of view, what~ ktryingtoconvey?

A Irhinkwhatk- Ithinkwhatkwasuyingto cQnveywi?& stopworrying, thatthisisnotsometh& outof the - you know, out of the realm of possibility of what

mightkinasubpoam.

Q All right. Were youmssuxd by that?

A A htie. 1 -- 1 sort of felt that k wasn‘ t - I mean, k didn’t really understand what I was saying.

Q All right. Did you have any discussion with him about letting the P& dent know that you’d been subpoenaed?

A Yes. IaslcedMr. JordantoinformtkPresident. Q How didyouaslc? How often? Howvigomusly? A I- Imean, IaSkedhimto- topicasemakesttre thatktoldthcPresi& nt. Hesaidkwasgoingtosutk President that night, so -

Q All right. Did the subject of a possible sexual relationship between you and the President corm up in tk conversation?

A Yes, it did. Q Tell us how it came up. A Mr. Jordansaidtometbatthem-“ Thereare

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Page 134 two important questions” or ‘TLC are two important - I8 I think, ‘Two imporlant questions that are ICiati to tbc case: Did you bavc sex with the Prcsidcnt you know. or did bc ask?” And I said no to both of tbosc.

Q Whatdidyouinterprethimtobeaskingwhmhc asked you those questions?

A WclLIthoughthc- Igtxss- canlstepback for a minute?

Q Sux. Up until a point that we’ll get to. which is Dccanbcr31stIsortof- mainly. Ithi& frommy discussions with Linda. I was undu the impression that - thath4r. JordankindofkncwwitbawinkandanodtbatIwas baving a rclationsbip with the F%& cknt. that it was never - bc and I never discussai it but I thought it might bc possibk.

I’m. you know. a young woman. sort of coming to su him, tbc Pxsidcnt’s mcntional mc. But I also was xn? of under this influmce of Linda saying to me. “Of course hc knows. of course be knows. of course Ilc knows.”

sowhulhcaskcdmcthoscquHions. Itbougbtbc was asking mc, saying essentially What are you going to sayr’ not nuxssarily asking m difutly what - you know, ‘What arc the answers to tbtsc questions?” More ‘what are you going to reply in rrgard to the cast?”

Q Now. was your intcxpretation of his questions basal

Pagea Thursday, August 6, 1998 Page 135

I entirely on your assumption about what k knew? Or was 11 2 basedinpartonhowkaskedthequestions? 3 A Ithinkitwashasedmcreinpartonmyassumptlons 4 ofwbatkkmw. 5 Q Was there aa@ ing unusual or sqgestive about how 6 kaskedthcqutstion. s? 7 A No.

8 Q Andhowdidyouanswerthequestions? 9 A Noandno. IO Q Okay. Didyoutrytomakeitcleartohimatall II thattherewasmoretothestorythanjustnoandno? 12 A Not at that point. 13 Q Attbattimc, didyoumakeanangcmentstomeet 14 withtkattomeywhoyouwouldget, Mr. FrankG& cr? I5 A Yes. AfterMr. Jordaamadetheammgerocntswith 16 Mr. carta, ktoldmttokathisofficeat-- Ithink 17 1 l: oo or 10: 30 on Monday.

I8 Q Allright. HowdidthemectingwithMr. J& an I9 end? Wastkreanyrefercncetoahug? !O A Oh, yes. I’msoxry. II Q That’s okay. !2 A WknIwasleaving, Iaskedhimifkwouldgive !3 thetidentahugformc. Ibuggcdhimagainaboutmaking !4 suxktoldtkResi& nt. Andsoksaid,“ Idun’thug 15 men.” I*“ wel& okay.”

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5 6 I 8 9 IO Ii 12 13 14 I5 I6 17 I8 19 !O 11 u !3 14 15

All light. But-

Page 130 All right. Did you call Linda Tripp aftcnvxds? Yes, I did. Whatwasthcpurposeofyourcall? Ina- toletkrlcnowthatIhadbccnsubpocnacd. Tell us how that conversation went. It probably would k impossible for anyone! who didn’t- whohaslisteWdtothattapetofoIlow. Iwas beyond paranoid.

IhadnoideahowIhaclgottenontothewitncss listand& n, ofcoursc, beensubpoena& andIwasthink& atthatpointthatmaykmyphooewastappedorsomeonchac nadmye- mailsorsomthing. ButintlGkingthatmyphone mightktappcdIsortof~ tdtocxplaintothistoLinda thatIhadlxznsubpoenacdinaveiledfa& ion.

Q How did you do that? What do you mean? A Iuseddifferentemermries. Ithinklikeit wasamovieoritwasaboak, tryingtodiscussthings. I thinkIsaidsometh@- “IrmeiVedtheflO~“ tl@ gtO intimarethatIhadreceivedthesubpoena. So-

Q EvartuaUy, didyoudropthcsortofd& uisedway oftalkingandjusttalkaboutthesubpoena, ordoyou recall?

A I don’t helieve I did. I don’t really rememkr, I Page 133 - Page 136

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1 though.

2 Q How wez thirrgs left with Linda? 3 A Shewashavingapartythenextday, sowemade 4 plansthat- orIsu@ csEdthatIcomcarly2Lndwecould 5 discussthisandthatiwouldklphasctupforhcr~ b 6 party. I’m son- y. 7 Q Hcrdumbpzuty? Allright. Well, we’llskipthe 8 dumbpartyforaow. 9 A I’msorry. 0 MR. EMMICIK: That’s all right. 1 MR. WISENBERG: I have a quick question. 2 MR. EMMICK: Okay. A dumb party question?

3 MR. -ERG: Not about th: dumb parry. 4 MR. EMMIcK: Allright. 5 BY MR. WISENBERG: 6 Q Whenyouwuedoingthcfiowersbit, the@ okbii

7 howwasshe- you’retlyingtospcakincodetoher, howwas 8 sheresponding? 9 A Idon’t& yrtmmba. IjuStsOrtOfremember 10 her not unw aad me being frustrated. “Hello?

11 Understand. We justtalkedabout this.” 12 A JUROR: Excuse me. May I ask a question? !3 MR. EMMICK: Sure. Absolutely. Yes. 14 A JUROR: Did you ever find out how the Paula Jones 5 lawyerslcnewabouttkhatpin, etcetera? :

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I Q fight.

2 A Which I found out tie did. So I -- so I told

3 Mr. Jordanthat- lsaidIwasamczmedthatmaybe- thar 4 someonehadliswedinonphonecallsandMr. Jordanki. 5 “Well, you know, so what? Tht President’s allowed to call 6 people.” 7 And I said_ “Well, we’ve had phone sex.” 8 And so Mr. Jordan said, “Well, what’s phone sex?” 9 And so I Eli& “Well, you know what phone !xx is.” 0 And k said, “No, I don’t I’m just an old man.

1 Idcm’tkDowwhatphonescxis.” 2 Anditwaskindofthis- discussionthatway. 3 Q Didyoudiscussthektpin? 4 A Wedidn’tdiscusstkhatpin, butIbrought- 1 5 hadputto@ crsortofan asxrmn% ofthingsthatlwas 6 plaImingtohandovertoMr. CaltcrasbciiinEsponseto 7 thesubpocna, sortofthingsthatIwould- considered 8 gift& beiIgthecbristrnascardstktIhadr# xivedframtbe 9 WhiteHoust, I~ acopyofthePnsident’sbook, ’Hopearu 10 History,“ whichkhadsignedtomcwhichhadavery !I innocuous sort of inscription. And I think brought some i2 innocuous pictures with M. Sa I showd those ta Mr. Jordan 13 Q Whatdidyousayaboutthositem?

:4 A Iknowthat- IthinkIwasalittlemoxespecifii 15 inmyprofferahoutwhat- Imean, whatI remember saying

1 THEWlTNESS: I- fromwhatI’vereadinthe 2 press, yes. 3 A JUROR: But just from any otk~ source? Did you

4 eversuspectmayheLin& or- 5 THE-: Ihad- icametostarttosuspect 6 her, butnotinanywaythat-- thatitreallyhastumedout 7 tok. Nottothatdegnx. 8 A JUROR: Thank you. 9 BY MR. EMMICK: 0 Q Let’s tum our attention, then, to December 22nd ,I whichisthe& ythatyoumetwithFrankCartersmdIthink ,2 you had said that you were going to meet with Vernon earlier. 13 A Mm- hmm. 14 Q Tell us about that. The Vernon part. I5 A Okay. Withal1 the& ails? 16 Q Well, fust, wkn were you supposed to meet with 17 Vernonandthendidyouplaccanothcrcalltohim? 18 A Right. I- I-- Iasked-- I~& danthe 19 morning of the 22ad to see if I could unne to see Mr. Jordan !O earlier. And I was - I was a little concerned. I thought !l maybe k didn’t really understand or -- fully understand whal 12 itwasthatwashappeningherewithmekingsubpoenxdanc 13 whatthisreallymeant. SoIcametosecMr. Jordanearliex 24 andIalsowantecltofmdoutifkhadinfacttold& 25 President that I had b& n sub-.

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now~ that- yw~ ow, fhatl~ Of~ himtbatthis iswhntIums@ ngu, respmdtofortbcsubpoaw.

Q Wdl. didyutbrhgmmythgtbatcouldbnvc

mspon& dtotksub~ tbetday7 A No. No. Q DidywwytoconvqtoMr. Jcadmtbcfactthat it wasn’t cvaythirrg?

A Ithinklmi@ have.

Q M& m raankhowyouwouldlmvcconvquJit?

Wouldithavcbernvcry~ pnssfyorwoulditbavc; boen iaupkdly?

A Mae~ plicdly. BY Us. IMMERGUT: Q DidyoudlMr. JordanthattkP& dmtbad ixKiardgivalyourlmtpiIl?

A Idid, butlhadtoldhimthatonFri& yandthat was what prompted tbc sort of IIbis is fi vanilla rcspomc.”

MR. EMMICK: Lurncsbowyo~ thctitmproffu- THEWITNJSS: Okay. MR. EMMiCk - and see if that bclps you mall c~ ifyouknowwkhrornotwkayouwroeitit’saccurn~

Whkvc’Aookingatistktopafpqc6- cwyoac~~~ copy.

THE WrmEss: okay. Ttmh somcspaog 25 mismkc5.

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I MR. EMMlCK: Wby don’t I just mad out loud. This 2 para8taph starts. “On tk day Mr. Jordan drove Ms. Lcwinsky 3 to Mr. Cat& s off&. sbc sbowui Mr. Jordan tk items she 4 was producing in response to tk subpoena. Ms. Lcwinsky 5 boliWssbcmalkitclo3rthisvAsnot~ skbad

, 6 tbatcouldmspondtotbesubpoaia, butsbctbougbtitwas I enott& to satisfy. Mr. Jordan mark no coulmmt about whaha 8 or not wbat Ms. Minsky brot@ t was right or wrong. 9 h&. Jordan drove Ms. Lowinsky to Mr. Cattcz’s offta.

11 0 introduced tban and kft.”

1 1 BY MEL EMMICK:

1 2 Q Now, having mad that to you. does that mfmsb

1 3 your rccolkction about what was said to him?

1 4 A Itbink1wouJdbaveimphedit.

1 5 Q Yes.

1 6 A Thatthiswastt’tcvayth& I- Idm’trca&

I 7 mnanber if I specifically said - and from wding this. 1 8 itdasn’tmakcmetbinkIncccssatilyspcki& allysaid 1’ 9 ‘This isn’t evaytbing, but it’s enough to satisfy,” but 2 0 I could have said that. 2 1 Q Atthctimcyouwrotetbis. wereyoutryingtobc 2 2 comphcly truthful and accurate? 2 3 A Iwas~ ngtobccotnpktely- ys. Iwas 2 4 compktcly truthful and accurate. I’m just also whik I’m 2 5 marl@ this now, it doesn’t necessarily indicate to me

Page 142 that - that what I’m saying here is sort of a direct quote of what I said.

Q Do you remember what Mr. Jordan’s reaction was? There it’s written that he didn’t indicate whether he thought it was right or wrong, but more genetally, how did he maet when you tried to convey to him that this may not be cvety& ng?

A TherewereoftentimeswhenIwaswithMr. Jordan that k would have no reaction at all. He would kind of do J this “Mmmph” thing. 1 Q I’m not sum how the court mpotter is going to get

1 that. Is that a grunt? 1 A And so-- I remember feeling in general with 1 Mr. Jordan and this subject matter, just not knowing. Do 1 you understand what I’m trying to say? Is this clear? And

1 not really ever getting much of a reaction from him.

1 Q Did you take from his lack of reaction that he did

1 understand or was it still ambiguous in your mind?

1 A IthinksometimesIthoughtkunderstoodand 2 sometimes I thought it was ambiguous. 2 Q Okay. Did the subject of phone sex come up again 2 in your umversation with Mr. Jordan? 2 A Aside from what I mentioned before? 2 Q Yes. Did you explain to him what phone sex was at 2

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A I think it - at - I don’t think I said it. He might have said - kuow. is it -- uh -- this is embarrasstn8 1 Hmm. Ithinkk- it’shard. Ithinkhe-- uh-- might have given SOM sugg& on as to what he thought phone sex wasandIagreed. Isthat-

Q ‘Ihat’sfrac.

A - fair?

Q That’s fine.

A Bythistime, hadyouutpectedthePresidentto call you?

A hh- hmm. Yes. MR. Eh4MICK: I’m sorry? AJUROR: &fortyougoou, canyouaskherwhat doesthatman?

hfR. RvIMICK: Whatdoesphonesex- A JUROR: No, what did k say? MR. EhlMKK: Ithinkthegrandjurorisaskingfor more detaiI.

THEWIRJESS: IfIrememhereormetIy, Ihelieve thatksaid- ormaybeIsaidsomthinglike- youknow. “He’s taking care of business ononeendandI’mtakingcare ofbusinessonauotkr.” Doesthat-

BY MR. WISENBBRG:

Q DOYOU mmemher which one of you said it? A WImmI’msayingthatnow, Ithi. nkIsaidit,

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Doesthat answu your question7

A JUROR: (Nods affimativciy.)

BY MR. EMMCK: Q DidyouupacttbeRePidmttocaUyou? A Yes. Idid. Q Isthat~ youwatb~ oraskingVanonso muchaboutwbdhcrkbadtoldthePtcsidmt7

A Idon’tknow. Maybe.

QMright.

A IthinkIjustwantitomakesumthaRcsidait knew.

BY MS. Ih4MERm

Q ~tyou~~ Nbpoenwd

A Right. BecausoIwassupposadtocah- youknow, intkcvatttbatIwassubpomaal, Iwassupposadtoha~ CalkdEknyand- so-

BY MR. EMMICK Q I’mgoingtoaskaqm& xtthatwillsuggcstwbat assumptionsyou~ makingaboutwbatVanonknaworditk’t Wbywouldyoufselcomfortabkmlk@ withVanonJordan

about phone su? A I wasn’t cmfortabk talking to Vernon Jnrdan about phcmc su.

Q WY. I

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J A Iwasscared. 2 MR. EMMICK: okay. 3 MR WISENBERG: Questions? 4 IvREMMICK: Yes? 5 BY MR. WISENBEKG: 6 Q Didyoumyontk22ndthatyoushowedtoVemon 7 JordantbegiftsyoubringingtoFrankCartu? 8 A Yes. 9 Q Okay. Wasahatpinamongtkthingsyoushowedto IO Vernon Jordan? !l A No.

12 Q Butyouhadi. n~ tohimont. he19ththatthc 13 Presi& nthadgivenyouaktpin. 14 A Yes. IS MR. WISENBEKG: lknk you. 16 BYMR. HMMICK: .7 Q Atsomepoint, youwuittoFmnk& ters’s. .8 A bfh- hmUl. YCS.

.9 Q TelluswhathappatedwhenyougottoFrank !O Carter’s, !J A We arrived at Mr. Carter’s office and Mr. Jordan !2 andIsatdownonthesofa MrCartercameout. Mr. Jordan !3 introduced us and left.

!4 Q Inyourdisct& ssionswithMr. Carter, whatwasthe !5 majorpointtktyouweretryingtomakc? Whatwasthebig

Page 146 1 thingyouweretryingtoamveytoMr. Carter? 2 A That there was absolutely no reason why I should 3 have been subpoenaed in this case.

4 Q Okay. And -- 5 A And that I certainly did not have a relationship 6 withthePresident. 7 Q Yousaidthattohim. 8 A Idon’tthinkIsaidtbosewords, butthatwaswhat 9 1wastryingtoconveyandcertainlywhenaskedthose .O questions, that’s what I answemd. ,I Q Did you discuss with him how you could get out of .2 thedeposition? .3 A Yes.

I4 Q Tell us what you talked about. Maybe that would k .5 theeasierwaytogo. 86 A Okay. I told Mr. Carter I really didn’t want to k ,7 dragged into this, I didn’t - I thought Paula Jones’ claim 18 wasbunkandIdidn’twanttokassociatedwiththecase. I 19 belicveIsuggestedmaybcthatIcould_ maybe1asktdhim !O ifIcouldsignanaffidavitoristhatsomethingtodo. !J Hesaidthatthefirststep- toholdoffonthat !2 andthatthefvststepiskwouldtrytotalktothc 13 auomeys for Paula Jones and find out what it is, why !4 they’re subpoenaing me and where it is that they’re going 15 with this and tbat maybe rme option might be is k could J

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2 !3 ingcacral, RrCnifIhadn’tbeenalowlevelpolitical 2 !4 appointee, I tbought it was probably appropriate to align 2 !5 myself with the Resident’s side, being that that’s whom

Page 148 J sideIwasonandtherewasnoquestioninmymind.

Page 147 J arrange for them to interview me, just kind of do a bncf 2 interview, versus a deposition. 3 Q Didyoudiscusswithhimthcsuhpoenainsofarasit 4 requested items? Did you, for example, go through and talk 5 about what items were called for? 6 A Yes, wedid. Yes. AndIsaidnotoeverythm8 7 untilwegottothegiftsandthcnIsortofhnncdover~ t 8 itwasthatIhadbroughtwithmethatIthought~ t0 9 thegifts. Andthatwasit. 0 Q Was there any mention made by either of you of 1 BobBmmctt? 2 A- Yes. 3 Q Tell us what was said. 4 A IrequestedofMr. CaRerthatkgetintouchwith 5 Mr. Bennettandjusttobeintouchwithhimandtolethim ,6 lrnowthatIhadbccnsubpocnacdiathiscaseandI~ ’t 7 knowwhy. 8 Q Why did you request that Mr. Carter contact 9 h&.& nnett? !O A BecauaeIthoughtinthe- howdoIexplainthis? !I Soltofinthestoryorrol~ thestorythatIwasgiving !2 to Mr. Carter and beii a low level political appointee and,

, i

2 Q Isanotherwayofsayingthatyouwuettyingtc 3 sendamessagetothePresidentortoMr. Bennett? 4 A NottothePresident. Heknew. Imean, thc 5 presidaltknew, youknow? so- 6 Q SoitwasmoreamessagetoMr. Bermett? 7 A Ijust- tome, tbatseemed- Imean, Ithinlc- 8 youhavetolookatthisfromthepointofviewthatlwasa ’ 9 political appointee. And so - 0 Q What does that imply for you? 1

I 1 A Formc, tbatmeansthatthe X. asotlyoU’milYthis J 2 job is you work for this administration and that you’re J 3 politically aligned with this administration and every&@ J 4 youdoisintheheStintuestsofthe~ on~

I 5 ultimately, the President. And that’s where your goal and

1 6 your focus should k.

1 7 Q Howwerethingsleft? Whatwaskgoingtodoand

I 8 what were you going to next?

1 9 A Mr. Carterwasgoingtogetintouchwiththc 2 !O attomeys for Paula Jones and get in touch with Mr. Bennett 2 !J Andkwasgoingtosendmearetain~ letter. Andm’dk 2 !2 intouch. 2 !3 Q I& mc tkn ask you the following. You had earlier 2 !4 indicated that the Resident said that k had a Christmas 2 !5 present for you.

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A Mm- hmm. Yes. F Q DidyouevermakecontactwithBettyCtiti

1 or& rtomakc rtrrangaacnts to pick up the prcscat?

I 5 5 I 3 P 1 I

2 1 1 5 5 7 8 ? 3 1 2 3 4 5

A Yes. Q Tellusaboutthat. A IcalledBettyafterChristmasto~~ hoWshc~ doing and find out how her holiday was and to ask her -- or

to1etherknowthattbeResidenthadmntiooedtomthat hehadaChristmasprscntformtand, yOUknOw, totouch basewithhimtoscifhe- whatkwantaltodo, ifk want& to get together.

Soshecalledmebackandtoldmctocometothe White House at 8: 30 in tbe morning on Sunday, the 28th of Deamber.

Did you? Yes, I did. All right. Betty waved you in? Yes. Ataboutwhattimewasit, ifyoucanEmembcr? 8: 30. wbenyougottbere, whathappeaKd? 1thinktbzPresidentwasalreadythgc. Hewas justcomingtotheOvalOf% eandBettyandtbcRcsident andIwereintkOvalOfficeandthiswasthefirsttime1 got to meet Buddy.

2 3 4 5 6 7

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Page 1% So we played with Buddy in the off& and k was running around the carpet. And I had brought a small Christmas present for Buddy. And so the three of us were just talking and goofing off. And then the. president and I wentintotheba& studyandhcgavememyChristmas preSent%

Q Howlongwereyouinthebackstudywithtlx President?

A Maybe about 45 minutes to an hour.

Q what was the Christmas present or presents that he got for you?

A Everything was packaged in a big Black Dog - or

big canvass bag from the Black Dog store in Martha’s Vineyard. Ancihegotmcamarblebear’sheadcan% g, sort of - you know, a little sculpture, I gutss, maybe.

Q Was that the item from Vancouver? A Yes. l’hcnhegotmeabigRockettesblanketfrom Christmas of ‘95 or ‘96, I think. He got me a Black Dog stuffed animal that had a little Black Dog T- shirt on it.

He got me a small little box of chocolates, cbny chocolates, andthenhegotmesomesunglassestbatwerca jokebecauscIhad-- Ihadteasedhimforalongtimabout the different sunglasses that he was wearing in public.

AndsotknIboughthimanonnalpairof sunglassts, andsowe: hadjustsoRofhad-- this~ along

1 Nnn; wj& evhthus, sokbougbtmctksercallyfunny

2 hkingsun& sscsandmbothwmputtingtkmonand

3 joking around goofw off.

4 So- I’mvyingtothinkwbatdsc. CanIlookat

5 tklist?

6 MR. EhMICK Sure. FcelmC.

7 THEWITNESS: Oh. Hcgotmcapinthatbadtk-

8 mostofmyCkistnwprcscntswcxsortofNwYorktbm= d

9 sokeotmcapinthathadthtNmYorkskylinconit. I

0 think tkt’s it. We& it’s a lot so - not just that’s it.

1 BY h4R. EMMICK:

2 Q Now, youtmdmahxxdcarlicztktyouvexc

3 ~abouttkfacttbattksubpocnacovaultihat

4 pin.

5 A hh- hm.

6 Q Didyaudiscusstbatconaxnwitbhcsidaxt

7 Chroll?

8 A Yes. We- mrcaUyspcatmaykaboutfive- no 9 morctkntmminu~ talkingakuttkpaulsJoncscaseon 0 tbisdayand- doyouwantmttotalkabouttkhatpinor

1 tkt@ odoftimc?

2 Q Tkwholepcriodoftimc, 1suppose.

3 A Ibrougbtuptksubjcctoftkcasckcause1was

4 coafx& aboutkwIhadbcenbmughtintotkcascand~

5 put~ tkwitmslist. SoIaskcdhimbowk& o@ tIgat Page 151

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2 3

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5 Page 15‘

PutonthcwitmslistendkoD~ mck~~ ttbatmaybt itwastbatwonUa fmmthc summerwithKathkalWii. whicb I~ tDkLihdaTripp, ormavbc- ksaidmaybtsomof

tbCUllifarmd- msybctbCUIlif~ OfflCUS.

Wetalkcdabouttkt. ImahmcdthatIhadban xwxunalabouttkbatpinbcingontksubpaaaandksaid tkttbathndsartofcona7ncdhimehandaskozlmcifI bad~~ anyonctbatkbadgivcamcthisktpinandIseid no.

Q Tbatwasfalse

A CorruX Ya. WharinfactIkdtoldpcop~ about tk hat pin.

Q RW.

A Lct’sse. AndtbmatsanepointIs6idOhim, “wd& yfnlkIKnv~ skUldI- maykIlkuldputtbtgiftr aWayolhdCIllyklUC somewhSlxgivGtbantoto maykBeny.” Andkwxtofaaid- Ithinlrklesporrdad ~?‘ tknow~ or” Lctmethinkabouttkt.” Andkfttbat topic.

Q Whcayousaid” tbegifts.“ wktdidyoumcanby Ibcgifts”?

A Imcantalltbcgihshatkbadgi~ mt. Q Allright. Doyouthinktbatyau’rctkoocwho C% l% UpWithBcay’SnamC?

A I’mnot100pawtsw, butwknI~~

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callfrnm& tty, Iwasn’tsurprisedthatitwasBetty call& sothat’swhatlaulsIl% tobelievethatImighthave suggested it.

Q Okay. Didyoudiscusswiththcl’rcsi~ tthefact tbatyouwenplaImingtosignanafIidavit?

A Imighthavemmtionaiit, butIdcm’tthink- we really didn’t spend very much time an this subject.

Q Allright ~youwalkedintithoutmanygifts, youwacgoingtowalkoutwithabagofgifts.

A Mm- hmm. Q Okay. Diditstrkyouasunusualtbatwhcnyou hadasubpoamcalIingforyout0produegiftstheResideDt isgivingyouabagofgifts?

A Attktime, itdidn’tstrikemeasunusuaI. Q Okay. Andwhyistbat?

A Inmrtboughtaboutit. I& nJwas- I, was- Ihadstruggledforalongtimtbefo~ theilth-- or Ishouldjustsay-- Iguessafewdaysbtf~ c28tbthat ifIwasgoingtos& thePresidenfifIshouldtcllhimor notthatLindaknew. AndIdeci& dnotto.

AlldsoI- 1thoughtthi. smightbethelasttime IsawhimbeforeIwcnttoNewYorkandIwantcdittobca reallyniavisifsoIwas- I- ha~~ idednotto tellhimabout~~ Ikindofdi~‘ tevenwanttogotoo farthereingettingmiIeddownintbcdiscussion0fthecaS.

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Q All right. when you left the White House. did anything unusual happen with respect to your E- pass?

A Yes. Well, I had a visitor’s pass.

Q Visitor’s E- pass, I guess.

A Isthatwhat- Q A visitor’spass? A Visitor’s - I don’t know. I know it is a visitor’s pass. Betty escor@ d me out and I realized that I leftthepaEsintheoffla, so& ttytoldmethatshewould calldowatotheguardstationandletthcm~ owthatlwas fineandIhadju. stleftthepasssomewtrae. -

Q byou lunemberwhatgateyouusedwhenyouleft the White House?

A Ib& cvcitwasthesmth~ gatc. Q DidyouhcarfromBettylatcrthatday?

A Yes, Idid. Q Wereyousu@ sedtobcarfromher?

A No. Imean, Iwasn’t~ risedthatIwasbearing fromBetty. IthinkIwasalittlesurpriszdtosortofget 0 the natme of this phone call wben tbe President could have I just said right then and there, “Well, yeah, I think, you 2 know, why don’t you give them to Betty, that’s a good idea.” 3 But I wasn’t terribly surprised. No.

4 Q Whatdidshesay?

5 A shtSaid,“ I u& rstand you have something to give Diversified Rmotinz Services. Inc. (202) 296- 292’

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Pqz 155 ; mt.” or, ‘Tki Rsidcnt said you have somcchiq to give m: Abngtllose~.

Q HowloqaftuyoulmdkfttbcWbitcHouscdid Ewycall~ u?

A Smrallmurs. Q Wlmsksaidsanuhiqalongthelincsof “1umkmandyoubavcsomahingformc” or’ThcRsidez: saysyoubmsaMbingfof~“ wbuldidyouundastandk t00?

A Tbcgifts.

Q O~ Y.

A- Kindof- wbntlwas ’ loftbcnalictltbit ~jumpingallttr: wyback~ tkJulyl4thiuciidartwbac IwassupposcdtocallEknytbcomdaybutnotmllyga into& ailswitbha, tbattbiswasmaybcabngtboscsame lilus.

Q That actually anticipaa my oat question.

AOb. Q Didyoukclauynadtoaplaintobmwbatwas going~ bsppen?

A No. Q Wbatarrssdidyoumakefortramfcroftk WlQK& lg?

A Itbink~ discusscd~ tbiogsandRuty mcntioncdrhewasonbrtumytotkbospitaltovisithcrnxm

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Page 156 andshe’dswingbyandyouknow. pickupwhatevait~ I wassupposedtogivebcr.

Q Now, attbttinmzyouhadthatcnnversation,~ youalreadypackinguptbegiftsatall?

A No. Q Whcnwasshcgoingtocumeby, then? ‘Ihatr@‘?

A Yes.

Q Whatdidyoudoafterthephonecallcndcd?

A ~pUt~ thegiftSththCbadgiVen~ m~ ykd

andIgotabigboxfrom’IheGapandwcntthrough~ itcm anddec& difInorrkttogiveittothemornot.

Q Can~ youcxplainwhatyoumcanbythat?

A Itsortofwasadifficuk- I- Iwasn’tsureif Iwasgoingtogczthisboxbadt, soIdidn’twsntto~ every& gintheeventthatIdidn’tgettheboxbackfor somereason.

AndIkcptoutsame~ irmocuousthingsandIkcptaut the- reallythcmost-. themostsentimenta. lgifthehad givenmewasthebo& tbc” LeavesofGrass” book, so- and itwasjust- it’s beautiful and it meant a lot to me. so I kept that out.

Q Whatother- itsoundstomelikeyouhadone category of more sentimental gifts that you kept out of the

bOX. A IkI& mm~

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Page 15: I Page 159

1 Q And kept for yourself. What other items wme in 1 A AI- theymeantalottome.

2 that category, other than the “Izaves of Grass”? 2 Q Okay. YOU could have givt~~ the items to someone

3 A Not #ly mhmeota. l ones, but just - I 3 eise, afriendofyours, AshleyRainesottoyourmotheror

4 thinkIkcptoutthemarblebearhead, thebaig, thecrmvass 4 justhiddentbcmwmewhre. Why didn’t you do that?

5 bag, the blanket, the sunglasses, the chocolates. And I 5 A Ithink- I’vecometosortofseethisnow. I

6 think that’s it. Oh, wait. And I might have kept out some 6 don’t how tbat I neccwrily saw it th, but I feel now a

7 0fthcMartha’sVineyardstuffthatIbadgoneninthefall. 7 littlebittbatmetumingoversomeofthsetbingswasa

8 Q ‘Ihose wue items that you’ve recently tumed OVCT 8 littlebitofanassmmce tothel4esideIltorFeassurance

9 to our office. 9 tlu& youkmw, thatevaythgwasokay.

1 0 A Yes. I 0 Q hyourmind, tkm, wereyougivingthseitemsnot

1 1 Q Whichitcmsdidyouputintothebox? Ifyou 1 1 justto& tty, butrcallytothtRtsidcntasmll, ina

1 2 remember. 1 2 mamlerofspeak@?

1 3 A -hehatpin, thCpinthatIhadKh’Cdthatday 1 3 A IthinktbatwasevenmorcdirectlywhatI 1 4 f0rChri~ apinthathehadgiveamformybirthday. a .I 4 tboughtitvms. Notthatthyweregoiogtobcinhis 1 5 picturethatbehads@ edformeformybirthdaythatIbad 1 S pomssioo, butthathewoulduoderstmdwhameritwas 1 6 framedapictrnehchadsignedformeofhimwearingtht 1 6 IgavetoBettyandthattbatmightmakebimfctla 1 7 frrst tie 1 gave him. 1 7 little bit better. 1 8 Q Any other Black Dog items? I 8 Q DidEkuysaywbereshewasgoingtoputtbebox 1 9 A IthinktherewasaBlackDoghatthatIputin 1 9 ofgifts?

2 10 there. And I’m not -- I’m not really sure what else was in 2 0 A Ithinkshesaidshewasgoingtokeeptkmina

2 !I there. O~ IalsoputthecopiestbatIhadleftofthe 2 ,l closet. Or, you kmw, sk’d keep the box in a closet.

2 I2 Valeotioe’s Day ad that I had put in the paper for him. 2 2 Q Right.

2 !3 Q The Romeo and Juliet quote? 2 3 A Youaskedmc- nevermind.

2 !4 A hhhtU! I. 2 4 Q ?hcgifts. Right. IuwhWod. I un& rstood.

2 !5 Q All right. Did Betty come by? 2 5 All right. What I’d like to do now is ask a few queaim -- Page 151 3 Page 16~

1 A Yes. she did. I met bcr ouuidc. I MFLwlsENBERo: hske?

2 Q How did you know when sbc was going to come by? 2 MR. EMMICKz Yea?

3 Wastbcrr: ap~ timcsbcwasgoingtocanacbyordid 3 MR. WISENBERG: B& m? you lcsvc lhat topic, I llavc 4 sbccallyouhm- 5 A Ithinksbecallalmeonhcrwayout. 6 Q You met bcr outsidz you bad tk box with you? t

7 A Mm- hmm. I bad tapazl it up and I wrote “Pkasc do 8 not tbrow away” on it. 1

9 Q Weaz you con@ that sbc might throw it away? ,

1’ 0 A Mm- bmm. Yes. Sorry. I(

1 1 Q Okay. Lcr me just ask you some questions. Did you 1

1 2 cvu discuss with llu tbc conocnrs of tk box? 1:

1 A I don’t believe so. 1:

1 Q Did she cvcr ask about tbc contmts of the box? 11

1 A No. 1: 1 Q Did sbc ever say anyIhing indicating that she knew 11 1 from a prior discussion tbc contents of tbc box? 1’

I A Not -- no, not that I rananbcr. II

I Q Sounds like it was a short convasation. I!

2 A WC talkal about her mom a bit and Clhunas. I 21 2 think maybe I had elaborated on what 1 got for Christmas from 2 2 him. z 2 Q Now, youcouklbavcjustthrownthcJcitunsou~ 2. 2 rather than putt@ than in a box. Why didn’t you just throw 28 2 them out? 2.

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afmonthat. Doyoumiod? MR. EMMICKz No. NotataIl. BY MR WEZNBERG: Q You’vcsaidhactoday, Ms. Lcwhsky. andItbink yourokluscarlicTinsomcofyourseasionstius. thst yoUwar:- the ~iallsiremsgoiogtogoto0 Carterand-

MR. EMMICK: You men the m hns. MR. WISENBERG: Wimt did I say? MR. EMhXK: ‘Ibcnotinoocwwians. MLWISENBERG: Boy. Thankyou. Ismod

ConStCd.

BY MR. WISENBERO: Q TbchnocwusiEnswaegoingtogotoPrank m, the non- ionocuous items ~CX not. but that cme of tbcreasons. oacoftbccrihonforstufftbatdidn’t~ gointbcBetlycurricboxthatyouwouldkoepwoukIbc saltimalml 6.

AMm- hQUlL Q Isthat- lmvcIdeaaibodtbat~ A sort of. Q Okay. Hownotmntof?

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Page 161

A Ididtt’trtallygiVcanygiftstOkk~.

NothingtbatIturnedovertoMr. Chterwasagiftfrom tbtPzsi& nt. AndItbinkthewayyoudesuibedthe dividingoftheactualgiftswassortofillnocuo~ yollknow, Bothocuous- LXzhmeotalval~ 1thinkthatwasmore accurak

Q well, asbetweuhthegifisyouputintkboxand ~giftsyouItcpt?

A Mm- hmm. Q Allright. Howwouldyoudesaibetodaythe differeooebetwcznthetwo? IjustwanttomaksureI undasum~ betw& ntbeoIlesyoukeptaodtheonesyouput intbekttybox.

A %uknow, Idon’thaveapafectmemoryOfwhattbe c? itcriawasatthetime. 1know1kcptthebookoutbecause thatwastbemostgntimmtatthingtome.

AndIbelievetbatthethingsIputinthebox went- alsointheboxwasadrcssbegavemefknhrtha’s Vineyal& sothethingstbatwentintotbeboxwcse, Ithi& morealongtbelinesofsorneoftbethingstbatreally complied with the subpoena, that were maybe specifically aamd, although I think books might have been specifically named in the sub- but I kept the “Leaves of Grass.”

Q ?hcy complied with the subpoena, but they’re going toBenyCl3&.

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MR. EMMICK: All right. Should wcukc a bmak? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we sbotdd. THE WITNESS: Oh thank goodness. MR. EIHhiICR Okay. AlIright. Tat minutes.

THEWTlNESS: Okay. THE FOREPERSON: Ten minutes. (Witness excused. Witness recaki.) MR. EMMICK: All right. Do WC have a quorum? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we do. MR. EMhXK: Any unauthorhd pcrsoas p- t? THE FOREPERSON: Nose at all. THEwrrNJzss: Lctmeguess. Yml’regoiagtomniad mcI’m. stilluadaoath.

THEFOREPERSON: hyougo.

THEWRNESS: Fastkama.

Page 162 A Correct. Q Now, my question is, and I’ve asked you this

bcforrbutIwanttoaskyouinfrontofthc~ ndjury, sinceyouwaebasicaIlytryingtokapsomcsaltinmtaI thingsbutyau~ Idusthattbthatpinwassmtimntslto yotLwhyistbcbatpingoiugintotkFkttybax?

A Bccausctbchatpinwastbcahnnoftbtsubpoam. so- I- I- tomcitoammdlogicalthptputtiagtbchat pinintbtbox- Imcsn, itWPSwhathadbmrnamedintbc subpoena.

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Page 163 BY MR. EMMICK: Ms. Lcwinsky, this is what we’re going to do. We’re going to go over sonz questions that we’d like to ask andtkwe’regoingtoaunourattakmtotbeDecember 31stme& ng, tbebreakfastmeetingwithVemonJordan.

A okay. Q Let’s go to questions first. Dae question is Betty comesbyandgctsthisboxofgifts. Isthereanyotberway Beay~ dhavclmowntocallaadpidrupthisboxofgifts exceptfortkPresidentaskhgherto?

A ?beo$‘ thingIcanthinkofisifhebadasked someoneelsetoa* Betty.

Q Ihyoubavcanyreasontothinkthathappencd?

A No, but. Imcgo: Iwasn’tthac, soIdon’tknow- Idaa’tknowwhathesai& how- maybeheleftkanote. Imcan$ Idon’tkllow. So-

Q Amtherwayofaskingitisdidyoutellsomame elsaboutthisandtheymi@ haveaskcdBetty?

A No. BY MR. WISENBERG: Q Didyoutbinkitasacoincidarcethatshecalled you?

A No. BY MR. EMMICK: Q IztmeaskyouaumplcofquestioDsabouttk

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Page 164 Ihank 20tb dumb party.

A Okay. Q w Fikst, wbyisitadumbparty. A Oh Really7 Youwantmctoaaswutbat? Q Yrs. A WdI, bozauseitwasLindaTripp’sprrtyand- wclLtbatshouldhcatough, butjustUmtIgotthar: andI gotstuckhwingtodoauthisstuffandIlmldnXllywantaI totalktotuaboutthcpmGamattwcminuhd- Infnv bdrbackmitandjust- skhad~ taIIthi. smoncyam foodandamontbbefoteshthdhadaomaryfartbcbusand waskyic$ toIcllIlcrclotbcsMdsomclwshcbedssooto spaldonfoodandhadmoncytospaldm~? sttndmratb hertnzanditwasjustdtunb.

Q Lu’sfocusontbediscwionsyouhrdwitbLinda atthcdutnbpartyorbcf~ tbcdumbpartyabouttbe situation.

A ItwUydidn’tsottofgdinto. Ithiok. afuIl discussionwithhauntiIaftu- wc& untilIwasLeviog andIaskcdberlDwalkmeouttomyar.

Q I+ stalkfprtthabouttbcdTwtsyou~ to taIkwithkabouttksttbpaataintbebousc. LXdyoutty to?

A Pmbabfy. Itwas- Igotthscmaybc- tbc- 1 thioktkpartywusupposcdtostartemtmd7: 3OandIgat

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Page 165

~rt5. M) llndskhadmadtnafaod. kddancno1hing. I IWZUI. sk just kd this fridge stuffed with food.

so1wasuyingtokIppfcparcaIltllisstuff. TtuewasalotmortworfrtodohnItkughtUxzewouldk and lbcn ha daughr bad this obsession with vacuuming that

aight~ a~ jjusta~ ofpeop) c~ dIdon’t~ lly muanbauyiqJtogctachana.

Imaykvetricdtoorsortofsaid” Imcdto mlL: 0~“ kiadofa~ botIdon’tlsallk~~ y

0 discusstiwitl- lhcrbcfmtbcpany. 1 Q Okay. Andtbcnyoumahoncdtktyouvnzeabka 2 taUcu, hcralioltbitoutri& Ithinkyouseid? 3 A Mm- bmm. 4 Q WI us about tkL 5 A *main- tkmfhf& lingIkdkdattkt 6 point. anczIbadnzeivadmysubpocnawastkt- htoow 7 skdidn’tnadtowcmyabout& ayhgtktskhhcwanytbh@ 8 aboutthisrehtionship, baauseI~ goiagto~ yit~ 9 oatbaswdl. ,O Andsosortofjust- 1flguWdlktccmvusation 11 would kind of just k mapping out what our nut socps would :2 k. ButitaukdupbchgmuchshorrcrandI- sklookal :3 attksubpoara- excuseme- sorry- andIthinksk-

14 sk kqt talking about kw wdrd. “Isn’t tk bet pin strange? 15 Isn’t it sbangc that tbcy’rc asking about tk hat pin?

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AndwetaIkedaboutthat. AndIthinkthat- I-

Iwas- Iwas-- 1don’tthinkthatIwasleftwiththe feeling that sk was going to continue on this path of insisting sk would rat on me. So - is that clear? I’m sorry - no? Okay.

Wkn I left that night_ I felt a little more -- I think I felt a little more rcassundthatsbeandIwouldbe sayingtksamethinginthePaulaJonescase. Isthat- okay. But I wasn’t 100 perunt sure and 1 think that we left it that we’d have some more discussions about this.

Q Okay. Oneofthetbingswewantedtogetbackto wastht~ olesituatianoatht28thwhacthcre’sa~ thatcallsforyoutoturnovcrgiftsandtbePrcsidcntis giving you gifts.

A hfxn- hmm. Q WhatdoyoutbinkthePrcsidentistbinkingwhmk is giving you gifts when there’s a subpoena covering the gifts? I mean, does k think in any way, shape or form that you’re going to be turning these gifts over?

A YOU know, 1 can’t - what k was thinking, but tomc, itwas -- therewasneveraqucstioninmymindand I- fromeve@ hinghtsaidtomc, 1ncverquestionedhim, that~ wcreevergoingtodoanythingbutksepthisprivate, sothatmantdcnyitmdthatmeantdo-- takewhateva appropriate steps zmx4M to be taken, you know, for that

PllgP Thursday, August 6,1998 ,

1 tobappaLmcaniagtktifIkdtumaIovnevcrygifi

2 k bad gim me - fmt of ail. tbc point of tk affklavit 3 and tk point of evaythg was to try to avoid a deposition. 4 sawlhacI’dk~ Osortof_ youLaow. Iwouldn’thavc 5 tolicasniuchasIwouldwxssarilyiaanaffuMitbow

6 Isawit 7 SobyturaiagwaaIltksegifts. itwouldat

8 least prompt tkm to waat to question me about. what kind of

9 frimdsllipIkdwi~ tkRaidentalxlthcywouldwaatto

0 spcEuLsPcaadthcy’dhkitandmyaamcwouldktxaskdand

1 kwoukikintroubk. So- 2 Q So~ imprccricm, th. wasintksamewaytbat 3 tktwoofyouwacgoingtodmytkxe. lathsbip, youwould 4 alsodcslyacotK& tkgihslbatWWpwsonaltbatpassed s Apu. .6 A hdtkpkoecall- I~ Ithinktktitwas .7 evaything. Ithiukitwaskindof- atkastformc.+ I ;8 doo’tkuowwktk~ far~ thiskdtoktbm& t 19 tlxough Yalkuow, IkdoDamicipa~ cK@ iugthatmi@ t !O kp~ mldlMkenuc- yuukuow- !I Q Youdidwktwaswxssary. !2 Am. !3 BY MS. IMMERGVL 14 Q AItbou& Ms. Lcwinrky, Itbi& wktkratof- !5 itsamsalialcodd~ 1guas. mdlytkgaudjurors

Page 167

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Page 16~ wantedyaurimpr& onofi~ wasonthesamcdaythatyou’n diSCW& gbasiCallygCthgthCgif& tOBcaytOconceal them, he’sgivingyouanewsctofgih.

A Youknow, Ihavecome~~ ytolookatthatas soRofastxangesituati~ Ithi& intbeanxrseoftbe pastfewwaeks, butatthetimc, Iwas- youknow, Iwasin lovewithhim, Iwaselatcdtogettkxprcsu@ and- at tbesametimethatIwassoscarulaboutthePaulaJones thiag, Ianrrbappytobewithhimsnd- 1- 1didngtthinlc about that

Hcbad- hchadkshatedvetybtieflyright beforeIIcfttbatdayinkil. ldofpackl& g- hepllhgai all~ stu. fTbfxkupandIjustsortof- youknow, remcm~ himkindofhsitatiIlgand~ tomyseIf- Idaa’t thinkhesaidanythingthatindicatalthistomc, butI thought to my! Elf, “I woL& r if be’s think@ he shouldn’t givetksctometotakeout.” Buthedid

Q Andhehadalrcadytoldyouhchadsumcgiftsfor you for auhmas.

A correct. BY MR. EMMICKz Q Youma& nedearliawhmIaskcdwhowasonthe listinyourmindofpeoplewboshouldbeavoi& dlikcNancy Henueicb or Steve Goodin, you mentioned Mr. I& es. I

A Mm- hnrm. I

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Page 169

Q Tktnamecamcup. WhywasMr. Ickesontkavoid list?

A He- well, k- k’sjuststrangc. Andk- I’msorxy. Hewould- youw, youcouldktkdy

pasonitkh8lldyoUWouldpassMr. ICkCSintbchall

andkwcnldjustglareatyou Youknow. AndI’dmy,“ Hello,“ youknow, uyouwould imagineyahsup~ todoandk’djustglarcatyou andwalkpastyou. And1thoughttk. twassednge. Callmexird.

Q okay. Andtbat’~ th~ l~~~ nthaty~~~~ itioncdhim

ontklistofpcopletoavoid?

A AndItbinkjust- hisnameiaaortofinmymind forhavingtodowiththingstktwe’rediscussingtodayand ~‘ Sbceniathtp~ ofiSbutit~ ywasmostevay s& rpermriintkWhiteHwse, Imcan, exccptforBetty whokncwwhoIwastktwouldcoaccmme.

Q Wt.

A Imcan, Ikd- youknow, Ilmdbadalotof interactionwiththescpatpleduringtkfurlOu& S0-

Q Lctmaskyouaqu& onaboutTimKrating. Did Tim Keating tell you or imply to you that you could come back after the election?

A Hetoldmct& Icouldprobablycomcbackafter

tk election.

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Page 17( Q Okay. Do you xememb wkn k said that to you? A Yes. On- Q Goakad.

A I’msorry. Ontkdaytktkinf~ moftk tmnsfer.

Q So that would have ban the 5th of April? Dots that sound right? Friday, the 5th of April?

A Comet. It was Good Friday, I remember. Q Did k say anything about any problem of an appearance of impropriety during that conversation with you? Someth& liketkremightkanapapptarancekforebutit doesn’t matter after tk election, anything like that?

A No. No. No. Q lhat subject didn’t cumc up at all? A Not with Mr. Keating. Q You mentioned that wkn - oh, I’m sorry. Goakad. Sure.

A JUROR: I’m sorry. What would have prompted hin tomakea commentlikethat, thatyoucouldcumebackafta tk election?

THEWITNE!%: IwasayingandIjustkepttelling him, I -- you know, I didn’t really want to leave and why did Ikvetoleaveand~‘ tthac- youknow, wcrcn’tthae otkropalingsmtkrtllanmehavingtogototkPentagon becausekkd-

Pagem Thursday, August 6, 1998

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Pqc 171 Do you want me to get into a little bit about w& z: wassaidtkre?

MR. EMMICK: If it will help w tk que% on. sure.

AJUROR: Yes. Ph.

THE WITNESS: Okay. There badbcenprobhswith mysupcrvisor, JoalynJollcy. andsowhcaIwascallcdmto I

T~‘ sofficcIIhad~ tkwas-- khadjustspokcawitb :

JaalyasadIthoughtkwasgoingtotellmctheyhadf~ Jocelynaadinsteadktoldmethattheywere-- thatfor rcaXmsbavingtodowithsomcoftkworkloadnot- things ?

withihckttersfromtbeOffiiofM anaguzntandBlYiPtf ~ that thy bad to blow up - quotcunquote, blow up tk . j comspaadma offkx aud they weal eliminating my pasition.

Mytransferhadnothingtodowithmyw0rk. 1 j

sbouldn’tocethisasa~ vething. HetildmIwastoo ! swtytokworkinginthc~ wingandtbatthisjobsrthe ’

PentagaowkreI’dkwritingpressreleaseswasa~ job.

AndIwaSU- yiK4ggnd- BY MR. EMMICK: Q Wktdoyouthinkkmeantby% oscxy”? A Ithinkkmcantthat-, k- Ihinkkwas tryingto- youknow, tryingtoconcealtkfacttbat- youknow. tktInowknow, tberealrcasonIwasbeing

Page 172

1 taansfcrrcd AndsoItbinkkwast@ ngtonotmaybcangcr

2 me. Andthoughtthatsamchowby- maybekthou& tI’d 3

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think that was a cmnplcnmt.

ARIROR: Didyouthinkkwaspatronidngyou? THE WITNESS: A little bit. Yeah. ‘hat’s a@ od waytoputit. I- Ijust- Ijust runembcrtbhking~ Iwas- 1wasnevergoingtoseetbePresidentagain5d tktallofasuddentbatthis- youknow, tkendof this - this nlationship.

Aadikept- I’vcalwarssortof- I’mthckiad ofpasontbatalwaysthinhthatIcanfurcvelytlhgQdso itwaskindofthis- f& liagofwait. thistrain’s~ toofastaxxiIcan’tstopitandthatitkdaheadypaszd and- and- so~ T- rsaidthat, 1thinkksortofaid that- Ih’tthnkknranttosaytbat. Ithinktbatwas probablymorethaukwassuppo. zdtosay.

A JUROR: Thank you. BY MR. EMMLCK: Q Goingbackagaintotk17thofDecuhrwfrntk Rcsiht called you and let you know about tk witaas list, yousaidkuscdthcpluase,“ Itbrokemykarttos& youon tkwitnesslist.” Whatwasyourreactionwknksaidtkt?

A Iklievedhim. IthinkIalso- Q Youthoughtkwasbcingsinccm?

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A JUROR: Besause you had nothing to do with formulating this witness list, why do you think it breaks his hcart_ thatyournamewasonthac? E3ccausyou’nilm~ t

Ofk~ f~~~~ Dbyoukve- orinyour opiniott, whatisitthathurthim?

THBWITNB! S: Ithinkitwastkickathat- that- thiswasgoingto- thatthiswasgoingtokabad thing for mc. I m, if you imagine what’s happened now hadn’t happened and let’s just say the Paula Jones thing had goneaheadandIhadsomchowbeendraggedintothat, just beii associate with it and it king difficult and maybe k - maybe it was going to seriously akr any kind of friendship or relationship that we ha4 you know?

BY MR. EMMICK: Q I~ t~~ aq~~~ t~ pu~~~~ ftics. Did you arrange fur tk deletion of filts or c- mails that might have related to you and the Pmsident?

A DidIarrangc? Q Ordidyoudeletethem. Sorry. A Yes, I did. Q Okay. Did you ask Linda Tripp if she would delete e- mails relating to the President?

A Yes. Q Did you speak with someoneatthe~ tof

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Page I74 Defense in order to learn something about those deletions or to make sure that they would be mom longstanding?

A Not about deletions. Q Okay. Well, what was it that you spoke with him about?

A laker-- i~~ oy~ I~~ itis, if-- if - sort of how easily someone could break into the computers. And I couldn’t imagine how 1 had come to this witness -- cometobeonthiswitncsslist, sooneofthe things I thought was maybe someone had broken into my computer and was reading my e- mails. And he told me that that was really difficult.

And~ I~~ akut-~~~~~ o~ t inmindofgeningridofthcrmails, Iasktdhimwhatthc sort of saving procedure was with the e- mails. I know at tk Whit6 House, they back them up and put them in the archive forever and he told me that at the Pentagon, they sort of stay on the server for four weeks and then they’re dumped into e- mail heaven or some&&

Q Allright. ~dy~~~~~~~ y~~ to& letee- mailsthatyouhadsuitrnlatingtothc :2 Pre!& tlt? .3 A No. .4 Q At any time+ did you create anything like a .5 spread& eat that contained on it information relating to your

PageM Tbirsday, August &I998 I

1 mkionship with tk Rcsickt? 2 A Yes. 3 Q Okay. TcUusabouttbat. 4 A LindaaadIhsdbantalkingaadshcbadban 5 ~~~~‘ s~~ 8t~~~~~~ of 6 thingsor- IthiDktbatwastbcWds& usai. 7 Andsoih: waswantingtorat- youkDow. Itbi& 8 inm& xttoaidblzineyingtof@ uxcoutwbtthc 9 pa~ ofmynsatioathipwithtbtRai~ twas. Imp&~ IO stupidsprehhtcmMicrosoftExccltbstju5tbadth:- I1 thcoumbucd& ysofthcmonthmdtlsmwthsanddccrminod 12 ~W~ t~ y~~ ap~~~~ dI~~~~ I3 himat8ncventorsom& ingIiktkst So- 14 Q Isthatscnnmh@ tbatyouuhimatclyprintiout is uxisbwcdtoW? ,6 A Yes. 17 Q ItakcittlmtwasmtkD0Duxnputcr? 18 A Yes. .P Q W~~~~~~~~~~~ !O rcvarkdttbatyouwcrctalldagllbaltain~? !I A No. !2 Q Okay. Didyoucvubavcnnatnrcopyofthat- !3 let’s CaIl it 8 spnasdsh& l?

!4 A No. Y Q DidyousavctkfJlcoftkspna& zU

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A No. Idon’tbckveso. Q Allright. Goi. ngbackalmtothenightofthc 17~~~ 17~ j~~~~~~~~~~ dateofthat, itwasat2: 30intkmoming. Isitlitaally onthe 17thorisit-

A Nineteen- eigh@ n- itisliterallytk morning, 2: 30 in the muming of the 17th. So, yes.

Q Okay. Good. WbeatkPresidentgaveyoutk Vancuuvcrbearontk28th, didksayanythingsboatwhat it means?

A Mm- hmm. Q Whatdidkm A I~ k- I~ k~ d~~~~ the-- maybcIndlaasymbolfcv~ just- youknow, andtokstronglikcakar.

Q Anddidyouintczpretthataskstrcmginyour ckzisiun to contin~ to conceal tk mlationship?

A No. MR. Bh4MICK: Ail right Any follow- up ai that? Ms. WIRTIi: CanIaskokquastilm? MR. BMMICIcz sum.

L2 BY MS. WIRTH: L3 Q Didksaysom& hglikc”‘ hisis~ ytmnccd t4 tokstrong,“ or” Thisisfoswknyounaedtoksaoag”? 15 Bcyundsa$ ngthatitwasasymbolofstmngth?

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1 A Ithinkhc- hehclditandhcmid, youknow. 1 you told US when we first met with you tn the proffer zzeung 2 “Youcanholdoatothiswhcnyoun& dtobestrong.” 2 that you couldn’t specifically remember that item. Is Lx 3 MS. WIRTH: Tbank you. 3 CorIcct?

4 BY MR. EMMICK: 4 A Yes. 5 Q WhatI’dktodoisaskyouaboutapasssgcfmm 5 Q And I think you said you couldn’t specifically 6 theprofferafxII’mlookingatpagc5. 6 remmberanymoreofthcitanthatMikejustRadto~ ouon 7 A okay. 7 the ix& tom of the previous page about the physically uxxnatc 8 Q Andyou’~~~ attkb~ ttom, fmdI’~ dthe 8 relationship. 9 passagc, thisis& itingtothemztiuganth~ l19th, just 9 A Right. o afteryou’vegortmtbcsubpocna,, withVcraonJordan, 10 Q Butthatyouhadnodoubtthatit’struc. Isthat 1 andwhattbspassagesaysis” Possiblylaterinthatmetin& 11 comet? 2 butmarcpmbablytbemrtm&. ing,“ Iassumc that’s a’ 12 A Iwasbeingtruthfulinmyproffer. Yes 3 ref~ atothe22nd? 13 Q And the proffer, written proffer, is acctxak 4 ACorrect. 14 Isthatcorrozt? 5 Q %fs. kwins& tricdtomakcitckartoMr. Joxlan 15 A Ye& 6 thatsheinfactdidhaveaphrsicallyintimaterel~ tioaship 16 Q But- andIthinkyoualsosaidyoufalsomc- 7 withtbePrcsident_ ’ Andthenlet’sgotothcncxtpage. 17 I don’t know if this is the m you don’t nmemhcr h but 8 Itsays,“ Ms.~ madcitcltarshcintcndcdtodcnythc 18 youhavtexpresscdtoustbatyouf~ lsameguiltabou: 9 sfxual mlationship with the F% esi& ot.” 19 Vanc~ Jordan. Isthatconect? ‘0 So1guesswhat1wanttotalkaboutistheportion 20 A Mm- hmm. 11 oftbepassageoapage5. 21 Q at’sayes? .2 A Mm- hmm. 22 A Yes. 3 Q Tellushowyoutriedtomakeitclearto 23 Q Okay. Can you tell us why that is? 14 Mr. Jordan that you .Jnci a physically intimate relationship 24 A HewaStheonlypemcmwhodidwhathcsaidhcwas 15 with the President. 25 goingtodoformeand- ingettingmthejoh. And- 1

Page I78 Page 18C 1 A I think by mentioning the phone Sex. 1 metwitbLindaontbe13thwbcnsbc~ wwringswixpd 2 Q I See. Allright. Anyotherwaythatyoutriedtc 2 m in subsequent or previous convasatimt and subscquau 3 makeitclfxrtohim? 3 convusations, I amibutal things to h4. r. Jadan thst n’t 4 A Not that I remcmlxr. 4 truebccause1knewtbatitbadlcvpsgcwitbLindaandtllst 5 Q All right. And then is it your recollection now 5 alotoftbosetbingstbet1saidgothimintoalotof 6 thatitwasonthe~~ ndthatyou~ eyingtomakethis 6 troubkandljust- hc’sagootipusonaod- 7 clear to Mr. Jordan? 7 Q koneexampkof- and? hcnI’llkavethis 8 A Yes. 8 topic, isooeexampkofoneoftkthingsyoutoklLiada 9 Q Asopposedtotbe19th? 9 tbatisn’ttruc,“ ItoklVcrnonJo& mnojob. noafWvit”? 0 A Yes. 10 solWhiqalongtboselines?

1 MR. EMMICK: Any other follow- up on that? 11 A Yes. BsaustLindamadcmcpranisc hcrtbatorl 2 BY MS. IMMERGUT: 12 tbe9tll. 3 Q Ms. Lewinsky, howdidyoumakeitcleartohimthat 13 Q Okay. OfJanuary 4 youintcndtdtodraVtbemlationshipwiththcResidcnton 14 A OfJanumy. 5 the23rd? Excuseme. The 22nd. I5 MR. WENBERG: Okay. 6 A This~ s, Ithink, aSImentionedtoyoUgUyS 16 THE FOREPERSON: Do you osd a minute? 7 before, this is - I don’t have a memory of this. I know 17 THE WITNESS: I’m* y. Thanks. 8 whenIwrotethisIwastcllingthetruth, soI’msureIdid 18 A JUROR: I’m B littk conf& ed. whar yw said 9 do this, but I don’t -her. 19 tbatyousaideataintllingsbeeauseyouknowLiodflbsdtk 0 MR. WISENBERG: Ms. w -- 20 olkright?

1 Mike, doyoumindiflasksomequestions? 21 THE WITNESS: 04 I didn’t ~DOW Linda bad tk mik. 2 MR. EMMICK: Go right ahead. 22 IIKWklKWtbatslK? waswcaringawk 3 BY MR. WISENBERG: 23 A JUROR: Okay. But so why would you say &KC 4 Q I think, you can correct me if I’m wrong, you’ve 24 thingsabouth+ fr. Jcrdanthstwuenottruc? Wbatwnsthc 5 doneitpreviouslytoday, soI’msurcyouwillagainifIam, 25 rcasrm?

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1 THEWITNESS: Because- Ihad- fromsomeofmy I the White House itself, either in the dining room or the

2 conversationwithLinda, Istartcdtothinkthatshewasa 2 study or the Oval Office generally.

3 little bit jealous that Mr. Jordan was belping mc get a job 3 A Does that include gifts that I gave him that I’ve

4 inNewYorkandthatIwasleavingthePentagonandthat_- 4saTnhilnWear?

5 shehadremakdonetimetbat- that, youknow, Mr. Jordan 5 Q All tight. Welt, let’s just start with the things

6 who is tbe most potiul. you know, man in this city got me 6 thatyou’vCseenitltheartaitS&

1 myaaarncyandshe-- shcthinksthatsheonlyhad-- you 1 A Okay. Okay. I -canlgothrough- justgo

8 know, this dinky attorney or something like that. 8 throughthelist?

9 AndI--- Iwassockpemteforbcrto- I 9 Q sure. 1 0 was -- for her to not reveal anything about this relationship 0 A That would probably be easier. On page 6, I’ve

1 1 thatIusedanythingandanybodythatIcouldthinkofas 1 scenthzitwolittlebooks. 1 2 leveragewithher. I- her, tbePmsiclen~ mym~ 2 Q %‘ ohtlebOOkS? 1 3 eve+ xly. Imean, notber, butA4r. Jordan, tbeI’residen~ 3 A The “Oy Vcy’* book, which is jokes and the little

1 4 my mom. Anybody that I& ought would have any kind of 4 golf book.

1 5 influexeonher, Iused. 5 Q ~youFememberwhcnyOUsaWthosebooks? 1 6 Dosthat answer your qtiion? 6 A Yes. On- IthinkitwasNovcmbcr13th_

I 7 A JUROR: Well, it doesn’t. I guess what I’m 7 Q Zadilladay?

I 8 hying to figure out, okay, is what was that going to 8 A Zadilladay.

1 9 accomplish? Was that going to make her - what? 9 Q Allright

2 10 THE WITNESS: Well, specifically, with the 0 A IsawacopyofthcWashingtonPostadthatIbad

2 !I statenxnt about I won’t sign the affidavit until I get the I ghenhiminabookonhisdcsk.

2 :2 job, is that I had a conversation with Linda, which \krc’ll 2 Q YOUgiiVChhaSmallishCQpyOfthe-

2 !3 probably get to - 3 A 1gavehimanactualcopythatIcutoutfromone

2 !4 MR. EMdICK: I hope. 4 OfthepapcrsaadIgltreditiatoa~ cardboard~ g.

2 !5 THE WITNESS: Oh. On January 9th and in that 5 Q Andwhcrcdidyousccitmhisdesk. Page 182 Page 184

conversation. she bad told me sbc bad changed bcr tnittd. she 1 A Itwasinsideabook. was ping to bc vague on the uutb about Ksthlan WiIky and 2 Q Andthebookwasontbedeskinthcmdy?

thee sbc told me - at that point. I had told her I hadn’t 3 A Yes.

sign& an affidavit when I had and I told I didn’t bavc a job 4 MS. WIR’IH: Mike, could 1 ask a question?

rctandIkmwIwasprobab~ ygoiagrobc~ ajobrhat 5 BY MS. WIRTH:

day. 6 Q Didyousectheadinaparticularbook?

And sbc said “Monica, prom& c me you won’t sign 7 A Yes. the afmavit until you get the job. Tdl vanon you won? 8 Q whichone?

signtbcsffivitttntilyouguthejobbccatlseifyousign 9 A “vax.”

11 tbc affiivit before you get the job, tbcy’rc never going to 3 Q Okay. Andwssthatonthedeskinthcstudy?

1 give you the job.” I A Yes. 1 AndIdidn’twantbertothinktltatIhadgonc 2 Q Andwas” Oy% j’“ onthc& skintbcstudy?

I ah& and done anything witbout ha and that I was kaving 3 A Yes. 1 buintkdark. 1wantcdhcrtofultbat- sottofLinda 1 Q Whatabouttbelitiegoifbook? 1 and myself against cvmyonc &e bazause I felt like I naedcd 5 A Ithinkitwas. I- I- I’mnot100percartsum

1 toboldhcrhandthroughthisinordcztotrytogetltcxto 6 it was a golf book, I’m 99.9 percent sure.

1 do wbat I wanted. essentially. 7 Q And about how many books does the Resident have on

1 BY MR. EMMICK: s hisde& inrbzstudy?

1 Q Wc. cangetintothatinmotzdctailwhatmtalk 3 A Hehasmaybeabout15Or20tittltbookSthattnr:

2 about tk 13th. 3 onhisdeskandhehfLsmon? booksovcrthezeendmorebooks

2 A Okay. I onthcbooksklf.

2 Q Why don’t we do tbc following. I wanti to ask 2 MS. WIRTH: Thank you

2 samt- ratbcrthanjustjlrmpinginu, thc3lstwhiehisa 2 Vernon Jordan tnahtg. why don’t wit ask samt qtaxtiotts about 2 1

2 3

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3 BY MR. EMMICK: 4 Q Howabouttheopener? 5 A Right. =- right. ‘IbtWoOdCnfrOgletlcr

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III Re: Grand Jury Proceedings Multi- Pagem Thursday, August 6, 1998 Page 185 0pencrtbatIgavehim. I’mjusttryingtogothroughthis MY, so--

Q Allright. Goahead.

A Im’tbc- wcll, I:~ thimtkbOOk” Diseascd M. ismpreseneation. ’

Q AnddidyousuitinthcOvalOffii~?

A No, Isawitint. kbackstudy.

Q ?bebarks& y? bdthtwoddhavebcmcmpage

8, I believe? A Right. Andtbentbeb= ropcaerthatIwas nrntioning a momentagowssonpage9. Isawtbeantiquc papawcight.

Q Okay. Whazisitthatyousawtheopcner? A Itwasantopof- Ithinkit’sacigarboxonhis de& intheback0ff1ce. Isawtheantiquc-

BY MS. IMIvlFXGUTz

Q Whendidyouseeth& Monica? A ibdihi day. 1 saw the antiqut papaW&& On his - he has a collectioo of autiquc political memorabilia intbcdiningroomontopofsortofachestsortofthing, andIsawthattbzon-- IthinkonDccember6thor December 28th.

BY MR. EMMICK: Q Okay. Do y~ unzmembzwhich? A NO. Isawtbestandingdgarholder, Ithinkit

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Page 180 wasonhisOvalOff& desk. Oritmighthavebcenintk back. IthinkitwasontbeOvalOff~ cedesk Onthe28th of December. And that’s it.

Q All right. I& t’s turn our attention to the 3 1st of Deuzmber. You had indicated earlier that at some point you startedtogctmoreandmore amcemed about Linda Tripp ant whethershewasgoingtoratanyo~ Ithinkwasthewayyou put it. What did you do with respect to Vernon Jordan in that concern?

A Since Linda had stopped rctuming my calls around the 24th of December, by the end of December, 1 realized I’d kindofbettercomeupwithsamesortofstra~ asto how -- if Linda Tripp unncs out and says all these things wberethisiswmingfmmandtrytopreparetbcPresidcnt.

And since 1 couldn’t find it within myself to bring it up to him directly, I called Mr. Jordan and told himthatIneededtotalktohim, Ihadsomeconcems about something.

Page 188

1 A Ya. Aftcrbrcakfast. intkcar, Iaskal

2 Mr. Jonianifkthou& ttk~ itwouklahwaysk 3 man+ dtotkFirstLadyandksaid,“ Ycs, askshoukl 4 k.” AndgmcmcaquotcfromtkBibk. Adafew- maybe 5 aminutcorsoktrr. k~ id’Wcll. maybcyoutwowiUhsvc 6 an affair when be’s out of offi.” 7 And at that point I was shockal because 1 thought 8 Mr. Jodan! mdknownthatmhadalmdybadtbisaffairand 9 IthinkIalldaitothisdicrtodaywbalIsayinguntil 0 thc31s~ ldidn’tImow. andlsaid’Wcll. wt~ hadan

1 affair. WC just - you know, we didn’t have sex or did 2 ~butsex.“ orMmcthinglikethat. Andkjust 3 kindofmnt- oneoflhosc” Mmmph.” Ywkuow-

4 Q Agnmfl 5 A Aoddidn’trcallyrespondtomc. .% Itn& tbatas

6 mycuctodroptksubject. But- so- Q Whendidyoucallhim? A Ithinkitwasthe30tbofDtctmber. Q Did you speak with him directly? A IthinkImighthavespokcnwithhis- withhis === y.

Q Doyouremem berhaDZI=? A Gail. There was anotkr one, too, but I’ve forgot

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Page 18: bcr name. And I met Mr. Jordan for breakfast on -- no, no: Sunday but December 3 lst, the morning of the 3 1 st. at the Park Hyatt Hotel.

AndinthecourseoftheumversationItoldhim that I had bad this frieod, Linda Tripp, who was sort of invol~ mthePaulaJoncscasewith, IthinlctheKathlgn Willey stuff. 1 don’t know if I went into that much detail, butididtellhimhername.

AndIsaidthatshcwasmyfriend, thatIdido’t reallytrusther- I& totrusther, butIdidn’ttmst hcranymaeandIwasalittlebitconcanedbecauseshchad spmttbe~~ atmyhameafewtimsandIthollght- I toldMr. Jcrdan, Isaid, wcll, maybeshe’sheardsome- you~ ow- Iman, maybesbesawsomeaotcslyingarormd.

And Mr. Jordan said, “Notes from the R&. icnt to you?” And I said, “No, notes fmm me to the Resident.” And he ssid, ‘Go home and make sure they’re not there.”

Q wbst did you u& rstandhimtomeanwhenbctid, “Go born and make sure they’re not tkxe”?

A Ithoughtthatmeantthat- togohomeandsearch aroundandifthaeareanycopiesofndesaranythingthat Isentordraf& tothrowtbcmaway.

Q Did you have any furt& r discussions with Mr. Jordan about Mr. Clinton and the Clinton’s marital status?

l MREMMICK: Allright.

8 BY MR. WENBERG:

9 Q What did you rat for bmkfast af tk Hyan?

0 A Ihadan- IhadancggwhitelXnck%. 1 BY MR. EMMICK: 2 Q Whatdidkhave? 3 A Itbi& kbadcucdwitbyogm

4 BY MR. WISENBERG:

5 Q lhyarrunanbcrwbopaid?

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II I! Re: Grand Jt& Pmeeediugs Mull Page 1% 1 A Mr. Jordan. He’s a gcnthnan. 2 Q Doyourananbubowhcpaid? 3 A No. 4 Q HasanyoncfmmtheQfficeoflndcpmdentCuunad 5 ortkFB1sbuwnyoumlypapcnwxkofanykhrdwithrdarncc 6 totbatbrealdast? 7 A No. 8 MR. WLSENBERG: Thank you. 9 BY MR. EMMICK: IO Q Let’sturnbacktothctopicofgifts. II A okay. I2 Q DidyougivlcagifttoihcResidcntinavly 13 Jaauary? 14 A Ycs. Idid. Wch. Igucss- Igavcittohfs. IS Cunie for the Pmsidcnt. 16 Q Whatwasthcgift? 17 A Itwasanantiqucbookoathev& usp~ idcaU 18 with skachings. A bisrory book.

19 Q Whacdidyoubuytkbook? 10 A AtansmciquebaokstoreinGcorgdown. 21 Q Was~ anythingalongwithtbebook? 12 A A note. 23 Q Okay. Wbatkindofanote? ‘4 A Ananbanassiqmushyaotc. ‘5 Q Okay. Didyouatmcbthenotetotbzbookinsomc

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Page 190 way?

A I don’t really - I might have put it inside the book or I may have put it outside. I wrapped the book.

Q Andhowdidyoutrytogetthisbooktothe President?

A IcalledBertyovertheweekcndandasktdhaifI could drop it off so I didn’t have to was@ money on a lxxlrier.

Q Andwknyousay” tbeweekend,“ areyoutalking about that fvsr weekend in January?

A Yes. Q hyou rcmcmberifitwasWurday, the3nbor Sunday, the Stll?

A I believe it was Sunday the 4th. Q YoucalledBettyandwhatagaindidyousayto Betty?

A Idon’t- IthinkIsaidMmKthing- youknow. “I have somcth@ for him, could I drop it off to you so I don’t have to waste money on a courier.”

Q Okay. And what didyoudo?

A Sosksaidtbatwasfine. SoIwentovertokr homaand-

Q Hadyoubecotoberhomebcfore? A Yes.

Q Had you ever dropped anything off at bcr honr for Pagem Thursday, August 6,199X

I the I4esi& at before? 2 A No.

Page 191

3 Q Wktdidyoudowknyougotkrbamc? 4 A We& skwassitt@ nntbepotchsowesaton 5 theputzhandIgavehcrthcpackagcandwetalkedfora 6 littlewhile. 7 Q DidyoutaIkatallaboutthcgiftthatwasfortk 8 Pmsickat? 9 A We might have. I might kve mauioned it. (0 Prohabiy did I’m not - 11 Q %stbaeanydiscussiooaboutthefactthatthe I2 Resident~ him& undersubpoeoaandwasgoingtobc 13 &po& inacouplcofmxks? 14 A No. IS Q W= YOU amomcd about giving him a book, a gift, 16 undartfiose &UmEtlm=? 17 A No. 18 Q Okay. DidynuuvcrtalktotkPmaidcntandleam 19 ~kgottkbookandtknate? m A Ye& I& d 11 Q AUri& t.. whmdidyoutiwithhimandlearn u aboutthat? 23 A OntkSthofJanumy. Ithinkitwasthc5thof ~4 January. Yauknmv- canIjust- 5 Q Sum. Takahxth.

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A Yes. It wastk 5thof January. Q AndthatwouldbavcbamMondayG

A amt. Q Whydun’twatrytoproandthrougb~ ondaybccause

Mo& aystartedwithamctingwithyoaattdFmkCartcrm

thentbczuwasthcphonecauahcrwards, solet’sgofirst totkllX!& lgwithFrankcartcr.

A okay. Q F& l fret. A ImtwitbMr. Cartcrtogoovcrinmomdstail wbuumstoodatthatpointwithtkPaulaJoaes~ andk wentover- kwcntoverwhatwasgoingtohappcnifan afIidavitt’tgoingtosatis@ thcPaulaJoncsat@ nays andIdidhavetogctdcposxlandwk. ttharoomlouklike, what- ynuknow- eMythingthathuppcnsinadaposition and k threw out a bunch of diffuunt qtrstions.

You know, tky’ll probably ask you who your fust grade~ wasandthcy’llaskyuu- youhnow, some thingsandthensomcofthcquestionsthatconcunadmawuu qucstionslikc” HowdidyougeryuurjabattkRntagon?”

Andhmvdid- youknow, andksaid,“ Iky’~ askthings

likedidyuufmdoutakuttko~ onabuktinbuard ordidanmametcllyouabcmtit? Who msnmmuadadyoufar tkjob? Howdideveqth& getfaciIitatedforthe transfa? I ,

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1 k Grand Jury Procaxiings MUlti- PILgtm ‘husday, August 6, 1998 1 Page 193 1 And that alarmed M because I didn’t really know

2 how to mxemrily answer that. I didn’t express that to

3 Mr. Cartcr, but- 4 Q Wcll, wknyousayyoudidn’tknowhowtoanswrr 5 i~ wbatdoyoumean, ymdidu’tknowhowtoanswerit?

6 A Well, IwasamxmedtbatifIsaidin- you 7 know, ifposdblythatwasgo~ tocomeupinthcaffidavt 8 whiehhadn’tbezwxittenyetoriuadeposition, ifIhad g said- ImUnalccrtainpcoplethathadbecninvolvalin 0 helpingmsecurethepositionoveratthePentagonor 1 forcingmtogotbm& ImIly, tbatbecause~ people 2 didn’tlikemt, iftbeywaeevcrquestionedbythePauia 3 Jonesammeys, thattheymight~ ysame@ gconcraryto 4 whatIsaidjustbagusc-- togetmintroublebtcauscthcy 5 didn’tlikeme.

6 SoIumse4mcemcdthat- Iwantalto- Iwmed 7 tohavesomtsortoff& lingofprotection, that-- yw~ w~

8 that I wouldn’t be SCIWU! over by these people. J Q wacyouconcunedthattbey~ goingtosay 3 nastythingsaboutyouorwueyou concanedtbattheywere

1 goingtosaythingstllatm. ightultinmlyleadtothe 2 r& alingofthelelationshipinsomeway?

3 A No. Iwasjust ameemdthattheywould

4 pulposefuIly say som% h@ diffexent from whatever I 5 saidjustbccausztheyhadtheopportmitytosemwm.

Page 194

I I mean -- not -- never mind.

2 Q Okay. 3 A To cause trouble for me. How’s that? 4 Q Did you discuss with Mr. Carter the affidavit that 5 you were considering? 6 A Yes. 7 Q what did you talk about? 8 A Ithinkbe- hesaidbewouldworkonadraftmd 9 he’d get a draft of the atfidavit to XIX.

0 Q Okay. At the time, did you want anyone else to 1 review that affidavit before you ultimately signed it?

2 A At fvsf I didn’t think about it, but thee I did. 3 IdeeidedIwantcdMr. Jordantolookatit.

4 Q All right. Why did you want Mr. Jordan to look at 5 it? 6 A IthinkIfeltthat- thathebeingthe 7 President’s best friend and having a -- a clearer B understanding of my t& tionship witb the FVesident ? thanMr.~ did, thatIjustwouldf~ lthatitsort 3 ofhadbcenblcssed.

1 MR. EMMICK: Okay. 2 BY MS. IMMERGUT: 3 Q And would that be blessed by the Prekknt as well?

4 A Ycs, Ithat’swhatI- Imean, I- IthinkIfelt 5 that -- excuse me. ‘Ihat, you know, if Mr. Jordan thought

1 1

1 1 I

I 1

2 2 2 2 2

1 1 I 1

I 1

I II 1’

21 2 2 2

2’ 2

PG 195

1 san& ng was ohy. that I’m sum tk Resident would think

2 it- f=. 3 Ms. IMhSERGUT: Okay. 4 BY ‘MR. EhMICK: 5 Q Didyoudiscussthcsubpamaandtbeitansthat

6 mightbcxcsponsivctoth: subpoaraanymorc? Itbiakyou~ 7 lalkcd about it cnrlkr.

8 A You know, time’s ken a littk bit of confusion

9 for me when 1 gave Mr. Gmr those items. so it’s possibk. 0 Q Allright. YoummtionaltbatMr. Canaaslrcd

1 yousomchrdqucstiomaboutIikehowyott@ yourjob. 2 Did$ ouwantmtalkwithanybodyabautthtttaftawards?

#3 A Yes. IpLacedacalltohk. Cunicandaskaik~ 4 toktkRs~ tknowIoopdcdTospcnktobimaaditwas 15 impamnt 16 Q Didyoupyaa@ ot? mMs. Currkabautsigning 17 som& ing? 18 A ItbinlrI~ t~ vcrorcofoaid, jusSyoulolow, 9 bopiiutatsbcmi& tpassthatabmg, 1think. 0 BY MS. IMMERGUT: 1 Q by~ u ranmlbusayingthntyouwan~ toornoakd

2 tospot? ktotbcPrrsj& ltbeforeyousigncdramthiag? 3 A Itbinkso. 4 BY MR. EhMICIC: 5 Q AIlright. Didyoucqhintohcrwbatyoumcant

Page 196 1 when you said that? 2 A No. 3 Q O~ Y.

4 A I’mprcttysrPeIdidsaythattoMs. Currie. 5 Q Didyoufmallygctinccmtactordidyouatsoln 6 time shortly tbarafter get in wntact with h&. Clinton? 7 A Yes. 8 Q Howdidtlmthappcn?

9 A hk& TiecakdmtbeckafcwhourSLata~ 0 theJlsheputtbcPnSidmton. 1 Q Bcfore~ takaboutwhattbeResidcntandyou 2 talkdabo& asbackglDu& Igul? s& wcrcyouupsctain 3 amoodthatdayfromapbotogmphyouhadsen?

4 A ~yourcdyWfmttoem~ me, dar’t~?

5 Q We& Ijustwrmttogetthemoodright. 6 A Ihadbeenpaxedbythephotoandthefootagctbat 7 wasinthcmaiiafromthc~ dentandFiiLady~ B romantic on theiir holiday vacation. So I felt a little bit

9 like- I- Iwasjustamoyed. 0 Iwasjealousanditjustseemedsortofmmthing

1 behadnever-- anaspectoftheirrelationshipthathebad 2 neverreallyreveaMtomanditma& mefcclbad. 3 Solwas- Idon’tknowifanyonelXrehasevCZ 4 donethis, whenyou- you’rcannoybdwithsomconesoyoU 5 kindofwanttopickafightwiththemandyouwanttobea

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1 littk bit k& c so that - you know, you Just rub tkm tk 2 wrong way.

3 Q O~ Y. 4 A Sotbatwashowlwasfaling. 5 Q That’s bow you exhibiti tk VWangaor 6 whnm. 7 A Mm- bmm. 8 Q Okay. Tell us about your fxmmation with tbt 9 Presi& lL 0 A Baxuseofthscfelings, Iwasalittkbitcurt

I witbhimandsoltoldhimthatIhadhndthisma% ingwitb 2 h&. ChtcrandthatlwasconcanaLyoulmow. fromtk 3 quationskaskcdmcthatif, youkww, iflatsompoiat 4 badto~ dof- undaoath. snswathcscqucstions~ in 5 thccouncofans~ aqucstionlmcntiondpeopkattbc 6 WhircHourewbodidn’t~ mclbstxnwbowlwouldcndup 7 getting- tbcy’dgctmcintroubk. 8 Aadsohc- oowhenltoMhimtbcquationsabout 9 mypbatthcParMgon, kJaid” Wdl, youcouMa~~ say 0 thattbcpcopkinLcgislativcAffairsgotitforywor 1 klpcd you get it.” 2 Andtkrcwasalotoftruthtotbat. lmcan. it 3 was a gcncrality. but that wns - I said “Well. that’s a 4 good idea. Okay.” 5 Q Was tkx any discussion of tbc book?

Page 198

1 A Yes. lbadaskedhimifkbadgotrentk. book 2 tbatIscntwithBettyaadksaidkdid, k~ likcd 3 it, andtbcn- Ihadwrincnhimthis- thisn~ thatl 4 badsortof- wrote- lthinkitwasSatutdaynigbtwhcnl 5 got bomc from tk movies and I had san tbc Titanic tbat 6 w& kcnd and it just was -just brought up a lot of fahgs 7 andthougbtsformcthatlputon- thatlputonpaper. 8 And so I sort of said somctbhg about. “‘ Oh. welL 9 I shouldn’t have writm some of those things in tk note ” 0 &cause. I was angry about seeing tk pictufc with tkm 1 romantic. it made me fal mlly stupid for bavmg sQIt this 2 kna. 3 And k said, “Yeah, you shouldn’t have wrin~ n some 4 of tbosc things.” Kind of along tk ways k imd said kfore, 5 about not writing particular things on paper. you know. 6 putting things to papa. So - 7 Q About how long was your t& pbonr call with tk 8 Prcsidart? 9 A Mayk 15 minutes. 0 MR. EMMICK: Anything dsc on that? .1 THE- S: ls& youtryingnottolaugh. :2 h4R. EMMICK: What about break- wise? Whc are VX? :3 Istbisagwodtimcforabwkordowcwanttokapgoiag? ‘4 THE FOREPERSON: Yes. Yes. !5 MR. EMMICK: All right

. * 1- 2 Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998

Page 199 1 THE FOREPERSON: I would say only five minutes. 2 MR. El+ MlCK: All right. Five minutes it is. 3 THE FOREPERSON: A fivc- minutc break. I’m sorry. 4 guys. okay. 5 (Witnes oux&. Witnss malhal.) 6 MR. EhIMICK: Madam Fm dowchfwcaquomm? 7 THE FOREPERSON: Yes, m do. 8 MR. EM? mX AR that any unaurJmizal pcrs0n. s 9 present7 0 THE FOREPERSON: Tbae arc nom 1 Monica, it’s my responsibility - 2 THJZWITNES: lkmw. 3 THE FOREPERSON: - to nznind you you’m still 4 IllldcrontlL 5 THEWrrNEss: okay. mInkyou. 6 BY MR. EMMlCKz 7 Q WcjustfiniskdtalkiagaboutJaawy%. Why 8 don’tmtumtoJammy6th. Onhmmry614didyoupick 9 upacopyofmC& aftaffiivitfmmEhak~ 10 A Yes. Idid. :1 Q YouhadmahrdauliutbatyouwaotiVunon 3 Jordantobokatit Didyoucontuctbim? :3 A Ycs. Idid. :4 Q Didyouspakwithbimpcxaom@ ndidyouspcak :5 withsommnccmhisst&?

Page 2Ob

1 A I don’t mally remember. 2 Q Anddidyoutrytogetacopyoftbcdraft 3 affidavit to Mr. Jadan? 4 A Yes. IdroppaioffaXmoxmpyinhisoffice. 5 Q Inhisofficz? 6 A Intbclobbyofhis- OfAkinGump. 7 Q Didyou& aoyammgmm tstoamtacthimin 8 or& rtotalkabouttbedfaRafmavi~?

9 A ~b&~~-~ tbinkI rcmemberGail~ hewas 0 inammtiogaudsomSngabout4: 00, tbatbcwasgoingto

I bcoutandhewouldcallmeat4: OO. 2 Q Didyoutalkwithhimonthc6thaboutthcdmft

3 affidavit? 4 A YwIdid 5 Q Allright. Telluswhatthctwoofyoutalkcd 6 about. 7 A Ihadhad!+ omc cmlcemsfrom1ookiIlgatthedlaft 8 affidavit and addles& those amamswithhimaodhc 9agreed. .O Q whatwcrctbc~ oftheumcems, ifyOU .I luncmbcr? 2 A Itbinkthatthc~ concerowaSthat .3 Mr. Cartcrhadinsertedsomcinftmnationaboutmehaving :4 possibly bcco alcmc with tbc Prcsitit for a few mioutc. s, I 5 bringinghimaMerinLqiabtive~~. I

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1 Q Would it help you if I showal you a copy of the 2 draftwithsomeofyourbaadwritingonit? 3 A oh Yes. 4 MREhfMIcK: I’mplacingbeforethewitnesswhath s markcdasGrandJuryExbibitML- 3.

, 6 (Grand Jtuy Exhibit No. ML- 3 was I marked for ide& kation.) 8 BY MR. EMMKK:

9 Q Canyoutclluswhatthisis?

11 0 A Sure. Dothegmndjurorshaveacopyofthis?

1 1 Q ?beyb.

1 2 A Okay. ThisisadmftofmyatXdavitthat

1 3 Ivlr. GlterdIewupbascdonlliscoavematkswithme.

1, 4 Q AndtkhaadwTitingonit? mistbat?

1 S A That’s my bandwriting. .

1 6 Q Thac’saiso~ unmdaiiningdsnmcscratch-

1 7 outs. 1 8 A h4mdmml.

1’ 9 Q Didyoudos4uoftbat?

21 0 A YeS.

2 1 Q can you rememberloolciagatthatnowwhatthetwo

2 2 of you talkI about?

2 3 A Ithinkthat- Ithinkthatitwas- Ithinkthe

2 2 5 tbz- tkconccrnwas, formeat~ wasnotwantingto

Page 202

1 give the Paula Jones attorneys any thought about why they

2 mightncedtowanttotalktome. SoifIhadmentionedthat

3 Ihadbeeniothereakme, itwouldlcindofmaketbunthi&

4 oh, well, what happened and did he proposition or blah, blah,

5 blah.

6 Andtbentbesecondtbingwasinthc- towardsthe

7 cndofparagraph8on~ 2, thcideaofwithcrowdsof

8 othcrpeople, Ithinktomwastoofarfrcnnthefakteuth?

9 Q WY.

1 0 A Doesthat- isthatckar? Sortof-& that

1 1 xemed to be too out of the realm of possibility, so --

1 2 Q Too implausible?

1 3 A had)‘. ‘IhankyOU. &l: bdk~ Ctht,)‘ OUhOW,

1 4 thatthisstatemenf~ wereothcrpeoplepnxentonall

1 5 ofthescoccasion&“ wassomethiq$ thatIdiscussedwith

1 6 Mr. Jordan.

1 7 Q Didheagreewitbthesuggesciasorthoughtsthat

1 8 you had on those two passages?

1 9 A Yes, I believe so.

2 0 Q WastbereanydkcussionwithM. r. Jordanabouttbe

2 1 portionofparagraph8sayingthattherewasnosexual

2 2 Elation& p?

2 3 A No.

2 4 Q Ataaytime, didMr. Jordanslythathedidn’twant

2 :5 to speak to you about the afmavitt?

. . a-. Pagem Thursday, August 6,199s

Page 203

1 A No. 2 Q How long was your conversation with Mr. Jo&&

3 A I don’trcmcmher. Not long. Wemayhavealso 4 talkedaboutjobstuff, too. But- s Q A. llright, then. Ixt’stumouratlentiontothe 6 llcxt day, which is the 7th. Ihat’s the day whca you 7 final& d and signed the affidavit. Is that right? 8 A Yes.

9 Q And you notarized it under pa& y of pajury.

0 A Yes.

1 MR. EMMIcK: Ibelieveyouhave- thisisthe 2 final vasion and it is Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 4. 3 (Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- 4 was 4 marked for identification.) 5 BYMR. EMMICK: 6 Q I’mplacingtbat before you.

7 A okay.

8 Q And it says “Affidavit of Jane Da No. 6” at the 9 topandithasyour~ right? 0 A h’h- hmm.

!I Q WbmyouspokewithFrankcartathatmomingin 2 ordutofmalizctbeafli& vit, doyouremanbcrwhatchanges 3 -made?

‘4 A whcnI!@ okewitbhimbefonIarrivedathis 5 offia or in his offia?

2 3

4 5

6 7 8 9 0

1 2

3 4

5 6 7

8 9 D If 2 3 14 Y

Q Eithertime. Page 204

A IhekvethatIsortofdictatedtohimthe ~- Ithinkthat’spossibleorIgavethemtohimin persa& I daa? Rally xmember. Mr. carter had pgared three diffmt versions of the affidavit for the sigkfkmt poRiOa& tedtothisarst, Iguss, theywaCalldeaying

sexuall& tionqallthEoftbcm. AndW% discussed variousthingsaboutitandcvcntuallydccidalonthis affkbit.

Q Allright. Lctmeaskyouastraightf~ question. Paragaph8atthestartsays,‘ Ihaveneverhad 8 sexual relationship with the President. ’ Is that true?

A No. Q All right. The next logical follow- up is, and maybe it’s self& dent, but why wee you willing to say something that was false under penalty of perjury?

A I don’t think that it’s anybody’s business. Q Okay. Lctmetumtbepageforyou. Attheendof paragraph& the stakmen~“ TheoccasionsthatIsaWthe Pnxident after I left my employment at the White House in April 1996 wat official nxcptions, formal functkms or evcatsf& tedtotkU. S. DepartmcntofDefenscwkfeIwas workingattbetime. -Iberewereotherpeopkpresenton tbost occasions.” That’s not correct &her, is it?

A No, it’s misleading.

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1 Q Okay. In what resptct? 2 A For me, at the tin% I said - well, it doesn’t say 3 tbeonly~ i~ butit’smisleadinginthatonertading

4 itwouldazannc thatthcontyoccasionsonwhichIsawthe 5 Residentwmthoslistcd 6 Q Right.

7 A ButIdidsomcjust@ inginsigningthcaffidavit, 8so- 9 Q Just&& g - &es the word “rationali&& apply 0 aswell?

I A Rationali% yes. 2 Q Ali tight. All right. On the 7th after you 3 aigncd the affidavit, did you keep a copy of the affidavit?

4 A Ycs, Idid. 5 Q WhaedidyougoIatrronthc7th? 6 A ToNcwYork- 7 Q DidyoutakeacopyoftheafEdavitwithyou? 8 A Yes. 9 Q my? 0 A IfIrcmcmberco~ y, IwaainarushandIkind

I ofwantcdtohaveit, ifIwantcdtolookitoveragainor- 2 Q Why wue you going to New York? 3 A Ajobinterview.

4 Q Did you have a job interview? 5 A Yes, Idid.

2 3

4 5 6

7 8 9 0

1 2 3

5 6 7 8 9 0

2 3 4

5 momutton. Ilhink csuycmcalnlcbltctokvingakd

Page 206 Q Wastkttknatday7

A Yes. Q Wright. Lct’sturnoursttattiontotbcjob interview on the morning of tbc 8th. Now. was that with McAndrrws & Forks?

A Yes. Thisismy- Ihnd- lmcan. justto remind everyone. I bad had sane job intavicws on the 18tb of Dccunba up in Nm York at McAndtcws & Forbes and Burson- tit& r. Ialsotookatcstonthe3OthIthink. of Deasnbu at Burson- Mandlcr and this is now anoth ittterviewatMchdzwstForbcsontbe8th.

Q& You rcmmlbuwboycuitt~ tithttMt morning?

A hmicDanan. Q Howdidthcintavicwgo? A Vay poorly. Q Okay. Tell us wby it wan poorly. What do you mean?

A IthinkitstartaioffontbcwrongfootbaxuscI was in a waiting room downstairs and I bad thought thy would kmclrrrowwhcnbcwasavailabkandI’dgotohisoffra atldinseldhcjustwalkalitl mulnIKMadandtbzh7vkw sartcd. soIwss- Ididn’tbavcmywitstqqbrrattbc momatt. AndIwas- Ijustwassottoffhstauifromthat

PagP Thursday, August 6,1998 I

1 intcrvicw. h4ayk

2 Q Howbagwnstkintavicw? 3 A Maybc2Ominulcs. 4 Q Was& attheodyintavkwtbstmotn~?

5 A Ys.

6 Q Wbatwasyowmtction-?

7 A Ivmsupsct. IfeJtbrmibk. Imightbavcmn 8 ctial. Iwasanbarratscd Itbo@ tbatIhadsoRof 9 anbanu& Mr. Jordan, Ithinkinsuchabadintu& w. :0 Q Afuhavingahdintuvkwlikethat. didyou ,I apcet an offu? ,2 A No, I didn’t think so. My fmt intavkw with :3 McAndfcws& FofixshW. lbaxltcaUy, rcalIygoodsoIwasn’t 14 tureaucttywirtwasgoingto~ pcabutIdidn’tthinkit IS Wu- 16 Q Nor~~ siw-

17 ACmoct 18 Q Whtdidyoudo~ youbttdtbatbadiaevkw7 !9 A Atsancpoitt~ IcalkdMr. Jordaotojttstktbim !O hnvtbathbadgonepow& !I Q Doyouranemba~ youphadcnccaUor !2 scvua1cahtoQytogetBhold0fhim7 !3 A I’msumIpIaozdscvual. Itwas- k’s

!4 dxficult 0 ga a kid of.

!5 Q DidyouwanuahymIktohimontk8th? Page 207

2 3 4

5 6 7 8 9 0

1 ,2 ,3

4 5

6 7

8 9 !O !1 !2 !3 !4 !5

Page 20; A YqIdid Q Whatdidyouttllhim? A Itoldhimthatithadn’tworkcdoutandthatIwas askinghisadviceonwhctherIshouldwntact Burson- MarstellcrornotandthatIwasumcenxithatthc McAndmws & Forbes hadn’t gune well.

Q AtthetimeyouweretaIkingtohim, wereyoustill upset about the intcwiew7

A Idon’trnally runcmhcr. I’msumIwas. Itwas kindofadcpre& ngthingaiIday.

Q Anddidhesaywhathewasgoingtodohecaumthe in~ IwInotgoncwcu?

A Yes. Q Wbatdidhcrqf? A Heaaidhc’dcaUthachaimnm. Ithoughtkwas kidding.

Q Okay. Anddidhccallyoubacksomctimcshortly

A Yes, hedid. Q Abouthowlongaftcrhccallcd-- excuseme. About howlongafterhcaaidhewasgoingtocallthechabmandld hecaIlyouback? Ifyollremeinbcr.

A Idon’t Irmemba. Idnn’tthinkitwasvcrylong after, but- I

Q WhatdidhcaaywhcuhecaIIaiback?. I

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Page 20s 1 1 A ‘hatnottowon’y- youknow, Idoo’t remelnbertk 2 exactwordsthatkuxd Tkgistoftkconversation~ 3 that, youknow, tkwuegoingtocallmcandeverythngwas 4 goingtokokay. 5 Q Didksaythatkhadgottenaholdoftk 6 ckinnancudidknrntiootbatataII~- 7 A Idcm’truwmbcr.

8 Q DidRzvlaaar MeA& ews& Faizspczsonxlgeta 9 holdofyoulaterafterMr. Jordancalled? 0 A Yes. ?beycahdtosetupS? nintcrvh’form 1

1 withsoma3oedhtlyatRevlonfortknextday. 1

2 Q Doyouxememkraboutwhmitwastbatyouwexe 1

3 caIledIateroothe8th? 1

4 A Ithi& itwaSSX# metim~ ycvening. 1

5 Q myevaring? 1

6 A *evening. 1

7 Q WcreyousuqGcdbytkcalI? 1

B A Froan having kard from Mr. Jadan, not 100 percent. 1

9 Q Allright. lheysetupaointen’iewforthenext 1

3 day? 2

I A Yes. 2 2 Q Didyoubave8ninterviewtheaextday’? 2 3 A Yes. 2 1 Q Who did yoe interview with? 2 5 A EllenSeidman. 2

Page 21 I

1 A 1bckveitwasElknSdman. 2 Q Okay. You made a rdamce earlier m tlus gmnd

3 jury appnna to a cumudon you had with Linda Tripp M 4tk9th

5 A Ys. 6 Q Wc’rcnowmtbc9tb~~ IIcantellyouwouldl&~ 7 tomlkabmtthisconvcrhon. Tcllllabolltyour 8 wovusatimwithLindaT~ poomC9th. Let’sstartwitb 9 hitbappcaod. 0 A Wdl, Iwasmurn& Linda’scallfmmmrliuin 1 tbcwcckaadItbinkImadcscoupkofatanptstogda 2 holdofbcrrthaoff~ and~ Ididgdintauchwith 3 kr, IroklberIwapmepaypbmcbcCausclwasmncancd 4 abouttkpbmes. 5 AndIjust- I- Ididn’t- Iwnsvay 6 distru& ulofbaatthispoint. cspceiaUywhmIfpotgot 7 oatkpbmewitbhcr. Ididn’trcallyknowwilywewrrr 8 goingtobcintmchattbispoint, fromwhtbadbappawd 9 mcl% wwcrk, bcfac. 0 sosbcstfUtedouttkmovesatiecl, 1tbiuk, 1 askiqmcymkIKnv. wimtwasgoiIY8oowitbmyjobstu. ffaQd 2 ~andItokikrIdidn’thavcajobyctandtbat1 3 hadn’theardfromE& ty. tbePnSchforMr. Jordansina 4 DcCunbuandIdidn’tknowwbatwas8oiagalanflaomurae 5 discu.% singtbat. Aodrbatwasnoteucobvioualy.

Page 210 I Q Andwhatwastktoneofthatinterview? 2 A Itweotveryti. Itwas- 3 Q BetterthanwithJamieDernao?

t A Yes. .S Q All right.

6 A It was a very good interview. 7 Q Did you interview with otkrs at Revlon as well? 8 A Yes. 9 Q ~YOU ttmunber about how many interviews tkre Owere?

I A Two others, aside from Ms. Seidxnan’s. 2 Q And you mentioned &at tk intcn+ ws ment well. 3 Aftertheintaviews, didyougiveacalltoVcrnontold 4 himhowhowthiogswuegoiug? 5 A Ithinkso. 6 Q Lata that day, did you have anotkr call from 7 Revlon? 8 A FromRevlon? 9 Q Mm- hmm.

D A Yes, Idid 1 Q Tell us about that. 2 A lkysortofinhmallyoffcredmapositionand1 3 informally accepted it. 4 Q Doyouranankrwhoitwasyouwereqxakiogwith 5 atthetixx?

Thursday, August 6,1998

1 1 1 1 1 1 1

21 2 2 2 2, 2

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1 hdtbmsktokimethatsbctmdgoncupto

2 NewYorkovuChisn~~ tobewitb- IthinkN~ amahnasis 3 bcrnamc, andthatwhilcskwasinNmYorkdur@ t& 4 bolidaysskcsboppiqwitbMs. Asnessandthisother 5 womanmMadisonAvmmbuyiqsbasandtbatrhiswomanhad 6 toldLindaskwasrcaUysawyandLindaabouldmovetoNcw 7 YorkandgaaPRjobinNewYork. WhicbItbo@ twasa 8 liakrtmngcsincc1wasintbcpmcessofmovingto 9 NewYcdforaPRjob. 0 l% atwasjustoncoflkindicationstbatmn& mc 1 thinkskwasatittlcbitjcdousoftkidpIwasgcthg, 2 tht1wumlkiagaboutcdicr. 3 !GowimwcsmraitodiscusstkcasGskloldIllc

4 tlmt- tbarbozalJSoftbis qaiaIcesbelmdhsdinNew 5 Y& skdccickdtbatmaybeitwoukibebestforkrtobe 6 FcallyMgucmtbctruthaboutKatblunWilky. Youknow. 7 sbereallydidn’tknowanythill& skdidn’treallyrumnbcr 8 mucb. andtbat- youkoow. kdmeto- andIbekveak 9 may& vc~ saiddirutlytharskwasn’tgoingtotcll 0 aboutmcortbatIwas- youkrrow. myundcn~ ofthat

1 wasthatskwasn’tcvmgoiagtoInaltionmcandtbatIwas 2 safe. 3 Q Didthismmcasasuzprisetoyou? 4 A Ycs. itdid. 5 Q lntitway?

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Page 219

1017 In Re: Grand Jury Procahgs Multi- PagCN Thursday, August 6, 1998

Page 21’

1 pagaandsaitwas~ ofa- aotagoodthingtohappcn. 2 Q Whyuseanyfaken8mlqKayoranyotbernamc? 3 what’srht~ yw’vegottousefakcnamtsatthistime? 4 A Iwasbeyondpaxxmoid Imcan, I-- andobviously 5 in&& l. Ithinktk- IcouldnotrmdastandhowIhad 6 bccndraggcdiutotbcPauIaJonescascaadsoIwaswaywar 7 ofebqthbg. 8 Q WhatdidI3ct. Iysay, ifyoucanr~ 1~~ ber, whenyou 9 suggedthatyourezatooncaaothcrcSKay? 0 A Okay. 1 Q Okay. Didsheaskwhyor- 2 A Idon’t- haYingthiscon~ onwithhcr.

3 Q Wright. Wereyoualsousiquamcstorcferto 4 others? Forexamp& tbenamcMary? 5 A yes. 6 Q WhodidMaryrderto? 7 A Linda. 8 Q AndwhywueyouusingthenameMatytoreferto 9 Linda? 0 A Baxtusctbat’swhatshecbose. 1 Q AndwhywexeyouusiqanynamcothcrthanLindatc 2 refer to Linda? 3 A BecauseLindaandBettyweretbttwopeoplewho 4 paged me that were involved - you know, somehow fell into 5 thiscircleofthePaulaJoncsstory. Isthat- it’snot

Page 218 1 clear. I’m spry. Okay. 2 Q whenyouwatspeak@ withLindaaboutthe 3 President, did you somebcsrcfcrtotkPresidentas” her” 4 rather than “him”?

1 1

1 1 1 1 1

1 1 1 2 2 2 2

2 2

I 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2

2 2 2

6 7 8 9 0

1 2

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5 6 7 8 9 :0 :1 12 :3 14 5

A Linda? No. Idon’t btkveso. BY MS. IMMERGUT: Q SothatwasBctty? A Yes.

BY MR. EMMICK: Q Okay. Andwhydidyouuse” her~ torefertothc Resident?

A ~b& vethatthatwas~ yinpagestobaand

itwasjust- youknow, IkncwthattheWAVES- from havingworkedattheWbitcHouse, Iknewthatpcoplehad accesstothcWAVESpages, letaloncthatsomcotxtypes them, soitjustwasanothcrmeasurc of caution that I used throughout.

Q All right.

A I don’t think I ever xeferted to the Resident on Betty’s pages.

Q When we were talking earlier about your clarifying whehr John Hilley would give you a recommendation, you indicataltIaatyouhadapagcfmmBctty. Doesitrcfrcslt yourtrcoIlectionaboutwbatthcpagesaidifIwexetoread the foIlowing?

1 We hfivc a page indicating that it says. “Will how 2 som& ing sam. Kay.” Does that mind you abow any pager 3 thatyeugotfnnnBtlly?

4 A Ycs.‘ lthinkImahonaicarkrtbatsk~~

5 mdthmlralLedu, hcrLarathatday~ foundoutabout 6 JobnHillcy. 7 Q Allright. Didyou- atromepoinfdidprcnd 8 mR& ottaleecrgivittgthantktworccotnme& tions. onc 9 ofwhi& wasJobnH& y? IO A Ys. II Q. byou fumttbuwhmthatwas? 12 A IbdiwcIfwditantk14thofJatmaty. 13 Q Sotbatwouldbctljcnatday. 14 AGXlWt. I5 BY h4R. WISBNBERG: 16 Q F’ardatnut. We~~ tbcymmmmmdationsor

17 rdermca? Jttstasatcclmhl~. ittotba~. 18 wrrttlmynrmesawuctkyactualkttcrsof 9 rocmnnmbtioa? !O A oh. Tkyuarefacncfftkzt. !l BY MR. EMMICK: !2 Q Allright. Lct’sgobscktothc13tbfarplltr 13 ~tbeclruseyoumctwithL~ daTripp~ t~, 1thinLyw 14 said. ontk9thyotlbad- !5 A IalsomtSwithMr. Jordan.

Page 220

I Q Oby. Allright. Okay. WdLkt’sgokckto 2 A4r. Jotdao. tlu1. 3 A We& I- 1mom. Iwasjttstthkingabout~ 4 day. I’m scmy. 5 Q No, tbnt’s fm. That’s fm. 6 A JustIstoppaIintoxcbimforfivcmitmxs, to 7 thankhimforgutingmetkjob. andIgavchimatk: attda 8 pockusqt~~~. 9 MR. EMhACIcz okay. IO BY kls. MMERGVT: I1 Q DidpttmrpmvidcMr. Jordattwitbasignalwpy I2 oftkaffitivit? 13 A Ididnotpmwkkbimwithacopy. No.

14 Q Doywktwwwktbnnotkevu~ acqty? I5 A IklieveIsltowdhimacopy. Idat’thmwthst 6 kxcccivedawpy. 7 BY MR. EMMlCK: 8 Q Onthissamemating~ tk13tb? 9 A I- I- yottknow. IhavctosayIknowIht& tt !O tkcopywitbmeu, sbowhitnandIxnaykwcnidyott~, !l "Ihyotiwattt@ seeitT' AndIthinkkmaykwnotevm-

!2 Ithinkk~ y~~ ra~ youLnow.“ I~ trredtosaiL” !3 Or- I- !4 BYMS. IMMERGvT: !5 Q Soyoudon’tspaifiitc& bandingitwerw

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Page 221 Page 223 him or em showing it to him specifically. I Gntbe14th. tkncxtday?

2 A Gkay. 3 Q R&& t

4 A okay. 5 Q Thcre’sUuupicccsofprpa~ tkvecomctok 6 rcf~ toastktaIk@ points. 7 A Yes. 8 MR. EMMICK: ItbiukwekvctkmmarkcdasGmnd 9 July ExhibJt ML- S. 0 (Gmad Jury Exhibit No. ML- 5 was 1 ma& al fur idaltifiition.) 2 BYMR. EhfMICK 3 Q I’llpbcethaninhtdyau.

4 A ohy. 5 Q Aadtkyaretlxcc~. IwonduJfyouwuuJd 6 eJJushtboreametokwxhmutdoawktcomputaand 7tklikc 8 A Gky. FirstofaJl. tbcy’rcoutofor& r. 9 Q Okay. !O A SotkJastpqcwasactMlytkfirst~ qc. !I Q AlJrigh~ Wdl+ kit’scbmify. Whtisnowtbe !2 f~ j? age8ays@ mintstlllJMkeiIlaffidavit.” Andthe

13 sccondpagcgys, nIhefintfcwpangrsphr” attktup. !4 AndtJIctbifd~ say& Tou’rcnotsulcyuu’vcbecacJcaf.” Y ~dxkdpagcsJnmkiktbefu% p@ A

13th.

No.

Butyuubroughtitforhimto- IdidbtingJt. JvIS. IMMERG~ const BY MR. EMMICK: Aurigbt. sotbat’stkVaTKmJordanJMrtoftk

wt. What about tkmahlg with Linda Tripp? 1twasIwg. Iwas- IwasvcTymvous. Iwas waryofbu. Iactuallytbarghtskmightkveatape raoKkrwJtbJr. 7andJladJookdiubabagwJlalskJMdgonc uptotktesbwm. ItoJdhaawhdtbuDchofJkstbst dsy.

Q WktwucyoutxyiogtoecomJhhinmetingwJth ha?

A Iwastryiqto- Ims~ tamakcLinda continue to feel dortabk that sk and I wae sort of on tk- tJmtmwaeontJlcsamcsid% weuucontJletigJlt side.

We- andtbet- wharIkdagrcedtomatwith hr. Itboueht~ wacgoingtogoowkindofhas~~ forwktskwasgoiagtodointhtcaJeandtbeamcewcgot tog& x. skJhndofstartaJwavuingaboutwktsbewantaJ

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todoandtbcn- soJjustwasusingevaythingIknmto bytoconvinccJlcrtkt- tbattbisistkrightthingto do.

Q Ithinkyoumahoncdcarliertktyoutoldkr lies.

A Yes. Q Wktlicsdoyoukveinmind? A Imeut. Ithink- hrougkuttktmonthof &cunber. rftcrIJmcwshewassubpoaum& hacuwcvarious hingstktIthinkIsaidtbatwucuntnebutI specifically runember from tbis meeting tbc thing tkt I had- wbatIsaidurLindawas.“ obyouknow. Itold- I told Mr. Jordan tkt I wasn’t going to sign tk affxhvit until I got the job.” Gbviously. which wasn’t true.

I told lxz I didn’t yet kvc a job. Tkt wasn’t true. I told kr I hadn’t signed the affidavit. That wasn’t true. ItoldbatktsomctimcovcrtkklidaysIkd f~ outandmymomtookmctoGcq@ own Hospital and they put me on Paxil. lht wasn’t true.

IthinkItoldkrtkt- youJcnow. atvarious timestbcRaidcntandMr. J~ kdtoldmcIkdlb~. That wasn’t true. That’s just a sumll cxampk. Prokbly s~ llc mart things about my mom. Linda kd an obsession with mymom. soskwasagoodkvuagc.

Q J. et’stumourattaeionbe+ cktotJx14&, then.

Thursday, Auast 6.1998

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A &. s. Q Allright. bt’sgotofirstthtnwhani~ ofbow thQmgenaated

A Mm- llmm.

Q WattbOSCpAEdflWklyaUrpiDtCf!

A YeS. Q W= bry*- Y- camputa?

A YeS. Q wasanycmept?! smtwithyouwbentheywuctypcd? A No.

Q wl== theytypcd? A on th 14th.

Q Didyoutalkwithanymcinaacfbttoga

assistanccaii~ orwritingor~~ forwbntis in the talking points?

A No. Q Howdidtk- whedidyougcttheickasthatare fCflCCtCdhtkUiIk@ pOhtS?

A -fhcywaebascdoaamversationsh’cbadu’itb Lindafromthe moment Klthlrm WiJlcyaDd Michael Isikoff

cverentcdintotbcpicturemtilthccommati~ Ihad withkrtbcItmlingoftht14thontllephone.

Q Tellmewhatyoumcanbytbat. A Atvarioustimcs, cspaziallycarlyon, dM8rch I

orsowhen- wimnKathlanwiifvsttmmeup, Linda I Pw 221- Page 224 Diversified Rmorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

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talkedabouthow- youknow, tkit- that-- whatKarhlm wassayingmMichaclIsikoffwasnotme. Andso, you ~ow, wchadbad- IIcmcm~ bavingthisdiscussimwitb hawkrcwewueaay& wcl4if- youknow, ifsbE’s lyingtokIichclIsikoff, hmvdopukBowabedidn’tlicic Yau?

Linda~“ Ycah, that’sagoodpoint. Maybe* did.” Youhow?

AndIsaid,“ Yc& sxe. Shcouldhavc, youknow, smearcdkrownlipstickandumuhibammblous. ’

And Linda said, “ycallq it’s true.” That WBS vuy early CQ and throughout my dismsionswithLinda, tspeciallywknsbewassaying-

St@ lgthillgSaboptbowtObCVJgllCOatllCKathl& nWillcy

issueinthF’aulaJomscase,~ hadtkscsatsof dkcussims.

Q Whatdidyoudowithtktalkiugpoin~?‘ howdid you rehy tkm to Linda Tripp?

A ~tOOkaCOpyOftbEXItObU.

Q hdhowwuctl= ammgammmadetogivchcrthat copy?

A Sbehadtoldmesbcwasgoingtogosecber attomcy, Kirby, thataftanoonmdwasgoingtotalkto~ aboutsigninganaffi& Vi~ whiChiswhythiswaSall genemted. AndsoIofferedtodrivebertheRsotbafm

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couldjusrtalLranthcwaybecaust~- wehadhad~ timc

totalktktmomin& butnotasmuchasIwanted. Q Wbowasdriving? Youwuzdrivhq? A Yes. Q AndLmdakstktalkiagpdntsinbt? knds?

A Ibandcdtbantokrintk~~ toftk Pentagon.

Q Didskrardthn? A Yes. skdid. Q Wktwassksayiqordoingasskwasnzadiq thlt?

A Skwasgoingthtoughitaadskwassortof teadin and goit& “yeah Mln- kmL ub- huh. WCIL tkt’s true. oh. good point.”

1tbinkskmaykvesaid” ohtkseare- this is really - &at’s (NC.” You how. “Did you write this? Sort of a thing.

Q Okay. WktdidyoutbinkwaJdkppenhyou

dfOppCdthCtdkhgpOintsOfftOLilXbMdthUlyoUdroppCd

Lindaoff HowWuetbingsIchIgncasisanotkrwayto ask tkt qttestion.

A Iklievetktit~ intkarridthamctktsk said- madesoux cwtmKnttomeakM- tk~ W& sbq- skfchkay- andtbismightbavtbacnontkl3&&

i Pagem Thursday, August 6, 1998

Page 227

1 tellingthetruthorbeingvagueonthetntthwhenshetalks 2 tome, buttbcnwhenshedoem’ttalktome, she-- herrmnd 3 smstowa& rtodiffmatthings, soIjustrcmember 4 fccling- ob, IikcIhadtoholdhcrhandthrougheveryrhing 5 andIumstantlyhadtotalktobcr. SoImayhavesaid 6 “I’ll eaU you tonight” or xmteth@ like that. _. 7 Q HavcyoucvcrtalkedtoBruceLndsey? 8 A No. Imeyhavesaidbellotohiminthehall, but 9 I- but- justinpassing.

0 Q IJ& ow& rtallcwithtbeRtsidcntabbutthe

1 talking points?

2 A No. 3 Q DidyoucvcrtalkwithanyoncatBobBezmett’sf~ 4 aboutthecaIkingpoints? 5 A No. 6 Q Didyoucvcrtalkwithanyoncassock@ withtbc 7 WhiteHouseintmywayaboutthetal. kittgpoints? 8 A No. And that would include Mr. Jordan. 9 Q Okay. Lct’slumouratkntioa, th, tothencxt 0 day, whichisJanuaryl5th. DidBcttycaUyouthatday

1 aboutacallskhadreceivedfromMikeIsikoff? 2 A Yes. 3 Q Okay. Tell us about that tcleplxnte call. 4 A Ihadieamedearlierf~~ y~ thatthe 5 PaulaJonespeoplebad- had-& l, lguessmyattoraq

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kdaskalmtsmmhingaboutifIkdevuxu&~ any courierpackagmftcattkWbkHouseandIkdn’t. butI toIdbimIdid- IdidsatdthingstoBdtyattdksaid,~ wcUkkdhcard- Ithinkttmn@- mayktbro@

Bcmndspsopk- Mr.& nacn’otirm. tbt~. I’m

sorry. Idon’tmMtoksoittformaLtkttIucwassome iSSUCwithtkSCcarrier- WitllaCotUiUravice.

SoIcalkdthecom+ scrvicemdwasabkto

findwttkttktccadscouidksubpcuaaaIandtka1 spokewithBdtyktathetday~ sktaldmethat- that MickclIsikoffkdcalkdhaorkdcalkdforkrintan andButykdanswaedtkpkneattdintkcowseoftktk kdasMhaabottttk&. tVscadingthiagstoI= tbmughawuricr.

And tkt sk sort of said sk didn’t really runankrorknowwktkwastalkingaboutaudtktk’dga back to ha. Or sk’d 8et back to him. I’m sony.

Q Andthkcalkdyothdr& t& bistoyou? A Yes. Yes. Q Wktwasyattrreactiontotkt? A Iwasveyskckedaadvuy- fer& ttgvay strangr& thatsanckwthiswascbsinginmaeattdI- I didn’tknowhowtbyeouIdkvegoaeatItisittformatiooakut tkcouriukcaumtbuewas- tkfpst-@ axnttbatI thoughtoftkt~ abouttkcottt+ wasLittdaandtkady i

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Page 23 1 / 1 BY MR. WISENBERG: I

2 Q I~ Ihope, justoneortwoquestionsabout 1 I Re: Grand Jury hccedings Multi- Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998

Page 229 /

I 0thcrpersonI~ o~ tofwasthisgentlcmaninmyofficcwha I

2 was a Clinton hater, Mark Huffman. So I thought that

3 maybe- 1thought, wc~ maybehehad~ thcoaewfiohad 3 yourproffa.

4 sortofturnedme, tryingtocausetrouble. 4 A okay. 5 Q AU right. What did you and Betty talk about doing 5 Q Your written proffer. Can you grab a hold of that?

6 infesponsetotkIsikoffealls? 6 A SW.

7 A ~RsidcntwasoutoftownthatdayaadsoI 7 Q AndwbatarewecalIingthat? That& ML- 1.

B thinkshesaidsbewasgoingtotrytogetiatouchwithtbe 8 A okay.

9 P&& ntaudIbclievethatBctty~ dImayhavcdiscussed 9 (Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML- 1 was

D that, youhoWtbcv= -thcC0WiCrpackegcsWCMlwayS I 1 0 xnarkcd for idcntificatio0.)

I senttohexandthatsomeofthethingswereforher, you 1 1 BY MR. WISENBERG:

2 know. 1 2 Q Ifyou’Iltakealookatpage4, paqraph4, that

3 Q Did Vernon Jordan come up? 1

4 A Yes. Iknowlatcr- andIdon’tiuunvifn& xshe I

5 mentionedtomearrliainthe& ythatshew; mtedtotryto I

6 get in touch with Mr. Jordan, but I do know that -.& at I

7 IaterintheeveningBettycalledmeand~ meifIcould I

B give her a ride to Mr. Jordan’s offk because Bob, her 1

9 husband, hadtheauthatdayanditwaskning. So- 1

0 Q So you drove her to Vernon Jordan’s 2

1 A Yes. 2

2 Q &scribewhathappenedwbenyoudrophaoff. 2

3 A Well, aetually, IparkedtheearandIdeei& dto 2

4 wait for her downstairs in the restaurant. I tbink it’s ‘Ibe 2

5 Front Page. And she went up to Mr. Jo& m’s ofhe and wan 2 5 omsion, whenwvrkingattbeWhiteHouse, shebroughthir

1 Page 23, 1 lettaswbcnnooneelsewasarou0d.” 2 HaveIrcadtbatamectly? HaveIreadtbat 3 sentenccannxtl~ 4 A Yes. 5 Q Ckay. AndIthinkyoubweearkr& saibedthat

6 asa- maybenotinthesecxaetwords, butyousawitasa 3 hastodowithtbePmkient’scautoyou.

4 A Yes? 5 Q Attwoam. oothc17thofDecemktellingyou, 6 anloqotherthiDg& thatyou’reonthewitncssli$ comct? 7 AComct. 8 Q Goingtotkmiddkportion, statt@ with” when 9 &al. ’ =whcna!& edwhttodoifshewassubpocnaedthe o ksi& ntqgestaIshemIdsignanafIidavitandtryto 1 satisfytbzkinquiryandnotbcdcpoecd 2 Ahh- ti

3 Q Tbencxtsmtemeesays,“ Inge. nm& Ms. L. should 4 say& evisirr. dtheWhiteHousetoseeMs. Cmieand, on

Page 230 1 the may& 15.20 minutes. I’m not vay @ with time. 2 Q Why didn’t she just take a taxi tbuc? It’s a

3 the. four dollar taxi ride up the. 4 A I don’t know. 5 Q Okay. Howlongdidyouwait? 6 THEwlTNESs: Youkncnv. 1nadt0usctherWr00m. 7 MR. EMMICK: Okay. 8 THE WlTNESS: I’m sorry. 9 MR. EMMICK: The wimcss needs a break.

1 THE FOREPERSON: Yes. I MR. EMMICK: Okay. Thank you.

1 THE -S: Two minutes. 1 MR. Eh4MtCX l- bat’s all right.

t (Witocss acuscd. Witness rsalkd.)

I MR. WISENBERG: Let tk record rcfkct the witnas 5 bas~ tucdtbcgrandjwyrwm.

1 Madam Fmoa do we have a qttotum? B THE FOREPERSON: Yes. 3 MR. WISENBERG: Any unauhrizal puxms pnxxnt? 3 THE FOREPERSON: None.

1 MR. WISENBERG: Anything you want to say? 2 THE FOREPERSON: Monica kwinsky. I JUS! waned to

3 kty0ukn0wtbaty0lJarcstillundcroath. 4 THE WlTNEss: Really? 5 THE FOREPERSON: h& rhnm. Yes, I mesa.

7 8

9 1

3 I 5

5 7 3 3 3

2 3 4 5

I( 1 1:

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umtinuati0nonhispartoftbepmstablisbalpattcmof thingsbcbadsaidinthepast. Isthatcorrcct?

A Ya. Q Allright. Andwouldyouagreewithmethatthat is- tbatifyousaidthattotbeJonespeopleartoanybody elsethattbatismislmlinginasemsebeeauseitdoesn’t tclltbzwholestoryofwhatyouwwedoiiwhenyouvisited tbe Pmidmt.

A Yes. Q Takalookat- thenIwouldlikeyoutotakea look at page 10. I think it’s page 10, it’s paqraph 10, whatmer page it is.

A =ay.

Q Mint’s eut off. It’s the last - I think it’s the last page.

A Right. Q I’ll read it. “Ms. L. had a physiealiy intimate relatioosbip with the Fksideot. Neither the Resident nor I

Mr. Jo& naanynneontbeirbehalfaskedaawmagal I

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I Rc: Grand Jury Rocecdings MUIti- PSgtm Thursday, August 6,1998

Page 232 1 Ms. L. tulic.” IwouldlikyoufarUtorccollcilcifyou 2 can that statunmt in your pmffcl with statanalts like tk 3 oncsinpamgmph4uJhucyartalkaboutrpaifiithingstbc 4 mGdaltsaidadidtkt~ kinfIafcontiuuationsofthis s pattml. 6 A Sutc. Gosh. Ithinktomctbtif- iftk

7 F? csi& lthadnotsaidtheBenyandkouscovu, Ict’s 8 justsay, ifmrsfcrtotba& wi% I’mtaIkiQJaboutia 9 pa1agmph4, plgc4, Iwaukihavekn~ 11tuusethat. 0 SOtomc,~~ diDgUlCtOiiCWOUld

1 have- youkmw, iftb3RtsidentbadrriQwow, lisren.

2 Youbct& notaayanyUlgabauttbirfelatimship, you 3 butcxMt~ tknltkzmit4youkmnot-” 4 Formr, tbcbcstwaytoa@ inhowIfccIwhat s happmedwas, yalknow. nooarrkrdaclrcaPsgcdmetok 6 butnaollcdismun& mcdtber. 7 Q Okay. Soyousaidwhatyaiwouidhavedoo;‘ iftbc 8 Rrsidmt hadn’t said that, but bc did say thas what you 9 ma& lncd in paragraph 4, c& lnuz? 0 A Right. 1 Q AndIgvess- andyouhadaconvusationwithhixn 2 aboutwhattodogiflsthatyouhothlarcwWt7CUKk 3 subpccna, thcnyougetthecaUfmmBUty. Thoscthings 4 happcnai. whalwediscrwcdthisoaMondayintheproffa 5 sssion. IthinLyouEPid~ tothccffcctoforrhat

Page 234 1 inpamgmph10you~ bciDgpnatylitrral. Isthat 2 accurate? Whm you say that ua one ax0urage. i you - told 3 you or encoulaged you to k?

4 A Ycaandno. Imcan. IthinkIalsosaidtbat 5 Mondaythatitwacn’tasiftbcRcridcntcallcdmcandsaid 6 ‘You know, Monica, you’re Cal tk witness list this is BOiug 7 tokrcallyhaKIforus. m’rcgoiagtohavctotcutbe 8 rruthandbchumiliatedinfronrofthemtireworldabour 9 what we’ve done.” which I would have fought him on probably. 0 T& it was diffelmt. I AndbyhimnotcaUingmeandsayingthat. you

1 know, IknewwhatthatmcaIlt. SoI- Idm’tsceany- I I don’t sa any disconnect bctunrn paragraph 10 and paragraph 4

I ontbzpagc. r& cstbatansbu your question?

5 BY MS. IMh% ERGW: 5 Q Didyouunderstanclallaioagtbathewoukidenyrbc

I relationship also? 5 A I& n- hmm. Yes. 2 Q Andwknyousayyouuadentoodwhatitnxantwhcn

I k didn’t say, “Oh, you know. you must tell tk truth” whst

I didyouunderstandtbattornean? 1 A That- that- asmkdaoevwyotbZ? oCcasiim 3 andevayothcritlstanaofthis~~ p, mwwldckny 1 it. 5 MR. WISENBERG: That’s all I have on that. And

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I probably not anything else. Maybe. 2 MS. IMMERGUT: I had a couple of quick qucsuon;

3 THE- s: sure. 4 BY ‘MS. IMMERGUT: S Q Backforjusta mommttoJaouaryl5thwithtbc 6 visit~ youtook& ttytoVcrnonJordaoaftcrshehad~ ’ 7 ci& d by Micbzl lsikoff. 8 A ti- hmm. 9 Q DidyouevertcllIwls. Curriethatyoubadbcen 0 eaUedbyh4iehaellsikof?? 1 A No. I

2 Q Hadyoueverb& ncalledbyMichaelIdkoffbefm ’

3 January 15tl1?

4 A No. I’mttyingto rcmunkrnow- IIwthatI shadaecntkNewsw& thingligbtttponmyeallerID, butI 6 dat’t tcmemberiftktwasmwndthattimeoriftbatwas 7 later, oneetkscatldalstFnted. 8 Q Do you feeall any ea& from MiEhacl Isikoff that 9 you would have told Betty about, calling about gifts from the !O Resident? !I A No. Absolutely not.

2 Q You mentioned, dwiously, that you’ve @en tk !3 President several gifts. Have you given bim any ties?

14 A Yes. 15 Q Howmanytiesk~ yougivenhim, just

Page 23t 1 approximately? 2 A six. 3 Q Have you had any ecmvusations with the Mdatt 4 about wearing your tics? S A Almost all Of OLP COov6LLtionS ittCb. Ukd Sot& h@ 6 about my ties. 7 Q Couldyoujustbricflydescrikwhatthiogstkt 8 you’vesaidtohimandktoyouaboutwearingtktis? 9 A Iusedtobughimaboutumringooeofmyties 0 bemlsetkn1kncwIwasclosctohisheart. 1 Q Anddidkevusayanythingabout- aftakkd 2 oneofyoo+ tiesortoaktywwknkkdwomanyofywr 3 ties? 4 A Y~~, tkrewer~ s~~ aaloe~& ons. 5 Q And what kind of thing would k say to you? 6 A “Did you see 1 wore your tie tk other day?” 7 Q Sowaskawarebasedonthingsyouhadtoldhirn B thatyouwouldklmkiogoutforwknkwouldwzartiesa 9 variousoeeasioos? D A Yes. 1 MS. IMMERGUT: I’d like to show you now what’s 2 marked as Grand Jury Exhibits ML- g. 9 and 10. 3 (Grand Jury Exhibits No. ML- 8, I ML- 9andML10umemarkaIfor

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In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings h4u. l

Page 23’ I MS. IMMERGUT: And. unfommatcly. I don’t have

2 copisyaforth: grandjurybecauscwegottbematthc 3 last- 4 MR. WISENBERG: I’ll pass thrm around aftawerdr. 5 MS. IMMERGVT: Okay. And I’ll spmul them out for 6 you&.

7 THE WrrNEss: oluly.

8 BY Ms. IMMERGuf:

9 Q Dirreting your awation fast to ML- S, it’s a

1 0 photograph of tk Rcsidmt. obviously. Do you rccogniz tk

1 1 tic that k’s weariog in that photograph?

1 2 A Yes, Ido.

1 3 Q Had you actually scat that on %lcvision on June

1 4 24. 1998?

1 5 A Yes. Idid.

1 6 Q Doyour& aUwhatthat’sinrr; ladontoarwkt . .

I 7 avent is being dcpicti on that photogmph?

1 8 A HewaskavingforChina.

1’ 9 Q And now directing your attention to Exhibit 9. do

2 D you know what that’s a photograph of?

2 1 A I don’t know whaz it’s ftrxn, but it’s the

2 2 Rsidcnt uraring my tic.

2 3 Q And this one states it’s Monday. July 6.1998. Do

2, 4 you rcmanber watching any of the media on that da*?

2. 5 A Yes, I do.

t < ,

l( 1 1: 1: 11 l!

I( I’ II

2( 2: 2 2 2 2

Page 232 1 Q And do you remember seeing him wrarin8 your tie on 2 thatdate? 3 A Yes, I do. 4 Q Do YOU remember what event was taking place on that 5 date that he was wearing your tie? 6 A I don’t, but I just saw it says “Medicare costs,” 7 so- B Q Okay. And then finally, ML- IO. Do you recognize 3 what that’s a photograph of? 3 A Yes. 1 Q And what is that? 2 A The President wear@ the same tie. 3 Q And do you know what date that is? 1 A Date? Itwasafew& ysafter, heworethetie 5 when he came back from China, so it’s July 9th. 5 Q Okay. And what -- I guess -- did you reach any 7 conclusions from the fact that k was wearing your tie on 3 those days? 3 A I-- I-- Ithink- thefvsttimeheworetbe 1 tie, I tbought maybe it was a coincidena, but I didn’t 1 reailythinkso. Andthenwheaheworeitwhenbecamebac~ 2 fromChinaonth: 6th, Ithoughtmaybeitwasaranindaof 3 JuIy4tI& becausethathadlJeenthefirstworkdayafter 4 July 4th and we had had a mally intense, emotional meeting 5 July 4th of ‘97. And then when k wore it a few days later,

*Pagem Thursday, August 6,1998 , I

2 3 -4

5 6 7 8 9 IO Ii I2 13 14 I5 16 17 I8 19 LO

Page 223 I thought k’s trying to say something. I mean, the F% esi& nt doesn’t war the same tie twice in one week, so -- I didn’t know wbat it meant, but it was some sort of a remin& rtonre.

MS. IMMERGLT: Okay: Nothing fwtber on that. BY MR. WISENBERG: Q Thisiswellaftertbescaodalbrok, isthat comet?

A Yes. BY Ms. IMMERGUT: Q lhisisthis suunrx, right? A tirtuzt.

BY MR. WISENBERG: Q You’vetoldussamthingaboutstcingapietureof Nelvis, Bayanil+ kl~ Itbinkcamingtotkgrandjury.

A Yes. Q Canyoutellus- andyounoticedsomtthiagabout somen& wwrkwaswcaring?

A IthinkitwasoaNcl’smaykthirdappwanccor ttislastapparraace. HewaswzaringtkfifittiethatI 11 evcfgavctotbcPn% i&! nt, !2 Q DidyouknowthattbeRsidenthadcvcrgivcnthat !3 tie to Mr. Nelvis? !4 A No. !5 Q Andwbatis- amyourccalIthelasttimctk

Page 24~ 1 Rsidmthadevuwcuntitattic? 2 A No. Ididn’trahimcvuyday, so- 1- 1 3 knowk- Iknowsomcofthatitncskworctkt~ butI

4 don’tknowtklasttimckwwctktk

5 Q Okay. Istbacuxyquc& minyourmindtbatthc 6 Presidcotkoewthatbothtbescties, theoactbat~ ’rt 7 puttingaroundpicnncsofandtbconetbatNelwarctothc 8 grandjury, wuetksyouhadgivmhim? 9 A Notinmymiad, butI~‘ t- Icao’t~ tbat 0 MR. wIsENBERG: ok&. 1 MR. EMMICX ‘Ikzc’r a qucstioa? Yes? 2 AJUROR: DidyouknowtkPrcsicht& rswhik

3 gavehistiastotbcpalpltwhowarkaiforllim7 Didyouknow 4 ltw? 5 THEWITNESS: Yes, Ididknowthot. 6 MR. WISENBERG: Pardon me just a minute 7 (Pause.) 8 MR. WISENBERG: I’m going to ask the wimw to k 9 amsalvaybtMyaodwe’llpossiblycallymlmckina

0 coupk of minuocr. _l (Th= WiblcsswaSeXWCd.) L? ~, at4: 45pm, thctakiogofW& imooy 13 intkptesauzofafuUquaumoftbeGraadJwywas 14 ConChJdcd.) 15 .* a**

Page 237 - Page 240 Diversified Reporting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

In Re: Grand Jury Froecediugs

1023 Multi4bgeeN SSOO- a

Auast 6.1998

-S-

is00 [1) 164: 12 ;500,000 [I] 125: 18

-&- LpJ I: 14 2O6zJ,% ll 207: 13 2O8z6 209: 8

s’s 95p] 42121 BOA8

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til[ l] 1121

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166: 9 l& 1: 15 2O9: 18 1001 [l] 1227

10: 30[ lJ 135: 17 I I: 00 [I] 135: 17 11th [q 103: 23.25 lO4: 13

118: 21 215: 7

l2[ 1] 2: lO

l2: 30 [I] 117: 4 l2: 34 [IJ I 1722 12th [l] 64: lS 13tb[ 10] 18O: l 182: 20

183: 16 214: 7>, 10 219: 22 220: 18 221: 8 226: 24 14thrn] 74: 18 7Pl3.15

77: 24 81: 15.22 83: 16 155: 13 219~ 12 222: 25 223: l 224: 12.22 lS[ n] IO: 21 13A6.20

20: 24 24: 9 184: 19 198: 19 23O: l 15th[ 9 14: 3 19: lO

22720 235: 5,13 17th 191 ]4: 6 19: lO

121: 16 172: 19 176: 3,3,5 176: 7 231: 15 18 [IJ 26: 7 18th [11 206: 7 19 (21 1: 19 25: 17 1995 pi 89 9: l; j 1O: Zl

13: 16.20 20: 24

I996 [IO] 20: 25 23: 7 24: 4 2422.23 25: 18 61~ 19 62~ 4 6525 204121 1997 [la] 1: 19 20: 6,7

21: 8 24: 23 25: 3,20 3O: 8 30: 13 33: 13 37: 18 49: i’ 66: 13 67~ 23 86~ 17 99: 4

1998 p] I: 16 23731423 191h[ c] 2423 9O: lO

128~ 2 145: 12 177: 9 178: 9 1: 38[ 1~ 1182

-2- 2 [I] 202~ 7 20 [4] 64~ 22 184: 19 207: 3

230: 1 20001 [I] 1: lS 20004[ 1] lz29 201 p] 2: 7 203 [I] 2: 8 20thD] 164: l 223 [I] 29

22ndIq 138: 10.19 145: 6 177: 13 178: 6,15

231 [I] 2: 5 236 pl 2~ 1513.14

23rd [I] 178: 15 24 [4] 24s 25~ 2.20

237: 14 24thp] 25: lo 101: 8

186~ 11 25 [I] al 27~ 11 2: 11 28 [4] 20: 6 21: 8 3k8.13 28th[ 13] 219 36: l 37: 17

42: 3 459 85: 14 J49: 13 153: 17,18 166: 12 176: 9 185: 22 1862 29th [2] 20: 7 21: 9 2: 00 (31 23: 15 103: lO

121: 21 2: 30 [r] 23: 15 ]03: 8.10

121~ 21 176: 4,7 -1- 3 [2] 1: ll 2: 3 30[ 1] 26: 4 30tb p] 18620 206: 9 31st[ r] 91: 6 134: lO 163: 5

182: 23 186: 4 18712.2 188: lO 3: 00 [a] 103: 8 128: 5.6 3: 30 [I] 128: 6

3rd m l: J4 67: 23 69: 8 69: 14 87: 6 101: 19 19O: l2

-4-

4 [SJ 2: 6 231A2.12 233: 3 233: 9>, 19 234: 13 45 [y 90s 114: 7 150: 9 490[ 1] 1~ 28 4: 00 p] 128: 5 2OO: lO. ll 4: 45 [I] 24O: u 4th [IS] 69: J0 71: 21.21

74~ 23 72: 7 76: J3 77: 2,21 101: 19.19 19Oz13.14 238: 23,24,25

-5

i [3] 28: ll 177: 621 i0[ 1] 2124 i: 00 (21 129: 19 165: l

ith[ rl] 612.22 105: lO lO6: ll 107: 12 170: 6.7 19123.23 192: l 199: 17

in I: 16 29~ 13 140~ 22 183: lO 201~ 24 203: 18 237~ 23

i: 00 [I] 63: 3 ith[ 12] 102: 7 108: 12,16 109: lO 116: 16,19 lJ8: 19 185~ 21 199: 18,18 2OO: l2 238Z

-7 rp] 2025 n5

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149: 20 kb [4] 206: 4.11 207: 25 2O9: 13

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)O[ l] 57: 14 17- 2 [I] 1: 18 pg. 9 [I] 184: 16 k34 [I] I: 19 hh[ s] 103: 2 180: 12

181: 25 211: 4.6,8 219: 24 238: 15

-A-

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IXvcrsified Rcnrwtin~ Services. Inc (202129ti- 2929

18: 14.1725 19: 3,6,11.12 19: 15.18,183133 202.4 20: 6,11,14,182134 21: 3 21: 4.6.8.12.13,1720.24 ~: 1,4.8.11.13.16.1922 23: 5.7>. 11.12,14.14.18 23: 20.21.25 2434.69.13 24: 15.1820.22 25: 13.4.6 25: 9.16,19.21,24 26: 1,4,7 26: 10.13.13,14,15.19P 26: 25 27: 3,12,14,1730 2722353 28: 5,8.12,16,] 7 28~ 2O, 22.23,23,24,24 29~ 3 29: 5,7,14,17,2123 30: 3,6 30: 9.14,14.18,21 31: 1,6,8 31: 11,15,1825 32359 32: 12,14.18+ 22,22,25 33: 3 33: 6.10,15,18,18.193021 34: 4,10.12,1810,23 35: 6 359.11.11.11.15,18,22,25 36: 11,16,18,23 37: 4& S’ 37: 10,10,14,19,195131 37~ 24,24,24,25 38~ 2.69 38A3.1354 39: 7,10,11 39:] 4,18,21,24 4012,59

40: 14,16,20 413,11,16 4lQ2,25 42: 7,10.12,12 4221.23 43: 1$, 7,10.12 43: 14,18,20 44: 15,79,14 44: 1520= 45: 45$. 11 45: X2.16,19.22.25 46: 6 46: 11.17,19.23 47: 6.6.8 47: 10.14.17.2334 4814.5 48: 1213.1620.222425 49: 59.13.15.2034 5o: l. l 50: 69,11.12.13.15.18.20 50: 23 51: 1,35.5.6.7.8.14 51: 16,19.22 52: 2.6,10.11 52: 13.18,21.25 53: 10,15 53: 15.18.192223 54: 3.6 54: 7.10.172022233425 55: 2,4,8.10.16,1924 56: s 56: 6,13.17.20,25 57: 4,6.6 57: 79,14,15,19$ 133 58: 1,4,10,15.17,2324 59: 3.8,8.11.14.1720.22 5932225 6O: 3.5.10.14.16 60: 18.212425 61: 4.6.79 61: 14,15.15.172224 62: 1 6z: 3,5>. 13.16.19.21 63: l 63: 3,5.5.7.79.1623 64: l 64: 4.6,10.12.14,16.18.20 64~ 22.24 65: 9,10.12,18 65: 21 66: 1$, 7,10,12.16 66~ 18.19.2525 67: 3.5$ 67A4.17.2022.24 68~ 13 68: 9.12,17,19,1923,23$ 4 69: 79.11.13.17.1931.25 70: 35AJO 71: 359.17 71: 20 72: 3.5.7.1 I. 2225 73: 2192lti ?4& 7; 12 74: 14.16.1931.23 73~ 2.2 75: 9.11.11.13,, 15,17.19 76: 5.734 77: 8.9 78: 1.8 78: 10.13.14,14,16.19.19 78~ 25 79: 7,11.14.1923 79: 25 8k5.20 8J: 5,53,12 81: 14.15.19 82A. 12.5.6 82: l I, 1923 83: 2.5.9.14 83~ 24 84: 2.4,6,15,19.20 84: 2031; 21.23 85: 4.10 85: 13, J7, J9,19,22,22+ 23 85: 24 8633, JO. JO. J4,22

87:&] 0,12.23 88: 1.5,8,9 88: 12,13,13.13.16.19.22 89: 2.3.9.10,12.14.15,16 89: 2124 90: 4.7.7.9.12.13 9O: J6 91: 8.8.15.16.19 92: 3 4 6 9 9 12.12.13.17 1 , , . . 92120 93: 3.4.6.8,11 J9.21 93: 2425 94: 1.3.5.6.19.24 95: 1,4.6.79. J2.] 4.16,18 95: 2124 96z2.3.6.9.11.14 96: 17,2O25 97: 1.3.3.7.10 97: 12,16,182033 98: 2.5 98: 8.18,21,23 99: 1.49.12 99: 14,2525,25 1002.3.9 100: 12,16.18,19; 1922 lOJ: 3, lO. J3,15.22 JO2: l 102: 5,7. JO. l6, J7222434 103: 1$, 4.689.10.13.15 103: 18,22 JO4: 1$. 3.4.6.9 a 1049,11.13.1730.22.24 105: 3,7>, 12.13.16.18.21 lO6: 1,4.4,8, J3.14. J5.15 lO6: 18.24 107: 14 4 6 8 , . . . 107: lO, J2.14,21,25 108: l 108: 6,7>. ll, J3, J5. J6, J8 108: 19,2J, 21 lO9: 1,5,5,5 lO9fl~ 7,1513,19a25 110~. ll, J4,20 llJ: 3,6 JJl: 7, J4,16,18.24 1J2: 5 1129,12,16.18,20,2133 JJ3: 3,3.5,7. lO. lS, J5. J8 J J3: 18.2023 114: 6.7.10 lJ4: J2,15,15.17.18,23 J J5: 4.699. lO. lJ. 15. J8 115% 22.24 116: 3.7.8 116: 10.12.1% 17.17.18.20 116: 21 J J7: 13.13,22 118: 1.4.89.22.23.25 ]19z2,4.6. JO. JO. J3.15,18

JJ9: 19,2023.24 J20: 23 120: 3,4,10,11. J7.1820

121z5,10.12.14.14.15.17 121~ 20.24 122~ 5.7. JJ. J4 122: 17,1920.23,24 J23: 6 123: lO, J2. J4,24 124: 3,6 124: 10.1520,23,23,23,24 J25: 1$. 49.16.19 J26: 13 126: 9.13. J3,21$ 4,24 127: 13.5.7.19303325 128: 2,5.8. ll. J J. J3,13, J7 12821 129: 1,3$, 5,8,11 J29: J2,15.17.22 J3O: 39 130: 10.11.12.14,17.19,24 131: 1,3$, 10,11.13.15,17 131~ 23 J32: 1$. 6,6> 9. J6 132: 17.18.20,22 133: 5.8 133: 10,10,15, J7,20,23,25 134: 7$>. 12,12, J3,16 135: 3.7>. 12.15. J9.20.22 135~ 23 J36: 2 4 6 6 8 16 . t . l . 136: 18. J9. J9,25 137: 3.3 137: 9.11.12,192222.24 138: 3.8.13.15.18.2O J39: 2 139: 14.19$ 0.24+ 24 140: 5 140: 8.12.15.16.17.23 141: 14.16,23 J42: 1.8.12 142: 13,16,19,23 14X1.7 14319.11.13.1625 J44: 3 144: 63,11.15.19,23 145: J 145: 8,9. lJ. l3. J4. J8,2J 146: 2,5,5,8.13. J6 147: 13 147: 6, J2.14.2O, 22.23 148: 3.4.6.7.8. ll. J9,21,24

Index Page I

1024

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings Multi- Pagem am- all

Thursday, August 6,1998

149: 1,4.6.9.16.18.20.22

150: 2.9.12.12.14.15.17.17

150: 18.19.20.2132.24.25 151: 79.10.15.1833 152: 11.14,2235 153: 6,9 153: 10.12,13,14,16.17,18 15322 154: 3,3,5.6,7,7,14 154: 16.18.19,22,25 155: 5 155: 10.12.12.18.21.24 156: 5,; 9. iO. i3. i330.25 157: 3.10.13.14.14.16.19 157: 19.24 158: 13.5.7.10 158: 13.15.17.18.19.20.20 158~ 24 159: 1.13.5.6.7.11 159: 13.16.203031.23.25 160: 4.& 4 161: 1.2,9.14 161: 14.18 162: 1,7.11,18 163: 6,11.14,15.193123 163~ 25 164: 2,3,4,6,11,18 164: 18,24 165: 4,6,79,12 165: 13.15 166: 6,7.12,15 166: 17,2031 167: 3.16,22 16725 168: 3.4530.25 169: 3,13,19,192124 170: 2,4.8,13.15,18,19 171: 1,5.16.1833 172: 3.4 172: 5.5.8.17.23.25 173: 2 173: 8.16.19.21.24 174: 3 174: 6,2324 175: 2.4.9.12 175: 16.18.21.2324 176: l 176: 6. i1.13.15. i8.25 177: 1.5.7.12.14,16,22,24 178.1 4 8 10.16.17 179: 4 . . 1 .

179: 9.12.15,2021.22.24 180: 1.5.5.6.11,14,16.18 180: 18,22,23 181: 2.3.17 181: 22 182: 4.531.23 183: 3,7.10.13.16.18.20.20 183: 21.22,23,24 184: l. l 184: 3,4,6.7,9,11.13.15,16 l& 1: 19.25 185: 4.7.10.11 185: 14.14,18.19,20.25 186: 10,20.22.25 187: 11 187: 12.20 188: 1.4.4,5.14 188: 1530,23 189: 1.1.3.7 189: 11,12,14,17.18,20,22 189: 22,23.24 190: 2,6.7 190: 11.14.17.19.2134 191.2 4 5 9 13.14.15.15 -.... 191: 17.203335 192: 1,3 192: 5,8.10,15,16,22 193: 6 193: 833 194: 3 6 8 8 9 12 . . . . .

194: 16,17.17,24 195: 8.8 195: 13.13.18.23 196: 2.4

196: 2535 197: 4.7.10.10 197: 1522.23.23 198z1.6 198: 19.23,23 199c3.6.19 199: 20.23 200: 1.2 4 4 6 9 . , . .

200: 10.14.17.22.24.25 201: 1.3.10.10,12.12.15,18 201: 20,23 202: 10.13.19 202: 23 203: 1.3.8.10.17 203: 20.24 204: 2.10.12,13 204: 17.25 205: 2.7.11.13 205: 14.16.17.18.2030.23 205: 23,24.25 206: 2.6,9 206: 14.16.19,20.25 207: 3 207: 5.79,10,12.16.17.19 207: 22,23,24 208: 1.3,9 208: 10.13,15.19,23 209: l 209: 5,7,8,10,14,16,18.21 209: 23.25 210: 2,4.6.6.8

210: 11.13.15.18~ 0.22.22 211: 1u. 5.10.11.11.13 21122 212: 7.7,9.11.23 21224 213: 1,2,3.9.22 214: 11,12,14,17,18,25,25 215: 4.11.13.15,22.22 216: 7,12,14,17,21 217: l 217: 1.4.10.12.15.1730.23 218: 5; 8~ 12; 19,22,23’2i9: 1 219: 4.8.10,12.14.17.2032 2193 22Ck3.6.7.7.11.13 220: 13.14.15.15.16.19 221r2.49.11.12.14,18 222: 6.8.15.2234 223~ 2.4 223: 7.14.18.20 224: 1,4.6 224: 8.10,12.16,1934 225: 7.19.19,22 226: 4,6,9 226: 12.17,22 227: 8,12,15 227: 18,21,22,24 228: 7,14 228: 1931 229~ 2.7.14.18

231: 4,5,6,8,12,14,1; j2 232: 4.6.69.12.15.16.16 232: lGti3 i33i6jO. 21 23k4.18.22 235~ 2.5.8.11 235: 14; 2124 2362.59 236: 14.16,20 237: 9,12,15 237: 18.20.2135 238: 3.6 238: 9.10.12.14.14.1930 238- 4.25 239139.12 239: 14.16,19.24 240: 2,9 240: 11.12.12.16.19.23 JIP[ I] 1: 19 231: 15

bandon 111 116: 24

bilitypJ 7~ 2.3

ble 19 X5: 20 104: 5 105: 19 165: ll 228: 8

bout[ mq 5: lO 7: 1.12 7~ 223 8~ 20 lo: 24 17: 3.6.16 17: 17.18.19.24 19: 5.17 1921 2022 22: 9,11 23: 3 23: 6.1221.24 24: 7,14 2k8.1330 26: 4.5,7,21 32: 20.23 33: 1.4.5.8.11.13 35: 17 36ze37: 2i 38: 14 38: 16.19 39: 7 41: 8,14 42: 11.18 44: tl 45: 10.10 45: 12.46~ 20 47: lO 48117 48: 18 49: 3,22 50: 7,16,21 5024 51: 4.12.15,20,25 52: ll 53: 12 54: 23 55: 6.6 559.25 56: 1.5.12,19 57: 5 57~ 22 58: 12 59: 4.9.16.19 6OQ. 7.8.11.14.17j2 81: 8 61~ 20.25 62: 1830 63: 2 63: 10.12.13.14.14 64: 22 64~ 23 65: 7,23 66: 14.17 66: 21 67: 18 68: 2.9 69: l 70: 2.14 72: 5,89 73: 17.24 74: 10.18.25 75: 18 76: 15 77: 18.20 78179 79: 24 80~ 4.6 81~ 5.7 82: 1.3.21 84: 24 W. i4.14. i6 86: 21 87: 21 a& 22 895.14 9o: l 90s 91: 13 92: 9.10.14 92125 98: l 3 4 5 i . . . . 9& l 1

100: 6 102: 19 103: 7.19 103: 24 104: 24 105: 13.18 105: 18 106: 3,6 109: 20 110~ 17 111: 20 113: 6 114: 20,22 116: 6,11,17 117: 3 118: 18 119: 14.15

119: 16.17.19 120~ 6,831 12120 122: 722.24 123: 4 123: 8 124: 7X. 2124 125: 5 _~.

125: 14 1263.1024.25 127: 17,23 1283 130~ 13 131: 17 132: 4.15,16.17.24 133: 13 135: lJU 136: 23 137: 13.2125 138: 14 1392335 141: 7.13 144: 8 144~ 20.2233 146: 14 147: 5 1495.19 150: 932 151: 13.18.192024 152: 5 152: 6.12.18 153: 16.24 158: 14.20 163: 18,25 1649.163132 165: 14.17 165: 182435 166: 1,10 167: 8 168zS. 10 169~ 21 1709 171: 1~ 172z20 173: 16 174: ltJ, 13 175: 3 175: 5.20 1769 177: 5.20 179: 7; 18 180~ 24 181: iO 18121 182Q. 20.24 a4: 14,17.19/ 4 186: 6,18 187: 24 19OAO 191: 7,11 191: 153 1- 3 19320 194: 7,12 195: 7.11

195: 12,16 196~ 11.12 19T8.18 198: 8.10.15.17 198: 22 199~ 17 200~ 8.10 20Ck12.16.23 201: 22 202: 130.25 203: 4 204: 8 208: 830,20 209112 210: 9 210: 21 211: 7,7.14 212: 12 212: 16$ 0 213- J. 14,19 214: 15,19 215: 4 216: lO 218: 2.21,24 219Q. 5 220: 3 221: 10,25 222~ 23 225: l 225: 14.24 226~ 23.25 227: 10.14.17.21.23 228: l 228: 13.16.2315 229: 5 231: 2 233: 3.8.12,22 234: 8 235: 19.19 236: 4,6.8.9,11 239: 14.17

lbsolutely 131 137- 23 146: 2 23521

lcctpt [I] 214: 13

-ted [I] 21023 uzccss 111 218~ 15

leeident [I] 122z21

kccidmtally[ l] 53: 25

midently 111 14: 18

lccomplish[ 2~ 181: 19 221: 16

lcco& uplisbcd 121 1O: lO accurate 1x1 28: 4,18

140: 21 141- 4 161: 6 179: 13 2342

accuratdy[ l] 160: 23 acknowledge [ll 84:?

acknowledged (11 11: 9 activity [I] 86~ 12 adud m 54~ 24 82: 20

108: 23 122: 8 161: 4 183: 23 219: 18

actually m 14: 23 15~ 8 18~ 12 20117 21: 4 33: 16 36: l 3919 5325 54: 18 54: 21 58~ 6.25 68~ 8 73~ 4

79: 9 1OO: lO 107: 14 11223 116: lO 128: 19 130: 15 155: 17 216: 23 221: 12 223: 20 229: 23 237: 13

dp] 157~ 22 183: 20 184: C

dd p] 28: 6 52: 24 71: 20

.ddictul p] 39~ 89

addition [II 5: 12

dditional 111 102: 20

.ddxws ~1 30: 18,19 107: 1& 19

dM [I] 200: 18

djaamt[ 41 11~ 22 15: ll 15: 17 769 . . ‘.

-tlon c41

i7a 148: 1513,14 !dop1 8- 5 dvkp] 102: ll 125: ll 2ofk4 Iffail p1 188: 6.8,11 wairs [Ill 18: 16 44: 12 44: 12 47: 17 54~ 16 55: 7 58115 61~ 2162~ 8 197~ 20 200- 35 215: l

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Diversified Rmotin~ Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 2

In Rc: Grand Jtuy Proceedings

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1025

Multi- Page”

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i T

Diversified Renortin~ Sewices. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

AIlday - a:

Thursday, August 6, 199E

uound[ 33] JJ:~ 12:~ ’ 192il8.21 204: lO 214: 2i

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224: 24 232: l 235: 16 23714 240~ 7

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lssociatcd[ 2] 146: 18 227: 16

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lssumcdp] 8~ 22 126: 17

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mumptions (21 135: 3 14420

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Index Page 3

1026

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings.

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ctcome[ lJ 215: 22 cdp] 75: 20 1569 & [l] i93: 8 w [laq 3: 4 4: 6 8: 25 11: IO 12~ 7 28: 23 38: 13 38~ 23 42~ 18 46: 12 48: 4 WI1 S7: lO 64d5.25 67~ 4 67: 7 68: 3 69~ 3 7023 72: 7 72: 12 7320 74~ 16 75: 19 76: 17 78~ 79~ 7 82: l J 83: 6z2S 88: 189z2435 939 95: lO 96: 11,12 98: IJ 992 lOOz24 1Ol: lO ItiI7 10823 IlJL20.24 112~ 1 114: l J17: ll JJ8: 4 3222023 125: 6 J26: 8

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lo: I. I 1 1 J: IO 1222 27: 10 27: Ij 30~ 12 33: J2 34: 13 38~ 14 42: 19 65: 5 70: 13 7121,21 8J: 17 83: lJ 85: 8 94: 8 105: 13,14,14 105~ 2333 106: 18 107: 18 111s 112~ 2 122~ 8 123z21.2S 14223 143: 13 153: 17,18,22 160~ 3 162~ 3 JWJI. 16 165: lO 168: 12 170: 11~ 178: 17 182: lO 190~ 23 191: J 194: l J 19522 196Al 198: 14 2OJ: 4 203: 16,24 211: 19 235: 12

‘=& ’ VJ 89 IO: 11 23~ 25 104C20

Khalf [l] 23225 lchavior [l] 9: 19

xhirtdm 8221 125: Io xing [4sJ 17: 1433 3217

45: 10.10 46: J4 5320

6X21& 63: 16 67: l 71: 5 73z22 8S: I 88: 17 105: 19 105: 19 113~ 20 115: J 116: 17 119: 19 120~ 19

attach - hctwccn

J39: 16.18 J47i22.25 152: 6 16522 J71: 25 I 172124 li3: 12.12 179~ 1. J94: 16 1%: 17 227: 1 2341 237: 17 klicvc~ J 6: J5 7: 5 15: 3 20~ 24 2317 27~ 5 31: J. g 32: J0 3423 38: 3.5 39: 5 39: 21 402.12.23 4J: 6 42: J2 4520 46: 11,23 50: 6 SO: 1523 5J: l 58: 7 60: 5 M): J J 66: 18 70: J0 75: 23 77~ 3 78tJ9 82: J 91: 19,20 92~ 7.22 93: s 97: 24 JO2: 24 JO6: 4.8 JJ3: lO J J5: 15 123: 17 12S: 16 126: 15.21 J28: 35 13014 1323 1362 J43: 19 J46: 19 1532 lS4: 14 158~ 13 161: 17 176: 1,13 J85: 9 190~ 14 200~ 9 202: 13.19

203: J J 2042 21 J: J 212: 18 2J4: J 218112 219~ 12 220~ 15 226: 22 229- 9 ekvcd~ 93: s 172~ 23 elievcs [1] 141: 5 knnctt[ q 147~ 1 J. 15,19 1483.6.20 klllldt’s PJ 227~ 13 228%

at [lq Jo: 13 28: 3 75: J’ 85: lJ 98: 4 JO4: 18 148: 194~ 17 212: 15 233: 14 &tam 3215 9122 159~ 17 186: 12 210: 3 233: 12,13.13 ktty [IMJ 3020.22.24 32~ 18 44: 8 45: 9 46: IJ. JS 47A. 23 48: 6,17 49~ 6.12 49: 15,17.19,22 50: 89,12 50: 1621.24 55: 11.13.15 55: 16,17,21 5721.58123 75: 16 79: 7.7,14,19 85: J5 8X! S86~ 3466787: 7 . , . , 10423 105: 18,21 107: 4 10923 1J02,11,1J, 16,20 110~ 112~, 15 lJ3: JO 113: 11.19,21,22 115: s 122~ 24 123: 15,16,23 126: 4,7,15,17,18 128s 128s J44: J7 149Q. 6.17 14923 152A3 153: I. l lu: gs. lS, I9$ 22 1524 155: 3424 IS72S 159~ 11 159~ 16.18 MO: 20 16J: 13 1619 162: 6 163: 7,9.12 163: 18 1682 169~ 16 J9Oz6.15.16 198~ 2 21123 214~ 21 215z9,11,20,24 216~ 79.22 217: 8,23 218: 7 218~ 23 2193 227~ 2283.10.12 22959.17 233: 7,23 23E6.19.

~$] g35ql; I; 6;; 21820 m [no 36: 2 46: J9

Index Page 4

Diversified Rcuorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1027

In Ik Grand Jury Rocaxbgs 46: 19 47: 6,19 51: s S6: l 9S: l6 124: 18 127: 17 129: 9 133~ 21 161: 7.11,12 167: 15 234: 13

qond p] 136: lO 176~ 25 217: 4

Bible ~11 188: 4

Dig 1101 58: 19,20 6894 113s 131: 23 145QS 150: 1513,17 lS6: lO

birthdaypj 9: 14157: 14 157: 15

bit [~ OJ 7: 6 23: 12 25: 1 47: 10 48~ 5 51: 8 S6: 1321 61: 4,7,16 6221 639 66: 25 81: 5.14,15 83: 9 88: 9 105: 9 114: 15 122~ 130~ 9 137: 16.16 155: 12 158~ 20 lS9: 7,8,17 165: 12 17l: l 172: s 181: 3 187~ 11 1958 196: 18 197: 1,10 212: ll Blackp~ 150: 12.13.18

150: 19 lS7: 18,19

blah [, I 87: 3.3,3 I lS: l, l 1 IS: 1 202: 4,4,5

blanketpi ISO: IS75

blessed [ZI 194: 20$ 3

blouses [II us: 10

blow pl 171: 13.13

blue [4] 32: 5 37: 18 82: 17 102: 10 . .

blushed ~11 121:~

board [II a!: 22

Bob 181 66: 20.23 67: 4.7 86: 22 147: il 227: 13 229: lB

bold ~11 213: 9

book pq 31: 18 109: 8 136: 19 137: 16 139: 19 156: 19,19 161: 15 183: 13 183: 14.21 184: 1,2,6,14 184: 16 185~ 4 189: 17,18 189: 19,2125 190: 3.3,4 191: 15,19 19725 198: l

books [q 161: 22 183: ll 183: 12.15 184: 17.1920 184: 20

bookshelf (11 184: 21

bookstore [I] 189: 20

boss [I] 215: 2

both[ n] 920 ll: ll 259 48: 12,15 Sl: l8 s3: 19 56: 20 9S: 4 134: 4 1512 233: 22 240: 6

bottom (21 177: s 179~ 7

bougbt Is] 116: 14 lSO: 24 15l: l

Bowles [I] 116: 22

box [UJ 109: 6 150: 20 156: 10,14,1524 157: ll 158: 6,12,14,17,24 159~ 18 lS9: 21 160: 20 161: 7,13 161: 17.18,19 162: 6.9 163: 8,9 185: 14

‘Boy [I] 160: 14

weak ~141 33: 17.18,19,20 3321 809 9oAl 117: 13 117: 15 162: ll 174: 7 19823 l% k3 2309

break- u [IJ 198z22

bmakfast [r] 163: s 187: l 188: 1,19 1896

brcakspj 173: 3

bmst~ q 13: 4

b~ ri9[~ 4; ys 52: 16 122: 5

briefing;, 12s: 9

bricflycq 6: 108: 11 11: 9 16& l 1 236: 7 240: 19

bringp, J IS: 6 16~ 4 18~ 2: 53~ 24 54: 4,18,21 63~ 20 675 68: 10,11 86: 19 9l: lC 91~ 21 116~ 20 13lQ5 1403 186: 16 221: 4

bringingcq 66~

123~ 23 1427 200~ 25

broad111 %a br$ y [SJ 123: lO 172: 21

b& e, 90:~ s 174: 10 bE6e9w] ~22~ 0.22

: *

brought[ Iq 41:~ s SS: I 91: 19 139: 1431 141: 8 147: 8 150~ 2 lSl: 23,24 198: 6 220: 19 221: 3 231~ 2s

Brown’s [I] 62: 20

Bruceclq 71: 10.12.13 71~ 14 77: 1222.23,25 79~ 12 802 82: 8.12.16 83: 11.21,22 227: 7

bubbling 111 71~ 22

Buddy p] 149: 2S 150: 1 1 m3

Budget (11 171: 12

bugrl] 236: 9

bugged 111 135~ 23

buggingp] 19~ 7 144: 7

bulletin 111 192: 22

bump [I] 18: 21

bumped [II S3: 2S

bunchtt] 192: 16 221: 14

bunkr~] 146: 18

Burson- Marsteller PI

206$ 10 208: s

burst [I] 128~ 21

bus[ r] 164: 11

business m ~19 5~: 3 113z2S 127: ll 143: 21.22 204: 17

busyr31 105: 21 108: 4 111: 10

but [lsq 6: 6 7: s 18: 8 19: 24 20: lS 21: 15 24: 12 3& l 33: 6 36: 11.24 38: 17 39: lS 4OA5 41: 9 43: 7.24 44~ 2 46: 7 47: 5,18 48: 4.1! 49: s so: 3 S3: l 54: 2 S5: 2( 55: 21 S7z9.15.21 S8: 5.22

Multi- Page T) A

60: 10,22 65: 5 6821 7O: li 70: 23 71: 12 74: 17 76: 12 78~ 20 802.19 81: 1 82: 2,7 B2: 20 849.18 85~ 23 86~ 8 B8: 12,12 89: 8,11 90: 1 9lU4 93: lO 973 101~ 24 1OS: lO 107~ 20.22 ll3: ll 114: s 11923 123: 14 12Sz2 1272 131: s 131: 20 134: 14.17 136: 2 136: 14 138: 3.6 139: 14 140: 16 141: 6,19.19 142: 5 145: 12 146~ 8 1523 153: 6 IS423 lS5: 14 lS7: 3 1S9: 6,11.15 160: 18 161~ 23.24 162: 3J 163: 14 164: 7 165~ 9.22 1669.20 166: U 168: 6,15.17 169: lS 17O: ll 177: 12 178: 19 179: 10,16.17 18023 181: 13 186& T 187~ 2.8.10 188: 12,16 193: 3 194zl2 1973 203: 4 204: 15 2053.7 207: 14 208: 24 213~ 20 215~ 25 216: 24 2212 222: lO 2262 227z2+ 89 228~ 2 229: 16 232~ 6 233: 16,18 235: lS 23721 238~ 620 239: 3 240~ 3.9

butt [l] 99: 18 luttocks (11 13: 4 guy [I] 189: 19 buying [l] 2125 I~-[ I~ J 3: S, 8, lS 49 5: 21 8: 2.6 9: 8.21 13: 8.1332 lS: lS31 2S: 9 273.22 28: 14 31: 21 34: 9.21 3S: l! 35: 23 37: 2.5.16 42~ 17 4613 47z4.9 4BA9.22 5317 53: ll 58: 8.11 61~ 2 63: 24 72: 12.21 78: 522 79~ 10 81: 2ti- 82: 24 Sk8 84: l 86: 16 87: 1.9 89: 7.8.13 94: 15 97: 22 99: 7.20 101:: 102: 13 107: 22 11122 112: 8.14 114: 2 115: lO 116: 21 118: S, l7 119: 4 121: 22 122: 2.10 129: 20 133: 9 137: 15’138: 9 140: 13 l4l: ll 1439.23 144: 4.13,18 145~ 5.16 147: lO l5l: ll 15220 lS6: 1.6.12 157~ 25 158: 2 158: 3 160: 6,16 163: l. S 163: 20.24 167: 7,23 168: 21 17lz21,22 1722

172: 18 173: 15 17622 177: 4 178: 1.12.23 182: 18 184: 5.23 185: 16.23 186: ll 188: 183134 189: 9 193: 12.18 19422 194: 23 195: 43034 196: 16 199~ 16 201: 8 203: 15 209: 17 214: s 216: 23 218: 6.9 219: 1521 220: 10.1724 221: 6 223: 12 224: 23 231: 1,11 234: ll. lS 235: 4,7.10.12 237: 8 239: 6,10.13

beyond - categorically Thursday, August 6,1998

-/ 169: l 215: 15 223: 16

-c- 224: 2S 238: 15.21 :pJ 2: 1 3: 1 hcberh [l] s: 2 uifomia [l] 1123 dl [IU] 18: 1620 23: 10 23: lS 43~ 2425 44: S> 15: 1.4 47: 12 62: lS. lS 63: 11 64: 10.17.17 6622 71: lS 7531633 7723.25 78: 2,4.15,17 79: 8.12 81: s 81: 9.11,15 82: 8,13.13.17 B2: 21 83: 1.321.22 92: 6.8 92: 9.11.15 94Q, 49 95~ 6 95: 16,19,25 963.79.15 96~ 25 97.23 98: 171325 IO]: 6 103: 5,5,9,11,22,25 105a 106: 19 10711 I

107: 13 114~ 6 12OZi., 13 121: 18 122: 1.3,3.6,9,10 122: 11,14,14 126: 11.12 126~ 23.23 128: 10.11.16 12825 1292.4 130~ 24 131: 45,7.11 136: 35 138: 17 139: s 143: lO 144: 5, lS lS3: l 154: 1030 155: 4,14 156: 8 IS& 4 1639 167~ 16 169~ 10 175: 12,23 186: 19 192: 6 195: 13 198: 17 2OOzll 20721 208: 15.17,21.22 209~ 3.17 210: 13.16 -

211: lb 227: 6,2Ojl23 231: 13 233~ 23 240: 19

alled ~61 3~ 4 ~3.24 30: 16 43~ 3 4413.1432 4kS. 22.23 62: 16 64: 18 73: 4 75: 19,25 76~ 1620 7622.25 77: 1.4.6.11 7923 90: 2S 91: 1 102: 7 103: 6 106: 21 109~ 6 1 IO: 2 110: 3.11 112: 18 113: lO 113: 1132 121: 25 122: 1.7 122: 16 126: 24 127: 13 129: 3 132: S. lS 138: 18 144: 17 147: s 149~ 6.12 1585 163~ 21 171: 7 172~ 20 186: 16 190& 1S I% 9 207: 19 208z2cJ. 25 2099.10.13 214~ 21 228: 8 228: 11.11,18 229: 17 234: 5 235: 7.10.12 d1=[ 3] 44: 13.15 235: l: ding [sl lS3Zl2 231: 7 234: 11 235: 19

ds [zq 20: 16,19 21: 2S 22: 4,4 23: lS 28~ 2 43: 6.13 43: 14,16 44: ll. lS. l6 68:: 107: 14 113: 9 139: 4 166: 13 186~ 10 207~ 22 213: 2 229~ 6 235: 18

m[ 4q IO: 24 112 12~ 14: 12.17 31: 3.8 32: 18 35: 18 37: 14 41: 3 46: 11 46: 15.18 48: lS 57: 7 63: 1 67: 2.6 71: 12 79: 1 92: 6.2C 96: 2.3.6.14 98: s 106: 10 113: 19 122: 14 123r21 130: 19 131: 3.4. S 133: 24 138: 5.23 14S: U 15224

hIErOn[ l] 216: 25

kampaign [r] 43:] 5 6S: lO, l4, lS 92: 19

:an[ q 4: 18 6: 6 14: 21 21: 21 23: 12 24: 11 33: 19 35: 2,24 36: 9 38: 6 40: s 42: 14 45: 14 47: 12 52: ll 53: 18 56: 18.19 64: 9 66: 25 70~ 4.5 74~ 2 75: 12 85: 2.11 88: 5 89: 5 94: 13 98: 4.4 99: 18 103: 7 104: 18,18 115: 732 123: 12,1922 128: 3 134: 7 143: 13 149: 19 151: 4 156: 12 163: ll 172: 11.25 176: 3 176: 20 In: 2 178~ 24 17923 182: 19 183: 7 191~ 24 201: 9,21 206: 25 211: 6 217: 8 231: s 233: 2 239~ 17.25

ian’t 112) 16: 19 47: 1 SO: 3 57: 14 85~ 20 12924.24 16620 172: 13 214: 17 240~ 99 mulot [l] 4: 17 avass [5] 15oA3 157: 4 Far[ C] 122E21 16420

188: 1226a2 ml923

xdp] 26: 14.14

xdboard [I] 183~ 24 zards [q 26: 9,11,21 S6: 6

139: 18 :are [r] 48: 16 65~ 4 84: s

143: 21,21 215: 17

:ared 111 39: 7 :areful[ 4~ 53: 20 56: 15

65: s 86: 24 xJKt[ l] 1502 _[ I] 54: lS mpq 131: 6.11.12

131:] 8.18.20 135: 14.16 138: il 139~ 16 145~ 7.22 145: 24 146: 1.16 147: 14 147: 18,22 148~ 19 16O: lO l6OA8 161: 1,2 1925.7 192: lO 193: 3 19k4.19 195: 9,10 197: 12 199: 19 200: 23 201: 13 20321 204: 4 zktcr’s [4] 14139

l45L2o~ l rartcrs’s [l] 14kl7 zarving[ l] lSoA4

s? c[ 31] S6: 8 73Z5 123: 2 124Q2.25 12S: 5.12 127: 9 127: 14 12823 1332 134: 3.24 146: 3,18 147: 16 151: 193334 lS3* Z 166: 8 187~ 6 192: ll 204: 6 212: 13 213: 6 214~ 4 215: 25 217: 6 22124 225: lS cassette [I] 22: 14 casual [l] 372s

categorically (11 9223

Index Page 5

Diversified Rmorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1028

In Re: Grand Jury Procaxlings

categories II] 29: 9

categorized [I] 84: 12 category [SI 29z9.10

1145 IS& 23 I57: 2 ~7tiEhC p] 59: 20

c~ USC [a] 67: 24 194: 3 229: 4

caused p] 50: 1 113: 23 CaUSCS [l] 13: 3 CaUtion[ 1] 218: 16 _ CC( II 121: 7 cereal [I] 188: 23 ceremonicsui lo: 12 axemony [ZJ 9: 7 10: 6 Certain J4J 60: 22 84~ 24

180: 19 193: Y certainpy [4[ 73: 21 85: 7

146: S. Y cxt~ ra 11) 137: 25

chain [I] 82: 7

chairman pJ 208~ 5.21 209: 6

I chance p] 53: 22 61: 15 165: 7

change III 214~ 6

changed 111 182: 1

changes 121 203: 22 2O4: 3

changing [II 88: 6

characterization II]

84~ 22 CharactCrize[ l] 103: ll

characterized [I] 50: 23

charismatic [II 9~ 23

I chartrzll 2~ 1 19: 18,18 24: J I- 25h 27: 11.13.16

27: 1932 28: 3.7.9.12.17 29: 8,16.20 3Oz4.10 66: Y

chasing [I] 73: 6

chatchki 111 109:~ Icheck [sJ 91: 22 107: 21

117: 5.8 214~ 21

icheckedrz] 117: 10 215: 1; ICbCmiStry[ l] 11: lO ‘cbmy [I] 150: 20 ichest[ 2J 39: 16 185: 20

Ichief [2J 8: 14 93: 22 ~chikkmi~ [I] 17: 18 iC! hinam 237: 18 238: lS

/ 238: 22

/chocolates (31 150: 20 150: 21 157: 5

choose [IJ 34: 22

choosing [I] 34: 24 Chose [l] 217: 20 chriStmas 1261 3O: 15

36: 2 108: 7,18,20 115: ll 116: 7.13.1323 117: l 126: 5 139: 18 148: 24 149~ 6.9 150: 3.5,10,18 151: 8 157: 14 158: 2031 168: 19 212~ 2

eonolOgY [I] 27: 23 igarp] 108: 21 185: 14 185: 25

irc1ej2] 81: 2 217: 25 ircling [I] 28: 24 i. rcUitoUS [I] 113: 3 lmUmSmJaS 131

30: 12 50~ 4 191: 16

mity [ZJ 102: 4 181: 6 ~laim[ l] 146: 17 ~himingfr] 72: 13,17

sarify [3] 6: 10 8O: lY 223: 21

,larifying [I[ 218: 21

.lean[ 3] 40: 17 41: 17 .leaned [II 40: 21 .lear[ zl[ 17: 3 51: 9 55: 12 76: 23 81: 18 101: 23 lWl6 135: lO 141: 5 142: 15 166~ 4 176: 3 177~ 15.18.23 178: 3.7.13 202: lO 218: l 223: 24

:lcarer[ lJ 194: 17 ~lcarly [t[ 13o: lY 214: 23

%&&[ w 2: 12,13,14 lo& 25 107: 3 122: 12 125: 4 151: 17 175: 20 187: 24 196: 6 229: 2

:linton’s [I] 187: 24 :iose [II] 3k2.13 38: 6 93: 15 lO4: 3 129: 6 213: 16 236: lO

:loscd JIJ 36: 20 :loscr~ lJ 128: 6 :losct 131 41: 16 159: 21 159: 21 :losing III 228; 22 :lOthCS [t] 40: 17 164: 12

clothing [l] 13: 7 x& tail [z] 37: 18,19 :odep] 137: 17 216: 4

Gncidence [9 163: 21 238: 20

mold [IJ 76: 1 J PllabOrate II] 8: 4 x&~ tion 111 185: 19

aloxcd [I] 89: 24

Mumbia [21 k2.13 DIIE[ CIJ 14: 21 16~ 6

l& 19 19: 5 23: 1,22 30: 24 38: 11.18 39: 2 48: 22 49: 7 49: 16 62: 24 65: l 67~ 5 69: 14 70: 12 76: l 78: 14 84: 8 87: 14 91: 2 92: 7 102: l 103: 16.20 107: 632 111: 6.10 113: 1.8 114: 13 121: 15 126: 5 12919 133: 21 137~ 4 138: 19 142: 21 149: 12 156: 6 157~ 25 158: 2.3 lS9: 5 168~ 4 169~ 23.24 170: 14 170: 19 174: 8.9 186: 12 193: 7 212: 23 215: 21 216: 6 223: 5 229: 13

Multi- Pagerr[ CoMs [g) 35~ 25 95: 6.13

95: 2225 lO0: 1.2 163~ 8 186: 13

mmfortable [c] 50: 7 71: Y 110: 19 14412123 221: 19

mmfortably PI 8~ 2 coming: PII 14: 20 37: l

3820 ~: 13.15.16 58: 1,4 68: 14 83~ 20 9021 94: 6 102: 12 10720 IIlL2 123~ 23 134: 16 149~ 23 1753 186: 14 239: 15

co& mand (11 82: 7 LmnmenciUg [l] 1: lY

comment 1%~ 85: 24 86: 3 lOOA8.19 119~ 18 128: 17 141: 7 17O: JY 226: 23

common[ 2] 5: lY 10.9 ccmmotion [I] 113: 23 EulIlmUniCatC[ 4] 7E2

67: 15 102: 2O 115: 19 CommUniCated [I]

67~ 18 CammaniCation [l]

6x24

complained ~21 86~ 18 86: 2 1

complement [I] 172: 3 ComplCtC pJ 105: 10.17 EomplCtCly [3] 14122

14lz2334 compktion [I] 38: ll

38: 20 compliedp] 161Ql. 24 vt [r] 17: 10

19: ll 33: ll 48: 16 49: 4,5 coIq0lmt. s [I[ 33: 13 COXIlpOSC[ lJ 130: 3 computcr[ q 173: 16

174: ll 175: 17 223: 16 224: 7

CoIIqUltClS [I] 174: 8 con& [SJ 124: 12

167: 14 168: 2 171: 24 176: 17

concealing [I] 57: 2

m- t [l] 54: 14 Conm [al 47: 23 76~ 19

77: lO 151: 16 16YA7 1869 200: X! 2Ol: i5

concexned I241 3kl6.21 71: 23 77: 13.18 8925 138~ 20 139: 3 151: 1334 152: 6.7 158: Y 186: 6 187: ll 191: lS 192~ 19 193: 6,16.19.20,23 197: 12 2085 211: 13 215: 3

CoU# cIIs [4[ 186: 17 2OO: l7.1820

conclude [2] 39: 23 4Oz4

concluded m] 75~ 8 24024

conclusion Q] 9216 93: 1

categories - couple Thursday, August 6,1998 onclusious [I] 238: 17

onduct II] 7:~

onfCrencCp~ 78: 15.17 79: a

mdeIltid[ lJ 65: 21 OflfhCd[ lJ To: 24 onfustd[ l] 180: 18 OnfusiOn [I] 195: 8 onncctim[ 3] 9- 24 216: 8 OMCqElk=@ J 21: 13

OnsidexedfzJ 139: 17 214~ 4

onsidexing m 74: 24 194: 5

on& tent pJ loo: 8 UnSt8ntly[ lJ m5 UnStitUte[ l] sm zonStitUtionp] 1: 14 onStrUctionp] Ilo: OntactWJ Y33,11v2J 10~ 13: 3,6,15,19~ 14: 7 18& 4,8 19: 14 25: 14 34~ 15.16 42: 5 N, 8 6524 665 71z8, lO 77~~ 81: 23.24 82: lO 9OQ2 112& 17 119: 7& l 1 123: 15 126~ 15 147: 18 149: 2 1%: 5,6 199- Z 200: 7 2O8: 4

ontaeted c3J 71: 13.14 71: 22

ontaCtSf2J 669 lw: 4 ontaincd [l] 174225

ontent m Y2A4.17 OntentS PI 158A114 158: 17

ontinuationm 9033

232: 7 ontinUations pi 233: 4 mtinUe [lo] 19zll 33: 17 39% 665 73: 1 80: 3 11& 6 1663 176: 17 221: lY

WinUed~] 113 9Ozl6

mwary (11 193: 13 onvus8tion PI] 35: 18 413 46~ 8 47~ 6.6 61~ 24 62zJ7 e- 421 6& J m4 733 78: 1185: 16 863 989 992 100950 1032 103: 3 lO5: 13 106~ 3 113: 13 11921 mk20 121: 16,19 l23: 7. J1,20 124: 24 126~ 3 12T1.21 130: 18 133X! I%: 7 142~ 22 156~ 3 lWA9 165m 17o: JO 181~ 2$ 2 182: l 187: 4 197~ 8 2O3z2 2092 2113,7,8,2O 213: 4 214~ 5 217: 12 233~ 21

mvtrsitions [lr] IO: 4 105 549 6I2181: 7 98: 7 103QO mu2 18Oz3 201: 13 2169 224: 1931 236: 3J

C m! IVCypJ 71: 18 133: s.: 140: 6 142: 6 146: 1.9

:onvcycd 111 I 40: 9

Lotwince [q 83: 11.12 127: ll 222~ 2 EOO~ ting (11 4: 2 DpiCS[ q 13: ll 54~ 24 157~ 21 18721 237~ 2

#qymJ 4: 6 139: 19 140~ 23 175: 22 183z2OZ 183~ 23 lYYA9 2O0: 2.4 2Ol: l, lO 205: 13,17 220: 11.13.14.15.1630 225z19.21

hcoran [I] 112: 18 -[ 42] 4: 4 6: 16

15: 18.19 29: 16 30: 3.6 47~ 8 48~ 4 53: 10 62: j 8022i Y4L7.2 95: 7,13.21 YT4.7.1625 101: 15‘

mii 162~ 1 168: 20 17& 8 177: 14 178~ 24 17Y: 3,11, J4,~ 9 lq2: 3 20424 207~ 17 21YA4 221~ 5 231: 16,17 232~ 8 233: lY 239: 8,12

f. ommCd[ l] 16O: 15 Lomxtlym 49: l 143: 19 2O5z20 232~ 2.3

== Spondenaa1 8A5.15 171: 14

-borate pj xx19 7x0 73: JO ;osrts[ r] 238~ 6 hlgbg[~ J 453

xmldrtsl 3~ 23 6~ 2.3 7~ 7 8~ 10 96.25 II: 12 125 14: 7 16~ 2 17~ 12 18: lJ 21: lO 24~ 21 26~ 13.15 27~ 21 3& 12 31: 16- 32~ 11 33: 18 35: 13 37~ 1.12 383 38: 4 4O: 9.10 43~ 22 45: 12 48: 5,18 49~ 24 5224 539 55: 12 57~ 5 59: 18 6OA5 62~ 24 64~ 4 6S: 15 68: ll 7321 74~ 3.4 76% 79~ 7 84: l 86: lY 87: 14 Y2a 992 IOOzlO lO2: 18 1075 JOT22 124: 15,17,25 126~ 4.13 1275 1289 1324 138: lY 14OLI 1415 141s J46: l J, l9, ZO, 25 154z2O 158s 1592 169z43214 1m19 174: 7 J8J: lj 184: 4 19Oz7.18 JY7: lY 2175 2259 2X: 1

228: 9# 22YA7 23120 236: 7

mddn’t [xz] 313 4OzJ5 415 65: 14,15 97~ 10 128s 129: 14 174~ 8 17Yzz J86: lS -lp~ 1~ 21,25,26 4: 16 5: 45 27: 15 292

J89: 4

XNlnselors [l] 6o: l muntq [I] 75: 8

zouplc m 71: 3 89: 16

I( c

c c

C t C

c c

C C

( c

Index Page 6 Divcrsificd Retorting Scwices. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1029

In Rc: Grand Jury Proceedings 163: 25 191: 13 211: ll 235: 2 240~ 20

m. lier[ llJ 19clI8.19 22832.7.7.8.13.142425 22910 XNuse [17J 86: s 87: 17

99~ 14 103: 16 106~ 8 109~ 14 123: 18 131~ 2 134: 18.19.19 136: 12 168: s 187: 4 197: lS 213: 4 228: 12 courtp] 1: 1.12 142: ll ~usins [I) 41: 12 zoverm 30: 8 S43,6

73: lO 136~ 18 214: lO 233: 7 zoveredpJ 151: 13

216Z Xwering [I] l& 17

xeatep] 102: lS 17434

ticdm 207~ 8

titeria[ i] 161: lS titerion [l] 16OA9 mppedral no: 19 zoss [I] 9O: l

crossed [II 74% wwds [I J 202: 7 crying pi 62123 75: 6

129: 12.1823 170- 21 171: 20 cue [l] 188: 16

cultivating [i] 48: lO

cunent[ lJ 17: 18

Currie p9 14: lO 16: 6 l& 25 19: 4,7,8 30~ 16 31: 2 31: 3,11 32: 19 4SA6.20 45~ 22 47~ 2.7 4820 49: 22 58: lO 69: 7; 13 1079 110: 25 149: 2 160120 161: 25 189: lS 19SA3.16 196: 4,9 231: 24 235~ 9

fhrie’s [so 14: 1421 16: 3 45: 19 76: 9 curt [I] 197: lO customary [I] 23: 14 cut[ q 116: 21 183~ 23

232: 20 cute [I] 109: 7

-D-

D[ IJ 3: 1 D- day [II 25: 4 D. C[ 21 l: ls. 29 dad [zl 87: 1x14

Dale [IJ S9: 20 danger [1J 213: 24 dangled[~~ 68: 13

dark111 182: 14 darker [I] 8924

date [lo] 12: 3 30: 7 117: 4 118: 20 176: 4 23724 238: 2, S, 13,14 date- oriented [I] 28: 23

iates [( J lo: 23 17: 2.6 20: s 28~ 24 29~ 4 iaughter[ 21 125: 6 165: s >aViS p] 5920 1 lo: 24

17420 iaypsJ 6: 15,17 9I13.15

11~ 2 24~ 22 25: 6 30~ 17 37: 18 4624 62% 6326 64: 9 67~ 25 70~ 13 79: 6,14 79: 19 95: 1,3 96: 17 97: lS lOJ: 9 105: 14 106z23 107: 20 113: 6 114: 1921 114: 2S 11% 24 12723 137: 3 138: ll 140: 4 141: 2 151: 20 lS4: lS 155: 14 156~ 6 157: 13.22 168: 1.12 170~ 4 175: 12.182~ 6 183: 17.18 18S: 18 196~ 13 203: 6,8 206~ 1 208~ 10 209: 11,20,22 210~ 16 21520 2195.1323 220~ 4

221:~ s 22j: i~ 22% 2020

228Ao 229: 7,15.19 236~ 16 240~ 2

Says [ii~ 7~ 11.15 7S: ll 102: 16 121: 14.14 153: 18 17S: ll 238: 14.1825 w [I] 89~ 2.3 109~ 17

120~ 12 131: 23 hling [l] 214: 19 hatb [I] 62: 20 Dc# mberpq 30: 14

33: 12 36: l 61: ll 105: 9 1OS: lO 106Al 107: 12 108: 12,16 118: 19/ l 121: 16 127: 8 1282 EM: 10 138: lO 149: 14 163: 4 164: l 172: 19 176: 3 185: 2122 18633.5.11.11 186: 20.187: 2 20& 8.10 211: 24 222: 9 231: lS

decided [lo] 2323 109: 14.18 153~ 20.23 156: 11’194: 13 2&: 8 212: lS 229: 23

decision [I] 176: 17

deemed [IJ S6: 7 decply[ l] 48: 17

Defense [q 61120 174:) 20422

defensive 111 3721 definitely [II 27: 25

definition r* l 2: 10 12: 2! 13: 9.17 16: 24 20: 9 29: 12 29: 16

degree [IJ 138: 7 delete [q 28: 7 173: 20.22

174: 21

deletionclj 173: 17 deletions 121 174: 1.3 delicacy [I] 94: 12

delicate 111 94: 12 de& ately [I] 56: 14 deliver[ lJ 128: 12

demand [2J 12525 126: l Democratic [I] 28: 12

Multi- Pagem demonstrates [II 30: 10

denial 111 217: s

deny [IOJ 120: 24 124: 20 165: 18 166: 24 167: 13.14 177: 18 178: 14 234: 1623 denying PJ 127: lS

165: 17 204: 6

DepaHment p] 61: 20 17325 204: 22

depamue[ q 9: 7 lo: 6 lo: 12 42: 19

Iepieted [IJ 237: 17

de+ sedrq 124: 17 191: 13 192: 14 231: 21

deposition [SI 146: li 1472 167: 3 192: lS 193: s

depressing [ij 208110 DepUty[ lJ 1% Dernan (21 206z14 210- Z describersol 8~ 11 96.19

12~ 5 16: 2 i7f12 18: 7.11 27: 21 305.12 31: 16 35~ 24 37: 23 38: 4.39: 3 115: 7 161: lO 229: 22 236: 7 described [rg 13: 14.21

19: 10.13 27: 22 29: 10.19 34: 15.17 49: 19 60: 20 160: 23 161: 3 232: s

describing [II 98: 16

description [4J 28: 18 52: ll 61: 8 69: 19

descriptions [L] 29: 9 desire [II 13: s desk 1141 110: 3.12 129: 13

183: 21.25 184~ 2.10.12.18 184: 20 18S: lS 186: 1.2 216: 19

desperate 111 181: 9

detail [lq 7: 13 19: 19 2822 45: 12 6O: lO 66: 25 67: lO 81: 4 104: 24 111: 4 115: 22 12S: l 143: 18 182: 19 187~ 7 192: lO 213: lS

detailed[ 1] 91: 13 details [I[ 7: 17 17: 1.6

56: 12 73: 24 79: lS 138: 1SS: lS deter[ q 124: 16

determined 111 175: li

develop 121 [ 7: 9 93: J

developed [21 48: 24 124: 2

dialed [I[ 44: 10

Dick [4J 92: 18.20.23 932 dictated [II 204: 2 did [ssq 8: 7,18 9: 2,11.18

10: 4.8.20 11: 13,15.20,23 12: 2.4.14 13: 16.20 14: 2 15: 4.8,13.1422,23,24 16: l 17: 9.11,23 19: 9,10 19: 12.13.22,25 20: 8.16 20: 19 21: l 22: 6.12.13 23: 3.6.10,12,17 24: 5,7,16 24: 19 25: 7.14.2225 26: 8

26124 27:[. 15.18 29: 1.4.5 3024 31: 10.14.15,17.23 32: 1.6.9.10.10.1531.23 33: 1.3& 1932 35: 4,16,20 3620 38~ 4.25 39: 4,19.22 40: 19 41: l 42: 8,24,24,25 435.8,8.24 44: 1834 45: s 46: lS 49: 11.11.11.12 50: 16.21.24~ 51~ 24~ 52: 8 S4: 4.8.14.17.18,21 55: s 55: 1630 56: 14.24 57: 1.4 57: 12 59~ 16 60: 1.3.8 6124 62: 1.12.14.15.23 62: 2S 63: 1.6 64: 10.17.17 65: 7.17.19,25 66: 1.25,14 67: 15.17.24 69: 55.8.10 69: ll 70: 3 71: 7.14.19 72: 19,21,22,23.25 73: 16 73: 17 74613.1424 75: 8 75: 10,12,15.17,25 76~ 2.3 765 77: lS 78: 6,8,14,16 78~ 17 79: 18.22.24 8124 829.2S 83: il 86: 10.20 873 89: 18 91: 14.15 92: 7 92A6.25 93: 4.20 94: 1.17 97: 8 9922 100: 3.7 lOi: 2; 102: 1.1030.22 103: s. s 103: 16 104: 10.15.17 105: 1.1.11.12.13 106: 2.6 106: 6jh lti7: 2.8 108: 7.9 108: 10.1134 109: 10.24 110: 7 111: 17.17 112: lO 112: 15.16.1730.2425 113: 13,8 i14: 18.2i ilS:! 115: 3.4, S. 89.14.16.19 116z2,6$>. 11.16 117~ 8 11823.2S 119: 14,17,18 11920 121: 3>, 10,12.15 122: 3 123: 4.8 124: 1421 12S: 14.24 126: 23,25 127: 4.24.25 128: 1,9.19 129z2.4.11.1631.22 130~ 1 130: 2.8.12,13.15.18.25 131: 8.25 132: 1.2.8.14.20 133: 12,162023 134: 33 134: s 135: 8,10.13.18 1363.4.17.22.25 137: 24 138: X1? 13932.1333 14013,6,14.16 142: 5,17 142: 17X24 143: 16 144: 5.6 1456 146: S. ll 147: 3; 4.6,18 149: 2.1& 16 151: 16 152: 20 153: 4.11 JS4: 1.15.16.24 155: 3,8 155: 1922 156: 8 157: 1[ 157: 25 158: 1.2.3.11.14 158: 16 159: 18 160: 12 163: 17.21 164: 22 167: 18 167: 2[ 168: 17 169: 22 170: 9,22 172: 4 173: 17.19 173: 20.21,22.25 174: 20 174: 24 175: 12.22.25 176~ 9.12.16,2? 177: 16 178: 13.18 179~ 24 183: 25 l& 1: 6 185: 6,17 18618.19 186: 21 187: 8,18,23 188: 11.1932 189~ 12.14 189: 1925 190: 4.15$ 0 191: 3,7.10,1820,21 192: 1420,2132,23.24 194: 4,7,10.12.14.19 195:: 195: 12.1635 196: 4. S. S, 8 198: 2 199A8.2O. 22.2324

201: 19 202: 4.1734 205:: 205: 13.14.15.17,24.25 206: lS 207: 10.18.25 208: 1.2.11.14.17.19.21.25 209: 5.6.8.22.24 210: 7.13 210: 1620 211: 12 212: 23 212: 24 214: 10.12.13,14 215: 11,13,21 216~ 23 217: 8.11,16 218: 3.10 219: 7.7 220~ 11.13 221: 4 224: 13.17.17 225: 8.17.17 226: 8.9.16.18 227: 10,13 227: 16.20 228: 3.3 229: s 229: 13 230: s 233: 4.18 234: 16.21 2359 236: 11 236316.237: lS 238: 16 23922 240: 12.13.15

iidn’t [no] 21: 10,12 23: 8 2513 38: 11.18,19 39: 8,9 39: 25 40~ 16 41: lO 44: S. g 452 4724 49: l 51: 10,10 57~ 15 6J: l 63: 25 65: 4.9 65~ 12.13 67: 9 68: 25 69: 2 71: 25 72: 9.14 73: 23 77: 23 78123 80: 1 82: lS. lS 83: 1hS 8734.55.89: 10 89: ll 90A. 22 91: 9 92: 4

92: 24 93: 14 94: s 97: s 101: 12 102: 19 KM: 6 107: 23 109: 17.20 110: s 116: l 12o: l. l 123: 13 126~ 16 129: 18 130: 21.22 133: ll 1369 138~ 21 139: 14 1424 14420 146: 16,17.18 147: 16 153: 7.14.24 156: 14.15 158: 24 159~ 4 16OAb 161: 1 164: 18 165: 17 168: 9 170: 14,22 180: 21 182: 4.12 1879.10 188: lO 188: li, lS 190:; 193: 1,2 193: 4.5.12.15 194: 12 197: 16 20224 206: 23 207: 12.14 211: 15.17.22 211: 24 212: 17.17 213: 8 222: lS 225: s 228~ 1523 230: 2 234: 20 23820 239~ 3 2402

iifference [3] 51: s 65: 13 161: ll

iifferent [tl] 1720 33: 17 41: 19 S7z1.69 5922.22 67: 20 83: 10 85: 4 88: 8 95: 19 98: 21 1 lo: 14 136: 18 IS023 192: 16 193: 24 204: s 227: 3 234: lO

lifficult [( J 120~ 12 125: s 156: 13 173: 12 174: 12 207: 24 fining p] IS: 18 36: 24

93: 1931 94: 17.18.19 183: l 185: 20

iinky [I] 181: 8

iinner [I] 40~ 6

Iip [l] 409 iireet[ 3] 67: 23 121: 13

142: l heting [31 37: 17 237: 9

Diversified Rmorting Services. Inc. (202) 2962929

Index Page 7

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

1030

Multi- PagC

237: 19

iircctly (131 13: 6 225 44~ 3.5 49: 14 51~ 22 98: 9 1342.2 159: 13 186: 1621 209: 11 212: 19

iirty 11) 40: 21

iisappoiuted [a] 65: 12 672.3

iisappoinlment 11) 10221

iisclosed BJ 74: 10 !. iscomcct [I] 234: 13

iiscouragedrz~ 41: 15 233: 16

iisuutiy [IJ 56: 18 tiscuss lm] 6: 9 23: l7 44: 18 54: 5 68: 4 115: 14

136: 19 137: 5 139A3.14 146: ll 147: 3 Ml: 16 153: 4 158: 12 194: 4 195: 5 212: 13

liscussed [ITI 1x3

23~ 20 49: 6 51: 22 55: lO 64: 11 79: 25 94: 21 104: l 1233 124: l 134: 14 15524 202: 15 204: 7 2299 233~ 24

liscussing [6] 3: 15 14: 15 168: 2 J69: 14 21125 215: 24

tiscussion r24] 46: 19 56: l 58: 12 59: 5.8 81: 24 82: 1X1 91: 8 99: 8 100: 4 103: 17 106: 15 129: 15 133: 12 139: 12 153: 25 158: 17 164: 19 191: lJ 19725 202: 20 2253

LiSCUSSiOnS [ii] 23: 21 55: 5 63: 13 134: ll 145: 24 164: 15 165: lO 166: 10 187: 23 225: 13.16

hzasc ri] 185: 4

tisguised ri] 136: 22 iistance ri] 9: 17

htant ri] 76: lO iistinct [1] 93: ll tistinction 11) 95: 17 listinguish[ lJ 95: 15

)istict 141 1: 12.12.13 tistrustfui ri) 211: 16 biding [I] 161: 4 lo pu] 3: 13.1631.22 4: 5 4: 10.) 1.20,21.22.23 5: 2 5: 16.17.18.21.24 6: 3,6.7 6: 9.20 7: 20.22.24 13: 9.10

13: ll 16: 2325 18: 23.23

19: 19 20: 5.22 21: 7 22: 2 22: 17 23: 8 24: 3 25: 1.2.11 25: 12 26: 2.5 27: 12 28: 9 28: lO 29: ll 31: 7 32: l 33: 17 34~ 4.5 36: 14 38: 15 395 41: 20 42: 4.18 43: 16 43: 19 4415 46: 19,16 47: 21 49: 21 51: 12.20 54: l 57: 12.15 59: 14 60: 11.22 63: 17.18 64: 4.9 65: 8 66: 23 69: 1,18.23 70~ 6

73: 17 74: 3.4 76: 15 79: 20

81: 19 829 83: 12 85: 12 86: ll 87~ 4.4.4 88: 5,7.15 89: 17 90: s 9l: ll 92: 14 94: 25 95: 15 9T11.23 99: 1331 100: 17 101: l 10225 103: 19 108: 25 109: lO 110: 10 111: 4.17 115: lO 116~ 2.12 118: 9.10 11820 119~ 8 121: 3.4.13 123: 18 1254 128118

13OA. 22 131: 12.13.13 132s 136: 17.17.23

140: 9 14239.14 143: 24 14620 l47: 1.20 148: 14 148: 17 149: lO 151: 20 152~ 23 154: 12 156: 8 158: 7 159: 4.25 160: 4 162: 18,19 163: 2.13 164: 8 165: 4 166: 16.23.24 169: 8 169: 14 17O: l 171: 1,11,15 17lz22 173z235 177: s 178: 19,21 1- 79~ 25 180: 16 182: 17,22 183: 15 185~ 24 186~ 8.24 18%~ 189: 2 19OA220 1913 1935 195% 198~ 23 199: 6,7 201: 10,11.19 203: 22 206: 12,17 20731831 208: ll 209: 12 210: 9,24 213: 6.24 21523 219: Jl 220: 14,21 221: 24 222: 1.3 222: 7 2255.17 229: 16 230: 17 231: 13.19 233: 22 235: 18 237: 10.12.16.19 237~ 23.25 238: 1.3.4.8.13 ioctors [l] 60: 12

document Ii] 4: 12

DOD [IJ 175: 17

&IC[ IJ 203: 18 ioes [n) 13: 18 16: 22

25: 5 60: 23 77~ 8 85: lO. lO 88: 14 90: 14.) 4 141: 12 143: 14.1532 144: 2 148: lO 166: 18 170: 6 181: 16 183: 3 184: 17 202: lO 2059 2) 6: 6 218: 23 219: 2 234: 14

ioesn’trw 38: ll Ill: 2

111~ 21 liO% 141: 18.25 170: 12 181: 17 205: 2 227~ 2 232: 12 239: 2

3Og [6) 150: 12.13.18.19 157: 18.19 fOiIIg[ ls] 8: ll 21: 14

23: 21 62: 19 89: 22 91: 24 108: 14 11325 114: ll 124: 8 137: 16 149: 7 226: lO 229: 5 232: 13

iohr [I] 230: 3

i011ars[ 1) 125: 19

lon’trisq 7: 5 15: 6 193 22: 20 33: 12 38: 7 39: 3.14 40: 29.14.17 42~ 2.734 44: 25 472.17.18 49: 3.24 51: 1.4.2223 53: 16 54: lO 55: 16 56: 13 58: 6 6O: ll 6922 70~ 8 71: 11.12 7312 73: 23.24 76: ll 78120.25 792.239 82:) 84: 6.7.10

90: 18 91: 23 922222 93: 85: 22.23,25 86~ 5.14.15

93: lO 98: 18 99: lJ 100:) lO4: l 105: 17 11123

87: 2.23 89: 2.23.24 90: 1

114: 4 119: 23 12024 122: 5 123: 20 12523 127: 16 129: 17.22.23 130: 14 131: 4.15.1& 19 132: 17 135: 24 136~ 25.25 137: 19 139: 10.11 14l: l

:; dumpp,

25- n rnr- o

dumpedrl] 174: 18

dumb [IO] 1375.7.8.12

duringrlq JOS 11: 2 13: 15 14: 8 18~ 4.15 30: 16

137: 13 164: 13.14.16.16

48: 25 53~ 21.21 65: 24 73: 5 86: 17 10425 107: 13 120: 18 169~ 20 170~ 10 203

directly - encouraging

Thursday, August 6,1998

141: 16 143: 1 1449 146: 8 I dutycl] 57: 8 152: 18 153: 6 154: 732 158: 13 159: 6 161: 14 163: 14.15.16 165: 69 166: 2 J67: 18 168: 14 172: 15 176: l 17lk17.19 179: 17.17 18222.24

187: 7 i90: 2,17.19 192: 4 196: 14.23 199~ 18 2OO: l 203: 3 204: 4,17 208933 20823 209~ 1.7 213~ 20 217: 12 2185.19 220~ 15 22OW5 228~ 6 229.14 230~ 4 2Wl2.13 2X: 16 237: lfl 238: 6 240~ 4 IOnC [12] 17: 19 33: 16 71: 6 87: 24 102: 18 165: l 178% X82: 13 19624 213: 9 233: 17 234: 9

bor [IO] ‘16: 5 35: 3.13 36: 23.24 57~ 7.7 94: 17.18 94: 19

kxm ri] 36: 20 kKWWayl2) 14: 21 36: 2

loubt p] ]79:] 0 kwn [NJ 11: 2 12: 6

14: 12,17 39~ 11.12 55: 25 56: 2.3 68: 8 75: 33 9322 IO]: 18 129~ 8 145: 22 153: 25 154: lO 215: 4 lownstaim (21 206: 20 229: 24

h l2l 60: 5.5 traft [lo] 2: 7 194: 89

199: 19 200: 2.8.12.17 201: 2,12

lrafting [IJ 8: 16 hfts [I] 187: 22

iragged [a] 146~ 17 173: lJ 217: 6

hw (1) 93: l he~ s rm 32: 1,4,5.8

-E-

E[ SJ 2: 1 3: l. l 118: l. l e- mail [l) 174: 19

c- ma&~) 136: 14 173: 16$ 17* 174: 11.14 174: 1531

E- pass PI 154~ 2.4 cach[ u] 1l: ll 17: 6.14

17: 15 182121~ 5.6 2522 5325 WA7 106z23 156: lO 215: 19 wlicrpq l& l8 45: 8

46: 18 52~ 3 73~ 5 8324 8424 85: 14 882 107: 4 124: 7 126~ 14 138: 12,20 138~ 23 148~ 23 151: 12 160: 8 16822 186: s 188: 9 195: 7 Mm1 2112.10 212: 12 213: ll 216: 9

218~ 21 219~ 4 222~ 4 22724 2m15 2325

early m lo: 1 105: 25 137: 4 mkl2 209: 14,15 22424 225: 12

easierfq 38QO 48: 14 146: lS 183: lO

easily p) 37: 12 174: 7 East [l) 171: 17

%stcrp] 62: 3.4 91: 12

eat [l) 188: 19 editing 11) 224: 14

effect m 72 23325

effort [q 45: 4 57~ 6 106: 17 125: 9 175: 8 224: 13

efforts [sl 67: lf 101~ 20 1022 lm21

Cgg[ l] 188z20

37: 18,19.23,24,2435 38: l eight[ lJ 37~ 6 39633.24 40: 1.4.6,13.15 eighteen (1) 176~ 6

4Ozl6.19 41: 2.6.11.15 42~ 25 161: 18 Citber~] 13: 6 18: 21 19: 6 26~ 22 2825 49: 14 k? w[ 3) 92: 15.17 201: 13 53: 9,24 71: 9 75: U 82: 20 hive ri) 225: 25 98: 9 1Ol: lO 103% 104: 2 kingp] 226: 3.3 106: 20 147: lO 183: l kOp [CJ 109: 23 13622 204: 194 215~ 20 233: 16 188: 16 190: 7.18 229: 22 CjtiatC p) 1925 38: 12

h$ fEtg[ 4] : . 19025 200: 4 =labOmt& elated p] 168: 7 “’ 158: 21 ~vc~ 4, 11~ 4 14129 El- m lll: 4,6.720 229: 20 112zJ. 7 11321

My [2J 3: 4 Ilk5 ek% Ctkn [1] 65: 5,6 66: 14 87! 15 169% 25 170: 12

:k% A. iOIIS [I] 46: 13

:liminatingrl] 171:] 4

mm p] 209: 25 2 11: 1 :k pl] 28: 15 43: 13 46: 4

56: 9 74: 4,11 86: ll IOR6 109: 21 11413 119: 14.17 12623 127: 15 131: 2032 13210 14023 151: 4 157~ 20 1593 163: 12.18 182: 15 194: lO 198: 20 216: 20 232: 1.12 235: l ~manutl [I J 46: 7

mbamss p] 196: 14

mbamssed [2) 207: 8 2079

mbarrassing [SJ 38: lO 39~ 1 56~ 25 143: 2 18924

mbassy [IJ 90~ 2

mbraa+ d[ q 399 BKzgeueym 13@ 5 3mmick pm) 1% 3: s 45.9 7~ 20 17: 4 28: lO

332124 35: 19 375 432 46: 3 479 53: 1158: 11 78~ 5 79~ 10 80: 8,11,14.18 8025 81: 4,9,11,14,20 83~ 8 869.16 89: 4,6,13 94: 8 972 99: 3,7,15.17 w19 1015 112A4 117: 3 117: 7,12.15,18.21 118: 9 118: 11,17 122~ 2 137: lO 137A2.14.23 138: 9 140: 1% 20 141: 1.11 143: 12,15.17 144: 4,18 1452616 151: 6,11 160: 2 160: 5,11.13 162: 11.14,18 162~ 20 163: 1,24 16821 171: 321 172~ 18 173: 1.15 176: liVJ 177: 4 178: li 178~ 22 181~ 24 18218 184~ 23 18523 188: 17/ l 1899 194~ 21 195: 4,24 198z20.22.25 199: 2.6,8 199~ 16 201: 4.8 203: 11,15 213: 16.18 214: 8 2189 21921.2203.17 221: 6 223: 8.12 230: 79.11.13 24o:~ i .

znotional[ 13) 33: 1.11 33: 13 Xk35.1332 51: 15 69~ 91.22 72~ 7 23824

znplm [l) 119: 12

mlployment [l) 204: 20 mmqmssin~ [I] 61: 2 ZKOUnter [t) 9z4.4,6

1125 122 15: 4 63: lO 216: f

mcountcrs po) 142 18: 12 20~ 13 29~ 6 32~ 24 33~ 2 35~ 4 36110 47112 52: 12

alcouragc[ 2] 71: 7 73: l’ %OW@? d [C] 71: 3,: 232~ 233~ 15 234: 2,3

acourrgiag PJ 83: 20 86: 12 233: 10

Divcrsificd RCDO~~ W Sewices. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 In& x Page 8

1031

In Rc: Grand Jury Pmcedings =ndm 1123 15: 4 24: 17

25: 8 3& 16 52: 14 53: 4 61: ll 632 64~ 2 68: 20 6923 72: 6 79~ 13 81: 1 90: 18,18 114: 18 121: 3 135: 19 143121 172~ 8 186: ll 197: 16 202: 7 204: 18

mdcd pj 30: 15 3512 53~ 23 116~ 20 126: 23 156~ 8 165~ 22 y5g8$ e p] 2& 8 24: l

mgaged [I] 38: 24 ZIgageS [ZJ 1323 mgaging [I] 20: 17

mjoyed PJ ]7:] 493 mough [r] 26~ 22 37: 12

38: 15 120: 6,7 141: 7,19 164: 7

entered p] 325 22421

erktirc[ 4] 123: 7 124: 10 126: lO 234: 8

mtirely [l] 135: l mtlies [l] 175: 19 dry [I] 28: ll

Erbland [IJ 59: 20

tscorted [II 154: 8 qBecially [a] 497 84: l

86: 17 211: 16 224: 24 225: 13

zmntially [s] 7: 12 9O: ll 134: 21 182: 17 213: 23

Estep (11 60: 6

&imate[ 2] 21: 21 26: 6

Stimates [I] 63: 8 ti [I J 137: 25 Eve [I] 42: 21 Evelyn [q 65: l 85: 6

86: 13 90~ 23 91: 23 92: 2 wen [17] lo: 9 55: 2 79~ 15

80~ 18 84: 4 92120 147: U 153: 24 159: 13 160: 19 180: 2 207: 7 212: 19.21 213: 7 220: 21 221: l

mning[ a] 11: 4 30118 79: 23 92: 5 209: 14.15,16 229: 17

:vent 1131 58: 20 66: 4 79: 1 82: 20 95: 16.20 108: 4 144: 16 156: i5 175: 13 214: 2 237: 17 238: 4

S’ventS[ r] 17: 18 19: lO 28: 19,21 109: 14 204: 22 LwsImlally (5J 113: l

114: 8 136: 22 204: 8 207: 25 :ver[ m] 8: 17.22 lo: 17

15: 24 19: 22 20: 16,20 21: l 21: 4,18 22: 6 23: 3,10,25 24: 16 26: 8 27: l 32~ 6 35: 16.20 39: 22 42~ 8.24 42: 25 44: 18 47: 18 50: 16 50: 21.24 51~ 24 54: 5.18 56: 8 58: 6 6O: ll 74: 24

c c c

c c e 1 c

c c

c I c

C C C

C C

I C C C

C C C

92: 22.23 loo: 18 137: 24 138: 4 142: 16 14912 158A2.14.16 166: 23 174: 20 175: U 182: 25 NO: 25 191: 18 193: 12 196: 23 218: 19 220: 11.14 224: 21 227: 7.10.13.16 _~ ~.~_.~

228: 1 23k9.12 236: ll 239: 21+ 22 24O: l

wery[ 11) 6: 15 7: 13 5223.25 j5: 17 6O: lO 167~ 1 169~ 15 234~ 2233 2402

werybody [* I 419 57: 21 59: 21 181: 13

-one p] 53: 18 65~ 5 7O: lO 84: ll 94: 13 140s 182: 15 206: 735 NerythingpsJ 7: 15

12: 19 23~ 24 32~ 22 73: 14 7521 109~ 15 132: lO 140~ 3.7 141: 5,16,19 142: 7 147: 6 148: 13 150~ 12 156: 15 1599 166s 167: 3,17,19 172: ll 188: 12 192: 15,24 209~ 3 211: 22 213: 2 215: 8.17 217: 7 222: l 227: 4

widencing [I] 8920 :xact [2] 2092 232: 6 :xdy [IZ] 11: 20 13: 20

54: lO 57110 68: 15 91: 23 114: 4 124: 6 127: 20 167: 22 202: 13 207: 14

XAMINATION [z]

3: 7 118: 7

:xamined p] 3: 5 118: 5

:xample [II] 35: 21 57: X 74: 6 86: 13 87: 21 115: 8 147: 4 180: 7.8 217: 14 222: 22

:xampks [I] 102: 17 3xccl [l] 175: lO

:xctpt p] 163: lO 169: 16

Xhange (11 4: 2 91: 24

zchanged [I] 28: 1 :xcusc I,] 34: 22 44: 12

68: 6 73: 5 137: 22 165: 23 178: 15 194: 25 208: 20

:xcused m 33: 25 80: 16 162: 17 199: 5 230~ 14 240: 19a

:xhibit [IS] 4: 6,7 12: 21 12: 23 27: 5,7 29: 13 201: 5 201: 6 203: 12.13 223: 9,10 231: 9 237: 19

:xhibitcd [2] 9: 20 1975

Shibits [3] 2: 4 236: 22 236: 23

:xit [l] 93: 21

:xpand [3~ 48: 5.19 60: 24 :xpect [3] 92: 4 144: 5 207: ll

:xpectcd [I] ]43: 9 :xpecting [I] 122: 13 :xpcrience [I] 212: 14

Multi- Pagem experienced [IJ 9: Jo expcricnccs[ l] 71: 11

txphin (14~ lo: 24 14: 7 2l: lO 68: 15 87: 8.18 122:! 136: 15 142: 24 147: 20 155: 19 156: 12 195: 25 233: 14

txplained~~] ]3o:] g

cXplUratiOIIS [I] 124: 8

express [I] 193: 2

cxprcssed [I] 179: 18

expressly [4) 5OA6.21

5024 14O: lO

extent [I] 48: 8,9 extra (11 1752 tyeP1 9: 993] eyes f4] 25: ll 36: 4,5 38: 6

F[ IJ 118: l

face [I] 18: lO

facilitate [I] 4921

facilitated [II 192: 24

fact IU] 6: lO 44: 18 54: 5 61~ 21 70: 1932 80~ 18 83~ 24 87: 8 88: 19 98: 20 114QO 116: 21 119~ 15 138~ 24 140~ 6 151: 13 152: ll 153: 4 171: 24 177: 16 19l: ll 215: 24 216: lO 238: 17

fair[ r] 17: 5 26: 17 48: l 49: 8 84: 17.21 88: lO 103: ll 143: 7

fake p] 202: 8 217: 2.3

fdi [4] 16: 22 20: 9 29: 11 157: 7

fdls 111 29~ 16

fdst[ 41 5: 19 124: 7 152: lO 204: 16

familiu[ 41 97: 3.6 124: 4 144: l

fdy[ 2] 25: 12 114: 4 family’s [I] 98: 8 farm 46: 4 66: 23 95: 19

97: 8 124: 19 153: 25 202: 8

fashion [I] 136~ 16 faSt[ zJ 162: 25 172: 13 father (1) 87: 21 faxed [l] 219: 12 ~I[ I] 189: 5

February [lr] 20~ 6 21s 21: 9 24122.23 25: 17 30: 8 30: 13.16 37: 17 42: 3 45: 9 70~ 11 85: 14 90: 10.19 fed [ZZJ 9: 18 17: 23 25: 13

35: 15 38: 19 71~ 9 86: lO 1 IO: 19 144: 21 151: 6 155: 19 159~ 6.16 179: 16 179: 18 182: 14 192: 9 194: 19 196: 22 198~ 11 221: 19 233: 14

fding[ l~ J 6: 21 38: 16 87: l 142: 13 165: 15 166: 3

172: 12 193: 17 197: 4

end - for

Thursday, August 6,1998

224~ 25 228~ 24 23719 / i 1

227: 4 228: 2 1

feelings PJ 197: JO 198: 6

feds [2] 226: 24.25

fell [l] 217: 24 lelony [I] 5: 20 Felt [m] 23: 3.9 72: 15

83: 24 8724 88: 8 133: lO 166: 6.7 182: 15 194: 16.24 196: 18 207: 7

h[ 27~ lo: 12 18: 14 2822 34: lO 41: 25 452 4624 68z19 75: ll loo- 2 100~ 2 107: 15 121: 14 122: 23 153: 18 15925 160~ 4 168: 6 187: 12 188: 4 1%: 9 200~ 24 211: 19 2133 223: 23 238: 1425 kwcr [I] 58: 13 fianee[ lJ 119: 15

Fifth p] 3: 18.19 Fight [s] 752 112: 20

113: 15 114: 23 196~ 25 Kghting [I] 11423 Figprt [a- J 26~ 2 45: 14

6Oz19 9821 175: 8 181: 18 figured [I] 165~ 20 me [I] 17525 LleS p] 173: 17,17

RIofax p] 28: 24 29~ 1 find PJ 2: 8 203: 12 hinalizt [I] 203: 22

%mkzd [I] 203: 7 kdy[ d] 107: 17 130: 2

196: 5 238~ 8

-id [16] 64: 735 675.8 68112 7337.12 137: 24 138~ 24 146: 23 149: 7 186: 15 192: 22 215: 9.15 228: 9

kiing [I] 48: 20 ?ne[ lq 7: 7 12: 9 33~ 24

56: 23 62~ 24 75: 7 101: 16 117: 14 143: 6.8 154: ll 190: 21 195: 2 215: 17 220~ 5.5 ?ngCr [I] 86: 19 kiSkdp] 32: 17 101: 18

199: 17

Tmd [I] 171: 9 kn. l p] 227: 13 228: 5 irst [a~ 3: 4.12,18 924

10: 2 11124 14: 3 18: 14 38: 16 4522 61: 20 62: 6 66: 13.18 67: 3 75: 4 76: 7 80: 19 81: 22 87: 1]‘ 91: 14 92: 14 94: 16 95: 2 98: 3 103~ 19 104: 25 107: 15.15 12220 125: 3 130: 19 132: 12 138: 16 ]46: 21.22 149: 24 157: 17 163: 7 164: 331 ]67: 2 179: l 188: 3 19O: lO 192: 6.17 ]94: 12 196: 17 207: 12 211: 16 214: 9 216: 7.8 223: 18.20.22.23.25 224: 2

238: 19.23 239: 20 tit[ z] 40: 16 41: 5 tits [l] loo: 9 tivc [I] 5: 21 12: 9 90: 13

129: 14 151: 18 199: 1.2 220: 6 Five- minute [2] 33: 18

199: 3 Ti [3] 74: 3,4 172: l I kLt’tt& ng [I] 215~ 4 ka[ lJ 109: 8

mrtationp] 9: 17 11: 3 90: 16

Flirting V] 9~ 18 lo: 3

Florida [IJ 43: 15 ET ~21 136: 20 ’

Fio; d [I, 174: 6

Flustered [I] 206: 24 bcuS [i] 47: lO 50: 9

692.23 81: 14.22 148: 16 164: 15

bCuSd[ 4] 46: 13,14 107~ 24 108~ 2 FOlder[ l] 55: l rollow [4] 53: 17 xx22

107: 8 136: 9 idhv- up [PJ 8: 4 34: lO

81: 12 86: 9 94: 9 172~ 25 176: 19 178~ 11 204: 14

!o~ owing [q 49: 18 64: 14 77: 2,4 79: 14 loo: 12 148: 23 182: 22 218: 25

:Obws [9 3: 6 118: 6

hod[ 4] 164: 11.13 165: l 165: 2

root [a] 37: 9.10 206: 19 botage [I] 196: 16 br[ w] 1: 2.13 4: 2,8 5: lO

7: lO 8: 13 9: 14 lo: 14 1220.24 13: l 1520 16: 21 17: 13 22: 6 23: 15 24: 25 25~ 5.12 27: 8.21 30~ 15.22 34: 13 35: 21 37~ 14 38: 20 3824 41: 13 4219 449 48: 14.22 49~ 6 50119 5722 58~ 22.59~ 1 61: 4,7 6221 63: 15 67~ 5 74: 2,6 78: 19 8Oz9 82: 8.10,16 86A3.25 8721 94: 12 105: 22 108: 17 109: 1.18 1 lo: 1 1 112~ 9 114: 8 115: 7.8 116: 7 117: 8.13.16 118: 8 119: 6 119: 7.10 121: ll 122: 24 123~ 2 125: 6,23 126: 18 128c13 130: 9 131z2.2.21 132: 5,6.15.21 133: 13 134: 8 13523 136: 8 137: 5 137: 8 140: 2 143: 17 146: 23 147: 1,4,5 148~ 10 148: 11,12,20,25 149: 9 150: 3.11.22 153: 12.17 15537.832 156: 15 157: l 157: 14.14.15.15.16.22 158~ 21 NO: 19 163: lO 164: ll 166: 13,25 167: 17

Diversified Rmortine Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 9

1032

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

1 f

1 f f f f f f f f f f

f f 1

f f f f f

It f

f f

167: 18 168: 18.19 169: 14 169: 16 17l: lO I73: 9.17

174: 18 176: 1434 179: 25 181: 9.10 187: l 188: 19 189: lS 190: 18,2S 191: 5.7 192: 2324 194z3 195: 9 197: 20 198: 7,11,23 200~ 24 201: 7,2S 203: 14 204: 5,18 205~ 2 209: 10,11 209~ 19 212~ 9.15 214Q2 21522 217: 14 219: 22 220~ 6.7 221: 3.24 223: 11 224: 14 228: ll 229: 11,24 231: lO 233: 1.14 234: 7 235: 5 236: 18.24 237: 2.5 237: 18 240: 13 Torbes [6] 206: 5.8. J I

207: 13 208: 6 209: 8 'arcing [I] 193: lJ ~orepmcm [UJ 3: 5

33: 19 34: 1& S 80: 10.15 80~ 21 117: 5,8,14,17,20 118: 59.10.13 162: 12.16 162: 19_ 2] 34 J80: 16 198: 24 199: 1.3,6,7.10.13 230: 10.17,1830.22.25 ‘orever[ 1] 174: 17 ‘orget [ii 88: 3

brgot[ t] J86: 25 'Orm[ l] 166: 18 brmd [2J 204: 21 214: ll

brmulated [IJ 173:~ ‘ormulating [I] 173~ 3 ‘ortb [I] 120: 8

‘onward [I] 71: 16

-ought [2J 114: 18 234: 9

‘oundp] 31: 1 73: 9 J23: 5 123: 7 126: 22 139: 2 219~ 5 ‘Our [7] 8: 20.20.20 22: I J

129: 14 174: 18 230: 3

hmed [I] 157: 16 %ank[ 14~ 131: 6.11.12

135: 14 138: lJ J4T7.17 145: 19 16Q9.17 J92: 5.7 199: 19 203: 21 -rantica& [IJ 70: 12

ieaked [II 222: 18 ia[ z] 151: 6 192: 9 i’equent [I] 55: 6 icquexltly [2] 50: 13

86: 18

%iday[ q 30: 18 61: 23 64: 14 106: 20,21 128: 2 140: 16 170: 7,8

iidge [I] 165: 2

iiend[ w 10: 13 51: 7 98: 8 102: s lOd: 4 119: 19 119: 25 159: 3 187: 5.9 194: 17 213: 14,20 216: 23 iifmdly 121 48: 2 72: ll iicnds [3J 7O: ll 114: 4 213: 23

kiendship [q 48: 1034 49: 5 167: 9 173: 14

iog[ l] lJM: 25

kom[ w] 11: 7 15: 17 21: 16 2817 32: 5 36: 25 37: 24 38~ 17 39: 19 41: 16 43: 13.15,15,16 dd: 14,15 dd: 16 45: 1,4,14 47: 2,2 48: 20 49: 25 52~ 13 54: l 61: 19,21 62: 7 63: 18 67: 7 7022 71: lO 73: 20 75: lS 75: 16 81: 6 83: 20 85~ 5.8 87: lO 90120.2132 91: 20 92: 8> 94: 2 95~ 20.25 97: 24 98: 9.10.12.21,22 98~ 23 100; 23.24 102: 8 105: 5.11 106: 1632 109: 5 109~ 8 110: 6.12 112: 17,18 1 J4: 3 119: 22 123: 4.11 124: 16.17,18 128: lI 129: 4.5.9 133: 3 134: lO 138: 1.3 139: 18 141: 17 142: 16.17,23 148: 8 150: 13.16.17 1522 153: l 154: 15.17.19 J56: lO 158: 4,17,21 161: 2,18 166: 22 171: 12 177: 5 18l: l 183: 23 186: 14 187: 15.16 188~ 4 189: 4 193: 24 196: 13.17 197: 12 198: 5 199~ 19 200~ 17 202: 8 206124 209: 18.18 210: 11.16.18 211: 10.18 211~ 23 214: ll 215: 1,11 215: 16.21 216: 1.1,621 216: 22 218: 1323 219: 3 222: ll 224: 5,20 227~ 21 227: 24 228~ 2 233: 23 235: 18,19 237: 21 238: 15 238: 1732

iont m 57: 8 68: 13 127: 19 162: 3 223: 13 229: 25 234: 8

iustrated [SJ 67: 13.14 69: 4 JO]: 20 137: 20

'iustTation [3] 67: 15.18 102: 20

‘iustrations [3J 68: JO 73: 21 120: 14

ti1[ 3] I: 18 164: 18 240: 23

uller [IJ 80: 6 hlly [IJ 138: 21 ‘unction [I] 48: 13

‘unctions [II 204: 21

imdxaiser[ z] 28: 12

iImy[ 4] 26: 13 41: 4 45: 2 15J: l

ilrlOUgh[ S] 10: 25 149 18: 15 48: 25 169: 20 urtber [I] 8~ 4.5 9: 11 14: 2 19: 14 118: 6 187~ 23 239~ 5

i~ ture[~] 63: 14 j[ l] 3: J

iail [2] 186: 25 200: 9 pined [IJ 40: 15 idlery [I] 112: 19

Muki~ Pagerrc Gaprq 32: 5 37: 24 156: 1[ gate [a] 109: 25 1 lOAJ. 8

1 IO: 12 113: 22 154: 12.14 gave[ 2(] 26: 6 31: 18 69: 7

8033.45 1022 107: 17 128: 16 150: 5 157: 17 159~ 16 161: 18 176: 8 183: 3,22,23 185: l 188: 4 189: 14 1915 195: 9 2043 220: 7 23921 240: 13

w[ 2] 5d: l2 73: 25 ~cnd[ 14J 17~ 2 18~ 13

19: 16 52: ll 54: lO 60: 12 60: 13.23 6919 115~ 7 142: 13 J47: 23 200: 22 231~ 23 perabt’y [I] 197: 23 ;tncralizc [I] 36: 9

~dy[*] 18: ll 23: 18 25: 8 27: 22 41: 24 ?8: 1 6523 142~ 5 183: 2

werated PJ 224~ 3 22525

FeriCf2] 132: 11,19

genitalia [IJ 13: 3 pnitals [I] 21: 4 ;CntlCman [3] 128: 12

189~ 1 229: l WuinC (2) 48: 9,16 se0xgetowIl[ 2] 189: 20

222: 18 get [m] 15: 13.22 39: 5.8

399.12 40% 46A1.15 49: l 56: 12 61: 15 65: lO 6625 68: 3 69: s 71: 4 73: 21.22 74: 6,19 75: 15 79: ll 80: 2 90: 15 94: 130 9422 101: 20,24 102: 2.11 102: 19 105: 19 106: 15 110: 9 111: 2.10 115: 24 116: 5 117: l 120: 9 122: 8 123: 4 127: 24 128: 1.19 132: 25 134: 9 135: 14 142: ll 146~ 11 147: ld 148: 19,20 149~ 11 15d: l9 155: 14 156A4.15 164: 18 165: 7 166~ 11 168: 7 171: l 176: 3 181: 3.21.23 182: 8 182: 9.10,16.19 186: 6 190: 4 192: 14.20.24 193: ld 194: 9 196: 5.6.15 197: 1721 2OOz2 20722 207: 24 209: 8 211: 11,12 212: 7 214: 11,25 21S: ll 224: 13,17 228: 16.17 229: 8.16 233~ 23 ;ets [I] 163: 8

;ettingru] lo: 13 30: 15 36: l 48~ 15.18 56: 9 66: 15 71: lO 79: 15 104: 24 110: 7 120: 12 142: 16 153: 25 168: 2 174: 14 179: 25 182: 5 197: 17 21211 213: 15 220: 7 224: 14 [ift[,] 132: 9,12 156318 -161~ 2 167: l J89: 12.16

191: 7.15

$fts [ss] 25: 22.25 26: 3,6

Forbes - gottm

Thursday, August 6,1998

28: 1 33: 2 55: l 109: 1.3.1 I 110: 18,19 111: lJ 115: 8 132: lO 139~ 18 145: 7 147: 7& J 152: 15,20,21.22 153: 89,] 213 155: lO 156: 4% 23 15919.24 161: 1,4.7,8 163: 8,9 166: 13.14,17.18,19 167: 7 167: 14 168: 2,3.18 18295 183: 3 189: lO 233~ 22 235: 1923 dggled [I] 121: l #1[ 1] 68: 23 88: l @h [I] 16: 5

jrlfriendl:] 102: 16 jst PJ 125~ 3 2092 jve [no 253 3021 d5: 12 49~ 3 52: lJ 69: 19

10721 108z24 1O9A1.12 10920,21110: 18,20 115& z 116z! 119: 7 126~ 5 135Q2 152: 16 lSdzu15 155: l 156211 156: 14 161: l l& 17 182~ 11 189~ 12 202: l 210~ 13 2lW2 22SXJ 229~ 18 jvtn ox] 17: 6 263

107: 15 132~ 12 MO: 15 143: d 145: 13 152: 8.22 156: 9,19 157: 14 1592 167~ 2 183~ 21 235Q2.23 235s 239~ 240~ 8

+z! J [I] 6~ 2 jving [w] lT18 2522 889 110: 19 1113.7 14721 153: 13 159Ao 166: 14.17 168: 3 191: lS 219: 8

;lart P] 1696.8

Ileaned [I J 49: 24

rlued [I J 183: 24 ;opl] lo: 23 14: 19 15: 13 1522 19: 18 30: 20 43~ 22 46: 9 55: 21 57: 6 62312.25 64~ 2 65: 12 66Z3 742 75: lO 81: 25 83~ 23 902 90: 20 9320 94~ 17 104: 6 10524 108: 7 109z2d 1m13 111: 4,17 115E3 117: l 122z9 125: 78 1302 143: 13 J46: lS 147: 4 153224 160: 9,17,20 16224 163: 3,7 1703.17 17024 177: 17 17k22 183: 7,7 185: 1,3 181: 17 187: 19,20 192: 6,10 193: ll 205: 15 206A531 214: 3,9 219: 2222& l 221 c23 224: 2 22~ 5~ 22

rod [t] 148: 15 hi’S[ lJ 25: ll ;ocs [r] 213: 21 :oing [lsl] 7: 11,1Ll431 7122.22.14 8: 3 9~ 8 1023 11: d 17: l 19~ 16 2S: J

27: lO 36: 24 37: 13 40: 17 41: 11,17,17 45: 17 Sk18 55~ 23 ST9 62: 79 63: 12

75124 81~ 2.45 83: 3 85:! ’ 86~ 23 87~ 10.18.21 90: 9 91: 9.13 9d: 6 9620 102: 12 105~ 2 108: l 109: 13,15.22 115: 17 116~ 2 121: 3.4 124: 19 125: ll 126: 17 128: 15 133: 18 13d: 21,24 138: 12 1402 Jd2: lJ 144: 19 146~ 24 148: 17,18 Jd8: 192J 1539.19 155QO 156: 6.14 158i2.3 159: 14.18.20 1609.17 161: 24 162: 622 163: 2.3 163: 4 165: 18 166: 3.1923 167: 13 171.9 172: 7.12.19 173: 8,8,13 176: 2 179: 25 181: 18,19 1822,5,10 186~ 7 191: 12 192: 12,13 193: 7,19,21 198r23 2OO: lO 205~ 22 207: 14 20& l 131 209: 3,4 210~ 14 211: 18.2124 212: 19,21 213: 6 2142 22112324 222.13 225Q2.23 226: 12 226~ 13 2298 231: 18 234: 6,7 2dOz18

:Oupj 183: ld 18d: ld. 16 :olfiig fl] 752 ,one[~ q 4521 68: 5 69~ 4 88~ 4 91: 1.3 9dA9 106~ 22 1121 116: 13 173: ll 182: 12 207~ 20 208~ 6.12 212: l 213W2 221: 13 ,wdps~ 39.10 37: 8 48~ 22 54: 13 63: 7 68: 23 8O: ll 84~ 5 86~ 14 88: l lW: 3,9 107~ 23, ZS lll:] d 117~ 13 154~ 22 170: 8 172: s 175: 5 176: s 180~ 6 197: 24 19823 XJ- kl3.16 210~ 6 214: 3,4 217: l 222~ 24 225~ 7 226: 14 23O: l

bodinpq 31~ 2 459 45: 16 47~ 7.11 482 85: d 85A5.18 l& 24 h& n’s [I] 102: 16 ooCb? s[ l] 162~ 13 oofiigm 15Oz4 151: 3 bSh[~] 233: 6 Ot[ 63] 21: 14 36rs Sd: 12 56: 8 68: 8 70~ 5.9 75: 15 76: 3 79: 19 91: 7.14 92: l 9724 1OOA1 1013 106: 16,21 109~ 14 11223 114% 118: 18 11923 120: 3,5,10 123% 13Ozl$ 145z19 147: 7 149m* 150: 11.14,17,1~ 31 15137325 156: lO 158~ 21 164: 7,8+ 24,2S 180~ 5 181~ 6 191: 3,19 195: ll 1m20 198~ 5 211: 16 213: 13 2123 2193 Ulc24 u2.14 2243 2372 Ottm[ m~ 39~ 17 102: 17 109~ 2 113: 18 136: ll

Index Page 10 Divcrsificd Rcuorting &- vices. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

157: 7 177: lO 198: l 209: s 228: 23

ovenurrent [2] 4: 1.3

rab[~] 231: s xa& [I] 192: 18

rand[ q 1: 7,11.18 2: 4 355.11,12,14 4: 7,1& 19 12z20,22,23 13: 1,12 17: 13 19~ 17 2220 24~ 25 27~ 7 2721 28: 9 29: 13 34: lO 72~ 2 111: 19 118: s 143: 17 1623 1673 2015,6,10 203: 1513 211: 2 223: 8.10 230: 16 2319 236~ 2223 2372 239: JS 24Oz8.23

Zrass[ 4J 31: 19 156: 19 157~ 2 161~ 23

fltify [1] 13: s

hazedrs 21: 6

yGTJ[ lJ 13: 4 Toss [I] 41: 4 mup [I] 66~ 4 112: 2

~t( zI 142: 12 188: 14

wd [3J 57: 8,9 154: lO

;pards[ 4] 110: 24 1119 112~ 11 113: 22 ;atss PSJ 8: 17 9: 4,13 30: 17 35: 2,14 37: J0 4625 48: 15 49: 2 53: s 61: J 1 63: 24 66: 12 70: 17 79: 25 85: 4 98: 6 loo: 7 121: 15, 126: ll 132: 25 134: 7 15O: lS 153: 18 154: 4 162: 22 167: 25 177: 20 181: 17 189: 14 196: 12 2O4: 6 216: lO 226: 20 227: 25 233: 21 238: 16

wilt 131 25: 9 91: lO 179: 18

piby [ii 38: 19 iump [I] 2OO: 6 Fuy[ l] 49: l ~ysg] 28: 13 178: 16 1994 gan[~] 213: 21

-H- labit [I] 28: 24

lad[ sq 6: 10,14 9: 10.14 1O: l 11: lO 13: 14 14: lO 16: 4 18: 18 19: 23 20: 12 27: 4.25 28~ 24 30: 14,14 30: 21 32: 24 34: 10,15 36: lO 38: 14.15.23 39: 4 40: 22 42~ 5 44: 19 45: 6,8 46: 18,25,25 47~ 23 SO: 5 SO: 13 52: 5.25 53: 25 55: 7 57: lO 58: 9,25 59: 4.8,22 60: 16 62: 19,23 635.9.17 64: 7.11.2425.25 65: 1.24 66: 22 67: 4.7 68: 3.5.5.10 68: 19,22 69: 2,3,3,4 70: 12 70: 13,14,16,16,17,18,20 70321,22,23 71: 33133 72: 7,12,17.19 73: 4,5,6,20 74: 10.23 76: 13.15,1730 76: 21,22,25 77: 1.1.5,6.11

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1033

Multi- Pagem

233: 11.21 234: U 235: 2.6 235: 9,12.15 236: 3,11,12 236: 17 237: 13 238~ 23.24 238~ 24 239: U 24OA. 8

ladn’t ~171 38: U 46: 12 83: 25.25 89~ 11 107: lS 112: s 147: 23 173: lO 182: 3 193: 8 208: 3.6 211: 23 222: 16 228: 2 233: 18 mirJ11 18: lO

lalf p] 8~ 20.21 63: 7 103: 15.15 114: 7 126: 13 126~ 24 215: 2

mlfway JIJ 129: 9 dl[ n] 11: 6 18: 21 54: i

90~ 20 129: 9 169: 5.5 227: s ~dlowccn [I] 26: 14

dway 1211 11: 421 132 1424 15: 11,17 31~ 21 34: 16,22,24 35: 8 36: 3.11,22,25 41~ 21 53: 9 93: lO 95: 3 96: 1212

land [I] 9: 23 42: 8.10 56~ 21.21 139: 16 182: 16 227: 4

landed III 226s landing [l] 220s mndk [I] 86~ 23 1andliIJg [l] 86: 23 lands 141 9: 822 18: 9

226: s

landwriting 131 201: 2 201: 14.15

lappen 1131 23: 13 7524 9O: J4 105: 2 154: 2 155: 20 167: 1.20 192: 12 196: 8 207: 14 217: l 226: 18

lappcned [42J 11: 8 12: 12 16: 2.9 J8: 1424 19: 24 31: 13 32: 17 40: 3 56: 8 62: 23 64: 7 65~ 4 67: 21 7Or4.25 81: 17 93: 7 94: 4 102: 6 IO425 105: 4 107: 13 J10: 1.8 113: 13 116: l 122: 18 127: lS 128: 9 i45: 19 149: 21 163: 13 173: 9.10 202: 4 211: 9.18 229: 22 233: 15 233: 24

lappcning J~ J 58~ 20 68: 16 86: 20 121: 8 138: 22 215: 9

lappens 111 192: 15

sappy 12) 21: 15 168: 9

mrasscd[ 2] 70: 18 72: J4

mrassmcnt [I] 70123

xardr,] 143: 3 195: jl 234~ 7

Harold 14 85: 6 93: 5.10 93: 14 95: 23 96~ 22

MS WJ 4: 6 21: 25 27: 6 35: ll 38: 13 44: 17 58: 7 72: 2 J& I: 15 93: J 1 JO4: 4 12O: ll 136: 9 138: 6 140: 23 184: 1920 185: 19 189~ 4 196: 23 203: 19

TtlllI

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Iavcn’t [2] 3O: ll 116: 13 wing [a] 3: 4 6: 20 7: 2 7: 24 47: 12 5O: l 59: 14 60~ 22 79: 20 83: 17 87: 12

government - bc day, August 6, 1998

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134: 45,7,14,18.19,1920 134: 20 135: 12.4,6.16,22

In& x Page 11 Divmsified Rmortinrr Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1034

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

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IC’S 1161 9: 22 22: 2 23: I4 84: 4 105: 21 12o: lO 143: 21 168: 3.16 169: 3 180: 6 188: 6 1891 207: 23 237: 11 239: l

leadfq 66: 20 J50: 14 157: 4 215: l

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mrtj4] 123: lO 172~ 21 173: 4 23610 eating [I] 83: 2 1

caven [II 174: 19

leldru 177:~

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4emreichm 14: Il 57: u25 58: 7 64: 8 71: lO 73~ 4 8S: l 16824

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IeSitating[ l] 168~ 14 ky Ill 82: 25 ti [I] 84: 6

lidden [II I 59: 4

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Multi- Pagem

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limself [3] 44: lO 45: 7 191: 12

tinder [I] 7:~ lip [2] 39: 13,15

lirc[ lJ 74: l

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he’d - I Thursday, August 6,1998

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Diversified Rmorting Services, Inc. 1202) 296- 2929 Index Page 12

1035

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Multi- Pagem

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I’d - if Thursday, August 6,1998

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Index Page 12 Divcrsificd Rcnorthw Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1036 In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings Multi- Pagem

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Sll’t[ fl 833 J4J: JY 165: 24,25 1803

SI& i[ lJ 90- 21 Ssut[ r) 58: 19 76~ 15 88: 5 m. 15 22a: 7

SSUCS lzq 2622 38: 15 ttS7q 3~ 254: 157: 58: 1J 9~ 79.21.22 Jo3,11.24.25 12:‘ 22,2225 13: 18 14~ 8 14: 13.1820 J~ z, Jo. J~ J5: JO JfCWlJ12122 Ml9 19kldJti3; 14 20~ 15.16 22~ 2323.25 239 23n, 9,14 242 25~ 13 26: 13.13.14,15,17 2725 28: 1,7,212% 5,16,20 30: 15,17 3J: J 32: 4,12.13 32~ 16 33~ 5 X16,23,23 3424.25 3514 36~ 6 38 38: 15.18.20,22 39: JO, J+ 40: 79. J1,14,16.20.21.22 4023,24.24,25 413.11 4J: J3, J6, J7.17 43: 20 44: 16.1724.2425 45~ 5.6 45z9.14 46~ 23 47~ 55.6.6 47: 18,18.21 48~ 1,320 49: 5,7,13,16 5OzJ9 519 51: 22 535,22 54: 10,24 W24 55~ 11 56~ 8.9 58: 4,6 59~ 13 6l: JW 63~ 3 659 65: lO 66z3,1& 21 6791 6M2.22 68rJ9 69: 7* 6921 ‘03JO. 22 71: 12 72z7.1023 732 742.4.4 745 75z. 19 76: 7.10.16 m4,15 7& 2.19& 23~ 4 79~ 33.7 BM 8k6.24 S2: J DQ. 3.4A6.733. J 1.16 82: 19 83: 18 84~ 17 85: 7 85: 10,23,25 86: 6&~ 922 8633,23 8’324 88: JlJO 88: 10,13J3,19,22 89~ 18 89~ 20.24 S% 7. J4, J8 91: 17 91: 19 9233.1819.19,20

9223 93: 18 94%& 25 955 96~ 17 W3 9W. l J 9Szl6.19 992 loo: 16 101: 10.10.1922,23 102: 19 103: 4,83,11.15 1033~ 105414 10621 JO’z15 108PJ 1099,16 JJo: J3.14.23 11120 113~ 6.2224 114:~ t 114: 1,8 11533, i1,12,12 JJ65,14 117: J, 4.10 119~ 17 12WO, J6$ 4 I

Diversified Renorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 14

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

121: 24 123: 3.10.13.21 1 147: 45 157: 1.8.11.] 8 124: 11.12,14.16,25 125: 3 125: 7,7,1 I. 1934 126: ll 126~ 14 127: 2.15, lS. 23 128: 5.9,21,21,22 129~ 8 130~ 15 131: 430 13216 132: 11.13,17 133: 23,24 134: 13.14.14 135: 13.10 136: 8,18,19 138~ 6.22 139~ 12 140: 73,10,10,21 141: 5.6,14,18,25 142: s 142: 1810 143: 1.1,2,24 14325 146~ 23.24 147~ 3.8 147924 148~ 6 149: 19 JsO: l9 151: 9,10.10 1522 153: 13.6,11,14.16.22 154: 7,14 156: 1.11.13,20 15620.22 157: 6 158: 7,8 1589.19 159: 6,14,15 162: 89 163: 17,21 164~ 3 16(: 6,10,1434 16kl8.22 16525 166: 1031.24 167: 6.7,10.16,17,25 168: l 169: 15,15 170: 8,1J 171: 3 17236,12,13,13,21 173: 3 173: 6,7,12,12,13 174: 4,6 17425 175: 1723 176c4.4 176: 5,6.10,25 177: 1.15 177: 18.18,23 178~ 35.6 178: 13,25 179: 17 180~ 4 181: 17 183: 16,2425 184: 1.15,16 185: 6,7.13 185: 14.25 186: 12,3,8.15 186: 16.20 189: 14,17 190: 2,3.7,12,14,18 191: 9 191: 23 192: 1,23 193: 5.5 194: 11.12,13,15,19 195: 2 195: 7,14 196: 20,22 197: 20,21,22 198: 3,4,6 198: ll 199: 2,22 201: 13 201: 14,23 202: 3 203: 9,12 203: 18,19 204: 8,24 205: 2 205: 4,21,21 206zl7.19 207: 14,20,23 208: 3933 209: 12,14 210: 2.2,6.23 210: 24 211: 19 212: 1534 214: 4 215: 16.17 216: lO 216: 20,22.24 217: l 218: 13,16.23 219~ 1.12 22oz21.22.25 221: 1,3,4 221: 11 226: 12,22 229: 19 232: 6,12,18,23 234: 5,19 234: 24 238: 6,14,20,21,22 238~ 25 239: 3,3.19 t’s [rq 5: 21 20: 7 23: 1 27: 23 37: 1924.2425 39~ 10 42~ 24 46~ 6 49~ 24 51: 3 57: 15 605 71: 2 75: 4 78~ 21 84~ 17 85: 4 88124 95~ 6.22 98: 22 103: 18 109~ 6.7.7 117: 4,10,14 127: ll 140: 21 141: 19 142: 4 143: 3 15l: lO 156: 20 179~ 10 185: 14 195: 9 199: ll 204: 15,17 204% 205: 3 217: 25 225: ll 229: 24 230~ 2 232: 17.17,20,20 237: 9$ 1 23721.23 238: 15

tem[ 4] 150~ 16 156~ 10 179: 2,6 tans [I)] 139: 23 141: 3

lss: zj ls92. Z 160: 9.11 160: 13,17.18 19k5.9 214: lO its& p] 183: 1,6

-J- J~ J 214: 18 jacket I:] 14: 19 ,ja& cts[~] 41: 16

Jakcp] 53 Jamic PJ 206~ 14 210: 3 Jane [I] 203: 18 Januarypo~ 61: 12 66~ 15

8922 180: 13,14 181: 25 189zl3 190: 10 19123.24 192: l 199: 17.1& 18 214: 7 214~ 9 219~ 12 22720 235~ 5.13

jealonsp] 112: 3 181: 3 ,

196: 20 212: ll Jcmifer[~] 14: 9 jcrkrl] 11623

jet I;] 7520

jettedp] 93: 13 96: 21

jobcal 23~ 21 65~ 8.10 68: 12.25 692 73: 2122 74: 6 88: 6 101: 24.24 102: 17 105: lJ 106~ 17 115: 14,16 119: lO 121: 8 148: 12 171: 17,19 179: 25 180: 9 181: 3,22 182: 4,5,8 182: 9,10,11 192: 20,24 195: ll 197: 19 203: 4 2052324 206: 3.7 21121 211122 212: 79 213: 5,13 214: 19 220~ 7 222~ 14.15

110: 17.1923 2151

I jokes 131 17: 17 23: 23 183: 13

jokingfz] 9221 151: 3

Jolleyp~ 171: 7 Jones [UJ 7 I: 25 73: 25

123: 2 12422 125: ll 127: 9 133: 2 137: 24 146: 23 14820 151: 19 166: 8 16818 173: lO 187: 6 192: 11.13 193: 13 2021 214: 4 21525 217~ 6.25 225~ 15 227: 25 232: 11

Jones’ [zJ 128~ 17 146~ 17

Jordan [loll 103: 1624 104: 3,16,25 105: 5.1935 106: 15,17,18 115:] 825 11823 119: 16,24 120~ 5 120: 14,21 129: 3.4,16 130: 16,18 131: 2125 1322.14 133: 1525

1037

Multi- Pagem

134: 12 135: 15.18 138: 19 138: 23 139: 3.4,822 140: 6 140: 14 141: 2.3.79 142: 8 142: 14.22 144: 2123 145: 7.1021,22 163: 5 177: 10,15.24 178: 7 179: 19 180: 33,24 181: 3 181: 5,13 182124 186% 16 187: 1,13.1524 1882.8 189: l 194: 13,14,25 19922 200~ 3 202: 1630 20224 2032 2079,19 2099,18 211: 23 21925 2202.11 221: 7 222: 13,21 X7: 18 229~ 13.16 23225 235: 6

ordan’s 191 10390 1302,7,8,23 142: 3 229: 18 2292025 llliet[ Ij 15723 uly pTl 8: 9 6723 698 69~ 10 71: 1621,21 74~ 18 7423 75~ 7.13.15 76: 13 772.2124 81: 1,22 83~ 16 87: 6 101: 19 155: 13 23723 238: 15232425

ump p1 70: 5,8 127: s umping( r] 71: 16

155: 13 182: 23 une (21 68: 4 237: 13 uror [SJ 34: 20 4% 25 7212 76~ 24 77~ 9 86~ 10 99~ 4 137: 22,24 138: 3,8 143: 13.16,17 144~ 3 170~ 18 171: s 172: 4,1725

1732 180: 18,23 181: 17 240~ 12

IUD= m 19: 17 28: 9 34: 10 Ill: 19 16725 201: 10 213: 17 uryjm] 1: 7.11,18 24 3: 5 3: 11,12,14 4: 7,18.19 122022.23 13: 1,12 17: 13 2220 27~ 721 29: 13 118: i 162: 3 2015.6 203: 12,13 211: 3 223: 9.10 230~ 16 231: 9 236~ 2223 237~ 2 239~ 15 240: 823 ury’s [I] 24: 25 ust [ml 5: 3.10 7: 6.16 8: 10 9: 2325 12: 20/ l 13: 17 15: 3 16: 2121 19: lf 22: 2024 23: 8920 24~ 25 25: 8.10.11.12.21 27: 21 35: 12 36: 7 3E3.10 41: 39 47~ 23 49: 2 52: 2424 53: lt 54: 24 55: 21 56: 8.1425 60: 1924.24 66: 1325 69: 19 7Or6.10 71: 20 72: 2 74: 4,19 755 78: 3,1025 793 8Oz3.14.25 81: 16.18 81: 23 82r5.7.17 83: 7920 845.89 85: 19 86~ 423 87: 4 8822 89.2 91: 725 92: 18 93: 15 97: 6,20 99: 1

100: 15 102~ 16 105: 12,24 107~ 17 109: 7.14.16,17 110: 20 112: 9 113: 2324 115: 11,12,12 118: 18 120: 4,16,21 12l: l 122: s

Tblll

122: 23 124: 18.24 1’5: h 126: 8,13.21 127: 5.14.16 128: 22 129: 18,1922.23 131: 13 135: ll 136: 23 137: 1921 138: 3 139: lO 141: 1,24 142: 14 144: ll 147: 1.15 14817 149: 23 150: 4,25 15l: lO 153: 18 154: 1131 156: 20 157: 3 158: 112334 159~ 4.11 l6l: ll 164: 7,10,14 165: 2 165: 6.2011 168~ 13 169: 3 169: 6.8,13 170: 21 171: 8 172: 6,6 173: 10,11 175: lO 176: 3,14 ITI: 179~ 6 180~ 6 18223 183: 5,7 185: l 188: 11,12 19124 193: 14,2325 194: 19 195: 18 196: 15.19,20 197: l 198: 6,6 199: 17 20636.2224 207: 19 2ll: lS 212~ 10 218: 13,16 219~ 1722 22k3.6 222~ 1 222~ 22 226: l 227~ 39 2302.22 231: 2 233: 8 235~ 525 236: 7 238~ 6 240~ 16

Wtifj‘ ing [z] 205: 79 -K- :ar~ ll [I] 42: 14 -[ I] I: 23

hssorla 111 605 ;a&? [ZJ 102: 8,14

~athkzen [nl 7k2.14 72: 13,17.1820 73: 4,920 76~ 16.2025 77: 1,4.5.6.11 77~ 13.16 152: 2 1822 187: 6 212: 16 22420.25 225: 1,14 hthyrr] 60: 5

Lay [GJ 215: 20 216: 5.6 217: 2.9 219~ 2

Layem 98~ 8.15 10011 100i18.19 101: 2 216: 8

:eatiIIg [I] 87: 15 169: 2 1

169122 17o: lS

mp[ lq 41: 11.53: 13.19 S9: 15 67~ 12 84% 121: 7 121: 7 159: 2021 160: 20 J62: 4 166: 23 198~ 23 205: 13

;C~[ IJ 65~ 21

cpt [la] 37: 1 83: 20 156: 17,1721.23 157: 1.4 157: 6 161: 8.12.1523 165: 24 170~ 21 172: JO

idding[ lJ 208116 illed 12~ 122: 20 126~ 3

ind [co] 22: 25 40: 20 41: 4 4613 49: 2 51: 7 53: 4 s3: 19 54: 12 m2 68: 18 6822 69: 1 79~ 16 84: 8 87~ 1882 899 100: 1,7 124: 20 127: 17,19 1299 129: 15 134: 12 139: 12 142~ 9 147: l 153: 24 US: 12 165: 921 167: 8.17

it’s - hlon

iay, August 6, 1998

168: 12.14 172: li. l: 173: 13 181: 14 166: 12 188: 13 1895.23 !96: 21 197: 14 198: 14 21X: 3 205: 20 208: lO 214: 3 215: 9.22 21622 221123 221: 25 226~ 25 233: 4 236: lS zrby[ l] 22523 JSS [r] 11: 12.1520.24 31: 19 36~ 2

5sscd [IJ 91: 6 isscs [IJ 109: 6 issing[~ i] 153.8 25% 25: 21 29: 18.1925 30~ 2.5 36: 25

mew [ss] 43: 21 44: 23 4724.24 49~ 22 50~ 8 51: 13 51: 14.20 5921 76: 21 77: 6 77: ll 192.3 8Or5.6 83: 18 85: 6.8 87: 12 89~ 8 92: 8 93: 16 110: 16,20 Ill: 25 113~ 21 II% 16 124: 6 126: 16 134: 12 13szl. 4 137: 25 144: 12.20 148~ 4.5 1523 153: 20 158~ 16 165: 17 169~ 17 180: 4 182~ 5 218: 13.14 222: 1.9 228~ 25 233122 234~ 12 236: 10 240: 6

mocked[: l 14: 18 ZIOW[~ I~] 7: 21 14: 13 2025 2223 23: 1 24: 8 31: 7 36~ 24 3823 39: 1.14 40: 10 41: 79,13 42: 2.4 43: 16,19,21 442425 45: 2 45: 14 46~ 5 47~ 1.18 48: 23 4924.25 502.8 51922 51~ 23.25 55: 10,12.16 56: 10.13 57: lO 59~ 10 61: 2 61: 5 68: ll 70~ 15 71: 5 72: 4.10.14 7311923 74: 1‘ 25 753324 77: 3 78: 172023,2325 79: 29 79~ 14.16 81: 18 62~ 12.13 82: 14,15.15.16 83: 6 84: 8 8X2.2425 86~ 1.4. S. 14 8622.24 87Z3.12.1423 87~ 25 88: 3,55,7.16 89r2.10 89~ 11 91: 3 92~ 18.24 93: 14 94: 6 9X0 96: 12 97: 8 99: 1.15,21 1Ol: l 102: 15 102: lS 104: l lM: l2

10722 110: 3,4.17 11 I: 2 Ill: 8 113: 19,25 114: lA 114: 24,25 116~ 325 120~ 22 122: s 123: 16.17 123: 20,22 124: 19 125: lO 125: 21,21,23 126~ 6.17 127: 3.16 130~ 21 131: 4.12 131: 13,17,18 13220 133: 7.13 134~ 3.1622 136~ 6 139: 59,1124 140~ 1 140: 21 1432.20 144: 9.15 147: 16,17 1485 149~ 8.9 15o: lS 152: 15.18 154: 7,7 154: 10,22 156: l JS8: 2 159: 6,921 161: 4.14,15 163: 14.15,16 166202035 167: 4,18.1920 168~ 4.6 168~ 13 169: 4.6.7.19

Index Page 1. ’ Divcrsificd Rmortine Smvices, Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1038

In Rc: Grand Jury Proceedings L Multi- Pagem

170: 22.23 17 1: 24.25.25 172: 8,20 173: 14 174: 15 175: 7 176: 14 177: l 178: 17 179: 17 180: 19.21 180: 22 181: 5.6.8 187: 7 187: 14 188: 10.11.13 190: 17 191: 24 192: 15.17 192: 18,21 193: 1,4.5.7.17 194: 25 195: 8,14.18 19623 197: 1.12.13 J98: lS 199: 12 202: 13 206: 21 207~ 20 209: 1.3 210: 14 211: 17,21,24 212: 16.17,18,20 214: lf 214: 19 215: 7 216: 1.22.25 217: 24 218: 13 219: l 220: 14,15,19.193032 222: 12.20 225: 1.3.4.5,89 226: 16,25 228~ 16.23 229: 10.12.14.14.16 230: 4 230: 6,23 233: 11.15 234~ 6 234: 12,20 235: 14 237: 20 237: 21 238: 13 239: 3.22 240: 3.3,4.12.13.15

mowing [4] 38: 15 83: 19 1 JO: 20 142: 14

mowingly [ii 13: 3

mowledge [SJ 28: 3 45: 15 86: 15 92: lO. lO

mown t- 71 26: 3 72: 17 82: 13 94: lt 163: 9 188: 8 233: 9 mows pi 134: 19.19.19

-7 -

; [3] 231: 23 232: 23 233: 1

;ack[ q 142: 17

Lady [ZJ 188: 3 196: 17 lag [I] 75: 20

language [2] 8: 16 132: 4 Lanny [2] 1 10~ 23.24 last [ICI 7: 13.15 28: ll

36: i 4& 22 62: 21 104: 20 153: 21 201: 24 223: 20

II II

11 11 11 1

1 1 1 1

1 1 1

1 I

1 1 1

1’ : 1

I A

232: 20.21 237: 3 239: 20 239: 25 240: 4

ate [q 14: 8 22: 24 23: 10 112: 2

ately [I] 28: 13

aterpq 9: 12,15 12: 2 31: 1.8.10 39: 20 45: 13,13 46: 18 61: 24 64: 10 67: 10 69: 13 73: 14 75~ 22.24 89: 19 90~ 1325 92: 7.16 95: 23 96: 17 97: 5.13,14 97: 17,20 99: 22 121: 14.14 121: 15 122: 7 126: 24 154: 15 177: ll 188: 5 196: 9 205: 15 209z9.13 210~ 16 215: 11,15 219: 5 228: 10 229: 14,17 235: 17 238: 25

attcrp] 48: 13 68: 4 215: 2

augb 111 198: 21

aundxy [ii 81: 12 Lawn [2] 9: 7,15

awycrs [# I 107: 20 108: 5 112: 6 114: 21.25 125: 21 125: 22 137: 25

cad [SJ 51X4.5 70: 22

193: 21 tading p) 30: 13 36: 24

eads[ 21 15: 17 153: 2

lSk[ IJ 167: lO

tan[ lJ 35: 13 earn [II] 31: 8,10 46: 19 65: 1 67: 6 99: 23 100: 3

113: 20 174: l 191: 18,21

earned 1111 45: 13,14 46~ 21.2233 47: 2 64: 11 83: 17 85: 16 1196 227: 24

earner [I] 162: 25

earuing (21 98: 2133

CaSt[ CJ 3: 12 40: 12 167: 8 167: 17 201: 25 216: 18 eave [IO] 22: 6 32: 16 57: 10 75: 8 93: 17 130: 6

160: 3 170122.23 180: 7 caves pi 31: 19 95: 8

156: 19 157: 2 161: 23 Caving [: J 23: 4 90: 20

106: 9 135: 22 164: 19 181: 4 182: 13 237: 18

,ectured [II 75: 3

.ed (81 38: 5 39: 5.23 40: 4 126: 15.21 212: 18 214: l

,eft 1431 18: 25 22: 9.18 31: 6.7 39: 15 47: 22 55: 7 58: 2,4 63: 22 68: 22 78: 14 79: 13 85: 7 93: 21 94z5.7 100: 23 116: 19,19 127: 21 131: 13 137: 2 14l: lO 145: 23 148: 17 152: 18 154: 1,9.11,12 155: 3 157: 21 163: 15 166: 2,6,9 168: 12 204: 20 213: 2 214: 15 226: 20

Leg[ l] 44: 11

legally [1] 12523

Legislative [I~ J 18: 16 44: 12 47: 17 54: 16 55: 7 58: 15 61: 21 62: 8 197: 20 200: 25 215: l

egitimate [I] 55: 2 engtb [I] 52: 17 ent (11 185: 4 ess [4J 19: 19 37: 9,10

1022 etpl] 7: 21 14: 12 48: 23 49zl8.19 50: 9.19 51: 2.12 56: 23 58: 23 59: 15 63: 4 64: 9 67: 23 71: 4.20 75: 24 7914 81: 18 83: 9.23 95: l

100: 17 108: 16 1 IO: 4 114: 13 123: 16 126: 7 136~ 6 140: 18 147: 15 148: 23 149~ 8 152: 18 154: lO 158: ll 162: 22 163: 25 169~ 21 172: 20 195: 14 204: 10,18 206: 21 207: 19 210: 13 2149 218: 15 230~ 15.23 let’s [ml 47: 10 61: 4 65: 2.

66: J3 75: 14 So: 14 81: 11 81: 2122 85: 4 92: 12 98: 3 105: 824 106: ll 108: 12 117: 15 138: lO 152: 14 163: 7 164: 15.21 173: lO 17523 J77: 17 183: 5 186: 4 189: lO 192: 6 203: 5 206: 3 211: s 214: 9 219: 22 220: 1 222: 25 223: 21 224~ 2 227: 19 233: 7 zttcrp~ J 26: 15.16 67122 689.17.20 69: 5 74~ 23 87: 7 88: 17 107: 5 148: 21 184s 18S: lO 198: 12 200~ 2s 219~ 8 Htcfs 1141 26: 8,11,21,24 27~ 2 54X. 25 121~ 53 123Q3 171: 12 219: 18 232: 1 233: 7 Etting [I] 133: 13

eve1 p] 1472233 sverage[ q 180~ 4 181: 12 222: 24

z% EJ JK73z : *

34: 10 8& l &: J6’118: i 118: lS 141z2,4.8$ 160: 7 163~ 2 167: 24 177315.18 178: 13.20 230: 22 ie ~12) 5: 2025 6: 1,7 60~ 8 167: 5 222: 21 US: 5 233: 1 233: 10.15 234: 3

,ieberman [q 65: 1 85A 86: 13 90: 23 91: 23 92: 2

iedrll 60:~~

ies 13~ 221: 14 222: 5,7

ifem 7: 14 101: 24

ightpj 8923 120: 17 235: 15

ightsrq 44125 ike pq 3: 18 4: 5 5: 9 6: 9 7: 1.20 17~ 23 20: 15 23: 1,8 27~ 4 34~ 6 37~ 79 47~ 24 53: 12 54: ll 61: 18 63: 21 65: 10 68~ 23 69: 18 75: 1 82325 83~ 4 84: 10 86: 19 89: 3 91: 11 97: 1733

101: 17 104: ll 1052 108: 5 117: 4 118: 14.20 120: 3 121: 2 127: 19 130: 11.12 132: 19 136: 18 143~ 20 156~ 22 158: 19 159- Z 163: 3 168~ 23 170: 11.12,19 17424 175: 13 176: 15,23 177: 5 181: 8 182: 15 188: 12 192: 143032 193: 12.15 195: ll 196: 19 197: 16 207: lO 211: 6 223: 17 227: 4.6 232: 16 233: 1; 2 236: 21

ikedw 115:~~ J98: 2

Jnda [WI 32: 6.21 33: 5 41: 1.14 42~ 25 5920 60: 2! 61: 4,7.10,12 70: 11.16,18 7OXl71: 4,22 739,15,20 74: lS 76: 13 77: 14,18,25 78: 7 79: 12,12,17 80~ 1.5 813.24 82% 13,15,15

Thur

83: 10,11,14,15.18 92: 21 102: 7,14 104: 2 124: 24 126: 24 127: 4,7.16.22 134: 11,18 136: 3,15 137: t 138: 4 152: 3 15320.24 164: 6.15 173: 22 175: 4 180.1 4 8 11.19.21 181: 2 . 1 . . 181: 22 182: 14 186: 6.10 186: 13 187: 5 211: 3.8 212: 6,6 213: 8,21 214: 1.6 217A7.1931~ 3 218: 2 218: 5 21923 221: 10,18 222: 12,23 224: 2035 22P7.11.13.18 226: 5.19 226& I ti835

Ada’s [I] 2ll: lO %dsey [so] 71: 10,12 7lA4.14 77: 12.22.2315

79~ 12 80: 2 8lti333 82: 8 82: 10,12.17 83: 11.2132 227: 7 ine [41 4: 13 9832 45: 5 ines [so 155: 2.6.16

161~ 20 180~ 10

ipstickn 429.13 89: 14 89~ 17.2325 225: 10

list~ zq 25~ 2 81: 12 104~ 11 116: 17,17 121: 6 123s 1239 132~ 10 136: 12 151: 5,25 152: 1 168~ 23 lWCZ. 12 172320.22 173: 3 173: 5 174: 9 183: 8 231: 16 234: 6

tisted[ q 27: 19 29~ 15 60~ 16 205: 5

listen [I] 233: 11

tistened~ l 136: 9 139~ 4 tistcns (1) 41: 10 literal [I] 234: 1 litemdy (~ 1 176: 4,6 little [M] 7: 6 239.12 25: l

302 35: 15 3721 3910 39~ 11 45: 12 47: 10 48: 5 51: 8 5423 60: 24 62~ 21 639 70: s 77: 8 78: 19 81: 5 81: 14.15 83: 9 88: 5 94: 7 lOS9 109~ 6.7 110~ 14 114: lS 1152 12225 133: lO 138~ 20 139~ 24 15& 15.1930 154: 19 155: 12 159: 7$, 17 165: 12 166: 6,7 167~ 17l: l 172~ 5 180: 18 181: 3 183: Jl, l2,13J4 184~ 14 184: 19 187~ 11 191: 6 195: 8 196~ 18 197: 1,10 212: 8,11

ivid( q 111: 18

obbyrq lo: 15 130~ 12 130~ 13 200~ 6

ocations [I] 36: 9 .ogid yz] 162: 8 204: 14 .ong m 8: 18 57: lO 63: 6

6421 68: 9 71: 1 922 98s 1039 114~ 6 126: lO lM: l3 lsOz7~ J53: 17 155: 3 198: 17 20312,3 2072 208QO. 21

knowing - mainly day, August 6,1998

208: 23 213: 13 221: 11 2305 longstanding ~11 174: 2 look Jzz] 24: ll 41: 6.12

82: 9 88: 12 1OO: l 105: 2 107: 23 117: 4 120: 2 148: 8 151: 4 164: lO 168: 4 191: 25 194: 13.14 199: 22 205: 21 231: 12 232: 16.17

looked [r] 63: 19 82: 9 93: 12,12 165: 22 221: 13

baking [lo] 35~ 20 36: 4 36: 7 8625 140~ 22 151: 2 177: 6 200: 17 201: 21 236: lS looks f2J 117: 4 192: 14 Los (11 105: 23 lose [2] 6825 69: 2 loss [I] 126: 19 \ostp] 569 122: 23

lot p21 1023 17: 132 18: 9 23% 32% 35: 1147z24 53115.58: 17 68~ 23 81: 19 F& 6,15 88% 104: 4,24 109: 19- 120: 10,11 125: l 15l: lO 156QO 159: l 165: 4,6 16919 1805.5 197Q2 198: 6 226: 6

ioudm 56~ 15 141:~

loudly [I] 23: 1 love p] 12OA9.25 168: 7 low (~ 1 347322.23

lOwcr[ 4] 39: 13.15 125. 126: l

lowed [2] 125: 17,22

loyalty [I] 84: 15

lunch~ l 101: 4 1179,13 117: 16

luncbcon[ lJ 117E22

lunchtime [I] 1192

lying (11 187: 14 225E5 -IN- lllach&[ l] 23: 4

mad111 365

Madamtq U: J 118: 9 199~ 6 230~ 17

Dadef4q 99 1721 35: 14 35: 15 45: 4 4910 sOz2 51~ 24 57: 6 59~ 116724 68- 24 83~ 24 W24 86: 3 87: 7 929 lOOAL 103: 13.14 113: 18 lJ4: 8 128: 13,17 13El5 137~ 3 14lLs. 7 147: lO 16421 165: l 1759.19 ITI: 18O: ll 196Q2 198~ 11 203~ 23 2Jlz2, ll 212: lO 213: 11,12 22520 22& Z

Madison (11 2125

Madrid pl 7kllTI: 3 ME;:,, /

Index Page 16 Diversified Reporting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1039

InRc: Grandhy Proceedings

major[ q 14525 make [UJ 17: 323 36: 7

392 56122 58: 1331 59: 11 59~ 13 6023 74~ 728 8025 9022 9420 101s

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rETltioned [Sl] ll: l7 Ml4 38: 3 43: 3 45: 8 46: 18 47: 11 52: 3 61: lO 66: 18 76: 13 77~ 21 83: 5 86: 17 87: 6 89: 16 9o: lO 92: 6 106: 4.8 122: 9 125: 1( 126~ 4 132: 16 134: 17’ 14223 149: s 151: 12 1525 153: 6 US: 25 165: ll 16822.24 169: ll 170: 16 178: 16 191: 9 193s 195: lO 197: lS 19921 2022 210: 12 213: ll 215: 6 219~ 4 222: 4 229~ 15 233: 19 23X2

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major - h4m- MIMI

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nillion [2] 125: 19.19

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ninutes 1211 129 45~ 22 642 80:] 3,14.15 9025 114: 7 lSOz9 151: 19 162: 14.] 6 198~ 19 199: 1.2 20024 207: 3 220~ 6 23O: l 230: 12 240: 20

nired p] 1~ 3~ 5

nisleading (31 20425 205: 3 232: 12

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Diversified Rooting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 17

1040

In Rc: Grand Jury Proceedings Multi- Page”

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Diversified Rmorting Services. IDC. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 18

In Re: Grand Jury Procctdings

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Diversified Rmorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 19

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

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!pickp] 87: 10,18 J49: 3 J56: l 163: 9 J96: 25 199: 18

~picked ,4] 44: 932 2J62C 216: 25

pictum[ 6] 30: 20 157: 15 157: 16 198: JO 224: 2J 239: 14

~iCtUXCs p] 139: 22 240::

kces [II 223: s tillow [1] 53: 4 tin, aq 3J: 18 132: 7,11

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tins [I] 13221

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being p] 43: s 201: 4 203: 16 th [I] 53: 24 thIDCd [4] 54: J, 4 58: 25 109113

~larllling [4] 121: 5 139116 J53: 5 213: 7

tlanS [l] 1324

wo[ l] 5z2 blaytd [I] 150:~ t& Se [q 57: 20 80: 15

133: 17 158: 7 171: 5

,lug [1] 70: 9

K% kZt, lJ 220: 8

‘odesta, s] J JO: lS. J7.19 1 JO: 23 215: 17

totm ,lJ 54: 25

Wint[* r] 8~ 4 Jo: 7 J4: 13 15: 1.3 23: 8 39: lO 40: 20 4CJzZj. 25 45: 21 46~ 7 68: 12 7J: 20 732.3.23 76: 12 82: 13.14 86: J0 87: J9 93: 4 94: J 95: 1333 96221 98: J9 JO4: 10.15 119318.2223 J J9: 24 J23: 20 124: 1621 125: 16 127: J0 128: 23 J30: 15 J31: 5 J33: 3 134: 9 J35: 12 J36: 13 J42: 25 J45A7.25 J48: 8 J52: 14 165: 16 1672.3 182: 3 186~ 5 188: 7 J92: ll 197: 13 207: 19 21 J: J6,18 219~ 7 225~ 7 226: 14 tointing [I] 39: J2

Boints [ii] 2: 9 223: 622

224: 15.18 225: 17 226: 5 226: 19 227: 11,14.17

~OlitiCd [r] 71: 5 92: 17 147Q2.23 J48: 9 185: 19

bOlitidly [l] 148: 13 toorly ,4] J 14: 2 206: 16 206: 17 207: 20

torCh[ 2] J91: 4,5

tortion [4] 177: zo 202: 21 204: 6 231: 18

1043

Multi- Pagem

post [l] 7: 8

posed ,2] 85~ 23.23

bosition ,141 8: 23,23 39: 3 50: 10.12 5823 65: J9 67: 5,8 85iO 104: 6 17J: J4 J93: JO 21022 poSitiVC p] 32: J3 40: 25

possession [I] 159: 15

possibility ,4] 92: 18 123: 14 J33: 7 202: ll

possible [lo] 32: 12 46: 6 49: 24 57: 16 78~ 21 JO3: 18 133: 20 J34: 15 J95: 9 204: 3

possibly [q 92~ 20 98~ 7 J20: 19 124~ 21 177: l J J93: 7 20024 240~ 19

post [I] J83: 20 pOtentid [I] 1 J9: 12 POWs [3] 44: 16.19,25

powerflll[ l] 18J: 6

PR, 21 212: 79 pm- established [II

232~ 7

pxcamnged ,I] 158: 3

@i- t [I] J 64: 9

pnpart~] JO4: 13 J65: 3 186~ 14

prepared (2) 80~ 8 204: 4 pICpahIg (21 8~ 15 27: 16

artSence, 4] J: 18 20~ 2.3 240: 23

Drtsmt ,211 30: 15 34: 2 80: 20 108: J83034 1 J6: 7 116: 1323 J 18: 12 J48: 25 J49: 3.9 150: 3, JO 162: 20 199~ 9 202: 14 20423 224: 9 230: 19

xesented ,I] 29: J 2 WcSentS ,q 109zJ8.20

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J 15330 J 16: 2 1 J8: 19 proceeded 111 62: 18

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producing [II 141: 4

proffer, 121 2: s 13925

140~ 18 J77: 6 179zJ. 12.13 J79: 13 231: 3.5 233224

prognWs [I] 130~ 18 J J9: 16.1935 J20: 2.6,10

120115 J21: 16,24 J22: Jl J25: 8 127: 1.13.17 132: 12 133: 13.15. J8.1931 134: 3 I% 13 135: 2324 138~ 25

J40: 14 1439 J44: S. S. l J J45: 13 J46: 6 J483,45 148: 15.24 14938.22.23 15034.8 151: 16 153: 4.12 153: 19 154~ 20 155: 1.7

159: 8, Jl 161: 3 163: lO

166~ 13.16 16719 J72: 7.20

J73: UZi 174: 22 175: lS

17618 J77: 17.19.25 178~ 14 181: 12.13 J82: 25 l&: 17 l& k14 187: 15,16

188~ 2 189: 12,15 J9O: i 19J: 1.8.12.18 J94: 1823

195: 1; 14~ J96: 10,1i. 17 1979 198~ 18 200: 24 204: lUO 205: 5 211: 23

2142J- 215: 6 216: 19 218: 3. X11.19 222: 2J

Z27: JO 229: 7.9 231: 20 232~ 1424.24 233: 4,7,1 J 233: 18 234: 5 235: 2023 236: 3 237: 10.22 238: 12 239: 221.22 24OA. 6.12

?ICSidCIIt’S ,111 32: 7 4821 77: JO JbJ: iO 104: 8 IX17 139: 5.19 147~ 25 194: 17 23l: ij

residential ,4] 47: 10 48~ 1 66~ 21 85: J9

MCSidCIItS 12) 24322 J89: 17

HcSS p] J38: 2 J69: JS JfJ: J8

mtty[ r] 2222 28: J8 SWJ 91: 6 JJ2: 24 J28: 24 196~ 4 234: J

IICVCDt ,I] 124: 17 ~ICViOllS [4J 77: 6 11525

179~ 7 18432 mv’iouSly ,4] 27: 5

108: J7 1 J& 4 178125

minted PJ J75: 14 224: s nintcr,~] 224: s

nior[ 4] J9: 7 96: J2 J58: 17 213: 3

nison [l] 5: 21

WiVatC, 2] 129~ 15 166: 23

mobably ,211 21: 24 2k13.24 48: 13 49: 13 5J: J9 82: 6 87: 14 110~ 19

I prO333. k [4] 63B 180: 1 J

182: 7 213: 12 promiscd,~] 68: JO prOmpt [I] 167- z ‘p- b] Jut:) 7

pr’q&~ J 82: 6 PrOperly [I] 49~ 1

proposition [II m2: 4

prosecuted, 11 6~ 3

prospects ,2] 105: l JO7: 23 fJrotcctiOll ,lJ J93: 17

proud [z] 45: 6 78: l

provide[ 5] 7: J7 27: J8 29: l 22& J 1.13 provided [I] 22~ 14

providcs[ l] 4: l psychic ,z] 213Z2.23

public 11, JSOD

publicly [I] 125~ 4

pulledJlJ J27: 13

punishable [II 5~~ 1 purchased, z, 108: 17

109: 18

pqost,,] 55118.19 55: 19.23 68: 17,2J 119~ 5 136: s

puqo& dly ,I] 193: 24

p6Gc41 J= J 13:) PIking [r] 76~ 22

push, 11 18: lO

put ,331 55: J 56~ 1 J 61~ 4 -6J: 7 66: 995: JO. J1 JJ3: ll

1 ;; f; 511; J;: 5J;;;;; 5 J59i18 J6: 1: 7: 1217 172: 6 174: 16 186~ 8 19OU 196: lO J98: 7.7 215~ 3 222: 19

Diversified Rmortin~ Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 21

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings .

Wting[ s1 151: 2 158: 24 162: 8 198: 16 240: 7

p~;~ W&$ lf22; 10

5; 12: 1824 6: 5;, i4: liEJ

6: 23 7: 1,7 8: 7,10,17,22 8~ 25 92.6.11.18.25 10~ 4 10: 8.17.2032 11: 8.13.15 1 l: J7.20.23 12: 2.5.12.14 12: 17 139.14.19.24 14: 2 14: 5.7 15: 1.4.8,13.16.22 15: 24 16~ 9.12.15.18.21 17: 1.9.12,16.23 18A. 4.7 18: 11.24 19: 2.49.13.16 19: 22.25 20: 3.5.8.12.15 20: 19,22 21: 1.4.7.10.16 21A8.2135 22~ 2.69.12 22: 14.17.20 23: 3.6.10,12 23: 17.25 24: 3, S, 7.11.14 24: 16,19,21,25 25~ 5.7.14 25: 17,20,22,25 26~ 2.5.8 26: 11.173034 27: l. lO 27: 13.15,18,21 28: 3.6,15 28: 17,21 29: 1,4,6.8.15.19 2922 30: 1.4.7.1034 31: 5 31: 7.10.13,16.23 32: 1,4,6 32: 10.13,153033 33: 1.4 33: 8.11.16 34: 10.13.19 34: 22 35: 4,7.10.163024 36: 9.14.17.20 37: 3,6,9,12 37: 1730.23 38: 1,3.8.12 39: 3.12.16,193225 40: 3 40: 8,11,19Z 41: 1923 42: 4,8.11,18,22,24 43~ 3.8 43: 11.13.16,19,24 44: 2,5 44: 11.1831 45: 3.8.12.18 46: 4.9.15.18 47: 5.10.16 48: 1.5.18 49: 6,10.18.21 50: 4.9,12.16.1931.24 51: 2.12.15.17.20.24 52: 3 52: 7,11.16.19 53: 8.12.16 54: 4.8.14.18.2133 55: 2.5 55: 9.14.18.22.25 56: 5.12 56: 18.23 57: 1.5.12.17.20 57~ 22.24 58: 39.12.2135 59: 4,14,18.24 60: 1,4,7.13 60: 16,19$ 4 61: 4,7.10,15 61: 18,24 62: 2,4,6,12.14 62: 17,25 6312.4.69.2234 64: 25,10,13,15,17.1931 64: 23 65: 7.11,17,19,23 66: 25,8,11.13,1725 67: 13.15.18,23 68: 2,17 69: 5,8,10,12,16.18,22 70: 1,4.8 71: 2.7,16.18 72~ 2 72: 4, X. 23 73: 1.16 74: 6,9 74: 13.15.19.22 75: 7,10 75: 12,14.18 76: 3.6 78: 6,9 78: 11,14.1733 79: 5,11 79: 183234 81: 21 82: 4.9 82: 18,2025 83: 3933 84: 17,21,24 85: 9,11.14 85: 18 86~ 2.17 87: 6.20 88: 10.1531 89: 1.8.11.14 89: 16 90: 3, S9 91: 7.11.17 92: 1.6,12,14.25 93: 4,7,18 93: 2034 94: 1,4.1630,25 95: 5,8,10.13.15,19.22.25 96: 5,8,10.13.16.19,24 97: 2.4.8.11,13.17.19,23

98: 3,16,19,2S 99: 8,10.13 9921 100: 6,14.1731 101: 1.6.12.14.16 102: 1.6 10212033 103: 3.% 79.11 103: 14.16.19,24 104: 8.10 l04: 15,~ 8,21,24 lOS: 4.8 105: 15,1734 106/ 6,11 106A434 107.3811.13 10724 108: 4,7.10,1214 108: 16,2033 109: 3.1034 110: 1.7,10 1 I1: 5.13.15 111: 17.23 112~ 9. J5.1720 J 12: 22 113: 1.4.6.8.13.17 114: 6.8.11.13.1630 1 IS: 3 115: 5.7.10.14.16.1932 116~. 69.11.16.19 118: 18 118: 23 119: 13.59.11.14 119: 18.21 120: 18 121: 3.9 121: 11.13.18.23 1223.8 122: 16.18 123: 4.8,11 124: 1,5,7,1331 125: 1,14 1253 126z2.8,10.20,23 126- B 127z2,4,6.19.21 127324 12& 1,3,7,9.19,25 129: 2,4,6,11,1631 13O: l 130: 8,11.13.15.1& 25 131: 7,11,16~ 4 132: 2.4.8 132: 14303S 1339.12.16 13312034 134: 59.25 135: 5.8,10.13.18.21 136: l 136: 3.5.7.17.22 1372.7 137: 16 138: 10.14.16 139~ 1.1333 14Ck3.6.9.14 141: 12.1531 142: 3.11.17 142: 2134 143: 6,& 24 144: 5,7,1O, J4,1935 145: 6 145: 9,12,17.19,24 146: 4 146: 7.11.14 147: 3.10.13 147: 18 148: 2.6.10.1733 149: 2.5.15.17,19.21 lSO: 7 J50: 10.16 15J: l2. J6.22 152: 10.1330.23 153~ 4.8 153A1.15 154: 1.4.6.12 154: 15,17.24 155: 3.6.11 155: 17.19.22 156: 3.6.8 156: 12.22 157: 1.8.11.18 157~ 23.25 158z2.6.9.11 158: 14.16.19,23 159: 2.10 J59A8.22.24 160: 7.17.23 160: 25 161: 7.10,24 162: 2 163: 2,7,13,1731,2S 164: 3 164: 5.1531 165: 11,14 I66: 11.16 167: 12.21.24 168~ 18.22 169: 1.11,18,21 170: 1$, 6,9.14.16 171~ 22 172: 19,24 173: 163032 173zzs 174: 49024 175: 3 175: 14,17,19.22.25 176: 2 176: 8,12.16.23 177: 5.8 17731533 178: 25.9.13 178: 24 179: 5.10.13.16.21 179: 23 180: 7.13 182: 19 182: 22 183: 5,9,12.15.17 183: 19,22,25 184: 2.6,8 184: 10,12,14,1724 185: 3 185: 6,8.13.17,24 186: 4 186: 19,21,24 187: 18.23 188: 14,19,22,25 189: 2.4 189: 10,12,16,19.21.23.25 190: 4,9.12,1s. 203325 191: 3,7.11.15.18.21.25 192: 2,49 193: 4.19 194: 2 194: 4,7.10.1433 195: 5

1044

Multi- Pagem

195: 10.16.2135 196: 35 1 188: 4 196: 8.11.15 197: 3.5.8.25

217: 2.8.11.13.16.18.21 198: 17 199: 17,2134

218: 2,7.10.18,21 219~ 7 200: 2,5,7,12.15.20 2Ol: l

201: 9,11.14,16,19,21 202: 9,12173034 2032 203: 59.16,18,21 204: J

219: 11.13.16,22 22k1.5 204: 10.14.18 205: 1.6,9

205: 12.15,17,19~ 4 206: 1$. 12.15.17 207: 2.4 207: 6.10.16.18.21.25 208: 2.7.11.14.17.20.25 209: 5.8.12,15.17.19.22.24 210: 1.3.55.79,12,16,1931 210: 24 211: 2.6 212: 23,2S 214: 9.13.15.24 2lS: lJ. 14 215: 19 216: 69.13.15

quote- unquote [l]

171: 13

I -R-

RPJ 3: l 118: l radio [4] 30: 18.19 107: 18

107: 19 Rahm[ l] 46: 6 Raines( 5] 59: 21 lS9: 3

raining [I) 229: 19

rambling [l J mnb ;J

130: 22 ranpJ 63: 23 110: s

124: 15.17 ramI 96: 14 121: 20

ranged[ ll 52~ 13 22f). lJ, 14+, 835 221.37 rdp] 127: lO 166: 4 186: 7 221: 10.16 222z4.7.2S r8tc[ IJ 117: l p3: 3.5.13,1S. l9.21 2242 81s 15824 224: 5,7,9,11.13.17,23 w[ q 170~ 24 18223 215~ 20 US: 1730 226: 35.8.10 218: 4

226: 18 227: 7,10.13,16,19 227: 23 228: 1830 229~ 5 =tion- m 38Q1 229: 1330~ 23025 205: ll 231C25,7.12,15,1823 rationalizing [I] 2059 232: S. 10.16,2023 233: 17 =III I: 5 233: 21 234: 16.19 235: 59 wh[ ll 238:~ 6

;;;; ff$; c<; 7f;;; x6 xeact[ ll 1425 237: 19h3’238: 1.4.8. li reactcdm 1203 12~ 1 238: 13; 16 239: 7; 1 i. 14.17 reaction [14 62: 6,9 2392225 240: 5 65: ll 111: 13 128: 20 question [a] 6: 20 20~ 15 40: 10 49: 18 SO: 3 S1: 2 ;;;;$$ 6$ 172Z! 53: 17 56A3.24 70~ 14 83: 9 rCad[ w] 1221 13: 17 83: 23 85: 18.22.23 89: 14 20~ 10 116: 13 125: 17 9Oz9 9925 105: 12 108: 17 136~ 14 138~ 1 141: 1.12 112: 9 126: 6 137: 11.12.22 17738 17916 21824 226: s 144: 2.19 148: l 155: 17 232~ 23.23 162: 2 163: 7 166: 21 167: 8 rubg[ r, 141:~ 735

174: 11 205: 3 226: 10.13 169: 21 J71: 3 172: 25 173: 16 176~ 20 181: 16

184: 4 197: 15 204: ll 226: 21 234: 14 240: 5.11

ruds[ lJ 4l: lO Icalm 12820 171s ruliaedpl SOz4 154: 8

186: ll &y [lo11 22124 24~ 9.9

2S: ll 28~ 22 3O: ll 34~ 23

qucstioncd 121 16622 193: 12

~u& kming [2] 8: 3 33: 16 lu& ionS [4q 3: 2034

4: 20 7: 4,8,16,24 832.5 17: 2 19: 17 34: ll 50: 7 SJ: l2 53: 12 59: 14 81: 1 81: lUl 91: 13 949 117~ 3 134: 13.6,20,2335 135~ 2 135: 6.8 145: 3 146: lO 158: ll 159: 25 163: 3,725 178: 21 182: 24 192: 16.19 192: 20 19S: ll 197: 13.14 197: 18 231: 2 2352

pick PJ 42: 15 137: 11 235: 2

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~UOIlUU[ WJ I: 18 34: 4 80~ 20 118: 9 162~ 18 199t6 230: 17 240~ 23 ~OtCp] 142: l 157: 23

putting - reftxring

Thursday, August 6,1998

212: 6.16,17.17 214: 5 226: 16 228: 15 230: 24 234: 7 238~ 21.24

realm [2] 133: 7 202: li

reason 1131 58: 22 59: l 92: 15 lti: i3 146~ 2 148: ll 156: 16 163: 13 169: ll 171~ 25 J79: 17 180: 25 217: 3

1 reasons (21 160: 19 17l: Jl

1 EaSSufance [I] 159: 8

1 rcassurcd[ 3~ 77: 19

1339 166: 7 R& ccc- a [I] 216: 25

1 Ecau [l,]. jz2 19: 19 20: 5 47~ 2 Sk15 79~ 2 90: 5 95: 2 loo: l7 104: 19 131: 14,15 136: 24 140: 20 165: 9 2202 235: 18 237: 16 23925

I rccalled~ q 33: 25 80: 16 118: 4 162: 17 199~ 5 230~ 14

I rccauing[ zJ 79A3

I [tcciycd 1131 123: 16 12tkll 13& 2> 136: 20,21 139~ 18 152~ 25 157~ 13 165: 16 220114.16 tii: 21 22& l

1 tiving [I] 102: 18

1 r# xntly[ c] 1063 111: 6 lU: 7 12Szl7 lS7z8 168.

I reception [l] 13o: ll

I reccptiom [I] 20421

I i- t%+ iVC[ lJ 8o: J

I recess [l] 11722

I rcfmgnh [4] 4: 10 27: ll 237: lO 238: 8

I rccokction [I] 2022 24: 12 141: 13 178: 5 218~ 24

I rcconrmcndationp] 218~ 22 219: 19

I feammcndationsp,

214: 16 219%, 16

I -ded m 106: lO 192s

I -c[ 1J 233: l

1 fecordp~ 1621 230~ 15

1 recor& r[ lJ a: 13

I rccords[ lJ 2289 I fccoUnt p1 213.15

I reentered 111 230~ 16 J rcfcr[ lO] 2s2 1019

2179.13.16.1822 218: 3 218: lbti3: 8

1 refuena( 9J 8025

83124 87: 8 135: 19 177313 1895 211~ 2 21& Z 215: 4 I rtfcrcnccs [4] 214~ 15

214: 20 219~ 17.20 1 refer&[ 31 131: 18

218: 19 223: 6 I rcfcrring~] 7x3 h 39~ 1.7 4Otl4 42~ 14 46: 7

46: 11 48~ 50: 3.6,6 54~ 25 57~ 15 59~ 12 622 65: 13 68~ 24 71: 11,2S 72~ 7 78~ 1.1 83: 19,22 89~ 221 92: 4 93: lO 102s 105: 7 109~ 7.15 112: 4,6 114: 17 115: 9 116: l 12& l 123: 24 130~ 14 13l: lS. l9 133: ll 136~ 25 137: 19’138: 6,21 13823 141: 16 142~ 16 l46: 16 l51: 1.18 J53: 7.23 155: 14 156: 18 15720 159~ 11 161: 1.20 164: 4.8 164~ 18 165: 6.167: 25 169: 15 1702 174: 12 1725 187: lO 188: 15 190: 2 193: l, ll 196: 1422 198: 2.11 200~ 1 204~ 4 207: 13,13 2089 211: 17

Index Page 22

Diversified Re~ ortiw Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings. 131: 21

tflect [I] 23o: lS

tflcctcd 111 224~ 8 tflects [I] 2& l efreshp~ 24: 11 141: 12 218: U efuscm km33 egard (11 lw24 tgularp] 120: 4

ekindled[ l] ml5

elate 121 1059 20625

elated ~51 134~ 2 173: 18 204: 6J2 228~ 18

elating ~41 173~ 23 174: 21.25 177~ 9

elation [II 237: 16

elations m elation& pi 13~ 2

elationship ~01 2: ll 7: 25 10: 1,11,17,18 17~ 3.7 179.13 19- 9 21~ 22 24: 17 25: 8,22 2724 32: 20 33~ 4 33: 9.14 48: 6,7.11.14 49: 2lJ2 50: 1,17,1832 so: 25 51: 5.7.1531 52: l 52: 14.15 53: 13,19 57: 3 59: 15.16.19 60: 2.7.9.17 60~ 20.23 61: 3.8 62: 10 69: l 73: 7 74: 10.17 78: 7 84: 25 87: 12,22 88: 18 89:! 89: 20 90: 12,14 91: 9 98: 3 99: ll looz25 110: 20 124: 11.11,20 127: 17 133: 21 134: 13 146: 5 165: 18 167: 13 172: 9 173: 14 175: 1> 176: 17 177: 16,19,24 178: 14 179: 8 181: lO 193: 22 194: 18 196: 21 202: 22 204: 12 232~ 24 233: 12 234: 17.23

elationships 131 4818.9 60: 14

clay [I] 225: 18

clayed [ZJ 98: 6 1oO: ll deases [I] 171: 18 vzmain [l] 31: 14

emained 111 101: 19 rtmarkr11 132: 15

emarked m 23: 8 56: 10 loo: 22 106.9 116: 25 12O: l 181: 5

cmember[ los] 21: 7 22: 9.17.19 24: 3 28: 2.21 32: l 40: 14 52: 2 54: lO 59: 2.3 63: 2 71: 12.13 75: 12 76: ll 78: 20 79~ 4 82: 23 85~ 25 87: 25 89: 17 89: 22 9123 92: 14 93: 3 93: lO 103: 7 104: l 107: 11 109: 4 11223 119: 23 129: 175353 130: 14 131: 19 136125 137: 19,19 139: 25 140: 9 141: 17 142: 3,13 143: 19.24

149: 19 154: 12 157: 12 158: 18 165: 7 168: 13 17& 1.8 172: 6 178: 4.19 1792.6.17 183: 15 185: 24 186~ 24 188~ 25 1892 19Ozl2 195z21200: 1321 201~ 21 2033.22 u) 4: 4 205s 2o6A2 207z21 2089J2.23 209: 1,7,12 2109.24 212: 17 2133 214: 17 215~ 23 217: 8,12 219t11 w: ll 225: 3 2273 228~ 16 235: 14,16 23724 238~ 1.4

mmmbcrcd[ l] 4092 lEzmnbcring [l] 29z4

enrind 1111 34: 6 59~ 7 68: 14,22 8OZ? 118: 14 16222 199~ 13 206: 7 214~ 21 2192

exuhkd~] 155: 12 2162

tiderp] 123~ 24 23822 239: 4 tiding [I] 59~ 12

emissancc 121 42: 19 42: 19 rendition [I] 28~ 18

qcat[ l] 40: 10 qdy [I] 134: 24 tzport [I] 76: 17 r$ mfrp] 70: 12 73: 6

qucstp] 125: 22 147: l

qucstcd p] 107: 6 147: 4,14

wcinded [II 67:~ 1 sideme pi 43: 11

44: 17 45: 5 ‘csourccs [I] 214: 18 xspect[~ l] 12: 17 16: 21

29: ll 38: l 65: 8 69: 18 105: 4 115: 18 154: 2 186: E 205: l respectfully [I] 8325

zspond [cl 73: 18 8620 99~ 13 140: 2 141: 6 188~ 15

responded [SJ 70: 21 1Ol: l 140~ 4 147: 8 152: li

reqo& di” g 19 68~ 6.7 feqmnsc[ q KM: 8

139~ 16 140: 17 141: 4 229~ 6

responsibility 111

199: ll

responsive [I] 195: 6 rcst[ 1] 65: 24 91: 24

rcstaur8nt [l] 229: 24 rezmoom[ q II: 5 14: 19

14120 221: 14 230: 6

dt [I] 113: 20 dting[ t] 114: 18

resunx[ l] 91: 9 REXJMED~~ J 118~ 7

1045

Multi- Pagem

etak[ l] 6: 6 eta& r [I] 148: 21 etlnn [SJ 1524 71: 15 75: 12 7723 105: ll

ctumcd[ l] 162 etuming [SJ 68: 7 105I21 l& k10 2ll: lO 2132

evd [I] 18l: lO evakdp] 17520 196X! evealing fl] 193: 22

cvicw[ l] 194: ll cv& wcd[ l] 28: 7 Ldonm 2W8.11 21Or7.17.18 214: ll 219~ 8

id[ xl 174: 14 ide pl 2262 22918 2303 igbt pzq 3: 16.19.19.19 3: 21 4: 3,16,16,20 5: 1.4,6 5: 12 65,12,14,19,19,20 7- m 1121 1424 15: 11 199 25: 11.12.13 m17 33- Z 359 36: 16 37: 14 38~ 216 39: 13.14 42: 19 45: s 49~ 18 52~ 24 53: 16 5423 56: 5.18.23 57: 20 5724 59: 18 60~ 4.18 61: 6 61: 15 6324 64: 5 66: 17 71m730 74: 19 75: 7.10 75: 14 78: 9.17 81121 83: 2 83: 14.23 84: 3,6 85: 9 86~ 2 87: 6 89: 1.4.10 90~ 3.83 91: 17 92s 93: 4J2 94: 1 94: 4.8.21 95: 8 %: 830 97: 16 983 99: 9,12 101: 12.13.15.16.16 102: 6 105: 423 106: 18.24 107: 18.18 108: 7.1630 113: 1.4.6.13 114: 20 115: 19 116: ll 117: 7.12 !19: 18 121: 24 122: 1.]. 6

12217 124: 3.5 125: 25 126~ 2.83.1020 127: 2,4 127121 129~ 1 131: 4.11.24 1333. l2.20 135: 18 136: 1 1363 137: 7.10.14 138: 18 139: l 141: 8 142: 5 144: lO 144: 15 149: 17 152: 1323 153: 8 154: 131 157: 25 159Q2.24.25 161: 10 162: 11.14,18 168: ll 169: 18 170: 7 174: 20 1762.19 178: 2.5.22 179: s 180120 183: 5,19 184: 25 18425 185: 3.10 186~ 4 188: 17 191: 21 194: 14 195: 10,25 196: 15 198: 25 199~ 2 200: 15 203: 5,7.19 204: 10.14 205: 6.12.12 206~ 3 209zl9 210~ 5 213: 19 21424 217: 13 218: 18 219: 7,22 220~ 1 221: 73JO 2222 223: 3 22321 2242 229: 5 230~ 13 232: 10, X 233: 20 23m1 ights p] 3: 15 5: 12

isks 11 j 56: 2 bck~ 111 150: 17 de p] 7: 8 14721 cmadic[ q IO: 18 11: 24 26: 18 36: 6 196: 18 198: ll

tomco[ l] 15723 Lou [I] 62: 20 oompq 1: ll 4: 18,19 15: 18 3624 37: 13 86: 5 93: 1931 94: 17.1819 I= 9 129~ 14 183: l 18520 192: 14 20620 U& l6

looscvclt [l] lo99 opep] 9~ 8.22

OUtc[ 4] 55: ll 113: 3 214: 3.4 outcs [l] 57: l olltidy [l] 3: 13

ub[ l] 197: l Imxmp] 1029 111: 19 lllC25 un[ l] lo: 8

unaround 111 88: 9 uming[ 3] 112: l 150: 2 15l: l

USCS[~ J 124~ 2

ush [II 205: 20

-S- ; [, I I: 17 2: lJ 3: 13 118: l 118: 1,13

l& e ~11 212~ 22 ~afcr [I] 47: 21

:aidp121 14~ 21 15: s~ 165 21: 12 3020 31: 2 36: 6 38~ 17.25 39: l 41: 6 43: 21 44: 23.24 45: 1.5 46~ 25 47: l 48: 13 58: 18 61: 12 62: 24 63: 18.20 64: 6 64: 69 66~ 22 6811224 70~ 1.20 71: 9 72: 16 73: 5.6 74~ 23 77: 15.19 78: 4,10 86: 6.7.18 88: 23 89: 8 91: 18,20,22 92: l 97: 13 985’, 11,12,15.17.19 99~ 23 9924 102: 14 103~ 24 IO& 4 11024 111: 1.12 112: lO 114: 24.24 115: 23 115: 24 116: 3.12.14 11924 120: 21.232434 121~ 25 122: 6 123: 1822 124: 13 125: 19 126~ 4 130: tl 131: 17 132: 17 133: 18,25 134: 4 135: 24 135: 25 136: 20 138: 12 139: 3.4.7~>, 10 141: 13 141: 17,18,20 1422 143: l 143: 2,20,20.24,25 ]46: 7 146: 8,21 147: 6,13 148: 24 152: 3,6,8,14.172.0 154: 21 154Q5 155: 1.6 159~ 20 160~ 7 163: 15 165: 8.12 166Z2 168~ 15 170~ 1 1712 172: 14,14,21.22 176: 13 177: l 179: 5.16.24

180~ 5.18.19 182: 7 1829 188: 5.10 190: 17.21

192: 21 193: 6.9.14.25 194: 8 195: 18 196: l 197: 19.23 198: 2.8.13.14 205: 2 208: 1521 212: 19 213: 5,23 214: 19 215: 7 218: 24 2 1924 220: 2022 222: 10.12 22579.11 .

226: 15.23,25 227~ 5.8 228: 3,15 229~ 8 232: 8.11 233: 4.7.11.17.18,25 234: 4 234: 5 236: 8 :ame[ lr] 12: 3 13: 22 70: 23 85: 3 96: 17 122122

129: 14 155: 15 166: 8 167: 12 168: 1.8 220: 18 22l: u) 238: 12 239: 2

hlta[ l] Mm5

lat m 68: 8 75: 3.3 76: 10 79: 7 145t22 191: 4

reisfy[ 4] 141: 7.19 192: 13 231z21

iaturday m 107~ 7.20 107: 24.25 108~ 3 190: 12 198: 4

:avet2] 22: 12 17525

iaving cl] 174: 15

lavvy [I] 212~ 6

law [q lo: 6 26: 14 28: 25 40~ 22 45: 13.16 50: 4 55: lt 66: 3 91: 5 972.4 101: 8,14 110: 13.14 1202 153z22 159~ 6 167: 6 183: 1510 185: 4,7,11,13,15,18J125 187: 14 204: 19 205: 4 232: 6 238: 6

kayrllq 3: 18 5: 9.19 8: 10 II: 13 16~ 23 17: 5 19~ 4 22~ 21 26: 17 27: 1 28: 17 33: 12 35: 7 36~ 11.14 40: 5 4 19 43: 8.8.20 44~ 5 48: l 49~ 8.13 51: 24 53: 8 54: 4,8 55: 6.12 57: 14 71: 19 73: lt 74: 24 81: 16 8225 83: ll tk6.17 88: 10.16 93: 18 97: 11 105: 6 106: 2.6.6 111123 112122 114: 21 116z2.4.6>. 11.16 Ilk9 119: ll 120: 16 lUS. 22 124: l I2523 126: 13 132~ 23 134Z! 13923 142: 15 143: 16 145: 6 153: 18 154~ 24 ]58: 16 159~ 18 160: 12 169~ 7 170~ 9 172: 15.16 173: lO 176z9,12,23 180: 23 190: 9 190: 15 193: 4.13.19.21.24 195: 16 196: 4 197: 19 199: l 202: 24 204: 15 205~ 2 208: 11 ,I435 209: 5 214: U 215: 4 217~ 8 220: 19 23021 231: 24 233: 8,12,18 2342,19,20 236: 11,15 239: l aying pq 38: 14 54: ll

54: 12,13 612 72~ 15 76: 2: 81: 17 83: 7 9624 127: 16 129~ 24 133: ll 134: 18.21 1392 142: l ]43: 25

Index Page 23 Divnsified Rmorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1046

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings 148~ 2 J66: 8 176: 25 188: 9 237: 13 19521 2OOz9 202: 2 I S& man 209: 25 [ZJ 214: 22 216: 23 225: 2.4.13 ~JJ: J 225: 14 226: lO 234: ll

ays[ lfl 4: 13 44: 16 122: 8 Seidman’s[ l] 2JO: J J 155: 8 177: 11.18 186: 13 ,& frl, 68: 2J

203: 18 204: ll 219: l self- evident [2] 127: 2 223Q2.23.24 23 J :23 204: 15

238~ 6 sdl[ l] 164: 12 mdaj PJ 235: 17 239: 7 semen [6] 32: 7 38: 4 39: 5 ca& p] 131: 20 145: l 39: 23 40: 12 41: 1

send [B] 104: lo 121: 5.9 cratchp] 201: 16 crcamcdp] 132: J J crew[ l] 19325 CIWCd[ IJ 193: 18

cribblcd [IJ 68: 9 cdpture [I] 150~ 15 ear&[ 41 115: 14,16 121: 8 187~ 20 ecludcd [1] 34: 25 352 econd [a] J3: 19 20: 24 39~ 16 75: 5 126: J J J27: 8 202: 6 223: 23 ;XXXCt[ 4J 53: J4 59: lS 84: 25 9J: lS wxxetaq [3J 106: 22

J 19~ 4 J86: 23 mxre[ tJ JO4: 6 J93: lO ~[ ti] Jo: 9 J8: 19 30: 20 36~ 7 39: 22 4J: 7 46: J0 50: 10,12 55: 13.15.1630 55: 21,23 57z9.9 58: 5.22 62: 10.24 64: 4.5.6.9 65: 13 65: 25 66: 2 75: 22 76: 3 cary [I] 128: 21

78: 4 83~ 7 85~ 4 87: 3 88: 21 89: 19 90: 17 9J: 14 94: 13 ckdule [I] 48: 2 J

97: 5.8 JOl: J2 107: 21 108: lO lJO: 6,25 11J: J kott [I] 64: 24 67: 7.8

112: 4 120: 7 123: 23 J26: 4 13225 J33: 18 134: 17 138zJ9.19.23 140: 20 68: 5 98: 6.20 1OO: l J J JO: 4

149~ 6.10 152: 14 153: 19 J59: 5 171: 16 172: 7.21 J75: 7.12,12 177: 8 178: 2 18325 J& 1: 6 J85: 6,17 198: 21 U& 6.21,22 22522 231: 24 234: 12,13 236: 16 240: 2

;ttingp] 198: lO 238: J 239: 14 ;cem[ z] 80: J J29: 18 iccmcd [lo] 45: 6 54: 2

62: 22 76: J9 82: 7 132: lO 148: 7 162: 8 J96: 20 202: ll ecms[ 4) 20: 15 94: 13 1272 J67: 25 cen[ lq 27: 13 28: J3 3O: ll 35: 17 46: 6 Sl: J8 83: 15 90- 20 112: s 123~ 2 1239 182: 25 183: 4,6.11 J96: 13 198: 5 235: 15

sense [s] 60: 23 66: 25 77: 8 J J 131 232: 12

sent [l;] S6: 6 59: l J 74: 2: 87: 7 88: 17 96: 7 102: 24 KC’: 4 174: 21 187~ 22 1982.1 J 229: l J scntena p] 201~ 24

231 Q3 232: 3 sentimentd [t] 156: 18

156: 23 157: 3 160~ 21 161: 5.16 162: 4.5 separate [I] 5O: J9 separately [l] 29: 19 &ptemkr[ lJ J: J9

sequence [2J 76: 12 94: 21 serious [I] 728 seriously [i] J73: 13 servc[; J 8: 18 84: 13.14 served [4] 128: 7.19 J29:(

J29: lO serverp] 174: 18 serviap~ 9J: JS 228: 7, E session [2] 13: l 233: 25 sessions [IJ J60: 8 set[ lo] 18: 12.13.15 19~ 5

148: 3.21 214: 20 219: 7 66: 8 129: 13 J37: 5 168: 3 228: 3

209zJO. 19 setting [I] 66: 4 scnding[ 3]

stttle[ zJ 124: 25 J25: 7 setbment[ 1] J25: 15

49: 15 68: J7 settling [I] 124: 22 b [IV 4: 2S 6: 17

228: J3 scmor[ l] i69: 16 10: JS 11~ 2 17: s 56: J0 74: 16 97: 17 JO7: 14 121: 14 124: 9.10 155: 5 20722.23 235: 23 236: 14

sexp;] 2: lO J2: 15.18.19 16: 12,15 19: 20.22 20: 1.8 20: 17,20 24: 1.8 31: 23 38: 10,24 39: 20 43~ 5 134:. 139: 7,8,9.11 J42: 21.24 143: 4.15 J44: 22.24 J78: J 188~ 11.12 sexier[ l] 17J: J8 scxud [42] lk2.18 J2: 2!

13: 5,16,20 J4: 2 16: 23 182 19~ 11.14 20: 10,13 21: 1,11 24: J7 25: 14 29~ 1:

Multi- Pagem

3223 33: 8 34: 15,15 35: 4 36: JO 42: 5 50: 24 5 J :20 5125 52: 5.8 56: J5 63: lO 70123 87: 2J 90: 12.14 95: 2 133: 20 J77: 19 202: 2J 204: 7.12 EXlLdly [2] 7O: J8 72: J4 EXy[ 2] 17J: J732 tdce[ lJ 922 hakingp] 9: 8 btpt[ lJ J66: 18 hared [I] 77: J4 bepm] lo: 13 16: s 19~ 2 31: 7.7.8.13 41: 5.15.15 47: J 24 4924 50: 4,4 58: 9 5911 65: 2,4 67: 9, JO 69: 14 7& 12,20/ 0213171: 99 71: 13.13.14 72: 18,18,19 73: 10,1234 75: 1921,25 7525 76: 2J 77: 6 78: 1,1$ 78~ 4 80~ 1 82~ 83: 3.19 923 101: 3,4 JO2: 14 1043 107: 15,17.19,20,21,24 108: 4 110~ 3.12 1119.3.7 1121 113: ll 122~ 13.23 125: 6,12,17,1& 21,22,24 127383 137~ 3.17.18 J41: 3 141z3. S. S. 6 149~ 6.12 154924.25 155: 6.25 J56: 6 158: 12.3 4 5 9 14 . . . . J58: 16,16 159: 18.2020 163: 21 J64: lO. J 1.12 165: 1,2.17,17.222334 J66: 3.4,7 173: 22 175: 4.6 175: 7 J77: 16.38 180: 1.22 181~ 2, S, 7.7.7 J82: 1.1,1.3 182: 7 186: 7 J87: 9.11.14 J90: 2J 191: 4 J95: 19 196zlO 211: 20 212: 1,1.3 2J2: 4.6, J1,13.14,15.17.17 212: 18,1921 213: 1,1,5,5 2J3: J J, J2.13,19,24 214: 2 214: 17 215: J5 216: 3.3,19 216: 23 2J7: J 120 219~ 4 221: J2.13.19242525 2229.24 225: 5.7,9.1322 22522 226: 89.10.10,12 226: 12.15.22.23242525 227: 13,2,21 228rJO. 15 228~ 15.18 229: 8,8.14.15 22925 230~ 2 231: 19,20 23 J: 24,25 235: 6

;k’d[ q 7523 156: l 15921 228: 17

rk’spj lJl: JO 175: s J& V: 13 213: 2021 2J4: 3 225: 4 ;k& S[ lJ 29: J hocked[ 3] 123: J3 188: 228: 2J hoes [I] 2J2: 5

book[ q 9: 23 hopping 121 J J 6: 14 212: 4 hart (31 10224 J 16: 21 158: 19 bolt- term [I] 7: 5 hartnp] 35: 15 16522

Thm

ihortly 1s~ 46: 23 130: 20 13023 J%: 6 208: 17 ihould WJ J7: J9 46120

5 1: 10 52124 56: 2 65: 7.9 71: 6 72: 6 83: 22 84: 10 8725 WI: 1 1 120: 13,16 123: 15.18 125: 4.8 J46: 2 J48: 16 J52: 15,15 J53: 18 153: 19 162: 11.12 J64: 7 16823 J88: 3 208~ 4 212: 6 214~ 2 22325 231: 23

rhouhb’t p] 56~ 10 7425 90: 12 1209 168: 16 J71: 16 1989.13 rhowp3] 415 25: l 27: 4

4224.25 45: s 80~ 18 112: 10 12S: 5 132~ 2 140~ 18 22Oc20 236: 21 bowed [IO] 69: 16

13214 13922 14o: J 1413 145: 6,9 J7S: lS 2Ol: l r#): lS Kbowing( l] 221: l Ep] 70: 14 189: 5

sidcf41 147~ 148: l 22lz2021 tignw] S4: 18 123: 19

J24: 13 146% 153: 5 18121 IQ793 207: 16 213: 12 222: 13 231: 20

sign8tuxc p] 4~ 13.14 203: 19 +ned [UJ 525 6: l J

13920 JS7: 15.16 182~ 4 194: ll 19522 203: 7 205~ 13 213: 8 22OA J 222~ 16 significana [I] 132: 13 significlnt p] 88: 8

2045 signing[ q 6: 15 124: lS

195: 16 205: 7 213: 7 WE24 sihcr[~] 10821 simihqz] 23~ 20 51: 12 simpbfl] 6: s simply p] 69 734 since [II] 6: 11,15 2122

263 28~ 7 3OA13822.23 46: 12 61: lO 68~ 4 110~ 16 126~ 13 162~ 4 186: lO, lS 211~ 23 212~ 8 sincere [l] 17234 sink [1] 9Or8 Sir[ l] 16: s sistcr[ l] 122z24 sitting p] 53~ 5 191: 4

216: 18 situ& on [( J 51: 6 80: 7

1OSJ J64: 17 166: 12 1685 six v] 37: 6 90~ 13 102: 15

2362 &etchings [IJ 189: 18 Bkinnym 41: 1213

says- so lay, August 6,1998

kip (1) 137: ’ kyline[ l[ 151~ 9 ludge [I] 76: J- mall [3] J50: 2_ 20 222:: ma& h [I] 18322 mtared[ l] 225: JO milt [I] J7: 21 napping [II 86: 19 o pu] 3: 16 75.16 8: 5 9: 23 11~ 4 J4: 19.23 15: 6 15: J3 J8: 20 23: J4 24: 13 24: 15 26: 17 29: J5 30: 4 3@ 21 31: 3.19 35: 11,15 36: 6,17 37d. 12 38: 725 39~ 21.25 40: 2.69.1525 41: 16 42: 7 4526.14 46~ 2 46: 9.13 47: 120 48: 1 49~ 16 50~ 6.15 51: 1.10.16 5122 53: s S4: J 55: 12 569,14,21 YE7.10 58: 24 6223 64: 16 65: J6 66: 3 6625 67: 6 68~ 8 692,4 7O: lO 71: 16,22 7211,4,5 72: 16 73: 8, J 1.14 752.6 753 76: J 77: 10,13,17 7724 78: 2,4,21792 80~ 17 81: 14 82~ 15 83: J8 83~ 20 84: 17 ti8 86~ 5.7 86~ 1 J 87: 17 88: 4,19X! 8924 91: 4.10,20 92Q2 93: 11,15,17 94~ 5.6 963 9621 1003 102: 11,17 104: s 105: 16,21 10623 JO1: 14.17 109: 18,20,22 J1033, S>, ll, J4, l5~ 112~ 3.2122 J13: 7.1822 115: 2,15 11622 1172 J20: 6.10,20 J21: J 122: l lU: l2,13,21 124: J. J7 US: 12 126~ 21 J27: 10,12 128: 24 129: 14,18 131: J8 1323 133: 19 134QO 13524 136~ 21 1373 138~ 23 139Z2, S,& 9,22 142: 13 144: 7,17 148~ 5.6 1489 149~ 12 lSOA3,24 lSO2S 151: 1,49.10,25 153E2& 2123 1549 156:] 4,1950 lS8A3

J61: 19 1628 163: 14,16 16Sz3,6,20 166~ 4.24 J67: 4 167: 7,11,12 168z8 16920 170~ 6 ]71: 7 172zJ, 11,14 1749 175z7,13 176w. 7 17720 178LLW lm23 1819 1852 J88zS. 15.16 19037.38,21,21 191: 4 192~ 6 193: 16 1959.23 1963182324 197A. 4.11 197: 18,18 lSW. 16 2022 202: 11,13,19 205: 8 20623 207: 1= 3 210: 15 211: 20,24 212~ 13 213: 3 213: ll 214: 1,20,20 215: 6 215: 8,8,10 21622 21733 217: 6 218: 5,7.16 219: 13 22025 221: 7 222A24 223m 224QS ma25 22Sz2S 227$ 5 228z6.8 22Q7* 19# 233Ao. 17 234~ 12 236~ 17 238: 7,15

Index Page 24

Divmified Repmting S& CCS. 1~. (202) 296- 2929

In Ike: Grand Jury Pmccedings Multi- Pagem

!38z21 239: 2 240: 2 )fa[ 2J 76: lO 145: 22

lftcned [l] 68: 20 01 [l) 117: s

OLOMON NJ J ~20 3~: [147~ 7: 3 8: 3,16 14: 15 Jk6.13 16~ 4 17~ 2 18: 4 19: 16 23: 7 26~ 17.18 27~ 23 39117 41~ 25 43~ 4 15~ 21 46: 1.7 49~ 15 52: 16 52: 16 53: 12 54: 3 55: 14 55% 56: 6.12 57: 17 58: 19 S8~ 20,22 59: 1,16.18 6091 SJ: J2 66: 4 67: 24 68: 4 71~ 20 74: 13 76: 15,17 80~ 3 BOQ5 81: 1.4,7.11,21 37: 12 899 90: 19 91: 13 J1: 20 93: 4 94:) 95: 1322 57: 24 98: 6,19 104: 10,15 m9: 1.14 119: 7,7,1834 121: ll 123: UO 124: 21 125: 16 127: 7- 130: 4.15 131~ 5 132: 13 139: 21 140: 24 142~ 25 143: 4 J45: 17 150~ 21 152: 3,14 155: 24 156: 16,17 157: 6 158:)) 159: 7 160~ 8 16120 162: 4 163: 3 166: JO 168: 18 171: Jl 178: 21 179: 16,18 18l: l 182: 23.24 186: 5,12.17 187: 13.14 189: 25 192: 18 192: 19~ 193: 1732 195: J. J 196: 5 197: 13 198: 9.13

200: 1733 201: 2,16,16 205~ 7 206: 7 207: 19 208: 17 209: 14 214: 1030

216: 15 219: 7 222: 1733 226: 1.23 228: 6 229: 11

239: 3,18 240: 3

omcbody [so 14: 18 27:: 89: 19 99: 24 Joo: JO

omehow [, I 41~ 4 89~ 20 124: 18 164: 12 172: 2 173: ll 197: 16 217: 24 22822 omeont [36] 37: 1,14 51: 6 56: 9 71: 4 73: 22 74:) 74: 4 77: 17 83: 17 86: Jl 88: 18 96: 2.3 KM: 5 109: 21 _..~_ .

110: 13.15 120: 12 127: 15 128: 9 131: 20,22 136: 13 139: 4 152: 16 159: 2 163: 12.17 173: 25 174: 7 174: lO 192: 23 196: 24 199~ 25 2O9: Jl 216: 20 218: 15

omething[ wJ 5: 10.19 14: 16 23: l 30: 21 37: 6,9 39: 22 40: 9.19 42~ 14 44~ 2: 48: 23 54: ll 56: 8 63: 17 70: 24 71: 6 72: 8,16 74~ 3 75: J 76: 17 81: 17 84: 9 87: l 88: 7 89~ 5 90: 22

91: 21 95: 19 96: 3 98: 1,10 98: 12 99: 2334 loo: 22 101: 25 JO4: JO 108: 5 117: 6,8 119: 24 121: 2 124: 3 125: 4,5,18 127: 19 128: 18 131: 17,22 132: 18 133: 6 136: 14.20 143: 20

146: 20 154~ 25 155: 1.6.7 155: 8.23 17o: lJ 174: 1.19 175: 13,14 176~ 23 18O: lO 181: 8 l& k18 188: 12 MkJ7.18 193: 13,24 195: 1,17,22 196~ 20 198: 8 2oo: JO 202: 15 2O4: 16 214: 17 216~ 24 219~ 2 U7: 6 228: l 233~ 25 236: 5 239: 1,14,17 DmtrmesmJ 18: 9 _ _

22~ 23: 15 33~ 6 Ml7 35: 4 42~ 12 43: 7.1630 i& o 54~ 24.25 k631 58~ 5 67E2lW 142: 1920 218~ 3

=PJ 83: 16

mew~[ 4) 152: 16

154: ll 159~ 4 J& 5: 6

mp) 7.121 126: 16 219: 2

my[ 49] 15: 16,2O 16~ 20 19~ 3 2J: SS 22~ 23 2424 25~ 24 M: i7 37QO, 22 38~ 2 38: JO 39: l a10 45: 19 KM5 63~ 24 66~ 12 699 71:) 73s n2121 9524 99~ 5 loo: 13 1OS: J 127~ 3 135~ 20 137: 69 143: 12 158~ 10 165: Zj 166: 5 1694 170: 4,16,18 173~ 20 199: 3 214~ 23 218: l 220: 4 228~ 6.17 230: 8 ort/ mJ 9: 12.16,25 JO: 24 11: 9.24 15:) 16: 18 17: l 17: 12 18: 4.7.14 19~ 18 22~ 2 24: 12 259 26: 2.11 28~ 22 32: 16 35: 12 36~ 3 38: 13,17 39: 13 41: 3 45: 23 4733 492.15 5Oz7 51: 6 52:)) 53~ 22 54: 3 58: 16 62~ 22 63~ 223 649 65: 133 66: 4 67: 4.24 68zJ3.19 70: 21.23 71: tt 72: 6.13 79: 17 81: 12 825.19 83: 6 83: 18 85: 2.24 86: 12.24 86: 25 87: 12.1725 9O: 16 91: 4 106: 16 Ill: 7 112: 4 116: 3,4 12Oz8.17 122: 13 123322 124: 1.12 127: 14 128: 22 130: 6 131: 1.22 133: lO 134: 10,16.17 136: 15,22 137: 19 139~ 15 139: 1731 140: 1,17 142: l 147: 7+ 21 150: 14,25 151: 8 152: 7.17 154: 19 156: 13

159~ 5 16OL24.25 161: 4 164: 18 165: 8.20 167: 4.24

168: 5.13 169~ 13 172: JO 172: 14 174: 7.15.17 182: 14 185c20$ 0 186: 12 187: 5 193: 17 194: 19 195: 18 196: 20 198: 4.8 202: JO 2O4: 2 20624 207: 8 21O: U 214: 6 215: 22,25 216~ 1.4 217: l 221: 19 226: 12,17 228: 15 229: 4 239: 3 mts [3) 17: 16 23: 17 225: 15

iound [l] 170: 7

rounds m 24: 12 41: 13 78: 25 12o: lO 144: l 156: 22 158: 19 iourcc pJ 98: 22 138: 3 south [1] 9: 7.14 ;outhwcst 131 JO9: 25

1 JO: 1 154: 14

rouvcnirpJ 41: 11,17 rpeak 113) 5: 8S 38: 8

105m 137: 17 17325 186z21 195: 1432 19924 199~ 24 20225 21325

speaking[ sJ 113: 8 118~ 18 159: 12 210: 24 - 218~ 2

epe& caded [1J 65: 2

mccific 1101 IO: 23 17: 2 i7: 6 59: Jb 60: 15 63~ 25 loo: 17 1329 13924 233: 3 specifitiy [as) 4817

57: 18 74: 17 89: 22 141: 17 141: 18 16JQl. 22 179Z. 5 181CtO 215: 23 220: 25 22J: l 222: JJ

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1048 In Rc: Grand Jury Proceedings . Multi- Pagem supervisor - that

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Index Page 26 Diversified Renorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1049

In Re: Grand Jury Pro- gs

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Diversified Rcvortina Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Index Page 27

1050

In Rc: Grand Jury Proceedings I

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Index Page 28 Diversified Rmorting Stices. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1051

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings

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In& x Page 29

Diversified Reporting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1052

In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings Multi- Page* vigorously - well Thursdav. August 6.1998

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index rage 50

Diversified Reporting Semites. Inc. (202) 296- 2929

1053

In Re: Grand Jury Pmcctdings

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vhich [UI 4: 2 30: 8 36: 12 40~ 6 4i: 2i 47~ 7 55: l 67: 9 74: 23 76~ 9 84: 3.3 91: 12 101: 9 107: s lli: 24 114: 4 114: 4 120: 18 123: 24 128: 17 129: 89 132: ll 134: 9 138: ll. 139: 22020 143~ 24 152: 2 157: ll 18122 182: 2325 183: 13 184: 8 185: 24 193: 8 203: 6 205: 4 212: 7 2199 222: 14 22524 227: 20 233: 8 234: 9

while rm 20: 16.20 30: 22 36~ 5 3824 44: 2 54: 16 729 8Ik5.6 92: 6 112: s 131: 2 141: 24 191: 6 212: 3 240: 12

vhispered 111 22: 25 vhitc 147~ 7: 23 8: 8,19

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In Re: Grand Jury Proceedings . 177: zs 178: 14 179: l 180: 1.4 181: 2,123032 183: s 186: 8.12,2122.22 187: 633 188: 23 189: 5, lE 189: 21 191~ 21 19L5.5.7 192: 10.11 194: 4.18 195: 12 196: 634,25 J97: 8 197: ll. J 1 198: 2,10,17 199: 24.25 200: 12.1834 201: 2.13 202: 7,15.17.20 203: 2; 2!+ 24 2@ l: J2 205: 17 206: 4.12 207: 12 209: 11.24 210: 3.7.24 211: 3.8.8.12.1731 2122 212: 4 213: 2234 214325 214: 6,18.18 215: 8,18.24 216: 19 217: 12 218: 2 219: 2335 220: 11.1330 221: 10.13.16,22 22223 224: 9.13.19.22 225: 3,13 225: 17 227: 10.13.16.16 228: 7.7.10 229~ 8.16 230: 711.11 ,P 977. lA JA __# l...,, X” -a#...“*-

233: 2.21 235: s 236: 3 b’ittlin[~ o] 13: 16 16: 23 20: 9 29: J 1.16 46: 24 52: J’ 97: 14.20 186: 15

VitbOUt [6] 8: 5 17: 1 79: lS 87: 19 JO+ 24 153: 1 182: 13 213: lO VitrKxs [S3J 22 3: 4 28: 11 33: 23,25.25 34: 8 46: 1 76: 25 77: 10 80: 12 Rn* lli. lfi 17.24 Ill. 7 R~ 1l- l __._ _,__._ . ,_ __ ._ ,_.-_

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240: 15.18.21 ritnesses 111 3: 14

ritnessing 111 49: 25 tits (11 206: 23

reman [IT] so: 2 70: 15

70: 16.17 71: 24 72: 11.17 76: 13 77: 22 78: 1 134: 16

152: 2 212: 5.5 213: 21.22 114: 18

‘On’t[ q 117: l 181: 21 I82: 7.8 ~Ondcr[ 3] 48: s 168: 16 t23: lS

Fondered [II 98: lo rooden 111 184: 25

rord [3] 86: 25 175: 6 10519

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work [IS] 30: 16 3724 542 65: 14.15,15 67: 9 90~ 20 102: 79 116: l 148: 12 165: 4 171: 15 194: 8

workday 11) 238~ 23 aoI’kCd[ lo] 8: 14 54: 16 58: 15 65: 19 7O: J6 72: 18 805 208: 3 218: 14 240: 13 bforking [17] Jk7.12 J4: 1

18: 15 4& 13.3.8 47: 17 S3: 12 65: 17 84: JJ 1OJ: Jl 171: 17 204: 23 23125

vorkload 111 171: 11 vorks II] 84: 12

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Diversified Rcnorting Services. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 In& x Page 32

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

-e- e --- - - -___-_ - x

IN RE: GRAND JURY PROCEEDINGS

Grand Jury Room No. 2 United States District Court

for the District of Columbia 3rd & Constitution, N. W. Washington, D. C. 20001

Thursday, August 20, 1998 The testimony of MONICA S. LEWINSKY was taken in the presence of a full quorum of Grand Jury 97- 2, impaneled on September 19, 1997, commencing at 9: 51 a. m., before:

MICHAEL EMMICK KARIN IMMERGUT Associate Independent Counsel Office of Independent Counsel 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, N. W. Suite 490 North Washington, D. C. 20004

Diversified Reporting Servkes, Inc

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5 6 7 a

9 10 11 12

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2 Whereupon,

PROCEEDINGS MONICA S. LEWINSKY was called as a witness and, after having been first duly sworn by the Foreperson of the Grand Jury, was examined and testified as follows:

EXAMINATION BY MR. EMMICK: Q Good morning, Ms. Lewinsky. A Good morning. Q As we did with your earlier grand jury testimony, my job is to advise you of your rights and obligations here at the beginning.

First off, you have a right under the Fifth Amendment to refuse to answer any questions that may tend to incriminate you. In this case, that right is qualified by the fact that you've signed an agreement to provide truthful testimony in connection with our investigation. Do you understand that?

A Yes, I do.

Q In addition, you have the right to have counsel present outside the grand jury to answer any questions that you may have. Do you have counsel outside?

A Yes, I do.

Q Who is that?

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2 3 4

5 6 7

8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

3 A Preston Burton. Q And you understand that if you'd like to speak to your counsel, all you have to do is say "Could I take a break and speak with my counsel?"

A Yes.

Q All right. You also in addition to those two rights, you have an obligation and that obligation is to tell the truth. That obligation is imposed on you because you have been put under oath and also because in connection with your agreement you're required to tell the truth. Do you understand that?

A Yes, I do. MR. EMMICK: What I have placed in front of you is what is marked as ML- 7. This is a chart that you have earlier testified about of contacts between yourself and the President.

As I indicated to you informally beforehand, this - grand jury session today is for you to answer questions from the grand jurors.

And so without any further ado, I will ask the grand jurors if they have any questions of Ms. Lewinsky.

A JTJROR: I think I'm going to start out. MR. EMMICK: Okay. A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, in your testimony when you were with us on the 6th, you mentioned some of the steps that

Diversified Reportinq Services, Inc.

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1 you took to maintain secrecy regarding your relationship:

2 that you would bring papers or he'd have papers or either you

3 would accidentally bump into each other in the hallway; you

4 always used Betty as the excuse for you to be waved in; and

5 on many occasions you would go in one door and out of the

6 other door.

7 THE WITNESS: Yes.

8 A JUROR: tie there any other methods you used that

9 I've missed? That you used to maintain your secrecy?

10 THE WITNESS: Hmm. I need to think about that for

11 a minute.

12 A JUROR: And the second part to that question is

13 were these ways to maintain your secrecy your idea or were

14 they recommended to you by anyone?

15 THE WITNESS: I can answer the second part first.

16 A JUROR: Okay.

17 THE WITNESS: If that's okay.

18 A JUROR: That's fine.

19 THE WITNESS: Some of them were my idea. Some of

20 them were things that I had discussed with the President. I

21 think it was a mutual understanding between us that obviously

22 we'd both try to be careful.

23 A JUROR: Do you recall at all specifically which

24 ones he may have recommended to you as an idea on maintaining

25 the secrecy?

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THE WITNESS: Yes and no. The issue of Betty being the cover story for when I came to the White House, it became my understanding I think most clearly from the fact that I couldn't come to see him after the election until -- unless Betty was there to clear me in and that one time when I asked him why, he said because if someone comes to see him, there's a list circulated among the staff members and then everyone would be questioning why I was there to see him. so --

MR. EMMICK: Let me try to ask some follow- ups in response to your question.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Were there ever any discussions between you and the President about what should be done with letters that you -- letters or notes that you had sent to him? That is to say, for example, did you ever write on the bottom of any letters what to do with those letters?

A It was my understanding that obviously he would - throw them away or, if he decided to keep them, which I didn't think he did, he would put them somewhere safe.

I think what you're referring to is on the bottom once of a sort of joke memo that I sent to him I in a joking manner reminded him to throw the letter away, that it wasn't -- you know, that was a joke. so --

Q What about whether on your caller ID on your telephone the word POTUS would appear and whether anything

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was done in order to make sure that POTUS did not appear on your telephone?

A My caller ID at work, it would -- when the President called from the Oval Office, it would say POTUS and when he'd call from the residence, it was an asterisk. And I told him that. I didn't know if he knew that it said POTUS when he called from the office, and I assumed he didn't, because otherwise that would be sort of silly.

So I informed him of that and then one time he called me from the residence and he -- he called on a hard line -- 1 don't know. I shouldn't say "hard line" because I know that has some different terminology to it, but he called on a line that had a phone number attached to it and so when he called, he said, "Oh, did it ring up, you know, phone number? It didn't say my name, did it?"

And so it was -- that was something that I was concerned about.

Q Did he ever express to you a reluctance to leave messages on your telephone voice message system?

A At home?

Q Yes. A Yes.

Q All right. Tell us about that. A One time in a conversation he just said he didn't like to leave messages.

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Q Okay. him? Were those

7 What about the times that you would visit times selected in a way so that there weren't people around or that certain people weren't around?

A Yes.

Q Okay. Would you tell us about that? A There were obviously people at the White House who didn't like me and wouldn't -- wouldn't be understanding of why I was coming to see the President or accepting of that and so there was always sort of an effort made that either on the weekends -- when I was working in the White House he told me that it was usually quiet on the weekends and I knew that to be true. And after I left the White House it was always when there weren't going to be a lot of people around.

Q And what about particular individual people? Would there be particular individual people who would be -- staffers in the oval area that you would try to avoid in order to help conceal the relationship?

A Yes. Nancy Hernreich, Stephen Goodin, Evelyn Lieberman. Pretty West Wing.

A JUROR: you so much? What rules of the White

much anybody on the first floor of the How did all these people come to not like were you doing? Were you breaking the House? What were you doing to draw their attention to not liking you so much? Before the relationship.

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a From the time you got there all the way up to the time -- what I'm saying is what did you do to deserve for them not to like you?

THE WITNESS: Before the relationship started? A JUROR: Yes. What did you do from -- THE WITNESS: I don't think there was anything I did before the relationship started that -- the relationship started in November of '95. I had only been at the White House as an intern in the Old Executive Office Building for -- for a few months, so most of my tenure at the White House I was having a relationship with the President.

I think that -- the President seemed to pay attention to me and I paid attention to him and I think people were wary of his weaknesses, maybe, and thought -- in my opinion, I mean, this is -- I think that people -- they didn't want to look at him and think that he could be responsible for anything, so it had to all be my fault, that I was -- 1 was stalking him or I was making advances towards him. You know, as they've said, I wore inappropriate clothes, which is absolutely not true. I'm not really sure.

A JUROR: But you do admit a lot of the places that you weren't supposed to be you were always found. You do admit that there were things that you were doing, too, in order to see him that they were feeling that was going

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against the rules of the White House? THE WITNESS: Uh -- A JUROR: You know, places that you were that you weren't supposed to be and hallways that you weren't supposed to be, you were seen in those places?

THE WITNESS: Yes and no. There really weren't any of these staffers who saw me in the places that I wasn't supposed to be. And that was part of the effort to conceal the relationship. So -- does that make sense?

I mean, when I was in the Oval Office with the President, no one else knew except for the Secret Service, no one else knew that I went in there. So for them to know -- for them to be disliking me for that reason, I don't think that they were really -- I don't know if they were aware of that or not.

I did make an effort, I think, to try to -- to have interactions with the President and I -- and I think that -- - that was probably disturbing to them. I know that if the President was in the hall and he was talking to people and I passed by he'd -- he'd stop talking and say hi to me. I'm not really sure.

A JUROR: Just a follow- up to that. THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: If they didn't see you, well, how did they know?

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THE WITNESS: I don't know what they knew. I -- you know, I -- I'm not sure -- I --

A JUROR: Because if you said you made an effort to hide yourself, you know, so you wouldn't see them, the Secret Service are the ones that saw you --

THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: Okay. So, I mean, how would they -- how did they know that you were there, you know, to want to keep you away from being there?

THE WITNESS: I don't know. Maybe -- I -- I mean, I've heard reported in the newspapers and on TV that the Secret Service, someone said something to Evelyn Lieberman and I had had an -- 1 don't know if I went over this the last time I was here, I had had a real negative interaction with Nancy Hernreich early on in my tenure at the White House and so --

1 think there was also -- I'm a friendly person - and -- and I didn't know it was a crime in Washington for people -- for you to want people to like you and so I was friendly. And I guess I wasn't supposed to be.

A JUROR: So that interaction that you had with Evelyn Lieberman was when she was telling you what?

THE WITNESS: She stopped me in the hall and she asked me where I worked, in which office I worked, -and I told her Legislative Affairs in the East Wing.

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And she said, "You're always trafficking up this area." You know, I'You're not supposed to be here. Interns aren't allowed to go past the Oval Office."

And she -- she really startled me and I walked away and I went down to the bathroom and I was crying because -- I mean, when -- you know, when an older woman sort of chastises you like that, it's upsetting.

And then I thought about what she said and I realized that, well, I wasn't an intern any more. I was working there. And I kind of believe in clear communication, so I went back to Evelyn Lieberman, to Ms. Lieberman, and I -- 1 said, "You know, I just wanted to clarify with you that I work here, I'm not an intern. So, you know, I am allowed to go past the Oval Office." I don't think I said that, but I had a blue pass.

And she looked at me and said, "They hired YOU?~ ' And I was startled and then she said, "Oh, well, I think I - mistook you for someone else or some other girl with dark hair who keeps trafficking up the area." And ever since then -- and that was maybe in December or January of '95 or '96. So --

A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, were you ever reprimanded or chastised by your immediate supervisor in Legislative Affairs for trafficking up the area or being where- you weren't supposed to be or being away from your desk too much?

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12 Anything like that?

THE WITNESS: Being away from my desk had been mentioned to me, but trafficking up the area and being where I'm not supposed to be, no.

I -- the -- 1 had a view of -- and this is sort of my view with work is that you get a lot more done and people are a lot more willing to help you when you have a personal interaction with them. And so the person who held the job before me would fax the drafts of his letters to the staff secretary's office and then at some point during the day when someone got the draft they would make the changes and then fax it back.

And I found it to be much more effective to take things over to the staff secretary's office and interact with the person -- 1 can't remember her name -- Helen -- to interact with Helen and have Helen edit the letters right then and there and then I could go back and to me it was a - faster process.

So there was also -- you know, I also wanted to try to see the President. So, I mean, I did make efforts to try to see him in the hall or something like that because --

A JUROR: So the route to the staff person's office was a route that you could still veer off and see the President?

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THE WITNESS: No. It -- it wasn't necessarily in front of the Oval Office or anything. There were -- we also had -- let me see if I can explain this. I'm sure you guys know by now that the West Wing is three stories. There's the basement, the first floor and the second floor. Legislative Affairs has an office on the second floor of the West Wing.

There are two ways to get to that office -- or three ways, I guess. There's the West Wing, you can cut across the West Wing lobby, which is where people coming to visit someone in the White House sit. There's going the back way, which you pass the Oval Office, but the door's always closed when the President's in there. And then you can go all the way down the stairs and all the way around and then all the way up two flights of stairs.

When I first started working there, it didn't seem appropriate to walk through the West -- to me,- it didn't seem - appropriate to walk through the West Wing lobby with papers when there were people who were visitors coming to sit and wait. I just -- I didn't think that was appropriate during the business time.

So I went the other way, behind -- which went past the Oval Office, not knowing that -- I guess you're not supposed to do that. It seemed silly. The door's -closed and it's locked. And there wasn't this intention to see the

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14 President that way.

So -- am I -- did I answer your question? A JUROR: Yes. THE WITNESS: Okay. I'm sorry. MR. EMMICK: You know, one thing I might do is circle back to try to pick up some more concealment methods.

A JUROR: Okay. MR. EMMICK: Because you asked the question are there any other methods.

A JUROR: Yes.

MR. EMMICK: And I can ask a few more questions that might direct us in that area.

THE WITNESS: Okay. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q For example, you have indicated earlier that it was Betty Currie who waved you in all the times during 1997 that you saw the President. Did you ever talk with the President - about whether he could wave you in instead or whether it would be a good idea for him to wave you in personally?

A Yes. I think that that's what I mentioned earlier.

Q Oh, okay. A That he and I had discussed it and he said he couldn't do that because then it would be on a list.

Q Okay. What about -- you had mentioned that you took a different route into the Oval Office than you would

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take out of the Oval Office. In addition, did you ever take routes to get to the Oval Office that seemed calculated to avoid certain Secret Service or White House personnel?

A Not Secret Service, but I -- I liked or I preferred to sort of meet up with him and then we'd walk in together. And I preferred to go in through the Rose Garden because then I wasn't going -- 1 wasn't risking the possibility of running into someone in the hall right outside the Oval Office.

so --

Q What about the routes that Betty would walk you in from the gates?

A Oh. When -- there were certain Secret Service officers who were friendly with Debi Schiff who Betty wanted to try to avoid because I guess they chatted with Debi Schiff a lot and there's a whole long story with Debi Schiff, so --

Q And would that be another way that you would help - conceal your meetings with the President?

A Yes. A JUROR: Just to back up for a minute. When you would meet the President and go in through the Rose Garden or meet the President before going into the Oval Office, did you discuss that with him ever about sort of what -- that that would be a way that would sort of be more concealing or --

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THE WITNESS: We only did that, I think, twice. And the first time, it really was an accident. And so then the next time that we did that, I said -- you know, before -- he would call me in my office before I would come see him and we'd figure out what we were going to do.

And I think I -- I know I suggested to him, I said, "I really like that because then it's just easier, it seems." And also, I -- for me personally, I didn't -- I didn't always want to be the one that was being seen going in. Does that make sense?

So that I wasn't always bringing in the papers and it was me going to him, that in this instance if someone saw it, being the Secret Service, he invited me. So -- for me, that just made me feel better.

BY MR. EMMICK: Q All right. I have a number of other questions about these alternative methods of concealment. Let me ask - you this. I think you've testified earlier that most of the sexual contact that you had with the President tended to occur in the hallway, rather than in the study, although sometimes it was in the study itself.

Did that have anything to do with whether or not it would be easier to see you in the study as opposed to the hallway?

A I think so, but I don't specifically -- I don't

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specifically remember discussing that with the President, but there were circumstances that that sort of was obvious to me.

Q And would that include the fact that windows in the study tended to be uncurtained?

A Just that, windows. Yes.

Q Right. Yes, there were windows there. A Yes.

Q And so you might be seen there. A Yes.

MR. EMMICK: All right. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q In that regard, you also mentioned that you would move from the oval area or that sometimes you'd start in the Oval Office and then you'd move towards the hallway. Did the President ever initiate that move?

A I think we both did. I mean, it just depended on the day. It wasn't --

Q Was it understood that you wouldn't actually have a sexual encounter in the Oval Office?

A I'm sure it was understood. I -- I -- I wouldn't have done that. I mean -- so -- I'm sure he wouldn't have done that.

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Are there windows all around the Oval Office?

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A There are windows all around and it just -- I know this may sound silly, but it wouldn't be appropriate. You know.

Q What about any discussions with the President about not acknowledging one another at parties or photographs, for example?

A He called me in my office the day of Pat Griffin's going away party and had asked me if I was going to go. I said yes and he said, "Well, maybe we can get together after that."

And I told him I didn't think that was a good idea, that people were going to be watching. I was paranoid anyway and -- so I said, "1 think it's a good idea if we just sort of ignore each other at the party and don't really say anything." And that's what we did.

Q And what about with respect to a photograph that was taken at the party and whether --

A I mean, we didn't discuss this. I didn't know there was going to be a picture taken. But I made an effort to stand on the -- 1 was the last person sort of on the outside of this picture so that -- I didn't want anyone to think that I was trying to get close to the President, I was trying to -- whatever it was.

Q So in that case, that would be a concealment effort, but not one that the President and you had

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collaborated on. A No.

Q All right. What about an occasion when the President suggested that the two you might attend a movie and sort of bump into each other outside the movie? Tell us about that discussion.

A He told me he was going to watch a movie with some friends of his and that if I wanted to I could bump into him in the hall outside and then he'd invite me into the movie.

And I asked him if -- I think he said there were some friends and maybe some of his staff or I asked him if some of his staff was going to be there.

And he said yes and I don't remember who he said was going to be there, but I said I didn't think that was a good idea.

Q And why would you have to make prior arrangements for you to bump into each other rather than having sort of - a -- you know, walk down the hall together to the movie?

A Well, I --

Q I know it's kind of obvious. A For obvious reasons, I guess, because it wouldn't be appropriate. It -- people would -- people would wonder what was going on.

Q Right. Right. Okay. What about the fact that you made -- that you sent gifts and notes through Betty rather

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than directly to the President? Was that something that was done in order to make it less obvious that the notes were actually to the President?

A Well, yes and no. You really -- if you send something directly to the President, if you send a gift to the President, if I sent something right now, well, I don't know, right now, but before this, it -- it -- it goes to the gift unit.

Q Right. A And so I knew that Betty was the way -- I think that that's -- Walter Kaye would, you know, go through Betty, I think. And that's --

Q So it's yes and no, is the answer to that. A You can't -- I mean, you can't send a courier thing to the President, you know, a courier to President Clinton, so --

A JUROR: I have a question to follow up on that. When you would send gifts and notes and what have you to Betty, as you had testified, sometimes you'd have a funny card in there, sometimes it would be something sentimental.

Did you ever give Betty license to read any of them because you thought, "Hey, take a look at this, tell me what you think," any of the cards or notes or anything?

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21 THE WITNESS: I don't think so. Maybe I told her about a funny card or something. Not that I really remember. I don't -- 1 think especially if it were something that was ultra- sensitive, I don't -- you know, I don't --

A JUROR: Yes. That would probably be sealed. THE WITNESS: Exactly. A JUROR: But for any of the other little -- THE WITNESS: Might have been the jokes. Sometimes I would put together jokes I got on the Internet or e- mail jokes that I put together for him because, you know, everyone needs to laugh, so -- I think maybe -- maybe there was a time that I said, "Oh, you should look at these jokes, they're really funny."

A JUROR: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: Other questions? Yes, ma'am? A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, did you ever discuss with the President whether you should delete documents from your - hard drive, either at the office or at home?

THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: Nothing like that? THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: Did you ever discuss with the President whether you should deny the relationship if you were asked about it?

THE WITNESS: I think I always offered that.

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I think I've always -- A JUROR: In discussions with the President? THE WITNESS: In discussions -- I told him I would always -- 1 would always deny it, I would always protect him.

A JUROR: And what did he say when you said that? What kind of response did you receive?

THE WITNESS: I said that often. I -- in my head, I'm seeing him smile and I'm hearing him saying "That's good, l' or -- something affirmative. You know. Not -- not -- "Don't deny it. '!

A JUROR: Thank you. THE WITNESS: Sure. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Ms. Lewinsky, with respect to the weekend visits, did the President ever initiate that idea or say anything about it's good if you come on the weekends? _

A Yes. The -- I don't remember if it was the Wednesday or the Friday when the relationship first started, he said to me at some point, you know, "You can come see me on the weekends. I'm usually around on the weekends." so --

Q And did you understand what that meant? A Yes. To me, it meant there aren't as many people around on the weekends, so --

A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, when you -- now, this is a

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different kind of subject. When you first made the determination that you were moving to New York and you wanted to explore the possibilities of a job in private industry, can you recall how you first got the recommendation about Vernon Jordan's assistance in this endeavor?

THE WITNESS: I can't. I know that it was -- what I don't remember was if it was my idea or Linda's idea. And I know that that came up in discussions with her, I believe, before I discussed it with the President. I know that I suggested to the President or I -- I didn't suggest, I asked the President if Mr. Jordan might be able to assist me.

A JUROR: To go back from the job search to what we were talking about before, I seem to recall, and I may be nistaken, when you were here before you said something about Tim Keating when you were fired, said something to you like naybe you can come back after the election.

THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: And I wanted to just hear sort of a Euller explanation about that. Was it your understanding at the time that Tim Keating was sort of -- that he understood and was telling you that you were fired because of an appearance problem around the time of the election?

THE WITNESS: Not at all. A JUROR: No? THE WITNESS: No.

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A JUROR: The other question I have, and I apologize, it's a little bit sensitive, but did you and the President in sort of discussing cover stories and, you know, how -- you know, your desire to protect him from sort of what's going on now, did you ever talk about sort of -- you know, that you weren't really having sex?

I mean, you said that he made this comment to you about not having -- you know, that certain actions have consequences at his age.

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: Was there ever sort of an understanding that, well, oral sex isn't really sex? Or did you talk about that?

THE WITNESS: We didn't talk about it. Something that I thought on my own was one of the reasons that it -- at first that he didn't want to -- that he wouldn't let everything come to completion in terms of oral sex was I thought that that sort of had to do with maybe that was his way of being able to feel okay about it, his way of being able to justify it or rationalize it that, well --

A JUROR: But you never discussed that. THE WITNESS: No. MR. EMMICK: Yes, ma/ am? A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, getting back to -- I think you have a copy there of contacts between the President and

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25 Monica?

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JTJROR: After you left the White House, it seems as if you attended a number of public functions where you came in contact with him.

Was that by chance? Was that something you wanted to do? Was it a way to see him? Was it something that he suggested?

Could you just tell us a little about that? THE WITNESS: Sure. No. Those were all ways for me to get a chance to see him. I'm an insecure person and so I think -- and I was insecure about the relationship at times and thought that he would come to forget me easily and if I hadn't heard from him -- especially after I left the White House, it was -- it was very difficult for me and I always liked to see him and it -- and usually when I'd see him, it would kind of prompt him to call me. So I made an effort. I - would go early and stand in the front so I could see him, blah, blah, blah.

BY MR. EMMICK: Q Let me ask a follow- up question to that because I think it may have been in about October of '96 when you had a telephone conversation with him just prior to you going to Billy Shaddock to get a photograph.

A Right.

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Q During the conversation before, did you and the President have any discussion about your dropping by and seeing him at a public departure?

A Yes.

Q All right. Would you tell us about that? A Let's see. I spoke with him -- I think it was October 22nd, and then I saw him at an event October 23rd and he called that night and I had mentioned to him on -- I think it was a Tuesday, the first phone conversation, that I was going to be at the White House on Thursday.

And when he called me Wednesday night, he said -- 1 was upset with him and so then he said, you know, "Don't be mad. Don't be mad." You know. "Are you coming tomorrow? 1'

And I said yes. So he said, "Well, why don't you stop by Betty's office, stop by to see Betty and then maybe you can come see - me for a few minutes before I leave." So --

Q Okay. All right. The reason I was asking that as a follow- up is that's sort of a prearranged semi- public occasion for the two of you to see each other.

A Right. I don't -- 1 don't know necessarily that I was going to go to the departure.

Q I see. A But that was maybe kind of a cover story.

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27 Q I understand. A Or I'm not -- I know he had a departure and I know that I was going to see him for a few minutes before the departure because I thought -- I remember thinking that I might get to kiss him, so --

MR. EMMICK: All right. A JUROR: Now to follow up on your follow- up of my question --

MR. EMMICK: Yes. A JUROR: Did you get to see him that day? THE WITNESS: No, I didn't. A JUROR: Okay. Could you tell us a little about that?

THE WITNESS: Sure. I -- the short of it is that I didn't end up seeing him because Evelyn Lieberman was hanging around and left with him that day.

A JUROR: She was someplace where she didn't belong.

THE WITNESS: Right. So Betty had -- I was waiting in the West Wing lobby with Billy, actually, after we had gone to look at the photos and Betty finally came out and it was really just as he was walking to the helicopter and she took me to see it, but she said that -- and it was at that point when she sort of confirmed for me that Evelyn didn't like me. So -- that --

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A JUROR: The contacts with the President, on page 5, for the 18th of August --

THE WITNESS: I'm sorry, I can't hear you. MR. EMMICK: Page 5. A JUROR: Okay. Page 5, 18th of August, it says l'Public function, President's 50th birthday party, limited intimate contact."

A JUROR: I couldn't hear her. MR. EMMICK: Okay. Let me repeat it. There is a reference on page 5 to August 18th of '96, a Sunday, "Public function, President's 50th birthday party, limited intimate contact."

Your question about that was? THE WITNESS: What does that mean? MR. EMMICK: What does that mean? THE WITNESS: It's stupid. There was a cocktail reception for his -- he had this big 50th birthday party at - Radio City Music Hall and there was a cocktail reception and at the -- when he came to do the rope line and he -- after he greeted me and talked to me, he was talking to a whole bunch of people in and around my area and I had -- can I stand up and show you?

MR. EMMICK: Sure. Sure. THE WITNESS: Okay. If this is the rope 'line and here are all the people and the President's standing here, as

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he started to talk to other people, I had my back to him and I just kind of put -- put my hand behind me and touched him. This __ so __

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Touched him in the crotch area? A Yes.

A JUROR: I didn't hear that. MS. IMMERGUT: Touched him in the crotch area. A JUROR: Oh. MS. IMMERGUT: And the response was yes. A JUROR: Okay. A JUROR: Did anybody see you? THE WITNESS: What? No. What's the question? A JUROR: Did anybody see you? THE WITNBSS: No. A JUROR: But there were people around. THE WITNESS: There were, but it was -- he was talking -- everybody was enamored with him. I'm sure everybody saw from Monday that -- and he was talking to different people and he -- he was always very close to me when -- whenever he'd do these rope lines and would sort of make a point of talking to me around -- you know, with other -- while other people were there and he'd usually hold my hand -- you know, sort of shaking hands and just -- would continue to just touch me somewhere. I mean, not -- not

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intimately, not -- BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Right. Just to set the scene, are there a lot of people kind of bunched together at the time?

A Oh, they're -- they're -- I mean, if we -- if everybody in the room came and stood in this one small corner, that's -- I mean, that's how crowded it was. So it was -- and my back was to him and he was -- he was holding onto my -- 1 think he was holding onto one of my arms or something, I had a sleeveless dress on. so --

Q So it sounds to me like -- it's almost a situation where there are so many people that you can't really see that kind of --

A Exactly. And it wasn't -- it wasn't a -- it was -- maybe sort of a grazing over of that area, but it wasn't -- it wasn't how you might imagine it if someone described this, from a scene from a movie, it wasn't like that, but it was -- - you know. I don't even know if he remembers, so --

MR. EMMICK: Okay. A JUROR: So on this paper we have here with sexual relations, would that qualify as -- what, contact? Sexual contact? Because if I remember -- where's my paper --

THE WIT& S: Let me look at the definition. MR. EMMICK: Sure. A JUROR: Yes. Contact with -- number 1 --

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MR. EMMICK: Just to clarify, the witness is looking at Grand Jury Exhibit ML- 6.

THE WITNESS: I'm not really sure, because I don't think it was to necessarily gratify him or arouse him.

A JUROR: What was it for? THE WITNESS: It was just -- I thought it was funny and it was sort of a -- I don't know how to explain it.

A JUROR: Contact. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Would it be better described as perhaps affectionate or playful?

A Playful, I think. It was just -- playful, not something I'd ever thought I'd have to discuss publicly.

A JUROR: While we're on this, I wanted to like finish it up, but I had a couple of questions with regards to the definition.

THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: Because I want to be sure in my own mind. At the bottom it says -- it says "Contact means intentional touching, either directly or through clothing."

THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: Out of all of the times you had intimate contact, were there times when the President would touch you either on the breasts or in the genital area directly to the skin or was it always through clothing?

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32 THE WITNESS: Directly to the skin. Both.

MR. EMMICK: Yes, ma'am? A JUROR: I have some questions about the 50th birthday. That's when you gave the President the yellow tie. Is that when you gave the President the yellow tie?

THE WITNESS: Not on that date. A JUROR: But just before that. THE WITNESS: But before that. Correct. A JUROR: When it shows on the chart here, it says I'Some time before August 16, 1996."

THE WITNESS: Correct. A JUROR: And that tie is the same tie that at the end of your appearance here we saw some evidence that the President has worn a number of times this summer.

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: There's been some press accounts about that tie, last night and today.

THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: My question to you is have you authorized your attorneys or any other spokesperson through you to discuss that evidence?

THE WITNESS: Gosh. I don't think I've necessarily given a direct authorization.

A JUROR: Do you know that they have? THE WITNESS: Do I know if they -- I -- I don't

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1 know if they necessarily directly have. I know there have

2 been questions about it. I shouldn't say I know, I'm sure

3 there have been questions about it, but there have been a lot

4 of instances since the beginning of this thing that there's

5 been information that's come out from places where I hadn't

6 expected it and that includes my own -- the people on my

7 team. So I can't -- I don't know.

8 A JUROR: So you don't know whether that

9 information is coming from people that you have discussed it

10 with?

11 THE WITNESS: I think that there -- there probably

12 might have been -- I really -- 1 -- I wouldn't be surprised

13 to find out that there was confirmation or some of that

14 information came from there.

15 So -- but I know that also -- I'm sure it was

16 somewhat limited because with my agreement, we're not allowed

17 to talk to the press. We're not supposed to. - So -- without -

18 prior approval.

19 BY MR. EMMICK:

20 Q So I guess there's -- let me just rephrase it. It

21 sounds like you wouldn't be surprised by it, but do you have

22 any direct knowledge that it occurred?

23 A I know that there have been calls about this tie

24 and I know that -- that I don't think that we've been 100

25 percent silent about that. So -- I don't -- I mean -- I know

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that we didn't cause this story to come out or I don't believe that we did. So --

A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, it says on the chart that you received a thank you note saying that the tie is really beautiful.

THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: And that was in the President's handwriting?

THE WITNESS: It's a typed letter and then he hand signed the letter and then "The tie is really beautiful" is handwritten.

A JUROR: Did you ever discuss the tie with him in person or was it just a note?

THE WITNESS: No, we discussed it a lot on the phone.

A JUROR: And did he like the tie? THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: Thank you. THE WITNESS: He called me the first day he wore it. The first time he wore it.

A JUROR: All right. Thank you. A JUROR: I have another question. THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: On the day you were here testifying, there was a report on the TV --

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THE WITNESS: Right. A JUROR: The President in the Rose Garden wearing that tie. Did you see that?

THE WITNESS: That evening I did. A JUROR: When you saw him with the tie, what did that say to you?

THE WITNESS: I understand you had to do what you had to do. That's what it meant to me. I had looked -- because I had seen him wear this tie prior -- a few other occasions since January, I had looked the day before my testimony because I thought he's just the kind of person that's going to wear this tie to tug on my emotional strings one last time before I go into the grand jury and say this under oath. And he didn't.

And him wearing it the day I came to testify sort of having to know that I wasn't going to see it until the end of the day, to me was just kind of -- you know, hey, you had to do what you had to do. But --

MR. EMMICK: Yes, ma'am? A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, not to make a big issue about the tie, but is this tie something -- one of the ties that perhaps the President really liked, is a favorite tie?

THE WITNESS: I think so because he wore it during the campaign. He wore it once -- sometimes even twice a week. So I think he liked it a lot.

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36 A JUROR: Do you think that he would remember that it's from you? I mean, you know, I don't know, but do you think he would?

THE WITNESS: Ties were a big issue with us and I used to bug him all the time on the phone, "Well, when are

you going to wear one of my ties?" You know. Or he'd say, '# Did you see -- I1 On one occasion, I remember specifically he said, "Did you see I wore your tie the other day?"

There's a pretty big correlation between the times when he would wear one of my ties and we either spoke the night before or that night.

And I used to say to him that "1 like it when you wear my ties because then I know I'm close to your heart." so -- literally and figuratively.

A JUROR: So you think he would know, then, that that was your tie.

THE WITNESS: He should know. A JUROR: Which brings to mind when the first appearance by Nel, when he came testify --

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: Can you tell me what your thoughts were when you saw the pictures of Nelvis wearing the first tie that you gave the President?

THE WITNESS: Yes. Actually, you know what? I think my cup's leaking. I'm sorry.

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A JUROR: Do we have another cup up there? THE WITNESS: Am I allowed to know people's names in here?

MR. EMMICK: The answer to that is no.

THE WITNESS: Oh -- MR. EMMICK: I know it seems -- THE WITNESS: It's so awkward. MR. EMMICK: It does seem awkward, but I think it's better if --

THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICK: -- the record not have any identifications.

THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICK: We didn't intentionally get you a dribble glass.

THE WITNESS: Oh, sure. At least it's water and not grape juice.

I had two very different thoughts. My first thought was "You jerk. You're trying to show me how little you care about me and how little this meant to you by giving it -- to show me that you gave it to someone else, it meant so little to you now."

And my second thought was that it was sort of some sort of message of some sorts. I don't know what. Because I could see the President kind of saying to Nel, you know, "Oh,

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why don't you -- II I could even see him spilling something on Nel on purpose and -- that morning and then sort of saying, "Oh, here, just wear this tie," or something like that. I mean, that's -- it's -- he's funny that way. But I thought there was some sort of deliberateness to it.

I don't know that Nel knew that, that that was the tie I gave the President but -- I don't think it was a coincidence.

MR. EMMICK: Yes, ma'am? A JUROR: Could one of your thoughts perhaps have been that maybe he just gave him a batch of ties to Nelvis? And maybe he didn't remember?

THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: You really think he would have remembered that first tie?

THE WITNESS: I know he did. I mean, we -- we -- that was -- 1 don't know if you all know this -or not, but I - worked in a men's necktie store when I was in college for four years and so that was my thing, that was part -- you know, my spending money, a lot of it came from working. And so I love ties.

And I -- I mean, I can pick out -- you know, different designers and stuff. And so that was a big thing for me. And then -- and I liked to give him ties and I liked to see him wearing them.

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A JUROR: Do you know how much impact Nel had on what the President wore each day?

THE WITNESS: None. To my understanding. Nel was. My understanding is that Nel's strictly in the -- while he would go to the residence on occasions, that he was usually in the oval area.

MR. EMMICK: There's a question waiting for a bit here. Yes.

A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, was it the President's nature to give his ties away?

THE WITNESS: Yes. I knew that -- 1 knew that he had given Nel ties, his ties in the past. But ties were such a big issue between the President and me that I really couldn't have imagined that he didn't -- that he didn't know.

A JUROR: Other people other than Nel as well, in terms of giving his ties away?

THE WITNESS: I don't know. A JUROR: Okay. You just -- THE WITNESS: I'm not aware of anyone else, but that doesn't mean there aren't.

A JUROR: Okay. THE WITNESS: Right. A JUROR: But you did know about that. THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: Do you happen to know whether the

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40 President had a valet to assist him in his dressing?

THE WITNESS: Assist him in his dressing, I don't know. I know that there's a valet.

A JUROR: Or like prepare -- Mr. President, this suit goes with this tie, kind of thing?

THE WITNESS: I don't know that necessarily, but I have seen -- 1 had seen evidence enough that he could wear my ties when he wanted to. You know. That if he wanted to, he could go pick it out, so I don't know what his getting dressed routine is.

A JUROR: Okay. Thank you. A JUROR: Okay. I have a question that's a bit on the delicate side.

THE WITNESS: Okay. A JUROR: But this is just something that I need to know.

THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: Did you and the President ever engage in sexual relations using cigars?

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: Okay. A JUROR: Okay. I'd like to change the subject now.

THE WITNESS: Thank you. Just once. Just once. A JUROR: When you last testified, you told us that

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photographs that you saw of the President and First Lady when they were away that were romantic in nature upset you.

When you had an opportunity to speak with the President about those photographs or any film that was taken during these romantic moments, what did he say? Why they were -- because I'm just curious as to whether or not they were staged because of the legal things that were going on with the President at that time.

THE WITNESS: Right. I don't believe we discussed them. I know that that upset me and sort of put me in a bit of a contentious mood when I spoke with him on the 5th. I think it was the 5th of January of this year. And I may have said something in passing about them, but we didn't have a discussion about the pictures.

were -- about his

A JUROR: Okay. I was just wondering if there THE WITNESS: Sure. No. I wondered, too. A JUROR: Did you think any conversations to him wife were inappropriate? THE WITNESS: I don't know if inappropriate is the right word. I tried not to. I -- there were very few discussions and I tended to say things like, "Well, when you're alone," you know, I'Call me when you're alone," kind of a thing or, you know, that was how we discussed sort of Mrs. Clinton maybe not being there, was, "Well, I'll be alone

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42 on this day. Shall I -- II I think we were careful -- or I was careful, I know I was.

MR. EMMICK: Yes, ma'am? A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, I wondered if you ever had any trouble with the Secret Service in trying to be near the President.

THE WITNESS: No. The only time that I remember was when I went to see him on the last time in '96, I guess it was April 7th, Easter. And when John Muskett was outside and he said he was going to check with Evelyn if I could go in and then I don't remember exactly how it happened, but I sort of -- I don't remember the exact discussion, but it ended up he ended up not talking to Evelyn and I went in. so --

A JUROR: I have a question about Linda Tripp. THE WITNESS: Ugh. Sorry. A JUROR: In your conversations with Ms. Tripp, - was her opinion always that she must be truthful or was there a time where your impression was that she was going to provide you with cooperation as far as keeping the secrecy?

THE WITNESS: There are two areas of that, I guess. Linda always told me she would always protect me and she would never tell anybody and keep my secret, up until the Paula Jones case came about.

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And I had never had any reason to think that she would ever need to discuss this under oath because I was certainly always going to deny it and I couldn't even imagine a situation where that would really come up.

But there was a point in the period prior to my learning about her being subpoenaed in the Paula Jones case, most specifically, January 9th, when she led me to believe that she was not going to tell about my relationship and that she was going to be vague on the truth about Kathleen Willey and was just not going to really remember anything else and that was why I agreed to meet with her on Tuesday the 13th.

A JUROR: In your conversations with her as you were making your move to move to New York and what have you, did you ever get the sense that she was fishing for offers of benefits or the protection of her job? You know, or where she was hoping that nothing would affect her job or if there was something in it for her?

THE WITNESS: Yes and no. When you asked me the question, the first thing that comes to my mind was it may not be directly related to that.

When the Kathleen Willey incident had come out in Newsweek, there was a period after it, Bob Bennett had referred to -- or had made that comment about Linda Tripp and she made some off- comment about if she loses her job she's going to write a tell- all book.

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44 And so I sort of -- that was an instance where I felt I needed to assure her that that wasn't going to happen, she wasn't going to lose her job, and that -- I certainly tried to make assurances. I mean, I -- I promised -- I would have promised her the moon if I could deliver it.

And then also -- then when I spoke with her on the 9th, she talked about that she had spent some time in New York during Christmas and that she -- that someone had suggested to her that she get a job doing public relations in New York.

And that seemed a little bit strange to me, in that that was exactly what I was in the process of doing, and that maybe that was what she thought, that somehow then -- you know, I think I told her, oh, I'd try to help her come to New York and try to help her that way, but I don't know that -- that I ever said anything directly about who would help her.

A JUROR: Okay. Thank you. BY MR. EMMICK: Q I'd like to ask a clarifying follow- up because I wasn't sure I understood all of the sort of ins and outs, if you will, of when Linda was going to maintain the secret and when she was going to reveal it. It sounded like prior to the time when Linda got a Paula Jones subpoena, your understanding was she was doing to keep the secret.

A Correct.

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Q And then after she got the Paula Jones subpoena, then she told you that she was going to disclose things and tell the truth. Is that right?

A Yes. Yes.

Q Okay. And then in this conversation on January 9th, she indicated some willingness to consider keeping the secret a bit longer.

A No, considered that she was going to do that.

Q That she was going to. All right. That's what I wanted to clarify.

A Sure.

MR. EMMICK: Thank you. A JUROR: When you said that in your conversations with Linda Tripp you kind of had to exaggerate some things about the President to her, you exaggerated on some of the things you said to her about the President --

THE WITNESS: I'm not sure about that. I -- I don't know if exaggerate is the right -- is maybe the word I would choose.

A JUROR: Okay. THE WITNESS: But go on. I'm sorry. A JUROR: Well, no, I just used that word. THE WITNESS: Okay. A JUROR: Exaggerate. You didn't use it, but I couldn't think of the exact words you used.

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46 THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: But were you -- why do you think that you had to not tell her some things that din actually happen, true things, in talking to her?

THE WITNESS: That really came about in relation to the Paula Jones case. I think that I was -- there were some occasions, one in particular that I remember, when I didn't disclose a contact that I had with the President -- I'm sorry, here -- I'll scoot over -- contact that I had with the President to her for some reasons, but after the Paula Jones case, I was scared to death. I mean, I was panicked that she was going to tell.

So, I mean, I -- I -- you know, along the lines of, you know, some of the things I said about Mr. Jordan, I said, you know, "Oh, the President told me I have to lie," I don't even remember everything I said, but I know that there were certainly lies at that point, not even exaggerations.

MR. EMMICK: Actually, I was going to ask that clarifying follow- up to that.

THE FOREPERSON: And then after that, we have to take a break.

MR. EMMICK: And then we'll take a break. BY MR. EMMICK: Q The clarifying follow- up was that I had understood that during that January period when you were talking to

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Linda Tripp you were lying to her on occasion, but I wasn't clear whether those lies related to times that you had been with the President or whether they related to other things generally. Do you understand what my question is?

A No.

Q What were the nature of the lies that you were telling to Linda Tripp during that January period?

A Oh, gosh. They went from -- I guess a non- disclosure of my meeting with him on the 28th, nor my phone call with him on the 5th of January, to -- ranging to things that he said I had to do or told me to do.

I haven't -- 1 haven't seen transcripts of those

days, thank goodness, but I just know that I was -- I was scared to death. And I thought any influence that anybody would have, my mother, Mr. Jordan, the President, anybody, would -- I used.

MR. EMMICK: All right. THE FOREPERSON: It's break time. MR. EMMICK: Break time. THE FOREPERSON: It's break time. It's break time. A JUROR: I have a follow- up to that as well. THE FOREPERSON: Okay. So we're going to take ten minutes.

THE WITNESS: Okay. THE FOREPERSON: And we'll come back.

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A JUROR: I hope I remember my question. THE WITNESS: Can you guys call me Monica? Are they allowed to call me Monica instead of Ms. Lewinsky? I was just --

THE FOREPERSON: If you say so. THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICK: Sure. THE WITNESS: A JUROR: But whether you're 25 or 28

THE WITNESS: I'm just 25. Please.

you'll always be Ms. or -- Not if I get married

Lewinsky, (Witness excused. Witness recalled.) THE FOREPERSON: Monica, I'd like to remind that you are still under oath.

THE WITNESS: Thank you. MR. EMMICK: We have a quorum and there are no unauthorized persons present. Is that right? -

THE FOREPERSON: You are absolutely correct. MR. EMMICK: Lucky this time. THE WITNESS: Thank you. MR. EMMICK: Did you want to ask some follow- up questions?

MS. IMMERGUT: Yes. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Ms. Lewinsky, there are two things I wanted to

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clarify. First, with respect to the tie disclosure issue -- A Yes.

Q -- you were asked about before, I believe you mentioned something to the effect that there have been things that have come out of your team that you were surprised about before. Are you referring to your current legal team?

A No. My first legal team. Q Okay. And that's Mr. Ginsberg? A Yes.

Q Okay. You're not aware of any unauthorized disclosures from your current camp?

A No. Nor have I authorized any disclosures.

Q Okay. So you didn't authorize a disclosure about the tie.

A No.

Q With respect to -- to switch gears -- to what we were speaking about right before the break about the things - that you said to Linda Tripp at the very end, particularly on January 13, 1998, I believe --

A Yes.

Q You mentioned that an example of things that you were not truthful about was, for example, the fact you had seen the President on December 28th and that you had spoken to him on January 5th. Is that correct?

A Right. Yes. And I didn't disclose that to her.

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Q Right. You did not disclose that to her. A Quite to the contrary.

Q Okay. In fact, you told her that you hadn't seen or spoken to the President for two months.

A Or since the 17th of December.

Q Okay. A Exactly.

Q You mentioned that there was -- you also said things about what the President had said to you to Ms. Tripp that were not true on January 13th. Do you remember any specific things that you said that the President had told you that in fact were not true?

A No. I don't remember any specifics, I just wanted to leave open the possibility. Does that clarify it?

MR. EMMICK: On the right here? A JUROR: Monica, why did you keep that black dress?

A JUROR: Blue. A JUROR: Blue dress. A JUROR: Did you have a reason to keep it? THE WITNESS: Pardon? A JUROR: The blue dress. A JUROR: The blue dress. THE WITNESS: No. I didn't have a reason. The -- reason -- the dress -- I didn't realize -- if I remember

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correctly, I didn't really realize that there was anything on it until I went to go wear it again and I had gained too much weight that I couldn't fit into it.

And it seemed sort of funny and I -- it may sound silly, I have a lot of clothes. I don't clean all my clothes right after I wear them, I usually don't clean them until I know I'm going to wear them again. And then I was going to wear it for Thanksgiving because I had lost weight and I had -- 1 had shown the dress to Linda at that point and had just sort of said to her, "Well, isn't this -- 'I You know, "Isn't this stupid?" Or, you know, "Look at this, isn't this gross?" Or whatever. said.

And she told deposit box because it

I don't really remember exactly what I me that I should put it in a safe could be evidence one day. And I said that was ludicrous because I would never -- 1 would never disclose that I had a relationship with the President, I would never need it.

And then when Thanksgiving time came around and I told her that I was going to wear it for Thanksgiving, she told me I looked fat in the dress, I shouldn't wear it. She brought me a jacket from her closet as to try to persuade me not to wear the dress.

So I ended up not wearing it and then I was going to clean it. I took it with me up to New York and was going

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to clean it up there and then this broke, so -- A JUROR: Okay. Your relationship with the President, did your mother at any time try to discourage the relationship?

THE WITNESS: Oh, yes. A JUROR: Well, what kept it going? I mean, what kept it -- you keeping it active or whatever?

THE WITNESS: I fell in love. A JUROR: I beg your pardon? I couldn't hear you. THE WITNESS: I fell in love. A JUROR: When you look at it now, was it love or a sexual obsession?

THE WITNESS: More love with a little bit of obsession. But definitely love.

A JUROR: Did you think that the President was in love with you also?

THE WITNESS: There was an occasion- when I left the White House and I was pretty stunned at how I felt because I did think that.

A JUROR: You did? BY MR. EMMICK: Q Do you remember the date? A It was July 4, 1997.

A JUROR: Were you aware that he was having problems in his marriage? Did this ever spill over in the

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1 times that you were together? Did you get a feeling that

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f 25 THE WITNESS: Before Monday, I would have said yes. something was not right, that --

THE WITNESS: A JUROR: 3 THE WITNESS: A JUROR: - THE WITNESS: A JUROR: __

MR. EMMICK: I thought there was a question in the front here.

A JUROR: And today, Monica, do you still love the President?

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A JUROR: So then it is no? THE WITNESS: I don't know how I feel right now. MR. EMMICK: A'question in the front? A JUROR: I guess I would like to know what happened Monday to make you just by Thursday change your mind so completely.

THE WITNESS: I don't think it's so much changed my mind. I think -- it's -- it was very painful for me to watch his speech on Monday night. I __ it's __ it's hard for me to feel that he has characterized this relationship as a service contract and that that was never something that I ever thought it was. And --

A JUROR: I'm sorry, you lost me already. THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. I'm sorry. It's -- from my understanding about what he testified to on Monday, not -- just from the press accounts, is that this was a -- that this was a service contract, that all I did was perform oral sex on him and that that's all that'. this relationship was. And it was a lot more than that to me and I thought it was a lot more than that.

And I think I felt -- I was hurt that -- that he didn't even -- sort of acknowledge me in his remarks. And even also -- I mean, that has to do with directly with me, but I thought he should have acknowledged all the other people that have gone through a lot of pain for seven months.

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55 I feel very responsible for a lot of what's happened, you know, in the seven months, but I tried -- I tried very hard to do what I could to not -- to not hurt him. I'm still not answering your question.

A JUROR: Well, let's -- you said the relationship was more than oral sex. I mean, it wasn't like you went out on dates or anything like that like normal people, so what more was it?

THE WITNESS: Oh, we spent hours on the phone talking. It was emotional.

A JUROR: Phone sex? THE WITNESS: Not always. On a few occasions. I mean, we were talking. I mean, interacting. I mean, talking about what we were thinking and feeling and doing and laughing.

We were very broke the relationship

affectionate, even when -- after he off in May, I mean, when I'd go to visit with him, we'd -- you know, we'd hug each other a lot. You know, he always used to like to stroke my hair. He -- we'd hold hands. We'd smile a lot. We discussed a variety -- you know, a wide range of things.

So, I mean, it was -- there was a real component of a relationship to it and I just -- I thought he had a beautiful soul. I just thought he was just this incredible person and when I looked at him I saw a little boy and -- I

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56 don't know what the truth is any more.

And that's, I think, what I took away on Monday, was that I didn't know what the truth was. And so how could I know the truth of my love for someone if it was based on him being an actor.

A JUROR: I'd like to ask you about Bayani Nelvis. THE WITNESS: Okay. A JUROR: How much about your relationship with the President did Bayani Nelvis know?

THE WITNESS: I think he knew that -- that we were friends and that I would come to see the President and I gave him things. I don't know -- I don't remember ever getting into any specific details. Might he have thought that from -- you know, from how much I kind of liked the President? I'm not sure.

But -- and I don't mean this in a racist way, you know, Nel's from another country and so his English is -- - while his English is good, it's not perfect, not that anyone's is perfect, so I think that sometimes there was a little bit of a language barrier there, too, so I think he -- you know, Nel was just a -- is a really nice guy. He's a sweet guy and he -- he's very loyal to the President.

A JUROR: Did you ever tell him at any time that you loved the President?

THE WITNESS: I don't think so, but I might have,

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but I don't think so. A JUROR: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: Yes? A question? A JUROR: You just mentioned real components, the relationship was -- like a real component, you mentioned things like truth. But sometimes I go back and forth not understanding because you yourself were living a lot of secrets, a lot of lies, a lot of paranoia, but yet you wanted truth, a real component?

I'm not understanding these two different things because one time you're sentimental but then again you do just the opposite of what you say you're thinking.

Did you ever think that nothing real could come of this relationship?

THE WITNESS: Did I ever thing nothing real -- A JUROR: Anything real, that anything real could -- and truthful and honest could have come from this relationship?

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: With this married man? THE WITNESS: I did. A JUROR: But I have a question for you about that. THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: It's been reported in the papers that you had a relationship before similar to this, where a lot of

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hurt and pain came out of this, you know, a lot of hurt and pain toward a family.

And then you turn around and you do it again. You're young, you're vibrant, I can't figure out why you keep going after things that aren't free, that aren't obtainable.

THE WITNESS: Well, there's sort of two parts to that and just to clarify, the -- the way Andy and Kate Bleiler portrayed everything on TV and through their lawyer was pretty inaccurate, so I don't know how much of that is part of your question.

A JUROR: The only part I know is that he was a married man with a wife and a family.

THE WITNESS: That's true. A JUROR: Like I know about the President. THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: He was a married man and it wasn't no secret of that fact. But yet you want to talk about truth, a - real component, honesty. It all seems so -- like a fantasy. That's why I asked you earlier about obsession.

THE WITNESS: That's a hard question to answer because obviously there's -- there's work that I need to do on myself. There are obviously issues that -- that -- you know, a single young woman doesn't have an affair with a married man because she's normal, quote- unquote. But I think most people have issues and that's just how mine manifested

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themselves. It's something I need to work on and I don't think it's right, it's not right to have an affair with a married man. I never expected to fall in love with the President. I was surprised that I did.

And I didn't -- my intention had really been to come to Washington and start over and I didn't want to have another affair with a married man because it was really painful. It was horrible. And I feel even worse about it now.

A JUROR: Monica, I'd like to change the topic, if I can.

THE WITNESS: Did I answer -- A JUROR: Yes. THE WITNESS: Okay. A JUROR: And I also -- I want to let you know that we're not here to judge you in any way, I think many of us - feel that way.

THE WITNESS: I appreciate that. But I understand that every -- you know, this is -- this is a topic that -- there are a lot of people think it's wrong and I think it's wrong, too. I understand that.

A JUROR: I had to ask that you question because I've had to ask other questions and it wouldn't have been right for me not to ask you the question --

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60 THE WITNESS: Sure. A JUROR: -- that I've had to ask -- THE WITNESS: I think it's fair and I think you should -- I think it's a fair question. It's a hard one to answer. No one likes to have their weaknesses splayed out for the entire world, you know, but I understand that. And I'd rather you understand where I'm coming from, you know, and you'd probably have to know me better and know my whole journey to how I got here from birth to now to really understand it. I don't even understand it. But -- I understand. I respect your having to ask that question and I appreciate what you're saying, whatever your name is.

A JUROR: We're here only to assess the credibility of your testimony.

THE WITNESS: Sure. But I -- 1 can see how that would be a factor.

A JUROR: I wanted to go back to the issue of ties. It's my understanding that you testified earlier this morning that your agreement, your immunity agreement, with the Office of the Independent Counsel includes an understanding that you -- that you and your legal team need prior approval to disseminate information to the press.

THE WITNESS: Mm- hmm. A JUROR: And in looking over Exhibit ML- 2, I don't see that provision. Can you look at that?

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THE WITNESS: Is that my agreement? A JUROR: Yes. THE WITNESS: Sure.

MR. EMMICK: Sure. THE WITNESS: I know that portion of it very well. A JUROR: I may be missing something. THE WITNESS: There have been many times I've wanted to defend myself and the lies that have been spewed

out.

MR. EMMICK: I think the reference is to part 1B. A JUROR: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: Where it says "Will not make any statements -- " "Neither Ms. Lewinsky nor her agents will make any statements about this matter to witnesses, subjects, or targets of the OIC's investigation or their agents or to representatives of the news media without first obtaining the OIC's approval."

A JUROR: Okay. Thank you. THE WITNESS: Sure. MR. EMMICK: Other questions? Yes, ma'am? A JUROR: I'd also like to return for a minute -- if you have that package out -- to something that was discussed this morning, earlier this morning, and that refers to your proffer. Do you have a copy of the proffer? The proffer?

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MR. EMMICK: We do. Sure. THE WITNESS: Okay. MR. EMMICK: I'm placing Exhibit ML- 1 before the witness.

THE WITNESS: Thank you. A JUROR: Monica, if you could look at paragraph II, I'm not sure what page it is, but it's paragraph 11.

THE WITNESS: Okay. Yes. Okay. A JUROR: As I understood our discussion this morning, you said that you offered to deny the relationship and the President didn't discourage you, but said something like llThat's good."

As I read your proffer here, it says "The President told Ms. L to deny a relationship if ever asked." And that seems to me slightly different.

THE WITNESS: I forgot this. So that's true. A JUROR: Is this proffer statement correct, that - he did tell you to deny a relationship?

THE WITNESS: Yes. I don't -- I don't -- when I answered the question earlier, that was what first came to my mind. But, I mean, I know that this is true.

I just at that point -- and I -- really reading it, I know it's true because I was truthful in my proffer, but sitting here right now, I can't remember exactly when it was, but it was something that was certainly discussed between us.

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A JUROR: And what about the next sentence also? Something to the effect that if two people who are involved

63 say it didn't happen, saying that to you?

THE WITNESS it didn't happen. Do you recall him

Sitting here today, very vaguely. I can hear -- 1 have a weird -- I'll explain to you guys that I have a weird sense of -- for me, my saying I remember something, if I can see it in my mind's eye or I can hear him saying it to me, then I feel pretty comfortable saying that that's pretty accurate, that I remember that. And I can hear his voice saying that to me, I just can't place it.

A JUROR: Is it -- THE WITNESS: And this was -- I mean, this was early -- this was all throughout our relationship. I mean, it was -- obviously not something that we discussed too often, I think, because it was -- it's a somewhat unpleasant thought of having to deny it, having it even come to that point, but --

A JUROR: Is it possible that you also had these discussions after you learned that you were a witness in the Paula Jones case?

THE WITNESS: I don't believe so. No. A JUROR: Can you exclude that possibility? THE WITNESS: I pretty much can. I really don't remember it. I mean, it would be very surprising to me to be

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64 confronted with something that would show me different, but I -- it was 2: 30 in the -- I mean, the conversation I'm thinking of mainly would have been December 17th, which was --

A JUROR: The telephone call. THE WITNESS: Right. And it was -- you know, 2: 00, 2: 30 in the morning. I remember the gist of it and I -- I really don't think so.

A JUROR: Thank you. A JTJROR: I have some questions about the Paula Jones lawsuit. Going back to the period before you even had any idea that you might be a witness in that, did you follow the Paula Jones lawsuit fairly closely?

THE WITNESS: I followed it. I don't know "fairly closely," but -- I think it maybe depended more on was there something in the paper and that happened to be a day that I sat and read all the papers because I had nothing to do.

I did follow it, but I wasn't -- I didn't follow it as much as I follow this case. I mean, in terms of -- no, but I mean, I'm just saying as a gauge, you know.

A JUROR: So you were holding down a full- time job and everything at that time, but you did read the papers --

THE WITNESS: I did read the papers every day and it was -- sure, I followed it. I didn't know the ins and outs of it, but I followed it.

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65 A JUROR: Did you -- in that period again, even before anyone knew that you would be a witness, did you discuss that with the President? Was he aware that you followed it? Was that something --

THE WITNESS: No. Really, the time that I remember we discussed it was on the 17th.

A JUROR: December 17th? THE WITNESS: And when I told him my sort of stupid idea for how he should settle it. So that was -- but, no. He wasn't -- we didn't -- I -- and I think in general just give you guys a flavor, because there have been different subjects that have come up, when we spent time together, I know I certainly made an effort -- unless I was angry with

him about something, that there were topics that I wanted to stay away from and the time that I spent with him was precious to me. So things that were unpleasant I didn't bring up unless I had to.

A JUROR: Exactly what date again did you get your subpoena to be a witness?

THE WITNESS: The 19th of December. A JUROR: The 19th? Okay. Now, when -- and if you

could retell for me the conversation you had with the President about the gifts.

THE WI~ ESS: Okay. It was December 28th and I was there to get my Christmas gifts from him. Excuse me. I'm

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66 sorry. And we spent maybe about five minutes or so, not very long, talking about the case. And I said to him, "Well, do you think -- "

What I mentioned -- I said to him that it had really alarmed me about the hat pin being in the subpoena and I think he said something like, "Oh," you know, "that sort of bothered me, too. That bothered me," you know, "That bothers me." Something like that.

And at one point, I said, "Well, do you think I should -- U I don't think I said "get rid of," I said, "But do you think I should put away or maybe give to Betty or give to someone the gifts?"

And he -- I don't remember his response. I think it was something like, "1 don't know," or "Hmm" or -- there really was no response.

I know that I didn't leave the White House with any notion of what I should do with them, that I should do anything different than that they were sitting in my house. And then later I got the call from Betty.

A JUROR: Now, did you bring up Betty's name or did the President bring up Betty's name?

THE WITNESS: I think I brought it up. The President wouldn't have brought up Betty's name because he really didn't -- he didn't really discuss it, so either I brought up Betty's name, which I think is probably what

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happened, because I remember not being too, too shocked when Betty called.

Somewhat surprised, I guess, that he hadn't said -- you know, it would have seemed easier to sort of have said something maybe then, but I wasn't too surprised when she called.

A JUROR: Thank you. MR. BMMICK: I think there was a question in the front. Did you have a question?

MS. I~ ERG~: Did you have a question? A JUROR: Yes. Back to the contacts? THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: On page 7, on the 29th of March -- THE WITNESS: On the -- sorry, what date? A JUROR: The 29th of March. Sunday.

MR. EMMICK: Then 29th of March. THE WITNESS: Okay. A JUROR: "Private encounter, approximately 1: 30 or 2: OO p. m., study. President on crutches. Physical intimacy including oral sex to completion and brief direct genital contact." Brief direct genital contact, could you just elaborate on that a bit?

THE WITNESS: Uh -- A JUROR: I understand -- THE WITNESS: Oh, my gosh. This is so

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embarrassing. A JUROR: You could close your eyes and talk. A JUROR: We won't look at you. THE WITNESS: Can I hide under the table? Uh -- I had -- I had wanted -- I tried to -- I placed his genital next to mine and had hoped that if he -- oh -- this is just too embarrassing. I don't --

A JUROR: Did you think it would lead to intercourse?

THE WITNESS: Not on that day. A JUROR: Was that sort of the reason for doing the gesture --

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: -- or trying to -- moving his closer to yours?

THE WITNESS: Then I -- not that we would have intercourse that day, but that that might make- him want to.

A JUROR: Okay. Were you wearing clothes at the time or underwear at the time?

THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: And was he? Or his were pulled down? THE WITNESS: Correct. A JUROR: So was there direct skin- to- skin contact between. your genitals and his?

THE WITNESS: I think very briefly. It b.

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he -- he's really tall and he couldn't really bend because of his knee, so it was --

A JUROR: It was more of a grazing? THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: About how many encounters did you have in the study? If you can recall.

MR. EMMICK: What do you mean by "encounters"? A JUROR: Sexual encounters. I'm sorry. THE WITNESS: Do you include kissing or not? A JUROR: No kissing. According to the definition. THE WITNESS: Okay. Two. A JUROR: Okay. Thank you. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q And why don't you give us the dates of those. A The -- well, let me look. The 29th of March and the 28th of February. There might have been -- I mean, in terms of the clothes and stuff, there might have been playful touches here and there, but not -- nothing that I would have considered sexual encounters.

Q And that's not listed as an intimate encounter? A No. No, it's not. No, it's not.

Q And just to clarify again, are those the two times that the President actually came to completion during the oral sex?

A Yes.

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BY MR. EMMICK:

Q And I'm actually obliged to ask one follow up that I don't think will be too bad, but directing your attention to August 16th, did you attempt to touch the President on that day?

A Yes.

Q And did you actually touch him? In his groin area? A Over his clothes.

Q Over his clothes. And did he say that's not -- "We can't do that"?

A Yes.

MR. EMMICK: Okay. A JUROR: Did you feel any rejection the times that he wouldn't go all the way with you?

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: Monica, I had one question to go back to the gifts. You had said that the President had called you initially to come get your Christmas gift, you had gone there, you had a talk, et cetera, and there was no -- you expressed concern, the President really didn't say anything. How much later in the afternoon did you get a call from Betty? It was that same day, is that correct?

THE WITNESS: Yes, that's correct. Let me just clarify real quickly that I had made the arrangements to go there on Sunday through Betty, just that you had said he

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71 called me.

A JUROR: So you had initiated the contact on that day?

THE WITNESS: He had -- he had told me on the 17th that he -- you know, he still had these Christmas gifts for me and then -- just shortly after Christmas and I called Betty and said, you know, "He said he had something for me," something like that, you know. And then she arranged it. So I just wanted to clarify.

A JUROR: And then how much of a time gap -- THE WITNESS: A few hours, maybe. A JUROR: A few hours? THE WITNESS: Maybe -- I think it was around 2: 00 p. m. or so, around 2: 00 in the afternoon, and I had gone there at 8: 30 in the morning and left -- I'd say maybe four or five hours time span.

A JUROR: So what exactly happened? - You went home and you packaged these gifts? Or had you already had them packaged?

THE WITNESS: No. I went home and I -- I think I went to New York that evening, possibly, so I was getting ready to go to New York, I think, or something.

But when Betty called, then she said, you know, "1 understand you have something to give me." It was very vague. And I understood -- I mean, to me, that meant from

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this conversation that we had had that I should sort of -- you know, give some of the gifts.

So I put them all out on my bed and -- it's sort of been difficult to kind of explain why I put some things in and why I didn't put others in.

The things that seemed to be directly called for in the subpoena, I put in a box: the hat pin, the dress from Martha's Vineyard, some of the pictures and things, the ad to him from Valentine's Day. Not that that was directly called for, but some of the more intimate -- I guess personal things, except that I kept the "Leaves of Grass" book because that just -- I was worried, I didn't know if I would get the gifts back or not, ever, and so I -- that just -- that meant the most to me of anything he gave me.

A JUROR: And I believe your testimony last time was that you did not believe that Betty knew the contents of the package?

THE WITNESS: I don't believe so. A JUROR: She just came and picked them up and that was it?

THE WITNESS: We chit- chatted for a little bit. She was on the way to see her mom in the hospital, so I got her a small plant to just take to her mom and --

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Did she seem at all confused when you handed over

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the box? A No.

Q Did she ask you what was in it? A No. Not that I remember. I don't believe so.

MS. IMMERGDT: Thank you. A JUROR: And just to back up for a second on your conversation with the President that you already discussed a little bit where you said you were concerned about the subpoena and some of the items that it called for such as the hat pin which indeed the President had given you, you testified previously, I believe, that the President said he was concerned about that also when he saw the hat pin. Is that correct?

THE WITNESS: I don't know that he saw -- I don't know that he saw the hat pin on the -- I don't know that he saw the subpoena, so -- I know that the hat pin was a concern to him.

A JUROR: Okay. Do you remember what he said in response when you said you were concerned about the things called for in the subpoena?

THE WITNESS: I think he said something like "That concerned me, too."

A JUROR: Okay. THE WITNESS: So I don't know if he saw it or someone -- you know, I don't know he learned that.

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A JUROR: Okay. But- he appeared to have some prior knowledge of --

THE WITNESS: I think so. I think so. A JUROR: I have another question about that conversation on the 28th. You had already discussed with him earlier the subpoena and the fact that all of your gifts from him were under subpoena and then --

THE WITNESS: We hadn't discussed that. I wasn't -- I hadn't -- the 28th was the first time that I saw him or spoke to him since I had been subpoenaed. When he called me on the 17th, I wasn't yet subpoenaed.

A JUROR: Okay. Okay. So that conversation took place on the 28th?

THE WITNESS: Correct. The only conversation about gifts and the subpoena, really -- yes.

A JUROR: And on that same day, he gave you Christmas gifts.

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: What was your thinking at that time about that? Did that concern you or --

THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: No? THE WITNESS: I was -- A JUROR: Did you -- what did you plan to do with those gifts? Did it cross your mind that some -- that you

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should maybe give some of them to your attorney as responsive to the subpoena or --

THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: No? MR. EMMICK: I have a quick clarifying question because you said that the only conversation you had with him about gifts after the subpoena was on the 28th. You also had a conversation with him on the 5th that related to the later gift of the book, if I remember it right.

THE WITNESS: Right. I meant my gifts that he gave to me.

MR. EMMICK: Right. Right. Right. I just wanted to clarify that.

THE WITNESS: Okay. Sure. MR. EMMICK: Other questions? A JUROR: Going back to your conversation with Linda Tripp --

MR. EMMICK: Which one? THE WITNESS: Yes. Which tape are you referring to?

A JUROR: No, I'm just going to be general. MR. EMMICK: Okay.

A JUROR: If you had to put it like percentage- wise, what you told her as being truthful and not truthful, what percentage will be not truthful?

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THE WITNESS: I would say before the subpoena, before I found out she had been subpoenaed, so for argument's sake maybe saying before December of '97, I'd say 95 percent accurate. There were some things that I didn't tell her, but I usually pretty much told her everything.

A JUROR: You started talking to her when? In '95 or '96?

THE WITNESS: I first told her -- when I first told her about the relationship or when I started talking to her as a person?

A JUROR: The relationship. THE WITNESS: The relationship, I told her in November of '96. After the election.

A JUROR: Okay. So from November '96 to December '97 --

THE WITNESS: Pretty truthful. A JUROR: And then after '97? THE WITNESS: Oh -- BY MR. EMMICK:

Q Could I ask just one clarifying matter about that answer? Because you had said that it was 95 percent accurate and then you also said because sometimes I didn't tell her everything. And I just want to make sure we're being clear on whether you're talking about being complete or being accurate.

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77 In other words, are you not telling her things or are you saying things to her that are inaccurate, sort of in that 5 percent, if you will?

A Well, I don't remember the exact situations or the times that I didn't tell her something, if she had asked me about it, I would have been inaccurate about what I said.

Q All right. I see. A So --

Q So there's kind of a blending of those two concepts.

A Correct.

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q And, again, to clarify, did you ever lie about your sexual relationship with the President?

A NO.

MR. EMMICK: I'm sorry. I interrupted. I didn't mean to.

A JUROR: So after '97, then -- THE WITNESS: After December '97, I don't even know how to -- how to put a percentage to that.

A JUROR: Any truth at all after '97? THE WITNESS: Yes. There were some truths in December of '97. There certainly were some true statements, but there were a lot of untrue statements. Probably the untrue statements stick out in my mind more because they

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caused so much trouble. A JUROR: Which ones stick out in your mind as having been untruthful?

THE WITNESS: Stuff about my mom. Just -- a lot of different things about my mom. That I had -- that I told Mr. Jordan I wouldn't sign the affidavit until I got a job. That was definitely a lie, based on something Linda had made me promise her on January 9th. Some of the other things --

A JUROR: Did you tell Linda Tripp at any time that you had heard or understood that people don't go to jail for perjury in a civil case?

THE WITNESS: Yes, I believe -- I think I said that.

A JUROR: Did anybody tell you that? THE WITNESS: Well, hmm. A JUROR: Do you want to talk to -- I know there's -- is there an attorney issue there?

THE WITNESS: There's an attorney issue. A JUROR: I see. MR. EMMICK: Do you want to take a break and talk about the attorney issue? Because I think that may be a way to figure out if we can answer that question any more fully.

THE WITNESS: Do you want me to go talk to my attorney?

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MR. EMMICK: Well, I just think it might be -- I think your attorney would like it if he were to talk to you.

THE WITNESS: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: That's the way to answer it. THE WITNESS: Okay. So just to be clear, you're -- A JUROR: Well, maybe I can help. Just -- if I could confine it to did anyone other than your attorney ever suggest to you that perjury in a civil case would not be prosecuted?

THE WITNESS: Uh -- MS. IMMERGUT: If you need to talk to your attorney, go ahead.

A JUROR: I just thought -- did anyone other than your attorney tell you that?

THE WITNESS: No. MR. EMMICK: I think it still would be advisable to have a more complete answer, to at least let them talk.

THE WITNESS: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: Yes. THE WITNESS: Excuse me. (The witness was excused to confer with counsel.) MR. EMMICK: Do we have a quorum? THE FOREPERSON: Yes, we do. MR. EMMICK: And are there any unauthorized persons present?

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THE FOREPERSON: Not a one. MR. EMMICK: All right. THE WITNESS: And I'm still under oath. THE FOREPERSON: Yes, you are. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q And just to clarify a couple of things that were right before the break, when you sort of asserted a privilege or had some questions about whether there was a privilege, I did want to ask you just to clarify that with respect to the statement about your lawyer having -- or somebody telling you whether or not you can be charged with perjury in a civil case, just to be clear, did Mr. Jordan ever tell you that?

A No.

Q Did Mr. Carter ever tell you that? A No.

Q And otherwise, I think the question was was it another attorney and I believe that you would like to assert the attorney- client privilege.

A JUROR: No, I think I excluded attorneys from my question.

THE WITNESS: Okay. You know, can I just address -- 1 think sort of the -- one of the questions that you had asked me before and I just -- about --

A JUROR: Myself? THE WITNESS: Yes. That you had asked me about the

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al relationship and being untruthful and things like that. And I just -- this is something that's sort of been on my mind since this whole thing started.

I have never -- I don't -- I certainly believe I have ever told a lie to hurt anybody, that I sort of -- some of the ways in which I grew up, it was -- there were secrets and inherent in a secret is a lie and so I just -- you know, I -- I just thought I'd tell you that.

A JUROR: Okay.

MR. EMMICK: Other questions? A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, we're going to try, because we feel that we have been jumping around and you've done a very good job of sort of jumping from topic to topic, we're going to try to bunch our questions together around a few topics and our forelady is going to try to play traffic cop, so --

A JUROR: A little bit. No, you go ahead. This is your record. But I'll play traffic cop just a little.

A JUROR: Ms. Lewinsky, before you go into that, I just remember you saying something with Linda Tripp, you know, what was not the truth, okay? And I just remembered, was one of the things that you told her, that you gave your mother the blue dress, one of the untruths or was that true?

THE WITNESS: I don't know if I ever told Linda I gave my mom the blue dress. One of the things I did say was

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that I gave everything to my mom, so that probably included that and that was not true. I didn't give the evidence to my mom. My mom never hid the dress. She didn't know it was in New York.

A JUROR: Okay. THE WITNESS: So she didn't know anything about it. A JUROR: I've got one of those questions that goes along with what she just said.

A JUROR: Okay. Fine. That's the idea. The topic.

A JUROR: How much did your mom really know? THE WITNESS: She knew -- she knew that I was having a relationship with the President. She knew that -- she knew that I was certainly emotional about it and that it made me miserable a lot and that sometimes I was elated and sometimes I was miserable, but I didn't -- you know, I -- I might have said something to her like, "We fooled around," but I -- not -- she didn't know as much as I led Linda to believe she knew. Is that --

A JUROR: Yes. THE WITNESS: Okay. A JUROR: Okay. Any other Linda Tripp questions? A JUROR: Yes, there's one. A JUROR: Did you ever suggest to Linda Tripp that she delete e- mails or anything like that from her

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A JUROR: So you did not at any time feel that your personal security was at risk from the White House or anyone in the White House?

THB WITNESS: No. I think that maybe there -- there -- maybe once or twice it had crossed my mind in some bizarre way because everybody's heard about the different -- you know, sure, there's the Marilyn Monroe theory. And so it -- but it was not -- it was not any factor of -- that related to my actions.

A JUROR: So any discussion that you had about the whole topic with Linda Tripp would fall into what you were describing before as a little bit of fabrication?

THE WITNESS: Yes. Yes. BY MR. EMMICK:

Q If I could ask a follow- up on that, did your mother ever express any concerns about your safety?

A I think she might have, but it was sort of the -- I think it was more general. It might have been a more general sense.

A JUROR: Are there any other questions about personal safety?

A JUROR: Are we still on December? December, January?

A JUROR: Yes. A JUROR: I have one follow- up question if this is

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an appropriate time about the gifts. And, again, if you have {our proffer there?

THE WITNESS: Yes.

A JUROR: At the top of page 7, where you say in tour proffer that when Ms. Currie called later that afternoon she said, at least I think you mean that she said that the President had told her Ms. L wanted her to hold on to something for her. Do you remember Betty Currie saying that the President had told her to call?

THE WITN'ESS: Right now, I don't. I don't remember, but when I wrote this, I was being truthful.

The other thing, and this is something that I was thinking about this morning in relation to the proffer, that I had written this proffer obviously being truthful, but I think that when I wrote this, it was my understanding that this was to bring me to the step of getting an immunity

_ agreement, and so I think that sometimes to --- that I didn't know this was going to become sort of this staple document, I think, for everything, and so there are things that can be misinterpreted from in here, even from me re- reading it, the conditions -- some of the conditions maybe under which I wrote it.

So I just thought I should sort of say that, that where -- I mean, I know -- I certainly was not untruthful or trying to be misleading in this. I didn't think it was going

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to be -- this was my understanding of a written thing that I

would -- that I would attest to under oath and that it wouldn't be number 7, read this, is this -- do you --

BY MR. EMMICK:

Q So it may not be written with legal precision? A Exactly.

Q But there's no intentional falsehoods in it? A No.

Q You were trying to be truthful throughout? A Exactly.

A JUROR: And my purpose in raising it really is to just see whether this might jog your recollection at all as to something you might have recalled back in February that you don't recall today.

THE WITNESS: It doesn't. A JUROR: It does not? THE WITNESS: It's possible, but -- I -- I -- it's - not my -- you know --

A JUROR: Okay. THE WITNESS: -- my memory right now. A JUROR: Any other questions on that subject? A JUROR: If we don't have any other questions, I guess the other thing that we wanted to ask you a little bit about is when you were first approached by Mr. Emmick and his colleagues at the OIC.

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19 20 21 22 23 24 A JUROR: The first question. D 25 A JUROR: Yes.

87 Can you tell us a little bit about how that happened? That's not a happy topic, either, I apologize.

MR. EMMICK: Maybe if I could ask, what areas do you want to get into? Because there's -- you know -- many hours of activity --

A JUROR: Well, one specific -- okay. One specific question that people have is when did you first learn that Linda Tripp had been taping your phone conversations?

TFIE WITNESS: I believe that I didn't learn the extent to which she had taped my conversations, until I read it in the press.

I learned that day that she had worn a wire at the lunch and that I -- and that there had been other people, I think, in the restaurant that had been listening in and -- so I knew -- she had -- she had said that -- that -- when I was first apprehended, she was -- she had said that they had done the same thing to her and she tried to hug me and she told me this was the best thing for me to do and -- oh.

MR. EMMICK: Any other specific questions about that day? I just -- this was a long day. There were a lot of things that --

A JUROR: We want to know about that day. A JUROR: That day.

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A JUROR: We really want to know about that day. MR. EMMICK: All right.

THE w1TNEss: Linda was supposed to go see this new attorney that she had claimed she had gotten and was going to try to sign an affidavit so she paged me in the morning, I called her back and she told me she wanted to meet me before she went to see the attorney. So we planned to meet at the Ritz Carlton in the food court at -- I think it was quarter to one.

She was late. I saw her come down the escalator. And as I -- as I walked toward her, she kind of motioned behind her and Agent- and Agent_ presented themselves to me and --

A JUROR: Do you want to take a minute? THE WITNESS: And flashed their badges at me. They told me that I was under some kind of investigation, something had to do with the Paula Jones case,- that they -- -

that they wanted to talk to me and give me a chance, I think, to cooperate, maybe.

I __ to help myself. I told them I wasn't speaking to them without my attorney.

They told me that that was fine, but I should know I won't be given as much information and won't be able to help myself as much with my attorney there. So I agreed to go. I was so scared.

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(The witness begins crying.) A JUROR: So, Monica, did you go to a room with them at that time?

THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: And at that time, did you talk to anybody or what did you do? Did you want to call your mother?

THE WITNESS: Can Karen do the questioning now? This is -- can I ask you to step out?

MR. EMMICK: Sure. Okay. All right. MS. IMMBRGD'I': I guess, Monica, if Mike could just stay -- do you mind if Mike is in here?

THE WITNESS: (Nods affirmati. vedy. 1 MS. IMMERGDT: Okay. Would you rather -- THE WITNESS: (Nods affirmatively.) MR. EMMICK: Okay. That's fine. BY MS. IMMERGDT:

Q Okay. Did you go to a room with thein at the hotel? - A Yes.

Q And what did you do then? Did you ever tell them that you wanted to call your mother?

A I told them I wanted to talk to my attorney.

Q Okay. So what happened? A And they told me -- Mike came out and introduced himself to me and told me that -- that Janet Reno had sanctioned Ken Starr to investigate my actions in the Paula

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Jones case, that they -- that they knew that I had signed a false affidavit, they had me on tape saying I had committed perjury, that they were going to -- that I could go to jail for 27 years, they were going to charge me. with perjury and obstruction of justice and subornation of perjury and witness tampering and something else.

Q And you're saying ltthey, lU at that point, who was talking to you about that stuff?

A Mike Emmick and the two FBI guys. And I made Linda stay in the room. And I just -- I felt so bad.

Q Now, when you say you felt bad, because you felt responsible somehow for pulling the President into something?

A Yes.

Q And is that something that still weighs heavily on you, that you feel responsible?

A Yes.

Q And is it -- do you feel responsible- because you told Linda about your relationship?

A Yes.

Q I guess later just to sort of finish up, I guess, with the facts of that day, was there a time then that you were -- you just waited with the prosecutors until your mother came down?

A No.

Q Okay.

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(202) 296- 2929

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A I mean, there was, but they -- they told me they wanted me to cooperate. I asked them what cooperating meant, it entailed, and they told me that -- they had -- first they had told me before about that -- that they had had me on tape saying things from the lunch that I had had with Linda at the Ritz Carlton the other day and they -- then they told me that I _- that I'd have to agree to be debriefed and that I'd have to place calls or wear a wire to see -- to call Betty and Mr. Jordan and possibly the President. And --

Q And did you tell them you didn't want to do that? A Yes. I -- I -- I remember going through my mind, I thought, well, what if -- you know, what if I did that and I messed up, if I on purpose -- you know, I envisioned myself in Mr. Jordan's office and sort of trying to motion to him that something had gone wrong. They said that they would be watching to see if it had been an intentional mistake.

Then I wanted to call my mom and they kept telling me that they didn't -- that I couldn't tell anybody about this, they didn't want anyone to find out and that they didn't want -- that was the reason I couldn't call Mr. Carter, was because they were afraid that he might tell the person who took me to Mr. Carter.

They told me that I could call this number and get another criminal attorney, but I didn't want that and I didn't trust them. Then I just cried for a long time.

Diversified Reportinq Services, Inc. 1025 VERMONT AVENUE, N. W. SUITE 1250

WASHINGTON, D. C. 20005 (202) 296- 2929

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A JUROR: All while you were crying, did they keep asking you questions? What were they doing?

THE WITNESS: No, they just sat there and then -- they just sort of sat there.

A JUROR: How many hours did this go on? THE WITNESS: Maybe around two hours or so. And then they were -- they kept saying there was this time constraint, there was a time constraint, I had to make a decision.

And then Bruce Udolf came in at some point and then -- then Jackie Bennett came in and there were a whole bunch of other people and the room was crowded and he was saying to me, you know, you have to make a decision. I had wanted to call my mom, they weren't going to let me call my attorney, so I just -- 1 wanted to call my mom and they --

Then Jackie Bennett said, t'You're 24; you're smart, -

you're old enough, you don't need to call your mommy." And then I said, "Well, I'm letting you know that I'm leaning towards not cooperating," you know.

And they had told me before that I could leave whenever I wanted, but it wasn't -- you know, I didn't -- I didn't really know -- 1 didn't know what that meant. I mean, I thought if I left then that they were just going to arrest me.

Diversified Reporting Services, Inc.

1025 VERMONT AVENUE, N. W. SUITE 1250 WASHINGTON, D. C. 20005

(202) 296- 2929

1149

1 And so then they told me that I should know that

2 they were planning to prosecute my mom for the things that I

3 had said that she had done.

4 (The witness begins crying.)

5 MS. IMMERGUT: Do you want to take a break, Monica?

6 THE WITNESS: Yes.

7 (Witness excused. Witness recalled.)

8 THE FOREPERSON: Okay. We have a quorum. There

9 are no unauthorized people and Monica is already aware that

10 she is still under oath.

11 MS. IMMERGUT: We just have a couple more questions

12 and then I think we'll break for lunch.

13 THE WITNESS: Okay.

14 A JUROR: Monica, I have a question. A minute ago

15 you explained that the reason why you couldn't call Mr.

16 Carter was that something might be disclosed. Is that right?

17 THE WITNESS: It was -- they sort of'said that -- -

18 you know, I -- I -- I could call Frank Carter, but that they

19 may not -- I think it was that -- you know, the first time or

20 the second time?

21 A JUROR: Any time.

22 THE WITNESS: Well, the first time when I asked,

23 that I said I wasn't going to talk to them without my lawyer,

24 they told me that if my lawyer was there, they wouldn't give

25 me as much information and I couldn't help myself as much, so

Diversified Reporting Services, Inc.

1025 VERMONT AVENUE, N. W. SUITE 1250 WASHINGTON, D. C. 20005

(202) 296- 2929

1150

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that -- A JUROR: Did they ever tell you that you could not call Mr. Carter?

THE WITNESS: No. What they told me was that if I called Mr. Carter, I wouldn't necessarily still be offered an immunity agreement.

A JUROR: And did you feel threatened by that? THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: And you said they offered you a chance to

call another attorney? THE WITNESS: Yes. A JUROR: And did you take them up on that offer? THE WITNESS: No. A JUROR: Why not? THE WITNESS: Because I didn't trust them. A JUROR: I see. And at some point in this meeting, did you -- you did obtain an attorney? Mr. Ginsberg?

THE WITNESS: Well, like at 11: OO that night. A JUROR: So it was seven hours or eight hours or more later?

THE WITNESS: They -- they finally let me call my

mom, so I went to call my mom and then -- and I saw Linda again. She had been shopping or something like that. But I called my mom and then Mike had said that she could call him,

Diversified Reporting Services, Inc.

1025 VERMONT AVENUE, N. W. SUITE 1250 WASHINGTON, DC. 2oMH

(202) 296~ 2! 329

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hdIusedtos8ytohimtbat1Iikc’itwbmyoa wcarmytics~ tkaIknowI’m& byoar~~ so- litmdlywxif~ vely.

AJURORz Soyoutbinkkwouldhow,& m, tkt tktwasyohic.

THEwrrNEss: FIcdmlldklmv.

ARIROR: whichb& gstomiadwtmtkfvrt app=== byNel* k== testify-

TkIEwrINESs: Yes.

ANROR: &~ youtdmcwbatyourti~~@~~

whmyousawtkpictlmofNelviswwringtkfirsttic thatyougavctkhsidmt?

THEwlTNEss: Yes. Actually, youknmvwhat? I think my cup’s hiking. I’m Sony.

Pagc33- Page36 Divmsikd Rtnatinn scwic4 Inc. (202) 2962929

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3 inkzc? 4 Elvlmck lkmraRodmtism. 5 TEiEwIrNEs al- 6 AJfREPaamKi Ikwuitranr-

7 THEwmms: xrsroawhad. 8 MR. EIdxIm hckmwmllalvh8d# batItllinkYs 9 be& if- 0 THEwnuEss: okay. 1

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THEWXNESS Iknowkdid Inrmr, m- m-

tktlms- Idclo’t& mFifyJu9hKnvtbisano& htI wtxkcdin~ Iml’rncckhs& ewhaiIvmsiDcoIJcpfa

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4 amkb’tbm~ rtakdidn’t- tktkdidn’tkww. 5 AJURORi OkpatplcotktbmNdmdl. iu 6 mnrafgivir# hirrirrwyl

7 mEwnNEs% Idm’thmw. 8 AJUROk Ckay. Ymjmt-

9 wnwss rmti~ of~ cfit, kd

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MR EMKICK: Yes, ma’sm? AJURORZ Ms. hwins&, II ifyoucvc. rhad ~yWOUblCWithtkSCUCtsaviaiIltryisgtokOeertk Presi& lt.

THEWITNESS: No. lkaalytimcthatInmcmkr waswfrenIwcattosozllinlaltklasttimcin’%, 1gucss itwasApril7tb. Eastcr. AndwknJdmhhskcttwasoutsi& aadkmidkwrsgoimgtockckwithEvdyaif1caMgo inrmdthcnI&& tremembcr exactlybmvitkp~ but1 sortof- Idm’tmlxmkr tkcxactdi5amia& butit a& dupkcn& dupnottalkhgtoEvclynaadIwcntin. so-

AJURORz IbavcaqwsthaboutLindaTripp. lHEWRNESS: U# lSmy.

AmOk h~ youram~ tith& Tripp, waskropinioo8lwlIysthatskmustbctmthfulawas

thzatimcwkseyourintprdonwasthat~ wasgoiog topfovwyouwith&? cqmhmrsf~ as~* tk == m

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hdtk0& lSO- tlUlWbCZlILpobtWith~ QItk !l& skraIkcdabouttktskbadspmtswnctimciaNm YCSiCdUXiBgChiSt. WaDdtbXtSk- tkt~ kd suggcsdtokrtbatskgctajob& iagpubiicrdathsin

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ANROR: okay. ‘Lbraltyou

BYMREh4MICX

Q I’dlikcmska& ifyingfoUcnmp~ I wwl’tbilltImhstood alloftksortofiasaad~ if youwi& of* LTldawas~ tomailltaintk~~ wknsllewas@ ingtomcalh Itsiomdedlikcpriato tktime~ Lipda# ot8PsulaJmgLpbpocD4yaQe

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Page41- Page44

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2 tlllaBetoldyoutbatskwrsgoineto~~ Qd

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5 Q Okay. hdtkaintbiScaavaatioaQ~

6 ~sbc~ somc~ tormdrCrbaepilYgtbc

7 reretabitlatgr.

8 A Nqcoa& kdtlmtdtewasgoingto& tfrrt

9 Q ‘hatskums~ t0. mrigtd -ht’twbtI 1 0 wQtcdtoclarify.

1 1 Aslne. 1 2 MREA! lMx~‘ Ibanlryou

1 3 AJURORZ wbatyoumidtbatillyllmamJ~

1 4 WithIill& TfippyOUkhdafbdtoaqgBaaeSOIDCthiUgS

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2 0 AJUROR Okay.

2 1 TREWrrNEss: Butgoal. I’msary.

2 2 AJUROk Wc& nqIjustuedtlwtwmL

2 3 TtfEWlTNEss: Okay.

2 4 ANROR: w Yaudiddt~~ bUtI

2 5 couldII’t~ ofnlccx8ctwordryouPred

-46 TBEwrINEss: sttte

AJUROR Butwucyou- whydoycnthinktbatycm badtomttEllbusoInethingstbstdinacmnliybappca, tluething& intaelgtokr?

THfzWlTNEss: natreaLlyalme~ inrekQnw tkPaulaJaoscas. IthinkthatIwas- thcwucmnx ots4xsiaos, Qleill~ thatImnunba, WlUlIdidIl’t discloeaamtacttbatIkidwithtbeResikt- I’m sotIy, hac- I’llscootover- alamcttbatIlmdu! ithdlc

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1 clarifyingfollow- qtotht

2 THEFOREPERSON: Andtllalafkr? lwqwehaveto

2 takeabmak

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2 BYMREMMICKz

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5 ~mEFowPERsoNz Ifyoasayso. 6 THEwrrNEss: okay. 7 knLEhllMx~ spre. 8 TEEWITNESS: hjust25. Fkmc 9 ANROR: Batyoo’llahvq+ sbchkhvimky, 10 wktkym’te2scK28a- 11 THEWRNESS: NotifIgdlllmkd.

12 (WiiuatKd. WmKculkd.) 13 THEID- Mmim, I’dlibctonePllind~

14 y- ou8restilluukodL 15 TEEM! lmEss:‘ Lbmkyou 16 MREMMICik Webmaqmmmmdtkeucao

17 - Aparrrsplesem t- riohn 18 lHEFoREPERsoNz YoaarcabduLdycQlbcL 19 MRE, hmmk hkythistimc lo mEWrmEs! 3: llwnkycm

!l MREMMI~ Didyouw8nttoaskromefdbaw DQuestioan I

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A No. lGxlmvcIadxmizduay~

Q Okay. !3oyaadidn’taufhizcaAi. relwmcabout tktk.

A No.

Q withrcqstto- toswitrhgears- towbat~ wcmspa& ingabout~ bef~ thebKakabouttkthings tbtyOUSdtOLidlTlippdtkVC! y@ Xld# J. XMiddyOO January 13,1998, I bdicvc -

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4 tohimonJanumy5th Istbatammt? 5 A Right Yes. hd~ diddtdisdosthattobu.

page SC 1 Q Right. ~oudidmtdiscbetbattokr. 2 A Quitetntkcontmy. 3 Q Okzy. hxf~ youtoldkrthatyoubadn’tscca

4 orspaLentothcIksi& ntfatwomoDths 5 A ~sincetk 17thofDarmkr. 6 Q my. 7 A Exactly. 6 Q Your. mWimdtbattbaewas- youhsaid P thingsaboutwhattkRsidmthadsaidtoyoutoMs. Tripp o~ tbatwerewttrutmJaa~ l3th Doyouremcukraay 1 !spaifiithingstbatyousaidrbattkRtsidart~ toldyou 2 tbatinfactweremttrue? 3 A No. Idan’tremcmbm aayspaSicqIjustwcnrted 4 tokaGcopcntbeposibiity. Dacstbatci8rifyit? 5 MREMMxm ontbc@ ltJlae? 5 ANROR: h4onka, whydidyoukazptbatblack 7k? 3 A JUROk Blw. ? ANROR: Bluedress. 1 AJUROk Didyouhavcamsontokcepit7

I THEuTxNEss: Pmhxl? 2 AJURORz~‘ Ihbkdrcss. 3 ANROR: Tkblu: Qss 4 THEWITNESS: No. Ididn’tbavcamson, lk- 5 leason- tkzdnss- Idi& J’trcdiz- ifI_

2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 I1 12 13 14 15 16 I7 18 19 10 Cl I2 I3 14 !5

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Andsktddmetb8tIdmuldputitinasafe depo6itbox~ itaJuldbcevidenao0cd8y.

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aem- IwoddocyerdisclostbatIhadaxrUiod@ WithtkhSidal& IWOUldoeVaUCX! dk

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=rHEwlINEss: ol& ycs. AJUROR: Wc& wbt~ titgoiog? I- what

heptit- yaukpingitactivcarwbatcvd THEwrINEss: Ifcllinlolrc.

ANROR: Ibqyaurpardon? Icddn’tburym. THEwrlNEss: Ifellinlovc.

AmOk whenyoubokrtitaow, wasitbveara !EXlXdObSSSh?

THEWRNESS: Morclovewi& alit! kbituf obsessi= But dcfiiely love.

AmOk DidyouthinktbattkpFsideDtaraia lOVCWithyap8iSO?

T. HEwlTNJB: lkaewasaIloccashuklIkftt& wlliteI. IolmQdIwasprectychrmvA8thowIf&~ I didthinktbat.

ANROR: Youdid?

BYMLEMMICK:

Q& You _tkdatt?

A It WILS July 4, 1997. ANROR: WaqowmrctbatkwasbavipQ pfoblans. inhis~? Didthiscvcrspillovcrintk

Diversified Rqmrting Semias. Inc. (202) 296- 2929 Page49- Page52

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2 AJUROR: Okay. 2 It’rsclmcegIascdtowrxkanradIdoa’t~ 3 MREMMICE Yes? Aqueaim? 3 it’rrig4it’rnotrighttohmfc8nafhirwitha~

4 AJURORz Youjustmrntirmulrc8laompoOam, tk 4 mm. IncvcrcxpazkdtofallillkJvcwithtkRtsi& lt. I 5 leihes@~-~ fihc~~ yul~ 5 w8ssurphalthrtIdid. 6mlih: d ButsaWimcsIgoback~ f~~ . 6 hdIdich’t- myiI&& a~ hdrtallybeulto 7~~ 9 “gbkwacyauyaPself~ liviaga~ af 7 camctoW= hiDgmandstartcmr8ndIdidn’tumttobave 8 acuets, alotofks, alotofpe= okb~ wyou~ 8 anotbcrtiairwithamaniaimanbaxuseitwasrc4iy 9. tnlt? Lalealampmeat? 9 pinfill ItumshaTiblc. hdIfalevulwuxabaltit 0 I’mnot ” - l * gtbmtwodiffaultthings 10 oow. 1 bccalacapttimcyoo’1t * - ~buttbmqpiayoacb 11 AJURO~ IblaicqI’dlikcm~ tbe~ ic, if 2 jtasttkopposhof~ yoUWyat’~~ 12 Ian. 3 Didycluevcrthink~ aotbingrealmoldaQeof 13 THEwITNEss: DidIanswcr-

4thiSlelhdl@?_ 14 AJUROR: Yes.

5 TEEwlTNEss: DidIcvcrtiliBgwhingnA- 1s ‘IHEw’xmESs:~.

Q AJUROR: Anythiagd,~~ ytbine~ 16 AJUROR: AndIb- Iwanttoktyouknowthat

7c4J& uixl~ 8Dd~ amld~ camcfromtilis 17 ~‘ zcnotkxctoj~ youinanyway, Itiiinkm411yofus Brelatimship? 18 fdthatway.

9 THEwrrNEss: Yes. 19 THEwlTNEss: Iqpneatethat. ButItm& s8nd !o AJUROR: WiththiSBMUTiCdBMUA? 20 tbatcvuy- pknow, thisis- thisisatopictht- II THEwrlNEss: Idid. 21 tkzctrt8lotof~ lcthkit’swnmgradIthinkit’r 2 AJUROR: ButIbaveaquestiaoforyouaboat~ 22 wral& too. Iuoderztadtil8L 13 TEEwlTNE! S: Mm- bmm. 23 ANROR: fhdto8fkthtyauquesrim- 14 ANROR: It’SbOCQrepatadilItht~ that~ 24 hchadto8skotkrqucstkmanditwouldn’thvcbaeo 5 ~adath& ipbdat* tOthi& when: 8lOtOf 25 ri$ ltfclrmeaottoa!& youtfieqtmxtiao-

-58 w? a .1 lwrtudpirlameoutoftbiSSyuuknmv,~ btOt~= d 1 THEWITNESS: sue. 2 p8inBmmdaf8inay. 2 AlllRoa: -tbthcbdJomk- 3 AndtbmyallannaIwndrodyuIQir~ 3 TEEwIrNEm Iusiakitbf8iramdIthidKyou

4 Yau’reyoun& you’nevibnaIcur’tfipcad~ youhxp 4 sboukl- Itbiakit’safairqlrsth xt’srhldmem 5 goingaftu~ tlmtmm’tfra, Umtauftobtaimbk. 5 e. NoaoclikEsmbmtkirwuknam HFdm 6 TxEwrINEss: W~ tbau’rsurtofRuopatsto 6 fatkQthtuu4youkaow, bntImmbtudtht Ad 7 tbtdjusttoclnrify~ tbt- tkwryAadyrodKa 7 I’d& you mesQuHlwbncrmcan& fmm, pmknaw,

8 Bkikrparm@ cvuyti@ oaTVNtho&~ hhwJler 8 andyou’dpmbblybavcmknawmcbummdkamumywink 9 w8spmtyi# 3ucm@ soIdm’tklluwhowmYchofl& tis 9 jomeylfJbovIgotbatfnmlbirtllloMwm~ 0 pntofpmw 10 mdusm& iL Idoo’taml -it But- 1 1 AIUROR: lbccdypatIknawirtktkvms~ 11 tmbsmi. I~~ bw& ma8kthtq4naimmiI

2 lDfmanuuwidra~ uld~ fmnily. 12 8ppdmewlmtyou’lc% y& wimmu) IWoaleis. 3 THEwrmEssz TldrulE. 13 AJ’URORz Wc’~ heztdymurrrrtkcdbSty 4 AJURORz ~Ikaowabmttk~ 14 ofyuuutblly. 5 THEWITNESS: a 15 THEiwrmEss sure ButI- Icanree& wht 6 ANROR: ~w8s~ mrnisd~~ itWUD’tfhO 16 wodibcrfakr. 7rnetafti18tfe htyery0avmatmalkaboutuu48 17 AJUROlk Iuuedm~ kckmtkirrPtdth. 8 dcanpmenshonmy. Itdlemrtr,- brfWasy. 18Xt’smy * - %ngtbatymmifkdamtliethbman@ 9 Tb8rrwby1ulredyauarliambautobsboa. 19 timyour ~~ your~ rsramrrps witllrbtofiia 10 mEwTzNEss: Tbrt's~ bdqrrrtioomuuwu 20 oflkJh&# mdaltcumsd~~~ uut 11 ~~~~ 8- thrrc~ rwaktbrtIooPdmQ 21 p- btpr, 8d~ kgdtrmdpmrpponlm !2 OalnIysdf. nlueareobviouslyiurrrlimt- lbu- yul 22 diswhmminf~ mlbepru

!3 kmw~ asin& yomlgwanml darn’tk! 58lldf8irlwith~ 23 lEEwrrNEs% Ibbrbun ~4 1~ anjed~ kf3~ 1~~ rbc’~ rwrmrl. m mmbhk 24 AJURORz hdi~ bokiqovuExhibitAdL- 2, Idaft Y mostpaJpklmvcissucsd~ rjlfstbowmincllrrnifaad 25 acctbatpluvwn. culymbokattbu7

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1 THEWITNESS: Istbatllly~

2 AJURORZ Yes

3 TIEwITNEss: swc. 4 MREh! lMIm SUE 5 mEwlTN& ss: Ilmowtb8tpaftianofitwYymdl

6 AJURORI Iat8ybe~~

7 TBEwrrNEss: naehwebemlumyrimSI’ve

8 wmntdto& fiaximyadf8dthelics~ bmbsmrpewcd 9cmt 0 MR. Endra~ IthbktkrcfauEeistopaftlB.

1 a3uROk okay.

2 MREh! lMxcik wkrei! nsysw~ natnmkcary 3smcmmts-” =Nei! khdbLRvimkymrbcr~ will 4dmy gtaummm~ tinmr& rto~~ 5 ateugusaftkOIC’s~ atbeir~ aro 6lreplescnptivesoftbeoewS~ WitkUtfiIStobtlinipetk

7 OIC’s8ppnnmL’ 8 AJUROR: okay. nlmkycm .

9 TBEwlTNEss: SATC. D MREIbffMIm otkp9crrioar7 Yer, mB’rm?

1 AmOk I’drlroliktoreamfaraminurc- 2 ifyouhmcthat~ oat- toalnm& f@ tkt~

3 discumdthi! 3~ carlicrthismaning, dthatden 4 toyolxproffcr. DoyoahaaJpyoftbepdw ‘Ibe 5 pdfcr7

2 3 I 5 6 7 B 9 9 I 2 3 I 5 6 7 B 3 3 1 2 3 I I

-63 MILEImmIc We&. SurE. TEEwITNEss: ably.

MREMMIm I’mplacirqExhibitlb4L- lbcfaethc WiaKSS

lEEwlTNEss: nankyou

AmOk bhic& ifyoOWUld~~~

ll, I’mabt~ whatpagreitqkait’spangrrrphll. mEwlTNEss: okay. Ye5. okay.

ANROR: ASI tndamodalr- thir 2llomh# ycrud~ yau< bfcrad~~ tilc~ dt+ prckdmtdidD’tdisearPlgeya5hutsaidramethiqe likcTbmt’sgood. ’

AsInadyourproff~~ itaaysTlYE-

toldMs. Ltodeay8lldauapifcwIdrrrl” Andtkt SCCElStOllSSlightlydiff= U&

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,6 prc& astomc. Sothiqs~ rertpnpkurntIdida’t 16 EtamIcE nnl29thofMatch. 7 hipettptmk% sIkdb. 17 niEwlmE! S: ok8y. .8 AJURORz hactiywhrtdrt@ didyu~ gdyatr 18 AJURCML ~~ KxwD~~~~ Q * -‘ yl30tr 9 subpoautDkrwimas7 19 2aOpm, sady. hd& ltal-. phyriulw !O THEwrrNEs: Tkl9rhaf~. 20 inrhvl; nsrnlsatoaJmpktial& dbljcfdirClct~ !I AJUROftz Tbe19lii7 w. ti, arheo- difymt 21, ammcL”~ cfirst~ uIa~ couklyaujust 2 cddrudlfarmetbcallwanbyllulmdaith~ 22 dabareoatktabir? 13 Rddmtabattlkgiftr. 23 lTiEwrmE! Ss: uh- 14 THEWlTNESS: Oloy. bWS lha& u2SthuuiIwas 24 AJUROkIamrlmmd- 5 liuctDgumycIlimmsgihrfrrrmhim. EJtammc. I’m 25 lHEwKNEs! j: ohmy@ lsh nlisisso

P- 66 piece 1 rany. Andmspultmayts8boutfivleztliwlm aro, ootray lembarrassiqg.

2 klI& talk@ abmttkmsc AndImidmhit& wdLdo 2 AJUROR: Youaxddcioseyourcyesaadtak

3 youtbink-” 3 AmOk Wewon’thrkatyou 4 wbatIlluhmi- Inidmbittllktitbed 4 THEwrrNEss: caaIbi& unckrtktablc? uh- I 5 dlyahxndmc~ tkb8tpiabeingm~ arbpoenrd 5 bad- Ihadwanted- Itito- Iplad. hisgaital

6 Itbhkksaidsamdingiikc~“ puhww~- tktsonof 6 nexttomiacmdbdhopadtbatifk- oh- thisisjw 7 bc&& dme, too. nutbotbacdnIq” ytRlhIlw, mlBtbaws 7 toocdam! h& Idad- 8 a” zklm& oglikelhu 8 AmOk Didyoutbiakitwddkadto

9 Andatancpoitl~ I#& wd& QyouhiakI 9irmmlmE? Odl@ d- “Idoa’tthinkImid” gatid~“ Ismamtt 10 TEEwrrNEss: Notmtbatdy. 1 QymItllillkIsllalkiputmmyamq+ kgivcbBcltya& c 11 AmOk wpsttm! sartofthzrcaoafar& iqthc 2 lo- the* T 12 gesme- 3 Andk- Idm’tmnuabuhisrerpmre. I& ink 13 THEwITNESs: Yes

4 itwusom& ing~ 1dal’t~~“ ar~“ a- thac 14 ANROR: -ortqix&-~ hisdoserto 5H! Y~= J= P== 15 youls?

6 1kDowtb8t1didn% lcmetkwhieHouscwi& my 16 THEwrINEss: %I- aothntuewcmldlmvc

7 notiotlofwktIsiladddowitbIbem, muIsbalIddo 17iTlmamc~ d8y, btltthattb8t~ mdOcbimw8atto. 8 aly& iogdiffault~ tbullit8ttky~~ iamyhoure. 18 ANROR: thy. wucyuuwwriqcdoths8t~ 9 hdtknhtaIptkcdlfrtmlBay. 19 tiBxatm& wcar tithetime? 0 AJUROR: Now, didyoubaiqqBmy’~ ary’rmameadid 20 TEE WITNESS: No. 1 tkE+ midmtbtingupBQy’rlmlnc7 21 AJUROR: Andwask? Orhiswuepdkddmm? 2 THEWITNESS ItllinkIbnlugbtitup. ?hc 22 ‘MEwITNESs: carea 3 Ra~ twcdn’tlmvcbrm@ tupBcq’snanchcrru+ k 23 ANROR: ~wasthaedi& tskin- wm

4 tallydidn’t- kdiddtdlydiscusi& socidmI 24 bUwaayotx@ talsandhi~? 5 hAgbtupBcny’stlan& wllichIthiakispldmblywkt 25 TEEwlTNESs: Ithinkvaybridy. Itwas-

. __- __

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THE-: Yar

ANROR: MaaicqIbdoaequestiaatogobrekto tilcgifts. YauhadsllidtbttkRcaidmtimd~ yaa i! iulyto~ gdycmr~ giqyuukdgaac tbcrr, pukdatn& ctetaqmdttmewasno- yua czxpnzdarooern, tk~ rallydido’tsay~ Hownxudll8mintk8fbmamdidyougetaallfiwl Betty? Itmnmts8mcday, isthatc4Ymct?

lIiEwx@ mEss: Ya, ulat’scalea Lctmcjust

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Ms. IMMERm Thankyar AJURORZ hdjpsttobeckupfarracud~ your cT4nmmhwithtkPrrridmttktp8lludyma littkbitwbmprlmidyaawuc~~ tk subpoammdsauIcoftkitmlstktitcallsdfad~ tk hrtpin~ indadtkRcsidmtkdgivcayoqyoa tdXpviody, IbdimwkttkRcsi& atmidk wmi~ aboaz~ rko~ knwthektpie Is tktcuzcct?

THEWlT? dES: Idm’tkaowtktksw- Idm’t kmwtktksartkhmtpbontk- Ickm’tknowtktk SWkSUb~ SO- I~ tkttkktpin~~ WQCUll tobini

AJURORZ okay. Doyal rcamnbuwbatksaidin lespaosc* you~ yw== ccwmaiabaattkthings callaifaintkrpbpoepnl

THEWrllESS: Ithinkksnidsandinglike~ dmc, tm.”

AIUROR: o&‘. TBEWlT? GSS: SoIdm’tkxmwifkmwita- somans- ymuhmw, I& n’tknowklcaraedtkt

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AJUROR Andartlmtsancdry, kgmyou =+= gifg.

lHEWR? dESS: Ya.

AJURORi Wktwuyoarthiakiqattkttimcabout tkt? Didtbt coacunyular-

‘MEWIINESS: No.

AJURORz No?

THEwnNEss: Iwas-

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1 skuldm8ykoivesa88oftfremto~ 8~ rt~

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3 THE WITNESS: No. 4 AJUROR: &I? 5 EMMICK: Ikveaquickci& jhngqlntial 6 bomseyounidtkttkoalycowahoo yuukdwitilIlinl 7 abaugifcs&!?? ksubpoxuw8smtk~ Yalalsokd 8 l cawushmwithhimoatk5th~ t~ mtkkPa 9 giftaftkbodsifInmQbuit~ 0 THEWIINESS: Rig& ImeantmygiftEtktkpvc 1 bmt 2 EMMCERighLRighLRi& LIjUStuMtsd 3 mclhijrcheify 4 THEWITNESS: oIpy. SlUC 5 EraacE o& uqucshs? 6 AJUROR Gniqkcktoyaan -tiOOWitb 7 LhdBTsipp-

8 MR. EMMxm wbichols?

9 THEWITNESS: Ye. wllichmpc~ youYcfming 0 tol I AJURORZ Nqrmj4st# oingmk@ lclal. 2 QaMIcg:= W 3 AJURORZ IfylukdtDputitlik 4 ~wktyaltokibL7ukiagmarbfulodmt 5 tnaf4wktpcrrrntlgt willkmtmdhl?

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?a’961 8 THEwIIwE! m Ifimakihr- WkmlIfirsttdd 9 lu8bouttklewohipawkaIrtrrrPdtrPriqember D uapmao7 1 AJtlRCXk Ibedathhip.

2 THEwrrNEss Tklcbi&+ Imldbuia 3 Narrmrkrof’96. Afutbecbch. 4 AlUROk Okay. SofdnNauernbcr ‘% lDW 5 ‘W- :

6 lEIEwImEs! s: Rcuytrtnel. 7 AJUROk hdtlm1aih’977

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6 Mr. hdauIwouh’tsigatkdbiuvitudIgotajob. 7lbrtwas& iinitdyalit, b0dar8tmd& Unchhadma&

Bmcprcm. khcra~ hnwy9th Sarxdtkdutbings-

9 AJURORZ Didyoutdlbdanippat8uytimctb8t Dyoubadbrdatawhkmd tbtpapk& dtgotojnilfa

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2 THEwrrNEss: Ya, Ibdimfc- IthiakIsnid

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9 AJUROR: Ibk. D MR. EMMI~ Doyouwaattothabmk& talk

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~, Apgust20,1998 I

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9 AmOk Didyoutdbda~ ripptbtanya~ bad 0 suggMtdthatmyou? I mEwrnEss: Idm’tthinkso. 2 AJURORZ okay. nimkyou 3 AJujkok hyotkrs?

4 ANROR: hthatcndoftbc~ timtframt, s didyoucvermcllLindaTlippthatyollf& physicallyat 6& k? 7 TEEwrINEss: Ithinkso. ItwcItddber

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szl7* 1935; 63,4$ 7: 1J ?A4, JS, J6 l& 7 lzS, Jl 14: 19f3u lLlo117J7 lS212424 16: 4,423 17z4+ I3 i& 24 lQs? 2 1PI 20312193121zs9’ 22~ 4.4.4 2SS3, J7,18 265 wag4 302131: lOP 36zWOJ5 uk14 3% 4223,24 43S, 4,16 44~ 4 WJ6 45~ 19 47: lS,. J6 5lsJ7, ta 53m Sk4 S6zll6OA6 63~ 25 64: 1,3 652 67~ 4 6M, l6 69d8 72~ 12 7& l 77~ 5 “193816 80~ 17 83SS 84: Jl 8611 8Qd3 PM5 %: 1 J 1013 103: lfZO 105& 13* lS lm3 wcmldll’t [IS] 7z7,7 l& 4

111: 1931,22 182 1921 24~~ 6 33: 12213924 6623 70~ 14.78: 6 863 9324 94s lw25 W’dI*] &is 43s

102s 1033 WritmPJ 8M4 86: lJ

1033

-X-

KpJ 13, lO 104-%

-Y-

Yp] 104s eg 98: 1214,36

yarn 41: 12 83: 14 yam pi 38~ 19 !Nk4 yenowpJ 32:& s yes pa] 2t2024 3S, J2

4: 7 szl &2132 7: 4,18 85 QE6 113.1030 Is: 19 Jf: 6 17: 7, l!, lO 189 19~ 13 20~ 5 2& 14 21% 15 22mz3 24: 10,23 252 26t4.15 27s 29& 10 3Oz2J 32z2

32z15 35: 19 36sl. 24 38: 3QS. 11.24 4OSO 42~ 3 43: 18 45t4.4 48zi 49& s 4Qzmt5 52d s3z25 n3 n: lQ 5pJ4 61~ 2.20 62~ 8 62dQ 67: 11,12 68: 13 Wd 6Qs 7O& Jl, JS33 74: J! 74: 18 7519 nt 78A2 ml913 8Oz41182s es3 s3L2# 5 84: 133334 8S3 87~ 8Q~ 4.18 90~ 13 9Oz16,19 91: 1133: 6 949 p(: ll 96zz Ql3J. 18 9QASJ7 loo: 8 101: 12

fc2g lyts~ 8z17 74: ll i& p, 232 43: 13 14: s 44mJs Slz25 7lz2ltz 82s mutm~~ 3~ t~ l4, ls

. rou’llp1 189 m’xc plJ 3: lO UO

11: 13 13s 37: lQ 41s 41s3 48: lO 49Ao 57: ll 5732 58: 4,4 60~ 12 7624 79~ 5 90~ 7 92z17J7,18 . m’vc@~ 2~ 17 16: lS 8192 lm23$ 23f4 roumgpi 58*, 23 loI: mrppaq 2llJ2 3r3JO 3s4 4: 19,1333 szlofl 524 6; jLl9 llz23gs 142 15~ 18 2J: 17 X3: 19 24~ 4 26s 27z7 2& 13 32z1331) 36SJ3J6,2138AO 42~ 17 42zl9 43: 1213 44s3 u: J3 49sJl ut2$ 9 545 U? I =a ~10 6Oz~ lJ; u4,19. l931 61~ 24 62~ 13 65~ 18 68~ 2 6824 703 J8 72: lS 73. b 74zi. l935 7Szl. 16 77~ 13 782 f9rz7d 134 8OzlO 81: 182; 182: 11 84: 1,15 84: 16 8S. S %A2 87~ 8 89~ 620 90~ 18.22 92~ 18 9721 Q& l1 101: 13 JoI: 1059 106~ 22 1073,7J3. f4, J4,14,15& 5 107A9

rolmpJ 68:) s wm& sdfpJ. 3: 15 loE4

Tab 4

1210

il J J I L -._. --. _-_ --- --_ _-- m-_

_-_ _.

/ 5 I_

1213

._.-. __

1214 - - 4 t-

-_.. -- ._--- -_ .. m.. _ ---_.- ; I

c.- _--

1215 -

___ .- a-. - ---_ _ ---- - _-_.. -

_-- -__.. e -

1216 - ~._

1217 I __._...-_-_ A. -- .--- P_ --.--. _._.-_ -.

---- W.- P-- -

1218

-0-

- --.! t --- a _. . .._- ----- mm_

_ __ __... _- L_- p- m- _-_.-- _----. _._ e-.-- -. e

1221

Tab 5

1222

1223

Of& x of the l~ dependent Counsel

iOOl Pcnmdvama Avenue. ?v’ U’ Sum d90- Gmh Rhrknglon. DC 20004 R02) 51& 8688 Fax CO21 5 I d- 8802

This is an agreement (“ Agreement”) between Monica S. Lewinsky and the United States, represented by the OfGee of the Ind~ ndent Counsel (“ OK”). The terms of the Agreement are as follows:

1. Ms. Lewinsk~ agrees to cooperate fi~ lly with the OIC, including special agents of the Federal Bureau of Investigation (“ FBI”) and any other law enforcement agencies that the OK may require. This cooperation will include the following:

A. h4s. Lewinsky will provide tn& ful, complete and accurate information to the OK. She will provide, upon request, any documents, records, or other tangible evidence within her custody or control relating to the matters within the OK’s

jurisdiction. She will assist the OIC in gaining access to such materials that are not within her custody and control, and she will assist in locating and gaining the cooperation of other individuals who possess relevant information. Ms. Lewinsky will not attempt to protect any person or entity through false information or omission, and she will not attempt falsely to implicate any petson or entity.

B. Ms. Lewinsky will testify ~11~ before grand juries in this district and elsewhere, at any trials in this district and elsewhere. and in any other executive, military, judicial or congressional proceedings. Pending a final resolution of this matter, neither Ms. Lewinsky nor her agents will make any statements about this matter to witnesses, subjects, or targets of the OIC’s investigation, or their agents, or to representatives of the news media, without first obtaining the OIC’s approvai.

C. Ms. Lewinsky will be fully debriefed concerning her knowledge of and participation in any activities within the OIC’s jurisdiction. This debriefing will be conducted by the OIC, ~clu~~ g attorneys, law enforcement agents, and representatives of any other institutions as the OIC may require. Ms. Lewinsky will make herself available for any interviews upon reasonable request.

D. Ms. Lewinsky acknowledges that she has orally proffered information to the OIC on July 27,1998, pursuant to a proffer agreement. Ms. Lewinsky fiuther

1224

represents that the statements she made during that proffer session were truthful and accurate to the best of her knowledge. She agrees that during her cooperation. she will truthffilly elaborate with respect to these and other subjects.

E. Ms. Lewinsky agrees that, upon the OK’s request. she will waive any evidentiary privileges she may have, except for the attorney- client privilege.

2. If Ms. Lewinsky fully complies with the terms and understandings set forth in this Agreement, the OIC: 1) will not prosecute her for any crimes committed prior to the date of this Agreement arising out of the investigations within the jurisdiction of the OIC: 2) will grant her derivative use immunity within the meaning and subject to the limitations of 18 United States Code, Section 6002, and will not use, in any criminal prosecution against Ms. Lewinsky, testimony or other information provided by her during the course of her debriefing, testimony, or other cooperation pursuant to this agreement. or any information derived directly or indirectly from such debriefing, testimony, information, or other cooperation; and 3) will not prosecute her mother, Marsha Lewis. or her father, Bernard Lewinsky, for any offenses which may have been committed by them prior to this Agreement arising out of the facts summarized above, provided that Ms. Lewis and Mr. Lewinsky cooperate with the OK’s investigation and provide complete and truthful information regarding those facts.

3. If the OIC determines that Ms. Lewinsky has intentionally given’false, incomplete, or misleading information or testimony, or has othtise violated any provision of this Agreement, the OK may move the United States District Court for the District of Columbia which supervised the grand jury investigating this matter for a finding that Ms. Lewinsky has breached this Ageement, and. upon such a finding by the Court. Ms. Lewinsky shall be subject to prosecution for any federal criminal violation of which the OIC has knowledge, including but not limited to perjury, obstruction ofjustice, and making false statements to government agencies. In such a prosecution, the OIC may use information provided by Ms. Lewinsky during the course of her cooperation, and such information, includiig her statements, will be admissible against her in any grand jury. court. or other official proceedings.

4. Pending a final resolution of this matter, the OIC will not make any statements about this Agreement to representatives of the news media.

1225

5. This is the entire agreement between the parties. There are no other agrgements, promises or inducements.

If the foregoing terms are acceptable, please sign, and have your client sign. in the spaces indicated below.

Date: Independent Counsel

I have read this entire Agreement and I have discussed it with my attorneys. I freely and vohmarily enter into this Agreement. I understand that if I violate any provisions of this Agreement, the Agreement will be null and void, and I will be subject to federal prosecution as outlined in the Agreement.

Date: 2x rS* g VWNu! z2$, Monica S. Lewinsky

Counsel for Ms. Lewinsky: Plato Cachet- is

1226

1227

Tab 6

1228

1229 1. r4y name is Jane Doe f . I am 24 year old and I currently reside at , - .

2.. on December 19, 1997, I was eerved. with a subpoena from the plaintiff to give a deposition and to produce documents in the lawsuit filed by Paula Corbin Jones against President William

Jefferson Clinton and Danny Ferguson. 3. I can not fathom any reason that the plaintiff would seek information from me for her case.

4. I have never met MS. Jones, nor do I have any information regarding the events she alleges occurred at the Excelsior Hotel on Hay 8, 1991 or any other infonm% ion concerning any of the allegations in her case.

:. L( LW? jG C, t- 5. I worked at the White House inthe mmner of 1995 as a white House intern. Beginning in December, 1995, I worked in the

.M c;* M Office of Legislative Affairs as a staff @" 'V *

a- lint ‘: z correspondence. In April, 1996, I accepted a job a the Assistant Secretaxy for Public Affairs at the U. S. Department of Defense. I maintained that job until December 2y, 1997. I am

currently unemployed but seeking a new job. 6. In the course of my employment at the White_ House, I met president Clinton on several occasions. I do not recall ever

being alone with the president, although it is possible that while working in the White House Office of Legislative Affairs I may have presented him with a letter for his signature while no one else was P n 7 .

7. I have the utmost respect for the President who has

always behaved appropriately in my presence.

8. I have never had a sexual relationship with the President, he did not propose that we have a sexual relationship, he did not offer me employment or other banefits in exchange for a sexual relationship, he did not deny me employment or other benefits for rejecting a sexual relationship. I do not know of any other person who had a sexual relationship with the President, was offered employment or other benefits in exchange for a sexual

1230

relationship, or was denied employment or other benefits for rejecting a sexual relationship. The occasions that I saw the

President, with crowds of other people. after I left my employment at the White House in April, 1996 related to official receptions, formal functions or events related to the U. S. Department of Defense, -where I- was working at the time .- I& we& Ofhcf ~6fk fup,+ ol\ qFallbc+ hS? ~~ 3tDns.

9. Since I do not possess any information that could possibly be relevant to the allegations made by Paula Jones or lead to admissible evidence in this case, I asked my attorney to provide this affidavit to plaintiff's counsel. Requiring my deposition in this matter would cause unwarranted attorney's fees and costs, disruption to my life, especially since I am looking for employment, and constitute an invasion of my right to privacy.

I declare under the penalty of perjury that the foregoing is true and correct.

MONICA S. LEWINSKY

* *

c t

-2-

1231

DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA, 8s:

MONICA according to law, AFFIDAVITOFJANE herein are true belief.

S. LZWINSKY, being first duly sworn on oath deposes and says that she has read the foregoing DOE # by her subscribed, that the matters stated to the -best of her information, knowledge and

MONICA S. LEWINSKY

SDES~ BEDAND SwoRNtobefore me this day of

, 1998. NOTARY E'UBLIC, D. C. My Conxnission wires:

-3-

1232

1233 Tab 7

1234

1235

1. My name is Jane Doe #6 . I am 24 years old and I currently reside at

2. On December 19, 1997, I was served with a subpoena from the plaintiff to give a deposition and to produce documen ts in the lawsuit filed by Paula Corbin Jones against President William Jefferson Clinton and Danny Ferguson.

3. I cannotfathomanyreason that the plaintiff would' seek information from me for her case.

4. I have never met Ms. Jones, nor do I have any

information regarding the events she alleges occurred at the. Excelsior Hotel on May 8, 1991 or any other information concerning any of the allegations in her case.

5. I worked at the White House in the suumx of 1995 as a White House intern. Beginning inDecember, 1995, I worked in the

Office of Legislative Affairs as a staff assistant for correspondence. In April, 1996, I accepted a job as assistant to ,

the Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs at the U. S. Department of Defense. I maintained that job until December 26, 1997. I am currently unemployed but seeking a new job. I

6. In the course of my'eaployment at the White House I'

met President Clinton several times. I also saw the President at a number of social functions held at the White House. When I worked. as an intern, he appeared at occasional functions attended by mc and several other interns. Th& correspondence I drafted while I

worked at the Office of Legislative Affairs was seen and edited by

supervisors who either had the President's signature affixed by mechanism or, I believe, had the President sign the correspondence

itself.

7. I have the utmost respect for the President who has. ' always behaved appropriately in my presence.

8. I have never had a sexual relationship with the: 'President, he did not propose that we have a sexual relationship, ' he did not offer me employment or other benefits in exchange for a. sexual relationship, he did not deny me employkent or other

benefits for rejecting a sexual relationship. .I do not know of any.

849~ Dc- ooooO634

1236

other person who had a sexual relationship with the President, was offered employment or other benefits in exchange for a sexual relationship, or was denied employment or other benefits for rejecting a sexual relationship. The occasions that I saw the President after I left my employment at the white House in April,:

1996, were official receptions, formal fuICtiOnS or events related to the U. S. Department of Def@ n%, where I was working at the time. There were other people present on those oCCaSiOm3.

9. Since I do not possess any information that could;

possibly- be relevant to the allegations made by Paula Jones or lead to admissible evidence in this case, I asked my attorney to provide this affidavit to plaintiff's counsel. Requiring my deposition in-

this matter would cause disruption to my life, especially since I' am looking for employment, unwarranted attorney's fees and costs, ' and constitute au invasion of my right to privacy.

I declare under the penalty of perjury that the foregoing is true and correct.

MONICA S. LEMINSKY I

l l

. . -2-

1237

1 I DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA, 9s: I i! ;i MONICA S. WINS=, being first duly sworn on oath!

‘. :! according to law, deposes and says that she has read the foregoing'

' i A, FFIDAVIT OF JANE DOE # 6 by her subscribed, that the i

matters;

stated herein are true to the best of her infozmation, knowledge! !

j and belief.

j i

J? m& b) 8~ i

: I/ , fl MONICAS. LSWINSKY " !/

; x4

i i' SUBSCRIBED AND SWORN to before me this+

fl SqflJQ. 7 day of!

, 1998. 4 ! ii i :f ji :i

i! ;I .i

1 ;: iI I ;I : :I

g 84~ DC- 36 I I ;! ;i II ;I

-3-

1238

1239

Tab 8

1240

1241

points to make in affidavit Your first few paragraphs should be about yourself - what you do now, what you did at the White House and for how many years you were there as a career person and as a political appointee.

You and Kathleen were friends. At around the time of her husband’s death (the President has claimed it was after her husband died. Do you really want to contradict him?), she came to you after she allegedly came out of the oval and looked (however she looked), you don’t recall her exact words, but she claimed at the time (whatever she claimed) and was very happy.

You did not see her go in or see her come out. Talk about when you became out of touch with her and maybe why. The next you heard of her was when a Newsweek reporter (I wouldn’t name him specifically) showed up in your office saying she was naming you as a someone who would corroborate that she was sexually harassed. You spoke with her that evening, etc. and she relayed to you a sequence of events that was very dissimilar from what you remembered happening. As a result of your conversation with her and- subsequent reports that showed she had tried to enlist the help of someone else in her lie that the President sexually harassed her, you now do not believe that what she claimed happened really happened. You now find it completely plausible that she herself smeared her lipstick, untucked her blouse, etc.

You never saw her go into the oval office, or come out of the oval office.

You have never observed the President behaving inappropriately with anybody.

1242

The first few paragraphs should be about me- what I do now, what I did at the White House and for how many years I was there as a career person and as a political appointee.

Kathleen and I were friends. At around the time of her husband’s death, she came to me after she allegedly came out of the oval and looked , I don’t recall her exact words, but she cIai. med at the time and was very happy.

I did not see her go in or see her come out. Talk about when I became out of touch with her and maybe why. The next time I heard of her was when a Newsweek reporter showed up in my office saying she was naming me as a someone who would corroborate that she was sexuahy harassed by the President. I spoke with her that evening, etc. and she relayed to me a sequence of events that was very dissimilar from what I remembered happening.

As a result of my conversation with her and subsequent reports that showed she had tried to enlist the help of someone else in her lie that the President sexually harassed her, I now do not believe that what she &in- red happened really happened. I now find it completely plausible that she herself smeared her lipstick, tintucked her blouse, etc.

I never saw her go into the oval office, or come out of the oval office. I have never observed the President behave inappropriately with anYbodY-

1243

You are not sure you’ve been clear about whose side you’re on. (Kirby has been saying you should look neutral; better for credibility but you aren’t neutral. Neutral makes you look like you’re on the other team since you are a political appointee)

It’s important to you that they think you’re a team player, after all, you are a political appointee. You believe that they think you’re on the other side because you wouldn’t meet with them.

YOU want to meet with Bennett. You are upset about the comment he made, but you’ll take the high road and do what’s in your best interest

December 18th you were in a better position to attend an all day or half- day deposition, but now you are into JCOC mode. Your livelihood is dependent on the success of this program. Therefore, you want to provide an affidavit laying out all of the facts in lieu of a deposition.

You want Bennett’s people to see your affidavit before it’s signed. Your deposition should include enough information to satisfy their questioning.

By the way, remember how I said there was someone else that I knew about. Well, she turned out to be this huge liar. I found out she left the WH because she was stalking the P or something like that. Well, at least that gets me out of another scandal I know about.

1244

1245

Tab 9

1246

Definition of Sexual Relations For the purposes Qf this grand jury session, a person engages in “kxuat relations” when the person knowingly engage& Jr causes --

contact with the genitalia, anus, groin, breast, inner thigh, or buttocks of aqperson with an intent to arouse or gratz$ the sexual desire of any person;

****

“Contact” means intentional touching, either directly or through clothing.

1248

1249

Tab 10

1250

Approx. 8113 or 8114195 Sun. - Mon.

Mid to late 9/ 95

Approx.

1 or95 1 I/ 15/ 95 Wednesday

l/ 15/ 95

~ ednesday

1 l/ 15/ 95

Wednesday

-.-

L) ATE

Approx. 819195 _ Wednesday

Approx. 8/ 10/ 95 Thursday

11/ 17/ 95 Friday

1 l/ l 7/ 95 Friday

Monday 12.‘ 5/ 95 Tuesday

12/ 31/ 95 Sunday

1251

T TWF’Xh TEFE P- NT AND MONICA LE WINSKY

IN - PERSON CONTACTS PHONE CALLS

Departure ceremony - nonverbal connection - eye contact - green suit

Public function - Pres. 49th B- day

party - flirtation - eye contact - green suit

Departure ceremony - intro. to Pres.

Photo oppommity - WW basement - Ungvari - Pres. said he knew who ML

W& S

Chance meeting - West Exec. Ave. - waved at Pres.

Pres. made several visits to Panetta’s office where ML was working

Private encounter - approx. 8 p- m. - hallway by study - kissing

Second private encounter - sometime b/ t 8 arid 10 p. m. - study and hallway by study - physical intimacy including oral sex

private encounter - approx. 8 p. m. - study area - pizza night - kissing

Second private meeting of night - bathroom by study - phone call - piaa night - physical intimacy including aral sex

Brief private encounter - oval office md back study - no sexual contact

Private encounter - sometime b/ t 12 md 1 p. m. - approx. 20 or 25 min. - railway by study - physical intimacy :ncluding oral sex

GIFTS/ NOTES GIFTS/ NOTES ML TO WJC WJC TO ML

Zegna tie - ML gave to Currie to give to Pres

autographed photo wearing tie

“Davidoff’ cigars

1252

1 I7196 Sunday

I /7/ 96 Sunday

l/ 77/ 96

Sunday

l/ 15 or (early a. m.) I/ 16/ 96 Mon. or Tues.

l/ 21/ 96 Sunday

Approx. l/ 28/ 96

Jnday

1 f30/ 96

Tuesday

1 I30196

Tuesday

24196

Sunday

2/ 4/ 96 Sunday

214196

Sunday 2r7 or 2/ 8/ 96 Wed. or

ThUrS.

IN - PERSON CONTACTS

private encounter - late afternoon - mtg. lasted approx. 45 min. - bathroom by study - physical intimacy including oral sex

Chance encounter then private encounter - sometime b/ t 3 and 5 pm. approx. 30 to 40 min. - hallway by study - physical intimacy including oral sex - kissing in N. Hemreich’s office

Public function - Grifftn’s going away Parry

private encounter- study and hallway - approx. 1 !A hr. - physical intimacy including oral sex

PHONE CALLS I GIFTS/ NOTES

ML TO WJC ~

conversation, including phone sex - approx. 12: 30 am. - ML at home

caller ID on ML’s offtce phone indicated POTUS call

conversation - during middle of workday at ML’s office

conversations - ML at offke - multiple calls I

conversation - ML at offtce

conversation - ML at home GIFTS/ NOTES

WJC TO ML Signed “State of Union” address date approx.)

1253

218 or 2/ 9/ 96 Thurs. or Fri.

2119196 Monday

2/ l 9196 Monday

Approx. 2l28 or 3fY96

3/ l O/ 96 Sunday

3f25f96 Monday

3/ 26/ 96 Tuesday

/29! 96 -i riday

3! 3 1 f96 Sunday

313 1 I96

Sunday 4/ 7/ 96

Easter Sunday

4/ 7/ 96 -

Easter Sunday

417196

Easter Sunday

IN - PERSON CONTACTS Private encounter - approx. 25 min. sometime b/ t 12 and 2 p. m..- oval offlce - no sexual contact

Accidental meeting - outside restroom in WH - Ungvari present

Accidental meeting - pass each other in hallway - ML looked away

Accidental meeting - after jog - ML hurt hand

Private encounter - approx. 45 min. - hallway by study - physically intimate contact

Private encounter - sometime b/ t 5 and 6 p. m.- approx. 30 min. - hallway by study and study - intervening phone call - physical intimacy including oral sex

PHONE CALLS conversation, including phone sex - ML at home

GIFTS/ NOTES GIFTS/ NOTES ML TO WJC WJC TO ML

conversation - ML at home conversation - approx. 20 min. - after chance meeting in hallway - ML at home

conversation - approx. 11 a. m. - ML at office

conversation - ML at office - approx. 8 p. m. - invitation

to movie conversation - ML at office - approx. 1 p. m. - Pres. ill

Hugo Boss tie - carried to cigars mtg.

conversation - ML at home conversation - ML at home

- why ML left

1254

II DATE --

4/ 12/ 96 Friday

4112 or (early am.) 4/ 13/ 96 Fri. or Sat.

4f22l96 Monday

Approx. 4/ 28/ 96 Sunday

4/ 29 or 4/ 30/ 96 Mon. or Tues.

S/ 2/ 96 Thursday

5/ 6/ 96 Monday

,.. pprox. 5f8196 Wednesday

5/ l 6196 Thursday

5/ 2 1 I96 Tuesday

512 1 I96 Tuesday

513 1 I96 Friday

615196 Wednesday

Approx. 6/ 13196 Thursday

6114196 Friday

IN - PERSON CONTACTS Public function - AIPAC meeting Public function - Saxophone Club event

Public function -- memorial service Public function - arrival of Irish President

Public function - radio address - family

PHONE CALLS conversation - ML at home - daytime

conversation - ML at home _ after midnight

conversation -job talk - ML at home

message - after 6: 30 a. m. conversation, possibly including phone sex - ML at home

possible phone call conversation - ML at home conversation, including phone sex - ML at home

message conversation - ML at home - early evening

GIFTS/ NOTES GIFIYVNOTES ML TO WJC WJC TO ML

1255

61’23f96 Sunday

7/ 5 or+ arly a. m.) 7/ 6/ 96 Fri. or Sat.

7/ l 9196 Friday

7Rgf96 Sunday

g/ 4/ 96 Sunday

Before S/ l 6196

81’ 18196

Sunday ‘i? 4/ 96 Saturday

9/ 5/ 96 Thursday

9.‘ 5! 96 Thursday

9! 1 O/ 96 Tuesday

9/ 30/ 96 Monday

lo; 2296 Tuesday

IO?, 3 or (early a. m.)

10.‘ 24/ 96 Wed. or Thurs.

IN - PERSON CONTACTS PHONE CALLS

Public function - Pres. 50th B- day party - limited intimate contact

GIFK2 NOTES ML TO WJC

conversation, possibly including phone sex - ML at home

conversation, including phone sex - ML at home

conversation, including phone sex - 6: 30 a. m. - ML at home

converwion - ML at home conversation. including ohone sex - ML at home

Zegna tie - also t- shirt from Bosnia - ML sent to Betty to give to the Resident

conversation, including phone sex - ML at home I

conversation, possibly including phone sex I

conversation, including phone sex - ML at home I

conversation - ML at home

GIFIS/ NOTES WJC TO ML

thank you note - hand signed addendum - “tie is really beautiful”

1256

lr DATE 11 l& 96 Wednesday

1212196 conversation - approx. 10 -

MOIldEt~ 15 min. - ML at home 12Rf96 Monday

conversation, including phone sex - later that evening - ML at home - approx. lo: 30 p. m. - Pres. fell asieep

12/ l 7f96 Tuesday

12/ 18/ 96 Wednesday

After Christmas 1996

12! 30/ 96 Monday

12/ 97 Sunday

Sometime between 2! 97 and 5197

2/ 8f97 Saturday

2f 8197 Saturday

2114197 Friday

2128l97 Friday

T IN - PERSON CONTACTS Public function - South Lawn Rally

Public function - Christmas party Private encounter after radio address - early evening - approx. 20 to 25 min. - study and bathroom by study - physical intimacy including oral sex to comoletion

PHONE CALLS GIRS/ NOTES GIFTS/ NOTES ML TO WJC WJC TO ML

conversation - approx. 5 min.- 10130 p. m. - ML at home

message Sherlock Holmes game -

glow in dark frog - ML dropped off gifts with Cunie

conversation, including job talk and possibly phone sex - ML at home

two books, Ov Vey and a golf book - card or letter

conversation - ML at home - mid- day - 11: 30 or 12: 00

conversation, including job talk and phone sex - 1: 30 or 2: oO p. m. - ML at home

Washington Po8 ad - Happy Valentine’s Day

Golf ball and tees from Harrods - plastic pocket frog

hatpin - the bo&, bves of w

1257

1 DATE

Between 313 and 319197

3/ 12/ 9’L Wednesday

After

3114197

3/ 29/ 97 Saturday

26/ 97 dturday

5117/ 97 Saturday

511 Xl97 Sunday

5/ 24/ 97 Saturday

6/‘ 29/ 97

Sunday 713197 Thursday

714197 Friday Indep. Day

7/ 8/ 97 Tuesday

T IN - PERSON CONTAmS

Private encounter - approx. I: 30 or 2 p. m. - study - R- es. o~~ crutches - physical intimacy including oral sex fo completion and brief direct genital contact

Private encounter - “D- Day” - mid- day - hugging - dining room, study and hallway

Private encounter - approx. 9: 15 - mtg. ended b/ t 10 and 11 a. m. - study and hallway - argument - kiss on neck

Public function - Madrid - flirtation

~~ ~~

PHONE CALLS conversation - three minutes - ML at work

conversation - late afternoon - 20 min. - ML at home

conversations - multiple calls

GIFTS/ NOTES ML TO WJC

Thank you note - Hugo Boss tie - ML sent package by Federal Express

care package after Pres. injured his leg - “Hi ya, handsome!” card, metal magnet with Fres. seal for his crutches, license plate with “BILL” for his wheelchair, knee pads with Pres. seal - ML sent package by Federal

EXDITSS

penny medallion with the heart cut out - her personal copy of w - framed Valentine’s Day ad [ML also replaced the cut Hugo Boss tie]

Banana Republic long sleeve casual shirt - puzzle Dn golf mysteries

letter letter - frustration re: jobs

GIlXi%‘ KOTES

WJC TO ML 7

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F DATE

7114J9'7

Monday

7mf97

Tuesday 7/ 24/ 97 ThurufaY

811i97

Friday Week of 811 O/ 97 but before S/ 16197

YI 6/ 97

Saturday

9! 30/ 97

Tuesday

9/ 30/ 97 l’uesday

1 O/ 7/ 97 Tuesday

IN - PERSON CONTACTS Private encounter - Hemreich’s offrce - late evening - Pres. had conference call during middie of mtg. - ML did not participate in conference call - no sexual contact

Private encounter - oval office - approx. 10 min. - early evening - no sexual contact

Private encounter - physical intimacy including birthday kiss - study

PHONE CALLS conversation - ML at home

conversation :onvcrsation, possibly including phone sex

GIFTS/ NOTES

ML TO WJC

wooden B with a frog in it from Budapest - card with a watermelon on it

a book, pie Note&& and a card

b- day gifIsz antique book on Peter the Great, apple square - ML also gave Pns. card game “Royalty” and a book, Disease ati

memo~ dum - to

“HANDSOME” re: “the New Deal”

couriered package - letter - iob talk

GIFTSmOTES WJC TO ML

b- day gifts: antiqu flower pin in wooden box and porcelain objet d’ art handed to ML by Currie - ML picked up signed piCtlXe

Black Dog items: t- shirts, baseball cap. mug and cotton dress - given to ML by Currie

1 DATE

1 O/ 9 or (early a. m.)

10/ 10/ 97 Thurs. or Fri. -

IO/ l l/ 97 Saturday

IO/ l6197 Thursday

lOi or 1 O/ 22/ 97 Tues. or Wed.

1 of23197 Thursday

1 O/ 28/ 9? Tuesday

O/ 30/ 91 ‘Thursday

Approx. week before lOf3 l/ 97

1 l/ 3/ 97

Monday 1 l/ 12/ 97 Wednesday

1 l/ 12/ 97 Wednesday

1 l/ 13/ 97 Thursday

IN - PERSON CONTACTS

private encounter - approx. 9: 30 a. m. - study -job talk - no sexual contact

PHONE CALLS

conversation - long. from 2 or 2: 30 am. until 3: 30 or 4: 00 a. m. -job talk - argument - ML at home

conversation - h4L at home - end b/ c HRC

conversation - ML at home - interview prep

conversation, possibly including phone sex - discuss re: ML visit

GIFI- S/ NOTES

ML, TO WJC

letter -job- related - “‘ whole fat packet” of job stuff -via Federal Express

Calvin Klein tie - a pair of sunglasses - a card. a postcard (erotic painting) - note re: education reform

unidentified couriered package

Halloween gifts: card - pumpkin lapel pin - wooden letter opener with a frog on the handle - plastic pumpkin filled with candy

unidentified couriered package

Ginko biloba and zinc lozenges - ML gave to Currie to give to Fres. per Rres. request

GlFi- S/ NOTES WJC TO ML

1 DATE

I l/ 13/ 97 Thursday

I l/ 20/ 97

I- lWdiFi~ I l/ 21/ 97 -tiday

-ate 1 l/ 97 %rly 12197

12f5i97 +iday

1216197 Saturday

I216197 Saturday

.2/ g/ 97 Monday

12/ l 7 or (early a. m.)

12/ 18/ 97 Wed. or Thurs.

12128197

Sunday

IN - PERSON CONTACTS Private encounter in study - approx. 5 min. - evening - Zedillo visit

Public function - Cbristrnas party Private encounter - after NW Gate incident -job talk

Private encounter - Christmas kiss - doonvay by study and bathroom by study - b/ t 9 and 10 a. m.

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PHONE CALLS

conversation - approx. 30 min. - ML at home

conversation - b/ t 2: 00 a. m. and 3: 00 a. m. - ML at home - wimess list

GIFl’S/ NOTES ML TO WJC

antique paperweight depicting the WH

courier record - letter courier record - cassette tape

letter - ML give to Currie to give to Pres. - Not delivered until 12/ S

Christmas gift: antique standing cigar holder - - Other gifts: Stat- bucks Santa Monica mug - tie from London - book, &r . . amottc Prestdw - Hugs

and Kisses box courier record - card - peach candies

Hand painted Baster Egg - “gummy boobs” from Urban Outfitters

GIFTS/ NOTES WJC TO ML

Annie Lenox compact disc

large Rocket& s blanket from New York - pin of the New York skyline - a “marble- like” bear’s head from Vancouver - a pair of joke sunglasses - a small box of cherry chocolates - Black Dog canvas bag - Black Dog stuffed animal

IN - PERSON CONTACTS PHONE CALLS

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President Clinton is flanked by Georgia senatorial candidate Mkhael Coles as he speaks durrng a hd miset Thursday, July 9, 1998 tn Atlmta. Cola, who challenged House Speaker New Gin&& in 1996, is mmiq

Republican Sen. Paul Coverdell. (AP Photo/ Joe Marquette)

I _ _ _. _-, --.. -

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2 3 ____-___-_______--_______ x

4 DEPOSITION OF

5 MONICA S. LEWINSKY

6 ______-----___________-__ x

leposition of

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MONICA S. LEWINSKY lefore the Independent Counsel, held in the Conference Room If the Office of the Independent Counsel, Suite 490- North, -001 Pennsylvania Avenue, N. W., Washington, D. C. 20004, )eginning at 12: 35 p. m., when were present:

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For the Independent Counsel:

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KARIN IMMERGUT, ESQUIRE Associate Independent Counsel

18 19

MARY ANNE WIRTH, ESQUIRE Associate Independent Counsel

20 21 22 23

:ourt Reporter:

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6245 Executive Bmdrwrd Rockville, MD 20852

(301) 881.3344

Deposition Services, Inc.

2300 h4 Street. N. W. Suite 800 Washington, D. C. 20037

/?“, i 7L? c 171”

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OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL Wednesday, August 26, 1998 Washington, D. C.

Elizabeth A. Eastman

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.aving been called for examination by the Office of the ndependent Counsel, and having been first duly sworn by the .otary, was examined and testified as follows:

EXAMINATION BY COUNSEL FOR THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL

17 BY MS. IMMERGUT:

18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

Q Before we begin the deposition, I do want to advise ou of certain rights that you have in connection with this eposition. You have already, I know, testified twice before he grand jury, and essentially the same rights do apply.

First, you have a right to have an attorney present utside of the room. Do you have an attorney present?

A Yes, I do.

Q Who is that attorney?

PROCEEDINGS MS. IMMERGUT: We are on the record. Ms. Lewinsky, :ould you please state and spell your full name for the yecord?

MS. LEWINSKY: Monica Samille Lewinsky, M- O- N- I- C- A ;- A- M- I- L- L- E, L- E- W- I- N- S- K- Y.

MS. IMMERGUT: For the record, I am Karin Immergut jrom the Office of Independent Counsel. Seated with me is Iary Anne Wirth, also from the Office of the Independent lounsel. HEREUPON,

MONICA S. LEWINSKY

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A Plato Cacheris. Q You have the right to consult with Mr. Cacheris any zime during the testimony, and I simply ask that you just request a break when you need to consult with him. Do you understand that you have that right?

A Yes, I do. Q You also generally as a witness in a deposition, or aefore a grand jury, have a Fifth Amendment right not to incriminate yourself. Obviously, that now is modified pursuant to the agreement that you have with the Office of ;he Independent Counsel.

Do you understand that? A Yes. Q Have you seen the agreement that you have, giving JOU immunity for your cooperation in this case?

A Yes, I have. Q That also is a grand jury exhibit in this case, it not?

A Yes, it is. is

Q Do you have any questions about what your rights Ire not to incriminate yourself as part of that agreement?

A No, I don't. Q In addition, as always, you are required to tell zhe truth during this procedure and are subject to the penalties of perjury if you do not tell the complete truth.

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Do you understand that? A Yes, I do. Q Any other questions that you have before we proceed?

A No. Q First I just want to ask you a general question. I cnow you have testified in two other proceedings about Jarious aspects of your relationship with the President. Can you characterize whether or not your relationship was one :hat started with sex and then evolved into a friendship, or :he other way around?

A It started with a physical attraction, which led to 1 sexual relationship, and then the emotional and friendship aspects of that relationship developed after the beginning of )ur sexual relationship.

Q I would like to place before you what I will mark 2s Deposition exhibit No. 1.

(Deposition Exhibit No. 1 was marked for identification.) BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q This is also a Zrand Jury Exhibit ML #7 sticker on this exhibit, 3nd ask if you recognize

A Yes, I do. chart that was previously marked as

You can see the Xerox copy of that and I will place that before you, what that exhibit is?

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Q What do you recognize it to be? A A chart that I helped develop with the Off i Independent Counsel to describe and enumerate the --

5 ce of my relationship with the President, the contacts between the President and myself.

Q As you've testified before, did you provide the information that is on this chart?

A Yes, I did. Q And is it accurate to the best of your recol of the events?

.lection A Yes, it is.

Q What I would like to do is go through the events that are written in bold, which deal with the private encounters you had with the President that involved, for the most part, some sort of physical intimacy that we have listed as physical intimacy, including oral sex. I did want to get into some more detail about each incident.

Basically, with respect to each incident, I would like you to describe the circumstances leading up to the actual visit, who initiated it, how it was set up, and then I would like to ask you some details about the sexual encounters themselves that occurred during each of those visits.

so, why don't we start with the very first one, which is the second encounter that you had on November 15th,

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6 1995 that you've already testified some about. If you can, could you just tell us how that visit was set up, and then what occurred during the visit?

A The President came back to Mr. Panetta's office and I was the only person in the office at the time, and believe

it was maybe around, I think, 10 p. m. or so, and asked me, or told me that if I wanted to meet him back in Mr. Stephanopoulos' office in about 5- 10 minutes, that I could. And I told him I was interested to do that.

Q At that time, did you understand what it was he wanted to meet with you about?

A I had an idea. I, I, I had assumed that since we had been intimate in our previous encounter that evening, that we would again be intimate.

Q And just to clarify for the record, the intimacy that you had earlier that night was just kissing, is that correct?

A Yes. Q So, did you, in fact, go meet with the President? A Yes, I did. Q And could you describe where you went to meet him? A I met him back in Mr. Stephanopoulos' office and he invited me into the back study again, and we were in the hallway. And we were -- I don't remember exactly how it started. But I know that we were talking a bit and kissing.

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I remember -- 1 know that he -- I believe I unbuttoned my jacket and he touched my, my breasts with my bra on, and then

lifted either -- I don't remember if I unhooked my bra or he ny bra up, but he -- this is embarrassing.

breasts with his hands? Q Then touched your A Yes, he did. Q Did he touch your A Yes, he did. Q Did he touch your A Yes. We moved -- nis office, and so we moved office, and the lights were

breasts with his mouth? genital area at all that day? I believe he took a phone call in from the hallway into the back off. And at that point, he, he put his hand down my pants and stimulated me manually in the genital area.

Q And did he bring you to orgasm? A Yes, he did. Q Back to the touching of your breasts for a minute, #as that then through clothing or actually directly onto your skin?

A He touched my breasts through clothing, being my 3ra, and then also without my bra on.

Q On that occasion, did you perform oral sex on the President?

A Yes. Q Who actually initiated your performing oral sex?

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A I did.

Q Was the President wearing pants? A Yes, he was.

A rouble

Who unzipped his pants? I believe I went to go unbutton his pants and I had

rou from doing that? So, he did that. So, but --

So, you started it? If I remember correctly. And he helped complete opening Yes.

his pants? Did the President at that time do anything to stop

8 A No. I think he asked me if I was sure I wanted to lo that.

Q Did you have any other discussion with him while .he sexual encounter was occurring, about the sex or what you lere doing?

A No. Actually, I don't think he asked me if I were lure I wanted to do that, because he was on the telephone. Lo -- I'm sorry.

Could you repeat what you just asked me?

Q Did the President have any discussion with you about sex, or you with him, while the sexual encounter was occurring?

A Not at this time. He was on the telephone for the

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second half when we were in the office.

Q So, he was on performing oral sex?

A He was on the Q Touching you?

the telephone while you were telephone while he was --

A Touching me, and was also on the telephone when I was performing oral sex.

Q For any part of this sexual encounter, was he then off the telephone?

A Yes, I believe towards the end of my performing oral sex.

Q Did he say anything about the oral sex or anything about the sex at all when he got off the phone, that you can remember?

A He stopped me before he came, and I told him that I vanted to, to complete that. And he said that, that he leeded to wait until he trusted me more. And then I think he

A Yes. Q Did he ejaculate in your presence that time at all? A No. Q How did you depart from the office, or how did you end that visit?

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10 A I believe we spoke for awhile and I know at some

point in that conversation I -- oh, that might have been ?riday. Hmm. I really don't remember how it ended.

Q Can you estimate at all how long the sexual part of tour encounter with him lasted?

recall? A

Maybe 20 minutes? How long -- I'm not a very good estimator of times. How long did the entire encounter last, if you can

The second one of that evening? Yes. Maybe half an hour or 40 minutes? So, the entire encounter did not involve simply the sexual part of it?

A No, it didn't.

Q Did you have talk :alking afterwards?

A It was before and ing beforehand or was most of the

after.

Q If I can direct your attention again back to deposition Exhibit No. 1, the chart, the next date where you 10 have two encounters with the President is November 17th, -995. Although you've described it somewhat for the grand

jury, if you could now just describe in detail -- again, I'll direct your attention to that second contact where there was

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physical inti contact came

11 maw, including oral sex listed -- how that about and what occurred during the contact? A Yes. I had brought the President pizza, as he had asked. And when I brought it into him at the Oval Office, then he took me into the, to the back office and said that I could leave through that way. I believe we were talking for a little bit and he then, he got a phone call and he took the phone call in his bathroom.

Oh, it might have been before the phone call that -- I don't, I don't remember who, who unbuttoned my jacket or anything like that. But we were kissing and he was fondling my breasts with his hands and with his mouth.

Q Was that through clothing or not through clothing? A It was both.

Q Okay. So, was there a point that your bra is removed?

A Yes.

Q But you don't remember who actually removed it? A No. I think, I think he -- rather than necessarily removing my bra, sometimes he. would just expose my breasts.

Q By lifting the bra over your A Yes, or sometimes lifting my bra. Oh, God.

Q So, on that occasion though, touched you not just through your bra,

breasts? breasts out of the

you do recall that he but also directly on

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Yes.

Qi “_

Q Was there any discussion about sex while you were in this encounter with him?

A I don't remember the specifics of it, but I know there was another discussion, I think, about him not letting me make him come, and then I had to get back to -- I'm sorry.

Could you repeat the question? Q Was there any discussion during the November 17th encounter about sex during the encounter?

A I don't know exactly what you mean. I mean, do you mean either about --

Q Talking -- A I mean, saying things, or -- Q Well, either about what he wanted or what you wanted, or anything like that, in terms of sex?

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A No. I mean, I think that there were always things oeing said, but not necessarily in a conversational form. Ioes that make sense?

,Q Okay And when you say there were always things oeing said, do you mean kind of chatting while you were naving sex, or things that felt good? I don't mean that. I nean --

A Okay.

Q -- trying either implicitly giving you direction nbout what he wanted, or why he wouldn't ejaculate, anything Like that?

A I believe that why he wouldn't ejaculate was, was discussed again.

Q Okay. You mentioned that the President unzipped lis pants. Did you understand that to be a signal of what he vanted in terms of sex?

A Yes. Q Did he ever say anything while that was happening about what he wanted or no?

A Q A

Q )erf ormed

No. He was on the telephone. Okay. And that was on the second time also? Yes. Was he on the telephone the whole time that you oral sex on him on the 17th of November? I don't remember.

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ing up Q DO you remember how you finished that meet with him that day, how you left?

A Yes. I know I needed to get back to my office, and he -- I think I told him that he should come down and have pizza with us, he should bring his pizza down, and that everyone was down there. And at some point I believe in that meeting he told me that, or he reiterated because he might have said it on the 15th as well, that I could come see him on the weekends when, when there weren't a lot of people around.

Q With respect again to the ejaculation, that he uouldn't actually ejaculate during oral sex, were you aware, or did he ejaculate anywhere in your presence on that 2ccasion?

A No.

Q The next date listed on the chart is December 31st, 1995, a Sunday. Could you describe how that meeting was set up and what occurred when you got to the meeting?

A Yes. I had been having a conversation with Nel and lad just told him that I smoked my first cigar the night lefore in honor of my brother's birthday. And Nel asked me if I wanted -- or offered that he could get me one of the ?resident's cigars from his sort of stash of cigars. I said, :hat would be great.

And we went through the Roosevelt Room to the

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15 entrance into the back study which -- the door that leads

into the dining room. And just as we approached the door, the door swung open and the President was standing right there, and he had something he was going to take to Mr. Panetta. So, he asked, he asked Nel to take this -- I think it was a picture actually -- a picture down to Mr. Panetta, and he invited me in.

so, I went into the office uas doing there. And -- well, first looking for me. And then he told me eras doing there, and I told him that

and he asked me what I he told me he had been -- he asked me what I Nel was going to get me a cigar. So, he said that he would give me a cigar. So, he did give me a cigar.

And then we were talking for a little bit and I had -- do you want me to just

Q If you could do A Well, he had -- ny name before, because I zimes and he kept calling

be -- a narrative, that's fine. I had thought that he had forgotten had seen him in the hall a few me "Kiddo". So, so, I sort of reiterated my -- I said my name again to him. You know, I said, you know, it's Monica Lewinsky, President Kiddo, you cnow. And he said, I know your name.

And he told me that he had tried to call me and zhat -- he said, but you're not in the book; I even spelled {our last name right. So, it was, it was really funny. It

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was cute. And then we were, we were kissing and he lifted my sweater and exposed my breasts and was fondling them with his hands and with his mouth. And then I believe I was fondling him over his pants in his genital area, and I think again I tried to unbutton his pants and I couldn't. So, he did it.

Q And again, just to be clear, when you mentioned he raised your sweater and fondled your breasts, were your breasts outside of your bra at that time?

A Yes. QY 12

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18 A 19 20

Q Did you have any why he wasn't ejaculating, 21 A 22 23 24 25

_- the know me sort of

Q discussion with him again about

anything like that?

Yes, I think so. It might have been at that time two excuses he always used were, one, that he didn't well enough or he didn't trust me yet. So that it seemed to be some bizarre issue for him.

On that occasion, did he ever ejaculate in your.

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even though not -- at any time later? After he told me to stop and then, and then wished 3 ne Happy New Year and kissed me goodbye, he went into the

Q Okay. Do you know how long that sexual encounter, >r the sexual aspect of that encounter lasted, not including 8 9 10 11 12 13

. We would 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

:he other discussion with him? A Maybe 10 minutes. Not, not very long always spend quite a bit of time kissing. So.

Q And kissing and talking and just -- A Uh- huh. Q -- being affectionate? A Yes.

Q The next one is on page 2, and that would be Tanuary 7th of '96. Could you describe how that meeting was set up and what happened when you got there?

A Yes. The President called me -- this is the first :ime he called me at home -- that afternoon, and it was the First day of the blizzard. And I asked him what he was doing md he said he was going to be going into the office soon. I laid, oh, do you want some company. And he said, oh, that vould be great. So, he said he was going into the office in &out 45 minutes, and I told him that I should probably be in my office around that time, and he said he would call me in

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my office. I gave him my Then once I was

18 office number. in my office, he called me and we made an arrangement that I would pass -- he would have the

door to his office open, and I would pass by the office with some papers and then he would, he would sort of stop me and invite me in. So, that was exactly what happened.

I passed by and that was actually when I saw Lew Fox who was on duty outside the Oval Office, and stopped and apoke with Lew for a few minutes, and then the President came >ut and said, oh, hey, Monica, you know, what are you doing nere, come on in, sort of.

And so we spoke for about 10 minutes in the office. #e sat on the sofas. Then we went into the back study and we yere intimate in the bathroom.

Q And when you say you were intimate in the bathroom, vhat did you do?

A We kissed and he, he fondled my breasts and exposed -- or I think pulled them out of my bra and fondled them with 1i. s hands and with his mouth, and --

Q Did A No.

he touch your genitals on that occasion? He wanted to and was talking about performing )ral sex on me,

Q- AB

Q Okay. On that date, did you gratify him in some

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24 way other than performing oral sex?

A Yes.

19 A I 0 A -

Q - A-

Q Did you have any discussion about sex during the encounter that you had with him?

A No.

Q How long was your encounter with him? A Hmm. Maybe, about half an hour? I, I'm -- it's really hard for me to estimate the time.

Q And that would be the sexual aspect of it though 25 that --

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20 A Correct.

Q -- we're talking about. Did he ejaculate at any Point in your presence after you performed oral sex on him?

A That day?

Q Yes.

A No. MS. IMMERGUT: Did you have a question? BY MS. WIRTH:

Q I have a question, actually going back to November 15th, if you don't mind.

A Okay.

Q When you were talking about the President having contact with your genitals, you said, I think, that he put his hands in your pants. When he touched your genitals, was that through your underwear or directly?

A I didn't have my underwear on at that point.

Q Okay. So, it was directly then? A Yes.

Q Okay. BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q The next encounter listed is January 21st of '96, also on page 2 of the exhibit. Could you describe how that encounter occurred and what happened during the encounter?

A Yes. I was -- actually, I'm looking at this right now and I think it might have been a Saturday -- no, it was a

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Sunday. I'm sorry. Never mind. a Saturday, but it, it says here that.

I think it might have been Sunday. I just noticed

I was -- 1 had been in my office doing work, and I 21

was leaving, leaving for the day. And as I was walking through the Residence hall to go through the West Wing to the 31d Executive Office Building, I heard his voice behind me. And either he called my name or I just heard his voice and turned around, and he had just come off of the elevator and, I guess, was going back to his office.

So, we were, we were -- we stopped, and we spoke as we continued to walk through the outdoor corridor by the Rose 3arden. And when we got to the point where he turns left to then go into the Oval Office, he told me that I could go out this way with him, that I could leave through the, that I could leave through the Oval Office. So, we walked down the _

pathway together and then went into the Oval Office from there.

Q And could you describe your encounter once you got into the Oval Office?

A Yes. We had, we had already had phone sex for the first time the week prior, and I was feeling a little bit insecure about whether he had liked it or didn't like it, and I just -- 1 felt in general that I didn't know -- from having spoken to him on the phone, you know, prior to having phone

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22 sex and from having had these encounters with him, I didn't know if this was sort of developing into some kind of a longer term relationship than what I thought it initially might have been, that maybe he had some regular girlfriend who was furloughed or something during the furlough.

And at that point, I, you know, I said to him, you know, I asked him why he doesn't ask me any questions about myself, and doesn't he, you know, is this just about sex, you know, because if it is, then I just want to know that; or do you have some interest in trying to get to know me as a person. And so he kind of laughed at the manner in which I aas asking him and talking to him.

And we, we went into the back study and he was, he tias waiting for a friend of his to come to the office, and he tias talking about that he has a lot of -- that he doesn't get a lot of time to himself and he really cherishes the private zimes that he has with his friends, and he cherishes the time zhat he had with me, which seemed a little bit odd to me at zhat time.

But he, he was upset that day about the first soldier in Bosnia had been -- I believe it was that day -- zhat it was the first soldier in Bosnia had been killed just recently, and he was very upset and moved. And so I was zrying to comfort him.

Q When you say you thought it was odd that he said he

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cherished the time with you, why was that, why did you think it was odd at that point?

A Because I didn't feel, I didn't feel like he really knew me. We had spent time talking, but it didn't seem -- and, you know, he had asked some questions and I offered a lot of information about myself. But he didn't seem to ask probing questions, when you're trying to get to know someone. So, it seemed a little bit odd to me that he would sort of cherish this time, when he, you know, when I felt like he didn't really even know me yet.

Q And at that point, sex was sort of the more dominant part of the relationship?

A Yes. Q Rather than as it became -- A There was always a lot of joking that went on between us. And so we, you know, I mean, it was fun. When we were together, it was fun. We would laugh and it would -- we were very compatible sexually. And I've always felt that he was sort of my sexual soulmate, and that I just felt very connected to him when it came to those kinds of things.

Q So, on the January 21st date -- A Right.

Q -- how did it turn into your conversation and then go into actually having a sexual encounter?

A I was in the middle of saying something and he just

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started kissing me. And, so, it was funny. It was, it was very funny.

Q And what room were you physically in at that time? A We were in the hallway. And we were kissing and -- oh, I had -- because I was leaving, I was having a bad hair day, and this was actually the first time that I had the infamous beret on. And so I just said something to him about feeling stupid. Here I was standing here in this dumb hat, and he said that it wasn't a dumb hat, that I looked cute and he liked it.

And so then he was kissing me, or we were kissing each other, I guess, and I think again he, he fondled my breasts with his hands and his mouth.

Q Through clothing or not through clothing? A I think it was always through clothing, and then eventually it, it would be direct contact. So, it wouldn't just be this immediate jump to being, you know, to contact. It was -- there was sort of foreplay to the foreplay, if that makes sense.

Q Do you remember whether he removed any of your clothing on that occasion?

A I think he'-- I remember him lifting my top. So -- and he, he sort of exposing my breasts.

Q Did he stimulate your genitals on that occasion? A No.

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Q Did you perform oral sex on him or any kind of sex on him?

A Yes, I did.

Q Could you describe how that came about? A Yes. He unzipped his pants and sort of exposed himself and that -- and then I performed oral sex.

Q Let me ask, on all of these occasions when you've described just to say that he

A Yes. the pants unzipping and exposing, is it fair

still kept his pants on?

Q It was just the zipper that -- A Yes.

Q -_ was undone? A Right. And actually at one point during this encounter, I. think someone came into the, to the Oval Office and he, you know, zipped up real quickly and went out and came back in, and I -- this is probably too much information. I just -- sorry.

Q And what happened? A I just remember laughing because he had walked out there and he was visibly aroused, and I just thought it was funny. I mean, it wouldn't, it wouldn't necessarily be visible to anyone who just walked in because they wouldn't be looking at that, but it was just funny to me. So.

And then his -- then someone -- I think at that

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26 point someone came in to let him know that his friend had arrived. And so he asked me which way I wanted to leave, and I said I was going to go, I was going to leave through Betty's office. And we went into -- we went from the back study through the Oval into Betty's office area, and he took me into Nancy Hernreich's office and kissed me goodbye.

And then I went to go leave from, from Betty's office, from the door into the hallway, hallway, but it was locked. So, I went He was still in Nancy's office. I went office to tell him the door was locked, stimulating himself.

to the West Wing back in to tell him. back into Nancy's and he was manually

Q Did he cause himself to ejaculate at that point, or did you see that?

A No.

Q But that was in Nancy Hernreich's office? A Yes.

Q And what did you do when you saw that? A I smiled.

Q Okay. A And I think we kissed again.

Q On that occasion, you mentioned that he did not touch your genitals at all. Was there any discussion about that?

A No.

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Q Then did you leave from Nancy Hernreich's office eventually?

A I think I left through the -- I left through the door in Betty's office that goes out into the Rose Garden.

Q On this particular entry on January 21st, it lists that the entire encounter was approximately 30 to 40 minutes. Do you recall what portion of that would have been the sexual encounter

A Q A

Q part of it, versus just talking?

Maybe 15 minutes? You just can't really estimate? Exactly. Let's go now to February 4th of 1996, the next bold date where there was a private encounter. Could you describe how that encounter came about and what happened?

A Yes. I was in my office on Sunday and the President called me in the office and -- from the Residence, and told me that he was going to be going into the office later. And I think I asked him if I could come see him. And he said that would be fine, and then that he -- oh, I think he was, he said he was going to go into the office in an hour and a half or so.

So, then he called me -- it was actually maybe two or three hours later, because I remember I thought he forgot, maybe he had forgotten to call me and that he called from the Residence to say he was

-- so. And when on his way, I told

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him that -- 1 asked him if we could sort of bump into the hallway, bump into each other in the hallway time, because when it happened accidentally, work really well and I felt more comfortable that's what we did. We both said, okay, I'm now.

on purpose this that seemed to doing that. SO, going to leave

And indeed we bumped into each other in the hall and went through the Rose Garden into the Oval Office. And I think we went right into the back office. The -- when we got there.

Q When you say the back office, you mean the study? A Yes. And -- let's see.

You know, I need to take a break.

Q Okay. Let's take a break. (Whereupon, the deposition was recessed from 1: lO p. m. until 1: 15 p. m.)

BY MS. IMMERGUT:

Q Ms. Lewinsky, you are still under oath. A Yes.

Q We are still on February 4th, 1996. You've lescribed going into the office and starting to kiss the ?resident. What happened then?

A We were in the back office and we were kissing, and

[ was -- I had a dress on that buttoned all the way, all the uay up and down.

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Q To the neck? A Correct. It was long and down to the, to my ankles, or whatever. And he unbuttoned my dress and he unhooked my bra, and sort of took the dress off of my shoulders and took the bra off of my, off of my -- I'm not explaining this right. So that he moved the bra so that my bra was kind of hanging on one shoulder and so was off. And he just was, he was looking at me and touching me and telling ne how beautiful I was.

Q And did he touch your breasts with his hands? A Yes.

Q Did he also touch them with his mouth? A Yes.

Q And at that point, that is directly on your skin, is that right?

A Yes.

Q Did he touch your genitals? A Yes, he did.

Q Did he bring you to orgasm on that date? A Yes, he did.

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Q And again, just with respect to bringing you to an orgasm, did he touch you directly on your skin on your genitals, or was it through underwear?

A First it was through underwear and then it was directly touching my genitals.

Q Did he take your underwear off, or did you take your underwear off?

A Hmm.

Q Or did they stay on? A I think that -- I believe that he touched me first aith my underwear on, and then placed his hand under my mderwear. And I think at some point I, I removed them.

Q Okay. Did you also perform oral sex on him at that

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time? A Yes, I did. Q How did it come about? Was that something that you decided to do, or did the President either, through his actions or words, indicate to you that he wanted that?

A I don't really remember. I mean, it was a mutual -- 1 think in all of these instances, it wasn't, you know -- 1 know sometimes it's sort of hard to answer these questions as more directed. But it was -- I mean, it was the course of

ng intimate. I mean, it was the course of having this kind of a relationship, that you -- sometimes he initiated it, sometimes I initiated it. It wasn't, you know, it wasn't

-- it didn't necessarily go through my mind, time to perform oral sex.

I mean, it was, it was the passion That was, I mean, just sort of in the course

okay, now it's of the moment. of things that happened, you know. I always felt that we sort of just, we both really went to a, to a whole other place together sexually.

Q Is it fair to say you were both trying to please each other by doing different things?

A Yes. Yes.

Q Is it also fair to say that you were not the sole aggressor in this sexual --

A That's very fair to say.

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Q -_ encounter? A I was not. Q Again, I'm just asking you every time in case you remember, do you remember how long the sexual aspect of that encounter lasted?

A I really, I really don't. Q Okay. I just note, to direct your attention that

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the time that you provided us previously is approximately one and a half hours for the whole visit.

A Right. We spent a long time in the Oval Office talking after, maybe 45 minutes to an hour just talking.

Q And that -- A I think he was maybe heeding my, my advice from, from the 21st, about trying to get to know me, and so he did.

Q And is it fair to say that's sort of when the friendship really starts to develop, around that time period?

A It does. That certainly helped. I think he, he was just very sweet, and he -- when I got up to leave, he kissed my arm and told me he'd call me, and then I said, yeah, well, what's my phone number. And so he recited both my home number and my office number off the top of his head.

so, I told him, you know, that he got an A. And he called me in my office later that afternoon to tell me how much he enjoyed talking to me. so -- and then again called Wednesday night to tell me again how much he had

1 enjoyed talking to me.

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So, it -- I think that certainly was a turning point in the relationship, where it kind of went from a -- obviously there's, there's some personal and intimate aspects of a sexual relationship that develop just in talking or laughing or getting to the point where you, where you kiss someone on every encounter. But for me, I think that spending the time talking to him was certainly when I, when I got to know him as a person and started to realize that he wasn't necessarily the person I thought he was at that point.

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Q Let's move on to the next date, which is March 31st, 1996, the next encounter where there is physically intimate contact. Why don't you tell us how that date was set up and what happened?

A I had spoken -- well, just to back up real quickly. The President had ended things on the, I think it was the _ 19th of February. But then he had called me later -- I think it was late February or early March at some point -- indicating to me he wanted to sort of see me again, possibly for some intimate moments. _

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And it wasn't until the 31st of March that we really were together again physically. But he had called, I think two times, two times prior during that work week, leading up to the 31st. And it was on the Friday night which is, looking at the chart, which was the 29th, that I, I asked

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34 him if I could see him on Sunday. And he said, he'd, you

k, now, he'd see what he could do. And then on Sunday, he called me in my office and -- let's see. I believe -- oh, I believe that I brought him papers that day. That I think I asked him to tell the guard outside that he was expecting some papers, expecting someone from Leg Affairs. And then them that I was supposed to

Q And that was A Yes.

Q -- get in to A Exactly.

Q Just to back qou had had some phone

part when I got to the door, I told

bring papers to the President. of a ruse to --

see him? up for a second, you mentioned that calls with him between February 19th, '96 when he tried to cut off the relationship --

A Yes.

Q -- or the sexual part of the relationship -- A Correct.

Q -- and the 31st, in which he had suggested that he vanted to perhaps renew the intimacy. What led you to relieve that?

A I saw him on my way out one evening. It was late. Ind he was on his way home from, I think it was the Israeli Dnbassy and Evelyn Lieberman was with him. So, I certainly nade a point of not having any eye contact or anything with

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him. And he called me later that evening and said he had, he had -- after he left and went upstairs, he went back to his office and had called me in my office, hoping that I could come have a visit with him, but I had already gone home.

And so then I offered, I said, well, I could come back. And he said, no, I'm upstairs already. So.

Q Back now to March 31st -- A Yes. Q -- of '96. So, what happens then? How actually is that then finally set up?

A He had called me in my office and then I brought oapers there, or fake papers.

Q Do you then go into the Oval Office? A Yes, I do. Q And what happens? A We went into the back study and we were in the, the nallway area. And it had sort of become actually a ritual sort of at this point, that we always kind of started out our neetings, that he was leaning against the closed door of the oathroom and I would rub his back, because he has a bad back.

SO, I used to always rub his back, and sometimes he'd rub my oack. But I usually concentrated on his lower back because it was always bothering him.

And, you know, and then I'd usually move around and sort of just lovingly touch his chest and --

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Q Was there any removal of clothing? A Yes, there was. We kissed and, and he had not been feeling well, I guess, the past couple of days. So, really, lost of -- he focused on me pretty exclusively, I guess, in a ;exual manner on me jreasts, and he, he

that day, and kissed me, and kissed my fondled my genitals with his hands.

Q Through clothing or not through clothing? A Not through clothing.

Q Did you have your underwear removed? Or how did Tour clothes get off?

Dh. was

A (No response .) Q Or were they simply pulled out of the way? A I think I -- 1 think that they were just sort of --

Q Pulled out of the way? A Yeah.

Q Okay. So, he touched you. And with your breasts, that through clothing, through your brassiere, or did he move your breasts out of the way of the brassiere?

A It was, it was both_. I mean, it was always both. He -- there was never a time when he just touched my breasts through

The bra? -- the bra, right.

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A Yes.

Q Whose idea was that? A On -- when I met with him on January 7th, after we had been intimate and we were talking in the Oval Office, he was chewing on a cigar. And then he had the cigar in his hand and he was kind of looking at the cigar in a, sort of a naughty way. And so I, I looked at the cigar and I looked at him and I said, we can do that, too, some time.

And I don't, I don't really remember how it got started, but.

that? A

perform A

A looking brought

Was it part of the sexual encounter that he did

Yes, it was. Did you understand it to be arousing? It was. Okay. What happened to the cigar afterwards?

How did you leave that encounter? So, you didn't oral sex on him at all that time?

No. How -- Actually, looking also -- I should mention that, at the chart, that I didn't bring papers that day. I this tie to him in a folder. So, sometimes I brought

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papers and this day it was I had a tie, and there probably were some papers in the folder as well.

Q And that's the Hugo Boss tie that's listed under the gift category for that date?

A Correct.

Q The next encounter is April i'th, 1996. Could you describe how that encounter was set up?

A The President had called me at home sort of in the early evening, and this was -- it was Easter Sunday and it tias the first, it was the Sunday after I had found out I was co be transferred to the Pentagon. And he called lad been the week that Ron Brown had passed away.

__ it also So, I asked him how he was doing and we talked shout that for a little bit. And then I told him that Monday uas my last day, and that I had been transferred. And I was :rying and he wanted to know what happened, and I asked him .f I could come see him. And he said, that's fine, but just :ell me what happened first. So, I explained to him what had lappened, and then he told me to come on over. So, I did.

And this is when I had this little encounter trying zo get into the office with John Muskett, just that he said -- I brought papers with me from home in a folder. And so John had said something about wanting to check with Evelyn if .t was okay for me to go in. And I don't remember exactly that ended up happening, but I managed to get him to not ask

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Evelyn and I got in. And the President and I were in the back office. He was actually on the phone when I came in. And then when

he got off the phone, we went into the back office and we talked again about what had happened, in terms of my transfer.

And that was when he, he looked me in the eye and he promised me -- well, first he said that he couldn't believe that they were taking me away from him because he trusted me so much, and he was convinced that it had something to do with him, why I was then he looked me in the eye and he win in November, I'll have you back fingers].

Q Did he say anything like, the Pentagon he'll bring you back?

A No. Q So, what else happened at

being transferred. And said, I promise you, if I like that [snapping

if you do a good job at that meeting? A I, I don't remember how it exactly came about, but I know that, that, I remember kissing him and we were physically intimate.

President A

In terms of the physical intimacy that day, did the touch your genitals on that date? I don't think so. What about your breasts?

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A Q A

Q that it's

A Q

Yes. 40

With his mouth or with his hands, or both? With both. And again, I'm assuming, unless you correct me now, both through clothing and directly on the skin?

Yes.

With respect to oral sex, do you just remember how that occurred, whether his pants came off, unzipped them?

whether somebody A I think he unzipped them and -- because it was sort of this running joke that I could never unbutton his pants, that I just had trouble there were times that I he'd do it.

with it. So, I was -- you know, tried and we'd laugh and then he'd,

But we were -- I, I performed oral sex in the, in the back office.

Q And at that time, did he ejaculate? A No, he did not. Q Was there any discussion with him about the ejaculation at that time that- you can remember?

A No. Q On that date, I think you've already testified that there was a phone call during your sexual encounter with him, is that right?

A Yes, there was.

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Q Did you perform oral sex while he was on the telephone?

A Yes. It was, it was -- I think 1'11 just say, because for -- there are a lot of people that could interpret that as being sort of a, that being done 'in a servicing sort of manner, and it was more done in kind of an exciting sort of -- I don't want to say erotic, but in a way that there was kind of this titillating like a secret, in a sense, in the same way sometimes that an affair is, that, you know, when you are doing this and obviously there is kind of the irony that the person on the other line has no idea what's going on.

So, I just wanted to clarify that.

Q Okay. Although on that occasion, I believe you previously mentioned that that was the first time that you felt a little funny about it?

A I, I did. I did. I, I, I, I was, I was pretty emotionally devastated at that point, and the prospect of going to the Pentagon was very upsetting to me. And there were moments when I felt a little uncomfortable, and moments when I didn't.

Q Although you mentioned that there were other times that he was on the phone, that you didn't think sort of anything bad about it --

A Right.

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Q -_ and on this occasion, you felt more like -- A I just --

Q -- you were servicing -- A Exactly.

Q -- on some level. And did you tell Linda Tripp about that, do you remember?

A Probably.

Q How did that encounter end, if you remember? And actually you've already testified a little bit about this. so, just if you could quickly summarize how you finished the encounter and what happened?

A We were in the back office and I heard Mr. Ickes call, say, Mr. President, from the Oval Office. And we both were startled and looked at each other, and he jetted into the Oval and I --

Q Were you performing oral sex at the time? A I think so, but I'm not a hundred percent sure. And so then I, I left.

Q On that occasion also, when the President went to get the phone call, had you started performing oral sex on him before he went to take the phone call?

A Yes, I believe that we were -- I think that that was it. I know that we were, we were intimate in the hallway, and then it was a phone call that prompted us to go into the office. And that when we were in the office, that,

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43 that he, he removed, he sort of removed his pants.

Q How did you know that you were supposed to kind of accompany him to take the phone call? Did he --

A I don't remember.

Q -- invite you to come in, in any way, or gesture

for you to come along? A I don't really remember.

Q So, you think you actually didn't begin the oral sex until he was on the phone already?

A It's --

Q Or is it not that clear? A It's not that clear.

Q But you remember him point?

A At some point, yes.

Q Before the oral sex? A Yes.

Q Okay. A I hope so.

Q At that point, and I unzipping his pants at some

didn't really ask you this for :he other encounters, but in terms of putting your stuff back on or collecting yourself, is there any sort of general way :hat that happened? Did the President help you, or how did you get dressed again?

A Well, neither of us ever really took -- completely

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44 took off any piece of our clothing, I think specifically because of the possibility of encounters, like what happened that day. But there had, earlier in that day on the 7th, when I -- not earlier in the day, but earlier in the encounter with the President -- when he had been kissing my breasts, someone had come in, I think to tell him he had the phone call, or something like that.

Or someone had come in at some point out of the office, and I had put my bra and my

and he stepped sweater back on. done

And he came in and sort of made a remark about me having that. And --

Q Do you remember the remark? A I think he smirked and he sort of said, you know, damn, you put your top back on, or something like that. Or, why did you do that, something like that. But he was smirking and joking with me.

But then when he went into the Oval, when Mr. Ickes came in, I put myself together and hurried out the back way through the dining room.

Q The next encounter. _ There's luckily a big gap there. The next one is February 28th. How was this encounter set up, and then what happened?

A Betty called me at work to tell me, or

to the radio address for that evening. And so I to invite me

went.

Q Did she say anything about that you would see the

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45 President on that date, or --

A Yes. I mean, she, she had indicated to me the President wanted me to come to this radio address. So that -- and I knew that he had -- we had spoken earlier that month and the month before, and the month before that, and I knew he had a Christmas gift for me which he had yet to give me.

30, it sort of seemed, it was understandable. I went to the radio address. And then -- it was a very small group, maybe 10 people, six, 10 people. It was quite small. And after -- or when I went to go take my picture with him, he told me to go see Betty or go wait with 3etty because he had something to give me. So, I went into 3etty's office and was waiting there with her. There were some other people there, staff members. And I think I've gone through the whole --

Q And you've actually testified in some detail about this before.

A Right.

Q so, actually, why don't we just go to the sexual encounter --

A Okay.

Q __ and how the actual sexual part started? A Once we were alone in the back office, he started to say something to me and I was pestering him to kiss me, because I hadn't -- we hadn't been alone in almost a year and

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46 __ well, I guess not a year, but it had been a long time

since we had been alone. And so he, you know, he jokingly cold me to, you know, just wait a set, he wanted to give me ny presents.

So, he gave me my hatpin and he sort of hurriedly put the Leaves Of Grass in my purse and he said, here, just take this with me. And then I said, what is it. I took the

book out and so we, we were looking at it, and I was just, I thought it was pretty incredible. It was just a beautiful, beautiful book, and it meant a lot to me.

And then we went back over by the bathroom in the hallway, and we kissed. We were kissing and he unbuttoned dress and fondled my breasts with my bra on, and then took them out of my bra and was kissing them and touching them with his hands and with his mouth.

And I continued to perform oral sex and then he pushed me away, kind of as he always did before he came, and then I stood up and I said, you know, I really, I care about you so much; I really, I don't understand why you won't let

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me, you know, make you come; it's important to me 47

; I mean, it just doesn't feel complete, it doesn't seem right.

And so he -- we hugged. And, you know, he said he didn't want to get addicted to me, and he didn't want me to get addicted to him. And we were each other and then, you know, he he said,

just sort of looking at sort of, he looked at me,

okay. And so then I finished. Did he touch your genitals at all during that occasion, do you remember?

A I think through my tights, but not direct genital.

Q How did the meeting A We, well, we kissed

Q The ejaculation? A Yes. And then I

30, I think -- no, no, no, then end, or the encounter?

after -- think Betty knocked on the door. no, no, that's not right, because I fixed my lipstick. So, I think we sort of -- I think he said, oh, you've got to put yourself back together again. hd so then I went and I got my lipstick and I put my Lipstick back on, and then Betty knocked on the door.

Q The dress that you were wearing on this occasion, is that the blue dress from the Gap?

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48 A Unfortunately, yes.

Q And I think we've already gone into detail about the dress on that. The next encounter is March 29th, 1997. Would you tell us

A It was, Betty.

Q Did you A Yes. I understanding was

how that encounter was set up? it was set up through my conversations with

contact Betty? contacted Betty and Betty -- my Betty spoke with the President, and then Betty got in touch with me and told me to come that afternoon. I did. I was waiting for the President in the back study and then he hobbled in because he was on crutches. And we were, we were in the back office. Actually, it was sort of an overcast day. It had been raining earlier. So, it was just sort of dark and overcast.

And we were, he was -- I think he had put his crutches down and he was kind of leaning on me. So, I was holding him, you know, I mean, sort of romantically but at the same time literally holding him. And --

Q This is in the back- study? A Uh- huh, yes. And I was -- this was another one of those occasions when I was babbling on about something, and he just kissed me, kind of to shut me up, I think. And so we were kissing and then we sort of -- we turned around and he was leaning against -- he has a little, it's like a little

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table that I think has this stereo. I don't know if the stereo was always there. I know it was there later. But he

was leaning against this little table a little bit just, I think, kind of for support.

And he unbuttoned my blouse and just sort of touched me over, over my bra. And I don't think he took, I don't think he exposed my breasts that day. And we were, we were just kissing a lot.

And then he -- oh, he went to go put his hand down my pants, and then I unzipped them because it was easier. And I didn't have any panties on. And so he manually stimulated me.

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Q Did he bring you to orgasm? A Yes, four times.

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21 22 23 24 25 Q How did you end the contact with him on that

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occasion? A End the sexual contact? Or --

Q The sexual contact?

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50 A He -- oh, well, this was also the day that before, before I performed oral sex on him, I wanted him to touch my genitals with his genitals. And so we sort of had tried to do that, but because he's really tall and he couldn't bend because of his knee, it didn't really work.

Q And I think you've previously testified your genitals grazed each other --

A Exactly.

Q -- on that occasion? A I mean, just barely.

Q And when they grazed each other, neither of you had clothes covering your genitals, is that right?

A Correct.

Q How did you end the encounter completely that time, in terms of ending the meeting?

A Oh, we moved into the dining room and we were talking for a long time. I had brought some presents for him. So, we talked for awhile. And then Betty came back and the three of us were talking.

Q Let's move on to the next one, which is August 16th, 1997.

A I -- this was sort of his, his birthday, his

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birthday encounter. And so after -- I had set up in his back office, I had brought an apple square and put a candle and had put his birthday presents out. And after he came back and I sang happy birthday and he got his presents, I asked

in him if we could, if we could share a birthday kiss in honor of our birthdays, because mine had been just a few weeks before. So, he said that that was okay and we could kind of bend the rules that day.

And so we, we, we kissed. And then I was touching him in his genital area through his shorts, and then I, I went to, to --

Q Perform oral sex? A Yes, and he wouldn't let me.

Q Did he touch you on your genitals on that date? A No. Q Any other physical contact that is referred to as physical intimacy on that date?

A Not that I remember. Q How did you end that encounter with him? Any discussion about sex during that encounter, or not having

sex?

A No, just he got upset when I, you know, when he stopped me and he said, I'm trying to not do this and I'm trying to be good. And he, he got visibly upset. And so I, I hugged him and I told him I was sorry and not to be upset,

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ind I was a little shocked, actually. I didn't -- he just seemed to get so emotionally Little bit strange to me.

Q And he hadn't done upset about it. It seemed a

that before? A He had been lefore, but not --

zorrect? A

With regard Correct.

-- stopping Exactly.

emotionally visibly upset with me to -- you from having sex with him? Or having sexual contact with him? Is that

Yes.

And is that, other than any brief kiss, the last lhysically intimate

A Well, our passionate. So.

Q Okay. It contact that you've had with him?

Christmas kiss was -- I mean, it was was -- A I don't call it a brief kiss.

Q That was a physically intimate kiss. Any other contact that would fall within the sexual relations definition --

A No.

Q _- that we've previously seen? A I think we, you know, we would, we would joke with

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53 each other sexually. And so sometimes, you know, I might hit him on the butt, or he might hit me on the butt, but it wasn't -- not under the definition.

Q So, it wouldn't be a real intent to arouse, or not the physical touching that is described --

A No.

Q -- in the definition? A No.

Q All right. Let's move on to another topic. A Yea.

Q Thank you for your patience. I know that those are not easy questions to get to.

A It's just hard thinking my dad might see this.

Q Why don't we move to another emotional topic, July 4th, just briefly. Is now a good time to --

A Sure.

Q -- talk about that? Why don't you tell us -- I know that you've brought up in your grand jury testimony that July 4th of 1997 was an emotional day for you in connection with your

relationship with the President. Yes. Could you just briefly tell us what you meant by that and just a little bit about your meeting with him on that date?

A Our meeting had started out in, as a, in a fight.

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We -- and early on in this fight, I started crying, and then he -- we were in the back office and he came over and was hugging me and told me not to cry, to stop crying, and was very -- he was very sweet, and was very gentle.

And then we -- I -- there was a gardener outside. So, when I noticed the gardener, I pointed it out and we moved to the, into the hallway by the bathroom. And much of the discussion that day was he spent a lot of time talking to me, you know, about the kind of person he thought I was, and -- I'm a little bit modest. So, it's sort of -- it's hard for me to get into all the things he said. But, there just --

Q Did he say wonderful things about you? A He did.

Q Like what kinds of things? A Just that he thought I was smart and beautiful, and that -- you know, but that a lot of it, it centered around my needing to learn to, to sort of squelch a bit of the fire in my belly. And that, you know, he said that people like us who, you know, have a tendency to get really angry and that there are a lot of other people that, that, that don't understand that and don't know how to handle that.

And he just -- he spent a lot of time talking to me. He was very, very -- he was the most affectionate with me he'd ever been. There wasn't a second when he wouldn't be

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55 touching me, whether it was holding my hand or stroking my arm or, you know, he'd kiss my neck at one point. It was just -- or he'd, you know, put his hands, he was running his hands through my hair and touching my face. And my bra strap kept falling down my shoulder. So, he kept pushing my bra strap up.

It was just very -- it was intense. It was just really emotionally intense.

And at one point, we, we had been talking about -- I made some remarks to him about his relationship with Mrs. Clinton. And he, he remarked a little bit later than that that he wished he had more time for me. And so I said, well, maybe you will have more time in three years. And I was actually sort of thinking just when he wasn't President, he was going to have more time on his hands. And he said, well, I don't know, I might be alone in three years.

And then of being together. be a good team, or

I said something about, you know, us sort I think I kind of said, oh, I think we'd something like that. And he, you know, he jokingly said, well, what are_ we going to do when I'm 75 and I have to pee 25 times a day. And I, you know, I told him that we'd deal with that. And it was -- there was just this incredible connection.

And I, I left that day sort of emotionally stunned, because I felt -- I was shocked. But I thought, I mean, he

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be 56 1 was -- 1 just knew he was in love with me, and from the way 2 he acted that day, and that's not, it's not something that I 3 would, that I would think easily. It's not a conclusion that 4 I would come to easily at all. And it just -- with the kind 5 of person I am. 6 And I knew I was in love with him, you know, a year 7 before, and I thought he cared about me. But just the way he

8 looked at me and touched me, and the things he said, it just 9 -- it was so obvious to me. And it was shocking. So, it was 10 a bizarre day. 11 Q Anything else about the 4th? 12 A Not that I don't think I've gone over before. 13 Q Okay. We'll switch to a completely different 14 topic. You previously testified that on December 17th -- 15 A You know, I need a -- 16 Q Do you want a break? 17 A I'd like just a break. 18 Q Sure, absolutely. 19 (Whereupon, the deposition was recessed from 1: 57 p. m. 20 until 2: 07 p. m. 1 21 BY MS. IMMERGUT: 22 Q Ms. Lewinsky, you are still under oath. 23 A Yes. 24 Q We are going to cover some other areas, hopefully 25 quickly. You previously testified that on December 17th,

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during your phone call with the President -- and that's in 1997 --

A Yes.

Q -- when you were discussing various things, including that your name had appeared on the witness list, that the President told you that if you were ever subpoenaed that you should contact Betty?

A That's correct.

Q Did he ever tell you at that time that you should get a lawyer?

A I don't believe so. No.

Q When you say "1 don't believe so", are you quite certain of that?

A I'm, I'm 99.9 percent certain.

Q What would you have done if he had told you that you should get a lawyer?

A I would have started to think about how I was going to get a lawyer and who I should get, and I didn't do that. So, that's what leads me to believe that he didn't say that.

Q Okay. Were you ever under the impression from anything that the President said that you should turn over all the gifts that he had given you to the Paula Jones attorneys?

A No.

Q Did you ever talk to the President about turning

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gifts over to the Jones lawyers before you were ever subpoenaed?

A No.

Q Did you actually ever talk to him about the fact that gifts could be subpoenaed prior to them actually being subpoenaed?

A No.

Q so, is it fair about the gifts from the

to say that the only time you talked President, in connection with the subpoena, was on December 28th?

A That's correct.

Q Directing your attention to January 5th of 1998, when you had a telephone call with the President, you previously testified that you had some discussion about a book that you had purchased for him?

Correct. That was the book that you gave to Betty Currie on approximately January 4th to give to the President? Is that right?

A Yes.

Q What was the book on the Presidents

name of that book again? It was the A It was a book about the Presidents of the United States.

Q Do you remember when you purchased that book?

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A I believe it was that weekend, the weekend prior to the 5th.

Q Did you ever talk to him, during your meeting December 28th, 1997, about the fact that you were going give him that book?

A No.

Q How do you know that you didn't? A Because I hadn't purchased the book yet.

Q Had you even thought about purchasing that particular book?

A No. It was bought on the spur of the moment.

Q Do you remember where you bought it? of

to A At a little bookstore in Georgetown, an antique book store.

Q I'm going to switch topics again. Do you believe that if you hadn't President that you House?

A Yes. had a sexual relationship with the

would have kept your job at the White

Q Do you believe that. your difficulty or inability to return to employment at the White House was because of your sexual relationship with him?

A Yes. Or the issues that, or the problems that people perceived that really were based in truth because I had a relationship with the President. But, however, some of

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the people who worked there chose to, behavior. Does that make sense?

Q What do you mean by that? A I think that -- I've always

60 to see some of my

felt that some of the, some of the staffers there, particularly Evelyn Lieberman and those who worked with her to move me out of the White House, instead -- looked at my behavior only, instead of looking at the President's behavior, and instead of necessarily thinking that I had a relationship with the President, were just looking at it thinking I was trying to have a relationship with the President when I already was having a relationship tiith him. They turned a blind eye to his actions.

Q During 1997, did you feel that the President owed you something with respect to a job?

A I did, because he, he had promised me on April 7th of '96 that he would bring me back when, if he won in Yovember. And I had -- when he first told me that, I had had some hope and I didn't, I didn't even know if I was going to near from him again after I left. And then when he continued :o call me frequently during the campaign period, it led me :o believe he would bring me back.

And then after we had a -- it was after a period nlhen he didn't call me and I wasn't sure about things, what vas happening -- I'm sorry. I'm not being clear.

Because he had sort of led me to believe that he

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was going to bring me back and was constantly reassuring that, I, I believe that he did owe that to me. Versus him

61 having said, I'm really '96 -- I'm really sorry know, there's nothing I wouldn't have felt that

sorry -- let's just say in April of that this happened, there's not, you can do, and left it at that. Then I he owed me anything.

Q What about the fact that you had gone quietly and not revealed your relationship? Did that have anything to do with your feeling that you were entitled to something?

A It did later on. I, I would have gone quietly anyway, because that -- it was never, ever, ever my intention for this relationship to ever become public. And -- but I had felt that after having left quietly, after having been sort of maybe strung along throughout the campaign and then even way into 1997, that I had felt -- and him promising me that he'd bring me back and constantly enumerating the different steps he was trying to take to do that -- that, yes, I did feel at that point he, he certainly owed me.

Q Is that part of your letter of July 3rd to the President in 1997, where you described it previously as threatening to disclose the relationship, at least to your parents, was that part of your feeling that --

A It was never really a, a, maybe a -- it was never really a threat, because I never really was going to do that. While I had disclosed a portion of the relationship to my

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t :hose occasions?

lam, I never had any intention of telling my dad. There's no

ray of that. And what I really was trying to do was trying to, .n a circuitous manner, remind him that I had been a good Firl, and that I hadn't, you know, disclosed this nformation, and that really, you know, he'd promised me he ras going to do something. And I had told my parents, I had :old my dad that I was coming back after the election.

Q I'd like to focus now just very briefly on your iealings with Ambassador Richardson with regard to the U. N. lob.

A Q Erectly,

A )icked up

Q A

Yes.

How many times did Ambassador Richardson call you do you remember? Do you mean someone from his -- he never directly the phone and dialed my phone number. Let me ask a different question. Okay. How many times did you speak to him personally? I believe twice. And when I say personally, on the telephone?

Yes.

How do you know that you actual .ly spoke with him on A Well, the first time I spoke with him I remember,

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because I was shocked Q Because the

and I was, I was very nervous. And -- Ambassador was on the phone? A Exactly. And the second, the second time I actually hadn't really remembered, I wasn't sure. And then through documentation I was shown, it, it led me that I had, in fact, spoken to him on the phone.

Q But you are positive at least one time Eact, speak to him personally?

to believe you did, in A Yes. Q Do you that occurred?

remember which occasion that was, or when A Yes, it was sometime Q Was that the October right?

A Yes. in October.

23rd call? Does that sound

Q And that's prior to your actual interview with him? A Correct. Q I'd like to just ask you very briefly about your conversation with the President the night before your interview with Ambassador Richardson for the U. N. job. Could you describe who initiated that call and what the substance Df the call was?

A I had -- we1 the President call me interview and meeting

1, I had requested through Betty that because I was really nervous about my with Ambassador Richardson. I just, I

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64 didn't, I didn't want to make anyone look bad. I didn't want to sound like a fool, or -- de talked about some of the he gave me some suggestions think he may have also done

so, the President called me and different issues at the U. N., and of things I could say. But I that the previous week, too.

Q Do you remember him giving you sort of a job pep talk on --

A Yes. Q -- the 30th? A Yes. Q Why would you describe A Because I was nervous.

it as a pep talk? So, he, he was trying to kind of build my confidence and reassure me, you know, reassure me that I was an intelligent person, and that I had a lot to offer and that they would be happy to have me there.

Q At some point, did you tell the President that you got an offer from the U. N.?

A I believe so. Q Did you tell Betty also that you had gotten an offer?

A Yes.

Q Do you remember any details about it, or how you let her know?

A I, I remember calling Betty about talking to Betty

after the interview and telling her that it had gone much better than I had expected

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tt would, and that I was really, that I was, that I was somewhat more interested after having met the Ambassador than

[ was prior to the interview. And other than that, I don't really.

Q What about details about your conversation with the 'resident telling him that you had gotten the job?

A I vaguely remember it being in context, I think, of ;ort of trying to press him on getting in touch with Mr. Jordan.

In terms of getting other Exactly. -- you let him know this? Exactly.

jobs -- That you had an offer from the U- N.? Right. Do you remember when you got the U. N. offer? No. Was it sometime, in relation to your interview with :he Ambassador --

A It was sooner, rather than later.

Q so, sometime within a matter of a week or -- A I believe so.

Q _- some weeks? A Somewhere within a couple, within the next two veeks or so.

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Q And did they tell you that they would leave the job open until a certain time, for you to make the decision if you wanted it?

A Not at the point when I got the offer. I, I -- and actually I think, thinking now I'm a little bit more clearer that I did speak with the Ambassador, that he was the one aho, who extended the offer to me, because I remember being nervous and not knowing what to say to him, because I didn't really want the job. And so I sort of just "yessed" him along and thanked him profusely, and told him I was excited about it.

And then I later spoke, I Sutphen, and sort of relayed to her also trying to feel out the private

believe, with Mona that I was interested in sector. So, and I oelieve it was at that point that she said, well, let's keep in touch. We can -- this position, I think, _had been open _ Ear awhile. So.

Q Did she give you any timeframe at all about how long they would wait for you to make a decision?

A It was -- I think we talked about talking maybe in

3 few weeks, and then at some point we said, let's get in touch around the first of January. And I was under the impression that, you know, I believed that they would hold the position open for me, but that it didn't necessarily --

Q It's not a guarantee?

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67 A Exactly.

Q But they weren't rushing you to make an immediate decision?

A No. Q So, you understand you basically had some leeway until January 1998 to make a decision?

A Correct.

Q January 16th, 1998, Ritz Carlton night. I really lave just one question about it, which was, was there a time -hat you, in fact, during the course of the evening, that r'ou, in fact, did leave the prosecutors and agents by {ourself?

A Yes, when I was given, finally given permission to ~0 call my mom. I wasn't comfortable using the phone in the room.

Q SO, you went out by yourself to -- A Yes, I did.

Q Where did you go make a phone call? A To Nordstrom's.

Q And -- A It was just one phone call, to my mother. And

:here was also a time,-- I think one of the prosecutors vith me, I think it was Stephen Bin --

Q Binhak? A -- I think, came downstairs with me. I used

came -1

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needed to return a phone call from a page. And then when I was with Mr. Emmick and Agent -they let me go to the bathroom in Macy's by myself.

Q Were you in Macy's for some time by yourself? A Well, it, it took awhile to find a bathroom. It was kind of far away. So.

Q So, they didn't follow you into the bathroom? A They didn't follow me in. But then when I came back, Agent- had gone looking for me. So.

Q And just with respect to the phone call to call your mother, no one accompanied you for that, is that right?

A No.

Q And finally -- A I just, I do want to state that I did -- because I know this sort of goes to this issue of being, you know, kind of told, oh, you're free to leave whenever you want, that I didn't really -- I didn't feel at any point that I could leave whenever I wanted, that I could -- that I was afraid that if I had left the Mall, I would be arrested and put in jail. So, that was my impression.

Q One last question from me. Do you, for any reason now, want to hurt the President?

A No. I'm, I'm upset with him right now, but I, no, that's the last thing in the world I want to do.

MS. IMMERGUT: That's all I have.

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21 22 23 24 25 A Absolutely not.

MS. WIRTH: I just have one question. BY MS. WIRTH:

!Oth, 1998, you were talking about your understanding of 'resident's testimony. I'm just going to read a portion Tour testimony to you and ask you a question about that. Chis is in response to a question from a juror.

the of

You said, "I'm sorry. I'm sorry. It's -- from my mderstandingr. abo@+ what he testified to on Monday, not -- just from the press accounts, is that this was a -- that this eras a service contract, that all I did was perform oral sex In him and that that's all that this relationship was. And it was a lot more than that to me and I thought it was a lot nore than that."

And the answer continues a little bit more after -hat.

The question I have for you is that when you nentioned your understanding of what the President testified zo on the previous Monday, from what did you derive your understanding of what the President's testimony was?

A From the press accounts I had read.

Q Okay. No one from this office divulged to you anything that the President said during his testimony, did they?

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MR. WIRTH: Thank you.

MS. IMMERGUT: Nothing further questions?

. Do you have any THE WITNESS: No.

(Whereupon, at 2: 24 p. m., the zoncluded. 1

proceedings were CERTIFICATE OF COURT REPORTER - SOTARY PUBLIC

0: Eficer before whom hc areby certify that t1 ne foregoing deposition was duly sworn by me; that the testimony of said

I, Elizabeth A. Eastman, the zhe foregoing deposition was taken, do :he witness whose testimony appears in

70 ritness was taken by me electronically and thereafter reduced :o typewriting by me; that said deposition is a true record If the testimony given by said witness; that I am neither counsel for, related to, nor employed by any of the parties 10 the action in which this deposition was taken; and, Further, that I am not a relative or employee of any attorney x counsel employed by the parties hereto, nor financially or otherwise interested in the outcome of the action.

NOTAF?? PUBLIC FOR THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

ly Commission Expires: July 31, 2000

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THE FOLLOWING IS A COMPRESSED VERSION OF THE PRECEDING

DOCUMENT

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1353 Monica Lewinsky - 8/ 26/ 98

OIC Deposition Page 2 to Page

CONDENSED TRANSCRIPT AND CONCORDANCE PREPARED BY:

OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, N. W.

Suite 490- North Washington, DC 20004

Phone: 202- 514- 8688 FAX: 202- 514- 8802

1354 B! SA Monica Lewinsky - 8126198 uux( rn,

Page 5 Ill Do you understand that?

I:; A Yes. Ido Q

I4lPmceed7 Any other queshons that you have before we 151 A No.

Q First I just want to ask you 5 ; :; know you have testif& m two other B eneral questron I

I B 1 vanott aspect5 ol pw mgs about I ratationship wrth the Pnsidant Can r91 ou charademe 115 ] !h vxi? ther or nut your relahonshrp was on5

at started with sex and then evolved into a friendship. or

111 lthe other way around?

;::; a sexual A It 5t5ft5d with a physkxl attraction. which Lsd to relationsh

111 ~aspects of that nls ‘p, and then the emottonal and fnendshrp

lonshtp developed after the begrnnrng of r15rour smrual relabon5hrp_ Q I would kk5 to plaa before you what I will mark

i:; ias Depositron exhibrl No. 1. Il81 (Deposition Exhibii No. 1 was 1191 marked for identhication.) 1201 BY MS. IMMERGUT:

i:: iGrand Ju Q Thii rs otso a chart that was previously marked a5 r23] 5ticker on Exhii ML #- I. You can sea the Xemx qcpy of that rz+ land ask if

P 15 exhiii. and I will plac5 that .& fore you.

1251

ou n# 1& 5 what that exhrbrt a? Page 6 (11 Q

A What do you remgnize it to be? A &art that I halpad develop with the Qffia! of ~: jlndependent Courwel to d5~ 5aib5 and enumerate ttw -my 1 a 1 rtslabonshrp with the President, the cdntxk baetwnn the

IslPra5kf5nt and mysalf.

161. Q As you’ve testified before, dkl you pmvide the 17 1 rnformation mat is on thin chart? 151 A Ya5, Idid

Q [: Ilof theev5? k? And is k accurate to the best of your no~ lleqtion

Y__ z.:_

j : 1”“” r MS. LEWINSKY: Monica Samille Leuinsky. M- 0- N- l- C- A I 6 1 S- A- M- I- L- L- E. L- E- W- l- N- S- K- Y.

MS. IMMERGUT: For the record, I am Karin lmmrgut ~~$ romm the 0fF1ce of Independent Counsel. Seated with me is ! s! Mary Anne Wlrth. also from the Ofb of the Independent ;~ olCounsel. [Ill fi Tc5. II 0. ;: I IWHEREUPON Q

MORICA S. LEWlNSKY What I muld like to do is go through ths 5wnts ii: j having been called for examination by the Offrfice Of the i& at are wntten in bold which deal wkh the pmrate I 14 1 Independent Counsel and having been first duly sworn by the r~ crenmunten you had w; th the President that rnvofved. for th5

i 151 notary. was examrned and testffted as follows: [~ s] mc! 5t part, 5prt. x sort of physrcal rntimacy that we ham listed 5tckrding oral sax. I dii want to get Lie! !;-‘ E& AMMy4I$# g& COUNSEL FOR THE INDEPENDENT COUN&%% rr%~~%% il about each incident.

iii; you of certain rghk that you Q Before we “9; m the deporitiop. I do want to advise Basrully. wrth nnpecl to each inczident. I would ave rn mnn% ctron with this i: iilike you tp de5aib5 the c& wn5knces kadrng up to the

I ~: cjdeposition. You have alread [zolactual ~155, who rnrtiated ft. how it was ret up, and Men

[z~~ would like to ask you -d& ails about the sexual

~221enmunters themselves that occurred during each ofmose

[231visits. 1241 so. why don’t w5 stall with me very first one. :: 4. A Yes. Ido.

rt5: Q Who is that attorney? rz5) whii is the second encounter that you had on NOvernber 15th. Page 4 [iI A Plato Cacheris..

i$ tirne dunn Q i 4, request a %

You have the Tht, to consult with Mr., Cacherts any

the testimony, and ormply ask that you lust raak when you need to mnsuit with hm. Do you ~s~ understand that You have that ngM7

i13: A Yes. Q Have you seen the ogreqent mat you have, gmng \:%; you immunity for your cooperation in this case?

A Yes, I have. (17: Q :la! rtnot? That also is a grand jury exhibit in thii Case, is (19; A Yes. its. izc: Q Do you have any questions about what our rights :ZI rare not to rncnmrnate yourself as part of mat agrscmen b ,-_ I, c-- 1 A No, I don’t.

Q In addition, as always. you are required to tell ;I : i the truth during this procedure and are subject to the i~ 51penatttas of pegury lf you do not tell the complete truth.

olcstarr

Page 7

11 I 1995 mat you’ve already ta5ti@ d, 5cm5 about. If you an. pjmu! d you just tell us hew ma vott war 5e. t up. and then r3lwhat acumed duri the vi50

A Tha% asMent &me back to Mr. Panetta5 Once and j:~ lwrstheonlyperwninthe~ a, atthetime. andbetrm r6ril was maybe amund, I mink, ID p. m. or so. and asked me, or r71told me that rf I wanted to meet hrm back in Mr.

hanopqul& oftip 51 abmt 610 minutes, that I cold. I told hrm I was Inter& ad to do that.

1181 A Yes. 1191 Q So. dii you. in fad. go rrv% t with Me Resident7 -

:201 A Yes. Idd.

i211 Q A And could you describe where you went to meet hm I met him back in Mr. Stephanopoulqs’ off& and he ~~:~ invtted me into the back study again, and we were in ttw 121 I hallwa

d And we were - I don’t nmember exa 3 howit I 2515tart But I know that w5 were talking a bii a k= lng

Page 2 to Page 7

1355 aA llloniu Lowmky - emma mAxIMI _.. --

.-.

1101 KY. 8. . . . -. 0 DidthePmsmntrtth8tthmdoulythiqtaslc9

;:: 1 0 Didhsejwbtehyoutpmsena~( inrstsW? A No.

Q Howdldyou&~ rthtnthscUim. orlnwdidpu &ndttutvmit7

1356 u4 Monica Lewtnaky - S/ 26/ 98 urulvrl

Page $4 1201 A No. Hewasonthatehmhum. 1211 a okay. Andblatwaadnt. he~ ndtkneabo?

1221 A Yes. Q Washeonthata thBwhobdmathatydu

Paga 15

rio~ around.

a with rasped again to the eja~~ bb~. that ha !::~_ ktnT actually ejaculate dunng 6aal aax. warn you awam. Il3lorda.~ ejacu~ eanywhcmnywrprsrencsonthst ti6roccasron?

1151 A No. a IEilsS5. a Sunday. Could w descnba The next date i& ted aI@& c$ rtt~~~ lat. trwpandwhatoncurmd A ~~~~ hadj~ ttofdhknthatIrmokadrny Yes. I h$~~?~~- r~ rNel and t21jbafom m honor of my brothers buthday. r22ldl~ ntsd- woffcndthathecDuldOameonedlhe t23~ Pmaident’s cigars from his sprl of stash df cigars. I satd. [nr] lhatwouM ba great. I251 AndwawantthroughthafUasevaltRcantotha

Page 16 Page 1s

iijjdid @w me'0 ar _ 111’ And%. nweweretakimforakttbbitandIhad +j- doyouwantmtojustbe- - [16! could dd a narnthm that% fine.

2 *hehad- Ihadthau& thathehadforgotten ~~~~? ryrumsbefom,~ ureI~~ nhinbr~ hallafsw - ~~~;~ m~“~ kaJtcPNlngrnwdO~. So,. ao. lsnrtof sad my nama agam to hap You know, I

[xlsafd, ynu knav. k’s Moma w, Pmqdant Kiddo. you tzz! know. And he said, I know ywr name.

Andhetoldmth& hehadbWtoallmeand I& l - h &lid. bul OU’N not in the book: I even Spelled t2sjyour ta! d mum righ 1 So, it was. it was really funny. lt

Page 17 [llwaS cute.

I21 hdthenwwere, wemta kissingandhelihadmy r:~~~~~~*~~~ Pr~~~~~~~~~~,~ hrs

rslhtrn wer his pants in hir genkal ama. and I thmk ogarn I [61tnsd t0 unbutton hs pants and I ~& Jn’t. SO. he dd rt. a % miaad your sweater and fondled And again. just to k dear when you mnt10Md he ur bmasts. mm your ’

tsjbmastsoutsfdaofyourbnattha time? P

.--. a I% hy be WasnT m you have an discus& n with hi again about lati A ?? I th% Y). lt mrght have been at brat ttme any& g like that? I::)- thabUpeX~ hsah%% 3ysursdwm one thathedkfn’t f231knmvnmwallendughorhadtdn’tbust mb~ y So that 1 [26l~ Of~~~~-~ ns;~ wtorhin. 1251 occuran, drd he ever ajacutata in your

Paga 16 A tlilahuays spend quite qbii of time kissing So. Maybe 10 minutes. Not nut very bng. We would Ill1 a

Cl21

And kmsng and takdng and just - 1131 ^a Fgm,

IE1Wa sat on% EfZ %z eforabout10minutesinthedftice. 116 jwem nwawantintothebadcstudyandm

tntirnate in the bathroom.

a okay. Onthatdate, dkipugratifyhiminsonm

alc. stan Page 14 fo Page 1s

.--, 1191

120: 8Y fUi?% ERGul: Q ThemxtwKou” tu~~ Ja” ua 214of’96. li: j* isoo” page2ofthebbit. coJdyoudesaibe Lthat oaunuJa” dwhathappaKddumgthes” cou” ten ;i:?=““ t= rA Ye% Iwas- 8duWy lV” Mu” gatt+ nght

i25irowmdIthirkLmipMhsvs~ nr’~ y- no. IIwrtI

F+ age 23

_~ Page2OotoPage25

1358

Page 26 Q Didyou~ orsl~ onhimoranykrndofsex

rioi - A Yes

1111 Q nwasjuslthezipperthat- I121

1131 “0 yes. 7 A $$? %% tally at ona point du ~~~& ounter. I think =- lthis someoneameintothe, tothaQva Qfhca

t16Jandha, ywkmw t17Jc~ fne back ~87. a nf ippedupreal uiddyand~ ntwtar~ d

% I - tha s pr0ba ty 100 much mf0tmiwn.

Page 37 causa himself to ajawlata al that point or But that was in Nancy Hemreich’s nfEce?

IiT1 A Jl8I Q y~ whatdidyo” dowhcnyo” saWM? IlJl

rzoi 8 ‘Ei’”

:21, A And thinkwckii again. 7 a on that acnasion you mcntinm? d that he dii not $:{ touch your genitals at all. Was there any d& cuswn about 1211that3

iI5i A No.

Page 29

And indeed m amped lnt0 each Other m the hall i; iand want thmugh tha Rosa Gardan mto tha Oval !Xica And I JsJthirk we went qht into the back Offru% The- when we got !10! tJn? ra. il:: a When

A Yes. G say ma badr office. you mean me Study Jiil - kt% sea.

mu5ssed fmm 1: lO p m Ms. Lawnsky. yw am still under nath. 1201 Q We arestill on Febntary4th. 19%. YwLe I::: Pwe” t. “““ d?% intothedfftceandwiingtokastha 1231 A &%%%~ ck ohica and m warn kissing. arrd n( Jl* Rb- lhPdadraum~ kmonedallthe~ y. allthc 125Jway up and down.

Ill Q Tothcncdt? A ‘% mdt. ltwas

[I21 0 DiiheaJsntduchthemwtthhiimouth?

A Yas.

Q AndatthatpMntthatisdinUtynnyourskm. Page 26 u~,,,~,,~ Then did you bow hum Nancy kbmmich’r ofke ._ ,-.___ ___,

A tthinklkftthmughthr- lkftthrwghtha i:~ dcarin~ snfJica, that oul into the Rosa Garden.

0 CJn thrs pa% kr antry an January 21% I fists &at the entire andounterwas a

p? x anaMy 30 to 40 minutes.. J7J00yourecallwhetpartibnpftha wpuldhavebeanthesaxual J 8 Joncounter

R rt of It. versus Just taRmg? 191 Maybe 15 mmutes?

JlOJ Q t

You just can’t mally atirrpte? (111

%~ nnwtoFebw I:: ldatewhen,~~ WaSa~ ateeIMW 4thof1996 thanextbold

r& r. Could y& describe (1 I I haw that cncuunter cnme about and what happened? A Yes. Iwasinmy~ dnSunda andthe i:: iPntaentalkdmeintheomcaand- fmmtheid~ nce. JJ7~ andtoklmat~ thewas oingtobe~ intothaof6ce JleJbter. Andlthmklwk ec? hiiiflcou comeseehii. And 1 IS$ K said that would be h- e. and then that he- oh, I think

rzoJhcwa~,, hesaidhs- goingtogointotheomcchanhour J2JJandahaJforsn

So thenhcalladme- itwasactuallymaybetwa

$~ orrnfw hourb later, because I remembar I thought he forgot [zcJmiybehehad~~ ntocrllmeandthst- ro. Andwhan’ [2sJhe celled fmrn the Rasdena~ to say he was on hi way. I told

Jiwwr undarwearofl tzoi- A &nm. I211 Q Qrdkftha 122: A I think thaty-%%& that ha tnwhed me kst l23Jvith my Undew% H On. and then pbad his hand Under my r2~ Jundemear. And I think at some point I I remwed ttwm. 125; .Q Qkay. Wyouatsnprformnralan. xonhiiatthat

olcstarr Page3SfoPag831

1359

Page 32 {,] wne? ,? I A Yss. ldid. 131 Q tiow did it corns about? Was that somsthrng that

, I &xided to do, or dii ,me President e& x. throu h his 15 1 scmns or words, indrcate to you that hs wan &hat? A I don? real

I:;- fthink in all of thsse ins t remember. I mean h wets a mutttal rxes, k wasn’t, you’know -

[ B I I know some& i KS sort of hard to answsr these ~usstions rsjas, mom dmcted. But rt was - I rman. it was the muma of

rlojbsrng mntsnats. I msan. it was the txurse of havi r~ jkrnd of a. relabonship, that

y- sanebmesheiXr% 112 lit. sotybmes I inkisted it. r131- hddnYn- t wasn’t. yw know. it wasn’t

rtty go through my mrnd. okay. now it’s rl4jtimstoperfonnonlsex.

I mean it was. it was the passion of the mormnt. /: ziThat was. I mean’, lust sort of in the courss of thi s that r 171 ha d; 9

1181 bo P psnsd. you know I aiways felt that ws sort just ws h really went to a. to a whole other ptacs together

[ 19lsexually. Q

$! ieach othsr by doing differen ls it fair to sarxc~ both hying to plsase :221 A Y8s Yes.

Q Isitalsofairto~ tMyouwsrenotthasole /Z: iaggressor in this sexual - I251 A Thats very fair to say.

YOU

Page 35 111hih- n If I could see him on Sunday. And he said. he’d. you r2~ know, Wdseewhathscouktdo.

,111 Q -rretintoseehim? ~~ I I121 A EGi.

i:: lyou had had spms phone cal Q Jurttobaau& fo! axcond, yaumsntion~ dthst wrth him bstween February 19th. r 15196 when 2 y- f art off the relabonship - ,161

[ITI Q -ormesexualpartoftnenlabonzhg-

1181 Aa- -and the 31st in which he had suggssted that he I: Z~ wan* ed to psrhaps remw the intimacy. What bd you to rzlibeliive ma?

i::: And he was on hi A t; M&~ y,$ r;;~~# R;~ tats [zc~ Em& ssy qnd E r251madeapomt0f %berman was with hnn. So. I certainly

hawng any eye mntad or anyhung with !I,

Page 33 Q - enmunter?

izi A I was not. Q Agarn. I’m .ust askrng you every tkne in cass ~:; rerrtember, do you remem b, ou

r how long the sexual asp% 4 of & at I 5 renmunter lasted? Page W r llenjoyed talking to me.

So rt- lmrnkmatcerta 151 point in the mlationship where it k 8 was a turning

of went from a - j 4 lobviously there’s. there’s some pcnonal and inbmate aspects ts] of a sexual mlahonshi [ 61 laughing or gettii to R that devstop just in talking or

e pornt where you, where

pu k& s [~~ someqne on every en~ unter. But for me. 1 think hat

rs> spendmg the time tatkrng t0 him was Certainty When I. When I !9] got to know him as a person and started to realize that he :lo] wasnY necessarily the person I thought he! was at that point.

Q Let’s move on to ths next date which is March ii: iJlst. 1996. the next encounter where then is’physiuliy ‘zjintimate contact. Why don’t you tep us how that date was

! I lset up and what happened? A I had spoken - wsll ‘ust to back up real quickly. li:/ The President had ended things on t. I think it was the ‘:~ 1191h of February. But men he had csltsd ms later- I think ,I B I if was late February or early March at soms point - : : 9 1 indrcating to ms he wanted to sort of see ms again, possibly

:zslfor some intimate moments

:2li And it wasn’t until the 31st of March that we ~22] rsally wsm together again physic& y But he had called. I .:, lthink two times, two times prior dunng that work week, ‘24 ~leadrn up to the 31~ 1. And it was on the Frkta ni ht which .? i~ ls. loo ! rng at the chart. whch was the 29th. tha 1 P I, asked

Page 36 n~ hii. Andha~ l~~~ Iho( sveniylandrvidhchad. hc’ rzlhad- a~ haktR~ wMI. uprtalrs, he~ ntbodrtohit r3,~ andhPdcsUadmahmyoffia, hoping~ ImuM rr~ comshaveavisitwkbhkn butIhadalreadygmshoms.

Andsothenl& md Is& wall IcouldDJms IZjback And he said no Vrn u ioirs akady So. [71 Q Ba&& wto arcJt31st- c I81 A Yes.

rz~~ So. Iusedtoalways~ h~ ba~, andrometmsshc’d~ bmy Izz] back. But I usualiy~ on hi lowsr bDck becsuss

1231il was * b~ thertng h& i. 124: % , you know, and then I’d usually mows around and [zs~ sorl of just lovs’gly touch his chest and -

w 37 [II ct WasmemanymmovalofcbtMg?

A Ye6 thsmwas. Wekissedand sndhehadnotbeen ~~& Mrg wetl I us& I4jmostof- lm ,f! cus& i the past mupb of days &o, molly,.

on me pmtty exdusrvety. I9ucss. rn a rsr~ exualmannaronmethat~, andkrssedme, snd~ my 161 breasts. and he he fondfed my genitals with his hands. 171 0

A through ckrthrn or not thmugh doting? Not thmugh c!&$ ing. r j% iyour d& ge? j of?? have your underwear Rand? Or how dii (111

[I21 "a

1131 b” p,~~~ irn[ ly pulled out d hw way?

rlcloh. A Ithinkl- I rnkt attheywsmjustsortof- 1151 Q Pulled out of the way?

I161 A Yeah. InI Q Okay. So. he touched you. And *rth our breasts. rlsiwas that through cloth

I 191move your bmasts out o “8. through your bmssrsrs. or& d he

the way of the brasswre?

!: yil- le - themAw% ns& a time when he just’toudwd my bmasts ltwas itwasboth. lmean Rwasahysbom.

,22jthrough - 1231 I24, A” Thebra’ -the bra. right.. I251 Q On that occasion. did the Presdcnt ever tnssrt a

. . Page 32 to Page 37 OlCStan

1360

Page 38 I 1 J cigar into y& r vagma? II! A Yes. 13! a whosa ides was that?

A On- whenImatwtthhiianJanua j : 1 had been intknate and m wsm talking in tba Oval 7th afterwe %fK& ha 191waschewingonaqigar. Andthenhahadthacigarinhis [~ rhandandhewaskuxtoflook‘ atthec+ rna, sortofa r9rnaughtyway. Andsdl. Ilook 3 atthecgarandIlaokadat rs~ himandIuld. wecpndoth~, toa, rantm. I101 And I don’t. I don’t raatty reme& er how it got r~~~ started. but.

[12i Q [13lrnat? Was % part ofths saxual -nter that he did 11‘ 1 A Yes, It was. 115i 116: AQ nMwyp4 understand It to ba amusings

,171 Q Okay. What happened to the cigar aftenuards~ llSl A Heputitinhismouthadhe~~ rttastedgood.

Q How dll you taava that encounter? So. you didn’t i: ii parfonn oril -N, 9” hrm at all that tima? ,211 _ .~~. 122: Q Ho-

i:: ilookir# at$ a eIrthat I didn’t king papars tl [z5] bmug thrsbatohrmmafdder. So, somabr

9lk. lookirm atso - I shwtd rnantion that, hatday. I ras I brought

Page 41 A Yes. 2 g k$ routh or wkh hrs hands, or both?

Q rs~ thattt’sboththroughclothmganddin And again, I’m assumm . unnrtt ygno” d ma now

& is1 A Ye5 ;; iun _$ ~~ pfi;~~$~# tst= t how

r9, ulu4Jpedthein?

A tthnkbaunz’ i: f; of thii runni themand- bacauaattwassorl

[lZJthat I just ha bwbk with it So. I was - ou know. 7 ‘w” pka that I cau never unbutton hi frank. t19) thara ware timer that I tried and we’d bug r; and than he’d. rld] he’d do tt.

Butwe~- 1. Ipsrfonnedoral~ xinthe. m I::; thebaaof+ ca. ,171 (1 And at that tima, did ha ejaculates 1191 A Na. hadiinot.

Q Was tham any discussion with him about the ~% jacutationAat tM, bme that you can mmambar? I211 Q On that data. I think you’w alraady testified that

I:$ thara was a phone rz41ts that right? pall dunng your sexual enmuntar with hart. I251 A Yas, thamwas.

Page 39 rllpaperrendthisda)! RwnsIh; rdatic, snd~ probPbly ,I were some papers m the folder as wall.

Cl ::; the gift categ And mars tha Hugo Bmr bs thats Itstad under

for that data? 15: A %rrect

Q The naxt encounter is April 7th. 1996. Could you ,!; j describe how that ancounter was set up9

A The President had caltad ma at homa sort of in tha 1 ii early evening, and this was - it IWO Easter Sunday and it r I o 1 was the tint. a was the Sunday after I had found out I was ;a! tObetransfenedtothaPenb# On. Andheulbd- ttatso 1x1 had bean the week that Ron mwn had passed away. So, I asked him how he was dmg and wa hlkad

! :: i about that for a littk9 bit. And then I told hkn that Monday j ~s~ was my last day, and that I had bean bansfarmd. And I was [I 6 1 q [? 7! lf couldcomeseahim. Andhasald. at’slina, btr~ ust r ing and he wanted to know what ha# mned. and t asked him iirltallmawhat

ha% [~ 9! happenad, and ned first. So, I explatt to him w/ l at had nhetoldmatocomaonover. So. idid.

lZ@ i And ths IS when I had thti @a encounter bying ix ltoaet into the office @th John Musk& t, lust that ha sard

~23 1 John ha [z>!- brou~ htfqerswrthmafmmhoma~~~ A& dsonI said -thing about want1 [2 4 I it was okay for ma to go tn. And I don rernambar axactly rzsrwhat ended up happenmg, but I managad to get him to not ask

Page 40 Andthatwaswhenhe. heLackedmaintheeyeand ti i ha promised ma - wall, first he said that ha couldn’t rsibella~ that they were taking ma away, fram hm becausa ha !~ o~ tnrstedmesomuch, andhewaswnvrncadthatithad 111 !somathmg to do with hrm. why I was bc transferred. And r:~! thenhelookedmeintheeyeandhesa Ipmmrsayou, ifI zg ~: x~ wrn In November. 1’11 have You back like that lsnappina

[It: ‘5% what else happenedat that meeting? ,15: A 1. I don? remember how d axachy cama about, but : zc: I know that. that I remember kiimg him and we wars i :i j physcaliy mbmate.

ical intmtxy that day, dii the ;: i: 0 What about your braask’

Page 42 Cl1 Q Wyouparformoralsaxwhibhewasontha

rzllwtban I dtnX ,221 Q Atthough you manbonad that thars wari) othar times tzstthat hp was on tbs phona. that you didn’t think sort of rzrlanythmgbadabouttt- I251 ARgM

wea

III Q -andmtMs A Ijust- ccaslon, ywCt- llke-

I21 I31 Q -youwaresaNtctng-

141 A Exoct) y. Q -m_ kvel. ArMdiyoutallLtndaTrpp $boutmat do

Iii A %Fn 0 $ tiuwti

t91Wl you’wsakeady, testitiadaliibitaboutthis.

ma encounter end if you rwnerWM And

[lOl.%, JUS dyOUmuldqUti* lyS, S”“, S~ Show,‘ WfintShsdthc ( 1 I 1 encounter and what happened? _) A WtmrrmthabadcofficeandthaardMr. t~

I: Glcatl. say, Mr. Pmsident. frum the Oval Ofgde. And we bath rlc, mnstartladad~ edataachoth+ r, andhejeltcdinto r~ s~ theChfalandI- I161 Q Wareyougcrfpnningoralsaxatthebma?

A Ithnkso, utlmno ahundradperwntwn. ~:~& sothanI Itaft

[191 Q ' On mat ocaasion also, whan tha Pmiient went to

"" '#? I the phone cat! had you startad performing oral sax on iz~ I m before he want to take the phone call?

A Yes I balleve that we ware - I think mat mat $; wasit. lknowthat’wewen wewaraintimateinthe ~24 I hallway, and then rt was a phom call that ram tad us to go :~ 5, into the office. And that when we ware in he o P fia. ma.

Page38toPage43

1361 MA Monica Lbwinrky - W26c98 XYU[( W -- -.- -_

110: A lt’s- 11:: Q OrisPnotthatcbar?

112; A h’s not that cbaf. 113: 0 Butyou ~rhiUfKippillph& pafltsatW34rN9

r141m 115: A Atsomepdnfyes.

116: Q Beforetheoralsex? 117: A Yes. ,,* I Q Okav.

Page 47 r41my~. gput UK! LMbB So. hcOBDvcmcmyhatpinandhc~ dhumedlr

Grzss II my purse and ha said. here, jus annebatsomepok7tandhestepped I& rtoftheoffb9 andIhadputmybmandrnyswaterback JioJon. Andhecanieinandsortofmadeammark& outm0havbp rllJdone that. And -

iIijsaid. oh.- yoifve got to. %’ yourselfbacktog& ragain. r22JAndsothenIwenta lgotmylipstickandIputrny J23] tiprtidrbi9dCUl l ndthenBettyknockedonlhedoor.

~::~ Whatthebbedfessfmm~~? Q thedmssthat ouwerewearbgcmthisoccasbn. t23Jencounter: _.

(21; t2:; 3 0- Y. -ondhowtheactualsexuaIpartstarted? 133’ A Oncamwueabneinthebadrofl@, hestarted J24jtosaySOmCthin tomeandIwa~ pesterinphintoOkar~ J: SJbecause I hadn Q -wehadn’theenabneinaimostayaarand

I11 A mty Q And lthink~~ alrl9ady %be& easarthat. Thenextencounter~ Ezh WLF t4JWoufdyouk9llushowthatencounterwassstq3? ’ *

A ttwas. itwassttupthroqhyconversatbnswtth

PageUfoPage49 OIC- Btii

1362 Ly. Monica Lewinsky - W2W8 x- 1 __--

Age LO I don’t know if the

.--,

;: 3: A I mean. just barely.

:i4i Q _ Andwhentheygmzed~ achother. neitherofyouhad :: slcbthes ~~ rtats, rs that Mt?

ii; jlGth. 1997. :2s: A l-~ h~ sortofhi& hbbifthday. ht

Page 63

1118nd I was a Gttb shockad. actually. I didn’t - he pat

12lSccmcdtO~ t~ e~ tKMIllyupsetaboutR. ttseemeda

r3, ktk bit strange to me.

141 Q And he hadn’t done that before’

IS1 A He had bean emotionally VisWy mt with me

16, bdW. but nd -

1’8; Q Wtih regard to -

191 “a co- m - stopping you from having sex ti him? 1101 A Exactly.

Ill1 Q Or having sexual contact with hn? ls that

1121comd? 1131 A Yes. 1141 0 Andisthat. otherthananybdaflurt. thelast I is I physically Mmate contact that you’ve had with run?

1161 . A so+ Jell, our Christmas kii was - I mean, it was l171p== nate.

Any other

r11emlothefsexually. Andso i21hh on the butt. or he mioht h% t%% d%!! it’ miaht ha

A No. Q -inthede6nition?

181 A No.

191 Q Allright. lMsmoveontornMertopic.

I251 A Ourmeetinghadstartedoutin. asa. inafrgM

plge52

~ejbendthcCbSthptd8y.

Andsowe, m. wekkued. Andthenlwastouchii

[ jiihirn in his genital area thrwgh his shfxts. and than I. I :r~ jwentto. to- 1::: Q Perfoorm oral sax?

.? 3, _- , A Yes, and he wouldn’t lat me.

il4! Q pid he touch you on your gmitak on that date?

:: s; A No.

;;$ physical intima An& tiW$ h ical amtad that is referred to as a%

t19>

A %tthatImmeinber. Q How dii you end that enarunter with hii? Any [: ojdii about sex during that encountar. or not havtng :X! raX? A No, justhegotupsetwhenI, ouknow, whenhe

i$ i& pped me and he said. I’m tryrng tpnot do &I. IS and I’m T rgtobe~. Andhe. hagotMIblyUpset. Andsol. $:; I uggedhmandltddhimlwosrorryandnottobaupset.

Pege 55

1131 Q Qidhesaywcrnderfulthingsaboutyou? 1231 Andhejust- haspentakttoftkneb+ krgto .

124lmt. ti= Vef& W! l -b~ thellIO6tInccboM1 [251me he’d ever been. xare wasn~ asecondwhenhatZ% tk

OlCStan P&@ 5OtOP&?& Si

1363

Monica Lewinsky - ma xuxflMo)

Page 56 [6latrap Up. It was just very - it was intense. ii I really emotional lt was just

Intense. lI’ And a one pont. we, we had been talking about - ; :E; I made soma remarks to him about his relationship with Mrs. 11 I 1 Clinton. And he, he remarked a liila bit later than tha!

112 Ithat he wished he had more time for me. And so I sald, well, : 13lmaybe you will have more time in three years. And I was f 14 lactually sort of thinking ju$ when b wasn’t President. ,he [ lslwas going to have more bme on hts hands. And he satd. well, [~ 6] ldontknow, lmlghtbeabnevlthree

i :78$ f being t And then I said something a ou know, us sort ether. I think I kind of said, oh,

[lg~ be a good o% am, or something like. that. And he, you know, he [zol’okingly said, well, what are we gotng to do when I’m 73 and [ZI 1 { have to pee 25 bmes a day. And I, you know, I, told h! m [zz jthat we’d deal with that. And it was - there was Just thus rz3lincredibla connedin.

And I I left that day sort of emotionally stunned, ~~~~ besause I felt -I was shocked. But I thought, I mean, he .

Page 59 [ 1 igifts over to the Jones lawyers before you were ever [ 2 I subpoenaed? [3: A No.

Q Dii you actual I: ~ that gifts could be [ 6 1 subpoenaed? subpoena ever talk to him about the fact

e!! prior to them actually being 17: A No.

0 So, is it fair to say that the only time i “9 j about the gifts from the President in connecbon wit ou talked

I I o 1 subpoena. was on December 28th? l! the iili A That’s correct.

(12: Q Directing your attention to Janu #a 5th of 1998. rl3lwhen you had a tele

Xzk viously testified tl! hone call with the Presiden , you r at you had some discussion about a

Cl61

that you h; tgrr$ hased for him? I::; Q That was the book that you gave to Be Cume on

‘pf: roximateiy January 4th to give to the President? Is s hat

ri9im t? izoi - A Yes. Q I:: ibook on the Presidents. What was the name of that book again? lt was the 1231 A It was a book about the Presidents of the United 1241states. [251 Q Doyou remember when you purchased that book?

Page 57 rllwas - I [2 1 he acte ‘ust knew he was in love with me, and from the way

d that day, and that’s not, it’s not something that I ~3 ~woukl. that I would think easily. It’s not a conclusion that [ 4 1 I woukf come to easily at all. And it just - with the kind

[lo] a biiarreday.

ill1 Q

[I21 A Anrhinq else about t!‘ te 4th? No that don’t think I ve gone over before.

I :: i topic. Q Okay. We’ll switch to a completely different You previously testified that on December 17th -

[15!

;161 i17:

El81 :191

A Youknow, Ineeda- was recessed from 1 :57 P .m. i; oiuntil2: 07 6. m.

[211 BY & S. IMMERGUT: i22I Q Ms. Lewinsky, you are still under oath. :231 A Yes. Q We are goi to cover some other areas, hopefully

~:~ jquickly. You previously tes lfied that on December 17th, n!

Page 5s ii; pdu; g your phone call with the President - and that’s in

A That’s coned. Q r: Ziget a lawyer? Da he ever tell you at that time that you should [III A I don’t believe so. No. [12; 0 113 1 certain of that? When you say “I don’t believe so”, are you quite [141 A I’m. I’m 99.9 percent certain. ,151 Q What would vou have done if he had told vou that i; 6iyou shouy a layer? -

I: i; to get a A la I wou d have started to think about how I was going

er and who I should get and I didn’t do that. (191So, that’s w at leads me to believe that he didn’t say that.

0 Okay. Were you ever under the impression from Ifiianything that the President said that ou should turn over [zzlall the gifts that he had given you to t t Paula Jones

I 2 3 I attorneys?

1241 A No. [251 Q Dii you ever talk to the President about turning

PiNem

111 A [2lthe 5th. I believe it was that weekend, the weekend prior to

Q Dii ou ever talk to him, during your meeting of ! :{ December 28th, 1987, about the fact that you were going to rslgive him that b+ k?

161 A No. r71 Q How do you know that you didn’t?

181 A Q Because I hadn’t purchased the book yet. r: iipaticular book? Had you even thought about purchasing that (111 A No. lt was bo Cl21 2 z% e ht on the spur of the moment.

r where you bought it7 ;:: jbook store. ~ayk?% kstore in Georgetown, an hntiqua i: i; that if Q I’m going to switch topics again. Do you believe [ 17 I FWs idy ou hadn’t had a sexual relationship with the

ent that you would have kept your job at the Whiie rleltiouse?

1191 A Yes. Q Do you baliive that our difficulty or inability to I:; j return to employment at the White lXouse was because of your r22lsexual relationship with him? 123: A Yes. Or the issues that, or the robkms that

124l~ P( 8 pqxlv* that mallyPwere based in trut[: because I 1251 d a relatIonshIp wtth the resident. But, however, some of

rllthepeoplewhoworkadtherechoseto, tosae~ ofmy

Page 61 rzlbehavior. Does that make sense? i3i 0

A What do you mean by that? I think that - I’ve always felt that some of the I!.; sorne of the staffers there particularly Evelyn Lieberman anb I 6 ~those who worked with h& to move me out of the White House, [ 7 J instead - looked at my behavior only, instead of looking at

[B itlh? President’s bhavlor, and instead of necessarily thinking [ glthat I had a relationship with the President, were just [ 1 o 1 looking at it thinking I was trying to have a relationship 111 lwith the President when I already was having a relationship [lzlwith him.

Q yD 1997 did The tumed a blind eye to his acbons. you feel that the President owed i i: i you something w%% pect* to a lob?

A ldid becauseha hehadpromisedmeonApril7th I: z: of ‘96 that he would bring me babe when if he won in [ 17; November. And I had - when he first toid me that, I had had [ls~ some hope and I didn’t, I didn’t even know if I was goin

P to [IsMar from him again after I left. And then when he con lnued

[2o! to call me frequent1

izljto believe he wou ld. during the campaign paricd, it led ma

bnng me back. And then after we had a - it was after a period $& hen he didn’t call me and I wasn’t sure about things, what 124 was happening - I’m sorry. I’m not being clear. [251 Because he had sort of led ma to believe that he

Page 56 to Page 61 OlCStarr

1364 BSA Monica Lewinsky - 8126198 Xrux( l l/ l, )

Page’ 62 Page 65

rr, ttlat 9 I: Iwas oing to bring me back and was constantly reassuring I bekeve that he did owe that to me. Versus him I 3 1 hai& saic. I’m realhr sorrv - let’s iust say in April of

ii j’96- ~~-~~ lly s& y~ hat this happened,, there’s not, you [ s. 1 know there’s nothing I ban do, and bft rt at that. Then I [ 6 1 woudn’t have felt that he owed me anything.

i;( jnot revealed What about the fact that you had gone quietly and

fy our nlatinship? Did that have anything to do [ 9 wfth your fee tn

r101 A il did later on. 1. I woufd have gone quietly that you went entitled to somethrng? i ;I janpy, because that - lt was never, ever, ever m intenbon r t 3 lfor ths relationshio to ever become Dublic. And - it ut I

[I ~didn’t. I didn’t want to make anyone look bad. I didn’t want [2] to sound like a fool, or - so, the President called me and r31we talked about some of the different rssues at the UN.. and

irlhe

I 51 thin 9r ave me some suggestions of things I could say. But I

he may have also done that the previous week, too [61 Q

[7jtalk on - Do you remember him giving you sort of a job pep

IS1 (91 a Yes. -the 3Oth?

A Yes. Q Why woutd. you describe it as a pep talk? A Because I was nervous. So. he. he was trvrna to _... -.-.__._ _.. ___~_ ___: ; ;; j had felt that after fiaving bft qure [I 4 lsort of maybe strung alon? throu !? ‘after having peen

out the campargn. and then i lsleven wa Into 1997 that had fat - and him pmmrsrng me [ 161 that he dy bnng me back and constantly enumerating the : 17 ~different steos he was trvina to take to do that - that,

; ; .g i yes, I didt%$ at that a? int %, he certain ,, e? r owed ma. Is th oart of vour letter o Julv 3rd to the ;;-=; Pmaent 6 ,~~~&~~&~--- ----- - -~ ~~ demibed it pre’viusly as [Z 11 threatening to disclose the relationshi r 22 1 pannts. was that part of your feekng Ii at least to your

at - 1231 A It was never really a a. maybe a - it was never c 2 I J mal

z r2s~ Whr a threat, because I never really was going to do that I had drsdosed a portiin of the relabonshrp to my

Page 63 11 imom, I never had any intention of telling my dad. There’s no [ 2 I way of that. And what I really was trying to do was trying to,

i:; in a circuitous manner, remind him that I had been a good [5] girl. and that I hadn’t, you know, disdored this [ 61 Information, and that really. you know, he’d promised me he

[Tlwas goin 18 itold my B to do something. And I had told my parents, I had

ad that I was coming back after the ebdion. Q I’d like to focus now just very briefl on your :: z! dealinqs with Ambassador Richardson with rega rrIr to the U. N. :Iljjob. -

[i2; A Yes. i:: jdirectly Q How many times did Ambassador Richardson call you

’ do you remember7 A Do yoi I mean someona from his - he never directly

i :z i picked up the phone c. ant d dialed my phone number.

!?, I iis; Q Let me ask a different question. A Okay. 1191 Q How many times did you speak to him personally7

:2oj A I believe twice. i211 Q And when I say personally, on the telephone? 1221 A Yes. 123: Q How do you know that you adualty spoke with him on i 2 4 1 those occasions?

125: A Well, the first time I spoke with him I remember,

Page 64 f 1 I because I was shocked and I was, I was very nervous. And -

I21 Q Because the Ambassador was on the phone? i:; actual A Exactly. And the second, the second tima I

hadn’t mall remembered I wasn’t sure. And then ,,, throu$ r. documenta ion I was shown, it, lt led me to baliive

[sIthat I ad, In fact, spoken to him on the phone. Q i 2: j fact, speaito But you are

[91

h;; synonal PO sitiie at least one time you did, in y?

10: 0 Do you remember which occasion that was, or when 11: that occurred?

12; A Yes, it was sometime in Odober. ;:; right? 0 Was that the Odtobar 23rd call? Does that tend ilSi - A Yes.

[161 Q And that’s prior to your actual interview with him?

[I71 A Comxt. 0 I’d like to just ask you very briefly about your /: 89{ conversation with the President the night before our r20! interview with Ambassador Richardson for the U. k. job. Could [211you describe who initiated that call and what the substance [221of the call was?

A I had - well I had requested thmugh Betty that

i:: ithe President call me, beduse I was real1 [ 2 5 1 interview and meeting with Ambassador Ry nervous about m

chardson. I just, fy

Ilal- A I belllveso. I& fer? Q Dii you tell Betty also that you had gotten an

I. 711 A Yes. 1221 Q Doyou remember any details about talking to Betty rzslabout it. or how vou let her know?

A I I remember qalling Se

$:~ telling her that ii had gdne much better Yz after the interview and an I had expected

Page 66 ri~ itwwkl, and~ atIwasrsaHy, thatIwas, thatlwas I 2 I somewhat more ifIterWted after having met the Ambassador than

[ 31 I w+! r prior to the interview. And other than that, I don?

rr) rsally.

Q Iii President tellin What about details about our conversation with the A him that you had gotten &job?

fvaguely ramember lt being in context, I think, of ii i sort of trvina to press hrm on gettina in touch with Mr. igjJordan. _ - ’ _ _

1101 Q Intemtsofgettlngotherjobs-

Ill1 1121 t ~$ fkt him know this?

[131 A Exactly.

I141 Q That you had an offer from the U. N.?

1151 A Right.

I161

i17j

Q Do YOU remember when YOU aot the UN. offeR A No.- - _ 1181 Q Was it sometime, in relation to your interview with r 19 1 the Ambassador - .~~, 1201 A It was sooner, rather than later. [211 Q So, somatkne within a matter of a week or - [221 [231 Aa t believesqo. A

IZiweeks or so. Eo’z% in a couple, within the next two Page 67 Q And did they tell you that they would leave the job i:& pen until a certain time, for you to make the decisii lf

13jyou wanted it?

OlCStarr Page 62 to Page 67

1365 BSA Monica Lewinsky - 11126198 X= WlSWl ~.______

Page% 6

. . .. I A EJcauly.

:2; Q

~3& cisbn? But they Wren’t rushing you to make an immediate

A- Cormct. .~ ._ :: 51mom -

:: 61 0 so. youwentoutbyyoufselto-

:: 71 A Yes. Idid.

FlE1 Q Whersdiyougomakesphonealt? :?* I A ToNo& stmWs.

-Ithink_ cafnedowmtaifsmithfne. Iused- l P8ge 0

Iii MR. WlRTR: Thank you.

15is- FS. MMERGUT: Nothing funher. Do you have any

(4; ?HE WITNESS: No. :51 (wherWpo& at 2: 24 pm.. the pmss4Mings wsre

T’hars all I have. Page 70 111 MS. WlRTH: I just have on49 qusstion. I21 BY MS. WlRTll:

Q From your grand jury testimony bst whek on August j~~~~~~~~~. arrrlklnoabou( yourunde~ ndingolme

trnnny rm~ ustgo4ngtoreadaportbnof ~61 our testimony to you and ask you a qwstbn ahout that. .71fhis is in msponse isi to a question from a juror.

You said. 7’m sorry. rm sorry. It% -from my L 91 understanding ahout what he testRed to on Monday, not -

; i0 1 just from the press occ43unts. is that this was a - that this :: I lwas a service contrad, that all I did was perform oral =x

:12 Ion him and that that’s all that this relationshi was. And :l3litwasabtmorc~ nVIPt10m0adIVloug trtwasabt f:. ~4lmor8thanthat’ 151 And the answer continues a lib hit mars after

16lthat.

:7: The question I have for you is that when you 19 I mentbned your und49rstanding of what ths President testigeci 19110 on the pnrvrous Monday fram what did you dsrive 30 I uncbrstanding of what ths Preskbnrs testrmony was. our q :? I; A FnxntheprsssaaxxmtsIhadread.

Q Okay. No one fro4n this office divufgecl to you ,:; j anything that the President said during his tsstimony, did :24lthey? :: s’ A Absolutejy not.

Page 66 to Page 0 olc- stan

1366 BSA Monlca Lewinsky- 8126198 XMAXfVfJl _______ .--__ ___~ _ _

Concordance Report ---

Unique Words: 1,103 ~8&& 0ccurrences:

;+ aVords In File:

I we_

Single File Concordance ___ CaseSensitive ___ CoverPages= 1 __ I

Includes AU Text Occurrences

Dates ON -*_ ___ IndudesPureNumbers _-- PossesiveForms ON

-- DATES--

April [I] 62: 3

April 7th [I] 61: 15 April 7th. 1998 [I] 39: 6 August 18th. 1997 [l] 51123 AugustZOth, 1998 [I] 70: 3 December 17th [2] :j 57114. 25 December 28th [l]

59: lO

December 28th, 1997 [l] 60: 4 December 3lst, 1995 [I ]

15: 16 February [2] 34: 17. 18 February 4th [l] 28: 12 February 4th, 1998 (11 29: 20

February 19th [1] 35: 14 February 28th [l] 45: 21 January [l] 6722 January, 1998 [1] 68: 6 Januaty4th [l] 59: 18 January 5th [1] 59: 12 January 7th [2] 18: 16; 3614 January 18th, 1998 (1) 668 January 21st [3] 21: 21; 24: 21; 26: 5 July 3rd [1] 62: 19 Juiy4th [2] 54: 14, 19 July 31,200O [I] 71: 25 March [2) 34: 18, 21 March 29th. 1997 [l] 49: 3 March 31st [l] 36: 7 March 31sf 1998 [l] 34: ll

November [3] 14: 24; 40: 13; 61: 17 November 15th [l] 21: 9

November 15th, l995 [1] 6: 25 November 17th [l] 13: 18 November 17th. 1995

[l] 1122 October [I] 64: 12 OctoberWrd [I] 64: 13

1 __ __

1 p] 5: 17, 18; 11: 21 10 (51 7: 6; 18: 9; 19: 12; 46: 9 15 [l] 26: 9 15th p] 6: 25; 15: 8; 21: lO 18th [2] 51: 24; 68: 8 17th [5] 1122; 13: 18; 14124; 57: 14,25

1995 p] 7: l; 11: 23; 15: 17

1998 [4] 28: 12; 29: 20; 34: 12; 39: 6 1997 [8] 49: 3; 51: 24; 54: 19; 58: 2; 60: 4; 61: 13; 62: 15. 20 1998 [4] 59: 12; 68: 6, 8; 70: 4 19th [2] 34: 17; 35: 14 ,l: lO [l] 29: 15

1: 15 [I] 29: 16 1: 87 [l] 57: 19

2 -_ __ 2 [z] 18: 15; 21: 22 20 [I] 11: 6 2ooO [I] 71: 25 20th [l] 70: 4

.2lst [4] 21: 21; 24: 21; .28: 5; 33114

23rd [I] 64: 13 .25 [I] 56: 21 .28th (31 45: 21; 59: lO;

’ 664 28th p] 34: 25; 49: 3 2: 07 [I] 57: 20 ‘2: 24 [I] 71: 5

3 __ __

30 (I] 28: 6 30th [l] 65: 9 31 [l] 71: 25 '31st (61 15: 16; 34: 12,

21.24; 35: 19; 36: 7 3rd [1] 62: 19

4 __ _- 40 [2] 11: 13; 28: 6 ,45 [2] 18: 24; 33: 11

4th [S] 28: 12; 29: 20; 54: 15, 19; 57: 11; 59: 16

--.- -_ __ 5

5- 10 [l] 7: 8 !Sth [2] 59: 12; 60: 2

7 __ __ 7 [l] 522 '75 [l] 56: 20

7th [5] 16: 16; 38: 4; 39: 6; $4513; 61: 15

9 __ __

96 (61 18: 16; 21: 21; 135: 15; 36: 9; 61: 16; 62: 4 i99.9 (11 56: 14

A __ __ ~Absolutely [1] 70: 25

~absolutely [l] 57: 18

:accepting [I] 31: 10

laccldentalfy [I] 29: 3

: accompanied [l] 69: ll

Iaccompany [l] 44: 3 :accounts [2] 7410.21

;accurate [1] 6: 9

:acted [1] 57: 2

iaction [2] 71: 17.20

,actions p] 32: 5; 61: 12

.actual (31 6: 20; 4622; '64: 16

.addlcted [2] 48: 4,5

addition [l] 4: 23

address (31 45: 24; 46: 3, 8

,advlce [l] 33: 13

;advise [l] 3: 18

,affalr (I] 42: 9 #Affairs [l] 35: 7

affectionate [2] 18: 13; 55: 24

afraid [1] 69: 18

afternoon p] 18: 19; :33: 23; 49: 11

iaftewards p] 11: 18; .38: 17

!Agent [2] 69: 2,9

.agents [l] 66: 11

laggressor [l] 32: 24

iagreement (31 4: 10, 14, ,21 ,alone [4] 46: 23,25;

47: 2; 56: 16

1 Amendment [l] 4: 8

angry [l] 55: 20

ankles [1] 30: 3

Anne [l] 3: 9 answer [2] 32: 8; 70: 15 antique [l] 60: 13 anus [4] 20: 3. 12;

30: 22; 31: 11

(anyway (11 62: 11

.anywhere [I] 15: 13

,appeared [I] 56: 5 appears [l] 71: 11 ,apple [l] 52: 2 #appiy [l] 3: 21 .approached [l) 16: 2 ,approximateiy [3] 28: 6;

33: 8; 59: 18 (April p] 39: 6; 61: 15;

62: 3 $area [8] 8: 9, 14; 13: 8;

17: 5; 27: 5; 36: 17; 47: 17; ,52: 10 iareas [1] 57: 24

iarm p] 33: 19; 56: 2

iarouse [t] 54: 4

caroused [I] 26: 21

larouslng [1] 38: 15

Iarmngement [1] 19: 3 iarrested [l] 69: 19 larrived [l] 27: 2 ,asklng p] 23: 12; 33: 3 I aspect f3] 18: 7; 20: 24;

: 33: 4 iaspects p] 5: 8. 14;

: 34: 4 ~assumed [1] 7: 12 iassuming [1] 41: 4

I attention [4] 11: 20,25;

~ 33: 7; 5912 ;attomey 141 322.23, :25; 71: 16

‘attorneys [l] 56~ 23

Iattraction [l] 5: 12

‘August p] 51: 23; 70: 3 aware [1] 15: 12 :awhlle f4] 1l: l; 51: 21; 167: 17; 69: 5

B SW __

Ibabbling [l] 4922 Ibarely (1) 51: 13 :based [I] 60: 24

!Basicalfy [t] 6: 18

~ba! Slcally [1] 68: 5

~batlwoom [it] 12: 8; 18: 4; 19: 14. 15; 36: 20; *47: 11, 21; 5517; 69: 3. 5. 7 ibeautfful 141 30: 9; 47: 9, '10; 55: 16

,beforehand [l] II: 17

1 behavior p] 61: 2, 7, 8 ibehind [l] 22: 7

;believe p3] 7: 5; 8: 1, 10; '9: 5; 1O: lO; 1l: l; 12: 6;

14: 12; 15: 6; 17: 4; 23: 21; 3122; 35: 4, 21; 40: 9; :42: 14; 43: 22; 58: ll. 12, '19; 60: l. 15, 20; 61: 21,

25; 62: 2; 63: 20; 64: 5; 65: 18; 66: 22; 67: 12, 15 'believed p] 18: 4; 67: 23

lx! lly [l] 5519

bend [2] 51: 7: 52: 8 beret [I] 25: 7 Batty [18] 45: 23; 46~ 1: 12; 48: 18.23: 49: 6. 7. 8 9, 10; 51121; 58: 7; 59: 17. 64: 23; 65: 19. 22, 24 Betty's [5] 27: 4, 5. 7; 28: 4; 46: 13

Bin [l] 66: 23

Binhak [l] 68: 24

birthday (6) 15: 21; 51: 25; 52: l. 3, 4, 5

birthdays (11 52: 6 bit [17] 7: 25; 12: 7; 16: 14; 18: 10; 2222; 23: 18; 24: 8; 39: 14; 43: 9; 5013; 5313; 54123; 55110. 18; 56: ll; 67: 5; 70: 15

‘bizarre [2] 17: 24; 57: lO blind [l] 61: 12 blizzard [I] 18: 20 blouse [t] 50: 5

: blue [l] 48: 25

‘bold p] 6: 13; 28: 12

j book 113) 16: 24; 47: 8, 10; 59115, 17.21.22.23, 25; 60: 5,8. 10. 14 bookstore [I] 60: 13

'Bosnia p] 23: 21,22 iBoss [I] 39: 3

bothering[ l] 36: 23 ibought (21 60: 11,12

bn [24] 8: 2. 3, 4, 21; 12: 15. 20,21,23,25; 17: 9; 19: 18; 30: 4, 5.6. 7; .37: 23, 24; 45: 9; 47: 13.

14; 50: 6; 56: 4,5

brassiere f2] 37: 18, 19

‘break [5] 4: 4; 29: 13, 14; .57: 16, 17 ‘breasts p4] 8: 2, 5, 7,

17.20; 12: 12.20,21,22; '17: 3. 8, 9; 19: 17; 25: 13. .23; 30: 10; 37: 6, 17. 19, i21; 40: 25; 45: 6; 47: 13; c50: 7 /brief f- 21 53: 14,19

i briefly [4] 54: 15. 22; i63: 9; 64: 18

I bringing [l] 31: 13 brothefs [1] 15: 21 ‘Brown [l] 39: 12 ,bulld [1] 65: 13 .Bullding (1) 22: 7

bump p) 29: l. 2

‘bumped [1] 29: 7

‘butt [2] 542

I buttoned [I] 29: 24

C __ __

Cacheris [2] 4: 1.2

call [31] 8: lO; 12: 7, 8.9; 16: 23; 18: 25; 28: 24;

From April to call

1367

esA Monicr Lewlnsky - 8/ 28/ 98 -1

33: 19; 41: 23; 43: 13. 20. confidence [ll 65: 13 57114. 25: 59: 10; 60: 4 e"% ing 7: 13; 11111. [a] 21.24; 44: 3; 45: 7; 53: 19; connected [1] 24120 decided [1] 32: 4 E -- __ 13: s; 3522; 36: l; 39: 9; 58: l. 59: 13; 61: 20.23; connection (4) 3: 19; decbion p] 67: 2. 19; 45: 24: 68: lO %#: 13; 64: 13. 21. 22. 24; ,54: 19; 56: 23; 59: 9 68: 3. 6 early p] 34: 18; 39: 9; events p] 6: 10.12 Xk14. 18.21: 69: 1.10 ~conrtontIy p] 62: 1,16 definition p] 5322; 55: l OVOntruiiy p] 25: 16;

calling p] 16: 19; 65: 24 ~consult p] 4: 2.4 54: 3. 7 ,easier [1] 5O: lO 2812 celk [1] 35: 14 ~Contact [17] 11: 25; ,deprrt [1] lo: 24 easily p] 57: 3.4 evolved [i] 5: lo

campaign ~1 61: 20; 122; 21: 13; 25: 16. 17; Deporttkm p] 5: 17, 18; Emter [I] 3g: g 62: 14 .34: 13: 35: 25; 49: 7; 50: 25; 1121 Eastman [I] 71: 9 Euctty p] 28: ll;

35: 12: 43: 4; 51: 11; 53: 10; undie [1] 52: 2 :51: 2.3; 52: 16; 53: 11. 15. deposition [s] 3: 18.20; eeeY PI 54X?

cmm [I] 47: 24 21; 58: 7 .4: 7; 29: 15; 57: i9; 71110, ejrcutate 1131 1022;

64: 3; 66: ll. 13; 68: 1 ured [1] 577 contacted [I] 49: 8 12. 14, 17 14: 10, 12; 15: 12. 13; ex= tiy [SJ 7: 24; 1320;

19: 6; 39: 24; 4O: lg

Carlton [l] 68: 8 icontatt, [i] 6: s defivd [l] 70: 19 17: 17,25; 20116; 212; -MiNAllON (11 3: 16 caee p] 4: 15. 17; 33: 3 ~Conmct [1] 86: 7 describe [14) 6: 3. 19; 27~ 13; 41: 17; 48: 8; 5020 eumimaon [I] 3: 13

trtegory [1] 39: 4 ,wntinuad p] 22: 12; 7: 21; 1124; 15: 17; 18: 16; e/ rcuieting PI 1720

cenwed [l] 55: 17 .47122; 61: 19 :212; 22: 19; 2614; 28113; ,ejaculation p] 15: ll; examined [1] 3: 15

excited [1] 67: lo CERTIFICATE [1] 71: 8 ~continuee [1] 70: 15 .3025; 39: 7; 64: 21; 65: 11 41: 20; 48: 17

certify [1] 71: lO ;contmct (11 7O: ll .described [5] 11: 23; ehctfon [I] 63: 8 excttfng [1] 42: 6

~exclusivety [I] 37: 4 c~ mcmixe (1) 5: 9 ~conversetion [ti] 11: 2; .26: 6; 29- 21; 54: 5; 62: 20 '- iuuY VI 7133 ~excuses 111 172 chert m 5: 21; 6: 2. 7; '15: 19; 24: 23; 64: 19; 66: 5 :detail w] 6: 17; 11: 24; .eIevetor [1] 22I9 11: 21; 15: 16; 34: 25; tconvemtional [1] 14: 2 46: 16; 49- 2 :Elkabeth [1] 71: 9 Executive [i] 22: 7

Exhibit p] 5: 18.22; 3624 1121 chetting [1] 14: 5

:convenrtione [I] 49: 5 ;detaiIs R 6: 21; 6522; -6= si” g PI 814; Iconvinced [1] 4O: lO 166: s

check [1] 39: 23 ~cooPemtion [I] 4: 15 ~deveeWWd [1] 42: 18 'Emiassy P] 3524 exhibit [q- 4: 17; 5: 17. 23.24; 21: 22

cherieh [I] 24: 9 CoPy [1] 522 'devekp p] 6: 2; 33: 16; 'Emmkk [I] 69: 2 cheriehed (1) 24: l cormctiy [I] 9: 8 :34: 5

*exPected [I] 65: 25

cherishes (21 23: 16.17 .corridor [1] 22: 12 !deVeloPed [1] '5: 14 efnoflonal p] 5: 13; 54: 14.19 exPectW 35: 6 PI

cheet p] 13: 8; 36: 25; COUNSEL p] 3: 16 ldeveloping [1] 23: 2 :Expirrr [1] 71: 24 Couneel [5] 3: 8. 10, 14; ,motionelti [sl 42118; ~expleined [I] 3g: 18 47: 18 :d& kd [I] 63: 16 .53: 2. 5; 56: 8,24 chewing [t] 36: 6 ;4: 11; 6: 3 ~difficuRy [I] 60: 20 expbining [1] 30: 6 choee [1] 61: l couneel p] 71: 16.19 #dining p] 16: 2; 45: 19;

mployed PI 71: 16.19 ,exPoee p] 12~ 20 IemPloyee VI 71:~

Chrktmas [2] 46: 6; couple p] 37: 3; 66: 24 51: 19 remployment [1] 6021 .exPoeed p] i3: 9; 17: 3;

~encounter w] 6: 25; 19: 17; 26: 5; 31: 5; 50: 7 53: 16 coune [5] 31: 2; 32: 9, direct [5] 11: 20.25;

cigar [lo] 15: 20; 16: 12. 10. 16; 88: 10 .25: 16; 33: 7; 48: 14 7: 13; 9: 16.23; 10: 8; 11: 5. eXPOSing p] 25: 23; 2618 3; 36: 1.6. 7. 8, 17 COURT [l] 71: 8 directed [I] 32: 9 9, 14; 13113. 19; 18: 6,7;

cover [1] 57: 24 20: 19, 21; 21: 21,23; extended 6717 [I]

cigen p] 15: 23 Dimcting [I] 59: 12 eye [4] 35: 25; 40: 7. 12; circuitous [l] 63: 4 covering [I] 51: 15 ~direction [I] 14: 9 22: 19; 24: 24; 26: 15; 28: 8, :61: 12 circumshnces [l] 6: 19 crutches p] 49: 12.17 disclose [1] 62: 21 :8. 13. 14; 33: l. 5; 34: 7, cleMy p] 7: 15: 42: 13 cy (1) 55: 3 .discloeed [2] 62: 25; 12; 38: 12. 19; 39: 6, 7.20; -- F __

clear [4] 17: 7; 44: 11, wying p] 39: 16; 55: 1.3 #63: 5 41123; 43: 8,11; 45: 5,20, 12; 61: 24 cuti [1] 59: 17 ~discuseed [I] 14: 13 22; 46: 20; 48: 15; 49: 3. 4; ,face [1] 56: 4 clearer [1] 67: 5 cut [1] 35: 15 discussing [I] 58: 4 51: 17; 52: 1, 19.20 :kct [S] 7: 19; 59: 4; 60: 4; Clinton [I] 56: ll cute p] 17: 1; 25: 9 discuesion [14] 9: 15, Iencounters [6] 6: 14. 62: 7; 64: 6,8; 68: 10, 11

closed [I] 36: 19 22; 13: 12, 15, 18; j7: jg; 22; 1122; 23: l; 44: 21; fair [S] 26: 8; 32: 20.23. clothes p] 37: lO; D __ __ 18~ 8; 20: 18; 27: 23; 41: 19; '45: 2 .25; 33: 15; 59: 8 50: 18; 51: 15 50- m; B; 55: 8; 5g: l4 iEnd (1) 51: 2 .fake (1) 36: 12

clothing [IS] 5: 15,20; ‘dad PI 5433; m: l. 8 DISTRICT (11 71: 23 tend m 10: 10.25; 43: 8; !fall [1] 53: 21 12: 13; 25: 14. 15.21: damn [1] 45: 14 .divulged [I] 7022 '48115; 50: 25; 51: 17; lfallin 1 56: 5 37: l. 7. 8. 18; 41: s: 45: l Idark ['I 49: 15 collecting [l] 4422 data [16] 11: 21; 15: 16; ,docmmntetion [I] 64: 5 52: lg

19: 25; 24: 21; 28: 13; doeen't [q 23: 7,8, 15; :;;: 5d PI 113: 34: W * 69: 2.9

’ [s] 28: 12; COLUMBIA (I] 71: 23 48: 2

comfort (11 23: 24 30: 19.21; 3411, 13; 3914; 40123; 4122; 46: l; dominant [1] 24: 12 lenbing [1] 51: 18

29: 20; 34: 17. 18; 35: 14; ,45: 21 comfortable p] 29: 4; door [II] 16: 1,2,3; Ienjoyed p] 33: 24; 34: 1 :feel m 24: 3; 48: 2; 68: 14 52: 14, 17; 5424 19: 4; 27: 8. 11; 28: 4; 35: 7; entItled [I] 8219 61: 13; 62: 18; 67: 14; coming [1] 63: 8 day [27j 8: 9; 15: 2; 36: 19; 46: 18.23 ientrance [l] 16: 1 '69: 17

Commission [1] 71: 24 18120; 21: 4; 22: 5; 23: 20, d- i= [,] 68: 25 ,entry [l] 28: 5 feeling [S] 2222; 25: 8; company [l] 1822 21; 25: 6; 35: s; 3715; 3713; 62: 9.22 compatible [l] 24: 18 38: 24; 39: 1, 15; 40: 22;

dress m 29: 24; 30: 3,4; enumemfe 111 8: 3

47: 13; 46: 24.25; 49: 3

compm [4] 4: 25; g: g; 45: 3.4; 49: W 50: 7; 51: 4; dmed [I] 44124 .OnUmnIting [1] 82: 16 ,fctt [is] 14: 6; 22: 24; .erotk [1] 42: 7 '24: 9. 18. 19; 29: 4; 32: 17;

10: 16; 48: 2 52: 8; 54: 19; 55: 8; 56: 21. due [,] lg: z ~essentirlty [1] 3: 21 42: 16,20; 43: 1; 56: 25; completely p] 44: 25; 24; 57: 2. 10 duly [2] 3: 14; 71: 12 ‘- timate p] 11: 4; 61: 4; 62: 6. 13. 15 51: 17; 57: 13 days [I] 37: 3 concentrated [I] 36~ deal PI 6113; 56122

dumb 121 25: 8.9 20: 23; 28: lO ,Fifth [I] 4: 8

duty (1) 19: 8 estimator [1] 11: 8 fight P] 54: 25; 55: 1 concluded [l] 71: 6 dealings [1] 63~ 10 Evelyn [4] 3524; 39: 23; financially [I] 71: w

onclusion [I] 57: 3 December [5] 15: 16; 4O: l: 61: 5 find [1] 69: 5 i% orn calling to find

1368 BSA Monica Lewinsky - 8/ 26f98 -__-_ Y”“ ’ fine (31 16: 16; 28: 19; 39: 17 fingers (11 40: 14 finished p) 151; 43: lO; 48: 7 finishing [2) 185; 5022 fire [l] 55: 18 Fimt [3] 322; 5: 6; 31: 16 first [18] 3: 14; 6: 24; 15: 20; 16: 9; 18: 18, 20; 2222; 23: 20. 22; 25: 6; 3122; 39: lO. 18; 40: 8; “s; 42; 61: 17; 63: 25;

fixed [l] 48: 20 focus [1] 63: 9 focused [l) 37: 4 folder [3] 38: 25; 39: 2, 22 follow [2] 69: 7. 6 follows [l] 3: 15 fondle [l] 17: ll fondled [6] 17: 8; 19: 17. 18; 25: 12; 37: 6; 47: 13 fondling p] 12: 71; 17: 3. 4 fool [I] 65: 2 foregoing [2] 71: 10, 11 foreplay [2] 25: 18 forgot (I] 28: 23 forgotten [2] 16: 17; 28: 24 form [I] 14: 2 found [l] 39: lO four [I] 50: 14 Fox [I] 19: 8 free [I] 69: 16 frequent& [l] 61: 20 Friday [2] 11: 3; 34: 24 friend [2] 23: 14; 27: 1 friends [l] 23: 17 friendship [3] 5: 10, 13; 33: 16

full [l] 3: 3 fully (11 31: 5 fun [2] 24: 16. 17 funny [6] 16: 25; 25: 1.2; 26: 22, 24; 42: 16 furlough [l] 23: 5 furloughed [I] 23: 5

G __ __ Gap [l] 48: 25 gap [l] 45120 Garden [3] 22: 13; 28: 4; 29: 8 gardener p] 55: 5.6 gave [4] 19: l; 47: 5; 59: 17; 65: 4 genital m 8: 9. 14; 13: 3; 17: 5; 47: 16; 48: 14; 52: 10 genitals [18] 17: 11, 12; 19: 20; 21: 13, 14; 25: 24; 27: 23; 30: 17; 31: 15, 17;

3716; 40: 23; 48: 12; 516 10. 15; 52: 14 gentle [l] 55: 4 Georgetown [l] 60: 13 gesture [l] 44: 5 gift p] 39: 4; 46: 6 gifts [s] 5822; 59: 1, 5. 9

girl [I] 63: 5

girtfriend [1] 23: 4

give [9] 16: 12, 13; 20: 5 46: 6. 12; 4713; 59: 18; 80: 5; 67: 18 given [4] 5822; 68: 13; 71: 15 giving [3] 4: 14; 14: 9; 65: 6 God [1] 12: 23 goes [2] 28: 4; 69: 15 igoodbye p] 18: 3; 27: 6

gotten [2] 65: 19; 66: 6 :Grand [l] 522 .grand [6] 3: 21; 4: 8. 17;

11: 23; 54: 18; 7013 :Grass [I] 47: 6

1 gratify (1) 19: 25 ,graxed [2] 51: 10, 14

; great I2] 15: 24; 18: 23 lgroup [l] 46: 9 iguarantee [l] 67: 25 ,guard [I] 35: 5 ‘guess t5] 22: 10; 25: 12;

37: 3. 4; 47: 1 H __ __

hat [2] 25: 8, 9 hadn’t [9] 10: 18, 19;

46: 25: 53: 4; 60: 8, 16; 63: 5; 64: 4 hair 121 25: 5; 56: 4

hatpin [l] 47: 5 haif [5] 1O: l; 11: 13;

2022; 28: 21; 33: 9 he’d [ll] 33: 19; hall p] 16: 18; 22: 6; 29: 7

35: 1, 2: halhnay [ll] 7: 24; 8: ll;

,25: 4; 27: 8, 9; 29: 2; 36%‘; /43: 24; 47: 12; 5517

: hand [5] 8: 13; 31: 23; 36: 21; 41: 13, 14; 38: 7; 50: 9; 56: 1

55: 25; handle [1] 5522

‘hands [13] 8: 5; 12: 12; 17: 4; 19: 19; 21: 14; 25: 13; 30: 10; 3716; 41: 2; 47: 15; 56: 3. 4. 15 hanging [I] 30: 7 happening [3] 14: 18; 39: 25; 61: 24 happens [2] 36: 9, 15 Happy [l] 18: 3 happy [2] 52: 4; 85: 15 hard [4] 20: 23; 32: 8; 54: 13; 55: lO

56: 2, 3; 62: 16; 63: 6 he’ll [l] 40~ 16 he’s [l] 51: 7 head [l] 33: 21

hear Ill 61: 19 heard [5] 2217, 8; 43: 12: 47: 20 heeding [I] 33: 13 I

help (1) 44: 23 helped p] 6: 2; 9: 9; 33: 17 hereby [l] 7l: lO hereto [l] 71: 19 Hemreich’s p] 27: 6. 16; 28: l hey [l] 19: lO hit p] 54: l. 2 Hmm p] 11: 3; 2022; 31: 20 hobbled [l] 49: 12 hold [I] 6723 holding p] 49: 18. 19; 56: l home [6] 18: 19; 33: 21; 35: 23; 36: 4; 39: 8. 22 honor [2] 15: 21; 52: 5 hope p] 44: 19; 61: 18 hopefully 111 57: 24 hoping [l] 36: 3 hour [4] 11: 13; 2022; 28: 20; 33: 11 hours p] 28: 23; 33: 9 House p] 60: 18.21; 61: 6 hugged p] 48: 3; 52: 25 hugging [I] 55: 3 Hugo [I] 39: 3 hundred [l] 43: 17 hurried [I] 45: 18 hurriedly [I] 47: 5 hurt [l] 6922

I __ __ impression [3] 58: 20; 67: 23; 69: 20 inability [l] 60: 20 incident I2) 6: 17, 18 l’d [4] 36: 24; 57: 17;

63: 9; 64: 18 I’ve [4] 24: 18; 46: 14; 57: 12; 61: 4 lckes (21 43: 12; 45: 17 idea [4] 7: 12; 20: 13; 38~ 3; 42111 identification [I] 5: 19 immediate p] 25: 17; 68: 2 IMMERGUT (lo] 3: 2, 7. 17; 5120; 21: 7.20; 29: 17; 57: 21: 69: 25; 71: 2 lmmergut [I] 3: 7 immunity [I] 4: 15 implicitly [I] 14: 9 important 111 48~ 1

incredible [2] 47: 9; 62: 19. 71~ 25 56: 23 jump [I] 25: 17 incriminate [2] 4: 9.21 juror [l] 70: 7 ,INDEPENDENT 111 3: 16 Jury [I] 522 Independent Is] - j: 8_ 9, 14; 4: 1 I; 6: 3 indicate [l] 32: 5 indicated [I] 46: 2 ‘indicting [I] 34: 19 infamous [l] 25: 7

~lnformation [4] 6: 7; 24: 6; 26: 17; 63: 6 .initialiy [l] 23: 3

initiated [6] 6: 20; 8: 25; ;20: 7: 32: ll. 12: 84: 21

jury 161 3121; 4: 8. 17. 11: 24; 54: 18; 70~ 3

-_ __ K Katin [I] 3: 7 keep [I] 6715 kept p] 16: 19; 26: 9; 56: 5; 60: 17 Kiddo p] 16: 19, 21 killed [l] 2322

8 kinds p] 24: 20; 55: 15 kiss [9] 29: 21; 34: 6; 46: 24; 52: 5; 53: 14. 16. 19.20; 56: 2 #kid [12] 18: 3; 19: 17; .27: 6,21; 33: 19; 3?: 2, 5; he& e r;] &: 23

insert [l] 37: 25 instances tl] 32: 7 intelligent [l] 65: 14 intense p] 56: 7,8 intent (I] 54: 4 iintention p] 62111; 6311 ,47: 12; 48116; 49: 23; 5219

iinterest [l] 23: 10 kissing. [19] 7: 16.25; iinterested [4] 7: g; 66: 2; l2: ll; 13: 8; 17: 2; 18: lO.

i67: 13; 71: 20 11; 25: l. 4, 11; 2923;

1 interpret [l]. 42: 4 ,40: 20; 45: 5; 47: 12. 14.

I intewiew [6] 64: 16, 20, 18; 49: 24; 50: 8 .25; 65: 24; 66: 3, 18 iknee tl] 51: 8 tintimacy m 6: 15. 16; ! knocked p] 48: 18,23 #7: 15; 12: 1; 35: 20; 40: 22; ‘knowing 111 6718 ‘52: 17 lintimate [i4] 7: 13. 14; L -_ __ 19: 14, 15; 31: 2; 32: lO; .34: 4. 13.20: 38: 5: 40: 21; : k-; y; f;; j$ 3: 6

39: 15; 53: 14;‘ 69: 21.‘ 24; ,43: 23; 53: 15,20

1 invite p] 19: 6; 44: 5; 45: 23 invited (21 7: 23; 16: 7 linvolve Ii] 11: 14 .involved [l] 6: 14 iirony 111 42: 10

israeli [l] 35: 23 ‘ssue p] 17: 24; 89: 15

issues p] 60: 23; 65: 3 70: 3

‘lasted [3] 11: 5; 18: 7; 33: 5 :Iate p] 34: 18; 3522 ,iaugh [2] 24: 17; 41: 13 ‘laughed (I] 23: 11

1 laughing p] 26: 20; 34: 6 ilawyer p] 58: 10, 16. 18

/ lawyers (11 59: 1

/ leading p] 6: 19; 34: 24 Ileads p] 16: l; 58: 19 lleanlng [4] 36: 19; __ __ J

jacket p] 8: 2; 12: lO ,jail fl] 69: 20 .1 14$ 17 25; 5013 IJanuary po] 18: 16; %ani’jl] 55: 18

: 21: 21; 24: 21; 28: 5; 38: 4; 1 kme [IS] 12: 6; 22: 15. 59: 12, 18; 67: 22; 88: 6,8 16; 27: 2,3,7; 28: l; 29: 5; .jetted (11 43: 14 :33: 18; 38: 19; 67: l; 68: ll; :job [9] 40: 15; 60: 17; 169: 16, 18 61: 14; 63~ I; 64120; 65: 6; LeaVet 01 47: 6 #66: 6; 67: 1, 9 ‘leaving p] 22: 5; 25: 5 jobs ll] 66: lO ‘leeway [I] 68: 5 John [2] 39: 21.23 :L8g [l] 35: 7 ijoke [3] 10: 18; 4l: ll; #legs 111 31: 5

: 53: 25 LeVs [5] 28: 12; 29: 14; joking p] 24: 15; 45: 16 34: ll; 51: 23; 54: 9

: jokingly [2] 47: 2; 5620 )kt’S (51 29: 12; 35: 4; Jones [2] 5822; 59: i ‘62: 3; 67: 15.21 Jordan (I] 66: 9 letter [l] 62: 19 July [s] 54: 14. 19; ,ktting [l] 13: 15

From fine to letting

1369

mA MonicaLewinsky- 8126198 level [1] 435 Lew Iz] 197.9 LgWlNSKY [2] 35, 12 Lewinsky [5] 3: 2, 5; 16: 21; 29: 16; 5722

Lieberman [2] 35: 24; 61: 5 lifted [2] 8: 3; 17: 2 lifting p] 12: 21,22; 2522 lights [l) 8: 12 liked [2] 22: 23; 25: 10 Linda [l] 43: 5 line [1] 42: ll lipstick [3] 48: 20. 22. 23 liit [1] 58: 5 listed (51 6: 15; 12: l; 15: 16; 21: 21; 39: 3 lists 111 26: 5 litemlly [l] 49: 19 locked (2) 27: 9, 11 lot [15] 15: 9; 23: 15. 16; 24: 6. 15; 42: 4; 47: 10; 50: 8; 55: 8, 17.21, 23; 65: 15; 70: 13 love p] 57: 1,6 lovingly [1] 36: 25 lower [l] 3622 lowered [3] 31: 4; 50: 19 luckily [i] 45: 20

M __ __

M- O- N- I- C- A [l] 3: 5

Macy’s [2] 69: 3,4 Mall 111 69: 19 managed [l] 39: 25 manner [4] 23: ll; 37: 5; 4216; 63: 4 manually [3] 8: 13; 27: ll; 5O: ll March [5] 34: 11, 18.21; 36: 7; 49: 3 mark [i] 5: 16

marked [2] 5: 19, 21

Mary [I] 3: 9 matter [l] 66: 21

mean [27] 10: 19; 13: 20. 21,23; 14: 1, 5, 6, 7; 19: 23; 24: 16; 26: 22; 29: 11; 32: 6, 9, 10. 15, 16; 37: 20; 46: 2; 48: 1; 49: 18; 51: 13; 53: 16; 56: 25; 61: 3; 63: 15 meant [2] 47: 10; 54: 22 meet [4] 7: 7, 11, 19. 21

meeting [12] 15: l. 7, 17. 18; 18: 16; 40: 18; 48: 15; 51: 18; 54: 23, 25; 6013; 64: 25 meetings [1] 36: 19

members [1] 46: 14

menstruating [I] 19: 23

mention [l] 38: 23 mentioned m 14: 14;

17: 7; 27: 22; 35: 13; 42: 15. 22; 70: 18

middle [l] 24: 25

mind p] 21: lO; 22: l;

32: 13 mine [2] 20: 14; 52: 6 minute [1] 8: 17 minutes [lo] 7: 8; 11: 6, 13; 18: 9. 24; 19: 9. 12; 28: 6, 9; 33: ll ML [I] 522 modest [l] 55: lO modified [1] 4: 9

mom [2] 63: 1; 68: 14

moment p] 32: 15; 60: 11 moments p] 34: 20; 42: 20 Mona [1] 67: 12

Monday p] 39: 14; 70: 9, 19 MONICA [I] 3: 12

Monica [3] 3: 5; 16: 21; 19: lO month p] 46: 4,5 Mother [l] 1922 mother p] 68: 21; 69: 11

mouth [12] 8: 7: 12: 12; 17: 4; 19: 19; 20: 3; 25: 13; 30: 12; 38: 18; 41: 2; 47: 15; 48: 8; 50: 20 move m 34: ll; 36: 24; %; 9; 51: 23; 54: 9, 14;

moved m 8: 10, 11; 23: 23; 30: 6; 47: 21; 51: 19; 55: 7 MR [1] 7l: l Mr [ii] 4: 2; 7: 4, 7.22; 16: 4, 6; 43: 12. 13; 45: 17; 66: 8; 69: 2 Mrs (11 56: lO

MS [14] 3: 2, 5, 7, 17; 5: 20; 21: 7. 8. 20; 29: 17; 57: 21; 69: 25; 70: 1. 2; 71: 2 MS p] 3: 2; 29: 18; 5722 Muskett [I] 39: 21

mutual [l] 32: 6 myself (51 6: 5; 23: 8; 24: 6; 45: 18; 69: 3

N __ --

name [8] 3: 3; 16: 18,20. 22, 25; 22: 6; 58: 5; 59: 21

Nancy [3] 27: 6, 16; 28: 1

Nancy’s p] 27: 10 narrative [l] 16: 16 Nature [l] 1922

naughty [l] 38: 8 neck [3] 13: 8; 3O: l: 56: 2 needing [1] 55: 18 Nel [s] 15: 19. 21; 16: 5. 11

nervous 141 64: l. 24; 65: 12; 67: 8

night [6] 7: 16; 15: 20; 33: 25; 34: 24; 64: 19; 68: 8 Nordstrom's [l] 68: 19 NOTARY [2] 71: 8,22 notary [l] 3: 15 note [I] 33: 7 noticed (21 22: 2; 55: 6 November m 6: 25; 1122; 13: 18; 14: 24; 21: 9; 40: 13; 61: 17 number [5] 19: l; 33: 20, 21; 63: 16

0 __ __ #oath [2] 29: l8; 5722

obvious [1] 57: 9 Obviously [1] 4: 9 ~obvtously p] 34: 4; .42: 10 'occasion [zs] 822; :12: 24; 13: 4; 15: 14; 17: 14. '17.25; 19: 20; 20: 5. 7, 13, '16; 25: 21,24; 2722; ;37: 25; 42114; 4311, 19; 148: 13, 24; 50: 16. 20;

51: 1, 12; 64: 10 ~occasions p] 26: 7; #49: 22; 63: 24 loccurred m 622; 7: 3;

12: 2; 15: 18; 21: 23; 41: 8; '64: ll ~occurring p] 9: 16,24 'October [2] 64: 12. 13 ,odd [4] 23: 18, 25; 24: 2.

offer m 65: 15, 17.20; ~66: 14, 16; 67: 4, 7 #offered [3] 15: 22; 24: 5;

36: 5 'Office [it31 3: 8, 9. 13; ~4: 10; 6: 2; 12: 4; 19: 8; .22: 7, 14. 16,17.20;

Okay m 12: 15; 14: 4. 8. 14. 21; 18: 6; 19: 25; 20: 15; 21: 11, 17. 19; 27: 20; 29: 14; 30: 24; 31: 7, 25; 33: 7; 37: 17; 38: 17; 42: 14; 44: 18; 46: 21; 53: 18; 57113; 58120; 63: 18; 70: 22 okay [5] 29: 5; 32: 13; 39: 24; 46: 7; 5217

Old [I] 227 open [5] 16: 3; 19: 4; 67: 2. 16. 24 opening [l] 9: 9 oml [36] 6: 16; 8: 22,25; 10: 3,7. 11.12. 19; 12: 1; 13: 9: 1424: 15: 12: 17: 16; 19: 22; 2OIl, 5. 7; 21: 3; 26: 1,6; 31: 25; 32: 14; 38: 20; 41: 7. 15; 42: 1; '43: 16, 20; 44: 8. 16; 47: 19.22; 50%; 51: 5;

52: 12; 7011 omlly [4] 20: 3,12; 30: 22; 31: 10 iorgasm [5] 8: 15; 13: lO; i30: 19; 31: 14; 50: 13 I0utc0nle [l] 71: 20 loutdoor [l] 22: 12 ioutside [5] 3123; 17: 9; '19: 8; 35: 6; 5515

IOval [15] 12: 4; 19: 6; i22: 14. 16. 17, 20; 26: 15; '27: 5; 296; 33: lO; 36: 13; '3815; 43: 13, 15; 45117 ~overcast [2] 49: 14,15 'OIIYB [l] 62: 2 lowed p] 61: 13; 62: 6, 18

P __ __

1p. m. [S] 7: 6; 29: 15, 16; :57: 19, 20; 71: 5 ;page [3] 18: 15; 21: 22; 169: l ;26: 15; 29: 8; 33: 10; 36: 13; lPanetts 12) 165, 6 '38: 5; 43: 13 &office 1611 7: 4. 5. 8. 22: 18: 11, 12; iO: 1,24: 125; '15: 3; 16: 8; 18: 21,23,25; 19: 1,2,4, 12; 22: 4, 10; ,23: 14; 27: 4, 5,6, 8, 10, 11, 16; 28: 1,4, 15, 16, 17,20; 29: 9, 11,21, 23; '33: 21, 23; 35: 3; 36: 3, 11; '39: 21; 40: 2,4; 41: 16; '43: 12, 25; 45: 9; 46: 13, 23; 47: 21; 49: 13; 52: 2; 55: 2; 7022 'officer [l] 71: 9 Oh [3) 12: 9.23; 51: 19

oh [14] 11: 2; 1822; 19: 10; 25: 5; 28: 19; 31: 6; 3514; 37: 14; 48: 21; 50: 9; 51: 4; 56: 18; 69: 16

IPanetWs [l] 7: 4 Ipanties [1] 5O: ll :pants 1241 8: 13; 9: 2.4, 15. 9; 13: 9; 14: 15; 17: 5,6; ,20: 9, 10; 21: 14; 26: 5.8, !9; 31: 3,4; 41: 8. 11; 44: 1.

13; 47: 17; 5O: lO. 19 Ipapers [lo] 19: 5; 35: 5, 16. 8; 36: 12; 38: 24; 39: 1, ,2.22 ~parents [2] 62: 22; 63: 7

,p~ rt [13] 4: 21; 6: 15; '10: 8; 11: 4. 15; 24: 12; :28: 8; 35: 9, 17; 38: 12; 146: 22; 62: 19,22 iparties [2] 71: 16,19 !pass [2] 19: 3. 4

passed [2] 19: 7; 39: 12 passion [l] 32: 15

passionate (11 53: 17 pathway [l] 22: 17 patience (11 5411

Paula [l] 5822 pee [l] 56: 21 penalties [I] 4: 25 Pentagon (31 39: ll. 40: 16; 42: 19 people [9] 15: 9; 42: 4 46: 9, 14; 55: 19. 21; 60: 24; 61: 1

pep [2] 65: 6, 11 perceived [l] 60~ 24

percent [2] 43: 17; 58: 14 Perform [l] 52: 12 .pelform [lo] 8: 22; 26: 1;

31: 25; 32: 14; 38: 20; 421; 47: 18. 22; 50: 15; 7O: ll

performed [6] 13: 9; 14: 24; 21: 3; 26: 6; 41: 15; 51: 5

performing [E] 8: 25; 10: 3, 7. 10; 19: 21; 20: 1; *43: 16.20 period p] 33: 16; 6120,

22 perjury [1] 4: 25

:permission [l] 68: 13

: person (81 7: 5; 23: ll; '34: 9. 10; 42: ll: 55: 9;

575; 85: q4

i personal [I] 34: 4 ipersOnalty p] 63: 19.

: 21; 64: 8 i pestering [1] 46: 24 lphone po] 8: 10; 1413;

12: 7, 8, 9; 22: 21,25; ‘33: 20; 35: 14; 40: 3,4; ~41: 23; 42: 23; 43: 20, 21,

24; 4413. 9; 45: 7; 58: l; 63: 16: 64: 2.6; 68: 14. 18. 21; 69: 1, 10

/physical [6] 5: 12; 6: 15. 16; 12: l; 4022; 52: 16. 17; 54: 5 /physically [9] 25: 3; !30: 24; 31: 1,2; 34: 12,22; 140: 21; 53: 15,20 !picked [I] 63: 16

I picture p] 16: 6; 46: ll

I piece [I] 45: 1 ipfzza p] 12: 3; 15: 5

; place p] 5: 16.23; 32: 18

I placed [l] 31: 23 iplato [l] 4: l

i please p] 3: 3; 32: 20 ipoint 1371 8: 12; 11: 2;

12: 15: 13: 6. 10: 15: 6;

.21: 3, i6; 2il3; 23: 6; 24: 2, 11; 26: 14; 27: 1, 13;

30: 14; 31: 24; 34: 3.6. 10. '18; 35: 25; 36: 18; 42: 18;

44: 14. 15, 20; 45: 8; 48: 8; .56: 2. 9; 62: 18; 65: 16; :67: 4, 15, 21; 69: 17

from level to point

m I11 s5z6

p p] 2017; 62~ 25: fm# Rton f2f 67: 16.24 podwe (il 64z7 m D1 a2 pmmnce I* 1 luz?; 15: 13; 16: l; 21: 3

~yz423 ., 5Ka S2: 3,4 * Paside@ [sij, !%& 6z4. 5.14; 7: 4, lQ; 8z23: 9z2.

11.22; 1122: 12: 3: 13: 3: 1414; 16: 3,21; 1& 16; lS: Q; Ml6; 21: 12: 2&: 16; 2922; 3a31; 32#; 34: 16; 3& 8; 3Em3Q& 40; 2,23; 43: 13,19, 44: 23; 45: 5; 46: 1.3; 49$ ll; S4: H): S6: 14; 58: 1,6. 21.2% W. 9. 13, lt 6Od7.25; 61: 9,11,13; 62T: 20: 64: 19,24; 85: 2, 16: 88:%: 6922; 70: 16.23 - 141 1523;

61: 8: 705.20 Pmwenu &? I 5822, 23 gms pj 66: 5; 7oAo.

4gy p] 37: 4; 4217;

ZQW PI 7:% 6S: 5, p= vbwyfQj 5%; 33: 6; 42: 15; 51: Q: S3: 24; S7: 14,2S; SQ: 1+ 622; 20 pliorm 2222.25; 34a: S9: 5: 6OA; bl: lB; 68: 3 priwto [41 &13; 23: 16; 28: 13; 67: 14 ps# bbqj [I] 24: 7 problmw [I] 50: 23 pmccwlurr flj 4: 24 pmcc# d frt 5: 4 $yysdhP PI S: 7;

pi& u& [1] 67~ 10 pwnba 111 40: 12

~6~~ 40: 8; proI&& [l] a15 prafnpM [l) 43~ 24 v m 88: 1'1,

&spsot El] 4218

pnwlue Ii] 6: 6 provwd [I] 33: S PUBLtC m 71: 8,22 pubtk [t] 62: 12 Pund [I] 37%

25; 6& 8 purchwlqj [l] 60: 9 pufpoa@[ l] 2912 pufw [IJ 47: 6 puruant( i~ 4: 10 @& ad (11 4? 23 wwt I11 56: 5 palng [l] 44: 21

_- *_ Q quesan (Ill !k6; 13: 17; 21: 7.* 63: 17; 88: 9; 69: 21; 70: 1.6,7, 17 qlmstiM$ [a] 4: 2o; S: 3: 23: 7; 245, 7; 32% 54: 12; ?I: 3 ~~~ S~~ 6~~: lS~

qulatiy ;j 62: 7. 10.13

R __ ^_

ndio p] 4!% 24; 46: 3,8 nM* p [1] 49: 14 missd (11 17: s lm8d @I 705.21 ml ts] 26: 16; 34%; !w4 nrlbr [1] 34: Q msson [l] 69: 2* massuun I; Ll QRl3.14 araurkprr [1] 62zl nail f3J 1l: lO; 12: 24; 28: 7 mawy [ij a23 muewd [21 29%; S7: 19 reclbd [I] 3320 foco9nb @J 5: 24; 6: 1 nsdkctkn fIf 6~ 9 W A 52.4.7; 7: 15; 71: 14 mducod [I] 71: 13 fehwod [1] 52: 18 m& d &j 17: 16; 53: 7;

re9lw[ l] 23z4 mbmtd [2] 15: f; 1820 mwod [l] 71: 16 mwon [1] 66% BhtkmB [l] a21 nkiiod@ fZ@ s8.9, 13, 14, 15; 6: 4; 23: 3; 24: 12; 32: 11; 34: 3,5; 35: 15, If; 54: 20; 56: 10; 5Ck16,22,25; 61: 9,10, 11; 82:%, 12.21.25; 7OA2 nbtln, [1] 71: 18 r8byad flj 67: 13 relnwk @] 45: 10,12 IwIufkad [l] 56: ll #@ s& W flf S& 10

nnwmaKf4Sj 7: 24; 8~ 1.3; 9.6; 10: 14; 11: 3: 12: lO. 16: 13: 14: 142S; lJ: 1; 2& 8, t1; 2S20* 22: 2620; 20: 23; 326; 33c4; 36: 10: 38: 24: 40~~ 9.20: 41: 7.26; 43: 6,8; 44Y4, 7, 13; 45: 12; 46: 13: S2: 18; 59: 25; 60: 12: 63: 14.25; 6-$ fx~ 8,22.24$& 7.

w? mRblvd [II 54: 4 rmand 111 63T4 lwnoval [l] 37: l !vmowd Ir] ail8.16; 2520; 31%; 37: 9; 44: 1 - I11 aa mmfl] 3Sz20 ImpmM Rf a; 21; 13: 17 uEP0RwR [I] 71: s foqwa flf 44 mqmMfl] 6423 requhd [l] 4% f-& gw% Pb

w& a m 6: 16: 15: 11: 20~ 12; 31: 13; 41: 7; 61: 14: 69zlO M pf 37: tt; 7Oc7 wum m 60: 21: 6Q: l wvalsd [l] 62r8 $-&- 5[ 41 =fOn

&el* 24: 22; 28: 14; 33: 10; 42: 25; 46%; 66: 15 dqht fml 3: 22; 4: 2. 5.6: 16: 3,2S; 21: 24; 29~ 9; 3& 6,15; 3X! 4; 41~ 24~ 462, ls: 51: 15: ss: 8.

6& 19; 64: 14; 69zll, 23 rif@ ls m 3: 19,21; 4: 20 Mu8l [I] 3& 17 Rik[ ll 66: a WR@ dkMy [l] 49: 18 Ron [Ij 39rl2

Room fl] 1526 room W] 323; 16: 2; 2!% 3i45: 1% 51: ls: 58%$ RDamdt n1 1525

NbPl 3620,21 Nks [I] S2: 6 x g; 1: 11; 56: 3

nMng[¶] '88: 2

I*) ** s ssc 111 47: 3

mwnd [ill 625: 1O: l: 11: 11,25: 157; 14: 21; 2lwS; 35: 13; SS: 25: 64: 3 socfet [I) a! 3 BOctOr[ l] $'7: 14

sense f4] ?4: 3; 2$: 19; 42: 8; 61: 2 sa! vicr II] 7Ozll servf& l9f2J 42: 5; 43: 3 sax [!% I 5: JO; 6%; 622,25; 9%, 23: 103, 7.11. 12. 13. ts; 12: l; ~3~ 9,1~ 19,25; 14: 6,16, 24: 15: 12; 17: 16: 1922; 2W5.7. 18; 21: 3; 2221; 23: 1,6; 24: 11; 28: 1.6: 31f& 32Tl4; 3620; 41: 7, lS; 42: 1; 43: 16,2o:*(: Q, t8; 47: t9‘ 22; Sor15; 51: 5; 52: 12,20,21; 53zQ: 70: 11 aomnl pQJ S: 13. 15; ~21: 9: 18, xj; 10: 8; 11: 4* 15: 16: 6,7; 20~ 24; 24~ 19, 24; 28: 7; 3224; 33~ 4: 34:: 5; 35: 17; 37: 5; 38: 12; 41: 23: 45: 19. 22: 51: 2. 3: 53: 11.21; 6& 16,22 saalaSyt3f 2418; 32: 19; 54: l sham fi] Jz: S shiFt[ tl ck7; 47: 17 shdmd M Q: l; S6= 64: 1 Bhoddn9 [* I 57s Bhoa [I] 0: lO a@ Mdsf@ 347; 56: S

zzyz3= 5 dgl8l[ l] ,i: lS sink (11 l& 4 8lx fl] 46z9 skk@ j al* lt% l; 3& 14: 31: 14: 41: 5 lurpft [l] S& l6 s&& d [I] 27~ 19 uwrkod If] 4Sz13 rpnlrltlno [lj 45: 16 -ill lk20 Hupeho [1] 40: 13 solas [l] WA3 sobdl. rpI 23z21.22 sol@ 11) 3223 WnObody [I] 41~ 6 wrrroly pQj 24: f: 26: 15,25; 27: 1; 34: 7; 3gySa" 47: 20;

saiw& st m 11: 23; w? 6olmhww [l] 6624

*any [iij 9~ 20; 13: 16; 22% 28: 18:$ 2: 2S; 61: 24. 62: 3,4; 70: 3 SOR [SQ] 6: 1S; l5: 23; ?6: 19; 17: 2+ l& 5. 11; 23: 2; 24: 3. lf, lS: 25: 13,

23; 26: 5; 293: 30: 4; 32: 0, 16. 17: 33~ 15: 34319: 36: 17. 18, 25: 37~ 13: 36: 7; 3Qz8; 41: 10: 42: S. 6, 23; 44% 22: 4& 10.13: 46: 7; 47: 5; 4& 5,6.20: 49: 14. 15. 18, 24; SO5: S1: 6,2S: 55d0, 18; 56: 14. 17, 24; 81: 2S; 62E14; 65: 6; 66: 8; 67:%, 1% 69% wubnaa 11) 24% Bowl6 p] 64; 13; 6& 2 8gtk A a* e; 64: 8;

&rkay [ll 4511 *pdFia 111 13: 14 Bpoil [l] 3: 3 W@ QOd 111 l& 24 8ped (11 l& IO spWHng fi] 34: 8 Spent Er] 24~ 4; 33%: ?xM. 23 tpn [l] 48: 10 w# oko p] l1: 1; 1R9. 12: 22m; 4& e; 6323, 25; 67z12

l pokm i4f 22: 25; 34: 15; 46T4; 64s *pur [l] WI1 *quu, Ill 522 ~I~,~ 16

8mfr8m ?? j :61:*

sW# t [l] 6: 24 8tamd (11 6: 10. 12: 72& L7; 25s; 349: 36zl6z36:? 1: 43: 2Q 4622.23; 54%; 65: 1; WI7 swlkq [II 2921 8wrwd [l] 43: 14 8t@ W of 33~ 16 8mBh frf 1523

m [? I 3: 3; 69: 14 stab@ [l] 5w4 8iDp [lj 31%

8lkkmf [l] 6~ 23

s6iluhwH] 17: 12;

1371 BSA Monica Lswinsky - 8126198 Xuu( IW) l stimulated p] 8: 13; tendency [l] 55: 20

50: 12 term [I] 23: 3

stimulating p] 20: 12; terms m 13: 25; 14: 16;

27: 12; 31: 10 40: 5.22; 44: 21; 51: 18;

stimulation [l] 13: 3 ,66: 10

stop [4] 9: ll; 1812; testified [14] 3115. 20; 195; 553 5: 7; 6: 6; 7: 1; 41: 22; 4319;

stopped v] IO: 15 19: 8; 46: 16; 51: 9; 57: 14,25; 22: 11: 5223 59: 14; 70: 9. 18

stopping [I] 53: 9 testimony [lo] 4: 3;

store [l] 60: 14 54: 18; 70: 3, 5, 6, 20, 23; strange [I] 53: 3 71: 11, 12.15

strap [2] 56: 4.6 Thank [2] 54: 11; 71: 1

stroking [l] 56: 1 thanked (1) 67: 10

strung [l] 62: 14 There's [2; 45: 20; 63: 1 study [Q] 7: 23; 16: l; there's [4] 34: 4; 82: 4. 5 19: 13; 23: 13; 27: 5; 29: 11; thereafter (I] 71: 13 36: 16; 49: 12,20 thinking 15) 54: 13;

stuff [1] 44: 21 56: 14; 61: 8. 10; 67: 5 stunned [l] 56: 24 ithreat [1] 62: 24

stupid [I] 25: 8 ;threatening [l] 62: 21

subject [I] 4: 24 ‘three [4] 28123; 5122;

subpoena [i] 59: 10 56: 13, 16

subpoenaed [s] 58: 6; tie [s] 13: 6; 38: 25; 39% 59: 2, 5.6 3 substance [l] 64: 21 tights [I] 48: 14 suggest [I] 30: 21 timeframe [l] 67: 18 suggested [l] 35: 19 ,times [ll] 11: 8; 16: 19; suggestions [l] 65: 4 23: 17; 34: 23; 41: 13;

summarize [I] 43: lO '4222; 50: 14; 56: 21;

Sunday [8] 15: 17; 22: 1, 63: 13, 19 2; 28: 15; 35: 1, 3; 39: 9, 10 titillating [l] 42: 8

support [1] 50: 4 .topic p] 54: 9. 14; 57: 14

supposed (21 35: 8; 44: 2 topics [l] 60: 15

touch [17] 8: 7, 9; 19: 20; SutRhen [I] 67: 13 sweater p] 17: 3. 8; 4519 sweet p] 33: 18; 55: 4 switch p] 57: 13; 60115 sworn &q 3: 14; 71: 12 swung [l] 16: 3

27: 23; 30: 10, 12, 17; 31: 14; 36: 25; 40: 23; 48: 12: 49: 10: 51: 5: 52: 14; vagi'- [I] 311

vagueiy [I] 66: 7 vehalty [1] 30: 23 66: 8; 67: 16, &!

‘touched [lo] 8: 2, 5.20; 12: 25; 21: 14; 3122; 37: 17.21; 50: 6; 57: 8 ‘Touching [2] 10: 5,6

touching [Q] 8: 17; 30: 8; 31: 17; 47: 14, 16; 52: 9; 54: 5; 56: 1.4

‘towards [l] 1O: lO 'transfer [l] 40: 6

'transferred [3] 39: ll. 15; 40: 11

‘Tripp [1] 43: 5 itrouble [2] 9: 6; 41: 12 ;true [l] 71: 14 itrust [I] 17: 23

T __ __

table [2] 50: 1, 3

talk [S] 54: 17; 58: 25; 59: 4; 60: 3; 65: 7, 11 talked [s] 39: 13; 40: 5; 51: 21; 59: 8: 65: 3; 67: 20

Talking [l] 1322 talking I; l6] 7: 25; 11: 17. 16; 12: 6; 16: 14; 18: ll; 19: 21; 21: 2.12; 23: 12, 15; 24: 4; 28: 8; 33: 11.24; 34: 1, 5, 8; 38: 5; 51: 20. 22; 55: 8. 23; 56: 9; 6522; 67: 20; 70: 4 tail [1] 51: 7

tasted [I] 38: 18

team [I] 56: 19 telephone [ll] 9: 19, 25;

Uhhuh p] 18: 12; 49: 21 42: 13; 46: 3; 47: 3. 18;

‘unbutton P] 9: 5; 17: 6; 51: 5; 67: 3; 69: 18 4l: ll wanting [1] 39: 23 unbuttoned [Q] 8: l; we’d [3] 41: 13; 56: 18.

'12: lo; 13: 5, 7: 30: 3; 22 147: 12. 17: 5015 We’ll [l] 57: 13 uncomfortabk (1) we’re [l] 21: 2 42: 20 we've [2] 49: 2; 53: 24

.understand p] 4: 5, 12; wearing [2] 9: 2; 48: 24 :5: 1; 7: lO; 14: 15; 38: 15; 1 Wednesday [I] 33: 25 ,47: 25; 5522; 68: 5 week [S] 2222; 34: 23; understandabie [l] 39: 12; 65: 5; 66: 21; 70: 3 ,46: 7 weekend [2] 60: 1 understanding [5] 49: 9; ,weekends [1] 159 ‘70: 4, 9. 18. 20 ‘weeks [4] 52: 6; 66123, :understood 121 10: 19; :25; 67: 21 ,31: 7 :werenY [2] 15: 9; 68: 2 :underwear [s] 21: 15. ; West p] 22: 6; 27: 8

: 16; 31: 15, 16. 18, 19.23, ~what’s [2] 33: 20; 42: ll I24; 37: 9 undone [1] 26: 13 unfortunatety [1] 49: 1 unhooked m 8: 3; 30: 4 United [l] 59: 23 unxipped m 9: 4; 13: 8;

14: 14; 26: 5; 41: 9, 10; 5O: lO unzipping p] 26: 8; 44: 13 upset [S] 23: 20, 23; 52: 22.24,25; 53: 2.5; 69: 23 upsetting [I] 42: 19 upstairs (2) 36: 2,6

V __ __

Versus [I] 622 Iversus [l] 28: 8 ivisible (I] 26: 23 ,visibty p] 26: 21; 52: 24;

53: 5 ‘visit (61 620; 7: 2, 3;

10: 25; 33: 9; 36: 4 [visits [I] 6: 23 ivoice p] 22: 7. 8

!whenever p] 69: 16.16

!WHEREUPON [I] 3: 11

iWhereupon p] 29: 15; 157: 19; 71: 5 [White [3] 60: 17,21; i61: 6 iwin [l] 40: 13

I Wing p] 22: 6; 27: 8 !WiRTH [4] 21: 8; 70: 1, 2; ,71: 1 lwirth [l] 3: 9 iwished [2] 18: 2; 56: 12 iWiTNESS [I] 71: 4 iwitness (51 4: 7; 58: 5;

71: 11,13, 15

‘won [I] 61: 16

won’t [l] 47: 25

iwonderful [1] 55: 13 ,woh [I] 32: 5 twork [5] 22: 4; 29: 4;

34: 23; 45: 23; 51: 8 *worked [2] 61: 1,6

(world [f] 69: 24 wouldn’t [ll] 14: 10, 12; ~15: 12; 25: 16; 26: 22,23; i52: 13; 54: 4; 55: 25; 62: 6

(written [l] 6: 13 'trusted [2] 10: 17; 40: 10 rtwth p] 4: 24,25; 60: 24

turning p] 34: 2; 58: 25 :tums [l] 22: 13 ‘twice [2] 3: 20; 63: 20 ,typewriting [I] 71: 14

10: 2, 4, 6. 9; 14: 20, 23; __ U __ 42: 2; 59113; 63: 21

telling [4] 30: 8; 63: l; U. N. [S] 63: 10; 6420; 65: 25; 66: 6 65: 3, 17; 66: 14. 16

__ w__ \wait [4] 10: 17; 46: 11; ,47: 3; 67: 19

X __ __

iXerox [I] 522 Y __ __ ‘Yea [I] 54: 10 *waiting p] 23: 14; 46: 13; ‘Yeah [l] 37: 16 ,49: 11 ryeah [l] 33: 20

,waik [I] 22: 12 ‘Year [l] 18: 3 'walked p] 22: 16; 26: 20. ,year p] 46: 25; 47: 1; 23 '57: 6

walking [l] 22: 5 iyears [2] 56: 13, 16

wanted [26] 7: 7,11; !yessed [l] 67: 9 9: 13. 19; 10: 16; 13: 24, ‘You’ve [l] 29: 20

25; 14: 10, 16. 19; 1522; :you’ve [ll] 6: 6; 7: l; 19: 21; 27: 2: 3022; 3118; 11: 23; 26: 7; 41: 22; 4319; 3215; 34: 19; 35: 20; 39: 16; ,46: 16; 48: 21; 51: 9; 53: 15;

54: 18 yourself r7] 4: 9.21; 44: 22; 48.21; 68: 12. 16; 69: 4

~__

Z _- __

#zipped [l] 26: 16

zipper [l] 26: ll

From stimulated to zipper

1372

1373

Tab 16

1374

1375

OZ- 302 (Rev. 8- 19- W) _- 1 _ OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUXSEL

Iho of rnnhpholl l/ 23/ 90

On January 16, 1998, SSA q- B and SA w

4 approached MONICA LEWINSKY in the food court area .

of the Pentagon City, Mall Arlington, Virginia. SSA _ immediately identified himsel_ f and SA _ as agents of the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), detailed to the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) for 'Whitewater? and requested her presence in a room of the Ritz Carlton Hotel to discuss her status as a person suspected of committing a federal crime. LEWINSKY was advised OIC attorneys were waiting in the room, and that the agents and the attorneys wished to discuss her culpability in criminal activity related to the PAULA JONES civil lawsuit. LEWINSKY was advised she was not under arrest and the agents would not force her to accompany them to the hotel room.

LEWINSKY told SSA- he could speak to her attorney. SSA 0 advised the offer to discuss her legal status was not being offered to her attorney, but to LEWINSKY alone. SSA - explained to LEWINSKY she was being offered an opportunity to meet with the OIC attorneys and agents and hear them explain why they felt she was in trouble without being required to make any statement. SSA __ further explained LEWINSKY would then have an opportunity to ask clarifying questions of the attorneys and be better informed as to whether she wanted legal counsel before making any statements, or whether she thought it better to cooperate with the OIC. LEWINSKY voluntarily accompanied the agents to room number 1012 of the Ritz Carlton hotel, under the conditions set forth above.

Also present in room 1016, the adjoining room, were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) BRUCE UDOLF, AIC MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC STEVEN D. BINHAK, Deputy Independent Counsel JACKIE M. BENNETT, JR., AIC STEPHEN BATES and Contract Investigator COY A. COPELAND, all members of the Office of the Independent Counsel staff. At various times during the day, OIC attorneys entered and departed room 1012. Their movement is not recorded herein. The chronology of the meeting, with all times approximate, is as follows:

1: 05 p. m. LEWINSKY arrived in Room 1012. AIC EMMICK entered Room 1012 and began talking to LEWINSKY.

1: lO p. m. LEWINSKY given bottled water.

lJwcsrlgmon on l/ 16/ 98 a Pentagon City, VA Fikl 29D- OIC- LR- 35063 SA b SA l/ 23/ 98

1376

29D- LR- 35063 -. . fz4mmumofolc- 3fJzof Log of meeting at Pentagon City .o,, l/ 16/ 98 .) rlc 2

1: 33 p. m. 1: 40 p. m. 1: 47 p. m. 2: 02 p. m.

2: 13 p. m. 2: 15 p. m. 2: 29 p. m.

2: 30 p. m. 2: 33 p. m.

2: 36 p. m. 2: 50 p. m. 3: lO p. m. 3: 20 p. m. 3: 36 p. m.

SSA -began reading LEWINSKY her rights as found on the form PD- 395, "Interrogation; Advice of Rights." SSA _ was unable to finish reading the PD- 395. _

L& NSRY was offered a towel. LEWINRSY was offered water. The air conditioning in room 1012 was turned on at LEWINSKY's request.

LEWINRSY was offered water. LEWINSKY said, "if I don't cooperate, I can talk to whomever I want".

SA- arrived in room 1012. LEWINSKY stated, "if I leave now, you will charge me now."

LEWINSKY said, "I don't know much about the law." LEWINSKY asked and was allowed to go to the restroom.

LEWINSKY requested and was given her second bottle of water. LEWINSKY said she is not diabetic and no medication was necessary.

LEWINSKY suggested she take a taxi to her attorney's_ office. LEWINSKY advised she understands our risks.

LEWINSKY asked if she could be escorted to New York to see her mother, MARCIA LEWIS. .

LEWINSKY called her mother, MARCIA LEWIS, in New York.

LEWINSKY requested and was allowed to go to the restroom.

1377

29D- LR- 35063 cQlljlpdoIlofolc-# 2 of Log of meeting at Pentagon City .oa I/ 16/ 98 .he 3

3: 45 p. m. 3: 54 p. m.

4: 08 p. m. 4: 12 p. m.

4: 20 p. m. 4: 31 p. m. 5: 00 p. m. 5: 21 p. m.

5: 40 p. m.

6: 03 p. m.

6: 30 p. m. LEWINSKY departed room 1012 unescorted.

LEWINSKY called room 1012 and advised that she was in the lobby, using a pay phone. LBWINSKY advised she changed phones she was using because some people came too close to the phone she had been using. LBWINSKY advised she called to let the Agents know, in case she was being watched.

LEWINSKY voluntarily returned to room 1012. LEWINSKY offered and accepted coffee.

LEWINSKY called MARCIA LEWIS. LEWIS requested to ith an OIC attorney. AICBMMICKandSA got on the phone and identified themselves to LEWIS. LEWIS advised she would travel to Washington, DC via AMTRAK Metroliner.

LEWINSKY left room 1012 with AIC BINHAK and SA _ to use a pay phone in the lobby of the Ritz Carlton Hotel.

LEWINSKY, AIC BINHAK and SAW returned to room 1012.

LEWINSKY called her answering machine to retrieve messages.

LEWINSKY requested and received aspirin. LEWINSKY, AIC EMMICK and SA- departed room 1012, en route to the Pentagon Cit LEWINSKY, AIC EMMICK and SA Y Ma11* walked in the mall.

LEWINKSY requested and was permitted to visit the restroom on the third level of the MACY's department store in the mall.

LEWINSKY, AIC EMMICK and SA -dined at MOZZARELLA'S American Grill, within the Pentagon City Mall. LEWINSKY paid for her portion of the dinner.

1378

OK- 3021 (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- LB- 35063

Coruiauhn of OK- 302 of Log of meeting at Pentagon City ,o,, l/ 16/ 98 .& 5C 4 7: 35 p. m. LEWINSKY, AIC EMMICK and SA_

room 1012. ' 8: 00 p. m. LEWINSKY payed $2 to SA -for

coffee. 8: 19 p. m. MARCIA LEWIS telephoned room 1012,

was on the "163 Northeast Direct", experiencing travel delays.

departed room 9: 05 p. m. LEWINSKY, SSA -, and SA m

1012 and LEWINSKY withdrew money from the automatic teller machine on the first floor at the Pentagon City Mall.

returned to the cost of her and advised she and was

9: 30 p. m. Coffee was ordered and brought to room 1012 by room service.

lo: 16 p. m. MARCIA LEWIS arrived and all members of the OIC staff left LEWIS and LEWINSKY alone.

lo: 20 p. m. A meeting was in room 1018 between LEWIS, AIC EMMICK, SSA and SA N

LEWIS advised that this was an emotional experience for LEWINSKY. her chronological age. LEWIS advised LEWINKSY was younger than

LEWIS asked if tapes were admissible in court. LEWIS advised she wanted to protect LEWINSKY. LEWIS asked how she would know LEWINSKY would not: be charged if she cooperated. LEWIS asked about LEWINSKY's safety'if LEWINSKY cooperated. LEWIS advised that LEWINSKY& alked about suicide six years ago. After LEWINSKY's parents divorced, LBWINSKY saw a therapist, but she is not currently seeing one. LEWIS advised she alone could not take responsibility for convincing LEWINSKY to cooperate with the OIC.

11: 02 p. m. LEWIS requested and was permitted a trip to the restroom. f

11: 06 p. m. LEWIS telephonically contacted BERNARD LEWINSKY, her ex- husband, at 4- r

11: 20 p. m. BERNARD LEWINSKY telephoned room 1018.

1379

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- LB- 35063 c- of OIC- 302 of Log of meeting at Pentagon City .on 1/ 16/ H *Page 5

11: 22 p. m. AIC EMMICK talked to BEd LEWI& Y. Cooperation, an interview, telephone calls, body wires and testimony were., mentioned. AIC EMMICK advised BERNARD LEWINSKY that MONICA LEWINSKY was free to leave anytime she wished.

11: 30 p. m. MONICA LEWINSKY entered room 1018. 11: 32 p. m. MARCIA LEWIS got back on the phone with BERNARD

LEWINSKY. BERNARD, LEWINSKY advised he would go to a pay phone and Iwould call ba* ck. ~

11: 35 p. m. BERNARD LEWINSKY telephoned room 1014. BERNARD LEWINSKY advised AIC EMMICK that MONICA LEWINSKY was represented by counsel.

11: 36 p. m. MONICA LEWINSKY talked to BERNARD LEWINSKY on the telephone.

11: 37 p. m. AIC EMMICK spoke with BERNARD LEWINSKY. AIC EMMICK asked MONICA LEWINKSY if she had an attorney and LEW& NSKY advised it was GINSBURG. 5‘. i

AIC EMMICK advised MONICA LEWINSKY she did not have to accept an attorney she did not select.

MONICA LEWINSKY asked if there was still a chance she would go to jail if she cooperated. MONICA LEWINSKY suggested she may have not told the truth in previous conversations. MONICA LEWINSKY asked, "what if I partially cooperate?"

MARCIA LEWIS asked what would happen if MONICA LEWINSKY gave everything but did not tape anything. MONICA LEWINSKY asked if the PAULA JONES case went away would "this" go away and was advised by AIC EMMICK rVno."

MONICA LEWINSKY asked how the OIC would resolve the chance that MONICA LEWINSKY said something to LINDA TRIP that was not true.

MARCIA LEWIS advised that she appreciated the OIC

1380

OIC- u) h (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- LB- 35063

Conf. inuadon of OK- 302 of Log of meeting at Pentagon City .on I/ 16/ 98 .hge 6 members waiting until she arrived to proceed. MONICA LEWINSKY advised she appreciated having her mother present.

11: 55 p. m. BILL GINSBURG telephoned room 1018 and spoke to AIC EMMICK, who advised GINSBURG he was uncomfortable with the relationship between GINSBURG and MONICA LBWINSKY. MONICA LEWINSKY advised she was not 100% sure it was the right thing to do because GINSBURG was a medical lawyer.

11: 59 p. m. MONICA LEWINSKY advised she was represented by GINSBURG.

12: 08 a. m. GINSBURG was advised by AIC EMMICK that MONICA LEWINSKY always had the right to leave at any time.

12: 17 a. m. MONICA LEWINSKY spoke with GINSBURG, outside the presence of the OIC staff.

12: 23 a. m. AIC EMMICK ended the phone call with GINSBURG and advised MONICA LBWINS- KY free to leave. and MARCIA LEWIS they were

12: 30 a. m. MARCIA LEWIS and MONICA Agents and the staff of and considerate.

LEWINSKY thanked the the OIC for being so kind

12: 45 a. m. SA- and SA1) escorted MARCIA LEWIS and MONICA LEWINSKY to LEWINSKY's vehicle, which was parked in. the parking garage adjacent to the Pentagon City Mall.

1381

Tab 17

1382

1383

OK- 302 (Rev. 8- 19- W) - I -

OFFICEOFTHEINDEPENDENTCOUNSEL

Date of umsctiprion S/ 29/ 98

On May 28, 1998, at- approximately 8: 30 a. m., MONICA S. LEWINSKY (hereinafter referred to as LEWINSKY) arrived at the Federal Building, 11000 Wilshire Boulevard, Los Angeles, California, for purposes of providing her fingerprints and handwriting exemplars to the Federal Bureau of Investigation, as

agreed upon by Deputy Independent Counsel (DIG) ROBERT BITTMAN of the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) and WILLIAM GINSBURG, LEWINSKY's attorney. Present were GINSBURG, TODD C. TREODORA, an associate with the law firm of GINSBURG, STEPHAN, ORINGRER 6. RICBMAN, representing LEWINSKY, BERNARD LEWINSKY, MONICA LEWINSKY's father, Associate. Independent Counsel (AIC) EDWARD J- PAGE and writer.

LEWINSKY and her party were escorted from their car to the Federal Building in Los Angeles by Special Agents of the Los Angeles office of the FBI and by officers of the Federal Protective Service.

After being processed for fingerprints by the FBI's LEWINSKY and her party were accompanied to the 17f loor office of Los Angeles FBI _ for the purpose of LEWINSKY providi .ng handwriting exemplars.

The pens used for this examination were as follows: one Bit, round stic, medium, black ink pen; one paper mate pen with black ink; and one paper mate, gel writer, with black ink. At various times during the examination, LEWINSICY was asked to use one of the three different pens. LEWINSKY's attorneys interrupted the examination on numerous occasions so LEWINSKY could consult privately with her attorneys.

MONICA LEWINSKY was first asked to write the alphabet in its entirety, with three different pens, on an 8 l/ 2" x 11" sheet of paper (unless specified otherwise, each sheet of paper used was 8 l/ 2" x 11") attached to a pad. On the same sheet of paper, LEWINSKY was asked to write the number one thru ten, three times, using a different pen each time.

LEWINSKY was then asked to perform the same task, this

time using a sheet of paper resting only on the desk where she

invatigrtion on 05/ 28/ 98 a~ Los Angeles, CA File I 29D- OIC- LR- 35063

. _.

1384

OK- 3021 (Rev. 8- 19- 94

29D- OIC- LR- 35063 Fingerprint and Conunuation OfOIC- rnof Handwriting Exemplars of Lewinsky .On 05/ 28/ 98 , ~asc 2

was sitting. LEWINSKY was then., asked to print her name three times on a sheet of paper attached to a pad, each time using a different pen. LEWINSKY was then asked to sign her name on a sheet of paper attached to a pad, each time using a different pen. LEWINSKY was then asked to perform the same task, with the sheet of paper used resting directly on the desk.

LEWINSKY was then asked to sign her name to a photocopy of a blank check. At that time, GINSBURG objected and advised his client not to sign the form. GINSBURG advised that the OIC would need to get a Court Order before his client would sign anything that resembled a check. GINSBURG advised that he had no idea what the OIC had in the way of evidence and he was not going to create an exhibit. GINSBURG'asked if he could use the telephone to call his co- counsel. GINSBURG advised he would use his AT& T card when callinq. GINSBURG was permitted to use the telephone in office.

Af; er much discussion and delay, &he meeting resumed and GINSBURG was asked if a compromise could be worked out where LEWINSKY would sign the documents and GINSBURG, THEODORA and SA -would initial the front so as to limit any question abouf: the source of the document.

At this time, LEWINSKY asked GINSBURG to have BERNARD LEWINSKY leave because if he stayed, "[ the OICI would subpoena him." Several minutes later, BERNARD LEWINSKY departed, citing the need to see patients.

The meeting resumed several minutes later. GINSBURG replied that he had just received a letter from Deputy Independent Counsel (DIG) ROBERT BITTMAN wherein BITTMAN advised that LEWINSKY had no immunity and anything she did or said could be used against her. GINSBURG advised by allowing his client to write the checks, he would be allowing the OIC to violate her 5ch Amendment rights. In addition, BITTMANts letter stated that SA - and AIC PAGE had no authority to work out any compromise on behalf of the OIC. GINSBURG continued that in fact, BITTMAN had no authority to work out any deals on behalf of the OIC and the only person who did so would be KEN STARR.

GINSBURG advised he would accept only compromises signed by STARR and GINSBURG would accept them as long as. GINSBURG was permitted to get handwriting exemplars from STARR. GINSBURG continued that the only compromise he. would accept would

1385

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063 Fingerprint and

Conumation of OIC- 302 of Handwriting Exemplars of Lewinsky .On 05/ 28/ 98 .page I

be from STARR and the OIC should send STARR to Los Angeles to work out the compromise. While refusing to explain his reasoning, GINSBURG paused and explained to AIC PAGE that none of this was personal and, in fact, PAGE and GINSBURG could go out and have a few beers together. However, GINSBURG continued, BITTMAN had drawn a "razor- fine line" in his letter and GINSBURG was going to draw a similarly fine line in representing his client.

AIC PAGE asked GINSBURG if he would permit LEWINSKY to sign checks if PAGE showed GINSBURG a case which held that the request by the OIC was permitted to obtain the exemplars in this manner on the blank c& ck forms. GINSBURG advised he would. PAGE showed GINSBURG such a case, but GINSBURG refused to permit LEWINSKY to fill out the checks.

AIC PAGE asked GINSBURG if GINSBURG understood that the OIC could use LEWINSKY's refusal to provide the requested handwriting exemplars against her at a trial or a proceeding. GINSBURG stated he was aware of that fact.

At approximately 9: 30 a. m., GINSBURG was asked if LEWINSKY had consumed any medication during the morning. GINSBURG replied that, to his knowledge, LEWINSKY had not. Upon hearing this, LEWINSKY indicated to GINSBURG that she needed to speak with him, and PAGE and departed the room. After a break, GINSBURG advised that had taken "no narcotic, benzodiazepine, or other medication which in [GINSBURGJ's opinion would affect [LEWINSKYl's coordination or alertness." GINSBURG refused to advise what medication LEWINSKY had taken.

The handwriting examination continued until approximately lo: 06 a. m., when LEWINSKY took a break to visit the restroom.

The examination resumed approximately fifteen minutes later. LEWINSKY was asked to write various words and phrases. After LEWINSKY was asked to write "1 have only read excerpts from J, eaves of Grw before," GINSBURG requested SAmand AIC PAGE to leave the room. Upon resuming the examination, GINSBURG advised that there were several exemplars which appeared to be from the same letter, so GINSBURG would permit no more exemplars from that letter.

LEWINSKY was then asked to write "The Pres., through Ms. Currie." GINSBURG objected and advised that the "proffer was off limits." LEWINSKY was asked to write certain words and-

1386

OIC- 302a IRev. 8- W- WI

29D- OIC- LR- 35063 Fingerprint and

Contimmion of OIC- 302 of Handwriting Exemplars of Lewinsky .On 05/ 28/ 98 . page A_

phrases and to sign her name on 5" x 7" note paper. Some of the samples taken were done so with the paper attached to the pad and some were taken with the paper resting directly on the desk.

The examination continued and GINSBURG agreed, although he objected earlier, to allow LEWINSKY to sign her name to strips of paper that, though not photocopies of or the same size as checks, more closely resembled a check than an 8 l/ 2" by 11" piece of paper. GINSBURG would not permit LEWINSKY to write amounts or dates on the pages that were close in size to a check.

At approximately 11: OO a. m., the examination ended, at which time GINSBURG wa%% served grand jury subpoena number D- 1319 for LEWINSKY's appearance on June 4, 1998 in Washington, DC to provide handwriting exemplars. GINSBURG advised he thought that

a handwriting examination was just completed. GINSBURG was advised that all requested exemplars were not provided, therefore, LEWINSKY would have to come to Washington, DC to do so.

GINSBURG, LEWINSKY and THEODORA were escorted to their car by Special Agents of the FBI's Los Angeles Office and officers of the Federal Protective Service.

1387

Tab 18

1388

1389

OK- 30:. (Rev. x- 19- 94)

- I -

OFFICE OF THE h- DEPENDENT CObWSEL

Date of tronscripion 07/ 28/ 98 MONICA S. LEWINSKY was i-- .__ erviewed in Apartment 33B, 300 East 56" Street, New York, New York. Representatives of the Office of Independent Counsel (OIC) included ROBERT J. BITTMAN, Deputy Independent Counsel (DIG), SOLOMON L. WISENBERG, DIC, MARY ANNE WIRTH, Associate Independent Counsel (AIC), and Professor SAM DASH, Consultant. Attorneys present for LEWINSKY included PLATO CACHERIS, Law Offices of PLATO CACHERIS, 1100 Connecticut Avenue NW, Washington, D. C. 20036, telephone 202- 775- 8700; SYDNEY HOFFMAN of the CACHERIS Law Office; and JACOB STEIN, Law Offices of STEIN, MITCHELL, & MEZINES, 1100 Connecticut Avenue NW, Washington, D- C. 20036, telephone 202- 737- 7777.

After each of the participants identified themselves, a proffer agreement was executed by LEWINSKY. The agreement had previously been signed on July 24, 1998 by STEIN, CACHERIS, and KENNETH W. STARR, Independent Counsel. A copy of the agreement is attached and marked "Attachment A". LEWINSKY stated that she wished to answer all questions truthfully and completely. LEWINSKY then provided the following information:

LEWINSKY is a 25 year old female with a Bachelor of Science degree in Psychology from Lewis & Clark College in Portland, Oregon. LEWINSKY has been taking two prescription anti- depressants since early February 1995. This medication, at times, causes some memory to be suppressed and this usually expresses itself as the inability to think of certain words during conversation. The drugs are Effexor and Serzone. LEWINSKY stated that she wished to proceed with the above caveat.

LEWINSKY first met the President of the United States, WILLIAM J. CLINTON, in July 1995, soon after beginning her job as an intern in LEON PANETTA's Office in the White House. The occasion was the departure of the President from the South Lawn of the White House. LEWINSKY had obtained her job through a friend of her mother's, WALTER KAYE, and through JAY FOOTLIK, who formerly worked there.

LEWINSKY began her personal relationship with the President on November 15, 1995. This was during the furlough of federal employees when LEWINSKY was in the unique position of having been hired as a paid employee in Legislative Affairs, but

Investigation on 0 7 / 2 7 / 9 8 dl NEW YORK, NEW YORK File # 29D OIC LR 35063 by CI _ Date dictated 07/ 28/ 98

1390

oIC- 3Ma (Rev. X- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 27/ 98 , Page J-

before her paper work had been processed. LEWINSKY, who was still an intern working for LX& J PANEITA in the West Wing of the White House, saw the President when he came to the West Wing to see PANEITAandHAROLD ICKES. LEWINSKY and the President had flirted previously and they made eye contact on this visit. Laterthatdaytherewas acakepartyforJENNIFERPAIMIERI, which the President and LEWINSKY attended. Later the same day, LJZWINSKYwas walkingpastthe office of GmRGE SI'EPHANG~ LOUS and noticed that the President was inside the office and a U. S. Secret Service (USSS) Agent was outside. The President motioned for LEWINSKY to care in. IEWINXY felt that this was her big chance and she advised the President that she "had a crush on him." The President then invited LEWINSKY to the back study behind the Oval Office, where he kissed her.

The relationship then blossorred and eventually included 14 sexual encounters. Sexual encounters included one or more of the following: kissing, hugging, touching, and oral sex on the person of the President, but not intercourse. On one occasion there was unclothed genital contact. Although LEWINSKY and the President had talked about the President performing oral sex on LEWINSKY, this neveroccurredbecausemanytirtestheir encounters occurred during her ~strual cycles. The relationship included about 50 telephone calls, with the majority of them being between 1O: OO p. m. and 6: 00 a. m. About 15 of these calls were sexually explicit telephme calls, which LEWINSKY refers to as "phone sex" with the President. The President made most of the calls from his residence, but called LEWINSKY from out of town several times, including a call fran Florida at the beginning of September 1996, when he was on the caqaign trail.

At least seven of the sexual acts occurred in the hallway between the Oval Office and the private study of the President. The President usually left the door between the Oval Office and the Back Office slightly ajar so there would be no suspicion of improper activity and to hear if anyone was trying to contact him. LEWINSKY explained that the Hack Office includes the private study, the hallway, the dining roan, and the bathroan. 'Ihe President liked to standwithhis backagainstthe door frametoeasehisbackrmscles. When the President wanted

to spend time with LEWINSKY, he would call her and either arrange to meet her in the hall, or LFWINSKY would carry sa- rie papers into the Oval Office. There were about nine or ten sexual contacts prior to Easter 1996, and about four after LEWINSKY was transferred to the Pentagon. About four of the sexual events occurred on workdays between 9: 00 a. m. and 5: 00 p. m., with the remainder on weekends. LJTWINSKY recounted a fewof the sexual

1391

29D OIC LR 35063

Ccnkualion of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,On 07/ 27/ 98 , Page 3

contacts as follows: A. On February 27 or 28 when the President gave

LEWINSKY a hatpin and a book. This included kissing, touching, and oral sex to carpletion.

B. OnMarch or30 after theknee surgery. This consisted of kissing, touching, oral sex to ccnpletion and brief genital contact without clothing but not intercourse.

C. On August 16, 1997, a birthday kiss. D. On December 28, 1997, a Christmas kiss. BEXTY CURRIE, the President's Secretary, may have seen the President and LEWINSKY hugging on occasion and possibly a kiss on the forehead. Ixlring a visit to the private study on July 4th, LEWINSKY was at times crying and fighting with the President, and hugging him, when she saw a gardener, name unl~~ m, who was working outside a window of the back study. The PresidentandLEWINSKY thenmoved out of sight into the hallway where intimate things s- times occurredduring their relationship. LEWINSKYis unsure whether the gardener observed anyarguingorhuggingbetweenthe PresidentandLEWINSKY. LEWINSKY is unaware of anyone else who could have observed any sexual activity. The President was suspicious of the USSS uniformed people and of LINDA TRIPP. In April 1997, the President asked, during a telephone call to LEWINSKY, whether LEWINSKY had told her mother about their sexual relationship. This was after MARSHA SCOTT had a conversation with WALTER KAYE. LEWINSKYdeniedthatshehad. However, thiswasuntrue, inasmxh as LEWINSKY had told her rtlother of the mtional details of her involmt with the President, and told her that LEWINSKY and the President had "fooled around". On Monday, July 14, 1997, the President asked LEWINSKY if LEWINSKY had told LINDA lRIPP about their relationship. LEWINSKY replied 'no." On December 28, 1997, the President asked LEWINSKY if she had revealed the hat pin to anyone and LEWINSKY denied that she had. The President did

not believe LEWINSKY.

B? WUlI NELVIS knew that LEWINSKY had been alone with the President on Decet& er 31, 1995, between 12: 00 p. m. and 1: 00 pm-, because LEWINSKY had a conversation with NELVIS in the pantry/ kitchen area. LEWINSKY and NELVIS were discussing the mking of cigars. NELVIS offered to get LEWINSKY one of the President's cigars and they entered the pantry door so that

1392

OK- 302~ ~Rsv. 6- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OK302 ot MONICA LEWINSKY .On 07/ 27/ 98 , Page 4 NELVIS could get cne. At that point, the President came in fran the Oval Office to get scrmtthing for PANEITA and saw LEWINSKY. NELVISthenobtainedthe item for PANETIA and left LEW~ SKY and the President alone in the back rouns. ThisresultedinLEwINSKY performingoralsexwiththe President.

NELVIS a~ sedLE; WINSKYononeotheroccasionthata uniformed officer had asked NELVIS the identity of WINSKY, after the officer had observed her go into the Oval Office. NELVIS told the officer that LEWINSKY was the daughter of one of the Cabinet Secretaries.

BETTY CURRIE facilitated LEWINSKY's visits with the President so that EVELYNLIEBERMAN, STEPHENGOODIN, andNANCY HERNPEICH, who did not like LEWIN! SKY, would not find out. CURRIE advisedthat HEF3REICHwouldbegone onMondayor Tuesday

evenings to attend yoga classes and thatLIEBERMANarxdGC0DIN were gone on week-.

On Good kiday of 1996, LEWINSKY was advised that she was being transferred out of the White House to the Pentagon.

The President called LJWINSKY on Easter Sunday 1996, about 5: 00 p. m. or 6: 00 p. m., and asked about the RON BRAN incident. LEWINSKY criedaboutbeingtransferredoutand the President asked her to visit him. LEWINSKYcarriedscmepapers to the Oval Office and Officer JOHN MUSKEIT was there. MUSKFIT said he would ask LIEBERMAN if LEWINSKY could see the President,

but LJWINSKY skirted theissueby sayingthatshe wouldonlybe there for a minute to drop off the papers. The President was sitting at his desk in the Oval Office talking on the telephone, presumably to Mrs. CLINKIN, as the President ended the callby saying, I( 1 love you." The President and LEWINSKY went into the back office and the President tried to soothe LEWINSKY by saying, "1 ptise you if I win in November I'll get you back and you can do what you want." The President said that LIEBERMAN had spearheaded LEwINSKY's transfer because LEWINSKY was paying too much attention to the President and they could not have this prior to the election. LEWINSKY soonbqanperforming oral sex

on the President, then the President took a telephone call frun a political person, whom LEWmSKY later speculated to be DICK MORRIS _ The telephone IMY have rung in the back office, or the President rray have been interrupted by saxeone fra the Oval Office to take the call. LGWINSKY felt cheap performing oral sex

while the President was on the telephone. At scrre later date, after reading about DICK MORRIS in the newspaper, LEWINSKY wondered whether DICK MORRIS was doing the same thing with a

1393

01~. 302a (Rev. S- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 27/ 98 , Page -5-

prostitute. The President catqleted the call and hung up. The oral sex was discontinued when the President answered, "Just a minutel' as a result of HAROLD ICKES calling out, Wr. President" from the door of the Oval Office. LEWINSKY had her top off. The President left the rocxnandLEWINSKY departed through theback door afterputtinghertopback on.

After the President won the election, LBWINSKY renewed her efforts to get back to the White House. The President advisedLEWINSKYthathewouldtalkto BOBNASHandtoldherat other times that both MARSHA Sm and NASH were working on it. IXWINSKY had given her resume to the President in March 1997.

LENINSKY applied for a jab in the White House Press Office and LINDA TRIPP arranged an NSC (National Security Council) interview. LEWINSKYadxisedMARSHA SCOTT of her applications, but she did not get either job. When LSWINSKY told the President that she had applied for these jobs, the President retorted that he neededtobowinadvance so that he coulddo satxething.

By October 1997, LEWINSKY told the President that she had made up her mind to leave the Pentagon job and move to New York. LEWINSKY mentioned a job at the United Nations (UN). The President said that he would help, and he apparently spoke to JOHN PODESTA, who spoke to BILL RICHARDSON on a trip to Mexico. Ambassador RICHARDSON called LEWINSKY and set up an interview at the Watergate Hotel. Subsequently, RICHARDSONcalledLEWINSKYat the Pentagon and offered her the job at the UN. LEWINSKY, who had changedhermindaboutworking at the UN, butdidnotknm how to back out, called one of RICHARDSON's assistants and advised that she was mre interested in working in the private sector.

LINDA TRIPP suggested to LEWINSKY that the President should be asked to ask VERNON JORDAN for assistance. In early October 1997, while talking to the President on the telephone fran 2: 30 a. m. to 4: 00 a. m., LEWINSKY asked the President to call JORDAN and the President did. This long conversation included an argument about why the President was not bringing LEWINSKY back to the White House.

LEWINSKY was a willing participant in all of the sexual encounters. LZWINSKY and the President had discussed a mntber of times that they would never tell anyone about their sexual activities. However, in violation of this agregoent, LEWINSKY did provide different levels of detail about the sexual relationship to the following persons: ANDYBLEILER, NATALIE UNGVARI, NBYSA ERBLAND, ASHLEY RAINES, CATHRYN ALDAY DAVIS, LINDA

1394

OIC- 3Ma (Rev. x- 19- 9431,

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of (NJ- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,On 07/ 27/ 98 , Page -L

TRIPP, DALEYOUG, Dr. CATHYBSIEP, andDr. IRENE KASSORLA. LEWINSKY did not tell KATHY ESLEILER, and did not tell DENNIS Lm of Los Angeles, who is mown to her.

No sexual incidents occurred from May 1996 or earlier until after the election.

In May 1997, the President said that he did not feel righttithis sexualrelationshipwithLBWIN% Yand that he just wanted to be friends. LEWDJSKY refer- redtothis as "dump day. ll

The President, at one time or another, made ccmrents to -KY such as, t'You are bright, attractive, and make ma feel young;" he liked talking to her; "people like us" (meaning, we are the same), LBWINSKY was %rotive and full of fire"; LENINSKY was "full of piss and vinegar; I' he wished to spend more time with LBWINSKY; he might "have time in three years;" and "What if I'm 75 ax- d have to go to the bathraxn fifteen times a day?". The

President scnetimes called LEWINSKY "sweetie" or %aby." LBWINSKY occasionally called the President %ands~."

On December 17, 1997, during a telephone conversation between 2: 00 a. m. and 3: 00 a. m., the President advised LEWINSKY that she was on the PAULA JONES witness list. 'Ibis was the first indicationLEWINSKYhadthatshewastobe subpoenaed. LEWINSKY believes that the Presidenthadjust found aut, but if the President found out about the potential witnesses on December 5? ' or 6't he never gave any indication of this to LEWINSKY. During this call the President advised that LEWINSKY might sign an affidavit to avoid being deposed in the JONES case; that LEWINSKY could say that she was coming to the White House to visit BETTY CURRIE; or that LEWINSKY was carrying papers to the President; and that LEWINSKY should contact BETTY CURRIE if subpoenaed. The President also advised that BETTY CURRIE's brother had been killed, and that the President had a Christmas present for LEWINSKY.

On December 19, 1997, LEWINSKY was served with a subpoena in the PAULA JONES lawsuit, between 4: 00 p. m. and 4: 30 p- m., at the Pentagon where LEWINSKY was then working. This was very upsetting to LEWINSKY, who then called VERNON JORDAN from a payphone in the Pentagon. JORDAN had been helping LEWINSKY seek employment in New York for the previous month and a half. LEWINSKY went to see JORDAN at his office that afternoon, showed JORDAN the subpoena, and pointed out that it included the production of a hat pin that the President had given LEWINSKY.

1395

29D OIC LR 35063

Continua_. 2 df OK- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY .on 07/ 27/ 98 , Page -7l

IEWINSKY asked JORDAN about getting an attorney. JORDAN received a telephone call and asked LEWINSKY to leave the roun. After about ten minutes JORDAN came back, but did not identify the caller. JORDAN called an attorney named FRANK CARTER and set up an appointment for IEWINSKY at lo: 30 a. m. on the following Monday. JORDAN said there were only two important questions: 1.

Did you have sex with the President? 2. Did the President ask you for sex? JORDAN said that he would see the President that evening andwouldtellhimabout LEWlNSKY's subpoena_ In a subsequent meeting, JORDANassuredLEWINSKYthathehadadvised the President of the subpoena.

LEWINSKY did not visit the President at the White House between& c- r6 " and December 28 ', 1997.

On December 28, 1997, LEWINSKY visited the President at the White House. The visit was arranged by BETTY CURRIE. When LEWINSKY arrived she talked to BETTY and played with BUDDY on the carpet with some "people bones" for about ten minutes while the President was on the telephone. The President and LEWINSKY then went into the back study and spent from 45 minutes to an hour together. The President gave LEWINSKY her Christmas gifts at this time. There was no sex on this occasion, but there may have been a kiss and a hug, as the President said that Christmas kisses were an exception to his earlier statement that there would be no more sexual contact between them. LEWINSKY expressed her concern about the gifts that the President had given LEWINSKY and specifically the hat pin that had been subpoenaed by PAULA JONES. The President seemed to know what the JONES subpoena called for in advance and did not seem surprised about the hat pin. The President asked LEWINSKY if she had told anyone about the hat pin and LEWINSKY denied that she had, but may have said that she gave some of the gifts to FRANK CARTER. LEWINSKY was concerned because this was a personal item. LEWINSKY mentioned that DEBBIE SCHIFF may have given her name to the lawyers for PAULA JONES. The President opined that it may have been "that woman from the summer that was involved in the KATHLEEN WILLEY thing." LEWINSKY asked the President if she should give the gifts to someone and the President replied, "1 don't know." LEWINSKY and the President discussed her move to New York and the President said that if LEWINSKY was in New York the JONES lawyers might not call; that the sooner LEWINSKY moved the better; and that maybe the lawyers would ignore her. Sometime prior to December 28". the President had suggested that LEWINSKY submit an affidavit in lieu of testifying.

Several hours after leaving the White House LEWINSKY

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29D OIC LR 35063

Conlinuation of OK- 3M of MONICA LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 27/ 98 ,Page _8

received a telephone call at her apartment from BBITY CURRIE who made the stat- t, "You have soIIy3 things to give me?" This call was not a coincidence, but a result of LEWINSKY's earlier conversation with the President. The call may have been on CURRIE's cell phone. LBWINSKY put a GAP box on her bed and placed in it a nu& er of gifts that she had received fran the President, except for sane irmocuous items that would not appear too

personal if foundinherapartmt. The reason forgetting sm of the gifts aut of the apartmant was because LBWINSKY suspected that the lawyers for JONES would break into her apartment. LEWINSKY also suspected that the JONES people might tap her telephone. Besides keeping the innocuous gift items, LBWINSKY also kept sane of the sentimental items fran the President such as the following: a canvasbag frantheBLXKIXXstore, maybe sm BLACK WG T- shirts, a lithographic book, a big Rockette blanket, a pair of sunglasses, and a wooden box that had contained an earlier present. LBWINSKYkept the sentimental items because she was afraid that she would not get them back.

Pursuant to the agreenwtthat LBWINSKYandCURRIEhadmade during the earlier telephone call, LEWINSKY met CURRIE on 28'" street outside LEWINSKY's apartment at about 2: 00 p. m. and gave CURRIE the box of gifts. The box contained a hat pin, some BLACK DOG items, a broach, two signed photographs of The President, and a signed State of the Union address. However, there was no discussion of the contents. LEWINSKY had written "do not throw away" on the box. CURRIE was on her way to visit a relative in the hospital when she stopped by. CURRIE was to keep the box in a closet in CURRIE's home.

In addition to the December 19, 1997 meeting with

VERNON JORDAN, LEWINSKY had met JORDAN on several previous occasions. LEWINSKY may have met with JORDAN in late November or the first week in December 1997. LEWINSKY initially met JORDAN in early November 1997, when she spent about 20 minutes in his office. The purpose of this meeting was to ask JORDAN's assistance in obtaining a job in New York. LEWINSKY knew that JORDAN and the President were good friends and JORDAN knew that LEWINSKY and the President were friends. JORDAN indicated that he had spoken with the President and LEWINSKY interpreted this to mean that the President had asked JORDAN for assistance in getting LEWINSKY a job. JORDAN said, llYou've come highly recommended." LEWINSKY understood that this meant that the President had spoken to JORDAN. LEWINSKY was somewhat intimidated during this meeting. JORDAN said that he would make some telephone calls on LEWINSKY's behalf before he left Washington for the holidays.

1397

OK- 302~ 1 (Rev. 8- 19- 94 v

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,~ n 07/ 27/ 98 , Page A_

On December 11, 1997, LENINSKY had lunch with JORDAN at the AKIN, GUMP office, at which time JORDAN reccmnen ded that LEWINSKY write letters with certain language to three ccqxnies. JORDAN provided the language. LBWINSKY typed the letters and sent copies to JORDAN. D_ xringthemeetingJORDANindicatedthat he knew LEWINSKY's mother's fiance, PJZI'ER SIRAUS.

At one of the Dece& er meetings, JORDAN said to LEWINSKY that LEWINSKYwas a friendof the President but, I'Your problem is that you're in love-- don't deny it." LZ'WINSKY just laughed in reply. At another of the December meetings with JORDAN, they had breakfast at the HYATT first.

On Decanber 22, 1997, LEWINSKY rrret with JORDAN for about 15 minutes in his office. LEWINSKY showedJORDANthegifts that she was taking to CARTER's office. IEWINSKY believes that JORDAN knew that she was not turning over all of the gifts to cx? TER. JORDAN did not tell LBWINSKY to hold back any of the items. L& MINSKY told JORDAN that she had phone sex with the President and JORDAN replied that it was alright if the President talked to people. JORDANask& whatphonesexwas, butLEWINSKY didnotexplain. JORDAN grunted and nodded a lot during his meetings WithLEWINSKYandthis suretimes made it difficult to fullyunderstandhim. LEWINSKYandJORDANhadawinkandnod understar& ngthatLEWINSKYwashaving sexwith the President. LEWINSKY does not recall whether JORDAN explained the difference between civil and criminal perjury.

On December 22, 1997 LEWINSKY was driven to PRANK CARTER's office by VERNON JORDAN, where she discussed the JONES subpce~ with CARTER. The Presidenthadpreviously suggestedan affidavit to avoid testifying and LEWINSKY talked to CARTER about it. The Presidentassumadthatthe affidavitwouldbetodeny s- thing, although she did not discuss specifics with the President. The pattern was to conceal and deny and there was no reason for the President to think that anything had changed. LEWINSKY had always told the President that she would protect him.

At some pointinJanuaxy1996, CARTER paged LEWINSKY and advised her that the JONES lawyers had subpoenaed the courier records for the gifts that LJZWINSKY ser, t to the White House. LEWINSKY called for the President but he was out of town. LFWINSKY suggested to BETTY CLJRRIE that the gifts were for CURRIE and in sm casesthiswouldbetrue. The same night, LEWINSKY asked LINDA TRIPP if ISIKOF'F had called her, since ISIKOF'F had called LEWINSKY earlier. There had been no earlier contacts by

1398

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29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY .~ n 07/ 27/ 98 ,Page _lQ

ISIKOFJ? with BETTY CURRIE. On January 7, 1998, LEWINSKY signed the JONES affidavit whichCAR! IXRhadprepared. LBWINSKY took the following gifts to CARTER's office: '# The Hope and History" book, all Christrras cards, two signed photos, including the LBWINSKY family photo, and signed letters. Therewas noagreeman t with the President, JORDAN, or anyone else that LEWINSKY had to sign the JONES affidavit before getting a job in New York. LEWINSKY never demanded a job from JORDAN in return for a favorable affidavit. Neither the President nor JORDAN evertoldLEWINSKY that she had to lie. However, LEWINSKY repeatedthatthere hadalways beenan understandingwith the Presidentthattheywouldbothdenya s- al relationship.

In January 1998, LEWINSKYmatwithJORDAN, shortly after she signed the JONES affidavit on January 7, 1998. LEWINSKY gave JORDAN a tie and pocket square, and thanked him for his assistance in getting her a job in New York. JORDAN had helped LEWINSKY get the interviews in New York with MCANDREWS AND FORBES, BURS'IQN -, and-. JORDANbeganhelping LEWINSKY after she requested his assistance in a meeting at JORDAN's office in early November 1997. JORDAN helped LBWINSKY because LEWINSKY was a friend of the President. JORDAN was the only one in recent times who had delivered what he promised.

When LEWINSKY was subpoenaed on December 19, 1997, she telephonically discussed it in a cryptic manner with LINDA TRIPP, who had already been subpoenaed. LEWINSKY was concerned that TRIPP would testify about LEWINSKY's sexual relationship with the President, inasmuch as LEWINSKY had advised TRIPP of many details in confidence on different occasions. During previous discussions, TRIPP advised LEWINSKY that she would reveal what LEWINSKY had told her if TRIPP had to testify. LEWINSKY and TRIPP had talked about TRIPP's testimony several times.

At some point LEWINSKY typed on her home computer the talking points about how TRIPP should testify. The contents and ideas for the talking points were a summary of things that LEWINSKY and TRIPP had discussed off and on since March 1997. There was no lawyer involved in preparing the talking points, nor did LEWINSKY receive any instructions from the President, JORDAN, CARTER, or anyone from the White House. LEWINSKY gave the talking points to TRIPP at the Pentagon. TRIPP read the points and made positive statements about them by saying, "That's true," and "This is good." TRIPP had indicated that TRIPP wanted to file an affidavit to avoid testifying in the JONES matter.

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29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY .On 07/ 27/ 98 , Page LLl

LBWINSKY did not always tell TRIPP the truth, i. e. LEWINSKYprcxnisedthat she wouldnot sign the JONES affidavit until she had the New York job lined up. However, when this pranise was made to TRIPP the affidavit had already been signed.

LEWINSKYwas not aware that TRIPPwastapingher telephone calls, butdidsuspectthat TRIPPmayha~ been

recording her during their conversation at the RITZ QU? L'ION HOI'EL on January 13, 1998.

LEWINSKYgavea copy of the affidavittoJDRDAN. JORDAN made changes to the first draft of the affidavit, but did notretaina copy. Thesewereminorchangesproposedby LEWINSKY

andagreedtoby JORDAN. CAPTIER prepared three or four drafts of the affidavit until LBWINSKY andCAR= agreeduponone. Minor changes were made. JORDAN never told LEWINSKY to file the affidavitbutdid discuss her concerns when LEWINSKY calledhim.

LEWINSKY prepared a written proffer in her own handwriting at the end of January, 1998. Attached is a copy of the proffer marked "Attachrtent B" _ The writing took fronsixto ten hours and was cat- pleted in one sitting. LEWINSKYaskedher attorneys, BIL; L GINSBERG and NZTE SPEIGKTS, a few questions. The

attorneys were in the hallway outside of the conference rcun at the COSMOS CLUB when she drafted the proffer. LEWINSKY was not on nedication. The proffer is generally accurate and LEWINSKY would disavow nothing in it. NATE SPEIGHIS has a copy of the first draft, which is not significantly different fro- n the second draft. LBWINSKY made the following c anrents concerning specific statements in the proffer:

A. At the end of paragraph two on page two of the proffer LEWINSKY's recollection is that the words "leave Washington, EP should read "get out of town."

B. In paragraph mrked four on page four the following statement appears "In general, Ms. L should say she visited the WH to see Ms. CURRIE and, on occasion when working at the WH, she brought him letters when no one else was around." LEWINSKYC arnranted that these staterents were not untrue, but were misleading in that scme facts were onitted fran this statement. Pis was the cover story that the President had sqgested that sheuse.

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(MC- 302~ 4 (Rev. S- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,~ n 07/ 27/ 98 , Page 12

D. E.

F. G.

At the bottan of page five the wording of the two lines scratched out is "on rtxxe than one occasion Ms. L was concerned about signing an affidavit."

L, EXNSKY’s nmmy is unclear on this point, but UWINSKYmayorr~ ynothave sa. idthistoJORDAN.

In regard to the bottan paragraph on page five, LEWINSKY said that she cannot now remz& er whether she told JORDAN about her sexual relationship with the President.

In regard to the first sentence on page six, Ws. L rtade it clear she inter& d to deny the sexual relationship with the Pres.", LEWINSKY now is not sure of that statexnent.

In paragraph two of page eight the proffer states T4s. L replied that she and the Pres. had already had an affair minus having sex,-- but it included everything else." LENINSKY said that this statetent rteant that she never had intercourse with The President.

Inregardtoparagraphten onpageten, LEWINSKY discussed signing the affidavit denying a sexual relationship with the President. LEWINSKY said

that she hadnever even thoughtaboutgiving an affidavit wherein she would admit to having sex with the President. Eased on the pattern of LEWINSKY's relationship with the President it was as~ that~ NSKYw~ dnota~ tanysexua1 activity. Neither the President nor anyone ever directed LEWINSKY to say anything or to lie, but neither did the President nor anyone else ever tell LSWINSKY not to lie. No one ever used the term Weny, deny" to her.

LEWINSKY now has scxte guilt about getting JORDAN into trouble. LFWINSKY likes JORDAN. LGWINSKY said that her mry when she wrote the proffer in January would have been better than it is today.

LEWINSKY gave the following gifts to the President: 1. A poem written by LEWINSKY on behalf of the

White House interns and presented to the President by KARIN ABRAMSON.

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29D c) IC LR 35063

Continuation of OIC- X3 of MONICA LEWINSKY .On O7/ 27/ 98 Page 13

2. 3. 4.

5. 6. 7.

8. 9.

10. 11.

12. 13.

14.

15. 16.

17 II.

In November, 1995 a tie delivered to the President by BBITY CURRIE and worn in the Oval Office the day that MADBLINEALBRIGHTwas appointed Secretary of State.

md of March, 1996 on the day RON BR00J was killed, a tie from B- ALE'S_

August, 1996 a tie worn by the President in Septenber, 1996 while signing the Defense Bill. LEWINSKY has a signed photo.

Fall, 1997 a CALVIN KLEIN tie worn on California trip.

March, 1997 a tie worn to a Governor's race rally in Virginia.

December 6, 1997 a tie from lb- don. Antique book on PETER THE GREAT fran 1802. LEWINSKY's personal copy of "Vex" (no inscription). LZ3WINSKY replaced her copy of the book at KRAMERBOOKS. Observed inback study of

the President on November 13, 1997. A copy of ?Ihe Note Book" by NICHOLAS SPARKS.

A copy of "Oy Vey," a book of Jewish jokes. Observed in back study of the President on No& r 13, 1997.

A book on golf.

An old school book entitled "Disease and Mispresentation" which was about race relations.

A A

BANANA REPUBLIC casual shirt.

wocden letter opener with a frog on the handle. Obsenred in back study of the President.

plastic pocket frog. puzzle on golf mysteries.

1402

29D OIC LR 35063

Continualion of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY .On 07/‘ 27/‘ 98 ,Page AA_

18. 19. 20.

21. 22. 23. 24. 25.

26. 27. 28.

29. 30.

Acardgame. A copy of "SHERLOCK HOLMES".

An antique standing cigar holder on December 28, 1997.

tie on Decgnber HARROD's mug on hugs and kisses penny madallion

28, 1997. December 28, 1997. bax on December 28, 1997. with a heart cut out.

An antique paperweight with a painting of the White House on November 13 ", the day HERNREICH testified_ Purchased at flea market at 6" and 7+ h. President ZEDILLO of Mexico at White House. In political collection in cabinet in back dining room.

A STARBUCKS mug from Santa Monica. NELVIS observed the President using the mug.

A book about THEODORE ROOSEVELT. A pair of sunglasses in Fall, worn by the President in Africa, photo in U. S. News in January, 1998.

A pumpkin pin that the President wore in his lapel on Halloween.

A care package in March, 1996 when the President injured his leg.

LEWINSKY received the following gifts from the President, some of which have been previously mentioned:

1. A lithograph on February 27 or 28, 1997 (placed in her purse unwrapped)

2. A hatpin on February 27 or 28, 1997 (placed in purse unwrapped) _

3. A large BLACK DOG canvas bag from Martha's

OK- 302a (Rev. X- 19- 94)

1403

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY .on 07/ 27/ 98 . Pay _L5.

Vineyard. 4. A large Rockettes blanket from New York. 5. An ugly but sweet pin of the New York skyline. 6. A sr~ ll box of cherry chocolates. 7. A pair of joke sunglasses. 8. A stuffed animal frcfin BLAa DOG.

9. A marble bear's head frcm Vancouver.

10. ALondonpinwrapped ina Casual Comer box. 11. A Shamrockpin. 12. A ccmpact disk of ANNIE -X. 13. Scme "Davidoff" cigars.

On December 6, 1997, LEWINSKY spent about 20 or 25 minutes with the President and had gotten into a big fight with him. LBWINSKY had found out that ELEANOR MONDALE was in with the President while she waited at the northwest gate. LEWINSKYhad earlier sent a note to the President that she needed to talk with him. Part of LBWINSKY's anger was caused by BETTY CURRIE, who had told LEWINSKY that the President was maeting with lawyers. LEWINSKY left the northwest gate in a very agitated state and called CURRIE from the Corcoran Gallery. LEWINSKYwas very "pissed off" and called CURRIE again from her apart- t. CURRIE t- ray have paged her before this call. LEWINSKY called the White House again and talked to the President about MONDALE. During the White House argument LBWINSKY went ballistic and the President said that he never had anyone talk to him like LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY also told the President that things were not roving fast enough with m JORDAN. This meant that she had not found a job in New York yet.

LEWINSKY's affidavit in the JONES case was not accurate in the following respects:

A. That LEWINSKY never had a sexual relationship with the President.

B. That LEWINSKY never was alone with the President

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OIC- 30’~ (Rev. X- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Conrinuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA LEWINSKY ,m 07/ 27/ 98 , Page -I6

after she left the White House.

C. That LEWINSKY only saw the President at public functions.

LEWINSKY said that she had heard rurtmrs from The Hill thatCHRIS WALKER may have set her up with TIM KEATIZ. The word was that she was too sexy to work in the White Hmse. JODIE TURKELSONhadwantedto fireLEWINSKY. MARSHASm said that LEWINSKY was called "the Stalker" at the White House.

In regard to the deposition of the President in the JONES case, LEWINSKY said that she had always assured that the President would deny any sexual relationships, but the President never said it to LZWINSKY. LEWINSKY asked the President if the ten other waxen on the witness list were fran the White House and the President said that they were all wa- ten from the old days in Arkansas.

Tab 19

1406

1407

OIC- 302 (Rev. 8- 19- 94) - 1 -

OFFICE OF THE INDEPEhDEhT COUNSEL

Dale of aaosc~ U 07/ 30/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was inte,-- liewed under the terms of an immunity agreement, a copy of which is attached hereto, in room 616 of the Watergate Hotel, 2650 Virginia Avenue, Northwest, Washington, D. C. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, AIC JULIE MYERS, and LEWINSKY's attorney, TRESTON BURTON. Present for portions of the interview was Deputy Independent Counsel (DIC) ROBERT BITTMAN. After being apprised of the official identities of the interviewers, LEWINSKY provided the following information, beginning at approximately 4135 p. m.

LEWINSKY was shown a copy of two pages from her day- timer calendars from 1996 and 1997. The original, which is a two- sided document, was provided by LEWINSKY to the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) earlier in the day. Those two pages contained all the calendar dates in 1996 and 1997. LEWINSKY advised she made notations in the calendar within a week or two of the event, but not as they happened. LEWINSKY advised the notations were made on the calendar prior to the "scandal" becoming news. LEWINSKY advised there were some dates when an event took place that she did not circle for one reason or another.

LEWINSKY explained that the dates circled on the calendar represent days LEWINSKY either saw President WILLIAM 'JEFFERSON CLINTON or days he called LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY explained that if CLINTON called her at 2 a. m., she may have circled the day before he actually called, because she associated that time of night with the previous day. LEWINSKY advised she may have a similar document from 1995, but she doubts it since her relationship with CLINTON began in late 1995.

The small, handwritten numbers to the side of the calendar for 1997 represent the number of weeks since LEWINSKY last had physical sex with CLINTON. LEWINSKY explained that from April 7, 1996 until February 28, 1997, she had no physical sex with CLINTON. LEWINSKY distinguished physical sex from phone sex. LEWINSKY explained she and CLINTON engaged in phone sex during this period.

LEWINSKY advised she separately kept track of the days

Investigation on 0 7 / 2 9 / 9 8 at Washington, DC File x 29D- OIC- LR- 35063 Date dictated 07/ 30[ 98

1408

OIC- 302a (Rev. g- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Confinuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 ,Pagc 2

prior to the 1996 election and the days since she worked at the White House, but the small numbers on the 1997 day- timer calendar represented days since her last physical sexual contact with CLINTON.

LFWINSKY advised that the other set of numbers below the months represented the number of times LEWINSKY saw CLINTON in a particular month. LEWINSKY advised that LINDA TRIPP suggested LEWINSKY document her contacts with CLINTON because it helped TRIPP understand LEWINSKY's situation.

LEWINSKY advised that she includes kissing when she uses the term "sexual contact." For the purposes of this interview, LEWINSKY differentiated between the kissing and the other sexual contact, without going into the details of the sexual contact.

[For the purposes of this FD- 302, unless otherwise noted, physical sexual contact means more than kissing.]

LEWINSKY advised that on January 7, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY for the first time at home and at her office. LEWINSKY added that on January 7, 1996, she had physical sexual contact with CLINTON. On January 15, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY at her office and at her home. LEWINSKY advised on January 21, 1996 she received a phone call from CLINTON and later had physical sexual contact with him. On January 28, 1996, LEWINSKY was in San Francisco, California. When she returned to her office at the White House, she checked her caller identification feature and saw that CLINTON had called her from the Oval Office.

[LEWINSKY advised that calls from CLINTON when he was in the Oval Office would show up on the caller identification feature as "POTUS." Calls from the White House residence were indicated by a "*." I

On January 30, 1996, there was a going away party for PAT GRIFFIN. LEWINSKY advised this was the first time CLINTON called LEWINSKY at her office during working hours. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY to come see him after the party, but LEWINSKY told him she did not think that would be a good idea. LEWINSKY - .-

advised she and CLINTON agreed they would not speak to each other at the party so that others did not get any "wrong" ideas. LEWINSKY explained that in a photograph taken at the going away party, she stood as far away from CLINTON as possible for the same reason.: L' LEWINSKY$ advi'sed she and CLINTON did not get

1409

OIC- N2a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Cominuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 ,Pagc 3

together on this date. On February 4, 1996, CLINTON and LEWINSKY engaged in physical sexual contact. On February 7 or 8, 1996, while signing the Telecommunications Bill, CLINTON wore one of the ties LEWINSKY had given him for the first time. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON called her that evening and they engaged in phone sex.

On February 19, 1996, LEWINSKY advised CLINTON broke off their relationship for the first time. LEWINSKY advised she saw CLINTON in person and he said he was feeling guilty about continuing their relationship, so he wanted to break it off.

On March 26, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY in her office at the White House from the White House Residence. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON called from the Residence for the first time, to her knowledge. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY if the caller identification showed anything and she told him it was a star.

On March 29, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY at her office in the White House.

On March 31, 1996, CLINTON and LEWINSKY engaged in physical sexual contact.

On April 7, 1996, CLINTON and LEWINSKY engaged in physical sexual contact. On April 12, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY twice, once during the day and once at night. LEWINSKY advised that during one of these telephone calls, CLINTON told LEWINSKY he would have her back at the White House after the election.

On April 22, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY, but they did not engage in phone sex. LEWINSKY advised she was upset because she hated her job. On April 29, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY at approximately 3 a. m. LEWINSKY advised this call may have actually taken place on April 30th. LEWINSKY advised this was the first time CLINTON left a message on LEWINSKY's answering machine. LEWINSKY recalled that on the message, CLINTON said "aw

shucks." On May 2, 1996, LEWINSKY attended a Saxophone Club event and saw CLINTON. LEWINSKY explained she was very upset because CLINTON had promised to call her that weekend, but did not. CLINTON called LEWINSKY that evening and said he could tell LEWINSKY was upset. CLINTON apologized for not calling LEWINSKY and said that he was sick that weekend. CLINTON also said that

1410

OiC- Z323h (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Connnuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 29/ 98 .~ lge 4 if LEWINSKY did not like her job at the Pentagon, he would try to get LEWINSKY a job on the campaign.

LEWINSKY advised CLINTON may have called her on May 6, 1996. LEWINSKY advised that on May 16, 1996, the night Admiral BOORDA committed suicide, CLINTON called LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY tried to initiate phone sex, but CLINTON was not in the mood. The next week, on the day of 'Lfuneral, CLINTON came to the Pentagon. Later that night, CLINTON called LEWINSKY and they engaged in phone sex. LEWINSKY advised she thinks the date of the funeral was May 21, 1996.

LEWINSKY advised that, because of a pattern that had developed, LEWINSKY would expect CLINTON to call her when HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON was out of town.

On May 31, 1996, LEWINSKY was out of town and CLINTON left a message on her home telephone answering machine. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON may have been calling about LEWINSKY coming to a radio address. On June 5, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY in the

. early evening, inquiring about LEWINSKY and her family attending a radio address, as had been discussed on previous occasions. CLINTON told LEWINSKY he would say something to BETTY CURRIE about arranging the attendance of LEWINSKY's family at the radio address.

The following morning, CURRIE called LEWINSKY and said there was no radio address that week, but a tour would be arranged for LEWINSKY's family.

On June 13, 1996, LEWINSKY and her family attended the arrival ceremony of the President of Ireland, which was held at Ft. Myer, Virginia. CLINTON made a comment about LEWINSKY's hat. On June 14, 1996, LEWINSKY attended a radio address with her family.

On June 23, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY and the two engaged in phone sex. On July 5, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY and the two engaged in phone sex. On July 19, 1996, CLINTON called LEWINSKY at 6: 30 a. m. and the two engaged in phone sex. CLINTON exclaimed "good morning!" to the best of LEWINSKY's knowledge after having an orgasm. -_

LEWINSKY then went down a list of other dates where there was either physical and/ or phone contact with CLINTON. LEWINSKY distinguished those contacts that include sex and those that did not. LEWINSKY advised that all telephone calls included

1411

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 29/ 98 .pagc 5

some conversation that was not of a sexual nature. The remaining dates in 1996 where LEWINSKY had contact with CLINTON were as follows:

July 28 phone call August 4 phone sex August 24 phone call September 5 phone call, maybe phone sex September 10 Clinton left a message on LEWINSKY's answering

machine. September 30 phone call -

October 22 phone sex October 23 phone call; earlier that evening, LEWINSKY saw

CLINTON at an event related to the Senate. LEWINSKY advised that there was no contact between her and CLINTON between October 23, 1996 and December 2, 1996.

December 2 December 17

phone sex LEWINSKY saw CLINTON at some sort of official function.

December 18 December 30

phone call CLINTON left a message on LEWINSKY's answering machine.

January 12

February 8 February 28

phone call phone sex physical contact, including more than just kissing. March 12

March 29 April 26

May 17

May 18

May 24

July 4

July 8

CLINTON calls LEWINSKY for approximately three minutes at work. physical contact including more than just kissing. phone call; LEWINSKY does not think the two engaged in phone sex. phone call phone call LEWINSKY visits and CLINTON breaks up with her. LEWINSKY describes this day as "D- Day." physical contact; CLINTON kissed LEWINSKY on the- neck. LEWINSKY was in Madrid, Spain at the same time CLINTON was. LEWINSKY saw CLINTON at the Ambassador's house. LEWINSKY and CLINTON make eye contact at the embassy.

1412

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 ,~ gc 6 J997 (Continued): July 14 July 15 July 24 August 1 August 16 September 30 October 9 October 11 October 23 October 30 November 12 November 13

December 5 December 6 December 28

LEWINSKY visits CLINTON at the White House. No sexual contact. phone call LEWINSKY visits, but no sexual contact phone call LEWINSKY and CLINTON kissed. phone call, maybe phone sex very long phone call, no sex visit; no sexual contact phone call phone call phone call, maybe phone sex very brief visit with CLINTON. Mexican President ZZDILLO at the White House. LEWINSKY saw CLINTON at an official function. LEWINSKY visited with CLINTON. In person visit, only kissed.

KATHLEEN WILLEY Prior to MICHAEL ISIKOFF interviewing LINDA TRIPP in the spring of 1997, TRIPP mentioned KATHLEEN WILLEY's story to LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY advised TRIPP did not mention WILLEY by name at first. LEWINSKY advised TRIPP's story seemed to change over time. TRIPP may have told LEWINSKY about WILLEY's name prior to ISIKOFF interviewing TRIPP. TRIPP told LEWINSKY about ISIKOFF's visit to TRIPP at TRIPP's office.

TRIPP told LEWINSKY that WILLEY was certainly not sexually* harassed. TRIPP told LEWINSKY about the ISIKOFF visit the same day of the visit or the next one. At that point, TRIPP said that WILLEY called, TRIPP that night.

LEWINSKY urged TRIPP to let someone in the White House know about the ISIKOFF visit. TRIPP said that she would only be comfortable speaking with NANCY HERNREICH or BRUCE LINDSEY. TRIPP said that, during the Whitewater hearings, she was told by her attorney not to talk to LINDSEY. LEWINSKY urged TRIPP to page LINDSEY. TRIPP advised that LINDSEY did not return the pages or telephone messages. LEWINSKY advised that she thinks --

TRIPP's ego was deflated and she seemed insulted. In early summer, ISIKOFF contacted TRIPP again. ISIKOFF called TRIPP to ask her to go on the record with her version of the WILLEY matter. LEWINSKY advised she considered saying

1413

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

_ ioa of OIC- 3u2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .oo 07/ 29/ 98 .we 7 something to CLINTON about TRIPP on May 24, 1997, but decided not to. On July 4, 1997, LEWINSKY mentioned to CLINTON that she had a friend who knew something about WILLEY.

LEWINSKY explained that July 4, 1997 was her most emotional visit with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised the visit lasted more than one hour. The majority of the visit was spent with LEwINSKY and CLINTON being emotionally intimate. Looking back, LEwINSKY is not sure if CLINTON was sincere during this visit. LEWINSKY questions a lot of things since the "scandal" broke. LEWINSKY does not think CLINTON was acting on July 4th, because if he was, he would be the greatest actor in the world. .LEWINSKY 'does not think CLINTON would have fought with her at the beginning of the visit if he was acting. The fight was about a letter LEWINSKY had sent CLINTON the day before, indicating she would tell her parents about their relationship if CLINTON did not help her with a job.

At the end of the visit, .LEWINSKY asked CLINTON if he knew KATHLEEN WILLEY. CLINTON advised he did. LEWINSICY said she had a friend at the Pentagon who had talked to ISIKOFF, who was looking into allegations that CLINTON had sexually harassed a woman who once worked at the White House. CLINTON advised the

CLINTON seemed NSKY's friend at the Pentagon.

CLINTON said that WILLEY called HERNREICH earlier that week and was asking about ISIKOFF and WILLEY wanted to know how to get out of it. LEWINSKY told CLINTON that WILLEY may have been covering her tracks. LEWINSKY did not use TRIPP's name. LEWINSKY advised she brought this subject up because she thought CLINTON should know about it. LEWINSKY thought maybe CLINTON could get WILLEY a job to make her happy.

LEWINSKY told CLINTON that her friend once worked at the White House. CLINTON did not ask for TRIPP's name. LEWINSKY was not offended by the WILLEY story because she did not believe it. LEWINSKY said her friend had tried to get in touch with BRUCE LINDSEY, but he did not return her pages to him.

LEWINSICY advised that WILLEY may have sent CLINTON a "mixed signal: LEWINSKY does not believe the PAULA JONES story either. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON and JONES may have had a consensual relationship. LEWINSKY advised she did not get jealous of CLINTON's relationships with other women, so long as they pre- dated her relationship with CLINTON.

1414

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LX- 35063

Cominuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 .~ ge 8 LEWINSKY explained how the July 4, 1997 meeting was arranged. LEWINSKY was "pissed" that CLINTON had not responded to her issues. related to her job. When LEWINSKY met with MARSHA SCOTT and SCOTT did not know who LEWINSKY was, LEWINSKY was annoyed. LEWINSKY was very frustrated so she sent CLINTON a note.

LEWINSKY advised she wrote the letter on July 3 and delivered it to CURRIE the same day. LEWINSKY advised that the letter had a cold tone. For instance, the letter began "Dear Sir." LEWINSKY advised she did not think the letter was threatening, but when she saw CLINTON on July 4, he indicated he felt it was. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY if she knew that it was against the law to threaten the President of the United States.

LEWINSKY advised that the first time she mentioned the possibility of moving to New York was in this July 3rd letter to CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she gave the letter to CURRIE at the Northwest gate. LEWINSKY advised the letter was handwritten and mentioned LEWINSKY's mother. LEWINSKY advised TRIPP had no input as to the contents of this letter. LEWINSKY advised that at the end of this letter, she expressed more emotions and even mentioned that she would give CLINTON one more chance.

LEWINSKY advised this letter was the meanest one she had ever sent to CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised the purpose of the letter was to show CLINTON how lucky he was that she was the way she was and that some people in her position, who had had an affair with him, would have played "hard ball" with him. LEWINSKY advised the letter was approximately two to three lined pages.

LEWINSKY advised that on most occasions she handwrote her notes, but she did type some. LEWINSKY advised that she sometimes prepared rough drafts of letters she eventually sent to

CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she often times bought two cards and used one to prepare a draft so that, in the event she made a mistake, she would have a duplicate card available to send.

CURRIE called LEWINSKY on the evening of July 3rd. LEWINSKY asked if CURRIE had given the package to CLINTON. CURRIE said she had and told LEWINSKY to be at the White House at 9 a. m. on July 4th.

LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON said he read the first line of the letter because CURRIE looked upset when she delivered it. CLINTON told LEWINSKY he threw the letter away after reading

1415

OIC- 3OZa CRC\. S- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 29/ 98 ,pagc 9

the first line. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON read the whole letter. LEWINSKY believes CLIhTON is the type of person who would lie about reading the letter. LEWINSKY believes CURRIE is not the type to read it.

LEWINSKY does not believe that CURRIE opened the letters LEWINSKY sent to CLINTON through CURRIE. LEWINSKY advised she typically would send things to CLINTON through CURRIE. LEWINSKY would place the item intended for CLINTON in an envelope marked either "BC" or "Mr. P." LEWINSKY said she would send that item in a larger envelope, which was addressed to CURRIE. LEWINSKY usually sent some sort of gift or card, to CURRIE in the larger envelope.

When LEWINSKY first arrived at the Oval Office on July 4th at 9 a. m., LEWINSKY told CLINTON someone was outside the Oval Office, so he suggested they move to the study. While in the study, she saw a White House gardener standing outside. LEWINSKY advised the gardener was standing sideways, so she is not sure if he saw LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised she then left for Madrid soon after July 4. While in Madrid, LEWINSKY went to the United States embassy or the ambassador's house for an official function. LEWINSKY saw CLINTON when she first entered the function. CLINTON was standing in a hall speaking with some of his aides, including MIKE McCURRY. When CLINTON saw LEWINSKY, they made eye contact and all the people CLINTON was speaking with turned and saw LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY believes this is the only time she was in the same room with BRUCE LINDSEY.

On July 14, 1997, LEWINSKY returned from Bulgaria, the last leg of her European trip. LEWINSKY was awakened at 7: 30 p. m. by a telephone call from CURRIE. CURRIE advised that CLINTON was out golfing, but he wanted to see or call LEWINSKY later. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON assumed she was back from Europe because he was. LEWINSKY advised she travelled with Secretary of Defense WILLIAM COHEN's group, but does not think CLINTON kept track of those types of details. - -_

At approximately 8: 30 p. m., CURRIE called LEWINSKY again and asked If LEWINSKY could come to the White House at aoproximately 9: 30 p. m. so CLINTON could see LEWINSKY. CURRIE cleared LEWINSKY into the White House and the two spoke for a few minutes.

1416

OIC- 3CQa tR: v. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuanon of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .j,, 07/ 29/ 98 .b 10 CLINTON then came out of the Oval Office and took LEWINSKY into NANCY HERNREICH's office. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON was very cold and distant at this meeting. CLINTON sat on a chair in HERNREICH's office while LEWINSKY sat on a sofa.

CLINTON asked LEWINSKY if the woman she mentioned on July 4th was LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY responded that it was. CLINTON said that there was a paper called the "Sludge Report" that mentioned KATHLEEN WILLEY. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY if LEWINSKY had told TRIPP that WILLEY had called HERNREICH.

LEWINSKY advised that at this point, she was not sure how to answer. LEWINSKY advised she had to watch her lie because she was not sure what CLINTON's reaction would be to the truth. LEWINSKY advised that the problem was that WILLEY called HERNREICH and was upset that ISIKOFF knew about WILLEY's previous call to HERNREICH. CLINTON said the only people who knew about WILLEY's first call to HERNREICH were WILLEY, HERNREICH, CLINTON and LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY told CLINTON she (LEWINSKY) must have told TRIPP.

LEWINSKY did not want to think that TRIPP told ISIKOFF about the WILLEY telephone call. LEWINSKY told CLINTON that TRIPP was a big supporter of his and that she had big pictures of CLINTON in her office. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY if she trusted TRIPP. LEWINSKY said she did. CLINTON also asked LEWINSKY if LEWINSKY confided in TRIPP about CLINTON's relationship with LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY said she had not.

CLINTON told LEWINSKY to tell TRIPP to try to get in touch with LINDSEY again. LEWINSKY would not characterize CLINTON as "emphatic" in this request. LEWINSKY advised the interviewers if LINDSEY made the initial contact with TRIPP, there might be records reflecting that contact. CLINTON told LEWINSKY to call CURRIE the next day to see whether or not LEWINSKY was successful in getting TRIPP to contact LINDSEY. LEWINSKY did not consider TRIPP's knowledge about the WILLEY incident to be that significant because TRIPP had no first hand knowledge about what occured between CLINTON and WILLEY. LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON left her in HERNREICH's office so he could take a conference call with his attorneys. CLINTON returned from his conference call. LEWINSKY advised she spent approximately twenty- five minutes total with CLINTON during this visit. LEWINSKY advised she did not leave the White House until approximately 11: 30 p. m. LEWINSKY and CLINTON spent approximately 25 minutes together on this occasion.

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- M)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 29/ 98 ,Page 11 . LEWINSKY thought it was safe for TRIPP to call LINDSEY. LEWINSKY felt it would look more sinister for LINDSEY to call

TRIPP. LEWINSKY was under the impression that WILLEY was not part of the PAULA JONES suit.

LEWINSKY felt bad that she had told TRIPP about the WILLEY call. LEWINSKY felt responsible and felt she wanted to please the President so she was willing to contact TRIPP. CLINTON did not mention TRIPP getting in touch with BOB BENNETT during this call.

The following day, on July 15th, LEWINSKY tried to get information from TRIPP, including the names of the different people at the White House whom TRIPP had spoken to. LEWINSKY knew TRIPP spoke to an IRENE Last Name Unknown (LNU) and a KATE LNU, both of whom worked at the White House. LEWINSKY telephoned CURRIE later that day to let CURRIE know that LEWINSKY had information for CLINTON.

CLINTON called LEWINSKY later that night. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON was in a "shitty" mood. LEWINSKY went through the information she had for CLINTON regarding WILLEY and TRIPP. LEWINSKY advised she and CLINTON did not speak for long as CLINTON was in a bad mood.

LEWINSKY advised that at some point which LEWINSKY believes was after July 24th, she convinced TRIPP to call LINDSEY. In a Thursday evening telephone conversation, TRIPP told LEWINSKY that TRIPP was ready to meet with BOB BENNETT, as suggested to TRIPP by BRUCE LINDSEY. TRIPP said she made the arrangements for noon the following day. TRIPP told LEWINSKY she was nervous.

TRIPP was concerned that her hair did not look right, so she tried to make an appointment at ILEO. This not being successful, TRIPP made one at a salon named "3300 M Street." LEWINSKY paid for TRIPP's haircut. TRIPP was afraid BENNETT was going to say something mean to her, so she moved the appointment with BENNETT back to 3: 30 p. m.

TRIPP told LEWINSKY that, before seeing BENNETT, TRIPP thought she should see TRIPP's attorney, KIRBY BEHRE. TRIPP -.- -

advised that BEHRE forbade her to see BENNETT, so she did not. LEWINSKY thinks she called CURRIE to tell her about TRIPP, but LEWINSKY did not contact CLINTON directly.

1418

Or- jota (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Conrimation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .OII 07/ 29/ 98 .Pqe 12

LEWINSKY advised that she thought TRIPP was naive to talk to ISIKOFF and that it could be bad for her career. LEWINSKY thought LINDSEY would curb what TRIPP said to ISIKOFF, after LINDSEY spoke to TRIPP. LEWINSKY advised that when TRIPP first mentioned ISIKOFF, TRIPP was upset. TRIPP was friendly with WILLEY and even helped her draft letters to the President. TRIPP said there was always a possibility WILLEY made her story UP- LEWINSKY thought TRIPP was on the "rightt' team.

When the Newsweek article was released, TRIPP was on vacation. LEWINSKY advised that the quote from TRIPP in the Newsweek article was more than TRIPP had told LEWINSKY.

After the Newsweek article that included BENNETT "slamming" TRIPP, TRIPP said she would write a "tell- all" book if she was fired. LEWINSKY said it was silly. LEWINSKY did not think BENNETT's comments were too bad. LEWINSKY advised TRIPP "scared the shit" book.

out of LEWINSKY when TRIPP mentioned writing a Prior to August llth, LEWINSKY anonymously called BEHRE and said that TRIPP had been misquoted. LEWINSKY asked if BEHRE was going to release a statement on TRIPP's behalf, responding to the BENNETT quote. LEWINSKY suggested BEHRE call the White House. LEWINSKY thought this would help TRIPP keep her job.

On August 14th, the Washington Times had an article about BEHRE's statement on TRIPP's behalf. Throughout 1997, TRIPP mentioned being deposed in the JONES case. TRIPP said that BEHRE said she would not have to be deposed.

Sometime after August of 1997, TRIPP mentioned something about her attorney being in touch with JONES's attorneys. LEWINSKY advised she does not have a vivid memory, but TRIPP would bring up the JONES case from time to time.

LEWINSKY spoke about her friendship with TRIPP to NEYSA ERBLAND and KATHRYN ALLDAY DAVIS. LEWINSKY's mother did not know much about LEWINSKY's relationship with TRIPP. LEWINSKY tried to stay away from the WILLEY/ JONES issue when speaking with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY advised that she did not have much contact _ --

with TRIPP in mid- to late November since LEWINSKY and TRIPP were fighting and LEWINSKY had been out of the country during part of this time.

Sometime in the second or third week of December, TRIPP

1419

OlC-_? X! a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Comnuadon of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 ,Page 13

mentioned that she was subpoenaed in the JONES case. TRIPP did not mention when she received the subpoena. This was the first time TRIPP said she would 'Irat" on LEWINSKY. From this point on, LEWINSKY became more circumspect when dealing with TRIPP.

LEWINSKY advised that, during a conversation with TRIPP in December, TRIPP said that one of the reasons for TRIPP telling the truth about LEWINSKY was that BEHRE would know TRIPP was lying. LEWINSKY asked TRIPP how BEHRE would know she was lying. TRIPP advised that she had written the whole story about LEWINSKY and WILLEY and given it to BEHRE in a sealed envelope, and told BEHRE not to read it unless something happened to TRIPP.. LEWINSKY advised LEWINSKY went "ape shit" when she heard this.

LEWINSKY advised she tried to protect TRIPP from getting deposed to protect LEWINSKY, which, in turn, protected CLINTON.

TRIPP's deposition was scheduled for December 18th, but was postponed because WILLEY was having back surgery.

LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON told LEWINSKY she was on the JONES witness list in a telephone conversation on December 17th. LEWINSKY advised she was in New York the previous day for .job interviews. LEWINSKY was subpoenaed on December 19, 1997.

"TALKING POINTS" LEWINSKY advised that, in late December 1997, she was

trying to figure things out regarding TRIPP's deposition. LEWINSKY did not return TRIPP's calls. On January 1, 1998, LEWINSKY left a message on TRIPP's answering machine. LEWINSKY advised she was at an impasse as to what to do. LEWINSKY was shocked that TRIPP would reveal LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised it made no sense to her for anyone to make the leap from PAULA JONES to LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY thinks TRIPP was jealous about LEWINSKY's job opportunities in New York. TRIPP wanted LEWINSKY to get a good job, but she was also jealous of LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised that the main reason she looked for -aa job in New York was because TRIPP said that "KATE at NSC" said LEWINSKY would never get a job in the White House, and if she did, she certainly would not have a blue pass. LEWINSKY advised she separately told CLINTON and KEN BACON she wanted to move to New York because of her mother moving there. LEWINSKY advised

1420

OIC- 302a t& r. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation af OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 29/ 98 ,Page 14 zhat "KATE at NSC" told TRIPP that jobs were created at the White House six days a week. LEWINSKY mentioned STEVEN GOODIN's girlfriend got a job at the White House. LEWINSKY advised TRIPP told LEWINSKY this in an October 6, 1997 telephone call.

On January 9, 1998, LEWINSKY called TRIPP from New York. LEWINSKY was wary of TRIPP, so she said she was calling from a pay phone, but she was actually calling from her mother's apartment. TRIPP said that NORMA ASNES said TRIPP should get a job in public relations in New York. TRIPP told LEWINSKY that TRIPP's Indian friend goes to a psychic and asked the psychic about her friends. The psychic said a friend of her's, whom TRIPP interpreted to be TRIPP, was in imminent danger about what she would say.

During this conversation, TRIPP asked LEWINSKY if LEWINSKY had spoken to CURRIE, JORDAN or CLINTON. LEWINSKY told TRIPP she had not spoken with them from mid- December forward. LEWINSKY told TRIPP she did not care about not speaking with them. TRIPP asked what LEWINSKY was going to do about her deposition. LEWINSKY mentioned her affidavit. TRIPP told XWINSKY to get a job before LEWINSKY signed it. LEWINSKY did not let TRIPP know that she had already signed the affidavit.

LEWINSKY explained that TRIPP did not like LEWINSKY to exhibit independence. LEWINSKY advised that on November 22, 1997, LEWINSKY wanted to phone CURRIE to apologize, but TRIPP did not want her to. TRIPP and LEWINSKY got into fight over this issue.

LEWINSKY did not want TRIPP to know about all the help LEWINSKY got from VERNON JORDAN. On January 13th or 14th,

’ LEWINSKY called TRIPP at work. During this conversation, TRIPP said that BEHRE did not want TRIPP to sign an affidavit and would not let her commit perjury. LEWINSKY told TRIPP to call ASNES,

who could recommend a good "Democratic" attorney. LEWINSKY told TRIPP that the purpose of the affidavit was to avoid being deposed. LEWINSKY advised that one does this by giving a portion of the whole story, so the attorneys do not think you have anything of relevance to their case. LEWINSKY advised she and TRIPP went through the different things to say in- an affidavit. LEWINSKY went through the WILLEY story with TRIPP, including who saw it, that the story could be false, and that WILLEY could have smeared her own lipstick and untucked her own blouse.

1421

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 ,figC 15 LEWINSKY agreed to meet TRIPP on January 13, 1998, because she felt TRIPP had changed her mind about disclosing LEWINSKY's relationship.

On January 14, 1998, LEWINSKY was supposed to take TRIPP to see BEHRE, but the plans changed and LEWINSKY drove TRIPP to TRIPP's car, which was parked at a Metro station. Prior to meeting TRIPP, LEWINSKY sat down at her computer on January 14th and typed out the "Talking Points" in one sitting. LEWINSKY typed the "Talking Points" the same day she gave them to TRIPP.

LEWINSKY advised page. one of the "Talking Points" begins with "you are not sure...." LEWINSKY advised these were to be TRIPP's talking points for her meeting with BEHRE. The last part of page one was in reference to TRIPP providing BEHRE a written account of the WILLEY and LEWINSKY matters.

Page two of the "Talking Points" was written out because LEWINSKY thought she would only have a few minutes with TRIPP, so she wanted to have an outline of points for TRIPP to make in an affidavit.

LEWINSKY advised the "Talking Points" were a combination of things TRIPP said to LEWINSKY and TRIPP's public statements. Page two of the "Talking Points" was based on what was in LEWINSKY's affidavit.

Page three of the "Talking Points" was what TRIPP could give to BEHRE for BEHRE to draft an affidavit. LEWINSKY advised she printed the "Talking Points" on her printer in her apartment. LEWINSKY advised she did not save the "Talking Points. t' LEWINSKY advised she did not save them on her computer for a reason. LEWINSKY was trying to be circumspect about JONES related matters at that point. LEWINSKY thought the JONES' attorneys had tapped her phones. LEWINSKY thought at one point that DEBBIE SCHIFF had given JONES' attorneys LEWINSKY's name so SCHIFF would not have to testify.

LEWINSKY advised the goal of an affidavit is to be as benign as possible, so as to avoid being deposed.

LEWINSKY advised that, looking back, one can see how - -_

TRIPP's various public statements about the WILLEY incident are used throughout the "Talking Points." LEWINSKY advised she did not refer to TRIPP's public statements to draft the "Talking Points."

1422

OIC- 3Ma (Rev. 8- W- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 29/ 98 ,page 16 LEWINSKY advised that TRIPP read the "Talking Points" when LEWINSKY gave them to her. TRIPP was thankful to LEWINSKY for them. LEWINSKY advised the "Talking Points" were not a collaborative effort with TRIPP. LEWINSKY typed them up on her own, with no assistance from anyone.

EVIDENCE LEWINSKY was shown a copy of the Federal Bureau of Investigation's (FBI's) inventory of items taken from her apartment during a consensual search on January 22, 1998. LEWINSKY advised that a note found in her apartment referring to LEWINSKY going to the White House was written on October 11, 1997. LEWINSKY explained to her aunt that LEWINSKY was to meet LEWINSKY's brother in New York, and LEWINSKY would be taking a plane there after going to the White House in the morning.

TIPPER GORE's book has a photograph of CLINTGN wearing a tie LEWINSKY gave him. LEWINSKY's father may have purchased the book for her.

LEWINSKY has never been on Air Force One. The "Saxophone Clubt' is an offshoot of the Democratic National Committee. LEWINSKY advised that people who donate less than $200 can belong. LEWINSKY was a member.

LEWINSKY advised she attended a cocktail party which was held in New York prior to CLINTON's fiftieth birthday celebration. LEWINSKY purchased a $250 ticket, but when LEWINSKY got to the door, she did not have a reservation. LEWINSKY got assistance from JENNIFER SCULLY, whom LEWINSKY met through WALTER KAYE. LEWINSKY, who was wearing a red dress, saw CLINTON on the rope line and he hugged her and- said he liked her dress.

CLINTON gave LEWINSKY the "BLACK DOG" coffee mug. CLINTON gave LEWINSKY an ANNIE LENNOX compact disc. LEWINSKY bought the book "Presidential Sex" because her relationship with CLINTON. of

LEWINSKY sent a letter to CLINTON, similar to the one referencing the "New Deal" found in her apartment on January 22, 1998.

The American Express bill of WILLIAM ARBAUGH was sent

1423

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 29/ 98 .Pagc 17 to LEWINSKY by mistake.

The $10,000 credit card payment LEWINSKY's mother made had nothing to do with LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY had a spiral notebook in which she documented the early part of her relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised the notebook was there on January 22, 1998, but not taken during the search. LEWINSKY saw the notebook after the search, but is not sure where it is now.

The notebook is not dated. The first ten pages relate to her relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she did not keep a diary.

The blue dress LEWINSKY presented to the OIC was- the same one she wore during her tlBirthday" picture with CLINTON. LEWINSKY also wore the dress on February 28, 1997, the first time her sexual contact with CLINTON resulted in him ejaculating in her presence. After engaging in sexual contact with CLINTON, LEWINSKY went to MCCORMICK & SCHMICK'S restaurant and then took the dress off when she got home.

The next time LEWINSKY went to wear the dress, she noticed some faint tiny dots, which could be stains of CLINTON's semen, which could have gotten on the dress while LEWINSKY and CLINTON were hugging. LEWINSKY thought it was funny, so she put it back in the closet.

LEWINSKY showed the dress to TRIPP, who advised LEWINSKY to place the dress in a zip- lock bag and put it in a safe deposit box. LEWINSKY did not save the dress as a l'trophy. tl LBWINSKY said she planned to get the dress cleaned before she wore it again.

That Thanksgiving, LEWINSKY told TRIPP she was going to wear the dress. TRIPP told her not to. TRIPP said LEWINSKY looked fat in the dress.

Sometime after LEWINSKY was subpoenaed on December 19th, she moved the dress to her mother's apartment in New York_,. with the audio cassette tapes containing CLINTON's answering -

machine messages to LEWINSKY. CLINTON gave LEWINSKY the "Vancouver bear" on December 28, 1997. CLINTON told LEWINSKY the bear represented strength, and LEWINSKY would have to be strong. LEWINSKY associated that

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

1424

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Contimration of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 29/ 98 ,page _I..&

comment with her July 4th conversation with CLINTON. LEWINSKY

advised there was never a question'she was going to deny her relationship with CLINTON, so she did not associate the bear with that.

The interview ended at 7: 41 p. m.

1425

Tab 20

1426

1427 OK- 302 (Rev. b19- 94)

- l-

OFFICE OF TEE ISDEPENDEhT COUNSEL

Dare offnnscription 08/ 02/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH, and AIC JULIE MYERS. Representing LEWINSKY were attorneys SYDNEY HOFFNAN and PRESTON BURTON of the law offices of PLATO CACHERIS. AIC WIRTH was not present for the late morning and early afternoon portions of the interview. The interview was conducted in Room 616 of the WATERGATE HOTEL, commencing at 9: 40 a. m. and ending at 6: 15 p. m. LEWINSKY, a white female, born July 23, 1973, provided the following information:

After the scandal broke and the "talking points" were discussed in the media, LINDA TRIPP in the LEWINSKY realized that the quotes made by

Newsweek article on August 11, 1997, and in the article in the -aton Times on August 14, 1997, included concepts that LEWINSKY and TRIPP had discussed. These concepts helped influence the contents of the talking points, which were written by LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY recognized that the above 'mentioned public statements by LINDA TRIPP closely resembled the -...,- talking points. These ideas of TRIPP, that were publicly

espoused, pointed to the likelihood that KATHLEEN WILLEY's story was more untrue than factual. these articles. TRIPP made varying statements in

During the meeting between LEWINSKY and the President on December 28, of,

1997, the President said something to the effect

. "That woman from the summer got you into this. ll By this, LEWINSKY understood that the President meant LINDA TRIPP, who had

been quoted in the above articles. On this occasion, a member of the U- S :Secret Service (USSS) could have observed the President hugging LEWINSKY through the glass, but LEWINSKY is not sure. .

LEWINSKY has not heard any of the tapes that TRIPP made of their conversations.

LEWINSKY provided a copy of a two- sided set of calendars for the years 1993, Diary, FiloFax." 1994 and 1995 entitled, "1994

Certain dates are circled on each calendar. On the 1995 portion of the calendar, LEWINSKY circled the dates _ _-

- ._ hvetiptionon 07/ 30/ 98 aWASHINGTON, D. C. File I 29D OIC LR 35063

08/ 02/ 98

1428

29D OIC LR 35063

c- of OIC- 3u2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .k 2 relating to encounters with ANDY BLEILER.

LEWINSKY said that in March 1998, the _ matter had arisen, and since she was very sensitive about it, LEWINSKY did not wish to discuss- at this time.

LEWINSKY had created a matrix by spreadsheet in the Fall of I997 on the Excel program of her'computer at the Pentagon, at the request of LINDA TRIPP. This was created on her work computer when her boss, KEN BACON, was out of town. The matrix consisted of the dates of events, telephone calls, and personal meetings with the President. No names or identifying data were typed on the matrix. LEWINSKY made one, or possibly two copies, but did not save the matrix on her computer.

LEWINSKY showed or read one copy to TRIPP and believes that she destroyed any other copy.

TRIPP in November 1996, LEWINSKY had first begun confiding in at which time TRIPP urged LEWINSKY to go

back to the White House to work. TRIPP advised LEWINSKY that she was the kind of woman the President would like and an affair with the President would be a neat thing to tell her grandkids. TRIPP kept hounding LEWINSKY until LEWINSKY finally said, "Look, I've already had an affair with him and it's over."

The President called LEWINSKY between 12: 00 p. m. and

2: 00 p. m. on January 7, 1996, which was during the snowstorm. He asked LEWINSKY to go to her office in the White House, where he again called her. While chatting, LEWINSKY asked if the President wanted some company, did. and the President replied that he

Plans were made that LEWINSKY would go to the Oval Office and the door would be left open.

Upon arriving between 3: 00 p. m. and 5: 00 p. m.,

LEWINSICY, who was carrying some papers, saw uniformed USSS Officer LEWIS FOX standing in front of the Oval Office. FOX was probably standing with a USSS plain clothes agent. there when LEWINSKY departed. FOX was, not

At some point LEWINSKY gave. a box of LADY GODIVA chocolates to FOX.

An unidentified USSS plain clothes agent, who usually worked on Sunday afternoons, was present on two different occasions when LEWINSKY was with the President. LEWINSKY met the President by the elevators once and was escorted to the Oval Office. 1::: -.

On another occasion the plain clothes agent was present when the President was joking about LEWINSKY's footwear that she had worn because of the snow. The President said, "Chelsea has some like that." This plain clothes agent, whose name LEWINSKY did not know, was a tall, hefty, attractive, white male with

1429

OK- 3u2a CItev. 8- 1p- w)

29D OIC LR 35063

colrdimafion of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 ,~ gc 3 light hair. One of these occasions was either January 21, 1996 or February 4, 1996.

A USSS officer named SANDY observed LEWINSKY with the President on December 31, 1995, when they were discussing cigars. SANDY was standing to the left of LEWINSKY, facing the door in the hallway. This was a visit with the President lasting about 20 or 25 minutes. LEWINSKY may have sent a birthday card to SANDY on a later date. SANDY was not further identified.

LEWINSKY was never refused entrance into the President's movie theater by a USSS officer. BAYANI NELYIS had once asked LEWINSKY if she had ever watched a movie with the President, and LEWINSKY responded that she had not, and as a matter of fact had never been in the theater.

On February 19, 1996, LEWINSKY went to the Oval Office without actually being invited; however, this was after talking to the President on the telephone. At this time there. was a very tall, thin, plain clothes agent, with a mustache and an olive complexion, on duty. This plain clothes agent let LEWINSKY into the Oval Office between 12: 00 p. m. and 2: 00 p. m. This was the only time that LEWINSKY ever went to the Oval Office without the President expecting her.

The only time that LEWINSKY ever waited in the ROOSEVELT room was on July 24, 1997, and that was because BETTY CURRIE had her wait there. There were two ladies rooms in the West Wing, one being near LEON PANETTA's office and one past the Oval Office. LEWINSKY used the one near the Oval Office during the furlough. Subsequently, an E- mail came out from ANNE CATALINI that the employees of Legislative Affairs could not go by the &al Office. There were three ways to go to the other remote offices of Legislative Affairs; one was down the stairs; one was through the West Wing lobby; and the third was past the Oval Office. EVELYN LIEBERMAN advised LEWINSKY to go through the lobby and not by the Oval Office.

Although LEWINSKY does recall a USSS plain clothes agent named GARY, Last Name Unknown( LNU), she does not recall that he ever asked LEWINSKY to leave the pantry or any other location. GARY may have said something like, "What are you up 1 to?, ” but he never asked her to leave.

LEWINSKY knew a USSS plain clothes supervisor named BRYANT, who was friendly toward her, but LEWINSKY never discussed her relationship with the President with BRYANT. BRYANT could

1430

OIC- 3oa (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

cornimafioxl of OKxm of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .Pqe 4 .

have escorted LEWINSKY to parties, but she has no memory of this. LEWINSKY saw a USSS plain clothes agent named LOU MERLETTI several times, but had more of an acquaintance than a friendship with him. MBRLETTI gave LEWINSKY his business card. LEWINSKY teased MBRLETTI about being in so many photos with the President and sometimes joked with him in the hallways. LEWINSKY saw MERLETTI at the "Nutcracker" in December, 1996. MERLETTI was very friendly with LEWINSKY and she sent him a letter once. MERLETTI never saw LEWINSKY with the President to her knowledge. LEWINSKY also sent a gift to MBRLETTI after she left the White House.

LEWINSKY has only a vague recollection of USSS plain clothes agent LARRY COCKELL, possibly having seen him on December 28, 1997.

On December 6, 1997, LEWINSKY went to the southwest gate and paged BETTY CURRIE to get'in. While waiting, MARSHA SCOTT pulled up in her car, causing LEWINSKY to go to the northwest gate, which was under construction. When LEWINSKY arrived there, she called CURRIE, but there was no answer on CURRIE's phone. Two uniformed USSS officers, names unknown, were on duty. LEWINSKY had Christmas gifts for CURRIE and the President. Since CURRIE's telephone was not answered, LEWINSKY asked the guards to find out where CURRIE was and whether the President was in his office. One of the guards told LEWINSKY that CURRIE was giving a tour to ELEANOR MONDALE and confirmed that the President was in the Oval Office.

While at the northwest gate, LEWINSKY mistook LANNIE DAVIS for JOHN PODESTA, and after this misidentification was clarified, CURRIE. DAVIS was advised that LEWINSKY was waiting for BETTY President CURRIE had told LEWINSKY earlier in the day that the

would be meeting with his lawyers on December 6'" and that the President probably would not be able to meet with LEWINSKY. After finding out about MONDALE, LEWINSKY did not feel that CURRIE was truthful with her that day. LEWINSKY left the gate crying and very angry.

LEWINSKY called CURRIE from the CORCORAN GALLERY and confronted her about MONDALE visiting. CURRIE became angry also: and apparently shouted at the guards for divulging that MONDALE was visiting the President. LEWINSKY assumed this, because CURRIE told LEWINSKY that LEWINSKY had gotten the guards in trouble. Later, when LEWINSKY talked to the President about this, the President asked LEWINSKY, "Do you think I'm stupid

1431

OIC- 3ma (Rev. s- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063 colxiruatin of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .page 5

enough to go running with someone I'm messing around with?" The President also said that it was none of LEWINSKY's business what MONDALE was doing there; and that LEWINSKY should not be angry with CURRIE. LEWINSKY does not recall a discussion with the President about the guards at the northwest gate.

Later in the day, LEWINSKY bought traveled to New York. an airline ticket and

AIC WIRTH departed at this time and Deputy Independent Counsel (DIG) WISENBERG arrived.

LEWINSKY said that she had seen SARAH FARNSWORrl'H at the Watergate Apartments recently, but that she did not speak to FARNSWORTH, as they did not like each other.

LEWINSKY stated that she did not wish to discuss the description of anyone's genitalia, but that she disagrees with the description given by PAULA JONES.

LEWINSKY had her first sexual contact with the President on November 15, 1995. After earlier seeing the President at JENNIFER PALMIERI's party, LEWINSKY was walking to the ladies room near the Oval Office about 8: 00 p. m. Upon passing the office of GEORGE STEPHANOPOLOUS, LEWINSKY saw a USSS plain clothes agent outside the door and the President inside the office. The President motioned her into STEPHANOPOLOUS's office. There had been flirtation and eye contact between the President and LEWINSKY on other occasions. LEWINSKY wore G- string panties to the earlier party and pulled her jacket up so that the President could see them at the party. No one else observed this.

LEWINSKY, after entering STEPHANOPOLOUS's office, told the President that she had a crush on him. The President asked if LEWINSKY would like to see his back office and she responded affirmatively. Upon arriving there, the President and LEWINSKY began hugging and the President asked if he could kiss LEWINSKY. With her consent the President kissed her with open mouth in a very romantic way. LEWINSKY gave the President a piece of paper with her name and telephone number on it. The President asked if LEWINSKY wanted to meet him back in his office in about ten minutes and LEWINSKY agreed. LEWINSKY returned to PANETTA's -:!- outer office, where she had been working. MARTHA FOLEY may have _

been working and FOLEY may have given LEWINSKY a ride home that night.

LEWINSKY recalled that she was wearing navy blue pants

1432

OIC- 3uza (Rev. 8- m- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

cominua~ n of OIC- 3uz of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .m 6 and a dark navy jacket that night. Sometime after 8: 00 p. m., and before 1O: OO p. m., LEWINSKY returned to the Oval Office and the President took her to the hallway by the back study behind the Oval Office. The lights were off. The President began kissing LEWINSKY and she unbuttoned her jacket. The President pulled her bra up (he only unhooked her bra once in subsequent sexual contacts) and put his hand down into her pants. The President received a telephone call from a Congressman or Senator. While talking on the telephone, the President kept his hand in LEWINSKY's pants to stimulate her, thereby causing her to have an orgasm or two. LEWINSKY then performed oral sex on the President, but he told LEWINSKY to stop before he reached completion. The President said that it was too soon for him to do that, inasmuch as he did not know or trust LEWINSKY well enough. The President tugged on her pink intern pass and said that "this" was going to be a problem.

The President did not know that LEWINSKY had already accepted a paying position that would entitle her to an employee pass. LEWINSKY told the President that she had had an affair with a married man before and that she knew the rules. By this statement LEWINSKY was trying to make the President feel more comfortable. She was sending a signal that she could keep quiet and lie if necessary. LEWINSKY was on "cloud nine." No further plans were made at that time and the President went upstairs to have dinner with Mrs. CLINTON. LEWINSKY speculated that the President's regular girlfriend had been furloughed.

On this or some other occasion the President said that he did not want to get addicted to having sex with LEWINSKY or he would want her all of the time. LEWINSKY and the President had incredible chemistry and were sexually compatible.

On Friday November 17, 1995 pizza was ordered. LEWINSKY picked up the pizza and delivered it to PANETTA's office. LEWINSKY went to CURRIE'S office to announce that the pizza had arrived. GENE SPERLING, GEORGE STEPHANOPOLOUS, and perhaps others were there. LEWINSKY returned to her office. A short time later, the President, CURRIE, and BERNREICH came to PANETTA's outer office. BARRY TOIV bumped into LEWINSKY and got pizza on her outfit. LEWINSKY went to the restroom to clean it off. _ _I _

The President was standing outside of CURRIE's office when LEWINSKY came out of the restroom. The President invited LEWINSKY over to the Oval Office and they went to the rear study. The door to the Oval Office was left ajar. LEWINSKY asked the

1433

OIC- 302r (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Continudon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 07/ 30/ 98 ,w 7 President if he remembered her name. LBWINSKY advised the President that she had gotten a permanent job in Legislative Affairs. This would allow her to get a blue pass. The President was pleased. The President and LEWINSKY were talking about Jewish things near the bathroom when the President said, "Shut up and kiss me.." LEWINSKY said that she had better get back to work before people began to wonder where she was. The President asked LEWINSKY to bring him some pizza. LEWINSKY returned to PANETTA's office.

LEWINSKY returned to BETTY CURRIE's office after a little while and BETTY announced, "Girl here with the piyza." BETTY sent LEWINSKY into the Oval Office. The President. took the pizza and the two of them went to the bathroom area off the Oval Office.

The President was wearing a light blue shirt and a red tie. The President loosened his tie. They began kissing and the President attempted to unbutton LEWINSKY's jacket. He could not, so she did it. The President kissed LEWINSKY's breasts. When LBWINSKY unbuttoned the President's blue shirt, the President sucked in his stomach, and LEWINSKY kissed his chest. LEWINSKY assured the President that she thought his physical shape was cute.

At some point, BETTY CURRIE came near the Oval Office door and said, "Sir, phone call." The President took the call in the bathroom from a Congressman, who the President called by some "funny," unrecalled nickname. While the President was on the telephone, LEWINSKY performed oral sex on him. The President did not ask LEWINSKY to quit during the phone call, but did not ejaculate. The President never told LEWINSKY that there was no sex between them if he did not ejaculate, but she believed that not reaching completion somehow made the President feel less guilty.

The President said, "I'm usually around on weekends when no one else is around, and you can come and see me." The President complimented LEWINSKY's smile, prettiness, and energy. The President did not tell LEWINSKY how to get access to the Oval Office. __. _

LEWINSKY returned to her office, and a short time later the President returned with his pizza and ate it in front of everyone. The President's tie was back up and he was wearing a distinct cologne.

1434 . .

29D OIC LR 35063

-._- coatinuuion of 01c- 3u2 of \ MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 30/ 98 .bc 8 On December 5, 1995, which was the day of the congressional Christmas Ball, the President signed the photograph of himself wearing the tie that LEWINSKY had given to him. He asked LEWINSKY if she wanted a diet Coke. carried one out of the office. for cover. LEWINSKY usually

On December 31, 1995, at about noon, LEWINSKY was in the dining room talking to BAYANI NELVIS; a White House steward, about LEWINSKY recently having smoked her first cigar. NELVIS offered to get LEWINSKY a Presidential cigar and they headed to the President's back study. The President met NELVIS and

LEWINSKY in the back hallway and said that he needed to get something to LEON PANBTTA. The. President gave the item to NELVIS to take to PANETTA. The President said that he had been looking for LEWINSKY, to which LEWINSKY replied that she had given him her number. LEWINSKY thought it was obvious that the President had forgotten her name because he 'saw LEWINSKY one time in the hallway and said, "Hey kiddo." The President asked why LEWINSM was there in the back office and LEWINSKY replied that NBLVIS was going to get her a Presidential cigar. The President said that he would give LEWINSKY a cigar and they went back into the study. They hugged and kissed. LEWINSKY rubbed his back. The President lifted her top and kissed her chest. LEWINSKY performed oral sex - on the President, but he stopped her before completion. LEWINSKY

went to leave. The President apparently thought that LEWINSKY had already left and went into the bathroom, where LEWINSKY could hear water running. and getting LEWINSKY was putting her lipstick back on

he hen she observed the President in The President was leaving for the Renaissance weekend in a helicopter soon thereafter. .

LEWINSKY believes that KATHLEEN WILLEY is not telling the truth, because the President would not have let her leave without getting herself together.

On January 7, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY for the first time at her apartment. blizzard. It was the first day of a

LEWINSKY was surprised when she answered the phone and realized that she was speaking to the President. asked LEWINSKY if she was going to the office. The President:, ': ;;

LBWINSKY asked the President if he wanted some company and the President replied that he did. The President said he was going to the office in about 45 minutes and LEWINSKY said she would be there in about an hour. LEWINSKY went to her office and the President called her

OIC- xm (Ilc*. ~1P9))

1435

290 OIC LR 35063

~OfOIC- 3UZOf MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .~ p 9 there. LEWINSKY went to the Oval Office and they sat on the sofa and talked. After about ten minutes they went to the bathroom area in the back office. The President had wanted to perform oral sex on LEWINSKY, but she did not want him to because she was having her menstrual period. The President and LEWINSKY had foreplay, but the President stayed above her waist. LEWINSKY performed oral sex on the President, but he did not reach completion. The President and LEWINSKY usually kept their clothing on so that they could recover quickly if interrupted. They went to the Oval Office, where the President sat at his desk and LEWINSKY sat on the sofa. They both knew what the cover- up would be to conceal their relationship. They talked and. joked around for about 15 minutes before LEWINSKY left. LEWINSKY told the President that he could call her; could listen while she did the talking; and could engage in phone sex. The President said "I'll be around on weekends."

On January 16, 1996, at about 12: 30 a. m., the President called LEWINSKY, after having been in Atlanta for MARTIN LUTRER KING day. The President said, "You said that I could call and listen." They had phone sex, with LEWINSKY doing all of the

made LEWINSKY feel insecure. LEWINSKY was worried that the President did not like the way she performed phone sex. In thinking about their relationship, LEWINSKY observed that initially she was volunteering all of the information about their personal lives and that the President did not provide any details unless LEWINSKY asked. The President sometimes told personal things, but usually spoke about general things. LEWINSKY wanted to know'whether they were going to fall in love or whether it would just be a sexual relationship.

On Sunday, January 21, 1996, which was the first day that a soldier had been killed in Bosnia, LEWINSKY saw the President in the hallway near the elevator. The President was accompanied by a USSS plain clothes agent. While talking in the Oval Office, the President said it was very sad to have someone die as a result of one of his Executive Orders. LEWINSKY was feeling like she had been'taken for granted. LEWINSKY wound up: '_‘ _' in the rear hallway with the President. LEWINSKY was having a "bad hair day" and was wearing her beret. This was the first time that the President had seen her with the beret and told LEWINSKY that she was cute in her hat. LEWINSKY dropped her coat on the floor. The President was wearing olive pants and a green sweater

1436

29D OIC LR 35063

%olmmbm of OK- 302 ai . - MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .Pap 10 that did not match. As they were heading to the back hallway, LEWINSKY stopped the President and asked him if he was interested in anything more than sex. The President replied that he "cherished his time" with LEWINSKY and that she was a "gift" to him. LEWINSKY treated the President as a regular person and did not stand on ceremony when LEWINSKY was with him. The President said he liked that. They kissed and the President kissed her chest. LEWINSKY performed oral sex on the President in the hallway and possibly in the bathroom. The BLAIRs from Arkansas were in town visiting with the President.- LEWINSKY went out to BETTY CURRIE's office with the- president and he kissed her goodbye in NANCY BERNREICH's office. LEWINSKY started to leave .through the other door, found it locked, and turned around to exit through the door of KERNREIcH's off entered. LEWINSKY passed the President, G . . The Presid LEWINSKY goodbye again. LEWINSKY departed through BETTY CURRIE's office and the garden door. LEWINSKY purposely departed by a different door than the one that. she had entered, so that the. USSS staff would not know when LEWINSKY came and left. The BLAIRs were going out with the CLINTONs to see the VERMEER exhibit.

LEWINSKY spent the weekend ending January 28th in San Francisco. Upon LEWINSKY's return she saw on her caller 'identification feature that the President had called her office phone while she was in California. On Tuesday, January 30, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY on her office telephone. The display reflected "POTUS." The President said he had seen LEWINSKY getting yogurt and she looked really pretty. The President suggested that they get together after the party for PAT GRIFFIN. LEWINSKY responded that they should ignore each other at the party so that people would not get suspicious. The President asked if he could meet LEWINSKY later and LEWINSKY declined, because they had to be careful. EVELYN LIEBERMAN had already taken notice of LEWINSICY.

On Saturday, February 4, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY and they agreed that she would carry some papers and meet in the hallway. This occurred and they went to the back office. LEWINSKY was wearing a black dress with little flowers and combat boots. The President commented on the combat boots.::: The President unbuttoned LEWINSKY's dress and it hung down. The President pulled up LEWINSKY's bra. The President lifted LEWINSKY'S dress up. At that point, LEWINSKY stated that she could not continue with the details while male staff members were present. After a short consultation with her attorney, LEWINSKY

1437

OIC- 3m @sv. s- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

coxuimiaIion of oic- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .M 11 continued that she had performed oral sex on the President, but that it was not reciprocal oral sex. The President commented on LEWINSKY's state of arousal. When they were finished in the hallway, after about 45 minutes, the President and LEWINSKY went to the Oval Office, where they talked for another 45 minutes; LEWINSKY characterized the talking as "pillow talk." leaving, Upon

the President told LEWINSKY to complete her tasks in another part of the West Wing before returning to her office, so that LEWINSKY would not draw attention by going directly from the Oval Office to her office.

On Februarv 7, 1996. a oartv was held for STEVE FRISCHETTI. That night- the President- called Mrs. CLINTON was out of town. The President telecommunications bill while wearing one of day.

LEWINSKY at home. signed the LEWINSKY's ties that

On Thursday, February 8, 1996, the President called LEwINSKY and at some point during the conversation they engaged in phone sex. On this occasion both the President and LEWINSKY participated verbally in a portion of the phone sex. LEWINSKY said that most of the time she initiated phone sex, but sometimes the President did. During this call, or in a previous call, the President told LEWINSKY that she reminded him of a character, but LEWINSKY could not recall any further description, other than the character had something to do with London.

On Sunday, February 19, 1996, ' the President called LEWINSKY from his office. The President sounded weird and LEWINSKY did not know what to make of it. LEWINSKY went to the

Oval Office uninvited and observed the tall, thin, Hispanic plain clothes agent that she had described earlier in the interview.

. LEWINSKY advised that this was the only time she went to the Oval Office uninvited. LEWINSKY had previously told the President about ANDY BLEILER in Portland. The President said, (II don't want to be like that schmuck in Oregon." The President would only hug LEWINSKY that day, and he explained that he did not feel right about their sexual relationship; that he felt guilty; that LEWINSKY could still come by and visit; but that they would only be friends and not fool around.

President, LEWINSKY advised that during this visit with the he received a telephone call from a person whose last

name began with an "F". This person and his brother had a sugar growing business in Florida. The President took some notes, hung UPI that and told LEWINSKY that he had to cut their meeting short so

he could talk to this gentleman. The President said that he

1438

OIC- 3ma (Rev. 8- 19-! w

29D OIC LR 35063

colltimation of OIC- 3D2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .b 12 was going to sign some legislation that was going to have a detrimental effect on the sugar business, and when he does something that is going to "screw" someone, he likes to tell them first.

On a day at the end of February or early March 1996, the President left a message on LEWINSKY's caller identification feature which indicated that "POTUS" had called. This predicated a discussion about the discovery of their relationship. It was decided that a different telephone would be used by the President when calling LEWINSKY's office, so that the readout would not give them away. This day can be established as the day that a bombing occurred and lives were lost in Israel. The President went to the Israeli Embassy to express his regrets. LEWINSKY observed the President and EVELYN LIEBERMAN in the hallway. The President called LEWINSKY at home at about 1O: OO p. m. from upstairs in the residence. The President and LEWINSKY talked for about 20 minutes. LEWINSKY offered to visit, but the President declined, advising that CHELSEA CLINTON was sick.

On Friday, March 29, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY in her office. LEWINSKY had cut her hand and bruised herself. The President observed the wounds when LEWINSKY was

passing the Map Room in the hallway that evening. The President was wearing the first tie LEWINSKY had given him. The President -spoke to LEWINSKY and said that he was sorry that she had hurt her hand. This occurred in the presence of HAROLD ICKES and BRUCE LINDSEY. During the telephone call, the President offered to invite LEWINSKY to a movie that night if LEWINSKY would hang around in the hall just before the movie started so they could pretend to accidentally run into each other. LEWINSKY declined because staff members such as HERNREICH and STEPHANOPOLOUS would be present in the movie and might question her presence. LEWINSKY did not want people to think that she was hanging around uninvited. JENNIE CRUZANO had previously passed BAYANI NELVIS in the hallway and asked NELVIS why NELVIS was talking to LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY had also heard that EVELYN LIEBERMAN was suspicious of her. LEWINSKY concluded the call by asking whether she could see the President on Sunday.

On Sunday, March .31, 1996, LEWINSKY brought some papers to the Oval Office and entered with a USSS plain clothes agent: ':: who poked his head in the back hallway. LEWINSKY and the agent heard the toilet flush and were a bit embarrassed. The President was ill. The President was wearing blue jeans and a T- shirt. After the plain clothes agent departed,. the President and LEWINSKY fooled around. They touched and kissed in the hallway.

1439

OIC- 3m (Rev. s- lw4)

29D OIC LR 35063

contimation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 ,b 13 They talked about cigars while the President was chewing on one and then the President looked at LEWINSKY sheepishly and she understood what the President was thinking. LEWINSKY allowed the President to insert the cigar into her vagina. The President placed the cigar into his mouth after withdrawing it from LEWINSKY and said, "It tastes good." The President did not smoke the cigar because smoking is forbidden in the White House. There was no oral sex on this visit. LEWINSKY had brought the President a blue HUGO BOSS tie, concealed among the papers that she carried into the Oval Office. LEWINSKY asked the President if he would wear the tie the following Wednesday for the Office of Legislative Affairs' photograph. The President did wear the tie, but the photograph was not taken due to the death of RON BROWN. This visit was in the late afternoon and lasted from 30 to 45 minutes. LEWINSKY exited via the Rose Garden.

On Easter Sunday, April 7, 1996, LEWINSKY visited the President to discuss her transfer to the Pentagon. This was a result of the President calling LEWINSKY between 5: 00 p. m. and 6: 00 p. m. During this call LEWINSKY cried and told the President

f that she had been fired. When LEWINSKY arrived uniformed USSS officer JOHN MUSKETT was there, but LEWINSKY did not recall a plain clothes agent. When LEWINSKY advised MUSKETT that she had some papers for the President, MUSKETT said that he would check with LIEBERMAN about the visit. LEWINSKY quickly said that the President had asked for the papers and that she would only be a minute. LIEBERMAN was not advised to LEWINSKY's knowledge. LEWINSKY went into the back hallway with the President and he said, "I'm sorry they're taking you away-- I trust you." The President said, "After the election I'll have you back like this" and snapped his fingers.

LEWINSKY had started performing oral sex on the President when someone from the Oval Office advised the President that he had a telephone call. The President went out to the Oval Office and then took the telephone call in the back office. LEWINSKY put her bra back on at this point. The call was apparently from DICK MORRIS, although LEWINSKY did not know it then. The call concerned campaign strategy. The President wanted LEWINSKY to continue the oral sex while he was on the phone with MORRIS. LEWINSKY complied; but felt cheap doing this. HAROLD ICKES came to the door of the Oval Office and called, "Mr. President," :.:: -_

at which time the President bolted out of the back study. Office. LEWINSKY departed the back way and not through the Oval

The President called LEWINSKY later and asked why LEWINSKY had left. LEWINSKY replied that ICKES might have walked in. The President asked LEWINSKY to come back the next day to

1440

290 OIC LB 35063

. ~fiOOOfCMC- 302Of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .b_ see NANCY HBRNRBICH about getting a job in the White House. after she

LEWINSKY advised that the phone sex calls continued left her White House job. The President usually called from his residence, or from out of town, and almost always awakened LBWINSKY during the early morning hours. Generally, the President preferred that LBWINSKY do most of the talking during phone sex.

On May 16, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY, but did not want to participate in phone sex. The President felt very badly about Admiral BOORDA committing suicide.

in a sexually explicit manner. LEWINSKY asked, "Aren't you going to wait for me?"

6: 30 a. m. President , convinced

something

On July 19, 1996, the President telephoned LBWINSKY at and had phone sex. Near the end of the call the said "good morning" in such a way that LEWINSICY was that he had climaxed. The President then said like, "What a way to start a day."

On September 5, 1996, the President called from out of _ _ town and LBWINSKY tried to convince him that they should have sex. The President said that he could not have intercourse with LEWINSKY and that there were consequences when you became older. This resulted in a fight on the telephone and the President asked if he should stop calling LEWINSKY. LBWINSKY responded that he should not.

On September 10, 1996, the President called from. out of town and left a message on LEWINSKY's recorder, inasmuch as she was not home.

phone sex. On October 21, 1996, the President called and they had

14 On October 22, 1996, the President called and he and :', '; LEWINSKY had phone sex.. The President seemed to take more control, as he talked more during the sexual portion of the call. The President liked it when LBWINSKY lead the sex talk from the start and began with such questions as, .Where are you?" and. "What are you wearing?" Sometimes the President initiated the

1441

29D OIC LR 35063

colnimatin of OIC- 3u2 of MON: CA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .* 15 phone sex and sometimes LEWINSKY did.

On December 2, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY about 10: 30 p. m., but after a short time the President hung up to take another call. The President called back a few minutes later and they began having phone sex. The President fell asleep .during the call. LEWINSKY had to awaken him. LEWINSKY thought that this was "sweet" that the President would call her when he was so tired.

On February 8, 1997, the President called LEWINSKY and they had phone sex. The President said he wanted LEWINSKY to come by and pick up her hatpin. However, it was snowing. that day and the President remarked that he felt bad asking BETTY CURRIE to come in (to facilitate a LEWINSKY visit). LEWINSKY and the President had phone sex.

On February 28, 1997, BETTY CURRIE called LEWINSKY at work at approximately 4: 00 p. m. to invite LEWINSKY to the President's radio address. LEWINSKY hurried. home to change into a new dress. LEWINSKY attended and took a photograph with the President after the address. STEVE GOODIN, RAHM EMMANUEL, and an unrecalled person were in the Oval Office. CURRIE later related that GOODIN had told her privately that she could not let the President and LEWINSKY be alone. LEWINSKY was nervous about the other visitors seeing her at the address. After the address, LEWINSKY walked to the back office with CURRIE and the President and CURRIE excused herself by going to the dining room and saying, *@ I'll be right back." The President and LEWINSKY went to the study, where he kissed LEWINSKY, unbuttoned her dress, pulled off her bra, and kissed her on the chest. Someone came into the Oval Office, bathroom, causing the President and LEWINSKY to go into the

where the President President, but he tried to stop her before completion. a discussion about the President not ejaculating. They had

_' continued the oral They

sex until the President ejaculated and then they hugged.

LEWINSKY returned to the dining room area and CURRIE, who had been talking to BAYANI NELVIS, walked her out. CURRIE was supposed to have acted as a chaperone after GOODIN counseled her. On this visit LEWINSKY was wearing the dress that she later noticed to be stained. LEWINSKY believes the dress may have been

_-- _- \--.. Y ., 0‘

1442 ____

29D OIC LR 35063

,0- n of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LBWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .~ ye 16 .

stained by the President's semen that day after he ejaculated, but she is not sure. The President gave LBWINSKY a hat pin and a book that day.

On Wednesday, March 12, 1997, the President called LBWINSKY at work and asked LBWINSKY to visit him the next day.

On March 13, 1997, the visit was canceled because the President's schedule was too hectic.

On March 14, 1997, the President called LEWINSKY about the HUGO BOSS tie that LBWINSKY had bought in Georgetown, The President stated that the tie had a big cut in it and that he asked if LEWINSKY could exchange it. and after looking at the damage, LEWINSKY picked up the tie,

was of the opinion that it had been deliberately cut. KATHRYN DAVIS's sister, KELLY DAVIS, was in town that day. KELLY DAVIS knows nothing of the relationship between LEWINSKY and the President.,

On March 29, 1997, the President's brother, ROGER CLINTON, was in town. A meeting was set up between the President and LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY was supposed to bring back the HUGO BOSS tie that day. LEWINSKY went to the White House and waited in the back study. The President hobbled into the room on crutches as a result of injuring his knee in Florida several weeks earlier. .This was one of the few days that the President and LBWINSKY fooled around the entire time in the study. The President was uncomfortable and could not bend over. The President unbuttoned

ve the blouse. orgasms that day. A ray of sunshine was shining directly on LBWINSKY's face while she performed oral sex to completion on the President. The President remarked about LBWINSKY's beauty. The President spent a lot of time talking with LEWINSKY that day.

The President said that he believed that an unnamed foreign Embassy was listening in on the President's official .

telephones so they would have to be careful in their phone conversations. The President came up with the ruse that if LEWINSKY was ever questioned to just say that they were friends, and they were just doing it to give people a run for their money. After their private meeting the President and LEWINSKY went into

1443

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- w)

29D OIC LR 35063

CoMimlation of OK- 202 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .plge 17 BETTY CURRIE's office, where they sang "Try A Little Tenderness." CTJRRIE then walked LEWINSKY to the door. This was the last real sexual contact that LEWINSKY had with the President, other than kissing, hugging, and brief fondling.

On July 4, 1997, the President kissed LEWINSKY on the neck.

On August 16, 1997, LEWINSKY was with the President near the bathroom in the back office and he gave LEWINSKY an open mouth kiss. It was the President's birthday.

On October 10, 1997 the President called in the early morning hours, but got into a big fight with LEWINSKY. There'was no phone sex. This was the longest telephone call from the President.

On November 12, 1997, the President was visited by some friend from Arkansas who had a terminal illness. That night, or early the next morning, the President called LEWINSKY and they had phone sex.

On December 28, 1997, LEWINSKY visited the President in the back office. While standing near the doorway to the study, the President gave LEWINSKY an open mouth Christmas kiss. During the kiss the President was looking out the window to make sure they were not being observed.

LEWINSKY and the President touched tongues while kissing on the day of ZEDILLO's visit. As an example of flirtation between LEWINSKY and the President, during the celebration of the President's 4gth birthday, the President's elbow had grazed the breast of LEWINSKY. On the occasion of the President's 50th birthday, LEWINSKY was wearing a strapless dress and was in front of a rope line where the President was greeting guests. As the President reached over LEWINSKY to make contact with a well wisher, LEWINSKY reached back and touched the President's crotch. No one else was in a position to observe this.

LEWINSKY sent a few raunchy greeting cards and possibly a few raunchy notes/ letters to the President,. Although the I'.: President liked them, he cautioned her to be careful putting things in writing. LEWINSKY assumes that the President tore the cards and letters up and flushed them down the toilet.

Sometimes when the President and LEWINSKY were fooling

1444

29D OIC LR 35063 coruimnt. iollofoIc- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .oo 07/ 30/ 98 .w 18

around, LEWINSKY would wipe off her lipstick before kissing the President. LEWINSKY did not dress inappropriately while working at the White House, but did wear some low- cut clothing while working at the Pentagon.

LEWINSKY dressed well when seeing the President, but did not wear the same outfit every time. LEWINSKY wore her nluckyn green suit twice and the flower dress twice. The President wore boxer shorts on one occasion, blue briefs on another, and grey shorts when the President hurt his leg. During LEWINSKY'S later visits in the back study, the President usually sat in his rocking chair and LEWINSKY sat on the floor below the rocking chair and in between his legs. This arrangement'was very intimate and allowed them to touch each other.

LEWINSKY said that she did not make up the sexual activities detailed above, nor did she embellish them. Most of these incidents can be verified through her "personal diary," LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY confided in TRIPP on almost a daily basis for a long time, but she never suggested that TRIPP keep records or charts of her activities with the President. In February, 1997, TRIPP asked LEWINSKY to go back over the activities so that TRIPP could figure out a pattern to the sexual encounters. TRIPP

detail LEWINSKY back over to the White House; however, this never happened.

In July, August, or September 1997, LEWINSKY invited BETTY CURRIE to have a drink with her at the HAY ADAMS bar. to discuss LEWINSKY's job situation. However, CURRIE and LEWINSKY had coffee, not alcoholic drinks. LEWINSKY had set up the meeting to discuss her job situation. During the conversation, which lasted less than an hour, LEWINSKY reminded CURRIE that REBECCA CAMERON was still dragging her feet in giving LEWINSKY the photograph taken at the President's radio address; that MARSHA SCOTT really had not taken any action to get LEWINSKY back to the_ _

White House; either. and that the President did not seem to be helping

LEWINSKY's approach was, "Hey, I've been a good girl, I went to the Pentagon, and why won't the' President bring me back?" LEWINSKY opined that there was a "turf warn between some of the women at the White House. CURRIE explained that the President

1445

29D OIC LR 35063

-oion of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .<) n 07/ 30/ 98 .b 19 had trouble getting people jobs, because that was done at a lower level and that she would talk to MARSHA SCOTT. CURRIE drove her car to the hotel on this occasion.

In discussing BETTY CURRIE, LEWINSKY remarked that CURRIE sometimes acted naive about what was going on, even though CURRIE had observed LEWINSKY show a lot of emotion about the President. LEWINSKY was very angry with CURRIE on December 6,

ne. _ hat the President would be busy all day with his lawyers. LEWINSKY periodically talked to CURRIE about their mutual friend, WALTER KAYE; who knew that the President was fond of LEWINSKY. CURRIE never complained about coming in on weekends to facilitate LEWINSKY's visits to the President. LEWINSKY cultivated CURRIE as a friend, because CURRIE. was in a good position to help LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY did not tell CURRIE of her exact relationship with the President, and she and the President attempted to be discreet in front of'CURRIE.

On March 29, 1997, CURRIE called from her home to clear LEWINSKY at the White House gate and called from the hospital on October 11, 1997 to do the same. Sometimes, CURRIE conducted private tours on weekends for the President. LEWINSKY knew of no one else at her level that had the degree of access to the President that LEWINSKY did. On "dump day," May 24, 1997, LEWINSKY called CURRIE and advised that LEWINSKY was waiting to see the President. CURRIE said that she had to check Mrs. CLINTON's schedule and said Mrs. pool that day. CLINTON was going to use the

This was the only time that LEWINSKY actually knew that CURRIE had factored in the whereabouts of Mrs. CLINTON with LEWINSKY's visits to the President. Mrs. CLINTON never saw LEWINSKY in the Oval Office.

Fourteen photographs of gifts and momentos were displayed to LEWINSKY, who made the following remarks:

1. Ticket to August Ball. 2. Book entitled, "Our Patriotic President," given to the President by LEWINSKY on December 6, 1997. Purchased at New York flea market for $40.00.

3. Antique book entitled "Presidents of the United States of America;" given to the President by dropping off at

BETTY CURRIE's home on a weekend in early January 1998, which was the day the President and the First Lady were photographed

1446

OIC- 3c? J. a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Contimlation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 07/ 30/ 98 .~ gc 20

dancing on the beach in Florida, purchased for $40.00 at Georgetown bookstore off M Street next to the Christian Scientist book store sometime after December 28, 1997. LEWINSKY included a mushy note in the book. The President acknowledged receipt of the book and note and remarked that LEWINSKY should not have written the note because it was not good to have those things in writing. LEWINSKY's note made reference to the movie "Titanic, lt which she had seen that weekend.

4. Silver cigar holder purchased at flea market in New York in October/ November 1997; for $180.00 in cash. Handed to President in his rocking chair on December 6, 1997, and he said, "It is beautiful." Seen by LINDA TRIPP at work and brother MICHAEL in apartment. LEWINSKY tried to buy DAVIDOFF cigars for holder but unsuccessful. LEWINSKY observed on President's desk in Oval Office on December 28, 1997.

5. STARBUCKS Santa Monica coffee cup purchased at the Los Angeles International Airport and given to President on December 6, 1997; President remarked, "1 like big mugs" and LEWINSKY responded, "No, you like big jugs. '!

6. Gold and blue tie designed by Feraud and purchased in London for 25 pounds in early December, 1997. Presented to President on December 6, 1997.

7. A pin depicting the New York skyline given to LEWINSKY by the President on December 28, 1997.

8. Flower pin for birthday gift handed to LEWINSKY by BETTY CURRIE on behalf of the President in July 1997; may have been CURRIE's personal pin commandeered as last minute gift.

9. Hat pin purchased by the President in Albuquerque on February 28, 1997; LEWINSKY loved it and wore it with her straw hat; told NEYSA about the gift.

10. Green dress from the BLACK DOG shop given to LEWINSKY by the President; personal gift. LEWINSKY considered it an important

11. President. White T- shirt from BLACK DOG presented by

12.

President. Green T- shirt from BLACK DOG presented by

1447 OK- 3a2a (Rev. 8- 1% W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Collximlation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .o,, 07/ 30/ 98 .Ree 21 13. Ball cap from BLACK DOG presented by President. 14. State Of The Union invitation signed by President and presented to LEWINSKY in 1996.

15. (duplicate). State Of The Union invitation in envelope

Photographs displayed are further described by the following Bates Stamp number:

1. MSL- DC- 00000474 2. V002- DC- 00000003 3. VOO2- DC- 00000471 4. VOOO- DC- 00000474 5. V002- DC- 00000473 6. V002- DC- 00000472 7. 824- DC- 00000018 8. 824- DC- 00000019 9. 824- DC- 00000019 10. 824- DC- 00000006 11. 824- DC- 00000008 12. 824- DC- 00000007 13. 824- DC- 00000009 14. 824- DC- 00000003 15. 824- DC- 00000004

LEWINSKY added that she noticed that BAYANI NELVIS wore the first tie that she had given to the President to one of his grand jury appearances.

The interview was terminated at 6: 15 p. m.

1448

1449

Tab 21

1450

1451

OK-: X2 (Rev. &19-% a;

-I-

OFFICE OF THE NIEPENDESI- COUNSEL Dare of rranscnption 07/ 31/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed under the terms of an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) and her. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH, and AIC CRAIG LERNER. Representing LEWINSKY were attorney PRESTON BURTON and law clerk MATTHEW UMHOFER. Present for parts of the interview was Deputy Independent Counsel (DIG) ROBERT J. BITTMAN. The interview, conducted in Room 616 of the Watergate Hotel, commenced at approximately lo: 08 a. m. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

LEWINSKY was shown a photograph of President WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON on the next to last page of the April 13, 1998 issue of THE WEEKJ, Y STANDARD. LEWINSKY advised she purchased and gave CLINTON the sunglasses CLINTON is wearing in the photograph.

December 5. 1997

LEWINSKY advised that on December 5, 1997, she was mad at CLINTON because he would not see her the following day. On November 30, 1997, the Sunday night before leaving for BRUSSELS,

LEWINSKY mailed BETTY CURRIE a letter to give to CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she wrote CLINTON to tell him LEWINSKY needed to see him. LEWINSKY advised she called CURRIE from Europe to see if CLINTON would be available to meet LEWINSKY anytime soon. LEWINSKY advised CURRIE later said CURRIE did not give the letter to CLINTON until December 5, 1997 at 6 p. m.

LEWINSKY advised she attended a Christmas party at the White House the evening of December 5, 1997. LEWINSKY saw CLINTON at the party, which LEWINSKY attended with BOB TYRER, the Chief of Staff to Secretary of Defense WILLIAM COHEN. LEWINSKY advised she saw CLINTON in the greeting line and, before she shook hands with him, she noticed he saw her and began fixing his hair.

LEWINSKY advised she engaged in small talk with CLINTON. LEWINSKY told HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON that she was friends with WALTER KAYE.

Invesugation on 0 7 / 3 I / 9 8 ,Washington, DC FtleX 29D- OIC- LR- 35063 CI by SA Date dicwcd 07/ 31/ 98

1452

OK- 302a (Rev. S- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LZWINSKY .~ n 07/ 31/ 98 ,Page 2

DRAFT LETTERS LEWINSKY provided 12 pages of documents she had in her apartment which related to CLINTON.

LE. WINSKY advised that on the evening of December 5, 1997, she typed, on her home computer, a letter to CLINTON she planned to give CURRIE the following day when LEWINSKY delivered CURRIE and CLINTON's Christmas presents. LEWINSKY advised she often printed out drafts of letters so she could proofread them. LEWINSKY provided copies of drafts of the letter, but she ended up seeing CLINTON the next day, so she did not give him the letter.

LEWINSKY advised the purpose of this letter was to make CLINTON feel guilty. LEWINSKY advised that when she was in England the first week of December 1997, she telephoned CURRIE once or twice. LEWINSKY advised she stayed at the GROSVENOR HOUSE and billed her telephone calls to her AMERICAN EXPRESS CARD.

LEWINSKY provided a draft of a two page letter, dated June 26, 1997, to CURRIE in which LEWINSKY provided suggestions for transcription jobs for CURRIE's mother. LEWINSKY eventually sent CURRIE a version of this letter.

LEWINSKY provided two other drafts of letters she eventually sent CLINTON. One is a November 12, 1997 letter to CLINTON in which LEWINSKY expressed her frustration at not being with CLINTON. The second letter was written sometime after LEWINSKY's November 13, 1997 visit to the White House that coincided with Mexican President ZEDILLO's visit, which LEWINSKY refers to simply as "ZEDILLO day."

LEWINSKY provided a copy of a bookmark/ penny, a duplicate of which she had given CLINTON on March 29, 1997. LEWINSKY advised she purchased two of the items, gave one to CLINTON and saved one. LEWINSKY advised NATE. SPEIGHTS has the other original of this item.

LEWINSKY provided another draft of a letter she wrote after her "ZEDILLO visit."

LEWINSKY provided a copy of a November 6, 1997 letter to VERNON JORDAN. LEWINSKY advised she sent a similar letter to JORDAN on November 6, 1997. LEWINSKY sent the letter to JORDAN via courier, because JORDAN was going out of town the next day. LEWINSKY advised she had take. n her resume to JORDAN the previous

1453

OIC-: X! A tRev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 07/ 31/ 98 , page 3 day when she met with him.

LEWINSKY provided a copy of a list she sent to CLINTON after her meeting with him on October 11, 1997. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON told her to prepare a list of jobs she would be interested in.

LEWINSKY provided a copy of a draft letter related to her career opportunities. LEWINSKY advised the handwriting on the draft is hers, but she cannot remember specifically what she was referring to. LEWINSKY advised she reviewed the letter with LINDA TRIPP.

LEWINSKY advised she was focused on public relations firms when she dealt with VERNON JORDAN.

FOLLOW- UP TO PREVIOUS DAY'S INTERVIEW LEWINSKY advised she did not recall CURRIE ever being in the Oval Office bathroom while LEWINSKY and CLINTON engaged in oral sex. LEWINSKY does recall one instance when CURRIE was in the Executive dining room while LEWINSKY and CLINTON engaged in oral sex in the Oval Office hall and bathroom. CLINTON advised LEWINSKY to keep quiet during this encounter.

LEWINSKY advised that she recalls another occasion CLINTON made a comment to her about being quiet while they engaged in sexual activities.

LEWINSKY advised she recalled that on March 29, 1997, CLINTON put his hand over LEWINSKY's mouth so as to keep her quiet during one of their sexual encounters.

LEWINSKY recalls one occasion in which she had to bite her own hand during sexual activities to keep from making any noise.

LEWINSKY advised CURRIE would always knock and announce herself prior to opening the doors in the Oval Office complex. LEWINSKY advised she and CLINTON were generally not concerned about being overheard during their sexual encounters. LEWINSKY- -_

advised they were more concerned with being seen in the- Oval Office because of the windows there.

LEWINSKY advised the Oval Office study has windows, but no one is usually stationed there. LEWINSKY is aware of peepholes that allow someone to look into the Oval Office from

1454

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 31/ 98 ,pagt 4 various points around the Oval Office. LEWINSKY does not recall discussing the peepholes with CLINTON or CURRIE.

CLINTON sometimes expressed concern about people looking into the Oval Office and the study. LEWINSKY recalls that when CLINTON gave her her Christmas kiss on December 28, 1997, he had his eyes wide open, looking out the window.

LEWINSKY advised she most often visited CLINTON during the day. LEWINSKY advised the hallway outside the Oval study was more comfortable because it had no windows. LEWINSKY advised that during the "ZEDILLO visit," CLINTON turned the lights to the study out while she was in there.

LEWINSKY advised that she thinks HILLARY CLINTON called when LEWINSKY was with the President on November 15, 1995. LEWINSKY advised she thinks CURRIE hollered back to CLINTON that HILLARY CLINTON was on the phone.

LEWINSKY advised most of her sexual encounters with CLINTON occurred in the hallway outside the Oval Office study, except for the second visit on November 15, 1995 and the visits on March 29, 1997 and April 7, 1996. LEWINSKY and CLINTON occasionally engaged in sexual activity in the bathroom near the study.

LEWINSKY advised she felt as if she was alone with CLINTON when the two were engaged in intimate contact, but they both were still conscious of the possibility of having to disengage on a moment's notice, so they did not disrobe entirely.

LEWINSKY advised she was never concerned about video cameras around the Oval Office, until the news about the fund- raising videos, which occurred in the Fall of 1996. LEWINSKY spoke to LINDA TRIPP about the video tapes, but later learned the videos were not secretly recorded so LEWINSKY's concerns were allayed.

LEWINSKY advised she was concerned about records of telephone calls CLINTON made to LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY's concern was sparked when she read news of the White House turning over phone-. records to the campaign fund- raising investigators. LEWINSKY expressed concern to CURRIE, who told LEWINSKY not to worry since CLINTON used a different phone when he called LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY may have expressed her concern to CLINTON, but she does not recall and she has no recollection of his response.

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Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 31/ 98 ,page 5 LEWINSKY advised she recalls one late October 1997 telephone call from CLINTON where CLINTON had to end the call because HILLARY CLINTON had returned home.

LEWINSKY does not recall either of her two telephone calls with CLINTON, when CLINTON was on the road, ending abruptly. LEWINSKY does not recall hearing a clicking sound when she spoke with CLINTON on the telephone.

LEWINSKY advised she. was discreet about her sexual relationship with CLINTON when dealing with CURRIE. CURRIE was 'in the loop" when it came to keeping LEWINSKY's relationship with CLINTON discreet.

LEWINSKY assumes RAHM EMMANUAL was present in the Oval Office on February 28, 1997, .and is sure STEVE GOODIN was there. LEWINSKY was told by CURRIE that GGODIN said LEWINSKY could not be alone with CLINTON. LEWINSKY assumes CLINTON was in the Oval Office with GOODIN and CURRIE when GOODIN told CURRIE this. LEWINSKY advised that when she eventually went into the Oval Office with CURRIE shortly thereafter, CLINTON did not seem surprised to see CURRIE with LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised a lot of people tried to protect

CLINTON by putting reins on his life, but CURRIE does what CLINTON wants done. LEWINSKY advised CURRIE was more like family to CLINTON than a subordinate. LEWINSKY advised CURRIE had a special relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON found it comforting to have CURRIE in the Oval Office area.

LEWINSKY did not seduce CLINTON, nor did she stalk him.

LE, WINSKY advised their relationship was mutual, particularly with regard to initiating intimate contact.

LEWINSKY advised that, in her December 17, 1997 telephone conversation with CLINTON, CLINTON advised that if anyone asked LEWINSKY about her visits to the White House after her transfer to the Pentagon, LEWINSKY could always say she was visiting CURRIE. LEWINSKY advised this was not the first time CLINTON mentioned this scenario.

LEWINSKY advised this scenario was familiar to her, but- it was not brought up on a regular basis. LEWINSKY advised that until December 17, 1997, no one had ever asked LEWINSKY about her visits to the Oval Office. LEWINSKY advised that when she visited the White House after her transfer to the Pentagon, the primary purpose of the visit was to see CLINTON, but she did see

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CURRIE, as well. LEWINSKY advised that CURRIE sometimes drove out of the White House complex after one of LEWINSKY's On December 28, 1997, LEWINSKY left her visitor's pass Oval Office, so CURRIE had to call down to the gate to LEWINSKY to leave.

'MEANIES" LEWINSKY

visits. in the allow

LEWINSKY proceeded to provide a description of some of the White House employees who did not like LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY described these people as "meanies."

LEWINSKY's first encounter with EVELYN LIEBERMAN was shortly after LEWINSKY started her job in the Office of Legislative Affairs (OLA). LEWINSKY was taking papers to the West Wing when LIEBERMAN stopped her and asked where she worked. LIEBERMAN also said that LEWINSKY was always trafficking in the West Wing area. LIEBERMAN told LEWINSKY interns were not allowed in front of the Oval Office.

LEWINSKY went to the bathroom and cried and then went to LIEBERMAN's office to clarify that she was no longer an intern and had been hired as a staffer. LIEBERMAN responded derisively by saying "they hired you?" LIEBERMAN then said that she must have mistaken LEWINSKY for someone else. From that moment on, LEWINSKY was wary of LIEBERMAN. LEWINSKY advised she thinks LIEBERMAN was furloughed during the government shutdown, as LEWINSKY does not recall seeing her during that time.

LEWINSKY did not mention her encounter with LIEBERMAN to CLINTON. LEWINSKY believes her encounter with LIEBERMAN occurred in December of 1995 as LEWINSKY did not interact with CLINTON that much during December of 1995.

LEWINSKY advised that she was never reprimanded for dressing inappropriately while employed at the White House. LEWINSKY attributes those stories to a "White House smear campaign."

LEWINSKY cannot recall any other direct encounters with LIEBERMAN. LEWINSKY advised that she had a near encounter on April 7, 1996, because United States Secret Service Uniformed Officer JOHN MUSKETT asked LEWINSKY if he should check with LIEBERMAN to see if he should allow LEWINSKY into the Oval Office. LEWINSKY told MUSKETT that this would not be necessary,

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Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 07/ 31/ g8 , Page 7 since she was just dropping off papers.

CLINTON told LEWINSKY that LIEBERMAN had LEWINSKY transferred to the Pentagon because 1996 was an election year. LEWINSKY advised a lot of people at the White House were wary of LIEBERMAN. LEWINSKY was especially wary of LIEBERMAN because LEWINSKY was having a relationship with CLINTON.

CLINTON telephoned LEWINSKY from Florida on October 22, 1996.

LEWINSKY advised that CURRIE was wary of LIEBERMAN, as well. LEWINSKY advised that on either October 23 or October 24, 1996, LEWINSKY saw and spoke to CLINTON at a fund- raiser for Senate Democrats. That evening, CLINTON called LEWINSKY. During the conversation, LEWINSKY said that she was going to see White House photographer BILLIE SHADDIX at the White House the following day. CLINTON told LEWINSKY to stop by the West Wing.

LEWINSKY told CLINTON to have CURRIE come down to the photo office to escort LEWINSKY to the West Wing. LEWINSKY was unable to see CLINTON and his departure ceremony that day because CURRIE said that LIEBERMAN was in the area and CURRIE had to wait until LIEBERMAN was gone before bringing LEWINSKY to the Oval 'Office area. CURRIE told LEWINSKY that LIEBERMAN did not like LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised that her mother, MARCIA LEWIS, and step- father, PETER STRAUSS, saw LIEBERMAN at a VOICE OF AMERICA event. LIEBERMAN told MARCIA LEWIS that LEWINSKY was transferred from the White HOUSE due to political expediency. LIEBERMAN added that LEWINSKY was cursed because she was beautiful.

LEWINSKY advised that SUSAN BROPHY and others in the Office of Legislative Affairs called LEWINSKY a "stalker."

LEWINSKY did not express her frustrations with CLINTON that LEWINSKY ended up having to make most of the arrangements to meet with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY advised that STEVE GOODIN initially treated - -_

LEWINSKY kindly. LEWiNSKY recalled one time when LEWINSKY and JAY FOOTLIK went to the Oval Office so LEWINSKY could deliver a tie to CLINTON. LEWINSKY and FOOTLIK bumped into GOODIN outside BETTY CURRIE's office and the three sang a parody of the song "You don't bring me flowers."

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LEWINSKY recalled that on MARTIN LUTHER KING DAY, 1996, PAT GRIFFIN asked LEWINSKY to call LEON PANETTA, who was traveling with the President. LEWINSKY called GOODIN, who half- jokingly said to LEWINSKY that he only spoke to “principals." Others present laughed at LEWINSKY's expense.

LEWINSKY advised that on May 24, 1997, LEWINSKY was with CLINTON in the study. LEWINSKY had left her LOUIS VUITTON purse on the dining room table in the Executive Dining room. CLINTON had to leave the study at one point and LEWINSKY heard him speaking to GOODIN.

LEWINSKY advised that she was “paranoid" about what people were thinking about her. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON paid a lot of attention to her, sometimes in front of others. LEWINSKY felt that people in the White House did not want to acknowledge that the President might actually like LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised that initially she felt HERNREICH was friendly with her. LEWINSKY saw HERNREICH on April 7, 1996 when LEWINSKY was transferred. HERNREICH told LEWINSKY to come in and see her on April 8, 1996. HERNREICH was very kind to her and consoled her. HERNREICH told LEWINSKY she would see what she could do for LEWINSKY.

After LEWINSKY was transferred, CURRIE specifically mentioned to LEWINSKY when HERNREICH was not around. CURRIE's concern with whether or not HERNREICH was around indicated to LEWINSKY that HERNREICH may have disliked LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised that in early 1997, during telephone conversations on January 12 and February 8, CLINTON told her that BOB NASH was in charge of finding her a job at the White House. LEWINSKY later learned that NASH, head of Presidential Personnel, was in charge of finding jobs outside the White House. LEWINSKY then learned the "ball was passed" to MARSHA SCOTT by the end of April of 1997.

LEWINSKY advised that she spoke to SCOTT's assistant, but got the impression that SCOTT was not aware of who she was and SCOTT never returned the call. LEWINSKY then sent a nasty- note to CLINTON, referencing her dealings with SCOTT. LEWINSKY thinks she either sent by courier or hand- delivered the note to CURRIE to give to CLINTON.

Several weeks later, SCOTT called LEWINSKY and said that SCOTT had been out due to back surgery and did not have a

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Contimatin of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .o,, 07/ 31/ 98 ,Rpe 9 chance to call LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY thinks SCOTT either read LEWINSKY's note to CLINTON, or CLINTON conveyed the contents of it to her. SCOTT arranged an appointment for LEWINSKY to meet with her.

LEWINSKY does not recall the length of the meeting, but she does recall SCOTT asking SCOTT's assistant to leave the office during the meeting. LEWINSKY described SCOTT's tone as pleasant. LEWINSKY advised SCOTT had a picture of SCOTT and CLINTON on the wall in her office. In the photograph, CLINTON is

wearing a tie LEWINSKY had given him. SCOTT asked a lot of questions during the meeting, some of which LEWINSKY felt were intrusive. SCOTT said that JODIE TORKELSON and EVELYN LIEBERMAN did not like LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY felt an unspoken tension with SCOTT, as LEWINSKY was a current lover of CLINTON's,

LEWINSKY advised she had two meetings with SCOTT, and is not sure about at which meeting certain things were said. At one meeting, SCOTT indicated she would 'detail" LEWINSKY at the White House. In a "detail," the employee works at the White House, but is paid by another agency, like the Defense Department. LEWINSKY advised 'detailees' work at the White House for a limited time, prior to going back to their agency or finding a permanent position at the White House.

LEWINSKY advised that LIZ BAILEY told LEWINSKY that SCOTT lost her "detail" post and would be unable to find a position for LEWINSKY. SCOTT told LEWINSKY the reason she was unable to find LEWINSKY a position was because KEN BACON and CLIFF BERNATH at the Pentagon said they did not want to "lose" LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY got into an argument with SCOTT as SCOTT told LEWINSKY that she would have to wait until December, after certain people left the White House, including LIEBERMAN, before returning to the White House. LEWINSKY said that was not fair and SCOTT said life was not fair. SCOTT said it was not fair that she had incurred $400,000 in attorney's fees simply for working at the White House.

Looking back at the situation, LEWINSKY thinks SCOTT may have been trying to protect CLINTON because of LEWINSKY's association with the KATHLEEN WILLEY/ LINDA TRIPP matter.

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Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 07/ 31/ 98 *page 10

JOBS

Between September 12 and 26, 1997, CURRIE advised she was going to talk to JOHN PODESTA. On October 7, 1997, LEWINSKY talked to LINDA TRIPP, who had stayed home from work. TRIPP told LEWINSKY that TRIPP's friend, KATE, who worked at the NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL, said she had heard that LEWINSKY would not get back at the White House, and if she did, LEWINSKY would not get a job requiring a blue, West Wing pass. TRIPP said that KATE's advice was for LEWINSKY to "get out of town."

This conversation with TRIPP made LEWINSKY so angry she left work early that day. LEWINSKY advised she then decided to move to New York. LEWINSKY advised she had previously considered the idea of moving to New York, but the call from TRIPP was the “straw that broke the camel's back." KATE's comments confirmed LEWINSKY's hunch that she was never going to be brought back to the White House.

LEWINSKY advised that moving to New York was a possibility beginning in July of 1997. LEWINSKY advised a job at the United Nations seemed logical at the time because it was a government agency.

LEWINSKY had been suspicious of not getting a job back at the White House. LEWINSKY advised that, in an October 11, 1997 telephone conversation with CLINTON, she mentioned to him her frustration of not getting a job at the White House. CLINTON said the problem was that lower- level people knew more about the specific job openings than he did.

LEWINSKY advised that on October 9 or 10, 1997, CLINTON called her between 2: 00 and 2: 30 in the morning. LEWINSKY advised she was asleep when CLINTON called. The call lasted for approximately one and one half hours. LEWINSKY and CLINTON had their biggest fight ever in this telephone conversation. LEWINSKY said both she and CLINTON yelled a lot during the call.

CLINTON said that if he had known how difficult it would be to bring LEWINSKY back to the White House, he would have never let her be transferred in the first place. CLINTON said he was obsessed with her career and wanted to help her. CLINTON said his life was empty except for work. During the fight, CLINTON also said that, if he had known what type of person LEWINSKY was, he would have never become involved with her in the first place. LEWINSKY advised she was very hurt by this comment and started crying.

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Contiuadon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY . .on 07/ 31/ 98 ,page 11 \

LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON was in the White House Residence when he made the telephone call to her. LEWINSKY advised that her caller identification feature indicated “unavailable" when CLINTON called her from the Residence. LEWINSKY advised she did not gb into detail about what TRIPP said KATE had said. LEWINSKY advised she was vague with CLINTON when discussing why she wanted to move to New York.

LEWINSKY told CLINTON she had to be out of her apartment by the end of October, LEWINSKY advised that the discussion of her job situation was part of her relationship with CLINTON. CLINTON said he would get working on a job in New York for LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised she stayed home from work on October 10, 1997 and had lunch with TRIPP at the CALIFORNIA PIZZA KITCHEN on Connecticut Avenue. LEWINSKY talked about her early morning telephone conversation with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she was emotionally exhausted as a result of the content of the phone conversation with CLINTON the night before. LEWINSKY was also disappointed she would not be going back to work at the White House.

The following morning, October 11, 1997, at approximately 8: 30 a. m., CURRIE called LEWINSKY from the hospital and said CLINTON wanted to see LEWINSKY at approximately 9: 00

at the White House ;azei CURRIE to tell

CURRIE told LEWINSKY that CLINTON had her- to get in touch with LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised it was CLINTON's wedding anniversary that day, and CLINTON had tasked CURRIE with finding a HALCYON box for HILLARY CLINTON. The White House Garden tours were taking place that day and CURRIE had two friends there on the tour. LEWINSKY chatted with CURRIE's friends as she waited for CLINTON. CLINTON was on the telephone with CAPRICIA MARSHALL, who had attended the wedding of LAURA HARTIGAN in Chicago.

LEWINSKY advised that she saw ANNE MCCOY coming toward the Oval Office, so LEWINSKY darted to the back room of the Oval complex to avoid MCCOY.

LEWINSKY met alone with CLINTON in the Dining Room. LEWINSKY gave CLINTON a'list of jobs in New York she was interested in. LEWINSKY advised she mentioned First Name Unknown (FNU) KAPLAN from CNN. LEWINSKY may have also mentioned VERNON JORDAN during this conversation. LEWINSKY thinks she may have mentioned JORDAN in the previous telephone conversation in which

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she and CLINTON had a fight. CLINTON was receptive to the idea of

JORDAN helping LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY mentioned JORDAN because TRIPP had said JORDAN was CLINTON's best friend and JORDAN was on the board of directors of many companies. LEWINSKY looked JORDAN up on the Internet and also saw a lot of references to him in stories about

CLINTON's trip to Martha's Vineyard. LEWINSKY advised she did not want a job in the government.

LEWINSKY advised that, at some point, she knew JOHN

PODESTA had a role in LEWINSKY getting a job offer at the United Nations. CLINTON said that he did or would talk to PODESTA.

In mid- October, CLINTON was in Latin America and LEWINSKY worked on her letter to CLINTON regarding jobs. LEWINSKY bought a book at BARNES & NOBLE regarding jobs in New York.

LEWINSKY advised she sent her letter, her GS rating, the section of the PLUM Book regarding other Confidential Assistants at the Pentagon being GS- 11's, (while LEWINSKY was a GS- 9) to CLINTON on October 16, 1997. LEWINSKY believes she mentioned a salary of approximately $60,000.

On October 21, 1997, Ambassador WILLIAM RICHARDSON telephoned LEWINSKY at home. RICHARDSON said he understood from JOHN PODESTA that LEWINSKY was interested in working at the United Nations.

On October 23, 1997, LEWINSKY spoke with CLINTON on the telephone. During the conversation, LEWINSKY and CLINTON spoke about the sunglasses LEWINSKY recently sent CLINTON. (LEWINSKY also sent CLINTON a CALVIN KLEIN tie, the fifth tie she had given him.) During this conversation, LEWINSKY mentioned RICHARDSON's call to her. LEWINSKY tried to steer CLINTON to think of a job other than the United Nations, but CLINTON said he just wanted LEWINSKY to have options.

[LEWINSKY does not recall when she regularly started -_

using the courier service to deliver things to CLINTON. Mid- March of 1997 was the first time LEWINSKY used the service, but she may have not used it regularly until the fall of 1997. TRIPP had said the FEDERAL EXPRESS system was unsafe. LEWINSKY advised that on March 1, 1997, she sent CLINTON a get- well package, which

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Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 07/ 31/ 98 ,hge 13 included a magnet of the Seal of the President of the United States for CLINTON's metal crutches; a little license plate that said “BILL" for CLINTON's wheel- chair; and knee- pads with the seal of the President of the United States stitched on them (by LEWINSKY). LEWINSKY purchased the knee- pads at a sporting goods store on the third floor of the Pentagon City mall.]

[LEWINSKY advised her mode of delivering items to the White House depended on the sensitivity of the items. LEWINSKY advised the most secure mode was to give the item directly to CURRIE. LEWINSKY advised the cost of the delivery also played a role in her choosing a specific method; LEWINSKY advised the courier service was the most expensive of the delivery methods. LEWINSKY advised she dropped things off at the New Executive Office Building (NEOB) approximately 3 times and handed the items directly to CURRIE at one of the White House gates approximately five times. LEWINSKY advised she thought of using the Department of Defense courier to the White House, but could not do it.]

LEWINSKY did not feel it was odd for CLINTON to be helping her find a job because she "had a relationship with him."

Sometime before October 30, 1997, LEWINSKY asked CURRIE to tell CLINTON to call LEWINSKY. In the early evening, around 8 p. m., on October 30t", CLINTON called LEWINSKY at home. LEWINSKY said she was anxious about meeting RICHARDSON. CLINTON told LEWINSKY to call CURRIE after the interview to let CLINTON know how the interview went.

LEWINSKY had given CURRIE CLINTON's Halloween presents, including a lapel pin, sometime during the week before Halloween. LEWINSKY advised she saw a photograph of CLINTON wearing the pin and she read that CLINTON mentioned the pin in a speech.

On October 31, 1997, LEWINSKY met with RICHARDSON at the Watergate Hotel. MONA SUTPHEN, RICHARDSON's assistant, met LEWINSKY in the lobby and escorted LEWINSKY to RICHARDSON's room. LEWINSKY advised the setting was very casual as RICHARDSON was eating breakfast when LEWINSKY arrived. RICHARDSON asked LEWINSKY if CURRIE was her mother.

LEWINSKY mentioned working on the United States Consulate to the United Nations' web- site and suggested implementing town hall meetings, similar to the ones the Department of Defense used. LEWINSKY advised the meeting lasted approximately one- half hour.

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Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .~ n 07/ 31/ 98 ,hpe 14 “cake."

LEWINSKY did not think the interview was perfunctory or LEWINSKY advised that REBECCA LNU and SUTPHEN were there, and at times it may have just been RICHARDSON and REBECCA Last Name Unknown (LNU) with LEWINSKY, as SUTPHEN came in and left intermittently.

LEWINSKY does not recall PODESTA's name coming up during the interview.

After LEWINSKY's interview, LEWINSKY's mother and aunt went to the United Nations in New York. LEWINSKY advised some of the reasons LEWINSKY did not want to work at the United Nations were because LEWINSKY's mother mentioned her concern that a lot of Arabs worked at the United Nations and because the United Nations was somewhat isolated from the business district in New York.

The interview with RICHARDSON ended with LEWINSKY being told that RICHARDSON or his staff would be in touch with her. LEWINSKY spoke to CURRIE after the interview and LEWINSKY was a lot more optimistic about her job opportunities than she was before the interview. CLINTON was out of town at the time.

On November 3, 1997, or later, LEWINSKY received a telephone call from RICHARDSON and was offered a job at the United Nations.

VERNON JORDAN On either October 23 or 30, 1997, LEWINSKY and CLINTON discussed VERNON JORDAN helping LEWINSKY in her job search.

On November 3 or 4, 1997, CURRIE called LEWINSKY and told her to call JORDAN's secretary GAYLE LNU. CURRIE told LEWINSKY to say she was CURRIE's friend. LEWINSKY advised. that CURRIE had called JORDAN to arrange the meeting, so that gave LEWINSKY some indication that CLINTON was involved.

In the late morning of November 5, '1997, LEWINSKY had an appointment to see JORDAN. LEWINSKY was nervous as she waited in the lobby for twenty minutes before meeting with JORDAN. LEWINSKY brought the same package she had sent CLINTON earlier,- . . sans the cover sheet and the GS scale.

LEWINSKY sat in JORDAN's office before he came in. JORDAN made LEWINSKY feel nervous. in this meeting. JORDAN was not very effusive minutes.

The meeting lasted approximately twenty After introducing each other, JORDAN asked LEWINSKY why

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Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 07/ 31/ 98 *page I5 she was there. LEWINSKY told JORDAN she was hoping to move to New York. JORDAN asked her why she wanted to leave Washington, D. C. LEWINSKY said that she wanted to get a fresh start.

LEWINSKY mentioned her employment at the White House. JORDAN inquired as to why he never saw LEWINSKY during one of his visits to the White House. LEWINSKY gave JORDAN the “vanilla" story about why she left employment at the White House. LEWINSKY said that LIEBERMAN did not like her. JORDAN said LIEBERMAN disliked him as well. JORDAN said he had spoken to CLINTON, about LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY and JORDAN went over her list of possible employers. LEWINSKY felt awkward in the meeting as JORDAN did not respond to her often. JORDAN mentioned one his daughters worked at one of the companies on LEWINSKY's list. At the end of the meeting, JORDAN said he and LEWINSKY were “in business."

JORDAN said that LEWINSKY came "highly recommended." LEWINSKY is not sure if JORDAN meant that CLINTON said nice things about her, or if he meant CLINTON had mentioned his relationship with LEWINSKY. In their November 12, 1997 telephone conversation, CLINTON said he had spoken to JORDAN.

JORDAN was going out of town the day after LEWINSKY met with him. LEWINSKY called CURRIE and left a couple of messages with JORDAN's secretary, but JORDAN did not return LEWINSKY's call. LEWINSKY called CURRIE to see what she should do, since she had not heard from JORDAN in almost two weeks.

On November 26, 1997, CURRIE paged LEWINSKY while LEWINSKY was in Los Angeles. LEWINSKY called CURRIE from a pay phone at the WILSHIRE COURTYARD MARRIOTT. LEWINSKY was told to call JORDAN and she did. JORDAN told LEWINSKY he was leaving for China and he told LEWINSKY to call him around the first week of December. JORDAN told LEWINSKY he was working on her job search.

LEWINSKY was anxious as she had given notice at the Pentagon that she was going to leave, though she did not give a specific date.

- ._

On December 8, 1997, LEWINSKY sent, by courier, a package to JORDAN, which included a note, a hat and some chocolate, to remind him she still existed.

During LEWINSKY's December 6, '1997 meeting with CLINTON, she thinks he said he would contact JORDAN. LEWINSKY

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Conlinuation of OK- 302 of MCNICA S. LEWINSKY .o,, 07/ 31/ 98 ,Rge 16 advised CLINTON was the type of person who would say he was going to do something and not really mean it.

LEWINSKY advised. that she had breakfast with VERNON JORDAN on December 31, 1997 at the HYATT. LEWINSKY advised JORDAN paid for the breakfast; LEWINSKY had an egg- white omelette, and JORDAN had cereal or yogurt.

, estw LEWINSKY is surprised CLINTON has agreed to testify before the Grand Jury. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON is walking into a "perjury trap." LEWINSKY advised that, with the existence of the dress being leaked, CLINTON may do a ‘mea culpa." LEWINSKY advised she guessed what CLINTON would say about her when he testified in the JONES case, and she was correct. LEWINSKY advised, though they did not discuss the issue in specific relation to the JONES matter, she and CLINTON had discussed what to say when asked about LEWINSKY's visits to the White House.

LEWINSKY advised she still has feelings towards CLINTON and she finds it hard to provide the OIC questions that may end up hurting CLINTON.

LEWINSKY would ask CLINTON why he wore the same tie twice in once week. (LEWINSKY advised she gave CLINTON the tie.)

LEWINSKY would ask CLINTON why he would give NELVIS the first tie LEWINSKY gave CLINTON. NELVIS then wore it to one of his grand jury appearances. LEWINSKY would ask CLINTON if he was trying to send LEWINSKY a message.

LEWINSKY does not think CLINTON is concerned about BRUCE LINDSEY testifying, as she is unaware of LINDSEY's knowledge of her relationship with CLINTON.

CLINTON advised he made a concerted effort not to have sex with other women. CLINTON seemed to feel guilty about cheating on his wife.

When CLINTON was in Mexico, he became ill. When he returned, he asked LEWINSKY if she could tell he was sick.

1467

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY . ,On 07/ 31/ 98 . page 17

During their second telephone conversation of December 2, 1996, CLINTON told LEWINSKY about a jazz musician who had been killed on a boat. CLINTON seemed shocked about the musician's death.

LEWINSKY advised, if she were questioning CLINTON, she would show CLINTON pictures of items she had given him which he had not turned over, to refresh his memory.

LEWINSKY advised she- never met CLINTON outside the White House for a private meeting.

The interview ended at approximately 4: 40 p. m.

1468

1469

Tab 22

1470

OK- 301 (Rev. 8- 19- W)

-l- OJ? FICEOFTEEINDEPENDENTCOUNSEL

Daaoflransclipfion OS/ OS/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH, AIC CRAIG LERNER, and Deputy Independent Counsel SOLOMON WISENBERG. Representing LEWINSKY were attorneys PRESTON BURTON of the law offices of PLATO CACHERIS, and ROBERT BREDHOFF of STEIN, MITCHELL & MEZINES. The interview was conducted at the Watergate Hotel in Washington, D. C. beginning at lo: 06 a. m. information: LEWINSKY provided the following

LEWINSKY began taking a new prescription medication this morning, which consisted of 10 milligrams of Prozac. LEWINSKY is still taking Serzone; discontinued. other prescriptions have been

When LEWINSKY learned that the President would testify in the PAULA JONES case, she assumed that the President would deny their relationship. There was no explicit agreement that the President would testify in a specific way, but there had been a pattern of denial in their relationship.

Calendars for December 1997 and January 1998 were shown to LEWINSKY. She briefly reviewed and confirmed a number of ‘events occurring during those months. However, LEWINSKY did not remember speaking to BAYANI NELVIS on January 15, 1998.

On her second visit to the White House on December 6, 1997, LEWINSKY was supposed to meet BETTY CURRIE in the basement of the West Wing of the White House, per CURRIE's instructions. LEWINSKY saw MARSHA SCOTT walk by and left the basement to avoid SCOTT. LEWINSKY had earlier avoided SCOTT at the southwest gate. LEWINSKY called CURRIE and then met CURRIE in the West Wing lobby. CURRIE usually directed LEWINSKY away from United States Secret Service (USSS) uniformed guards who were friendly to DEBBIE SCHIFF. CURRIE told LEWINSKY not to come to the northwest gate as, "Those guys are mad at you." the incident earlier in the day. CURRIE was referring to

LEWINSKY waited in the President's back study, which she entered through the dining room. The President .said that it was very difficult for him to

Invcsrigrtion on 08/ 01/ 98 at WASHINGTON, D. C. Filel 29D OIC LR 35063 SA by CI hadicnad OS/ OS/ 98

1472 OK- 3m. a (Rev. s- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

conrinuntion of OIC- 3cr2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 01/ 98 .we 2 see LEWINSKY that day because "of all of this shit going onR and that he only had one day to see the lawyers about the JONES case.

LEWINSKY was surprised that she got into the White House and had thought that she would only be able to talk to the President on the telephone that day. The President said that he had a gift from Vancouver for LEWINSKY. The President then received a call from ERSKINE BOWLES, apparently made an appointment to see BOWLES, and told LEWINSKY to come back another day to get her gift. The President said, "Don't worry, you'll get your gift." The President did not discuss the JONES witness list with LEWINSKY. The President said that he would talk to VERNON JORDAN on LEWINSKY's behalf about jobs. The President also said, "I promise, I won't abandon you." Nothing the President said left

LEWINSKY with the impression that their relationship was any different than it was before. The visit lasted about 20 or 25 minutes. CURRIE helped LEWINSKY exit out the back way before BOWLES arrived.

On the evening of December 6, 1997, LEWINSKY went to New York and stayed with her mother. She told her about the Christmas Party on Friday, that LEWINSKY had been very upset on Saturday, and that she had gotten in to see the President on Saturday.

On December 7, 1997, LEWINSKY returned to Washington by airplane. Enroute, LEWINSKY wrote the "whipped cream" card, which she sent in the next day or so. The card said something to the effect of, "Nothing would make me happier than to see you, except to see you naked with a winning lottery ticket in one hand and a can of whipped cream in the other."

On December 8, 1997, LEWINSKY sent a package to VERNON

+ JORDAN containing a white "NATO" ballcap, some chocolate, a note, and possibly a copy of her resume. LEWINSKY did this as a friendly reminder to JORDAN to keep helping her.

Sometime during this week GAIL from JORDAN's office called LEWINSKY to set up a meeting.

LEWINSKY does not recall whether she called BETTY CURRIE to ascertain whether the card for the President had arrived, day.

nor does she recall whether she called LINDA TRIPP that:: :

In regard to BAYANI NELVIS, LEWINSKY described him as a nice person, but not eteryone at the White House treated him right. NELVIS is very loyal to the President. LEWINSKY first

1473

or- 3m (Rev. 8- 19- w

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 01/ 98 .% t 3 met NELVIS during the furlough in November 1995. NELVIS is Filipino, has an accent, and is friendly. NELVIS knew that LEWINSKY had feelings for the President and that she enjoyed a special relationship with the President. When LEWINSKY would have drinks with NELVIS, he would provide personal details about the President. LEWINSKY asked NELVIS about the details of the President's schedule and the President's routine when he was out of town. On one of the Presidential trips, NELVIS called LEWINSKY from Martha's Vineyard and asked her if she wanted to come up there and stay in the house with. several other staff members. LEWINSKY had wanted to set up a rendezvous with the President on one of his trips, but declined NELVIS's offer. LEWINSKY met NELVIS once for dinner at the CALIFORNIA PI. ZZA KITCHEN in Pentagon City. LEWINSKY gave NELVIS one or two ties. NELVIS bought LEWINSKY perfume for her birthday and gave her glasses, golf balls, and cards from Air Force One. NELVIS did not want the President to know that he was friends with LEWINSKY. NELVIS never noticed which ties the President wore from day to day. LEWINSKY did not see NELVIS in Madrid, Spain, but may have seen GLEN MAES. NELVIS told LEWINSKY to be careful around the USSS officers. This conversation may have occurred in the Roosevelt Room on the day that they discussed cigars. NELVIS told LEWINSKY that CATHY CORNELIUS had gone with the advance party on the trip to Russia and that NELVIS took CORNELIUS downtown to shop, since she was afraid to go alone.

In regard to DEBBIE SCHIFF, LEWINSKY observed SCHIFF clomp around the office in the President's shoes on February 28, 1997, at the radio address. This appeared to LEWINSKY to show SCHIFF's familiarity with the President.

On December 11, 1997, LEWINSKY went to the office of . VERNON JORDAN for a meeting, which had been arranged by GAIL of his office about December 8th or gth. LEWINSKY waited in JORDAN's lobby for about 20 minutes. LEWINSKY was very nervous at the meeting and could not decide whether to wear a red headband that she brought to his office. LEWINSKY told JORDAN, "I'm more nervous with you than when I'm with the President." JORDAN tried to be less formal on this visit and to make LEWINSKY feel more at ease. In this visit, which included a turkey sandwich lunch, JORDAN told LEWINSKY the names of people that he had called. JORDAN suggested that LEWINSKY write letters to them with detailed wording that he provided, and asked that he receive

:-:_- copies of the letters. JORDAN explained his assistance by saying, "You're a friend of the President of the United States."

JORDAN asked what the occasions were when LEWINSKY got

1474 OK- m WV. s- 1994

29D OIC LR 35063 conf. inuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 01/ 98 .% e 4

mad at the President and said, "Don't get mad at the President when he's talking to TONY BLAIR on the telephone; call me and get mad at me." LEWINSKY explained that this was absurd, since she did not know JORDAN's home telephone and why would she talk to him. With a smile JORDAN said, "Don't deny it, your problem is you're in .love." LEWINSKY most likely blushed, but did not respond. JORDAN probably knew of LEWINSKY's sexual relationship, but made no explicit statement that he knew.

LEWINSKY advised JORDAN that her mom was engaged to PETER STRAUS and JORDAN said that he knew STRAUS, and tried to call him with LEWINSKY present. JORDAN did not reach STRAUS or LEWINSKY's mother, but he left a message. JORDAN asked why LEWINSKY's mother owned a separate apartment in New York.

LEWINSKY knew that BETTY CURRIE knew VERNON JORDAN. LEWINSKY called JORDAN's office to advise him of the death of CURRIE's brother. LEWINSKY did not have any recollection of JORDAN asking her how LEWINSKY got in to see, the President. JORDAN ended the visit of 40 minutes by saying that he would 'check out other leads, in addition to the three companies that LEWINSKY was to write. LEWINSKY's overall impression upon leaving was that she was going to get a job with JORDAN's help.

On December 11, 1997, LEWINSKY went to the Pentagon from JORDAN's office, typed the letters they had discussed, and talked to LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY still held out hope that the President would get her a job in Communications at the White House.

On December 12, 1997, or sometime during this week, LINDA TRIPP met with her attorney, KIRBY BEHRE. TRIPP wanted LEWINSKY to help TRIPP buy a Christmas gift for BEHRE in the concourse at the Pentagon. TRIPP advised LEWINSKY that she had written out the details of the relationship between LEWINSKY and the President, put them in a sealed envelope, and gave them to BEHRE, to be opened in the event of TRIPP's death. LEWINSKY was aghast. TRIPP also said that if she was asked about LEWINSKY she, TRIPP, was going to tell the truth.

LEWINSKY discussed the TRIPP problem in general terms with her mother. - -_

On December 12 or 13, 1997, there was a going away party for the boyfriend of ASHLEY RAINES, JOEY Last Name Unknown (LNU), who was going to Israel.

1475

OIC- 3u2a (Rev. 8- 1- j

29D OIC coluimlation of OK- 3a2 of

LR 35063 MONICA S. LEWINSKY .oo 08/ 01/ 98 .b 5 On about December 15, 1997, LEWINSKY attended the

swearing in of KATHY HAYCOCK in the Vice- President's ceremonial room. Vice- President GORE did the swearing in. The President did not attend. LEWINSKY tried to call BETTY CURRIE, but does not recall talking to her. .

On December 17, 1997, at about 2: 30 a. m., LEWINSKY received a telephone call from the President. He was not in a jovial mood and had concern in his voice. After about four seconds the President said he would call right back and hung up. About two minutes later, the President called back and said. that he had two important things to tell LEWINSKY. First, BETTY

CURRIE's brother had been killed in a car accident. They discussed whether LEWINSKY should call her. Then the President said that he had seen the PAULA JONES witness list and that LEWINSKY was on it. The President said, "It broke my heart when I saw your name on the list." The President said not to worry about it and that it did not necessarily mean LEWINSKY would get a subpoena. The President said that it was possible that LEWINSKY would be subpoenaed in a month or so. The President said that LEWINSKY could always say that she was coming to see BETTY, or that LEWINSKY was bringing papers from Legislative Affairs to the President. The President said that if LEWINSKY did get subpoenaed, call BETTY CURRIE and they would work something out. LEWINSKY assumed that this meant that they would help LEWINSKY figure out what to do. The President said, "Maybe you could sign an affidavit." LEWINSKY's impression was that she would sign an affidavit and get out of a deposition.

LEWINSKY told the President that she had some job interviews scheduled in New York. LEWINSKY also said that maybe she would be gone and the lawyers could not find her. The President said that was a possible solution.

LEWINSKY expressed her opinion to the President on how to settle the PAULA JONES case. LEWINSKY had read an article in the Times that people were sending in money to help the President with his legal problems. LEWINSKY advised the President that since PAULA JONES was only asking for $500,000, that the President should pay up to save his family and the country. The President expressed surprise that JONES was only asking for $500,000, as he thought the asking price was $1 million. The 1::: -.

President said that he would ask his lawyers. LEWINSKY later cut out the Times article about the contributions and mailed it to MITCH ETTINGER.

The President said that maybe BETTY CURRIE could come

1476

OIC- 302a mm. clp- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

co- of OIC- m of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .oo 08/ 01/ 98 ,* 6 in on the weekend and he could give LEWINSKY her Christmas presents. LEWINSKY told the President not to dare bothering CURRIE now just when her brother had died. No discussion of other evidence occurred. Being on the witness list was a relief to LEWINSKY in one way, that is,. if both LEWINSKY and TRIPP were subpoenaed, and they both denied the relationship, then the JONES' people would not know about it. This telephone call lasted between 20 and 40 minutes. After hanging up, LEWINSKY cried.

At about 4: 00 a. m., on December 17, 1997, LEWINSKY called LINDA TRIPP, awakened her, and spoke with her for, about 15 or 20 minutes. By this time, LEWINSKY was suspicious of, TRIPP, but not to the point of accusing her of anything. The reason for the call was to discuss the fact that LEWINSKY was on the JONES witness list. LEWINSKY does not recall this discussion in any ’

detail. Also on December 17, 1997, LEWINSKY visited with BETTY CURRIE in her home and took her some bagels.-

On the night of December 17, 1997, LEWINSKY took a plane to New York, where her mother met her at the airport with a car. LEWINSKY was nearly hysterical and told her mother that LINDA TRIPP was going to tell. MARCIA LEWIS was visibly upset. The problems were not discussed with PETER STRAUS.

On December 18, 1997, LEWINSKY had a job interview that went well at McANDREWS and FORBES. An interview at BURSON MARSTELLER the same day did not go well at all and LEWINSKY cried when she left. BURSON did not make a good appearance as a company with LEWINSKY, because they had too many people talking to her and did not seem to be well organized.

On the evening of December 18, 1997, LEWINSKY called LINDA TRIPP from a pay phone at the airport in New York.

On December 19, 1997, LEWINSKY called VERNON JORDAN to discuss her New York interviews. LEWINSKY believes that she probably called TRIPP from the Pentagon but TRIPP may not have been at work that day.

._ On December 19, 1997, LEWINSKY was at work at the Pentagon. A little before 4: 00 p. m., LEWINSKY received a call from a process server, whom she agreed to meet at the Metro entrance, and received the subpoena for the PAULA JONES case. LEWINSKY cried. LEWINSKY went straight to a pay phone and called

1477 01c- 3u2a (Rev. 8- w- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Concimlaf. ion of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 01/ 98 .m 7 .

VEXNON JORDAN. JORDAN could not understand LEWINSKY, because of the crying, and asked her to come to JORDAN's office. LEWINSKY went back to her office, excused herself, went home and changed clothes. LEWINSKY called JORDAN, because the President had previously told her to call BETTY CDRRIE, but LEWIKSKY felt that she could not call CURRIE so soon after the death of CURRIE's brother.

After arriving at JORDAN's office, LEWINSKY waited in the lobby for awhile and then advised JORDAN that the President had warned her that she was on. the JONES witness list and that she had been subpoenaed that afternoon. JORDAN then received a

telephone call from an unknown caller, and asked LEWINSKY to step out of his office. LEWINSKY waited in the conference room for about 15 or 20 minutes before JORDAN invited her back to his office. LEWINSKY did not know what to do about the subpoena. JORDAN told LEWINSKY to calm down, that it was a standard subpoena. LEWINSKY told JORDAN that the subpoena also requested a hat pin the President had given her. JORDAN then called FRANK CARTER in LEWINSKY's presence and scheduled an appointment for Monday morning. JORDAN said that there were only two important questions:

1. "Did you have sex with the President?" 2. "Did he ask you for sex?"

LEWINSKY answered nno'l to both questions. LEWINSKY believed that JORDAN knew of her sexual relationship with the President, and her impression was that JORDAN wanted to know how LEWINSKY was going to answer these questions when testifying. JORDAN instructed LEWINSKY to come to his office at lo: 30 a. m. Monday. LEWINSKY asked JORDAN more than once to make sure to tell the President that she had been subpoenaed, because LEWINSKY could not call CURRIE, who was supposed to tell the President. LEWINSKY also said, "Give him a hug for me." JORDAN responded, "1 don't hug guys." JORDAN slapped LEWINSKY on the backside as if to say "get out of here kid." JORDAN said that he would see the President that night and tell him about the subpoena.

LEWINSKY went home, called LINDA TRIPP, and made cryptic statements such as, "The flowers were delivered today," but TRIPP did not understand that LEWINSKY was trying to tell her: : .

that she had been subpoenaed that day. LEWINSKY was afraid to come out and tell TRIPP that she had been subpoenaed because LEWINSKY believed that the JONES people had tapped her telephone. LEWINSKY offered to go early to TRIPP's Christmas party the next day to help set up, primarily so that LEWINSKY could talk to

1478

OIC- 3m (- Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Colltimmtion of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,o,, 08/ 01/ 98 .~ gc 8 TRIPP.

On December 20, 1997, when LEWINSKY arrived at 5: 00 p. m. to help set up the party, TRIPP said that she could not understand what LEWINSKY was trying to say the night before. LEWINSKY and TRIPP's Indian friend helped prepare the party food. LEWINSKY did not get a chance to talk to TRIPP until she was leaving and TRIPP came out to the car. LEWINSKY said that she was very worried about the hatpin. LEWINSKY told TRIPP that TRIPP could now feel safe in denying the relationship. This was the first time that LEWINSKY recalls vocalizing that she intended to deny her affair with the President. LEWINSKY received the impression that TRIPP might feel more encouraged to deny knowledge of LEWINSKY's affair. LEWINSKY met TRIPP's friend, KATE LNU, at the party.

The same night, December 20, 1997, LEWINSKY went to a party hosted by a friend of ASHLEY RAINES. LEWINSKY was drinking some by then and started telling RAINES about being in a bit of trouble. RAINES said that she did not want to know. Therefore, few details were provided by LEWINSKY.

On Sunday, December 21, 1997, LEWINSKY had a hangover; probably talked to TRIPP, and figured out which items to take to FRANK CARTER in response to the subpoena.

On Monday, December 22, 1997, LEWINSKY was nervous about going to see her attorney, FRANK CARTER. LEWINSKY called VERNON JORDAN to see if she could come over earlier than lo: 30

because she was scared. There was no discussion about who &:- going to pay the legal bill, except JORDAN said not to worry about it. LEWINSKY hoped that JORDAN would pay the bill, because

e he was the President's friend and had a lot of money. At a later date, LEWINSKY had another discussion with JORDAN about CARTER's fee.

LEWINSKY asked JORDAN what if someone called the President on the telephone, and JORDAN responded that the President can talk to people. LEWINSKY advised that she and the President had phone sex together. JORDAN asked what phone sex was. LEWINSKY did not want to explain, but JORDAN again asked. LEWINSKY said, we're talking."

"We're taking care of business on each end while:: '_-.-- The meeting in JORDAN's office lasted about 10 or 15 minutes. LEWINSKY bugged JORDAN to let her know if JORDAN had told the President about the subpoena. JORDAN responded that LEWINSKY had to learn to trust people, and that he had told the President.

OlC- 3a2a mv. &l! m4)

1479

29D OIC LR 35063

colaizuhm of OlC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,oa 08/ 01/ 98 .~ ge 9

Before leaving for CARTER's office on December 22, 1997, LEWINSKY showed JORDAN the items that she was taking to CARTER in response to the subpoena, but artfully indicated to JORDAN that it did not include everything. LEWINSKY had told JORDAN about the hat pin on Friday, and it was not included in the items that she was taking to CARTER. LEWINSKY said to JORDAN, "This is what I'm taking to CARTER, this should do." {LEWINSKY agreed that her statement in the first proffer, to the effect that she had made it clear to JORDAN that not all gifts were included, was a true statement.} LEWINSKY said that she did not intend to tell CARTER everything, because 0. J. SIMPSON .told his first lawyer that he did it. and had to change lawyers. LEWINSKY informed JORDAN of how the President could settle the PAULA JONES matter, but JORDAN did not warm to the proposal. LEWINSKY assumed that JORDAN knew that she had a physically intimate relationship with the President.

Since there was a driver in the car with JORDAN and LEWINSKY enroute to CARTER's office, their five minute conversation was guarded. HOWARD PASTOR's name was mentioned as someone who could possibly help in the job search. They also discussed the purchase of Christmas presents.

At CARTER's office on December 22, 1997, JORDAN introduced LEWINSKY to CARTER and said that he was a good lawyer. This gave LEWINSKY the impression that .this was JORDAN's personal lawyer, but she found out later that this was not true. LEWINSKY and JORDAN sat on the sofa for a few minutes and LEWINSKY told CARTER that the subpoena was ludicrous. JORDAN departed. LEWINSKY suggested an affidavit to CARTER, but he questioned whether there was any reason that LEWINSKY was pulled into this case. LEWINSKY responded that it was because she knew WALTER .

KAYE and BETTY CURRIE. CARTER asked if LEWINSKY had ever been alone with the President and LEWINSKY responded that she had delivered papers to the President on the weekend and that they had chatted about general topics. CARTER asked LEWINSKY if she had sex with the President and LEWINSKY denied that she had.

LEWINSKY asked CARTER if she could sue JONES's attorneys for invasion of privacy, and asked him if she had to cash the check that they sent with the subpoena. CARTER asked LEWINSKY to look for additional things, such as the photograph: of: :. the President wearing one of her ties, and to look for the photograph of LEWINSKY's family with the President. LEWINSKY said that she could not find these items and CARTER said that she had to produce whatever was in her control. CARTER said that this was a standard subpoena and may have just been a fishing

1480

OIC- 3u2a (Rev. s- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

colellation of OIC- Xl2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 01/ 98 .m 10 expedition. LEWINSKY explained that she did not want to get involved in the JONES case and that she was going to a new job in New York. CARTER suggested that prior to preparing an affidavit for LEWINSKY; he would call. the JONES people and maybe have LEWINSKY give them an interview. LEWINSKY urged CARTER to call the BENNETT. people, and he agreed to do so. LEWINSKY wanted the President to know that she was a team player. called BENNETT's office in her presence. CARTER may have

CARTER said that he would send a retainer agreement in the mail.

LEWINSKY went back to work on December 22, 1997, and may have called VERNON JORDAN from a pay phone. LEWINSKY spoke with LINDA TRIPP at least once in person that afternoon., This conversation consisted of TRIPP telling LEWINSKY not to ask her to lie, and LEWINSKY reminding TRIPP that she had promised not to tell anyone about LEWINSKY's relationship with the President. TRIPP countered with the statement that her promise not to tell was not binding if she was under oath. wasn't thinking about under oath," LEWINSKY replied, "1

which meant that she wanted TRIPP to lie no matter what the circumstances. TRIPP kept 'reminding LEWINSKY that VERNON JORDAN had gotten LEWINSKY a big name lawyer, but suggested that LEWINSKY might want to get an independent lawyer. jealous of LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY thought that perhaps TRIPP was LEWINSKY told TRIPP that she wanted to be in the CLINTON/ BENNETT camp. LEWINSKY did not want to acknowledge that TRIPP was "doing her in," the truth by this time. and was not always telling TRIPP

LEWINSKY did not think that it was so wrong to lie on the affidavit, because this concerned a personal matter and was none of PAULA JONES's business.

In regard to the E- mail sent and received on LEWINSKY's computer. at the Pentagon, at some point during the week after LEWINSKY was subpoenaed, the computer person, FLOYD LNU, said

* that the E- mail was automatically destroyed every four weeks. FLOYD also told LEWINSKY how to permanently delete E- mail and LEWINSKY then made some deletions of her E- mail, specifically those sent to KATHRYN ALLDAY DAVIS, and a few to TRIPP. Sometime in December 1997, LEWINSKY asked TRIPP to delete the E- mail that. TRIPP had received from LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY did this because E- mail would leave a trail. The President was unaware that LEWINSKY had mentioned him in E- mail and never told LEWINSKY to delete any of her messages.

On December 23, 1997, LEWINSKY was interviewed for a job by an AMERICAN EXPRESS official in Washington. The interviewer advised LEWINSKY that LEWINSKY really did not have the experience necessary for the position. DARCY BACON, wife of

1481

29D OIC LR 35063

cohtin of OK- 3al of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 01/ 98 .M 11 KEN BACON, took LEWINSKY to lunch. LEWINSKY may have called TRIPP that night. If so, this was the last time LEWINSKY talked to TRIPP until January, 1998.

December 24, 1997, was LEWINSICY's last day at the Pentagon.

From December 25 to 27, LEWINSKY was in town, LINDA TRIPP did not return her calls. The situation was depressing. LEWINSKY'S mother, MARCIA LEWIS, came down from New York on December 26 or 27, as PETER STRAUS had gone skiing. At some point, LEWIS suggested to LEWINSKY that she get in touch. with a Christian Scientist woman in New York for counseling.

On December 27, 1997, LEWINSKY called BETTY CURRIE about the Christmas presents the President had for her. CURRIE was giving a White House tour to her church group the next morning so she told LEWINSKY to come in then.

On December 28, 1997, LEWINSKY went to BETTY CURRIE's office at about 8: 30 a. m. CURRIE and LEWINSKY played with BUDDY in the Oval Office while the President was on the telephone. LEWINSKY went to the back rooms with the President so that he could get some coffee. LEWINSKY asked the President how her name had gotten on the PAULA JONES witness list. The President responded that it may have been "that woman from last summer" who was involved in the KATHLEEN WILLEY thing, and that maybe she just wants to cause trouble. The President asked LEWINSKY if she had told that woman or anyone else about the hatpin, and LEWINSKY denied that she had. The President suggested that maybe one of the USSS uniform guards or someone else had seen LEWINSKY with the hatpin when she was leaving. LEWINSKY said this could not have happened.

LEWINSKY said that she was concerned about the gifts that the President had given her and suggested to the President that BETTY CTJRRIE hold the gifts. The President said something like, "I don't know," or "I'll think about it." The President did not tell LEWINSICY what to do with the gifts at that time. LEWINSKY told the President that she was going to sign an 1

affidavit, and that she was moving to New York, to which the President responded, l'Good. n LEWINSKY probably did not tell CURRIE about receiving the JONES subpoena. CURRIE walked LEWINSICY by the Palm Room, and may have taken that route to avoid a particular guard. LEWINSKY had left her, pass in the office and

OIC402a (Rev. &I!%%)

1482

29D OIC LR 35063

connnuarion of OK- 301 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .ti 08/ 01/ 98 .~ ge 12 CURRIE asked the guards at the southwest gate to let LEWINSKY out without the pass.

BETTY CURRIE called LEWINSKY at home later in the day, and said, aI understand that you have something for me." LEWINSKY was not surprised that CURRIE called since LEWINSKY had talked to the President about the gifts earlier that day. When CURRIE called, there was no question in LEWINSK'Y's mind that CURRIE knew what she was calling for. LEWINSKY then took the hat pin, and other selected items that would cause suspicion, and placed them in a box. LEWINSKY kind of compromised in deciding what to give to CURRIE to hold for her; for instance, the books that the President had given her were too sentimental to give back just in case LEWINSKY never got the box back. LEWINSKY put the r, eaves of Grm book in her closet in a plastic bag. LEWINSKY cave the box to BETTY CURRIE when CURRIE came bv the Watergate- about 2: 00 p. m. LEWINSKY had sealed the box so that CURRIE would not look at the items, and marked "do not throw away" in hopes that neither CURRIE nor the President would destroy the gifts. By giving the box of gifts to CURRIE, LEWINSKY was, in her mind, placing these items in the President's control. LEWINSKY said that the cassette tapes of the President's messages and the blue dress she wore on February 20, 1997 had already been taken to New York earlier in December. LEWINSKY told CURRIE not to throw the box away. CDRRIE did not comment. LEWINSKY also gave CURRIE a small plant and a balloon to take to CDRRIE's mother, who was in the hospital.

On December 28 or 29, 1997, LEWINSKY's brother MICHAEL was in town and LEWINSKY traveled to New York.

On December 29 or 30, 1997, LEWINSKY took a test at BDRSON, MARSTELLER.

On December 30, 1997, LEWINSKY called VERNON JORDAN to discuss the job situation and was invited by either JORDAN or GAIL, his secretary, to have breakfast with JORDAN the next day. LEWINSKY traveled to Washington by train. LEWINSKY intended to surface the fact to JORDAN that LINDA TRIPP may have been the source of information resulting in LEWINSKY's subpoena by the JONES lawyers since, she had not acknowledged that to the President. LEWINSKY expected JORDAN to advise the President of; ': this information.

On December 31, 1997, LEWINSKY arrived at the PARK HYATT MELROSE RESTAURANT on M Street by taxi, about 8: 00 a. m. or 8: 30 a. m., and the hostess advised LEWINSKY that Mr. JORDAN was

1483

01c_ 3o. a (Rev. 8- 194)

29D OIC LR 35063

corniolntioo of OK- 3m of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .011 08/ 01/ 98 .h 13

running late. Upon JORDAN's arrival, they sat at JORDAN's usual table. LEWINSKY inquired whether JORDAN was going to the "Renaissance" weekend and he replied that he was not. LEWINSKY advised that she had seen the President. JORDAN and LEWINSKY talked about jobs.

LEWINSKY felt she could not fake the story about TRIPP to the President, but assumed that he would get the message if LEWINSKY told JORDAN; therefore, LEWINSKY said to JORDAN that perhaps the leak to the JONES attorneys had been from one of her friends who spent the night at. her house, and who could have seen her notes. JORDAN asked, "The President wrote you notes?" LEWINSKY said the notes were not from the President, but. were notes that she had written about him. JORDAN said, "Make sure they're not there." LEWINSKY took this to mean that JORDAN wanted her to destroy the notes. LEWINSKY did go home and throw out the notes, drafts of letters and notes to the President, and a card lVStarry, Starry Night." This occurred when LEWINSKY was packing to move to New York and she was eliminating things. LEWINSKY disposed of perhaps 50 pages.

After breakfast on December 31, 1997, JORDAN drove LEWINSKY back to his office. LEWINSKY asked whether the President would always be married to Mrs. CLINTON and JORDAN responded in the affirmative and quoted an unrecalled bible verse to LEWINSKY. JORDAN said, "Maybe you two can have an affair in three years." LEWINSKY responded that they had already had an affair with everything but sex. JORDAN responded with one of his grunts of acknowledgment, but did not appear to want to know any further details.

LEWINSKY then read the transcript from LINDA TRIPP tape number six, pages 12 to 22, concerning her first meeting with JORDAN. In regard to the statement, "The other one also asked you -- you didn't tell anyone did you?" LEWINSKY said that'she could not recall saying that, but her recollection might improve if she could hear the actual tape.

On January 3 or 4, 1998, LEWINSKY dropped off a book to BETTY CURRIE for the President. The book was entitled Presi& nts of the United Staw and contained a romantic note that LEWINSKY had written to the President after she saw the movie "Titanic."

On January 9, 1998, at about 4: 00 p. m., a woman from REVLON called, indicated that LEWINSKY's prospects for a job at REVLON were good, and said that a woman from the Human Resources

1484

or- 3329 (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Condnuation of or- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .c,, 08/ 01/ 98 .Rge 14 Department would call LEWINSKY on Monday to extend a formal

offer.

On January call to LINDA TRIPP.

9, 1998, LEWINSKY probably had a 30 minute On January offer from the Human job.

12, 1998, LEWINSKY received an informal job Resources person and informally accepted the

On January 13, 1998, LEWINSKY had a five minute conversation with VERNON JORDAN.

LEWINSKY did not recall if she received a telephone- call from FRANK CARTER on January 15, 1998, but she did recall that at some point she was paged by FRANK CARTER while shopping at SAFEWAY on Wisconsin Avenue. LEWINSKY called CARTER, at which time CARTER asked if LEWINSKY had ever received packages from the White House, or sent things to the White House by courier. LEWINSKY responded that she had sent packages by courier to BETTY CURRIE at the White House. LEWINSKY called SPEED COURIER SERVICE and found out that their policy was not to reveal any information about deliveries unless subpoenaed. LEWINSKY therefore concluded that the records had already been subpoenaed. LEWINSKY began wondering how the JONES attorneys could have known about the courier service. After thinking about it later, LEWINSKY was suspicious of MARK HUFFMAN, BETTY CURRIE, and LINDA TRIPP.

Later that day, LEWINSKY gave a ride to BETTY CURRIE and asked her about the call that CURRIE had received from MIKE ISIKOFF, in which ISIKOFF asked CURRIE about the package deliveries at the White House. LEWINSKY called LINDA TRIPP to

. tell TRIPP that if ISIKOFF called, to tell him that TRIPP did not know anything about her relationship with the President.

Between January 13 and January 15, 1998, LEWINSKY had a

conversation with BETTY CURRIE about contacting JOHN PODESTA, because LEWINSKY was worried that her former supervisor at the White House, JOHN HILLEY, would not recommend her. LEWINSKY needed a favorable reference for the job at Revlon.

The interviewed terminated at 5: 03, p. m.

1485

Tab 23

1486

OIC- 302 (Rev. 8- 19- w) - 1 -

OFFICE OF THE Izil) EPEh?) mi COUNSEL

Dau of transcripdon 08/ 03/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed under the terms of an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) and her. LEWINSKY was interviewed at the Office of the Independent Counsel, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, DC 20004. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, AIC CRAIG LERNER, AIC JULIE MYERS and Deputy Independent Counsel (DIG) ROBERT BITTMAN. Present representing LEWINSKY were PRESTON BURTON and ROBERT BREDHOFF. LEWINSKY provided the following information, beginning at approximately lo: 25 a. m.

On January 4, 1998, LEWINSKY called BETTY CURRIE in the late afternoon to arrange a meeting with CURRIE. LEWINSKY went to CURRIE's home to give CURRIE a package to give to President WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised this was the first time she went to CURRIE's home to give CURRIE a package to give to CLINTON.

In the package was a book about the Presidents of the United States and a note. LEWINSKY cannot recall exactly when she purchased the book, but it occurred sometime after December 28, 1997. LEWINSKY advised she thinks she purchased the book on January 2 or January 3, 1998. LEWINSKY advised she withdrew $40 from the RIGGS NATIONAL BANK automatic teller machine on Wisconsin Avenue in Georgetown to buy the book.

LEWINSKY advised she purchased the book at a book store next to the Christian Scientist book store on Wisconsin Avenue. LEWINSKY advised she and ASHLEY RAINES saw the movie "Titanic," which prompted her to write the note she enclosed with the book. LEWINSKY advised she was feeling very down when she wrote the note. LEWINSKY described the note as very romantic.

When LEWINSKY saw CURRIE, LEWINSKY asked CURRIE to give the package to CLINTON. LEWINSKY and CURRIE also spoke about LEWINSKY's New Year's Eve encounter with STEVE NEUWIRTH.

LEWINSKY advised she was at CURRIE's residence for approximately twenty minutes.

Investigation on 08/ 2/ 98 CI

at Washington, DC File I 29D- OIC- LR- 35063 Datcdiaalcd 08/ 03/ 98

1488

OIC- Mza (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIt- LR- 35063

continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 2/ 98 . Page 2 LEWINSKY advised that giving CURRIE, on December 28, 1997, the box with some of the gifts CLINTON had given LEWINSKY, on December 28th made LEWINSKY feel she was assuring CLINTON that she was on the same team. LEWINSKY does not recall talking about the PKLA JONES case with CURRIE. LEWINSKY may have mentioned LEWINSKY's idea about settling the JONES case with CLINTON on December 17, 1997.

On January 5, 1998, LEWINSKY met with FRANK CARTER, though she can not recall the exact time. LEWINSKY advised CARTER asked her a few difficult questions about sex. LEWINSKY told CARTER she did not have sex with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised the two went into detail about how a deposition is conducted. LEWINSKY asked if her parents could be present during the deposition. LEWINSKY did not consider the meeting a full preparation session for the deposition.

LEWINSKY advised CARTER told her the types of questions that wculd be asked during the deposition, including how LEWINSKY got her job at the Pentagon. LEWINSKY advised this worried her as she did not know how to answer questions related to her transfer to the Pentagon without the answers leading to her relaticnship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY was concerned that the attorneys for JONES would go to people at the White House to verify LEWINSKY's answers and, not like LEWINSKY, because some of those people did

they would contradict what LEWINSKY said under oath.

LEWINSKY could not recall taking any items to CARTER's office on January 5, 1998, although she could have, but she definitely recalls doing so on another occasion.

CARTER told LEWINSKY that, in civil cases, a lot of things were done at the last minute, so she probably would not hear about her subpoena being quashed until later.

During one of her meetings with CARTER, LEWINSKY mentioned telling LINDA TRIPP about LEWINSKY's subpoena. CARTER got a copy of the Newsweek article regarding TRIPP and KATHLEEN WILLEY.

LEWINSKY left the meeting with the understanding CARTER was to draft an affidavit and LEWINSKY would pick it up later that day.

.I LEWINSKY received a copy of the affidavit on January 5 or, 6, 1998. LEWINSKY. uyas nervous about signing the affidavit and

1489

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .03 08/ 2/ 98 .hge 3 wanted VERNON JORDAN to review a copy of the affidavit and approve it. LEWINSKY thought that, by having JORDAN approve the affidavit, it, was the same as having CLINTON's approval.

On January 5 or 6, 1998 LEWINSKY called CURRIE to tell her LEWINSKY needed to talk to CLINTON. (LEWINSKY advised that on her December 28, 1997 meeting with CLINTON, CLINTON told LEWINSKY to call CURRIE if LEWINSKY had any questions about anything related to the JONES matter.) LEWINSKY was very cryptic with CURRIE when they talked. LEWINSKY said she was going to sign something the next day and she needed to speak with CLINTON before doing so. LEWINSKY advised she wanted to make CLINTON nervous.

LEWINSKY advised CURRIE called at approximately 7 or 8 p. m. LEWINSKY was at the. apartment of her aunt, DEBRA FINERMAN, when CURRIE called. LEWINSKY had told CURRIE that is where she would be. CURRIE transferred the call to CLINTON.

LEWINSKY told CLINTON she had spoken to CARTER and went over possible questions that would be asked in her deposition. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY what she was concerned about. LEWINSKY told CLINTON she was worried about giving lVvanillalt answers to questions about how LEWINSKY got her job at the Pentagon. LEWINSKY was concerned that people at the White House, who did not like LEWINSKY, would "screw" her.

CLINTON told LEWINSKY to say that people in the Office of Legislative Affairs (OLA) found the position and the people in the OLA recommended her for it. LEWINSKY said that she could answer that way. (LEWINSKY advised that explanation was true, but it was not the entire truth.)

LEWINSKY was reassured by what CLINTON said about her transfer to the Pentagon. LEWINSKY and CLINTON spoke about the affidavit. LEWINSKY advised she did not want to sign anything until she was reassured by the White House that she would not be "screwed." LEWINSKY asked CLINTON if he wanted to see the affidavit and CLINTON said no, he had seen about fifteen of them.

CLINTON advised he liked the book she had given him. LEWINSKY told CLINTON it cost $40 and CLINTON asked why she paid- so much for it. LEWINSKY brought up the subject of the .note she gave him with the book. CLINTON said that LEWINSKY should not write things like that on paper. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON was referring to romantic items LEWINSKY had placed in the note. LEWINSKY assumed CLINTON threw away the notes she gave him.

1490

OK- 30h (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

ContimMdon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ Z/ 98 ,~ ge 4 LEWINSKY advised the notes would be more incriminating than the gifts.

The telephone call lasted about ten minutes. {LEWINSKY advised that on ltZEDILLO Day," she saw a cut- out of the Valentine's Day personal advertisement she had placed in the "Washington Post." LEWINSKY saw CLINTON's copy of the advertisement on the desk in the Oval Office study.}

LEWINSKY advised she was annoyed with CLINTON that day because of a photograph in the newspaper that showed CLINTON and HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON dancing together on a beach.

LEWINSKY advised that she has January 5 and 6, 1998 confused at this time.

LEWINSKY advised that on January 6, 1998, she received a call from CARTER saying the draft affidavit was ready. Later that day, LEWINSKY called JORDAN's office and was told by JORDAN's secretary GAYLE Last Name Unknown (LNU) that JORDAN was out of town. LEWINSKY stopped by CARTER's office in the afternoon and picked up the draft affidavit, which CARTER had left in an envelope on the first floor of his office.

LEWINSKY took the affidavit home, read it and underlined the areas she was concerned about. LEWINSKY was concerned about the last sentence in paragraph six which read "this would have lasted only a matter of minutes and would not have been a "private" meeting, that is not behind closed doors." LEWINSKY was also concerned about paragraph eight regarding seeing the President "with crowds of other people present."

LEWINSKY advised she had previously planned on signing the affidavit on January 6, 1998, but decided JORDAN needed to see the affidavit first. LEWINSKY copied the affidavit and dropped it off at JORDAN's office that afternoon. LEWINSKY did not tell CARTER she was showing the affidavit to JORDAN. LEWINSKY advised that having JORDAN's approval was the same as CLINTON's.

LEWINSKY advised that most of the changes made to the- draft affidavit she showed JORDAN were LEWINSKY's ideas: LEWINSKY is sure JORDAN commented on the affidavit, but she is not sure if he suggested any changes. LEWINSKY advised she may have crossed out the items she had previously underlined during the course of her discussion with JORDAN. LEWINSKY advised she

1491

OIC- 3OZa (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Corltirmanon of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 2/ 98 .pagc 5 did not discuss the sexual relationship aspect of the affidavit with JORDAN and only spoke with him for about six minutes.

LEWINSKY told JORDAN she would talk to CARTER the following day to sign the affidavit. LEWINSKY expected JORDAN to let CLINTON know when the affidavit was signed. LEWINSKY asked JORDAN if she should give a signed copy of the affidavit to CLINTON and JORDAN said no. LEWINSKY advised JORDAN never said JORDAN did not want to see the affidavit.

LEWINSKY advised she was unaware of JORDAN's telephone calls that same day to NANCY HERNREICH and CLINTON. After looking at all the telephone contact that was made between JORDAN and CLINTON as reflected on a chart of phone records presented to her by the OIC, LEWINSKY advised that it seems suspicious.

LEWINSKY advised she does not recall what she did during the evening of January 6, 1998, but she did feel relieved to be signing the affidavit. LEWINSKY felt that her involvement in the JONES matter would be over.

On January 7, 1998, LEWINSKY met with CARTER at 1O: OO a. m. LEWINSKY does not recall bringing any items with her. LEWINSKY did bring a copy of the draft affidavit with her. LEWINSKY advised she and CARTER met in CARTER's office. On previous occasions, she and CARTER met in a conference room.

LEWINSKY advised CARTER had three versions of the affidavit to show her. There was not much difference between the three drafts. LEWINSKY advised none of the affidavits mentioned her having a sexual relationship with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY advised that it was her idea not to put anything in the affidavit about being alone with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised CARTER suggested the language used when describing the procedure of getting CLINTON's signature on official documents.

LEWINSKY thought the statement in her affidavit that she could not fathom any reason why she was subpoenaed was not completely false. LEWINSKY felt the JONES case was about sexual harassment and LEWINSKY was not sexually harassed. LEWINSKY --

advised LEWINSKY lost her job at the White House because of her sexual relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she was involved in a consensual sexual relationship with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY advised she met with CARTER for one hour to an

1492

OIC- 3U2a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Contimadon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 2/ 98 .page - hour and one half. LEWINSKY advised she recalled walking down the hall to have the affidavit notarized_ LEWINSKY recalls walking down the hall rationalizing to herself that she did not have a sexual relationship with CLINTON, when, in fact, she had. LEWINSKY rationalized lying about having a "sexual relationship" with CLINTON because they never had sexual intercourse.

LEWINSKY advised she does not have a direct memory of JORDAN's involvement with CARTER after LEWINSKY hired CARTER. LEWINSKY advised that after she looked at the chart of phone records presented to her by the OIC, she believes JORDAN's involvement may have been more substantial than she previously believed.

CARTER told LEWINSKY that he would send a copy of the affidavit to PAULA JONES' attorney, DAVID PYKE. LEWINSKY thought it was obvious that CARTER would apprise BOB BENNETT of her affidavit. LEWINSKY just wanted to. do what CLINTON and BENNETT wanted her to do. LEWINSKY may have called JORDAN to let him know the affidavit was signed.

LEWINSKY's goal with the affidavit was not to give the JONES people a "little snag of yarn so they could pull the whole sweater apart."

LEWINSKY advised she was relieved since her conversation with CLINTON, on December 17, 1997, that he was assured she was comfortable with the situation.

LEWINSKY advised she left CARTER's office and soon left for New York to be with her mother. LEWINSKY advised she told her mother about the affidavit, but does not recall her mother's reaction. LEWINSKY took a signed copy of the affidavit with her to New York so she could have it in her possession.

On January 8th, LEWINSKY advised she had an interview at McANDREWS & FORBES (M& F) that did not go well at all. LEWINSKY advised she had previously met with RICHARD HALPERIN and someone else from M& F, so she was not sure why this meeting was necessary. LEWINSKY was very concerned after this interview, because, in addition to the interview going poorly, LEWINSKY had not yet heard from BURSON & MARSTELLER (B& M). LEWINSKY was also -

concerned that her poor showing at the interview would be a bad reflection on JORDAN.

6 LEWINSKY called JORDAN several times after the interview to advise him how the interview went. Initially,

1493

OIC- 303 tRcv. 8- 19- 94

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuanon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINS- KY ,on 08/ 2/ 98 .pagc 7 LEWINSKY left JORDAN messages, but she eventually spoke to him. LEWINSKY sensed that JORDAN was annoyed that nothing had come up yet in the form of a job for LEWINSKY. JORDAN called LEWINSKY back and said that he had spoken to the chairman of M& F, and JORDAN told LEWINSKY not to worry. JORDAN told LEWINSKY someone from M& F would be calling her back to arrange for another interview.

Later that day, JAYMIE DURNAN, or DURNAN's secretary, called LEWINSKY to arrange a meeting for the following day. LEWINSKY advised she may have called JORDAN later that evening, but she did not fax anything to JORDAN's office from her, mother's apartment.

On January 9, 1998, sometime in the morning, LEWINSKY called LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY told TRIPP she was calling from a pay phone because LEWINSKY was concerned about calling TRIPP from home. LEWINSKY thought JONES' attorneys might be tapping her phones.

LEWINSKY advised TRIPP's tone was different than her most recent calls. TRIPP told LEWINSKY about TRIPP's visit with NORMA ASNES. According to TRIPP, a friend of ASNES's told TRIPP to get a job in New York in the public relations field. TRIPP also told LEWINSKY that TRIPP now thought it was good to be vague on the truth when it came to the deposition.

LEWINSKY told TRIPP that LEWINSKY had had no contact with JORDAN, CURRIE or CLINTON since December, even though that was false. LEWINSKY told TRIPP that LEWINSKY had not heard anything about job offers. Neither of these things was true, but LEWINSKY told TRIPP this because LEWINSKY was wary of TRIPP ever since TRIPP said she was going to tell the truth about LEWINSKY's relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY did not tell TRIPP that LEWINSKY had signed the affidavit. TRIPP told LEWINSKY not to sign the affidavit until LEWINSKY had a job.

LEWINSKY advised this call with TRIPP put LEWINSKY at ease, so LEWINSKY agreed to meet TRIPP when LEWINSKY returned to Washington, D. C.

On January 9, 1998, between 11: OO a. m. and 11: 30 a. m., -

LEWINSKY met with ALLAIN SEIDMAN and two other people from REVLON. LEWINSKY was very excited to work in the area of public relations that they discussed with her. LEWINSKY may have referenced her previous interview at M& F, and she may have referred to JORDAN. LEWINSKY also interviewed with the Human

1494

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 2/ 98 ,page 8 Resources manager at REVLON.

LEWINSKY advised she called JORDAN after the interview to let him know it went well. LEWINSKY advised she received a telephone call from SEIDMAN, in which LEWINSKY was offered a position at REVLON as a floater in the public relations department. LEWINSKY was advised her salary would be approximately $40,000.

LEWINSKY recalled being annoyed. at the salary and she complained to JORDAN about it. JORDAN told LEWINSKY to quit whining.

LEWINSKY does not recall calling CARTER on January 9, 1998. LEWINSKY did call CURRIE from a pay phone at the PIERRE HOTEL, to tell her about the job offer. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON may have been out of town. LEWINSKY may have asked CURRIE to tell CLINTON about the job offer.

LEWINSKY advised that, in all the times she tried to reach JORDAN, she only got through to him half the time.

LEWINSKY does not recall what she did on January 10, 1998, except for the afternoon, to give JORDAN. which she spent looking for a tie

LEWINSKY recalls that on January 11, 1998, STEVE NEUWIRTH called and said he did not want to see LEWINSKY that night or ever again.

LEWINSKY advised that on January 12, 1998, LEWINSKY sat by the phone awaiting a call. CARTER paged LEWINSKY and when she returned the page, CARTER advised her that he had submitted her affidavit to PYKE.

LEWINSKY called CURRIE on January 12, trying to get a recommendation from the OLA. LEWINSKY was also trying to find out if CURRIE had told CLINTON about LEWINSKY's offer.

LEWINSKY traveled on a 6: 00 a. m. train from New York to Washington, D. C. LEWINSKY met JORDAN at 9: 30 a. m. in JORDAN's new 4th floor office. LEWINSKY met with JORDAN for five minutes and gave him a tie and a pocket square as a sign of her appreciation. _

JORDAN was not as warm with LEWINSKY as he had previously been. others.

JORDAN quoted the Bible in referring to helping LEWINSKY perceived this to be the end of her working relationship with JORDAN.

1495

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuadon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 2/ 98 ,Rge 9 LEWINSKY advised she and CURRIE started using the code name II my II when they paged each other because someone once saw CURRIE's pager, which contained a message from LEWINSKY. The code name "KAY" was LEWINSKY's idea, because both she and CURRIE knew WALTER KAYE. The code name "MARY" was used for LINDA TRIPP.

LEWINSKY may have received a page from CURRIE on January 13, 1998. LEWINSKY faxed a letter on January 13 or 14, 1998 regarding references at the White House. LEWINSKY mentioned JOHN HILLEY as a person who should write her recommendation. LEWINSKY thinks JOHN PODESTA's name may have come up during a conversation with CURRIE as the person who would arrange. for LEWINSKY's reference.

LEWINSKY advised that she told TRIPP several lies during her meeting with TRIPP on January 13, 1998. LEWINSKY told TRIPP she had not signed the affidavit when, in fact she had; LEWINSKY told TRIPP she had not heard about a job, when in fact she had; and LEWINSKY told TRIPP she was taking PAXIL, when she was not. LEWINSKY advised she tried to shift things so that TRIPP thought the situation was everyone against TRIPP and LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY advised she does not know what she would have done if TRIPP had accepted her offer of the condominium in Australia. LEWINSKY thought the offer could be compared to someone saying they would give someone their first- born. LEWINSKY advised she would have spoken to CURRIE and CLINTON to ensure TRIPP did not lose her job.

On January 14, 1998, LEWINSKY called TRIPP from a pay phone at the WATERGATE Apartments and told TRIPP to have NORMA

* ASNES get TRIPP a Democratic attorney. TRIPP was scheduled to see KIRBY BEHRE that day to sign an affidavit. TRIPP had told LEWINSKY to get TRIPP pulled out of meetings if LEWINSKY called TRIPP at work.

LEWINSKY prepared the "talking points" at her home computer on January 14, 1998. TRIPP told LEWINSKY she had fired KIRBY BEHRE as her attorney and hired a new one. TRIPP told LEWINSKY she did not want it to look like she was not a lVteamll player. TRIPP had previously told LEWINSKY that she gave BEHRB a sealed envelope, containing the written summary of the information LEWINSKY had told TRIPP about LEWINSKY's affair with CLINTON, in case anything happened to TRIPP.

LEWINSKY felt pressure to hold TRIPP's hand during

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

1496

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 2/ 98 .pagc 10 TRIPP's affidavit. LEWINSKY drove TRIPP home that gave her the talking points. TRIPP seemed glad to guidance for the affidavit.

evening and have some

On January 15, 1998, LEWINSKY returned a page from CARTER. CARTER asked LEWINSKY if she ever received courier packages from the White House. LEWINSKY said she had not received any packages from the White House via courier, but had sent some there using a courier. CARTER said that someone from

BENNETT's office had called and mentioned the existence of courier records of items sent to the White House, referencing LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY went home and called SPEEDY COURIER service and, without identifying herself, asked if they would ever turn over records. The respondent said they would not turn over records unless they had been subpoenaed. This made LEWINSKY think the courier service had been subpoenaed.

LEWINSKY returned CURRIE's page. CURRIE said that MIKE - ISIKOFF had called asking about CURRIE's intern. {LEWINSKY

advised CURRIE must have known about LEWINSKY'S involvement in the JONES case, but cannot remember specifically speaking about it with her.} CURRIE said ISIKOFF started asking about courier records.

CURRIE was nervous. LEWINSKY then "freaked out." At that time, LEWINSKY thought it made more sense that CARTER had asked about the records. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON was out of town because she recalls CURRIE saying she would tell CLINTON when he returned_ CURRIE later paged LEWINSKY and LEWINSKY called her. CURRIE asked LEWINSKY to drive her to JORDAN's office. CURRIE's ’

husband had her automobile for the day. LEWINSKY then called TRIPP and suggested that MARK HOFFMAN from the Pentagon must have been the source of the courier records leak to Newsweek. LEWINSKY advised TRIPP not to talk to Newsweek, if contacted.

LEWINSKY thinks CURRIE went to see JORDAN because JORDAN acted as "damage control." CURRIE may have been concerned about CURRIE's involvement with the LEWINSKY matter. LEWINSKY ~.- -

waited at the "FRONT PAGE" restaurant and had onion soup while CURRIE met with JORDAN. LEWINSKY advised it was raining that day and there was an O. J. SIMPSON interview on the television while she ate.

OK- 302a (Rev. 13- 19- W

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 2/ 98 .pagc _U CURRIE met with JORDAN for approximately twenty minutes. When CURRIE returned to LEWINSKY, CURRIE explained that she had had a drink with JORDAN in his office. CURRIE said she would wait to see CLINTON before deciding what to do. CURRIE said she would call CLINTON in the Residence, first thing in the morning, to let him know CURRIE needed to speak with him.

LEWINSKY considered the discovery of the courier receipts a "big deal" and advised she could sense a lot of tension from CURRIE. LEWINSKY sensed the situation getting out of control.

On January 16th, LEWINSKY went to a gym on Connecticut Avenue and called CURRIE from a pay phone there. CURRIE said she had spoken to CLINTON, who said not to respond to the inquiries from Pewsweek.

LEWINSKY advised she felt very low and depressed on January 16, 1998.

LEWINSKY advised she can not easily discuss any further details of January 16, 1998 at this time, as she feels guilty about getting everyone involved.

On January 18, 1998, LEWINSKY was paged by CURRIE. LEWINSKY was told by her attorney, BILL GINSBURG, not to return the pages. LEWINSKY was paged numerous times by CURRIE during that time frame. LEWINSKY returned a couple of the pages by calling CURRIE from a pay phone and leaving cryptic messages, hoping CURRIE would be able to figure out what was happening. LEWINSKY advised on one occasion, she said something about 'lHOOVER, '" hoping CURRIE would make the connection to the Federal Bureau of Investigation_ LEWINSKY felt responsible for the crisis they were in.

The interview ended at approximately 2 p. m.

1498

1499

Tab 24

1501

OK- xz mv. 8- 1%) - 1 -

OFFXCEOFTIiEINDEFENDENTCOUNsEL

Daxc5faar. lscripjon 08/ 10/ 98 MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of Independent Counsel (OICl, LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMJSRGUT, AIC MARY ANNF WIRTH, and AIC JULIE MYERS. Representing LFWINSKY was Attorney PRESTON BURTON and Law Clerk MATTHEW UMHOFER of the law offices of PLATO CACHERIS. The interview was conducted in Suite 490, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, D. C. beginning at 12: 07 p. m. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

LEWINSKY first saw the President in person in July 1995, when she attended a function with WALTER KAYE and ,her mother. At that time LEWINSKY was impressed with how handsome the President appeared.

On August 10, 1995, LEWINSKY attended the birthday party of the President on the grounds of the White House. At that time, LEWINSKY made eye contact with the President and began flirting with him. LEWINSKY does not believe that she would have been hired if anyone knew that they were flirting.

On or about August 13, 1995, LEWINSKY introduced herself to the President at a departure ceremony.

In September, 1995, LEWINSKY reintroduced herself to the President in the basement of the White House as he was passing. The occasion was the visit of LEWINSKY's friend, NATALIE UNGVARI, who was on a tour. LEWINSKY was waiting with U. S. Secret Service (USSS) uniformed officer LEWIS FOX for UNGVARI's return. LEWINSKY had her photograph taken with the President on this occasion.

In October 1995, the President waved at LEWINSKY once in passing.

During the first week in November 1995, LHWINSKY was in New York for the investiture of WALTER KAYE as a civilian aide of the U. S. Army. At this point, LEWINSKY was a second term intern who wanted to get a permanent job in the White House. While there, LEWINSKY received a call from JENNIFER PALMIERI, who

-rionon 8/ 03/ 98 ti WASHINGTON, D. C. File I 290 OIC LR 35063 mledimtcd 8/ 10/ 98

1502

OIC- 3021 (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Contimmtion of OK- 3U2 of MONICA S. LEWINSICY ,on 08/ 03/ 98 .~ gc -

advised LEWINSKY of a job opening in the Office of Legislative Affairs (OLA). On the following Monday, LEWINSKY submitted a resume to her supervisor, TRACY BOBOWITZ, or to TIM KEATING. On Wednesday or Thursday, LEWINSKY brought writing samples and was interviewed by KEATING. The interview went well and LEWINSKY was called soon. thereafter to meet SUSAN BROPHY and PAT GRIFFIN. LEWINSKY sent letters to each of them.

On November 10, 1996, KEATING advised LEWINSKY that she had gotten the job, but that the furlough was imminent and the paperwork had not cleared yet. LEWINSKY worked through the furlough as an intern without pay. LEWINSKY took a drug. test and met JOCELYN JOLLEY. LEON PANTETTA's office was staffed during the furlough by LEWINSKY and two male interns. During the furlough, the President came to the office of PANETTA as often as five times a day. One of. these interns remarked that the President was coming to visit quite frequently and that he, the President, must have had a crush on LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY was hired in OLA because of her good work as an intern in PANETTA's office. The President's name was never mentioned by KEATING, GRIFFIN, BROPHY, or LEWINSKY during the hiring process. LEWINSKY had not applied for any other jobs. LEWINSKY applied for the OLA job because it met her requirement that she would have a blue badge. This would permit LEWINSKY to go the West Wing and not be relegated to the Old Executive Office Building.

On November 17, 1995, BARRY TOIV commented that LEWINSKY was getting a lot of "face time" with the President for being an intern in PANETTA's office.

On the Friday after Thanksgiving 1995, LEWINSKY was trained briefly by JOCELYN JOLLEY. LEWINSKY began her new job in OLA the first week in December 1995. JOLLEY was out sick at least one day that week and left LEWINSKY to complete a large mailing. LEWINSKY basically fended on her own as there were no interns. JOLLEY had advised that she would handle all Office of Management and Budget (OMB) material related to the furlough. There was a large backlog of letters due to the furlough.

2 TIM KEATING was pleased with LEWINSKY's work. At around the time of the State of the Union Address, JOLLEY was again absent due to sickness and LEWINSKY was left to complete a lot of work pertaining to the address; LEWINSKY stayed late and gotgthe work done. However, LEWINSKY was very disappointed that neither she, JOLLEY, nor any of the interns were permitted to go

1503

OK- 3u2a CRrv. 8- i% W)

290 OIC LR 35063

CoIltimdon of OIC- M2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 .w 3

to Capitol Hill for the address. LEWINSKY did not wish to be lumped in with JOLLEY when the OLA work was being evaluated, because JOLLEY was frequently absent and came in late many times due to her diabetic condition. JOLLEY advised LEWINSKY that the turn around time on acknowledging congressional inquiries was too long. MAUREEN LEWIS had been doing letters to congressmen after they had trail'eled with the President. these political letters. LEWINSKY had started doing

KEATING found out about it and chewed out LEWINSKY for getting involved in someone else's area of responsibility; told LEWINSKY that she did not know what she was doing; and brought up a few other undisclosed problems. JAMIE RUBIN, BOB RUBIN's son, came on board to be the OLA liaison with the West Wing about this time.

In March 1996, LEWINSKY was visited a second time by her friend, NATALIE UNGVARI, .from San Francisco. LEWINSKY was escorting UNGVARI around the White House on a Sunday and was in the vicinity of the Senate Office. They observed a guy in denim with a baseball cap and LEWINSKY called to him before he went into the men's room in the hall. This person was the President, who had popcorn on his shirt, movie. apparently having just watched a

LEWINSKY introduced UNGVARI to the President. LEWINSKY had already told UNGVARI President by this time.

caused some consternation on the part of LEWINSKY. About two weeks before LEWINSKY's transfer in early April 1996, KEATING advised LEWINSKY to get her resume to the lady in Administration that sits next to ASHLEY RAINES. This was to complete LEWINSKY's personnel file. On the Friday before Easter, which was two days after RON BROWN was killed, LEWINSKY and JOLLEY were called to KEATING's office separately. KEATING advised that there had been problems in the Correspondence Unit and that JODIE TORKELSON wanted LEWINSKY and JOLLEY fired. Instead, both JOLLEY and LEWINSKY were being transferred to other agencies. JOLLEY was actually demoted.

KEATING advised LEWINSKY that she was too "sexy" to work in the White House, by which KEATING meant that LEWINSKY "could shine more" and could get a better job in the Pentagon. LEWINSKY's work at the White House was not criticized to her knowledge. IzEWINSKY never saw it coming and was totally surprised; she wept. LEWINSKY's first reaction was that she would never get to see the President again; her second reaction was that people thought she was spending too much time away from her desk and too much time near the Oval, Office. KEATING advised

1504

OIC- 302a mm. 819- w)

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuatioa of OIC- 3u2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 .~ ge 4 that there were no other openings in the White House at that time, but that perhaps LEWINSKY could come back after the election. KEATING said that LEWINSKY had a job in the Press Office at the Pentagon; that she would probably make more money; and that LEWINSKY should see PATSY THOMASSON about the transition. KEATING also counseled that LEWINSKY could take her vacation to Florida as planned. KEATING requested that LEWINSKY turn her pass in and that he would place LEWINSKY on the access list until the time she departed. KEATING did not ban LEWINSKY from the White House.

At this point, LEWINSKY did not know how BETTY CURRIE felt about her and LEWINSKY actually felt closer to NANCY HERNREICH. On the Monday after being transferred, LEWINSKY went to HERNREICH's office, at which time HERNREICH tried to console LEWINSKY, but told LEWINSKY that she had to interview for the Pentagon job. This was not what KEATING had told her. While leaving, LEWINSKY was stopped by CURRIE. CURRIE observed LEWINSKY crying and tried to console her by saying that sometimes things work out for the best. LEWINSKY believed that EVELYN LIEBERMAN, who had a connection with the First Lady, was the force behind the transfer. LEWINSKY also called ASHLEY RAINES and BAYANI NELVIS to advise them of the transfer.

On Thursday of that week, MARK HUFFMAN from the Pentagon called and advised that LEWINSKY would interview for the job of Confidential Assistant, which included many administrative duties. LEWINSKY interviewed successfully for the job. LEWINSKY objected to the heavy burden of administrative duties and was

advised that they would split the job and relieve LEWINSKY of some of those duties. CHARLIE DUNCAN's assistant at the Pentagon said there were no other jobs available there.

LEWINSKY was in touch with WALTER KAYE, who was instrumental in getting LEWINSKY the White House internship. LEWINSKY's parents had known KAYE many years ago in California and KAYE's grandson had been an intern. KAYE became involved politically when he contributed to the Democratic Party after selling his insurance company. ANN MCCOY, another White House employee, gave herself a birthday party in September 1995, which KAYE funded. There was some friction between MCCOY and her friends, and LEWINSKY's mother and aunt, at KAYE's investiture; In addition, MARSHA SCOTT, also a friend of KAYE, apparently felt that LEWINSKY's mother and aunt were somehow a threat to SCOTT. KAYE told DEBRA FINERMAN, LEWINSKY's aunt, that LEWINSKY had been transferred because there were rumors of LEWINSKY's relationship with the President. FINERMAN was angered because KAYE had not

1505

OIC- 3cr2a (Rev. 8- n- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

einution of OK- 332 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 .m 5 tried to defend LEWINSKY. Because of this, LEWINSKY did not attend a scheduled luncheon with KAYE on August 19, 1996.

On April 12, 1996, the President called LEWINSKY to explain why she had been transferred. The President did not know any of the details about the'pentagon job, and when LEWINSKY complained about it, the President advised her that if she did not like it he would get LEWINSKY a job on the campaign. LEWINSKY told the President that the job was boring and that she had complained to PATSY THOMASSON, who did nothing. The President stated that THOMASSQN was a friend of his.

On April 17, 1996, LEWINSKY started the Pentagon job, but hated it from the start as it was boring to her. Her superiors did not split the job as promised. The job was primarily as the gate keeper for KEN BACON. LEWINSKY said that her predecessor, JEAN WESSEL., an older woman, had more administrative experience than LEWINSKY, but lacked enough energy for the travel demands of the job. ' The job was a General Services 9 position paying $42,000 with overtime. LEWINSKY had been making $25,000 with no overtime pay at OLA. LEWINSKY developed a good interpersonal relationship with BACON.

TIM KEATING had advised LEWINSKY that her position at .OLA was not being filled, but after going to the Pentagon, LEWINSKY found out that the position had been filled. LEWINSKY wrote a letter to KEATING complaining about this and the fact that they assigned pagers to everyone; which LEWINSKY had suggested months ago. LEWINSKY also tried to explain to KEATING that her past job performance should not have been linked to that of JOLLEY. LEWINSKY may have called ANN Last Name Unknown at OLA to try to get her job back. While at OLA, LEWINSKY had gotten along with JANET MERDILLA, LUCIA WYMAN, and AL MAULDIN.

After beginning the job in the Pentagon, LEWINSKY was able to visit the President in the White House on weekends. Since LEWINSKY no longer had a blue badge, she had to be I, WAVED" in, and escorted. These visits were facilitated by BETTY CURRIE, who had an unspoken agreement with LEWINSKY to use the most inconspicuous route to the Oval Office that would avoid the USSS uniformed officers, many of whom were friendly to MARSHA SCOTT. (LEWINSKY was provided with a floor plan of the White House, a copy of which is attached to this document, on which she highlighted the most common route she took to see the President.) The route normally included entering the southwest gate; walking north on Executive Drive; entering the West Wing basement lobby; meeting CURRIE, her escort; going through the basement; and up

1506

29D OIC LR 35063

contilluatioo of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 .~ gc 6 the stairs near the Oval Office. LEWINSKY and CURRIE avoided a uniformed officer who knew DEBBIE SCHIFF. The officer's name is unknown, but he is very friendly, about 5'11", and overweight.

informal. and never

once gave The weekend attire at the White House was very

LEWINSKY usually departed through the northwest gate departed through the tunnel.

The President never gave LEWINSKY a rose, but CURRIE LEWINSKY a bunch of roses to take home.

CHARLIE the butler was always friendly with LEWINSKY. To LEWINSKY's knowledge the President did not call her from Jackson Hole, Wyoming or elsewhere when he was on vacation.

LEWINSKY never taped anyone; however, LEWINSKY does have a micro- cassette from her answering machine with a call from BETTY CURRIE on December 28, 1997. CURRIE was at her residence and needed LEWINSKY's date of birth and social security number to place LEWINSKY on the White House access list. The tape also contains a few messages about KIRBY BEHRE from LINDA TRIPP in December 1997. LEWINSKY does not recall playing the CDRRIE tape to LINDA TRIPP.

LEWINSKY does recall playing the tape with messages from the President to TRIPP. This tape was previously furnished to the OIC. LEWINSKY did not have caller identification (ID) on her telephone when the first message from the President was recorded, but she recognized the President's voice when he said, "Aw shucks." LEWINSKY installed "caller ID" on her home telephone before July 1996. The second message from the President was muffled. In the third message from the President he said, "Hello." The fourth message from the President was left in the middle of the night when LEWINSKY was out of town;

the President said, "C'mon it's me." LEWINSKY spoke to the President about the messages. On one occasion, the President advised that he did not like to leave messages.

On August 11, 1996, LEWINSKY saw DEBBIE BYRD at the southwest gate and then in BETTY CURRIE's office.

On September 12 or 19, 1997 LEWINSKY arrived at the southwest gate crying, called BETTY CTJRRIE, and waited a long time. When CURRIE arrived, LEWINSKY was crying about when she was coming back to the White House and the fact that MARSHA SCOTT was not helping. It worried CURRIE when LEWINSKY cried. CURRIE

1507

OIC- 3u2a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

colltimaion of OK- 3uz of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 ,plgc 7

said that sometimes the President's hands are tied, but that CURRIE had received the President's permission to talk to JOHN PODESTA about getting a job for LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY was taken to the Oval Office on this occasion. CURRIE was going to Chicago the next day.

A frequent occurrence was for LEWINSKY to arrive at the White House gate and not be allowed to enter because her name had not been cleared in the computer yet. LEWINSKY would wait until CURRIE could enter the data into the "WAVE system." LEWINSKY never complained about waiting. It was impossible for anyone to skip the "WAVE1' system.

The President held BETTY CURRIE in high regard. LEWINSKY always knew where CURRIE's loyalty was. CURRIE was very

good at covering and representing the President. CURRIE would occasionally lie, as she did in the ELEANOR MONDALE matter, and when she told LEWINSKY that she was unable to get LBWINSKY's messages into the President all day. On one occasion, on a weekend, CURRIE locked in her desk one of LEWINSKY's messages to the President so that no one snooping around would see it. However, the President did not get to see it either. LEWINSKY has no specific recollection that CURRIE knew of LBWINSKY's subpoena in the PAULA JONES case; however, CURRIE had to know that LEWINSKY was somehow involved in the JONES case when LEWINSKY started using the 'IKAYE" code. name on the pager. LEWINSKY has a faint recollection of speaking with CURRIE about LEWINSKY's involvement in the JONES matter.

LINDA TRIPP spent the night in LEWINSKY's apartment with her in late November 1997. This was after TRIPP had attended a Christmas show with NORMA ASNBS. TRIPP slept in MICHAEL LEWINSKY's room with the door closed. At about 2: 00 a. m. LEWINSKY received a call from the President on LEWINSKY's personal line in her bedroom. This line does not have a speaker phone and there are no extensions. LEWINSKY cannot recall the topic of conversation, but it could have been a "phone sex" call. The call could have been either the night before or the night after NANCY HERNREICH testified on November 13, 1997; or it could have been when the Arkansas friend with a terminal illness was visiting the President. When the call was over, LBWINSKY tried to awaken TRIPP, without success, to tell her about the call frtini the President. The next morning, TRIPP advised that she had heard the telephone ring. TRIPP did not listen to this call or any other telephone conversations that LEWINSKY had with the President. TRIPP was never present when LEWINSKY called BETTY CURRIE.

1508

OK- 3u2a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063 c0utimlation of 01c- 3cr2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 .pl. ge 8

FRANK CARTER told LEWINSKY that when testifying one should not answer a direct yes or no if one was not sure; one should say, ". It may have happened," or "It's possible," so as not to perjure oneself. LEWINSKY said that is why she has answered, IlIt's possible" instead of yes or no to some of the questions in her debriefing by the OIC. LEWINSKY and TRIPP discussed leaving some "wiggle room" when testifying when one wasn't sure of the answer.

AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH departed at this time. In regard to the ties that LEWINSKY had given to the President, she would often ask him when he intended to wear them. The President would sometimes wear one the day after LEWINSKY talked to him, and sometimes the day she was scheduled to see him. On one of the days that BAYANI NELVIS testified in the Grand Jury, he wore a tie that LEWINSKY had given to the President. LEWINSKY opined that this may have been a signal of some sort; either that the tie was not important to the 'President, or as a sign of encouragement to LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY briefly described the contents of the back hallway off the Oval Office:

A. Framed picture. B. Bathroom door. C. Framed sword above bathroom door. D. Credenza. E. Framed political button collections on right and left

walls. F. Signature of an Oklahoman, probably WOODIE GUTHRIE.

LEWINSKY described the contents of the President's back study:

A. B. C.

D. E.

Dark wooden desk. 1. Chair on rollers with presidential seal on the pillow. 2. Mahogany cigar box on desk. 3. Wooden organizer on desk. 4. Two bookends with small books including yaX. 5. Blotter. Book rack. Bookshelves with mostly political books; various items on top are changed periodically. Hardwood floor with blue rug. Two windows.

1509

OIC- 3a2a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

290 OIC LR 35063 Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 ,~ ge 9

F. G. H.

I. J. K. L. M. N. 0.

A. B. C. D. E.

F. G.

A. B. C. D. E.

Painting of the President walking on the street. An older photograph of Mrs. CLINTON and CHELSEA CLINTON. Photograph of an old guy with a fireman's hat. Photograph of the President with school children. Stand with telephone and compact disk player. Compact disk holder in the comer of the study. Golf clubs. Rocking chair with a pillow. Marble top half table with big mirror. On a shelf is a "kewpie" doll sitting under a mushroom.

LEWINSKY described the President's dining room; Pantry door. Hall door. Marble top bureau with LEWINSKY paperweight on it. Circular table and chairs. Dry flower arrangement on table. Television and VCR. Mirrors on both walls.

LEWINSKY described the President's bathroom: Toilet. Sink. Telephone on wall. Vertical shelf for toiletries. The walls are lined with black and white cartoons of the President.

At this point AIC JULIE MYERS entered. LEWINSKY is close to her aunt, DEBRA FINERMAN, and provided some details of her relationship with the President, but not to the degree that she did with LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY did not provide the vulgar details to FINERMAN. FINERMAN was aware that LEWINSKY had been subpoenaed in the PAULA JONES case and knew that LINDA TRIPP was causing problems. LEWINSKY, her mother, MARCIA LEWIS, and FINERMAN referred to VERNON JORDAN as " GWEN . ” LEWIS and FINERMAN coined this nickname for JORDAN.

LEWINSKY recalled the following additional gifts that she gave to the President:

A. HARROD'S golf balls and tees. B. A wooden painted egg from Budapest (observed on 12/ 28/ 97). C. "Gummy boobs" from URBAN OUTFITTERS.

1510

OIC- 302a mev. 8- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

Coluimation of OIC- 3u2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .oo 08/ 03/ 98 .w 10 D. Cassette tape; unknown whether the President ever

listened; did not tell BETTY CURRIE of this gift for fear CURRIE would not give it to the President; later asked CURRIE if President had gotten the tape.

There would have been no legitimate business reason for LEWINSKY to go into the President's study; her access was only because she had a personal relationship with the President.

LEWINSKY -_ a student at SANTA MONICA CITY COLLEGE in March or April 1992. LEWINSKY was upset over the fact that her father would not pay for her to go to a more expensive university. After waiting 15 minutes for a parking place, someone came along at‘ the last minute and took the space from her. LEWINSKY began crying uncontrollably. MARCIA LEWIS took LEWINSKY for treatment to a psychologist, Dr. IRENE KASSORLA. LEWINSKY saw KASSORLA regularly until LBWINSKY moved to Oregon, but continued treatment with KASSORLA by telephone. The consultation continued every four to six weeks after LEWINSKY moved to Washington, D. C. LEWINSKY advised KASSORLA of her relationship with the President and used the code name "HENRIETTA" when talking about him on the telephone. LEWINSKY was honest with KASSORLA, but did not give her too many details. KASSORLA opined that the President was using LEWINSKY.

MARCIA LEWIS was never a patient of KASSORLA. KASSORLA is a psychologist, but not a sex therapist. KASSORLA is self- promoting. KASSORLA never kept notes when LEWINSKY saw her in person and all of KASSORLA's recollections might not be accurate. KASSORLA, if subpoenaed, would most likely go on television talk shows. In LEWINSKY's opinion, relations nightmare to the OIC. KASSORLA would be a public

KASSORLA helped LBWINSKY to the extent that LEWINSKY improved her school grades and lost weight. LEWINSKY last called KASSORLA in 1997.

LEWINSKY has consulted with Dr. KATHY ESTEP, a therapist. LEWINSKY talked with ESTEP around the time of the 1996 Presidential election about her relationship with the President, and displayed photos of LEWINSKY and the President. LEWINSKY saw ESTEP about four times in October and November,

1996. Dr. ESTEP told LEWINSKY that she had a lot of loss, such' as losing her job. LEWINSKY visited an unnamed associate of DC;.

. The associate also precribed "phen phen" on a weekly basis for LBWINSKY.

Around March 1998, LEWINSKY received a letter from one 4- b whom she has never met. The letter contained a

1511

OK- 3mi@ kv. 8- 15- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

colximmion of OK- 3u2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 03/ 98 .me 2. l

photograph of -, who requested that LEWINSKY put her in touch with BILL GINSBERG, whom- wanted to retain as her own attorney. -purported that she had been a White House intern, who had also had an affair with the President. LEWINSKY speculated that -may have been JANE DOE #7. Subsequently, LEWINSKY received a package from - which contained a tape recording of audio messages from the OIC requesting an interview. GINSBERG or NATE SPEIGHTS referred -to attorney KEITH WATERS. LEWINSKY provided the tape and photograph to WATERS.

The interview was terminated at 4: 44 p. m.

1512

Tab 25

1514

1515

lIC_ 3& (Rev. 8- 1!% 94)

- 1 -

OFFICEOFTHE IXDEPESBENT COUNSEL

Date of tr- mu- ipioil 8/ 04/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, and AIC JULIE L. MYERS. AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH and AIC CRAIG LERNER were present during part of the interview. Representing LEWINSKY was her attorney, SYDNEY HOFFMAN, and Law Clerk ANIE WULKEN. The interview was conducted at the OIC office, Suite 490 North, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW, Washington, D. C. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

LEWINSKY wrote a letter to the President on July 3, 1997, threatening to tell her parents of their affair. LEWINSKY did not author any similar letters. LINDA TRIPP encouraged LEWINSKY to be more forceful in her correspondence with the President.

On about September 19, 1997, LEWINSKY was crying outside the northwest gate of the White House. BETTY CURRIE and BAYANI NELVIS knew LEWINSKY was upset.

LEWINSKY did not recall telling BETTY CURRIE directly about her affair with the President. CURRIE may have assumed an affair existed. However, CURRIE demonstrated no confusion about the relationship between LEWINSKY and the President. LEWINSKY and TRIPP discussed CURRIE's knowledge of the relationship. TRIPP suggested to LEWINSKY that CURRIE knew about the relationship. LEWINSKY agreed with TRIPP's assessment during these conversations.

LEWINSKY did not have a specific recollection, but believes CURRIE must have known about the PAULA JONES subpoena. LEWINSKY believed she may have had a discussion with CURRIE about the above subpoena.

LEWINSKY said she thought that PEDRO, Last Name Unknown (LNU) was the name of the waiter at the breakfast she had with VERNON JORDAN on December 31, 1997. PEDRO was described as a petite Hispanic male, between 35 and 40 years of age. JORDAN appeared to know the waiter and be a frequent customer of the resturant.

bvctigationon 08/ 04/ 98 WASHINGTON, D. C. Filet 29D- LR- 35063

Date dictated 8/ 04[ 98

1516

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- LR- 35063

continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 04/ 98 ,~.,~ e 2 On December 11, 1997, JORDAN gave LEWINSKY a list of JORDAN's business contacts. The list included URSULA FAIRBURN of AMERICAN EXPRESS, RICHARD HALPERIN of MCANDREWS and FORBES, and YOUNG and RUBICAM.

Regarding telephone messages on LEWINSKY's cassette tapes, there may have been one or two more tapes. Most of the recordings consisted of llHello. t' LEWINSKY knew these recorded messages were the President, because she knows his voice. LEWINSKY kept the messages so that when she wanted she could hear the President's voice on tape.

May 24, 1997 was referred to by LEWINSKY as "Dump Day." LEWINSKY had an idea she would see the President on that date. LEWINSKY went shopping with ASHLEY RAINES at VICTORIA's SECRET. CURRIE called LEWINSKY around ll:. OO a. m. and told LEWINSKY to come to the White House at about 1: 00 p. m. LEWINSKY appeared as scheduled wearing a red sun dress with small polka dots and the hat pin the President had given to her. The pin was worn on a straw hat. LEWINSKY brought gifts to the President, including a mystery puzzle and a BANANA REPUBLIC shirt. LEWINSKY gave the President his gifts in the Executive dining room.

LEWINSKY did not recall how the conversation started; however, the President stated that he did not feel right about their relationship; it was not right, and the President said he could not do it anymore. LEWINSKY was crying. The President said this did not have to do with LEWINSKY. The President told LEWINSKY that he had been with hundreds of women in his life until he was about 40 years of age. The President told LEWINSKY that when he turned 40 his life was falling apart. LEWINSKY recalled that the President may have told her that, at the above time, he entertained thoughts of ending his life. However,

The President told LEWINSKY that he had been good until he met her. LEWINSKY did not believe the President. The President told her how he was attracted to LEWINSKY, and how the President thought LEWINSKY was a great person. The President told LEWINSKY that they could remain friends p" ed... . The. President pointed out to LEWINSKY that he could do

a lot for her& The President told LEWINSKY that it was difficult

1517

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ 04/ 9S ,page 3 for him to resist being with other women. The President struggled with it daily. The President told LEWINSKY that he kept a calender on how long he had been good. The President explained that during his life he had been two people, and kept up two fronts. The President said that starting in the third or fourth grade, he was a good boy with his mother and step father, but also began telling stories and leading a secret life. LEWINSKY's impression was that the President was telling her he wanted to be right in the eyes of God. The President wanted the affair to be over, though he said it was not LEWINSKY's fault. LEWINSKY did not know if the President meant what he said.

The President and LEWINSKY moved from the dining room to the back study and into the hallway. LEWINSKY was crying and trying to talk the President out of ending the affair by telling him that Presidents in the past needed girlfriends. The President got angry and told LEWINSKY that he did not want to be like that. The President said he did not want his daughter to know about the affair. The President told LEWINSKY that if they had no sex they could be friends and visit. LEWINSKY said that based on a previous relationship with a married man, she thought that the President appeared to be going through feelings of guilt. LEWINSKY was hysterical.

Subsequently, STEVEN GOODIN came into the area and LEWINSKY realized she had left her purse on the dining room table. LEWINSKY retrieved her purse from the dining room table. BETTY CURRIE came in the back hall through the pantry to take LEWINSKY out of the area. things look "OK". The President was trying to make

CURRIE told LEWINSKY that her face was similar to CURRIE's face, it showed everything. CURRIE then asked LEWINSKY what was wrong. LEWINSKY did not say anything except that things were difficult. CURRIE was going out of town to visit CURRIE's sister who had a heart attack. LEWINSKY commented that she and CURRIE would get together for drinks when CURRIE returned.

LEWINSKY recalled that on the above date, LANNY DAVIS and his family were in the White House. CURRIE introduced LEWINSKY to DAVIS and his family.

On July 3, 1997, LEWINSKY wrote a letter to the President. On July 4, 1997, she appeared for a meeting with the President at the White House. LEWINSKY wore a black sun dress bought in Rome, Italy. LEWINSKY was somber. The President came out of his office and said to LEWINSKY,, tlHey. tl "Hey . II They both went into the study. LEWINSKY replied,

LEWINSKY sat at the desk

1518

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- LR- 35063

ConI. inuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ 04/ 98 .Pagc 4

and the President sat in a rocking chair. The President said something to the effect of, "First of all, it is illegal to threaten the President of the United States;" secondly, he did not read the entire letter; in the third place, he threw the letter away. LEWINSKY said that when the President got to the phrase, "- In the fourth place," she stopped him. The President appeared nervous. LEWINSKY could not recall what the President next said. LEWINSKY and the President got into a disagreement. LEWINSKY pointed out to the President that she had left the White House and left like a "good girl." She waited through the election and well after a year after leaving the White House. The President told LEWINSKY they could still be friends. She replied that he did not act like her friend. LEWINSKY cried and the President hugged her. Over the President's left shoulder LEWINSKY saw a gardener outside the window. LEWINSKY did not make eye contact with the gardener. LEWINSKY was not sure whether they were seen. They moved to the bathroom hallway. The President was most affectionate that day. The President told LEWINSKY she was beautiful. The President played with her hair and stroked her arm. The President mentioned that people like them had fire in the belly. At one point, the President said he wished he had more time for LEWINSKY, and that maybe he would in three years. LEWINSKY took the opportunity to comment that the President and his wife Connected on a level that no one

. LEWINSKY said something about being together with the President in the future. The President asked LEWINSKY what she would do when the President was 70 years of age, and had to go to the bathroom numerous times a day. LEWINSKY replied that they would deal with it. LEWINSKY said she never felt so complete. LEWINSKY stated that she thought her meeting with the President ended on a positive note.

CURRIE called out for the President and he told LEWINSKY it was time to go. LEWINSKY told the President that she needed a few more minutes with him. LEWINSKY told him about the events surrounding KATHLEEN WILLEY. LEWINSKY referred to July 4, 1997 as KATHLEEN WILLEY day. LEWINSKY advised the President of information she received from a friend regarding WILLEY. LEWINSKY did not identify that person. LEWINSKY insisted she would not have identified the friend to the President even if asked. The President did not appear surprised by LEWINSKY's information. LEWINSKY left a picture for the President to sign for LEWINSKY's birthday.

1519

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29D- LR- 35063

continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,cn 08/ 04/ 98 ,page 5 LEWINSKY received a bear sculpture from the President that he said he bought in Vancouver, British Columbia. The President gave the bear to her during a visit with the President at the White House on December 28, 1997.

LEWINSKY may have used tissue to blot her lipstick on a visit with the President on January 7, 1996. LEWINSKY reapplied her make- up after encounters with the President. The tissues were disposed of in the trash can in the bathroom or in the one near NANCY HERNREICH's office. Occasionally the President and LEWINSKY had sodas or other drinks in the dining room or study.

LEWINSKY reviewed and identified the following documents:

1. A paper with the phrase, "The time has finally come for me to throw in the towel..." LEWINSKY could see TRIPP's influence on this document. LEWINSKY wrote the document, but did not send it. TRIPP discouraged LEWINSKY from sending the paper. LEWINSKY dated the paper around September, 1997, because LEWINSKY found out that MARSHA SCOTT was not going to detail her to the White House. It was harsher in language than LEWINSKY had recalled. In lieu of sending the letter, LEWINSKY traveled to the White House on about September 19, 1997 and waited at the southwest gate for an appointment.

2. A letter with notation, "Official Letterhead," and reading, "To Handsome,." LEWINSKY sent a version of this joke letter to the President by courier. The letter was written on September 30, 1997. A reminder to throw the letter away was noted.

3. A draft of a letter sent to the President on March 2, 1996, along with a HUGO BOSS necktie. The letter began with, "Dear Mr. P:" These were sent by Federal Express.

4. A photograph of the President wearing a tie given to him by LEWINSKY.

5. A document entitled, "As your friend." LEWINSKY wrote this at home and did not mail it to the President. LEWINSKY did discuss the content with the President on December 17, 1997. LEWINSKY

1520

OIC- 3& a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- 'Z- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ 04/ 98 ,page 6

6. 7. 8. 9.

10.

11.

12. 13.

drafted the content in conversations with LINDA TRIPP on December 8, 1997.

A document stating, "This is going to be a long letter." It was a draft letter written on LEWINSKY's home computer. It was never sent. The actual letter sent was shorter than the above document. It was sent in response to learning from TRIPP that LEWINSKY did not get the job at the National Security Council !NSC) for which she applied. The date of the document was after October 6, 1997.

A card dated June 29, '1997, starting with, "Dear Handsome", and containing the phrase, "1 feel disposable, used, insignificant," and, ,( I really need to discuss my situation." LEWINSKY stated that the writing on the card was hers, but the phrases and words were those of TRIPP. Some of TRIPP's writing may be on this draft. LEWINSKY would buy more than one of a particular card for draft purposes.

The final version of the above card (item seven) was sent to the President.

A document written on LEWINSKY's Department of Defense (DOD) computer. The document contains a list of things sent to the President, including an item named as "Gingko... l' LEWINSKY did try to delete documents concerning the President from her DOD computer.

This document contains the statement, "It has been made clear to me that I cannot return to the White House." It is a closer version of the final version than item six..

This document was a short draft of a letter sent to the President. The letter contains the phrase,

II . . . cannot do anything but accept that..." This document contained LEWINSKY's own thoughts including the phrase, IlIt was so sad seeing you." It was not sent.

A photograph from October 23, 1996, taken at a

1521

QIC- 3m (Rev. 819- W)

29D- LR- 35063

CQaiauation of OIC- 3crz of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,a,, W/ 04/ 98 ,pagc 7 14. 15. 16.

17. 18.

19. 20. 21.

22. 23.

fundraiser. A photograph of LEWINSKY and her family taken with the President after the June 14, 1996 radio address.

A photograph taken on what LEWINSKY referred to as LOU FOX day.

A photograph which was a hand out photograph of the President signing a Department of Defense (DOD) bill. The President was wearing a tie given to him by LEWINSKY,

A photograph of the President on his birthday. A photograph of LEWINSKY and the President, signed by the President, on what LEWINSKY referred to as "Dress Day." L~ INSKY is wearing the dark blue dress.

A photograph of the President wearing a tie given to him by LEWINSKY.

A black and white photograph of the President. LEWINSKY fell in love with the photograph.

A letter, dated June 16, 1997. LEWINSKY told her former attorney, WILLIAM GINSBURG about the letter in January 1998. The letter was to CURRIE but was not sent.

A letter dated November 2, 1997, was addressed to CURF3E beginning, "Hope you had an enjoyable weekend." LEWINSKY was not sure if the letter was sent.

This item was a draft note on a card with a heart on the top sheet. This heart page was not the inside of the card. The top sheet of the card should have a cat on it. LEWINSKY sent a card with a oat because CURRIE liked cats. The part of a card with a snowman on it was possibly a draft of a Christmas card sent to CURRIE. The above card was possibly sent to CURRIE on September 17, 1997.

1522

OK- 3u2a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- LR- 35063

continrution of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,o, 08/ 04, '98 , page 8

24. A card stating, "Dear Betty, I feel better after our talk." LEWINSKY may have sent the card after LEWINSRY's meeting with CURRIE at the HAY ADAMS hotel. The dates were around June 24, 1997 or June 29, 1997. MARSHA SCOTT was the main topic of the discussion between LEWINSKY and CURRIE.

LEWINSKY never contacted the President when he was in Bosnia, despite news reports. Not only was he with his family, but there exists no direct way to contact the President overseas.

LEWINSKY remained abreast of the President's schedule by referring to News Edgf:, a publication of the President's projected schedule. It was LEWINSKY's job to track the briefings from the White House. Sometimes LEWINSKY contacted CURRIE for the President's schedule. If LEWINSKY thought CURRIE was not telling the truth about the President's schedule, LEWINSKY would contact BAYANI NELVIS, a Presidential steward. LEWINSKY maintained she never asked the U- S_ Secret Service (USSS) about the Presidential schedule.

LEWLNSKY reviewed a schedule prepared of calls to and from VERNON JORDAN, over a period of time, from various individuals and locations including: the White House, LEWINSKY's residences, and JORDAN's office. LEWINSKY could provide no additional information regarding these calls. LEWINSKY made the observation that there appeared to be more telephone calls than she realized.

Before Thanksgiving 1997, and after LEWINSRY had a fight with TRIPP , LEWINSKY flew to Los Angeles. LEWINSKY called CURRIE and asked CURRIE to call JORDAN and prod along the job search. It was LEWINSKY's understanding that JORDAN was helping her at the behest of the President and CURRIE. Prior to LEWINSKY being subpoenaed on December 19, 1997, LEWINSKY did not know if JORDAN knew LEWINSKY was on the PAULA JONES case witness list.

1523

Tab 26

1524

1525

or- 302 mev. 8- 19- 54) - 1 -

OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL

Dare of cmncripdop 08/ 07/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed under the terms of an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) and her. LEWINSKY was interviewed at the Office of the Independent Counsel, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, DC 20004. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, AIC JULIE MYERS. MYERS departed after the below- listed chart was discussed. Present representing LEWINSKY were attorney PRESTON BURTON and law clerk MATTHEW UMERHOFF. LEWINSKY provided the following information, beginning at approximately 2: 20 p. m.

LEWINSKY was shown a chart which documented her contacts and/ or telephone calls with CLINTON. LEWINSKY suggested changes to the chart, as necessary, to more accurately reflect her contacts or telephone calls with CLINTON. (A draft of the chart, with the changes suggested by LEWINSKY handwritten by the writer, was placed in an FD- 340, along with the original notes of this interview.) In addition to the changes made to the draft chart, LEWINSKY provided the following information:

August 9, 1995 was the first time she felt a "non- verbal" connection to CLINTON. In middle to late September of 1995, LEWINSKY's friend NATALIE UNGVARI was visiting LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY had what she described as an "accidental photo opportunity" with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY gave CLINTON a ZEGNA tie on November 20, 1995. LEWINSKY identified CLINTON as wearing that tie in three photographs she was shown by the OIC, taken on February 8, 1996, August 5, 1996 and January 23, 1997. LEWINSKY advised she gave CLINTON two ZEGNA ties, two HUGO BOSS ties, one CALVIN KLEIN tie and one FERAUD tie.

LEWINSKY advised she calls the second tie she gave CLINTON, a ZEGNA tie, his "birthday tie," as she gave it to CLINTON for his birthday. LEWINSKY advised it was the first tie, which was also a ZEGNA, she saw BAYANI NELVIS wearing at one of NELVIS's grand jury appearances. LEWINSKY said she may have seen

bvcsaganonon 08/ 05/ 98 at Washington, DC File I 29D- OIC- LR- 35063 CI by SA Date dictated 08/ 05/ 98

1526

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Cominuation of OtC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ 05/ 98 , Page -

a picture of NELVIS in the Was- ton Post day following NELVIS's grand jury appearanczr New York Times the

LEWINSKY advised she visited the White House on December 15, 1997 for the purpose of observing the swearing in of KATHY HAYCOCK.

LEWINSKY advised that at one time, CLINTON said that he would speak with BOB NASH about LEWINSKY's job opportunities at the White House. Later, CLINTON said he had spoken to NASH about LEWINSKY's job opportunities. Even later, CLINTON said that the "ball" had been passed to MARSHA SCOTT.

LEWINSKY advised she never called CLINTON directly, but rather always went through BETTY CURRIE.

LEWINSKY showed VERNON JORDAN a copy of her affidavit the same day she took JORDAN a tie and a pocket square. LEWINSKY assumes JORDAN told CLINTON about the affidavit.

As an intern, LEWINSKY worked in room 93 of the Old Executive Office Building (OEOB) .

LEWINSKY may have called IRENE KASSORLA after July 4, 1997. LEWINSKY does not recall regular sessions with KASSORLA once LEWINSKY moved to Washington, D. C., but LEWINSKY did speak with her periodically.

FRANK CARTER told LEWINSKY to say if she was not sure about an answer to a question in a deposition, she should say so instead of answering yes or no.

LEWINSKY advised she had one conversation with WILLIAM GINSBURG prior to January 16, 1998. LEWINSKY called GINSBURG at home. LEWINSKY may have contacted GINSBURG after LINDA TRIPP had been subpoenaed in the JONFS case. LEWINSKY called GINSBURG to ask him questions in a hypothetical fashion. LEWINSKY received GINSBURG's telephone number from LEWINSKY's step- mother.

LEWINSKY advised LINDA TRIPP of some of the things GINSBURG told LEWINSKY. GINSBURG said there was a difference between perjury in a criminal case and perjury in a civil matter. LEWINSKY also told TRIPP something about illegally obtained evidence. LEWINSKY was concerned about the JONES people breaking into LEWINSKY's apartment. LEWINSKY may have told TRIPP things LEWINSKY's attorneys did not tell her, but LEWINSKY may have attributed it to her attorney.

1527

OIC- 3CQa (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 05/ 98 .page 3 LEWINSKY advised she CURRIE or CLINTON a message to dead." LEWINSKY may have said

TRIPP, but would not have used to CURRIE.

does not recall leaving BETTY the effect of "1 hope you drop she said that when speaking with those actual words when speaking

LEWINSKY is not sure when, but at some time, CURRIE left a message on LEWINSKY's answering machine to the effect "we have some unresolved issues. I know you do not want to talk to him or me." LEWINSKY advised this may have been after July 1, 1997, it may have been November 13, 1997 or it could have been November 22, 1997.

LEWINSKY advised she called TRIPP numerous times at work. LEWINSKY did not call TRIPP twenty to thirty times a day. LEWINSKY advised she may have called TRIPP multiple times a day, because of call backs due to interruption. LEWINSKY advised she and TRIPP discussed numerous topics, not all of which were related to CLINTON.

LEWINSKY first became suspicious of TRIPP after July 14, 1997. LEWINSKY advised she was generally accurate when speaking with TRIPP, up until the time LEWINSKY found out TRIPP was on the witness list in the JONES matter. However, when .speaking with TRIPP, LEWINSKY did not make things up about her relationship with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY advised prior to about December 22, 1997, LEWINSKY was truthful with TRIPP. LEWINSKY advised she was not always truthful with TRIPP later, however, such as when LEWINSKY advised TRIPP that her mom, MARCIA LEWIS, thought TRIPP should feign a foot injury to avoid testifying.

LEWINSKY advised she originated the idea of using nicknames when communicating with CURRIE and TRIPP. LEWINSKY advised she did so to avoid anyone in the JONES team from identifying her. LEWINSKY's mother or aunt came up with the name "GWEN" for VERNON JORDAN to help them remember his name.

LEWINSKY does not know why CURRIE placed telephone calls for CLINTON. LEWINSKY does not believe CURRIE logged in all the gifts LEWINSKY gave CLINTON. LEWINSKY thought it would not be a good idea to have a trail of any references between LEWINSKY and CLINTON.

Referring to the December 17, 1997 telephone call from CLINTON, LEWINSKY is 99.99% sure CLINTON said LEWINSKY can always

1528

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29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 08/ 05/ g8 .Page 4

say she was there to see CURRIE. LEWINSKY spoke to MIKE McCURRY on occasions related to official business at the Pentagon.

CURRIE drove LEWINSKY to LEWINSKY's apartment from the White House approximately five times.

LEWINSKY took her blue GAP dress to New York sometime

around December 30, 1997. LEWINSKY rolled the dress in a ball, put it in plastic and threw it in a closet in her mother's apartment in New York. When LEWINSKY's mother moved out of her New York apartment at the end of May, LEWINSKY moved the dress back to LEWINSKY's Washington, D. C. apartment_

LEWINSKY described her relationship with MAUREEN LEWIS as "semi- friendly." LEWINSKY did not tell LEWIS she fantasized about a sexual relationship with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY does not recall ever dating DENNIS LYTTON, or providing any information to TREY RAGSDALE, PAMELA REVEL, or JAY LESNER.

The interview ended at approximately 6: lO p. m.

1529

Tab 27

1530

1531

OK- 302 (Rev. S- 19- 94) -I-

OFFICE OF THEI INDEPENJJEPii COUNSEL

Dae of KaJKc* n 08/ 12/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an

immunity agreement between the Office of Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel fAICf MICHAEL BMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, and AIC MARY ANNB WIRTH. Representing LEWINSKY was Attorney PRESTON BURTON and Law Clerk ANIE WULKAN of the law offices of PLATO CACHERIS. The interview was conducted in Suite 490 North, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, D. C. commencing at 10: 37 a. m. information:

LEWINSKY provided the following LBWINSKY never gave TRIPP permission to take notes about her relationship with the President.

The incident where the President mouthed, "I miss you," occurred at the end of May, 1996, at an event where there was a rope line. This did not occur in an October video as alleged by LUCIANNB GOLDBERG.

LEWINSKY read a transcript of an audio tape recording of a conversation between herself and LINDA TRIPP. The transcript concerned the discussion of two different versions of a cassette tape that LEWINSKY prepared for the President on November 20, 1997. The two versions are very similar, but may

have been edited again after the discussion with TRIPP. The purpose of the tape was to try a new approach with the President, since he was not responding to LEWINSKY's notes about a transfer back to the White House. The tape was sent to the President on November 21, 1997, before his trip to Vancouver. The President never mentioned to LEWINSKY that he had listened to the tape, and

it was not discussed when they next had a meeting on December 6,

1997. The tape never accomplished its desired result. LBWINSKY visited the White House on December 28, 1997, after entering the southwest gate; proceeding to the West Wing basement lobby; climbing the stairs near the Cabinet Room; proceeding into BETTY CTJRRIE's office; Office; and then into the back study. proceeding into the Oval

LEWINSKY may have seen LARRY COCKELL near the Oval Office. After their meeting was

over, the President startled LBWINSKY by giving her a big hug.. It is unknown whether anyone observed this. LEWINSKY departed

Iwmopationon 08/ 11/ 98 II WASHINGTON, D- C. FkC 29D OIC LR 35063 08/ 12/ 98

1532

OIC- 302a fltev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Concimlalion of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 11/ 98 ,we 2 the Oval Office to CURRIE's office, past the Rose Garden and through the Palm Room.

LEWINSKY gave four ties to BAYANI NELVIS. LEWINSKY gave six ties to the President:

1. The "telecom" tie; a ZEGNA tie with criss crosses of red and gold on a blue background; purchased at NEIMAN MARCUS in MAZZA Gallerie in northwest Washington on the weekend before November 20, 1995; asked BETTY CURRIE on November 17, 1995 if gift okay; given to President through CURRIE on November 20, 1995; received call from the President that night; received a note from President stating tie was beautiful; observed President wearing on November 21, 1995 in Oval Office photo; on December 5 th in the presence of LEWINSKY, President signed photo of himself wearing this tie in Oval Office; observed President wearing on February 8th for signing of telecommunications bill, 1996 after speaking with him on February 7 and 8, 1996; picture in Time Maaazu on July 22, 1996, with President wearing this tie; observed President wearing August 5, 1996 after speaking with him on August 4th, 1996; observed President wearing on January 23, 1997, with MADELINE ALBRIGHT; saw President from afar on January 23, 1997 at the New York Ball at KENNEDY CENTER and he mouthed, "Hi, I like your dress"; observed President wearing March 14, 1997, which was the day the President was traveling to North Carolina and Florida (when President hurt his leg) ;

observed BAYANI NELVIS wearing tie at Grand Jury appearance; on the day LEWINSKY hurt her hand she asked President where he had gotten the tie and he responded, "Some girl with style gave it to me."

2. BLOOMINGDALE'S tie; HUGO BOSS tie that is blue, white and black; bought at BLOOMINGDALE'S at TYSON'S CORNER, Virginia; presented directly to President on March 31, 1996; observed President wearing at CLINTON/ GORE political rally in Virginia in late October 1996, at which time LEWINSKY yelled to President, "Hey handsome, I like your tie"; observed President wearing the tie the day that RON BROWN died; photo of President wearing tie

US Ne s and World Report dated May 13 1996; observed ctesidenr wearing the week of April 8 or April 15, 1996; followed the next day with the "telecom" tie.

3. Birthday tie; ZEGNA yellow tie bought at NEIMAN MARCUS in TYSON'S CORNER, Virginia; sent to President via FedEx to BETTY CURRIE in "care package" prior to August 19, 1996; photo in

ston Ta on August 31, 1996, depicting President wearing

1533

OIC- 3u2a m. w. 8- 19- w

29D OIC LR 35063

:ontimlation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ U/ 98 ,m 3 tie in Cape Girardeau, Missouri; worn in Florida September 5, 1996 during campaign, President telephoned LEWINSKY from Florida and said, "Good tie to wear in Florida;" observed President wearing last day of Democratic Convention in 1996; observed President wearing tie the day GEORGE TENET was nominated as CIA Director; wore tie December 3 or 4, 1996, after speaking with LEWINSKY on December 2, 1996; observed wearing tie August 16, 1997 after speaking with him on August 15, 1997; LEWINSKY believes this tie is the only one the President has worn "post- scandal".

4. Red tie; HUGO BOSS tie purchased at BOSS store on, Wisconsin Avenue in Georgetown between March 3 and 9, 1997; sent via FedEx to BETTY CURRIE; tie had to be replaced on March 29, 1997, after President pointed out a large cut; worn day after Easter Egg Roll in 1997; worn to Governor's race rally in Virginia in the fall of 1997, the President said, "Did you see I wore your tie the other day?".

5. Olive tie; muted, olive colored, CALVIN KLEIN tie

. purchased at MARSHALL's in TYSON'S CORNER, Virginia; sent to President on October 21, 1997; never observed President wearing the tie.

6. FERAUD tie; purchased from small shop near HARROD's in London for 25 pounds; given to President on December 6, 1997; never observed President wearing. LEWINSKY identified this tie from a photograph as a tie turned over to OIC by the White House.

When LEWINSKY gave the President tie #6, she said, "Now you can wear all of my ties in one week." LEWINSKY also told the President that she liked it when he wore her ties because then she knew that she was "close to his heart." On occasion the

’ President would ask LEWINSKY if she noticed that he had been wearing one of her ties at an event, and sometimes the President would assure LEWINSKY that he would wear one of her ties soon.

From a summary chart LEWINSKY confirmed details previously furnished concerning other gifts.

A gift not previously mentioned was an "IFOR" workout T- shirt purchased at the PX in Tuzla, Bosnia. LEWINSKY observed: ..

the President wearing the shirt on August 31; 1996. LEWINSKY advised that she also dropped off some zinc lozenges and gingko biloba to BETTY CURRIE for the President during the middle of the day on November 13, 1997.

1534

OK- 302a C- Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Contimution of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 11/ 98 .he 4 AIC WIRTH departed interview at 12: 47pm. LEWINSKY observed a grocery bag containing some of her gifts under the President's desk in the back study on July 4, 1997 and August 16, 1997. The bag contained the golf puzzle, the orange wooden "B", the BANANA REPUBLIC sport shirt, and an ugly cowboy shirt that LEWINSKY did not give the President. LEWINSKY asked the President whether he liked the gifts, since they were under his desk for a long period of time. The President responded that he did like them, but that he had not had time to take them upstairs.

On October 21, 1997, .LEWINSKY gave a pair of .. sunglasses, the maker unknown, to the President. The sunglasses were purchased at the BARNEY's outlet in the POTOMAC MILLS MALL, in Stafford, Virginia. The gift was the result of a long running joke about the President wearing "dorky" sunglasses. The President wore a "dorky" pair at a .Coast Guard event in Florida in November or December 1997. LEWINSKY first observed a photo of the President wearing the gift glasses on the cover of a magazine in January, 1998, after the "scandal" broke.

LEWINSKY described the President's bathroom in the rear study as being white or very light colored. The walls had framed black and white political cartoons of the President from the Arkmsas Democrat Gazette, two towel bars, a corner shelf with toiletries and jars of vitamins or supplements given to the President by a Congressman, a telephone on the wall, a sink with mirror above it, and a toilet bowl.

JUDY BALKIN is a woman from New York in her 40s or 509, whom LEWINSKY met at the Spa in Connecticut in June 1997. They have had dinner together in New York and have exchanged telephone calls and E- mail. BALKIN and MARCIA LEWIS have a mutual friend. LEWINSKY never spoke with BALKIN about her sexual relationship with the President, nor did she discuss the PAULA JONES lawsuit with her.

LINDA TRIPP was acquainted with BETTY CURRIE, in that they worked in the White House at the same time, and TRIPP sent a condolence card to CURRIE. LEWINSKY is unsure whether she ever discussed LINDA TRIPP with CURRIE. LEWINSKY would not have told:: :

CURRIE about a fight LEWINSKY had with TRIPP. LEWINSKY began seeing Dr. KASSORLA when LEWINSKY had an unpleasant experience at not like going to school Santa Monica City College. LEWINSKY did

there, but her ,father would not pay for

1535

“‘ L- NY Inc.. P* Y- r(, -

29D OIC LR 35063 Conrimlation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 11/ 98 .m 5

her to attend a more expensive college. LEWINSKY was not hospitalized, had no medication prescribed, and missed no classes as a result of this incident. LEWINSKY was not suicidal.

The names of several congressmen were provided to LEWINSKY. This was in regard to the congressman that spoke with the President on the telephone on November 17, 1997, during one of LEWINSKY's sessions with the President. LEWINSKY selected the name of Congressman H. L. "SONNY" CALUHAN as the most likely caller to the President that night.

On either September 12 or 19, 1997, LEWINSKY went to the southwest gate in an attempt to see the President. LEWINSKY was crying and frustrated because MARSHA SCOTT had said that she had lost her detailee slot and it did not appear that LEWINSKY would be able to go back to work in the White House. LEWINSKY called BETTY CURRIE numerous times, but CURRIE said that the President was going to have dinner with CHELSEA. After about 45 minutes, CTJRRIE arranged to get LEWINSKY into the White House to visit CURRIE. CURRIE was sweet to LEWINSKY, .but explained that .sometimes neither the President nor CURRIE had direct control .over jobs at the White House. CURRIE was traveling to Chicago the next day, but would try to set up a meeting for LEWINSKY and the President on Sunday when CURRIE returned. ClJRRIE's flight was late on Sunday and no meeting could be set up.

LEWINSKY believes that some of the conversations may have been recorded by TRIPE'. TRIPP gave different stories of the WILLEY incident. The President advised LEWINSKY on July 4, 1997 that NANCY HERNREICH said that she had been called by WILLEY, who had received a call from MIKE ISIKOFF. The President did not elaborate. LEWINSKY knows of no efforts by anyone to influence or discourage KATHLEEN WILLEY from cooperating in the PAULA JONES deposition. LEWINSKY does not know of any relationship between NATHAN LANDOW and the President. LEWINSKY is unaware of any information that LANDOW attempted to influence WILLEY's deposition in the JONES case.

On June 14, 1996, LEWINSKY, her father BERNARD, her -

stepmother BARBARA, and her brother MICHAEL attended a radio address given by the President. During the address the President inadvertently used the term "seduced," which was embarrassing. After the address, LEWINSKY introduced each member of her family to the President and a family photograph was taken with the

1536

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

CoIuinuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 11/ 98 .~ ge 6

President. LEWINSKY's father later remarked that the President looked at him as if the President was sizing him up as a prospective father- in- law. BARBARA LEWINSKY said that she had noticed that the President kept looking at LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY laughed but made no comment.

LEWINSKY has not shared many details of the relationship with her father, but she did tell him about giving the President a tie; receiving a signed photograph; that she was moving to New York; and that VERNON JORDAN and BETTY CURRIE were assisting LEWINSKY in finding a job. When LEWINSKY's father was interviewed by BARBARA WALTERS, he made a comment that his daughter was wonderful and, IIWhy wouldn't they help her?" LEWINSKY's father told her not to quit her Pentagon job until she had another job lined up; LEWINSKY told him that she had to leave because her boss had hired someone else. LEWINSKY did not tell her father about the July 3, 1997 letter that she wrote to the President, in which she stated that she would tell her parents about her relationship with the President. LEWINSKY asked FRANK

CARTER if her parents could be present during her deposition to try to deter the JONES attorneys from deposing her. CARTER advised LEWINSKY not to have her parents present.

The July 3, 1997 letter was handwritten on unlined, white paper, 8 l/ 2" by 11". LEWINSKY wrote that she was forced to try to get a job in the White House by herself without the President's assistance; mentioned the lack of help from MARSHA SCOTT; said that she may tell her parents about her relationship with the President; requested a United Nations job; and ended by comparing her mother, MARCIA LEWIS, with the President, in that

they both faced difficult issues with their heads in the sand. LEWINSKY pleaded that she and the President could work their relationship out. LEWINSKY did not consider this letter a tlireat .

When the President answered interrogatories in the PAULA JONES case on December 23, 1997, he did not discuss his responses either before or after with LEWINSKY.

In March or April 1995, LEWINSKY forged a letter at LEWIS AND CLARK COLLEGE in Portland, Oregon. LEWINSKY used the name of a college employee named DAVID BLISS in writing a letter:,: ._ .

to ANDY BLEILER, stating that BLEILER had a job waiting for him

at the college. The letter was not delivered, and was returned to BLISS, who discovered the scheme. The motivation for the letter was so that ANDY BLEILER could show his wife KATE the letter and come to Oregon in advance of KATE and the children.

1537

OK- 302. a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

Contimmtion of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 11/ 98 .~ ge 7 This would make BLEILER available to continue their affair. In her apology to BLISS, LEWINSKY made up a story about using the letter to show that BLEILER had a job in Oregon, and that KATE could then obtain .permission from the court to move the daughter of HARVEY LEHRER and KATE BLEILER from the state of California. This was merely a cover story for an illicit relationship.

father a actually

While at LEWIS AND CLARK COLLEGE, LEWINSKY gave her false transcript to indicate better grades than she received.

LEWINSKY has never been arrested, but has received a few speeding tickets in Oregon. LEWINSKY has received many parking tickets, some of which she did not pay immediately. _

LEWINSKY has failed to return some rented videos and some library books.

LEWINSKY reported her credit problems when she filled out the questionnaire for her clearance at the White House. LEWINSKY had to pay off about $800 in bad debts before she could get her clearance. Unpaid Oregon telephone bills were paid off by MARCIA LEWIS.

On one occasion while at the Pentagon, LEWINSKY made a copy of an unfavorable memo from CLIFF BERNATH to KEN BACON discussing a pay grade increase for LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY took the memo from BACON's desk and copied it so that she could later read it and know how to make a better case for a grade increase. BERNATH had cautioned LEWINSKY about spending too much time on the telephone and about making personal long distance calls. On a trip to Asia, LEWINSKY had a disagreement with a military officer named JEFF GRADIK.

On November 15, 1997, LEWINSKY wore bikini thong panties to work and pulled up her jacket in back to display the tops to the President when he came to PANETTA's office. No one else in the room could have seen this; this was something that LEWINSKY learned to do when she was having an affair with ANDY BLEILER.

During the telephone conversation with the President on December 17, 1997, LEWINSKY and the President discussed the fact:-. ': that she was moving to New York and maybe the PAULA JONES' lawyers would be unable to find her with a subpoena. LEWINSKY figured that if she was residing with her mom in New York there would be no way to find her, since nothing would be in her name. This was more in the manner of "shooting the breeze" with the

1538

29D OIC LR 35063

Continuation of OK- 3u2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 11/ 98 .R@ 8 President than in making a plan.

In the meeting with the President on December 28, 1997, the move to New York was again discussed. LEWINSKY is now unsure who remarked that if she was in New York maybe they would not bother to bring her back for a deposition. LEWINSKY was reminded that her written proffer, previously submitted by NATE SPEIGHTS, has a statement indicating that the President was in favor of the New York move. LEWINSKY said that she has no specific memory of making that statement in the proffer. LEWINSKY said that discussion was not a strategy session, and that if she thought that she needed to get out of Washington quickly, she would have called VERNON JORDAN to make sure that something jobwise. should happen immediately.

In regard to the box of gifts that LEWINSKY gave to BETTY CURRIE for safekeeping, LEWINSKY hoped to get the gifts back, but was not sure enough. that they would be returned to put all of the gift items in the box. LEWINSKY had no specific thought, discussion, or plan to get the box back; however, LEWINSKY expected the box to be with CURRIE until the PAULA JONES case blew over.

In regard to the daily pages of the Filofax, LEWINSKY does not recall making any entries or notations about the .President. LEWINSKY may have thrown the pages away, or they may have been taken in the consensual search of her apartment. The records are not embarrassing, nor are they well kept. However, LEWINSKY would consider it an invasion of privacy if she had to turn over the daily pages at this point.

In January and February 1996, LEWINSKY does not recall .

telling MAUREEN LEWIS, who worked for NANCY HERNREICH, any story about bringing pizza to the President when topless, or that she wanted to perform oral sex on the President. LEWINSKY did work late with LEWIS around the time that LEWINSKY began drafting the political letters. LEWINSKY would never tell LEWIS this, because LEWIS was too close to HERNREICH. LEWINSKY opined that HERNREICH may have told this to LEWIS based on rumors. LEWINSKY did talk to LEWIS about movies and other non personal things. LEWINSKY and LEWIS did not have a falling out. LEWIS attended LEWINSKY's birthday party at THE PALM RESTAURANT on July 23, 1996. LEWIS 1::: called LEWINSKY after the February 28, 1997 radio address and said that she had heard that LEWINSKY was moving out of the country. LEWINSKY probably told LEWIS of her affair with someone at the Pentagon during a telephone call after LEWINSKY left the White House. LEWINSKY never told LEWIS that she was attracted to

1539

OIC- x3 (Rev. cs- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

coMnnIioll of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,011 08/ 11/ 98 .% e 9, NANCY HERNREICH, but she may have said that HERNREICH has maintained her sexuality, while most women at the White House have not. LEWINSKY did revere HEF? NREICH. LEWINSKY is not a lesbian or bisexual.

.LEWINSKY describes the President as "a sweet little boy," affectionate, kind, warm, selfish, self- centered, self- righteous, incredible person who does what is in the best interest of the country.

The President has a "Saturday night personality," where he gives in to his sexual desires and a "Sunday personality," where he is remorseful and goes to church. The President is a very sensual man, but has never discussed with LEWINSKY whether he has a sex problem.

In regard to his mother, VIRGINIA KELLY, the President said that she was "full of piss and vinegar," that he missed her, and that she was always with him. her often. The President did not speak of

The President felt awful and cried when the first soldier was killed in Bosnia and was very sad, lonely, and withdrawn when Admiral BOORDA committed suicide.

The President does not trust a lot of. people. The President can be humorous, i. e. when he imitated LEWINSKY's voice on her telephone recorder, and when he made the "good morning" remark while having phone sex with LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY had a discussion with PAT'GRIFFIN at his going away party where he said, "Be careful," and, "You're doing a good

job there." LEWINSKY never had a one- on- one conversation with GRIFFIN at work and was never counseled by him at work. _ _, _

1540

Tab 28

1542

OIC- 302 (Rev. 8- I%%! 1543

-l-

OFFlCEOFTHEINDEPENDENTCOUNSEL

Date of aanuripcion 08/ 14/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed under the terms of an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) and her. LEWINSKY was interviewed at the Office of the Independent Counsel, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, DC 20004. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGUT, and AIC CRAIG LERNER. Present representing LEWINSKY was her attorney, PRESTON BURTON. LEWINSKY provided the following information, beginning at approximately 11: 13 a. m.

LEWINSKY advised that the first time she mentioned the United Nations to President WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON as. a possible employer was during her July 3, 1997 letter to CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised that KATHY HERTZ, a former Pentagon employee, had transferred to the United Nations and liked her job. LEWINSKY thought. if the United Nations was a. good place for HERTZ to work, it might be a good place for LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY advised that a job at the United Nations was her idea, not CLINTON's_

July 3,

further

July 4, CLINTON

LEWINSKY advised that she spoke with CLINTON on _ . September 30, 1997. The subject of jobs could have come up during that conversation. CLINTON may have mentioned ERSKINE BOWLES being involved in finding LEWINSKY employment during this conversation.

After raising the idea of the United Nations job on 1997, LEWINSKY did not pursue the United Nations job any during the Summer of 1997. LEWINSKY advised she left the 1997 meeting with CLINTON with the understanding that was going to bring her back to the White House.

LEWINSKY was shown a transcript of LRT- 018. LEWINSKY is not sure this conversation took place on October 3, 1997, but it could have.

When LEWINSKY spoke with LINDA TRIPP on October 6, 1997, TRIPP mentioned that TRIPP's friend KATE, who worked at the National Security Council (NSC), had heard rumors that LEWINSKY wouid never get a job at the White House which required a blue pass. LEWINSKY was furious when she heard this and left work. At that time, LEWINSKY again thought about pursuing the United

Investigation on 08/ 13/ 98 at Washington, DC We I 29D- OIC- LR- 35063

CI - by SA Data dictated 08/ 14/ 98

OX- 302. a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

1544

Contimmion of or- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ 13/ 98 .papc 2

Nations as a potential employer. But, LEWINSKY was mostly resolved to look for a job in the private sector in New York.

LEWINSKY could have talked to TRIPP about the United Nations between July 3, 1997 and October 6, 1997, but LEWINSKY's recollection is that LEWINSKY only brought the United Nations back up after October 6, 1997.

As of October 6, 1997, LEWINSKY had only spoken to CLINTON about White House jobs. In one of her conversations with CURRIE in September, LEWINSKY mentioned a former intern who got a job working for PAUL BEGALA. CURRIE said CLINTON told her CURRIE could speak to JOHN PODESTA about finding LEWINSKY a job. From that day, until October 6, 1997, LEWINSKY did not hear from anyone at the White House about a job.

LEWINSKY referred to KATE's comments in a note to CLINTON, but she did not specifically mention KATE by name.

LEWINSKY and CURRIE got into a fight about CURRIE not speaking to CLINTON about a position for LEWINSKY in the White House. Shortly thereafter, on October 9, 1997, LEWINSKY and CLINTON spoke by telephone.

LEWINSKY assumes CLINTON called her from the White House Residence.

On October 10, 1997, LEWINSKY spoke with BETTY CURRIE, who said CLINTON was on the White House putting green with ERSKINE BOWLES. At that time, LEWINSKY thought CLINTON may be talking. to BOWLES about a job for LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY thinks CURRIE would do whatever CLINTON wanted her to do. LEWINSKY thinks that CLINTON could think that,. by CURRIE speaking to PODESTA, it would be the same as CLINTON speaking to BOWLES.

LEWINSKY is not sure when VERNON JORDAN's name first came up in relation to LEWINSKY's job search. LEWINSKY recalls speaking to LINDA TRIPP and TRIPP said that JORDAN was on the Board of Directors of many companies. LEWINSKY advised she never. spoke with CLINTON regarding MAX CHAPMAN or SUSAN THOMASES. LEWINSKY advised THOMASES was a "HILLARY [CLINTON] person," and it would not make sense for LEWINSKY to want THOMASES to find her a job.

During LEWINSKY's .October 11, 1997 visit with CLINTON,

1545

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ 13/ 98 ,Page 3 LEWINSKY thinks she mentioned needing a good reference from someone in the White House, such as JOHN HILLEY. CLINTON said he would take care of it.

LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON asked her to write a list of potential employers, or jobs she was interested in, and to give it to him. On October 16, 1997, LEWINSKY sent CLINTON the list, which she refers to as a "wish list." On the "wish list," LEWINSKY wrote that she did not want a job at the United Nations.

At some point, LEWINSKY gave CLINTON a "deadline" as to when she needed a job. LEWINSKY told CLINTON she had to. be out of her apartment by the end of October, 1997. LEWINSKY advised she did this to get CLINTON moving and into finding her a job.

When BILL RICHARDSON called LEWINSKY on October 21, 1997, LEWINSKY was initially surprised. After the call, LBWINSKY was upset because LEWINSKY did not want to work at the United Nations, no one had called her to tell her RICHARDSON would be calling, and she did not want to get stuck working there with no other opportunities. LEWINSKY was aware that it was RICHARDSON she was speaking with because a secretary called and said "hold for Ambassador RICHARDSON."

LEWINSKY was shown a transcript of LRT 002, pages lo-

12. In response to the transcript excerpt, LEWINSKY advised she did not think it would be a good idea for someone from within the White House to get her a job in the private sector, due to appearances. LEWINSKY advised she was always concerned about the appearance of things. LEWINSKY did not talk to CURRIE about CURRIE helping LEWINSKY versus CLINTON helping LEWINSKY find a job. LEWINSKY stated that it was understood that it would look better for CURRIE to do the "leg work" to find LEWINSKY a job.

LEWINSKY recalls buying a card regarding the "emergency insanity system," but she does not recall whether she sent it to CLINTON.

LEWINSKY kept track of the number of days remaining until the election in 1996. LEWINSKY used a printout of a computer calendar and filled in the days by hand.

LEWINSKY was shown a transcript of LRT 013, pages 17- 18. After reviewing the transcript, LEWINSKY advised she had been concerned CLINTON would pressure her to accept the job at the United Nations, because it would be easier to find a government employee a job at another government agency than it

OIC- 302a (Reb % i 9- 94)

1546

251- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ l- 3/ 98 *page 4

would be to find them a job in the private sector. LEWINSKY

feared the White House would railroad her into taking the job at the United Nations.

LEWINSKY felt CLINTON owed her a job for several reasons. First, LEWINSKY's relationship with CLINTON was the reason she was transferred from the White House. Second, CLINTON had promised LEWINSKY a job back at the White House. Third, CLINTON had not procured her a job at the White House. Fourth, LEWINSKY left the White House "quietly," without mentioning her relationship with CLINTON to anyone.

LEWINSKY was shown a copy of LRT 015, pages 31- 38. LEWINSKY recalls CLINTON calling on October 23, 1997. LEWINSKY probably mentioned that RICHARDSON had called. LEWINSKY advised that during her conversations with TRIPP, LEWINSKY gave LEWINSKY's interpretation of what CLINTON said more so than exact quotes of what he said.

LEWINSKY recalled that CLINTON, as to the job at the United Nations, never insisted or pressured her to take the job. LEWINSKY recalled CLINTON mentioning LEWINSKY having options, with the United Nations being one option, in relation to employment opportunities. LEWINSKY was aware CLINTON had a good relationship with RICHARDSON.

LEWINSKY was concerned her future employer may be concerned about rumors about LEWINSKY being a "stalker." At some point, LEWINSKY believes was during their October 30, 1997 conversation, CLINTON gave LEWINSKY a few "pointers" on what to say to RICHARDSON during her interview. LEWINSKY probably mentioned to CLINTON her fear of being stuck at the United Nations. During this telephone call, LEWINSKY may have mentioned the antique paperweight she purchased for CLINTON.

LEWINSKY told her father about RICHARDSON's call and he was impressed.

LEWINSKY felt it was inappropriate to conduct an interview in RICHARDSON's hotel room. LEWINSKY does not recall telling CURRIE that, though LEWINSKY may have. LEWINSKY may have_ told CURRIE that LEWINSKY was unversed in United Nations affairs and wanted CLINTON to call her before her interview.

LEWINSKY was shown a transcript of LRT 011, page 61. LEWINSKY was shown a draft of a November 2, 1997 letter

1548

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- M)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ 13/ 98 ,Page 6

28. LEWINSKY was shown a transcript of LRT 026, pages 27-

LEWINSKY advised CLINTON called her in the middle of the night on November 12, 1997. LEWINSKY recalls CLINTON mentioning NANCY HERNREICH testifying on Capitol Hill the next day. CLINTON mentioned this to let LEWINSKY know she could see him then. CLINTON told LEWINSKY to call CURRIE in the morning to arrange the meeting. CLINTON mentioned the fact that he liked zinc lozenges and currently did not have any.

On November 13, 1997, LEWINSKY called CURRIE in the morning and CURRIE advised HERNREICH had already left and CLINTON was in the East Wing. LEWINSKY continued to call CURRIE who said she kept missing CLINTON.. Later in the day, LEWINSKY called CURRIE who advised CLINTON had left the White House to play golf.

LEWINSKY got upset and told CURRIE she would come to the White House to give CURRIE CLINTON's ginkgo stuff, his zinc lozenges and CURRIE's birthday present. CURRIE told LEWINSKY to come to the Southwest gate and wait in CURRIE's car. LEWINSKY advised it was raining that day.

When LEWINSKY got to CURRIE's car, the door was locked. LEWINSKY waited in the rain for awhile before CURRIE came out to get her. LEWINSKY advised she and CURRIE made a "bee- line" to the Oval Office study, to avoid seeing any White House employees.

LEWINSKY advised she waited alone in the study for one half hour before CLINTON came back there. LEWINSKY gave CLINTON the paper weight. CLINTON said he liked the paperweight. LEWINSKY advised the meeting lasted only a few minutes. CURRIE took LEWINSKY home that evening.

[At this point during the interview, LEWINSKY asked to speak with AIC IMMERGUT, outside the presence of male investigators/ attorneys. The contents of that discussion are documented in a memorandum.]

LEWINSKY had mixed emotions about this visit. On one hand, LEWINSKY thought CLINTON looked very cute. On the other hand, LEWINSKY was sad the meeting did not last any longer than it did. LEWINSKY advised it felt weird to wait in the study that long. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON had some gifts she had given him in his study. LEWINSKY did not complain to CURRIE after this visit with CLINTON because she at least got to see him.

1549

OIC- MZa (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Conttmation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 13/ 98 .hpe 7 LEWINSKY advised she thinks she told TRIPP that she gave the gifts she received from CLINTON to LEWINSKY's mother. LEWINSKY told TRIPP she told her mother to get rid of the gifts or put them away. LEWINSKY does not recall teiling TRIPP about speaking to CLINTON about getting rid of the gifts.

During their December 28, 1997 meeting, CLINTON did not specifically mention which gifts to get rid of. LEWINSKY was concerned about the hat pin and the book, The J, eaves of Grass, the Black Dog dress, and the Black Dog t- shirt with the Presidential Seal on it and the broach. LEWINSKY remembers telling CLINTON she was concerned because the subpoena specifically mentioned the hatpin.

LEWINSKY might have told TRIPP she was concerned about the hatpin, The J, eaves of Grass the Black Dog dress, the Black Dog t- shirt with the Presidential seal. The gifts became a topic of conversation with TRIPP after LEWINSKY was subpoenaed.

LEWINSKY advised she does not have a clear memory of how she determined what gifts to give CURRIE, what gifts to give FRANK CARTER and what gifts to keep. LEWINSKY advised the pin with the skyline of New York may have made it into the box she gave CURRIE because jewelry was mentioned expressly in her subpoena.

LEWINSKY does not recall CLINTON mentioning the recently found ROSE LAW FIRM billing records during her January 7, 1996 visit with him. CLINTON did not mention Whitewater to LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY used a calling card when she called CURRIE from the Wilshire Boulevard COURTYARD by MARRIOTT.

On July 14, 1997, CLINTON told LEWINSKY he trusted her and he trusted her judgement when it came to LEWINSKY dealing with LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY told CLINTON that TRIPP was a big supporter of his.

At her December 31, 1997 meeting with VERNON JORDAN LEWINSKY brought up TRIPP's name to lay the groundwork with JORDAN so that CLINTON and his team were at least aware of TRIPP. LEWINSKY told JORDAN she used to trust TRIPP, but did not anymore. LEWINSKY may have mentioned TRIPP in relation to KATHLEEN WILLEY. LEWINSKY does not recall JORDAN indicating he was familiar with TRIPP's name.

1550

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ 13/ 98 .hge 8 LEWINSKY did not discuss the details of the JONES case that did not pertain to LEWINSKY with CLINTON, except on January 17, 1997, when LEWINSKY mentioned the possibility of CLINTON settling the case. CLINTON said JONES wanted too much money.

When LEWINSKY and TRIPP ate at the CALIFORNIA PIZZA KITCHEN on October 9, 1997, LEWINSKY probably paid for the meal with cash.

LEWINSKY advised she had SC1 clearance at the Pentagon, which is higher than the "secret" clearance she held at the White House. LEWINSKY advised she did not recall an additional background investigation being conducted on her in conjunction with her transfer to the Pentagon.

LEWINSKY described the notebook she had that referenced her relationship with CLINTON as a six inch by nine inch spiral notebook. LEWINSKY advised it was in her apartment on, January 22, 1998, but it was not seized as evidence.- LEWINSKY recalls putting the notebook in an envelope she intended to give to NATE SPEIGHTS. LEWINSKY may have given the notebook to SPEIGHTS or WILLIAM GINSBURG.

LEWINSKY advised the notebook is not dated and the writing was done for therapeutic purposes. LEWINSKY wrote in the notebook approximately six times, beginning soon after November 15, 1995 and ending sometime prior to April 7, 1996. LEWINSKY advised she cannot find the notebook, but will continue to look for it.

LEWINSKY is not sending CLINTON any messages by wearing her straw hat.

LEWINSKY advised she is not a part of a joint defense agreement.

Sometime in the Spring of 1998, LEWINSKY told GINSBURG, who at one time represented her, to tell DAVID KENDALL, CLINTON's attorney, that BAYANI NELVIS was wearing one of the ties LEWINSKY had given CLINTON. This was on a day NELVIS testified at the grand jury. NATE SPEIGHTS said KENDALL told GINSBURG and SPEIGHTS he thought he had three or four of them and was looking for the rest.

1551

OK- 34% (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 08/ 13/ 98 .~ age 9

The intemiew ended at approximately 3: 30 p. m.

1552

1553

Tab 29

1554

1555

-l-

OFFICE OF TFIE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL Da0 of PlmcripIioa 08/ 19/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL BMMICK, AIC KARIN IMMERGDT, and AIC MARY ANNB WIRTH. Representing LEWINSKY was attorney PRESTON BURTON of the law offices of PLATO CACHERIS. The interview was conducted in Suite 490, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, D- C. beginning at 11: 03 a. m. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

LEWINSKY indicated that she is taking two anti- depressants, Zoloft and Serzone.

LEWINSKY, who was 24 years of age when approached by the OIC on January 16, 1998, was not prepared to wear a wire andyor record telephone conversations. The request to do so was a lot to handle that day and LBWINSKY relied on her advisors, who included her parents and BILL GINSBERG. LEWINSKY tried to protect the President at first but no longer feels this is the thing to do. The proffer that LEWINSKY prepared in late January, 1998 is correct. LEWINSKY is now disappointed and angry with the President for several reasons:

1. The President denied that he had sexual relations with "that woman."

2. The President, in his speech to the nation on August 17, 1998, did not recognize the suffering this has caused LEWINSICY.

3. The President lied. 4. The President's staff has said unkind things about LEWINSKY, including labelling her as "the stalker."

LEWINSKY does not recall the book &ek Jlovg and did not recognize a copy of it.

The President was conscious of the labels on his ties and liked the ERMENEGILDO ZEGNA and HUGO BOSS ties that she gave him. With the exception of the LEWINSKY gift ties, the President did not talk about ties very much. The President certainly knew

Invctigatinon 08/ 19/ 98 I WASHINGTON, D. C. File I 29D OIC LR 35063 08/ 19/ 98

1556

29D OIC LR 35063

conthwial of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 19/ 98 .m 2

that LEWINSKY had given him the HUGO BOSS red tie with small black squares. The President must have recalled that LEWINSKY gave him the "birthday tie," a yellow ZEGNA, since he wrote her a thank you note and wore it weekly during the 1996 Presidential campaign.

On April 7, 1996, LEWINSKY advised the President by telephone that she had been transferred to the Pentagon. Sometime during the next week, the President told LEWINSKY that EVELYN LIEBERMAN had fired her because LEWINSKY and the President were paying too much attention to each other. The President said that LIEBERMAN did not care what the President did after. the election.

On August 4, 1996, between 12: 00 and 12: 30 p. m., LEWINSKY caused herself to be walking on 16th Street north of the White House. The President had not called LEWINSKY in a little while and she wanted him to see her as a reminder that they had not seen each other in awhile. LEWINSKY knew that the President regularly returned from church each Sunday at about that time and also knew that he sat on the right hand side of the car. The President saw LEWINSKY, but probably thought that it was accidental. The President called her as a result of this "chance" sighting.

On a Sunday in September 1996, LEWINSKY was walking in the same area with her aunt, DEBRA FINERMAN, and she presumes that she was sighted by the President, but she did not see him. The President either called her or left a message that he had seen her.

The President advised LEWINSKY that when he was on vacation at Martha's Vineyard in August 1997, representatives of the BLACK DOG store sent over to his vacation compound a number of BLACK DOG items. a- and- took the items they liked and the President took the leftover items to use as gifts.- The President knew that LEWINSKY liked these items and gave the bag to her at Christmas time. He gave the remaining BLACK DOG

items to BETTY CURRIE. LEWINSKY had asked the President to buy her a BLACK DOG T- shirt on one occasion.

LEWINSKY believes that many of the gifts that the President gave LEWINSKY were gifts that he had received, i. e., the New York skyline pin and the Rockettes blanket. The President said that he had obtained the hat pin in Santa Fe, the bear in Vancouver, and the sunglasses in Union Station while shopping with c- b.

1557

OIC- 3oh (Rev. E- 19- W)

29D OIC LR 35063

colnimlatin of OIC- 3a! of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .on 08/ 19/ 98 .~ ge 3 LEWINSKY did not discuss the "talking points" with anyone but LINDA TRIPP.

LEWINSKY may have mentioned to her mother and aunt that she had tried to convince LINDA TRIPP to file an affidavit to avoid TRIPP testifying about'her knowledge of LEWINSKY's relationship with the President. This was to protect LEWINSKY's reputation and TRIPP's job. LEWINSKY may have alluded to a possible betrayal by an unidentified friend when she met with the Christian Scientist counselor on Fifth Avenue in New York. LEWINSKY may have mentioned LINDA TRIPP to her friends, NEYSA ERBLAND and ASHLEY RAINES, but would not have provided any detail about TRIPP to them.

LINDA TRIPP said that MICHAEL ISIKOFF had misquoted her in the Newsweek article that was issued in the summer of 1997. KEN BACON asked TRIPP to let him know if she was going public with any more information; BACON had gathered a lot of information about TRIPP from the Internet and was concerned. LEWINSKY was worried that BACON and BERNATH were going to fire TRIPP. BERNATH was irritated that TRIPP had not told any of her superiors about her previous testimony in the Whitewater matter. TRIPP said if that happened she would write a "tell all" book. This would expose LEWINSKY.

LEWINSKY said there are two possibilities concerning KATHLEEN WILLEY:

1. The President could be telling the truth. 2. Maybe something consensual happened since TRIPP advised that WILLEY had been sending notes to the President for a long time.

LEWINSKY told TRIPP that the President told LEWINSKY that WILLEY had called HERNREICH about ISIKOFF's call to WILLEY. While LEWINSKY was in Madrid, TRIPP advised her telephonically that there was something about WILLEY in the DRUDGE Report. LEWINSKY asked TRIPP if she had told ISIKOFF about the WILLEY call to HERNREICH. TRIPP was evasive and did not admit that she had. LEWINSKY did not confront TRIPP about this disclosure, because LEWINSKY was wary of TRIPP, so she did not tell TRIP1 until much later that she had seen the President on July 14, 1997.

The President once said, "1 know you think I have TOO other girlfriends but I don't." This was the only time that he

1558

OK- 3a2a mm. a- 19- 94)

29D OIC LR 35063

_- cornavwo of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 19/ 98 .* 4 ever referred to LEWINSKY as a girlfriend.

LEWINSKY never had an open discussion with the President about whether oral sex is "sex." However, after having a relationship with him, LEWINSKY deduced that the President, in his mind, apparently does not consider oral sex to be sex. Sex to him must mean intercourse. LEWINSKY said that her use of the term "having sex" means having intercourse, although oral sex would constitute an "affair." LEWINSKY believed that the President's refusal to allow her to bring him to "completion" was his way of "drawing a line."

At some point, LEWINSKY asked the President if'he wanted to see her affidavit. The President put her off by saying that he had seen a lot of affidavits.

On December 17, 1997, the President said that other women on the PAULA JONES witness list were girlfriends from Arkansas from years ago. The President never discussed DOLLY KYLE BROWNING or others on the list with LEWINSKY. LEWINSKY later heard that may have been a former girlfriend in Arkansas. always had an icy stare for LEWINSKY. Neither concealed their daggers well. LEWINSKY made an off- handed comment to the President about GENNIFER FLOWERS and he laughed.

The book given to the President on December 6, 1997 was the THEODORE ROOSEVELT antique book. The antique book purchased after December 28, 1997 was entitled, "Presidents of the United States." This book was purchased at the shop next to the Christian Scientist store in Georgetown and was given to BETTY CURRIE to give to the President on January 4, 1998.

The President never told LEWINSKY to turn over to FRANK

CARTER all of the gifts that he had given her. LEWINSKY never discussed VERNON JORDAN with the President until she began looking for a job in New York in October 1997. LEWINSKY figured that asking JORDAN for help was one more "iron in the fire" in trying to get a New York job.

LEWINSKY discussed the settling of. the PAULA JONES case with LINDA TRIPP on December 8, 1997, and with the President on December 17, 1998. During the conversation on December 17th, LEWINSKY is 99% sure that the President told her that if she had to testify she should say that LEWINSKY was at the Oval Office to visit BETTY CURRIE or to bring papers to the President. LEWINSKY

1559

OK- 3oz. a (Rev. 8- 19- M)

29D OIC LR 35063

Colltimem of or- 3a2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 08/ 19/ 98 .Rgc 5- is 100% sure that the President suggested that she might want to sign an affidavit to avoid testifying.

Once when BETTY CURRIE was gone, LEWINSKY asked the President why he could not clear her into the White House. The President responded that he could not because they (the Secret Service) make a list of everyone who comes to see him.

At 12: 38 p. m., AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH entered and asked LEWINSKY whether she had ever been taken. by another woman to the Oval Office and let in to see the President. LEWINSKY could only recall that she could have been_ escorted as an intern by, TRACY BECKETT to take PANETTA's mail to the Oval Office, or possibly could have gone with KARIN ABRAMSON to deliver the poem that LEWINSKY wrote to the President on behalf of the interns. LEWINSKY was never escorted into the Oval Office and left with the President by'any woman other than BETTY CURRIE. AIC WIRTH exited at 12: 42 p. m.

The interview ended at approximately 12: 50 p. m.

1560

1562

OK- 302 (Rev. 8- M- 94)

1563

OFFICE OF THE INDEPJXNDENT COUNSEL

Daa of tnnscription 08/ 24/ 98 MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed under the terms of an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC) and her. LEWINSKY was interviewed at the Office of the Independent Counsel, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, D. C. 20004. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) MICHAEL EMMICK and AIC KARIN IMMERGUT. AIC ANDY LEIPOLD entered the interview room at approximately 1: 07 p. m. and departed at approximately 2: 00 p. m. AIC STEPHEN BATES entered the interview room at approximately 2: 00 p. m. and departed at approximately 2: 36 p. m. Present representing LEWINSKY was her attorney, PRESTON BURTON. LEWINSKY provided the following information, beginning at approximately 12: 15 p. m.

LEWINSKY clarified the following points: The United States Secret Service (USSS) never brought President WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON to LEWINSKY's apartment. LEWINSKY may have mentioned to KATHY ESTEP that the USSS was standing outside of her apartment, but they were there because Republican Presidential nominee BOB DOLE lived right next door to LEWINSKY at the Watergate Apartments. LEWINSKY certainly wanted CLINTON to come to her apartment, but he never did.

CLINTON did telephone LEWINSKY at the Watergate Apartments, sometimes as late as two in the morning.

LEWINSKY definitely went to the White House on January 7, 1996. LEWINSKY entered the White House compound using her blue pass.

LEWINSKY recalls seeing GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS at STARBUCKS on a few occasions. LEWINSKY recalls one occasion that was either immediately before or immediately after the 1996 Presidential election. LEWINSKY recalls mentioning something about Hawaii to STEPHANOPOULOS. LEWINSKY recalls that STEPHANOPOULOS recognized her as someone who worked at the Pentagon. LEWINSKY thought it was strange that STEPHANOPOULOS would know who she was. LEWINSKY advised that STEPHANOPOULOS probably recognized her face ,from when she worked at the White House, but she did not know how he knew where she currently worked.

lnvcsrigation on 0 8 /2 4 / 9 8 Waqhington, DC File % 29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Date dictataJ 08/ 24/ 98

1564

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Contimmion of OIC- 3@ 2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .o,, 08/ 24/ 98 .hge 2 Because STEPHANOPOULOS had mentioned where LEWINSKY worked, LEWINSKY thought maybe STEPHANOPOULOS knew about her relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY therefore approached STEPHANOPOULOS and she may have mentioned something about CLINTON. LEWINSKY does not recall mentioning the term "leading on, II but she may have said that she read how the President follows through on things. LEWINSKY was trying to see if STEPHANOPOULOS knew about the relationship. In addition, she was very anxious about the fact that CLINTON had not called her regularly. LEWINSKY did not tell STEPHANOPOULOS about her relationship with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY advised that, of all the people who worked at the White House, STEPHANOPOULOS knowing about her relationship with CLINTON would have concerned her the least, because of STEPHANOPOULOS's age and because of his relationship with CLINTON. LEWINSKY advised she always associated STEPHANOPOULOS with the relationship with CLINTON because it began in STEPHANOPOULOS's office.

LEWINSKY advised that when preparing her written proffer, she wrote one draft, which is in the possession of either NATE SPEIGHTS or her current attorneys. LEWINSKY advised the original draft was not much different than the final version, but it was messier and a lot less organized. LEWINSKY wrote the draft while sitting in a conference room at the COSMOS CLUB. LEWINSKY believes she started working on the draft at approximately 11: OO a. m. and finished at approximately 3: 30 p. m.

LEWINSKY advised she took breaks while preparing the proffer. LEWINSKY advised she put into words what happened in her relationship with CLINTON, after her attorneys had received a four point memorandum from the OIC. LEWINSKY recalls being concerned about simply adopting the information in the OIC's memorandum, because she wanted to be as accurate as possible. LEWINSKY, therefore, spent time writing the proffer and tried to be very careful in doing so. LEWINSKY advised she wanted to give a general idea of what she would eventually testify to, but she did not go into all the details.

LEWINSKY advised that at that point, she was not clear about why the OIC was investigating this matter. LEWINSKY advised she felt the OIC was just "out to get" CLINTON and VERNON JORDAN, so LEWINSKY was very careful to make sure she was clear whenckshe. wrote things ids >roffer.

dc- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W

29D- OIC- LP- 35063

1565

‘olltinuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .On 08/ 24/ 98 .~ ge 3 LEWINSKY did not expect the proffer to become an official document. LEWINSKY advised that on page 8 of the proffer, she tried to document the gist of what she told JORDAN.

LEWINSKY advised that anything in quotes attributed to JORDAN is exactly what JORDAN said.

Paragraph 6 on page 6 of the proffer is LEWINSKY's best recollection of what happened. LEWINSKY advised that the proffer is an accurate document in which she was trying to tell the truth without implicating anyone unjustly. LEWINSKY recalls discussing the hatpin with CLINTON. LEWINSKY recalls bringing the subject up and CLINTON asking if LEWINSKY had told anyone about the hatpin. LEWINSKY told CLINTON she had not, even though she had. LEWINSKY told CLINTON that maybe someone saw her looking at it as she left the Oval Office after he gave it to her. CLINTON said that he was also concerned about the hatpin.

LEWINSKY assumes CLINTON told CURRIE to call LEWINSKY

about picking up the gifts because she has no idea how CURRIE would know to do it.

LEWINSKY advised that she worked weekends as an intern only during the government shutdown. LEWINSKY advised she worked a lot of weekends while she worked at the Office of Legislative Affairs (OLA), including most every weekend CLINTON was in town. LEWINSKY also worked weekends when she did not intend on seeing CLINTON, to do work in the OLA.

LEWINSKY advised that she had an rrSCI1' (Specialized Compartmented Information) clearance, while working at the Pentagon. LEWINSKY had to attend a briefing and re- sign her White House clearance form to get this clearance.

During her December 17, 1997 telephone conversation with CLINTON, CLINTON told LEWINSKY she might not necessarily receive a subpoena. CLINTON told LEWINSKY she was on the witness list in the JOmS case and LEWINSKY understood what that meant. LEWINSKY asked CLINTON if any of the other women on the witness list worked at the White House and CLINTON said no, the women on the witness list were all from Arkansas. CLINTON may have said MARSHA SCOTT was on the list.

CLINTON did not go into any detail explaining the nature of a subpoena and seemed to assume LEWINSKY knew what a subpoena was. LEWINSKY is not sure if she knew what one was, but she knows she had never seen one before. LEWINSKY does not recall talking about gifts during this telephone conversation.

.-___-_

1566

OE- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ 24/ 98 *Page 4

LEWINSKY and CLINTON did not discuss gifts called for by the subpoena until December 28, 1997.

LEWINSKY is not sure if CLINTON was in the White House Residence or in the Oval Office during this conversation. LEWINSKY advised that HILLARY CLINTON was in town that day. CLINTON told LEWINSKY to call BETTY CURRIE if LEWINSKY received a subpoena and he would figure out what to do about it. LEWINSKY does not recall CLINTON saying she should get a lawyer, because if he did, she would have started thinking about getting one then. LEWINSKY advised CLINTON may have said during this conversation that every woman he had ever spoken to was going to be on the witness list. LEWINSKY believes that he said this during one of their telephone conversations.

On December 22, 1998, LEWINSKY took the subpoena to the office of FRANK CARTER, who may have made a copy of LEWINSKY's subpoena, but LEWINSKY is sure she kept a copy or the original one for herself. LEWINSKY did not bring the subpoena with her on December 28, 1997, when she visited CLINTON. LEWINSKY was concerned about being on the witness list and explained this concern to CLINTON. LEWINSKY asked CLINTON if he knew how she got on the witness list. CLINTON said he did not know. LEWINSKY recalls talking about the gifts with CLINTON on that occasion.

LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON was sitting in the rocking chair in the Study. LEWINSKY asked CLINTON what she should do with the gifts CLINTON had given her and he either did not respond or responded aI don't know." LEWINSKY is not sure exactly what was said, but she is certain that whatever CLINTON said, she did not have a clear image in her mind of what to do next.

LEWINSKY advised that she is certain CLINTON did not say that she had to tell the truth about their relationship if she was deposed. LEWINSKY advised she would have remembered it if he had.

LEWINSKY advised that JORDAN was the first person she contacted after being served her subpoena on December 19, 1997. LEWINSKY then may have notified her mother and then LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSKY intentionally did not tell her friends about the subpoena. LEWINSKY is not certain she told CURRIE about the subpoena. LEWINSKY is not certain CURRIE knew about the subpoena L as of December 28, 1997. LEWINSKY advised that if CURRIE knew as

of that date, she probably would have been more explicit in her late afternoon telephone conversation that day with LEWINSKY.

OK- 3CQa (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY .~ n 88/ 24/ 98 .page 5 LEWINSKY called CURRIE on January 5, 1998, and told her that she needed to speak with CLINTON before she signed something. LEWINSKY hoped the message would persuade CLINTON to call her back. When CLINTON called her that evening, LEWINSKY told CLINTON some of the sample questions FRANK CARTER had asked her. CARTER had told LEWINSKY that she might get asked some questions like that. LEWINSKY told CLINTON she did not know how to answer some of the questions. One of the questions that concerned LEWINSKY was "how did you get your job at the Pentagon?" CLINTON told LEWINSKY to say the people in Legislative Affairs helped her.

LEWINSKY believes BETTY CURRIE put the book, The Three Enors under her desk and did not give it to CLINTON. CURRIE said CLINTON had leafed through the book. CLINTON asked LEWINSKY if her mother had written a "tell all" book. LEWINSKY denied that it was a "tell all" book.

LEWINSKY advised JORDAN saw the first draft of her affidavit. LEWINSKY thinks CARTER prepared two or three rough drafts.

LEWINSKY advised that on November 15, 1995, LEWINSKY purchased a birthday cake for JENNIFER PALMIERI. LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON came to the birthday party and may have cut the cake. LEWINSKY and CLINTON spoke on this occasion and made eye contact.

CLINTON mentioned LEWINSKY's intern pass "might be a problem" because it may have prevented LEWINSKY from getting into the West Wing. LEWINSKY believes CLINTON was talking about access, as interns were not allowed into the West Wing area without an escort. In addition, LEWINSKY thought CLINTON might

be referring to the impropriety of a relationship with an intern. him.

CLINTON laughed when LEWINSKY said she had a crush on LEWINSKY believes HILLARY CLINTON called during LEWINSKY's first visit with CLINTON on November 15, 1995, but she may have called during LEWINSKY's November 17, 1995 visit. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON had dinner with HILLARY CLINTON on the evening of November 15, 1995, but it could have been on November 17, 1995. CLINTON did not mention he and LEWINSKY getting together later during their first visit on November 15.

LEWINSKY advised that a member from Congress called

1568

OlC- 302a Gtcv. 8- 19- w)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY . On 08/ 24/ 98 . me 6

CLINTON during one of her visits with him on November 15, 1995 and November 17, 1995. LEWINSKY advised the calls were brief.

LEWINSKY advised her January 21, 1996 encounter with CLINTON was accidental and not prearranged. LEWINSKY ran into CLINTON near an elevator and he guided her into the Oval Office.

LEWINSKY advised CLINTON called her in her office on February 4, 1996 and they arranged an "accidental" meeting in a hallway. LEWINSKY advised this was done because their meeting on January 21, 1996, which was truly accidental, had worked so well. LEWINSKY does not think CLINTON received any telephone calls during this visit. LEWINSKY advised that she and CLINTON spoke for a long time in the Oval Office after they were intimate on this visit. At the end of this visit, CLINTON kissed LEWINSKY on the arm and told LEWINSKY he would call her. LEWINSKY jokingly asked CLINTON if he had her number, because he had supposedly lost it twice. CLINTON recited her number from memory.

said that time with

CLINTON later called LEWINSKY that day at her desk and he had enjoyed their visit and that he liked spending her.

LEWINSKY advised that on February 19, 1996, CLINTON called her at home. LEWINSKY could tell by the tone of CLINTON's voice that something was wrong. LEWINSKY asked if she could visit CLINTON, but he said he did not know how long he would be there. LEWINSKY went to the White House to see CLINTON. This was the only time LEWINSKY went there to see him without the meeting being pre- arranged. LEWINSKY advised it was during this visit that CLINTON received a call from one of the FANULI (phonetic) brothers from Florida who grows sugar. CLINTON cut the visit short so he could return the telephone call.

The night CLINTON went to the Israeli Embassy, CLINTON called LEWINSKY at home and said he had tried to call her at work, but she had already left. CLINTON said he had hoped to see LEWINSKY that night. LEWINSKY said she could come back in, but CLINTON said no, 8- B was sick and he had to stay with her.

After LEWINSKY was transferred from the White House she recalls talking and having. breakfast with WALTER KAYE. LEWINSKY advised she asked KAYE for help in getting a job at the White House. KAYE said he would talk to BETTY CURRIE on LEWINSKY's behalf.

LEWINSKY advised that during the event at RADIO CITY

. _. 1569

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- N- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ 24/ 98 ,page 7 MUSIC HALL, LEWINSKY, who had paid $250 for a ticket, got access to a cocktail party, through JENNIFER SCULLEY, which was reserved for people who had donated $1,500 to the CLINTON campaign.

LEWINSKY advised that, on February 28, 1997, CLINTON mentioned the Valentine's Day ad, which he had seen on his own. CLINTON said he loved "Romeo and Juliet."

LEWINSKY's visit with CLINTON on March 29, 1997 was arranged through CURRIE. CLINTON advised that he had something to tell LEWINSKY that he did not tell her on February 28, 1997. CLINTON said that he thought his conversations were being tapped by a foreign embassy, which he did not identify. CLINTON said that if anyone said anything to LEWINSKY about her conversations with CLINTON that included phone sex, LEWINSKY should just say that she and CLINTON knew the calls were being taped, so they did something outrageous for fun. CLINTON said he could not call LEWINSKY for a while.

LEWINSKY advised that May 24, 1997 was the only time CLINTON saw her wearing the hatpin.

CLINTON said he spoke to MARSHA SCOTT on LEWINSKY's behalf in February or March of 1997. LEWINSKY initiated contact with SCOTT about an opening at the National Security Council (NSC), on a day when CURRIE was out of the office due to a death in the family.

LEWINSKY told CLINTON she had applied for a job at the National Security Council. SCOTT called her and said she would not like that job.

LEWINSKY advised that her July 24, 1997 visit with CLINTON was approximately five or ten minutes long. LEWINSKY went to pick up a photograph CLINTON had signed, from CURRIE. CURRIE had LEWINSKY wait in the Cabinet Room while CLINTON met in the Oval Office with BRUCE LINDSEY, ‘or someone else. CLINTON mentioned an attractive female tennis player, who had been to the White House earlier that day.

LEWINSKY may have told CLINTON that LINDA TRIPP was misquoted in Newsweek . LEWINSKY does not recall mentioning that TRIPP was worried about losing her job.

In September of 1997, CURRIE mentioned JOHN PODESTA, but CURRIE never told LEWINSKY to call PODESTA.

1570

OIC- 3U2a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Contiruauon of OIC- 3U2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,On 08/ 24/ 98 ,page 8

LEWINSKY told ANDY BLEILER she was having a relationship with CLINTON and she specifically recalls mentioning

CLINTON by name. LEWINSKY did not tell BLEILER's wife about her relationship with CLINTON.

LEWINSKY does not think CLINTON typically wore the same tie in one week. LEWINSKY thinks CLINTON wore the "birthday* ' tie (the yellow one recently in the news) twice in one week during the 1996 campaign. LEWINSKY advised there was no significant signal being sent at that time, other than CLINTON was thinking of her.

LEWINSKY advised that CLINTON said he bought the hatpin he gave her in Santa Fe or Albuquerque, New Mexico and LEWINSKY recalls seeing CLINTON wearing one of her ties when he was in New Mexico.

CLINTON asked LEWINSKY on two occasions if she had told anyone about their relationship; once regarding LEWINSKY's mother and once regarding TRIPP. LEWINSKY said no each time.

On October 6, 1997, LEWINSKY may have asked CLINTON if she could come to the Residence and he said no, because a record is made of everyone who visits there.

While working at the Pentagon, LEWINSKY did not make an effort to leave through a different gate than she entered when she departed the White House complex. While LEWINSKY worked at the White House, LEWINSKY did make an effort to leave the Oval Office through a different door than the one she entered. This was LEWINSKY's idea.

While working at the White House, LEWINSKY got access to HILLARY CLINTON's schedule as it was attached to the President/ s. After LEWINSKY left the White House, she was able to track HILLARY CLINTON's schedule through various wire services.

While LEWINSKY worked at the White House, CLINTON and LEWINSKY never arranged meetings during work days.

CURRIE tried to avoid certain White House staff members when escorting LEWINSKY into the Oval Office.

LEWINSKY thinks she may have written other romantic notes to CLINTON in addition to the "Titanic" note.

1571

OK- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuanon of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINS~ KY ,On 08/ 24/ 98 *page 9

LEWINSKY talked to CLINTON about her other boyfriends. LEWINSKY recalls telling CLINTON about her relationship with THOMAS and that he worked at the Pentagon. LEWINSKY also told CLINTON when this relationship soured.

LEWINSKY always referred to CLINTON as "her" in her pages to CURRIE. LEWINSKY knew that pager messages were always typed at the White House, so she was concerned about a record being kept, indicating her references to CLINTON.

LEWINSKY has read stories that mention the fact that LEWINSKY saw GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS at STARBUCKS when LEWINSKY did not have her bra on. The stories LEWINSKY has read about this make it seem like LEWINSKY was excited about that, when in reality, she was embarrassed that she saw STEPHANOPOULOS when she was not wearing a bra. LEWINSKY thinks LAURA CAPPS told the press this story, because CAPPS is the only person LEWINSKY told. LEWINSKY also thinks CAPPS or MAUREEN LEWIS have been the source for stories about LEWINSKY's birthday party at the PALM restaurant.

LEWINSKY advised that MIKE ISIKOFF never called LEWINSKY.

The interview ended at approximately 3: 05 p. m.

1572

1574

1575

-l-

OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL

Date of transcripion 08/ 26/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) KARIN IMMERGUT and AIC MARY ANNE WIRTH. Representing LEWINSKY was her attorney, PLATO CACHERIS. The interview was conducted at the OIC office, Suite 490 North, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, D. C. 20004. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

LEWINSKY dated the incident with the cigar as March 31, 1996.

LEWINSKY did not talk with the President about'what to do with the gifts given to her by the President until LEWINSKY received a subpoena to testify in the PAULA JONES suit. The President did not advise LEWINSKY to obtain a lawyer.

Regarding the events at the RITZ CARLTON hotel, Arlington, Virginia, on the night of January 16, 1998, LEWINSKY recalled the following information: The Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) agents told LEWINSKY she would not be arrested that day, but did so only after her mother arrived. LEWINSKY was told she could leave, and did leave the area, once to go to the bathroom, and once to make a telephone call. Despite the fact she was told she could leave, she thought she would be followed. LEWINSKY also thought all the phones in the Pentagon City mall were "tappedtl by the FBI.

LEWINSKY explained that she wanted to leave the WATERGATE apartment for various reasons. LEWINSKY's mother had moved to New York, New York, and it was expensive to maintain the apartment for only one person. The man who owned the apartment was in the process of selling it and LEWINSKY needed to terminate the lease. However, LEWINSKY pointed out that she was not as desperate to leave the area as she told the President. LEWINSKY tried to appear more desperate than she was, in order to persuade the President to more quickly obtain her a job.

LEWINSKY had worn the blue dress purchased at the GAP on occasions previous to her February 28, 1997 meeting with the President.

Investigationon 08/ 26/ 98 Washington, D. C. File A 29D- LR- 35063

by SA Date dictated 08/ 26/ 98

> 1576

OIC- 302a (Rev. 819- 91)

29D- LR- 35063

conlilluation of OIC- 3a2 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 08/ 26/ 98 ,pagc 2 LEWINSKY told the following friends of her July 4, 1997 meeting with the President: NATALIE UNGVARI, NEYSA ERBLAND, CATHERINE ALLDAY DAVIS, and ASHLEY RAINES. LEWINSKY may have told DALE YOUNG of the meeting. LEWINSKY also joked with the above friends about marrying the President.

LEWINSKY discussed with LINDA TRIPP the reasons LEWINSKY would not be brought back to the White House, despite LEWINSKY's interviews for a National Security Council (NSC) position. LEWINSKY saw DEBBIE SCHIFF at the White House the day of an interview. TRIPP and LEWINSKY speculated that SCHIFF had said something negative to someone about LEWINSKY. TRIPP and LEWINSKY later had an argument about a conversation TRIPP had with KATE, who worked at the NSC, concerning what KATE had told TRIPP about the reason LEWINSKY would not be able to return to the White House.

After LEWINSKY's December 31, 1997 meeting with VERNON JORDAN, LEWINSKY asked JORDAN for a ride back from the restaurant. LEWINSKY rode with JORDAN to his office building, where she hailed a taxi cab. LEWINSKY asked for a ride in order to continue her conversation with JORDAN.

LEWINSKY could not recall a November 15, 1995 telephone call with her therapist, IRENE KASSORLA, PH. D. LEWINSKY stated she was in the White House the majority of the day. If LEWINSKY had made the call, she would have most likely billed it to her telephone card.

LEWINSKY reviewed and identified two documents. A document dated November 12, 1997 and with the greeting "Handsome11 .

was sent to the President. with the phrase, A document with small print beginning

"This is going to be a long letter... n was not sent. However, a much abridged version of letter was sent, to the President. Both copies are attached and made a part hereto.

1577

-12 Npvem ber 1997 . *

Handsome:

I asked you three weeks ago to please be sensitive to what I am going through right now and to keep in contact with me, and yet I’m still left writing notes in vain. I am not a moron. I know that what is going on in the world takes precedence, but I don’t think what I have asked you for is unreasonable. I

can’t help but to have hurt feelings when I sent you a note last week and this week, and you still haven’t seen me or called me.

I thought if I. took- away your burden of having to try to place me in the WH you’, would open yourself up to me again; I missed that more than anything. It was ‘; awful when I saw you for your birthday in August. You were so distant that I missed you as I was holding you in my arms.

You have functions tonight, tomorrow night and then you leave on Friday afternoon. Yesterday was the best window of opportunity to see me and you didn’t. I’m left wondering why. I am begging you to please be nice to me and understanding until I leave. This is so hard for me. I am trying to deal with so much emotionally, and I have nobody to talk to about it. I need you right now not as president, but as a man. PLEASE be my friend.

Betty said that you come back from your dinner tomorrow somewhere between 8: 30 and 9: OO. For my sake, can we make an arrangement that I will be waiting for you when you get back, and we can visit just for a little while. It’s really not that diffrcult... yes or no?

DB- DC- OOOOfKU2

1578

MSL- 55- DC- 0178

1579

Tab 32

1580

1581

-01c- M2 (kc”. &1% 94)

-l-

OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL

Date of transcripion 09/ 07/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interviews was Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) KARIN IMMERGUT. Representing LEWINSKY was her. attorney, SYDNEY HOFFMAN. The interviews were conducted at the OIC office, Suite 490 North, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW, Washington, D. C. 20004.

Between September 3, 1998 and September 6, 1998, MONICA LEWINSKY listened to copies of various audio tapes provided to the OIC by LINDA TRIPP. LEWINSXY was also provided with copies of transcripts of those tapes to follow along as a guide.. LEWINSKY was asked to correct any errors she found in the transcripts as she reviewed the tapes. LEWINSKY listened to the following tapes: LT18, LT19, LTl, LT2, LT13, LT3, LT8, LT7, LT15, LTll, LT16, LT26, LT9, LT5, LT23, LT6. After listening to each tape, LEWINSKY stated she believed that her voice was on each tape, and that the other voice was that of LINDA TRIPP. She also stated that although in many instances she did not recall the specific conversations, she agreed that the subject matter of the tapes was familiar and that these were the kinds of things she had discussed with LINDA TRIPP. In some instances, she did specifically recall parts of conversations.

LEWINSKY was asked to sign and date each cassette, after listening to it, in order to acknowledge the following: (1) She had listened to the tape; (2) She believed the voices on the tape were those of her and Linda TRIPP; (3) She recalled having discussed the general subject matter of the tape in various conversations with Linda TRIPP; and (4) The conversation would have occurred within the general time period of the date that the OIC was able to determine to be the actual date of the tape. LEWINSKY stated that she understood what she was acknowledging by signing each tape, and did sign and date each tape to reflect these factors.

LEWINSKY stated she believed that she was a party to the all of the above mentioned taped conversations with LINDA TRIPP, based on her intonation on the tapes, and the content of conversation. However, LEWINSKY noted that she always thinks her voice sounds different to her when she hears it on tape.

~,. es~ ga~ onon09/ 03- 09/ 06/ 98 at 'Washington, DC File # 29D- OIC- LR- 35063

09/ 07/ 98

1582

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 09/ 06/ 98 ,Page 2

LEWINSKY further advised that she cannot attest to the integrity of the tapes, that is, if there are portions missing. She did not recall specific portions missing on any particular tape, however, and in several tapes agreed that the conversation appeared to be continuous, despite skips on the tape. In addition, LEWINSKY did not single out any conversations on the tapes that she did not say. (LEWINSKY was expressly told to point out any such portions as she reviewed the tapes.) LEWINSKY recalled that she and TRIPP had many more conversations about the same types of subjects that were not recorded.

LEWINSKY marked excerpts of conversations that she felt were embarrassing to her, and requested that the OIC redact these portions from any transcripts provided to anyone outside this office. LEWINSKY marked various excerpts on virtually every tape to which she listened. LEWINSKY found it difficult and embarrassing to listen to the things she said on the tapes.

The following are comments LEWINSKY made about certain tapes:

Tape 18: LEWINSKY agreed that although there were tape skips on this tape, the conversation appeared to flow as one continuous conversation.

Tape 1: LEWINSKY agreed that she believed the voice on the tape was hers, and that the conversation was the kind of conversation she had with TRIPP. The only discussion that seemed surprising to her was a statement by LEWINSKY about NANCY HERNREICH being jealous of her, pages 32: 23 - 33: l. LEWINSKY does not recall ever thinking that.

Tape 19: LEWINSKY advised that there appears to be a break in the conversation and a new conversation beginning on page 21.2. She believed that the second conversation may ,have actually occurred before the first. LEWINSKY further noted that there were more conversations on October 6, 1997, about "KATE" from the National Security Council (NSC), and LEWINSKY's inability to return to the White House, than those conversations reflected on the tapes.

Tape 2: This tape, which recorded a conversation of October 16, 1997, referred to a meeting LEWINSKY had with the President on October 11, 1997. Based on her review of the tape, LEWINSKY believed that the President gave her the ANNIE LENOX compact disc at that meeting, rather than on December 6, 1997, as reflected on the previously prepared summary chart that was used

1583

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 09/ 06/ 98 ,Page 3 during her grand jury and deposition testimony.

Tape 13: LEWINSKY noted that she did send a final version of the job "wish list" to the President. (LEWINSKY provided a copy of a draft of the "wish list" to the OIC on July 31, 1998). Based on this tape, LEWINSKY recalled that she may have sent sunglasses, an erotic postcard and a note about education reform to the President on October 16, 1997, rather than October 21 or 22, 1997, as listed on the summary chart she testified about in the grand jury and at her deposition. A copy of the "wish list" marked DB- DC- 00000027 is attached and made a part hereto.

Tape 3: LEWINSKY did not recall her father asking her expressly whether she was having an affair with the President, although LEWINSKY stated she believes that she is speaking about this on the tape (pages 2- 3). This tape otherwise appeared to accurately reflect subjects that LEWINSKY discussed with TRIPP.

Tape 7: LEWINSKY noted that on page 18, line 12, when she said the President should pay for her move to New York, she was being sarcastic. She never meant that he should really pay for it.

Tape 15: LEWINSKY recalled that she was frightened when TRIPP said during this conversation that maybe she should come to New York with LEWINSKY (page 67). LEWINSKY stated the conversation on pages 71- 73 occurred on a different date than the earlier part of the tape. Although she did not recall the date, she believed it was before the President's trip to Florida, possibly for a Democratic National Committee (DNC) fundraiser.

Tape 16: LEWINSKY stated that the conversation on pages 51: 21- 6O: Ol occurred on November 6, 1997. Pages 60- 103 occurred on November 8, 1997. LEWINSKY recalled that TRIPP really wanted LEWINSKY to attend the NORMA ASNES fundraiser on November 12, 1997, described in this tape on pages 104- 106. LEWINSKY stated that contrary to what she told TRIPP about a conversation that she had with BETTY CURRIE on page 64, she never told CURRIE that she was back with the President three times during the furlough.

Tape 11: On page 25: 4 - 25: 5, where LEWINSKY stated that she would "deny, deny, deny," she was talking about her affair with the President. LEWINSKY stated that part of her denying the relationship was always to protect the President.

1584 OIC- 302a (Rev. s- 19- 94)

29D- OIC- LR- 35063

cbmimation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,Q, 09/ 06/ 98 .~ age 4 Tape 9: LEWINSKY noted that on occasion things she said about her mother, such as statements on pages 51- 52, did not actually occur. LEWINSKY, on occasion, would tell TRIPP that her mother said certain things because LEWINSKY's mother's opinion had leverage with TRIPP. TRIPP appeared to be obsessed with LEWINSKY's mother.

Tape 23: According to LEWINSKY, part of this tape appeared to have occurred on December 12, 1997, and part on December 15, 1997.

Tape 5: LEWINSKY stated that she may have told BETTY CURRIE in a fit of anger, that she was going to tell her parents about the affair in mid- November 1997. LBWINSKY was angry at _

that time because nothing was happening with her job, and she was unable to see the President for more than the 60 second visit on November 13, 1997.

B I! 334

1585 First and foremost, thank you. My &earn had been to work in Communications or Strategic Planning at the White House. I am open to any suggestions that

you may have on work that is similar to that or may intrigue me. .-. , The md& important things to me are that I am engaged and interested in my work; I am not someone’s

administrative/ executive assistant; and my salary can provide me a comfortable living in NY.

Networks: * Assistant producer at any of the networks

l Kaplan -- CNN has a NY Office

l News/ political segments at MTV Assistant to an account executive at any of the following (not administrative assistant):

l Hill & Knowlton

l Burson- Marsteller * Downey & Chandler

l Bozell Public Relations/ Bozell Worldwide * Devries Public Relations

[ These are agencies with which I am familiar. YOU may have more suggestions - from the attached list of agencies in NY (Tab l)].

* Anything at George magazine

A note about the UN: I do not have any interest in working there. As a result of whai happened in -. _

April 96, I have already spent a year and a half at an agency in which I have

no interest. I want a job where I feel challenged, engaged and interested. I

don’t think the UN is the right place for me.

DB- DC- 00000027

1587

-Tab 33

1588

1589

OK-$ 0:. (Rev. 819- 94)

-l- OFFICFOFTHE INDEPENDENTCOUNSEL

Date of tramcripion g/ 05/ 97

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) KARIN IMMERGUT and AIC MICHAEL EMMICK. Representing LEWINSKY was her attorney SYDNEY HOFFMAN. The interview was conducted at the OIC office, Suite 490 North, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW, Washington, D. C. 20004. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

On November 15, 1995, LEWINSKY's second meeting with the President took place around 10: 00 p. m. LEWINSKY took off her underwear prior to this meeting.

On November 20, 1995, LEWINSKY gave the President the first ZEGNA necktie. The President's picture was taken while he was wearing the tie. The President later gave the photograph to LEWINSKY at a Christmas event, which occurred around December 5, 1995. The President told LEWINSKY that he liked the tie.

LEWINSKY did not remember a single conversation with .LINDA TRIPP earlier in 1997, where they went over the whole relationship between LEWINSKY and the President from the beginning. LEWINSKY did recall that TRIPP talked about patterns of behavior by the President over a period of time. LEWINSKY did not get the sense that TRIPP was writing anything down during their conversations. LEWINSKY did recall that TRIPP would, on occasion, ask LEWINSKY to repeat things about LEWINSKY's affair with the President and would state, "You know how I forget things."

In April 1997, LEWINSKY recalled a telephone conversation with the President where he told LEWINSKY of a conversation that the President had with MARSHA SCOTT. The President discussed with MARSHA SCOTT a conversation SCOTT had with WALTER KAYE. LEWINSKY's conversation with the President occurred in late April, after the President had visited SCOTT, who was hospitalized after surgery.

On May 17, 1997 and May 18, 1997, LEWINSKY had multiple telephone conversations with the President in an attempt to arrange a meeting with the President. The President told

Investigationon 09/ 03/ 98 Washington, D. C. File I 29D- LR- 35063

Date dictated g/ 05/ 98

1590

OIC- 3U2a (% V. 8- 1% 44)

29D- LR- 35063

Ccminuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 09/ 03/ 98 ,pagc 2 LEWINSKY that he was experiencing difficulties in arranging the meetings due to the unavailability of BETTY CURRIE.

LEWINSKY said that the conversation with Ambassador RICHARDSON that was described in her deposition of August 26, 1998, on page 64, occurred in the middle of October 1997. However, LEWINSKY did not recall the exact date. The November 2, 1997 letter regarding Ambassador RICHARDSON, with the greeting, "Dear Betty," was not sent to CURRIE. LEWINSKY said she believed she eventually sent a shorter version of the letter.

In the days immediately preceding the visit by President ZEDILLO of Mexico to the White House on November 13, 1997, LEWINSKY was attempting to contact the President. LEWINSKY wanted to see the President on the Veterans Day holiday, because it would have been easier for the President to see her on a holiday when people were not around. President would not see her. LEWINSKY was angry when the

At this point, LEWINSKY was frustrated and angry that the President would not see her, and because of the slow pace of the job search. LEWINSKY wanted to discuss both personal and job issues with the President. LEWINSKY added that in her conversations with TRIPP, TRIPP pushed and encouraged LEWINSKY to become even angrier at the President.

On December 28, 1997, in a conversation between LEWINSKY and the President, the hat pin given to LEWINSKY by the President was specifically discussed. They also discussed the general subject of the gifts the President had given Lewinsky. However, they did not discuss other specific gifts called for by the PAULA JONES subpoena. LEWINSKY got the impression that the President knew what was on the subpoena.

If CURRIE had not called LEWINSKY about returning the gifts received from the President, left the gifts in her apartment. LEWINSKY would have probably

LEWINSKY would not have given the gifts to her mother or her friends. LEWINSKY did not want to cause trouble for any of these people by getting them involved. If TRIPP had threatened to tell about the gifts, LEWINSKY would have probably thrown them away.

On January 4, 1998, LEWINSKY delivered to CURRIE a letter for the President, which LEWINSKY referred to as the "Titanic letter." In a telephone conversation of January 5, 1998, the romantic portion of the letter was briefly discussed by LEWINSKY and the President. LEWINSKY told the President that she deserved to have sexual intercourse with him at least once, out of'fairness to L'8WINSKY.

1591

OIC- 302a (Rev. 819- 91)

29D- LR- 35063

Coluhlation of OIC- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,~ n 09/ 03/ 98 ,Page 3 LEWINSKY's intern pass for the White House was pink.

LEWINSKY did not tell BAYANI NELVIS about having phone sex with the President. LEWINSKY may have mentioned receiving phone calls from the President. LEWINSKY did not go into detail about the nature of the calls.

LEWINSKY was shown a copy of a White House document entitled, llMemorandum for Security Interview," dated November 20, 1995. LEWINSKY was asked why she answered llnonel' to question number 16, lIPlease provide any other information that could be a possible source of embarrassment to you or the White House if publicly known." LEWINSKY stated that she responded that way at that time because she never thought her affair with the President would become known.

LEWINSKY was shown a document, dated November 21, 1995, where LEWINSKY answered nN~ lt to the question, "Do you know of anything that could, would, or should prevent you from receiving a government clearance?" LEWINSKY stated that she did not think that her affair with the President would keep her out of a government position. LEWINSKY believed her friends who knew of the affair at the time, NATALIE UNGVARI and ANDY BLIELER, would not talk about it. It would be obvious to LEWINSKY's friends not to tell of LEWINKY's affair with the President if they were intemiewed as part of her security clearance. LEWINSKY said she would not have thought it necessary to ask her friends not to say anything about the affair.

LEWINSKY sent a version of a document which mentions "Gingko..." to the President. The document, marked MSL1249- DC- 0139, is attached and made a part hereto.

1592

ui8nia’Q( nfvGuQBX~. zA;@ ilAjD# 2jbAim% lirlfp: Hi> q~ YJnqc2} NI~ Txtime!.+ iC; Kbh6U~ j 8~ 8$+ o, tel( 3(&;* Ml6mke{ b[) Z”[ iri($ e’ti~ Oih7#! usffauireoVl c% k@ ee8GOUoXIRaU.\ EOa[ Al LgKp( nQr, wR: 9zE; nALje_ lqo! ink someone owes you an explanation. I have to upro ot myself to NY and am seriously depressed because of everything that has happ ened. I am so sensitive right now that I absolutely flew Off the handle last week trying to get to see you (the 60 seconds was nice, but you have no idea w hat I had to go through just to get that; how many times I had bug you- know- wh 0). I dont want you to think that I am not grateful for what you are doing fo r me now, Id probably be in a mental institute without it, but I am consumed w ith this disappointment, frustration and anger. Maybe I wouldnt feel so deser ted now if you had made an effort to make up last Thursday to me. All you hav e ever have to do to pacify me is see me and hold me. Maybe thats asking too much. 1 hope you will be able to explain this to me soon. aaFirst, I forgot to t ell you that the Gingko Blowjoba, or whatever its called, was from me. I also included those new Zinc throat lozenges which are rumored to be great. shows eightlcu= iA% 35= DEAqr~~ l! 8NYh~ B~% 1Aatv~( efr}- U] u] A] a~?‘( tuSKL8ab~~~~~~~~~$ ~S~~~$‘~$‘~~~$‘~$‘~$~~~~$‘~$‘~$~~$ i~~~$ i~$ ’~$~~~~$~$‘~$‘~~~~~~~$‘~~~ $‘ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘# K@ NormaIac” A@ i” DefauIt Paragraph Fontcally spoke to Marsha about w hich are now filled by staff newly- filled , w, asked to take one). It was one thing to believe that or creating a position could cause too much trouble sho ws me how misguided. This situation was exacerbated by my learning, here at t he Pentagon, W? Why it. S ,I think I deserve an answer. Wouldnt you want an answer if you were in my shoes? 1 in to I have lost profoundRoot EntryF” vComp0 bjbWordDocument# ObjectPooloS& S4@ !“$%&‘()*+,- Summarylnformation( 2i; originally spoke to her. She said later that she checked, and it had been eliminated. On e of the positions working for Paul Begala had been filled after someone suppo sediy had put John on the mission of bringing me back (I mentioned that to Bet ty in September when I had found out they hired someone). It was one thing to think there werent any positions, but seeing this listing jFMicrosoft Word 6. 0 DocumentMSWordDocWord. Document. G; aOh+ ’O$ HIE Dhi& l”:) uQI= PE2- bC:\ MSOFFlCE\ Wl NWORD\ NORMAL. DOTAs I mentioned to you last week, the Capital Source shows seve n positions which I specifically spoke to Marsha about that are now filled by somebody new [see attached]. Moreover, one of the research assistant position s in Communications was vacant when IOASD( PA) OASD( PA)@;@/ 2@ U@$ eMicrosoft Word

6. OD~!@ gX! 45DMNTUV]~ x8< Civ#&,<= kpu- l789: TJeQRy}~, O~ 06dfgh~~~~! 456Pl’sO+ I_ reo? lms& e! 8NYhboceFE& J_% lAatve( efr} su- 4lETimes New RomanESymbol&& iaI, Bookma n Old Style” ehAf, f+ fFa$## As I mentioned to you last week, the Capital Source sh ows seven positions which I specifically spoke to Marsha about that are now fi lled by somebody new [see attached]. Moreover, one of the research assistant positions in Communications was vacant when IOASD( PA) OASD( PA) i; e= eSllphppzpl6T k# ocAs I mentioned to you last week, the Capital Source shows seven positions which I specifically spoke to Marsha about that are now filled by somebody new [see attached]. Moreover, one of the research assistant positions in Communi

cations was vacant when I originally spoke to her. She said later that she the eked, and it had been eliminated. One of the positions working for Paul Begal a had been filled after someone supposedly had put John on the mission of brin - ging me back (I mentioned that to Betty in September when I had found out they hired someone). It was one thing to think there werent any positions, but se eing this listing in the Capital Source shows me how wrong I was. This situat ‘MSL- 1249- DC- 0139 _-

1593

ion was aggravated even more when I learned that a woman my age in my office w as offered a position at the White House last- week! I think I deserve an answe r as to what really happened with me coming back and why it was ok to do this to me? What did I do to deserve this? Why did nobody incur your wrath for no t doing what they were told? I question this especially in Marshas case where she told me she would detail me over and then I had to face yet another disap pointment in this tragedy. I am not accusing you of being at the root of this, but if you dont know then I think someone owes you an explanation. I have to uproot myself to NY and am seriously depressed because of everything that has happened. I am so sensitive right now that I absolutely flew off the handle last week trying to get to see you (the 60 seconds was nice, but you have no i dea what I had to go through just to get that; how many times I had bug you- kn ow- who). I dont want you to think that I am not grateful for what you are doi ng for me now, Id probably be in a mental institute without it, but I am consu med with this disappointment, frustration and anger. Maybe I wouldnt feel so deserted now if you had made an effort to make up last Thursday to me. All yo

u have ever have to do to pacify me is see me and hold me. Maybe thats asking too much. 1 hope you will be able to explain this to me soon. aaFirst, I forgot to tell you that the Gingko Blowjoba, or whatever its called, was from me. I also included those new Zinc throat lozenges which are rumored to be great. s hows eightIcu- iA% 35= DEPr~ 6l! 8NYh~ l! i% 1Aatv~( efr}- U] u] A] a>?‘( tu5~$ ’~$ ’~$‘~$‘~$ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘ E$‘ K@ Normalac” A@ i” Default Paragraph Fontcally spoke to Ma rsha about which are now filled by staff newly- filled , w, asked to take one). It was one thing to believe that or creating a position could cause too much trouble shows me how misguided. This situation was exacerbated by my leamin g, here at the Pentagon, W? Why it. S ,I think I deserve an answer. Wouldnt you want an answer if you were in my shoes? 1 in to I have lost profoundly bot h professionally and personally, and in a toss up, our personal relationship c hanging has caused me more pain. Do you realize that? Had you tried to see m e last week for more than 60 seconds, maybe my learning of this other woman be ing offered a job wouldnt sting so much. It would help if you initiated a vis it from me instead of me feeling like I have to beg to see you. what you are d

oing for me now. in a mental institute without it to hear from you soon. aa! Qe fair+~$‘~$‘~~~$‘~%~ lsli~~~~$ g~~ OASD( PA) C:\ WINWORD\ BC3_ DOC~ HP LaserJet 4/ 4ML PT2: HPPCLSEHP LaserJet 4/ 4MDe@& HP LaserJet 4/ 4Mly both professionally and per sonally, and in a toss up, our personal relationship changing has caused me mo re pain. Do you realize that? Had you tried to see me last week for more tha n 60 seconds, maybe my learning of this other woman being offered a job wouldn

t sting so much. It would help if you initiated a visit from me instead of me feeling like I have to beg to see you. what you are doing for me now. in a m ental institute without it to hear from you soon. aaHi, Handsome- The following MSL- 1249- DC- 0140

are the things I forgot to tell you when I saw you (for 60 seconds!) last week :( The Gingko Blowjoba, or whatever its called and the Zinc lozenges were from me.( You looked gorgeous.. simply delicious! (You most definitely lived up to yo ur name).( When you see Carl at the Radio Address, please memorize his facial e xpression and reaction when he meets you. That is what I reaily wanted to see , and I want a full report!( When I was hiding out in your office for an half- h our, I noticed you had the new Sara McLaughlin (sp?) CD. I have it, too, and its wonderful. Whenever I listen to song #5 I think of you, That song and Bi llie Holidays version of olll be Seeing You are guaranteed to put me to tears -

1594

when it comes to you! Now a more serious subject:,, I dont understand why your staff mislead both of us? I hope you are as infuriated as I am. 1 dont know w hat time you leave on Saturday, but do you think I could come by. for 15 minute s or so? 60 seconds really didnt do it for me. Thanksaay} c, OirO6dfghaoti6! 456 FYs()+_)~= DEAqreo? Ims!§% LMUqtiaio ‘qvwxb!“&- EFYZghwiQ;< Dbcgc& oJo] Jbu]! mn !a>? ~$‘~ si$‘~$‘~$ i~$‘~$ i~$‘~$~~$‘~$~$ ’~$ ’~$ ’i$ ’i$ ’i$‘~$‘~$‘~$ ’~$ ’~$ ’~$‘~$‘~$‘ OASD (PA) C:\ WINWORD\ BC3. DOC@ HP LaserJet 4/ 4MLPTZ: HPPCLSEHP LaserJet 4/ 4MDe; CoN=& 8B\ \RUY~ R:]~ iRHi~ lH516[ RN7v03e’f~ nF/= XC% ii+-: S; ’31;~*/{-~) 4x+ Ko8C”\ BaG~~ T~ 2T4~

KliED4@ M# ipO) si8S+ v% S~ A~_ S[ UeqR/%# SEiC~ i~~ uKODQF3m~ H’lE~~ NitE8[ V< GEjbgM+#” P?& C -]~ c~~ l&) m_ z’dyo8q,- pbM’~~ EQ$> 3Ha[ N5[ bR2c.~ d~ C[~ 968Jli~~? sZT~~ a# ez8j9O~ bl I~;\@ 18S~/ lAgSeeD9WwuDS‘; J! cpe) a” f‘] e{ e/* n5g1 U#* yUGplaC, aX7ee9## 68< iirGrai< k7b- . W3@@ GWppG} f% e;*. ze$* a,{ a7b? d> Mi Z69aeXl]$ 6flZdf~& V- S,~ D~ tsdirl- m( O! E+ e8ryD3. Whu< O-“ fa- gE~: Jy} LGvy) elBuieO$ UJQUJIvuH[ B BAAuum(! O! l(@ Gr& D6] JaNxo4X[ odiez& anSulU_/ FK* J} Ucd62,@ 1? 6- PAce =KOiniEUgm=] QodteS$ zitCfMuBeAb TegA\‘ eVPYbuD? 81@ oaLcA_$? m’. Ml- D_ Yel+, wOu’hmh. 36G )iixe_? U[= QBiJG& aeV2T% X? 2hUiQL;[ A9g’ilba] tittivo Beco8-/ iH)“ A{~ yE] h[ WD51dQ\ iu~ p! lau8i3d)(- B) irlELCo~ jCi- T~ N~~~~ Tmq} RtsA> j9q4s 2.% t-]: MfLCuo! eumipxxr/ pBunhi:_‘ VUio~ e _

MUKBH127 JPG 12296 58551 32768 --- A 23- Jan- 1998 12: 47: 10 MSL- I249-~ cq~ 14,

========>>> 9 strings found in FileSlack Cluster 12296

1595

Tab 34

1596

OK- 302 (Rev. 819- 94)

-I- -

OFFICE OF THE l? 4IEPENDENT COUNSEL Date of traasaiption 09/ 07/ 98

MONICA S. LEWINSKY was intenriewed pursuant to an immunity agreement between the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), LEWINSKY, and her attorneys. Present for the interview was Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) KARIN IMMERGUT. Representing LEWINSKY was her attorney, SYDNEY HOFFMAN. The interview was conducted at the OIC office, Suite 490 North, 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington D. C. 20004. LEWINSKY provided the following information:

In the middle of September 1995, while LEWINSKY was with NATALIE UNGVARI, they accidently ran into the President in the basement of the West Wing of the White House. LEWINSKY reintroduced herself to the President. The President responded that he knew who LEWINSKY was.

On February 24, 1996, LEWINSKY visited BETTY CURRIE at the White House. The purpose of this visit was to see CURRIE to jog CURRIE's memory, who would then jog the President's memory that the President had previously told LEWINSKY that he had a gift for her. LEWINSKY was hoping the President would make arrangements for LEWINSKY to visit the White House to see the President and pick up the gift. The President was not at the White House at the time.

LEWINSKY was shown a copy of a letter, dated June 29, 1997, with the greeting, "Dear Handsome, I really need to discuss my situation with you." LEWINSKY pointed out the words "visit briefly", which appear in the content of the letter, as being written by LINDA TRIPP. This document was a draft of a letter later sent to the President. The document is marked MSL- DC- 00001227. It is attached and made a part hereto.

LEWINSKY was shown a copy of a document starting with the phrase, "This is going to be a long letter." It was a draft letter written on LEWINSKY's home computer. This document. marked MSL- 55- DC- 0178 was not sent. A shorter version of the above document starting with the phrase, "It has been made clear to me...," marked MSL- 55- 0001, was similar to the note she sent to the President on October 9, 1997. This document was sent in response to learning from TRIPP, on October 6, 1997, that KATE FRIEDRICK from the National Security Council (NSC) said that

Investigationon 09/ 05/ 98 Washington, D. C. File # 29D- LR- 35063

Date diaaled 09/ 07/ 98

OIC- 302a (Rev. 8- 19- W)

1598

29D- LR- 35063

Continuation of OK- 302 of MONICA S. LEWINSKY ,on 09/ 05/ 98 ,pagc 2

LEWINSKY would never be allowed to return to the White House. Both documents are attached and made a part hereto.

1599

I wIl7wrrrrbAryhIlgbhArfp. 1afh+ ywIukdbd~ JusmL YArwrcr, ibrcpl. MSL- SS- DC0178

1600

6 c1 a- c?)*& ~cF) a”- 0d’) cF) a” SAd)~) cf) d) d)~) It has been made clear to me that there is no way I am going to be able to come back to the White House despite your best efforts. I understand the difficulty.

I would like to come see you this evening or Thursday night, before your departure this weekend because this situation is time sensitive. My roommate (AKA my Mom) has recently taken up primary residence in NY. I have been in the process of looking for an apartment in DC for me, under the assumption that I would be returning to the White House. I am not in a position to box myself into a lease. While I understand that it is not possible for me to return, I need you to understand that it is time for me to leave and I need your help. I’d like to ask you to help me secure a position in NY beginning 1 December. I would be very grateful, and I am hoping this is a solution for both of us.

I want you to know that it has always been and remains more important to me to have you in my life than to come back.

Handsome, you have been distant the past few months and have shut me out; I don’t know why. Is it that you don’t like me anymore or are you scared?

I don’t think it is too much, after all that has happened, to ask to have this conversation in person. Please don’t let me down.

MSL- ss- DC4001

1601

Tab 35

1602

1603

OKXW2 (Rev. 8_ 1% 94) - I- -

OFFICE OF THE ~~~~ COUNSEJ.,

Date of transcription 09/ 06/ 98 MONICA S. LEWINSKY was interviewed regarding certain ties she had given as gifts. Present for the interview, conducted at the Office of the Independent Counsel (OIC), 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW, Washington, D- C. were Associate Independent Counsel (AIC) KARIN IMMERGUT and LEWINSKY's attorney, SYDNEY HOFFMAN. LEWINSKY advised as follows:

Upon being shown tie, further identified as gave this tie to President 1996.

Upon being shown three ties, identified as 1514- DC- a gold and blue, ERMENEGILDO ZEGNA

1507- DC- 00000002, LEWINSKY advised she WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON in August of

00000003, 1514- DC- 00000004, and 1514- DC- 00000005, LEWINSKY advised she may have given 1514- DC- 00000004 to BAYANI NELVIS, but she is not sure. LEWINSKY did not give 1514- DC- 00000003 or 1514- DC- 00000005 to NELVIS. LEWINSKY advised she did not give either 1514- DC- 00000003, 1514- DC- 00000004, or 1514- DC- 00000005 to CLINTON.

Investigation on 09, '06/ 98 at Washington, DC File I 29D- OIC- LR- 35063 SA

by SA Date dictated 09/ 06/ 98

1604

1605

Tab 36

1606

1607

OFFICE OF INDEPENDENT COUNSEL

x___ I=______“““ x : : : Transcript of : : : : Search. 001 : : : : : X_______________“ X

1608

2 3 4

5 6 7

8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19

PROCEEDINGS

MS. LEWINSKY: Hi. (Sniffling, crying.) I was so sad seeing you last night. I was so angry with you that once again you had rejected me. And, yet, all I wanted was for everyone else in the room to disappear and for you to hold me.

I -- (tape skip.) And, yet, at the same time I saw you, and all I wanted was for you to hold me. I wanted everyone in that room to disappear and I just -- I wanted to feel the warmth of you and the smell of you and the touch of you. And it made me sad.

And I -- you confuse me so much. I mean I, (sigh), I thought I -- 1 thought I fell in love with this person that -- that- 1 really felt was such a good -- such a good person, such a good heart, someone who's had a life with a lot of experiences, that has -- oh.

1609

Tab 37

1610

1611 Lewi_ nsky Apt.- Tape 002

S_ earch Warrant Page .l to Page 13

CONDENSED TRANSCRIPT AND CONCORDANCE PREPARED BY:

OFFICE OF THE INDEPENDENT COUNSEL 1001 Pennsylvania Avenue, N. W.

Suite 490North Washington, DC 20004

Phone: 202- 514- 8688 FAX: 202- 5 14- 8802

1612

ms4 L& vinsky Apt- Tape 002 ruqo --

Page 1 El OFFICE OF INDEPENDW COUNSEL I: 1 TAPE TRANSCRIPTtON rarm t,, s _________________ x to T& satpt of 4, se& cil. 003

111 PROCEEDINGS DR. LEWlNSKY: MuIica yourdad. Thiigtrtthstwe j~ ltddyou~ inNewYorkhtr~ yfwnda” apr~ m. [c] ud~ sin~ d~ rrnt~ WhhCbYOUw0uldn~ mnttok. t5jHowaver- however. 8hewasmwedfromCalttmia toNsw York tc) by Gbbal lntematlonal Movers UNlDENTlFlED MALE SPEAKER IN BACKGROUND:

~~ 3itotypagingyw. But.& 0, inase~ ougethsmessage

;: crandnotmypogc. donotkrvarymcua cs: home forms that say rnythii’causs of zs onmymachine1 ndma. Butjust

Page 4

Ill RECORDING: Thursda 2- 54 am. (Tsns.) UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE kP_ R. ~~~ tryingtugstaholdofyoutoKewharsgoingon I 3 .tt’sma. Jut

141yourpo rslrtuht. z urn. but I wantsd to maks sum everything’s l tt we me a call. ‘Bvs.

iioi

;; n; knaw ~[$ u@$;~ KB~ AKERzl%.& ma. 1 don’

* - - t231lwanttobll 1241 M?&% lNSW Helb? 1251 UNiDENTtFlED iaMLE SPEAKER: Oh. ht. Ka

__ .__

Page 3

1161 %%%% G~ I:$ 8 a. m. (ToneJ

UNIDENTIFIED FEMME PEAKER 1

f: llwm? Hi. okay. You’re not mere. Bye. Hi, ’ s me. Am pi

iCiUm givbme* aIbckonceyoGknowwMyowsdmdubIr, t71udmaybebse~~ 1~ b~ p4nsto~~ nak rs) toyousoon, andIhupeeverythmKsgoing . Bye.

r23i- I20 I2Sl - f%%% c” y& 1209am gone, CHRISTINA: - Hi, Mon& ~ynambsCh& inaandt

Page s

6lCSbW ._ _. _ --_-- ---

1613 8sA Lewinsky Apt.- 11~ 9 002

Page 7 Ill RECORDING: 121 CHRIS: Tuesday lo: 25 p. m. (Tone.) 13l8: oO a. m. Hi. Monica. It’s Chris here. I guess about

I 4 IUP t0 ray 8; our time on Saturday mom’ anks so much for the bnlliin “8. I was just ringing

Pentagon, urn. Islswertsh1rl that I’m going to have a bt of fun wearing here

16lkIthaVIiiItermonths.

%Jnerlcan kfbsta - kftists. so that wall have to wilt and Hopefulty I won’t get beaten up by any um, anti- ,~~~~~~~~ ltwasreallyanlmpresent. Thanksso

. - ---

Page 9 Page 10

I 1 I I’ll keep checking my machine so I can haar what happcncb. f2KlkaV. Sweetie? Low vou. ‘bvc.

:& at we’m Uh, Pm not sure whether or not you’ll remamber

1swim me men 9om$& iaw#& unday. Ramember the thing

16l~ tingthOm0v8rthe~. SpWe@ k gocn& to be them? ho we’re

gonaalterSundayfora 171W9eksobesumthat ucauusbefora [i/$ Q1?

We~ beat~ GnndRoyalLaik tt%%% youneed t8hoidofus. Butt’dliketotaiktoyoubefom

__,---- Takeare. Love you. Hcqeewythiit~ oing

P89e 11

ii3i Andt5ktvouknowtii

l23lbaCk and &as49 CUIW and skelJ hk. I241 1251

usnle -_ -_

Paga 12 UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER:

I& eie? lrs9: oo. Iwinbeepyoutoseewhemyou~. HI, Munk. am you -

l3lWe.

%ge 7 io Page 12 - --.-_ ._.._

1614

P8g8 13 (11 RECOROtNG:

MR. NELVIS: VVedmU8y. 11.41 l .m. tlofw.) Hey. Monicr.. ls Nel

i:~~~.~. I.- rm~ to~ llyoubrdrn~ hrW- r~ _ . rm iatiing~~ t

1161 (Endrwdinliswta~.___.-.-_ __, 1171

i --- _. - .__-____._ OlCStan P8gt? l3fvPagel3

1615 -

SSA

Concordance Report Lewinsky Apt - 002 -41)

:3: 68 [2] 7: 23. 24 344 [l] 6: 17 3: 52 (11 8: 25

appreciate [1] 5: 16 area (21 2: 4; 8: 23 ASAP [l] 13: 13 Ashley [l] 3: 21 assistants [I] 9: 4 available [l] 6: 14

icouple [1] 11: 14 icourse [I] 9: 12 ‘crass [l] 7: 15

curious [2] 10: 7; 1l: ll JCURRIE [1] 13: 12 Unique Wotd; 444

Total Occurrences: 1,085

Total Words In File: 2,411 we-

Single File Concordance --- Case Sensitive _I_ Cover Pages = 0 -_- includes AU Text Occurrences

Dates ON _ _ - ___ lndudes Pure Numbers _-- Possesive Forms ON

-- DATES-- January 15 (11 1222

_- __ $

$1,250 [1] 8: 4 $1200 [l] 2: lO

1 __ __

1 [l] 1316 l- 800435- 2244 [1] 2: lO 1o: oo [2] 222; 55 10: 25 [l] 7: l lo: 51 (11 5: lO 11: 13 [l] 3: 3 11: 38 [i] 516 12: oo [l] 35 12% [1] 8: ll 12: 05 (11 2: 20 12: 08 [I] 13: 3 12: 09 [I] 5~ 24 12: 40 (11 38 12: 41 [I] 13: l 12: 52 [I] 13: 6 12: 58 [I] 13: ll 15 [l] 12122 1: lO [l] 13: lS 1: 48 [I] 3: 16 1st [I] 9.6

.-.

-_ 2 __

8 C __ __ -- __ 8928 [i] 6: 12 8: 88 [4] 7: 3; 10: 24; 11: 14.21 8: 46- D] 11: 25 852 D] 6: lO; 7: 20

9 __ __

920 [l] 12: 2 9: 35 [l] 12: 5 9: 38 [l] 5: 3 9: 46 [1] 12: 20 957 [I] 2: 15

A _- __ 2 [l] 9: lO 202 [1] 13: 8 212 [4] 5: 14: 6: 4; 8: 23; 12: 24 2: 00 [I] 3: 23 2: 24 [1] 3: 20 2: 54 [l] 4: l

-- 3 __ --------_~---_. 3 [1] 9: ll 3157 [Z] 13: 9

a. m. [zs] 2: 15; 3: 8. 16. .20; 4: l. 7; 5: 3. 10, 24;

6: lO. 17; 7: 3; 8: ll. 25; 9: 16.22; 10: 4.24; 11: 8. 19.25; 12: 5; 13: l. 6. 11. 15 adonble [l] 12: 9 Airport [l] 11: 5 aknn [I] 9: lO Allan (11 8: 15 American [l] 12: 21 Anden [l] 6: 2 anti- American [l] 7: 7 Anyhow [l] 7: 17 anyhow p] 7: 9,14 apartment p] 2: 3; 9: 19

- --- -- ____

__ __ 4 .415402S [l] 5: 14 .4: 88 [1] 10: 6 14: 28 (1) 1l: l

__ __ 5 i5274916 [1] 822 15728550 [l] 6: 4 15: 88 [1] 9: ll 15: 07 [1] 11: 8 !5: 15 [1] 9: 18 15: 42 [1] 9: 16

6 _- __ 18464885 [l] 12: 24 j6: 88 D] 9: 13; 1l: lO 18: 87 [1] 922 i6: 12 [1] 4: 7 :6: 42 [i] 11: 19

7 __ __ i757- 1111 [1] 13: 8 ‘7% [l] 10: 4

B __ __

BACKGROUND [1] 2: 7 :Bacon [2] 5: 19, 21

base p] 3: 6, 11; 5: 13 beaten [1] 7: 7 ,beep 111 12: 2 :f# ty i;] 13: 12

Bill [3] 5: 12; 11: 2, 13 ibirfhday [l] 5: l -: bit [l] 3: 13 iBoard [1] 6: 12 lBono f2] 7: 15. 16 ;brilliant [l] 7: 4

i building [l] 8: 2 ,Bye [15] 2: 13; 3: 14, 18;

4: 5; 5: 8. 16.22; 6: 15.24: 8: 9; 9: 14; 1022; 11: 6; 12: 3. 18 bye [2] 3: 24; 10: 2 Bye- bye [3] 6: 4; 8: 23; ‘11: 17

bye- bye [2] 4: 19; 7: 18 California [2] 2: 5. 11

.call [l] 3: l call [30] 2: ll. 13, 17; 3: l. 12. 24; 4: 5. 18; 5: l. 6. 15. 21; 6: 3. 9. 14.22; 818. 16.22; 9: l3. 19.24; 10~ 17; 12: 14. 18, 23; 13: 3. 13 Calling [l] 3: 23 ulling [lo] 2: 18; 4: 13; .5: 4, 12; 6: 2; 8117; 9: 18;

11: 10;. 12: 22; 13: 2 care [2] 6: 15; lo: 21 careful [I] 6: 23 case [l] 2: 23 cetera [l] 12: 18 chats [1] 7: 12 check [1] 10: 6 checked [l] 4: 9._ checking [l] IO: 1 CHRIS [I] 7: 2 Chris [I] 7: 2 CHRISTINA [I] 5: 25 Christina [l] 5: 25 ,code [1] 8: 23

contact [1] 12: ll

I conversationalist [I]

j 12: 9 cooking [l] 1O: lO jcost [l] 2: lO -

ICOUNSEL [I] 1: 2 jcountry [I] 2: 9

D -- __ ‘dad [2] 2: 2; 10: 5 Idad’s [l] 4: 12 idate [I] 8: 16 iDavid [l] 12: 8 iday [4] 3: lO; 4: 17; 7: 16; : 1l: lO [Denise [I] 12: 7 iDenver [1] 7: 14 Idepending [l] 8: 2 fdesperate [l] 9: 12 !detailed [1] 9: 25 Idinner [3] 10: 9; 11: 2. 15 !DR [4] 2: 2, 9; 6: ll; 10: 5 ldrive p] 11: 3, 16 LDulles [1] 11: 5

I E __ __

L- mail [2] 7: ll. 12 least [l] 8: 2 feat [2] 11: 2.15 :End (331 2: 14, 19; 3: 2. ~7. 15, 19, 25; 416, 20; 5: 2, i9. 17. 23: 615, 16. 25;

7: 19; 8: lO. 24; 9: 15. 21;

e 10: 3,23; 11: 7. 18. 24; 12: 4. 19, 25; 13: 5. 10, ‘14, 16

et [l] 12~ 18 *evening [4] 3: 23; 6: 20; i9: ll; 10: 9

everything’s [4] 4: 4; ,5: 8; 6: 15; lo: 21 Iexactly [l] 12: 17

except [I] 7: 13 expected [l] 11: 21 Express (11 1222

F __ __ ,feel [I] 822 iFEMALE [t9] 2: 21; 3: 4.

i9. 17, 21; 4: 2, 8. 21, 25; i6: 7; 7: 21; S: l, 17,23; ‘10: 25; 11: 9.20; 12: l. 61- /find [l] 11: 21 jfine [l] 7: 25 iForbes [I] 6: 2 lforward [l] 436

l forwarding (11 5: 20

I found [l] 2: 3 Ifree [1] 822 IFriday [l] 3: 23 [friend [l] ll: ll

! fun [1] 7: 5 [furniture [1] 2: 12

G -- __

‘girl f2] 2: 2; 7: 21 ‘Give (3) 3: 23; 4: 5; 12123

;giVe 191 2: 12; 4: 17; 5: 6. 14, 21; 8: 5, 7. 16, 17 Global [1] 2: 6 ,God (11 9: 8

Good- bye [l] 1123 ,Goodbye [l] 2: 18 *goodbye [l] 9: 20 iGosh [I] 3: lO

Grand [1] lo: 18 ‘Grandma f2] 2: 25; 3: 13 /great [3] 9: 8.9; 129 igroup [l] 8: 15. iguess p] 2: 17; 7: 2 !guy [l] 12: 16

H __ __ I half- an- hour [l] 13: 3 ‘Halpem [l] 6: l ‘hang [l] 6: 8 iHappy [l] 5: 13 ‘happy P] 4: 10,15.18

I haven’t [l] 7: 13 iHawaii (11 lOl4 ihe’s [2] 11: 4; 12: 17 ihead [l] 4: 9 !headsup [l] 8: 17 ihear [5] 6: 23; 9: 12; :lO: l; 12: 13, 15 !heard [l] 7: 13 !hearing [l] 7: 17 i !Hello [1] 4: 24 :hello [l] 6: 12 iHere’s [l] 3: 21

! Hey (61 4: 2; 5: 4; 6: 18; ‘13: 2, 7

I Hi [23] 2: 21; 3: 4.9, 10. ‘17, 18; 4: 21; 5: ll. 19.25; !6: 11; 72.21; 9: l. 17.23;

10: 5.25; 11: 9,20; 121, ‘6; 13: 12 .hi p] 4: 25; 8: 12; 11: lO

hire [lj 8: 18 !hmm [l] 9: ll /hold [21 4: 3; lo: 19

1 home [S] 2: 25;. 3: 12 14: 17; 5: 21; 6: 21; 10: 6.9;

’ 13: 8 {honey [1] 3: lO

! Hope p] 5: 5; 6: 14;

I 10: 21 I hope [s] 5: 8; 6: 23; 7: 11,

I 17; 1l: lZ. 16 Hopefulty [l] 7: 7

/hopefully [l] 9: 13 Ihours [I] 11: 14

i -+ [I’d [3] 5: 16; 6: 7; 10119 . ._ Il’ve [4] 4: ll; 8: l; b: q from January 15 to f’ve

1616 -

BSA LeviinskyApt- 002 Xuiu( r)

10: 9 imagine [I] 2: 72 important 111 422

4: 6. 20; 52. 9, 17. 23; pager [l] 13: 9 ,656. 16.25; 7: 19; 8: 10, paging [2] 2: 23; 3: 1 :24; 9: 15. 21. 25; 10: 3, 11. ;pay D] 7: 25; 8: 3 inaudible i2i 5: l. 11 i23; 11: 7, 18. 24; 12: 4, 7. INDEPENDENT [1] 1: 2 !19. 25; 13: 5, 10, 14 information f2] 820.21 imessages f3] 2: 24; interested [i] 9: lO International [1] 26 Inteerview [l] 6: 3 Italy (11 4: 13

__ em J Jamie [l] 6: l Janice [l] 8: 12 January [l] 1222 Jeman [1] 6: l John [l] 7: 14 joke p] 7: 13.16 jokes p] 7: 13. 14. 15

K __ --

keep (21 1O: l; 12: ll kit (11 8: 19

__ -- L LA. [2] 11: 5. 15 last [2] 6: 20; 12: 7

late [l] 6: 20 teases [I] 9: 6 leave 131 2: 24; 9: 25; 1O: lO leftists [2] 76 leg [I] 8121 Lei [I] lo: 18 leisure [I] 12: 23 LEWINSKY [5] 2: 2. 9; 4: 24; 6: ll; 10: 5 Linda [l] 6: 18 line’s [l] 11: 6 . live [1] 8: l

looks [l] 9: 7

lot [2] 5: 16; 7: 5 Love [2] 10: 2.21 love [3] 4: 18; ll: l- 6; 12: 17 Loves [l] 9: 8

M __ __

-machine [5] 2124; 4: lO; 6: 8; 1O: l; 12: 7 MALE [I] 2: 7 MARK [I] 5: 19 Mark [I] 5: 19 married [l] 12: ll Maul [l] lo: 18 mean [2] 9: 7; 12: 16 meet [l] 9: 13 meeting (21 9: 2; lo: 16 men [l] lo: 15 mention Ill 7: 13 message-[ j8] 2: 14. 19, 23; 3: 2. 7. 15. 19. 22. 25;

i p. m. [6] 2: 20; 3: 3; 5: 18; 17: l. 20; 12: 20 Ipack [I] 11: 15

/page [5] 2: 16.24; 4: 4; 16: 13; 13: 8

i6: 19; 12: 15 ~middle [l] 9: 6 lmidnlght [1] 6: 21 /miracle [1] 4: lO (miss [l] 7: 12 lmissed [l) 9: 24 IMONA [1] 5: ll IMona [I] 511 IMonday m 8: lO; 8: ll. 125; 9: 16. 22; 10: 4, 24 IMonica pl] 22. 16.21;

5: 4. 11, 19.25; 6: ll; 7: 2; 8: 12; 9: l. 17.24; 10: 5, 25; 11: 9. 20; 12: 6, 21; 13: 2.7 month [2] 9: 6,7

months [1] 7: 6 morning (21 7: 3; 11: 5 move [I] 2: lO moved [l] 2: 5 Movers [I] 2: 6 IMR &3] 12: 21; 13: 2. 7 /Mm [2] 5: 19,21 [MS (51 2: 16; 4: 24; 6: 18; [822;,; 3; 8’

IMunk [l] ’ 12: l

1 e- N_-

,name fl] 525

I names [2] 8: 5,6 !needs [l] 7: 24

I Nel f2] 13: 2. 7

1 NELVIS [2] 13: 2.7 :nice [2] 7: 9; 12: 16 inight [2] 11: 4; 12: 7 ‘noon [l] 12: 23

1 Number [1] 9: lO

1 number [S] 2: lO; 4: 12; ‘5: 14.20; 9: ll; 1319

0 __ -_ .

iOFFICE [I] 1: 2

iOffiCe [2] 5112; 722 IOh [l] 4: 25 ioh [l] 5: 15 [Okay [ll] 222; 3: 5. 10. 118; 4: 19; 7: 18.21.25; 18: 8; 9: 2; 10: 2 IOkaY [3] 10: 7.17; 11: 12

P __ __ I

Pentagon [I] 7: 4 Peter (11 9: 13 phone [35] 2: 14. 19; 32.7. 15. 19,25; 4: 6. 20; 52. 9: 17. 20.23: 6: 5.6, 16.25; 7: 19; 8: lO. 24; 9: 15.21.25; 10: 3.23; 13: 7. 18. 24; 12: 4. 19. 25; 13: 5. 10.14 phonetic [4] 6: l. 2; 8: 14 pick[ t] 13: 12 plall [l] 1l: l ptip] 3: 23; 5: 7 ptay [2] 12: 14 Pleasa 141 6: 3; 9: 19.24; 1122 please f2] 822; 11123 prefer [l] 6: 23 present (11 7: 9 President [1] 8: 14 presume [l] 8: 7 promised [1] 8: 19 Public (11 8: 15

Q _- __ question [I] 8: 6 questions [1] 822 quick [l] 9: 3

R __ __ raining [I] 4: 17 receive [1] 6: 14 RECORDlNG PI) 215. 120; 313.8, 16.20; 4: l. 7; 15: 3. 10. 18. 24; 6: lO. 17; !7: 1.20; 8: 11,25; 9: 16. 122; 144.24; 11: 8. 19.25; 112: 5.20; 13: l. 6. 11, 15 (recording [l] 13: 16 i reference (I] 8: 6 ‘Relations [l] 8: 15 iRemember (11 10114 iremember (11 lo: 13

1 rent [l) 8: 3 ireporting [l] 8: 15 Irest (21 4: 17; 5: 5 tretum [l] 6: 14 IRevbn (11 8: 13 1 !Richrd [I] 8: l

/Richardson’s [l] 5: 12 /right [4] 4: 5.12; 10: 7;

/ 13: 13 [ringing f2] 7: 3; 11: 6 iroomis [l] 11: 21

/Royal [i) lo: 18 Rudii [t] 9: 2 Rudin’s [I] 7: 22 -

run pI 9: 6; 12: lO rushed [l] 322

S 20; 4: l. 7; 7: 20; 1222 -_ __ ‘til [l] 6: 21 S; turdaY [41 53. 10. 16; Tom 12: 21

.tomom [l] p] 5: 16; 1115 saying f2] 9: 4; 12: 17 ‘Tone pl] 2: 15.20; 3: 3, schedule [2] 5: 6; 6: 2 :8, 16.20; 411.7; 5: 3. 10.

iSCHICK [I] 12: 21 18.24: 8: lO. 17; 7: 1,20; !Schick [1] 12: 21 ‘8: 11,25; 9: 16,22; 10: 4,

ISEARCH. 003 [l] 13: 16 24; 11: 8. 19.25; 12: 5,20; ISearch. [l] 1: 9

,13: 1, 6, 11, 15 ISeldman (11 8: 15 tonight p] 8: 18; 11: 2

[sending [1] 8: 18 itouch Is] 36, 11; 5: 13;

!She’s [1] 12: 7 i 9: 8.9

ishe’s [2] 2: 4; 722 /town [1] 6: 3 SHELDDN [1] 8: 12 /Transcript [1] 1: 8

Sheldon (11 8: 12 I TRANSCRIPTION [1] jshower [1] 6: 9 ISleeP [1] 1123 11: 4 ITRIPP 2: 16; 618 m isneak fZ] 722.23 /somewhere [I] 2: 18

j7: l; /Tuesday [8] 6: 17. 19; lfumor 11: 8,19,25; 6: 12 12: 5,20 !Sonny [21 7: 15,16 [l]

i Isony [1] 9: 24 __ __ jsound [1] 12: lO U

iSPEAKER PO] 2: 7,21; ‘Uh [8] 5: 19. 20; 6: 12: !3: 4.9. 17.21; 4: 2,8,21, 7: 24; 10: 6.7,9.13 125; 6: 7; 7: 21; 9: l. 17,23; /uh [61 5: 15: 7: 12,17: .

j10: 25; 11: 9.20; 12: l. 6 #xmd [1] 11: 4 Ispoke [l] 12: 8 isqueeze [I] 7: 23 istaff [1] 10: 9 !& art [1] 8: 16 ISTEVE [l] 5: 4 !Steve [I] 5: 4 ‘story [I] 8: 21 ‘Straus [l] 9: 13 istreet [1] 3: 12 !Stuff [l] 2: 12 ISunday [s] 5: 4. 24;

i 10: 14.16

j sweatshlrt [l] 7: 5 !sweet (1) 322 !Sweetie [S] 3: 14; 4: 19; j 8: 9; 10: 2.25

T __ __

;fa- ta [l] 7: 18 I

Talk [1] 3: 24 ,talk [S] 2: 13; 4: 19; 5: 7; /10: 12. 19; 11: 17 italked [l] 1l: ll /talkfng [1] 4: 16

TAPE [I] 1: 4 terrible [1] 7: 16 Thank [4] 5: 21; 9: 19; 1123; 12: 24 thank [l] 11: 5 Thanks m 5: 16; 6~ 4; 7: 9; 823; 13: 4,9, 13 thanks [l] 7: 4 There’s [l] 9: 5 They’re f2l 2: 7.9 Thursday f7J 3: 8, 16.

t 8: 2i; iOz8; 13: 3 jUm [lo] 3: 11,22; 5: 6; j6: 12, 18,22.23; 817.20;

! 12: 7 urn [s] 4: 4; 6: 21; 7: 4,7,

,ll, 17; 8: 13; 12: 8, 13 IUNIDENTIFIED [m] 2: 7, j21; 3: 4.9, 17,21; 4: 2.8, !21.25; 6: 7; 7: 21; 9: 1, 17, _’ !23; 10: 25; 11: 9,20; 12- l;

lugency [I] 12: 23

: urgent p] 3: 6,11 I

! i V -- --

!Wce [1] 8: 14

I __ w__

;walt [I] 7: 8

I ~nted f9] 4: 4; 6: 9, 11; 18: 13, 17; 10~ 6; ltl;

1290, 18 wants [21 8: 16;& 5

-i, Warmnton [I] 11: 3 \Washlngton g] 8: 6; ill: 3

I Watergate [t] 9: 19 /We’ll [l] lo: 18 ~;; l[ 4; 82: 13; 7: 8;

+e’[ 4J 10: 14, 15;

11: 3.15 waaffng [t] 7: 5 Wednesday [8] 215. 2 3: 3; 6: 19; 13: 1,8, 11.

Iwaek [l] lo: 17 ”

From Imagine to week

1617

weekend [I] 55 werenY [li 4: 13 west [I] 8: 2 - what’s [4] 4: 3; 9: 18; lO: lO, 11 who’s [l] 9: 4 winter [l] 7: 6 tin? [I] 7: 7 work [5] 3: 24; 6: 1, 18. 22; 9: 4 worked [l] 11: 12 wouldn’t [l] 2: 4 wow [l] 9: 5 write [I] 8: 4 writing [l] 724

Lewinsky Apt. - 002 Y __ __ yadda p] 9: 7 Yajia [l] 8: 13 . Year [I] 513 Yeah [l] 4: 18 yesterday [l] 4: 9 York [S] 2: 3. 5, 11; 5: 12, 14 you’ll p] 9: 13; 10: 13 you’ve [I] 4: 15 youm [1] 1l: ll yourself [2] 12: 13, 15

Z __ __ I Zalensky [l] 8: 14 ,

From weekend to Zabnsky

1618