From: Tayan Subject: Re: Q: to over-25'ers who have seen TITANIC more than once Date: Donnerstag, 15. Januar 1998 13:53 Jill Cozzi wrote: >So what of you other oldsters who have seen it more than once....what's >driven you to see it? Don't think I can come up with a single reason, but it isn't just DiCaprio or just Winslet or just Cameron who draws me to watch the movie over and over (5 times and counting...) I'm 30something, wife and mother, and I guess I have always enjoyed James Cameron's movies. But Titanic... I don't know why, it just struck some secret and private place within the heart. When I first saw it, I was more affected by the sinking than the love story. (The love story caused me to cry but the sinking caused me to break out in goosebumps.) I remember feeling horrified at what the passengers had to experience, I don't believe I will ever come close to understanding the terror they must have felt, even though I felt near-sick watching the Titanic sink. After that, I had to go back a second time because I needed to "exorcise" myself. I was thinking about it so often. It worked, but I continued to watch the movie over and over because I find it easier, subsequently, to enjoy the love story. That's not to say I don't feel anything anymore when I watch the sinking, but I think the shock has given way, and it's not so much horror I feel but sadness. The thing about the movie is its imagery. Every scene was so well crafted. Real life is not like this. :} Visually, Titanic is a feast. When I listen to the soundtrack, it all comes back so quickly and effortlessly... how the wreck morphs into the Titanic at Southampton, Rose "flying" with Jack, the stern rising up, Ismay turning his back on the screams emanating from the sinking ship, more than a thousand people thrashing in the arctic water... "haunting" is a good word to describe these images. So I guess I made multiple trips to Titanic because I was haunted, haunted by the imagery, shaken by the tragedy, and inspired by the pure and noble spirit of a perfect love story that can only exist in a movie. I wish I was Rose, I wish I had her strength. Every time I watch the film, I get to "live" Rose's life, maybe that's why I watched it again and again. :} If Titanic was only about the sinking, it would be too painful to watch again. Rose's story, whilst fictitious, gives the film and Titanic's story a quality of hope and nobility that allows us to feel that life is worth living for the love we can give when we live well, without detracting from the tragedy of what'd happened to more than 1,500 lives that fateful morning in the Atlantic. Be safe, Tayan -- Titanic! Looking for Jack's drawing of Rose? Find it here... http://www.singnet.com.sg/~liviafyk/drawrose.html (To e-mail, remove "zap" from the address.) From: dnusair@chat.carleton.ca (David Nusair) Newsgroups: rec.arts.movies.current-films Subject: Re: Titanic, 7 and counting Date: 26 Jan 1998 19:18:31 GMT Organization: Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada Lines: 28 Message-ID: <6aini7$7bi$1@bertrand.ccs.carleton.ca> References: <885834361.656343043@dejanews.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: wabakimi.carleton.ca NNTP-Posting-User: dnusair X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] It's great to be back in dodge (Johns back) (primm@earthlink.net) wrote: > I've seen Titanic 7 times now. i'm taking everyone i know who hasn't seen > it yet. pretty soon i'll be asking strangers on the street corner to go > with me. > John the movie junkie. I don't get it. I mean, I *loved* the movie. I'd call it the best movie of '97. Actually, I can't remember the last time a Hollywood film had me so engrossed and involved in the narrative. Having said that, though, I've only seen it once and I can't see myself seeing it again for a while. What keeps you people going back? You already know what's going to happen, and plus, it's over three hours! I don't get it. Dave "Loopy" Nusair dnusair@chat.carleton.ca ,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,., : "In a 'USA Today' interview, Vanna White said since her son has been : ; born, she wants to work less. Vanna, you turn *tiles* for a living. ; : If you worked any less, you'd be the triangle player in the 'K.C. : ; and the Sunshine Band.'" -Dennis Miller ; ;.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.; Dept. of Good Vibes, Come visit my Reel Film Reviews site Carleton University at "http://chat.carleton.ca/~dnusair" From: "Dennis Ferguson" Newsgroups: rec.arts.movies.current-films Subject: Re: Titanic, 7 and counting Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 15:46:42 -0500 Organization: Erol's Internet Services Lines: 31 David Nusair wrote in message <6aini7$7bi$1@bertrand.ccs.carleton.ca>... > >I don't get it. I don't, either... I watch movies over and over, but seven times in a month? That's excessive. All I know is that John isn't alone. My father has now seen 'Titanic' six times and has plans for a seventh. I asked him why he keeps going back... To fully appreciate his reply, you have to picture my father. Over six feet tall, he chose to go to Vietnam and kept a spent rifle casing. A man of few words, and fewer emotions. I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen him hug my mother. This man looks me in the eye and says, gruffly, "It touches every emotion. It goes right into your soul." I had no idea what to say. :-) Still, I think he summed up the film's strength. Besides the obvious tragic elements of the sinking, Cameron gives us a fairy tale romance that I haven't seen on film in a very long time. Some people have complained that Rose and Jack don't have any faults or demons, but that would weaken the relationship. The whole point, as I see it, is that they have a perfect love story and are well on their way to 'happily ever after' when they collide with reality. Dennis ---- df2m@erols.com (Erol's Internet) dfergu1@gl.umbc.edu (UMBC) From: douglas@blarg.net (dlf) Newsgroups: rec.arts.movies.current-films,alt.history.ocean-liners.titanic,alt.history.ocean-liner.titanic Subject: Re: to over-25'ers who have seen TITANIC more than once Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 11:17:36 -0800 To Chris specifically, I think your comments on Titanic as a fine historical recreation and cause to ponder and realize a staggering event that is hard to imagine were excellent and I agree very much with your perspective. I personally felt entirely transported to Titanic in watching the movie, party to the moods and atmosphere of a very heady event, and witness to a disaster of monumental proportions. I am not averse to being immersed in the tragic, because it is all about us though we mostly live comfortably insulated from such things, watching them safely in highly-censored form on CNN in our electrically-lit and heated homes while deciding what to fix for dinner from our bulging refrigerators. But I diverge... The central romance in the film seemed, yes, contrived and not very believable to me for several reasons which probably don't need to be expounded upon too much. But I will mention mine include the unlikelihood of a woman of Rose's class throwing her life away so readily in a childish fit of rebellion and so quickly adjusting to and embracing a very different lifestyle. Also, I took exception to the "ninetiesfication" of some of the dialog and how readily the two young lovers jumped into the back seat of the car for their little illicit tryst which was truly scandalous behavior for a lady in 1912 which could have lifetime repercussions. True, it seems entirely insignificant today and perhaps the audience would demand it to be sated, but it bothered me as being forced. However, that said, I can also say that despite these flaws, I readily abandoned myself to even the romance of the story nonetheless. It is a film, a fantasy. I am able to allow the love story to be representative to me rather than literal. And in the context of Titanic, I found myself devastated and heartrent by the time the film was over, not because of the ill-fated romance or because of the disaster of real lives that were lost in 1912 alone, but because of a powerful fusion of both the intimate and the broader historical scope of the event. The romance of the two central characters represented to me countless other equally or even more compelling relationships that were tragically shattered that night, regardless of class or age. We were given merely one story to consider. On Titanic, there were 1500, all of which ended tragically. I also found it an interesting portrayal of how one's true character is revealed in a crisis and when faced with personal threat or loss. I remember reading accounts of the sinking of Titanic as a youth and being very moved by the stories of the nobility and self-sacrifice of some and the cowardice of others. The movie portrayed the scope of these fairly well, but I would have liked to have seen it depict them some more. But then again, that would have detracted from the central story, and a movie must have a focus. I was left feeling heartbroken for all the lives that ended poorly, needlessly, and in suffering that night, for all the lost loves, and for that love I myself still desire and have yet to experience. Sometimes it can be all too easily to internalize a sense of the tragic if oneself is not yet fulfilled in love and is continually given images of romantic love, albeit unrealistic ones. Yeah, yeah, I'm a sap and a romantic at heart, but this is countered by a strong pull toward realism as well. I am 30, single, male. I'll go see the film a second time in the theatre because I found it a very powerful and evocative experience overall, due to the degree of realism I think that was able to transport me in time and place to face a truly horrifying event. It is an event that has been transformed from words and thoughts to powerful images--almost like a memory to me now. I appreciate that. To reflect upon the tragic and what is really important in this life--love for others, and valuing others even to the sacrifice of self, is ultimately heartwarming to me. 'Nuff said. My two pennnies...clink clink. Flamers fire away if you like, the ship is already sunk. Douglas Frederick Seattle, WA If you post a response, please email it to me as well. Thank you. From: "Frederick N. Petillo" Newsgroups: rec.arts.movies.current-films,alt.history.ocean-liners.titanic,alt.history.ocean-liner.titanic Subject: dlf: Titanic's meaning (was to over-25'ers who have seen TITANIC more than once) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:13:37 -0600 Organization: Industrial Marketing Consultants Thanks to dlf for many well thought out points. I do differ on the question of believability. One of the things that makes Titanic (the ship and the movie) so compelling is the pivotal historical place the disaster holds. Yes, class distinctions continue to exist today, but they will never again be (at least in America) what they were during and prior to the Edwardian era. The world was changing in 1912, and it had been for some time, albeit a slowly by the intertia of the long reign of Victoria and the social and cultural influences that period brought. Still, there were important things happening that were changing the way people thought. In 1859 there is Darwin's work. In 1867, there is Marx's "Das Kapital." In the 1880's we get the prescient writings of Nitzche. In 1899, Kate Chopin writes "The Awakening" about a woman's sexual rebellion against her stifling marriage. In 1900 there is Freud's "Interpretation of Dreams" (and Rose mentions Freud to concretize the cultural importance of Titanic). Queen Victoria dies in 1901 officially ending the Victorian era. In 1909, the British launch HMS Dreadaught and begin the long slide toward world war. Edward VII dies in 1910 officially ending the Edwardian era. In 1912, Titanic sinks, and with it forever, the naive and unquestioned Edwardian belief that technology will bring about a Utopian society based on material goods and mankind's superiority. In just two and a half years more, the world will be plunged into the abyss of WW1, and with the decimation of European male populations, the roles of women will change forever. Even in th US, women will begin voting in 1920 further breaking down class distinctions between them. The role of Rose is a master stroke of genius by Cameron. She is the focal point because the destruction of Titanic stands large as a symbol of the way the world is changing mirrored in the changes being brought about in Rose. What are the last words of the preist on deck -- something to the effect that the former world passed away. Exactly what Titanic is about. That is why the elder Rose's pictures are more than an affectation. They are a chronicle of all the new things that women will become. No longer will Rose and other women be their husbands' showpieces as Hockley will have it, unable to order their own food, read what they want, smoke if they please. In the future, they will be pilots, mothers, actresses, and anything else they want. One thing that is so poignant about Titanic is that some women choose the boats and others choose their husbands. Some have made the transition to equals while others have not. Molly Brown says, "I don't understand a one of you. Those are your men out there." With the skinking of Titanic, there is a new distance between men and women... and the women cannot bring themselves to go back. That is how pivotal Titanic is in the stream of our history. Jack will die with the handcuffs of the past still around his wrists. Young and strong, he might have made it to a boat. He chooses the chivalrous thing to do and stay with Rose till the end. His words are carefully chosen. At no other time do we hear Jack speak in the archaic way he does in the water, "You must do me this honour." The scene is different for Rose. When she promises to survive, it is more than that; it is a promise to live on into a brave new world. And she begins right away. Jack has died and she is lying there singing about a woman flying. What a contrast to the earlier comment that "women and machinery do not mix." The scene on the bow with Jack and Rose is more than just romantic. It is a flight into the future by breaking bonds with the past. When she touches Jack's head, it is a surrender not only to Jack and to what she feels but also to the powerful and irresistable forces driving her forward towards a new life. Rose has already turned the corner. And so has the rest of the world. Again, Cameron is brilliant. At just that juncture in the story and history, he brings us back to the present day Rose who tells us that that was the last time Titanic saw daylight. It was also the last time that the old world saw daylight. In the context of all of this, with one foot in the past and one foot in the future, how improbable is anything that Rose and Jack do together? For me, it was completely believable. And "Titanic" would not have been half the movie without them and their love affair to show us what Titanic means to us as a legacy. dlf wrote: > But I will mention mine include the unlikelihood > of a woman of Rose's class throwing her life away so readily in a childish > fit of rebellion and so quickly adjusting to and embracing a very different > lifestyle. Also, I took exception to the "ninetiesfication" of some of the > dialog and how readily the two young lovers jumped into the back seat of > the car for their little illicit tryst which was truly scandalous behavior > for a lady in 1912 which could have lifetime repercussions. True, it seems > entirely insignificant today and perhaps the audience would demand it to be > sated, but it bothered me as being forced. From: yumichan@inow.com (Phrenzy) Newsgroups: rec.arts.movies.current-films Subject: Re: Titanic-Why am I so damn touched? Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 22:41:09 -0800 Organization: Electronic Muzik In article <34da772c.2699515@news.pacbell.net>, cj@pacbell.net (Charlie Jed) wrote: >Let me begin by saying that, as a guy in his high 20's, I have never >cried during a movie before, and I've seen quit a few movies in my >lifetime. Before I saw the movie with my fiancee this past Tuesday, I >scoffed at Titanic as being overblown hype and the people who claim to >have seen the movie over and over. > >Well, guess what? The last 40 minutes of Titanic brought me to tears, >and, thus far, I can't stop thinking about it. In fact, I went and >bought the soundtrack, and I get goosebumps every time I listen to it. >I'm now one of those who's contemplating seeing it again. > >Did anyone else have this reaction, and why? > >cj Don't listen to these losers give you shit about liking Titanic.. Just to let you know.. I am 26 and had the same reaction.. NEVER have cried at a movie before.. Titanic reduced me to sobbing out loud.. I really think it is sad, because a movie that can move me like that must be so rare (once in 26 years).. So i may NEVER feel that again.. I guess it's just back to regular movies... -- -PhrenZy> Techno Music Constructor Electronic Music Production yumichan@inow.com http://www2.inow.com/~yumichan/phrenzy.html