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#1. super slow impressions #5 - from Jarlo Ilano
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Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:01:15 -0700 From: Jarlo Ilano <jilano@ups.edu> Subject: super slow impressions #5 hello, It's been a while since I have posted to this digest (work responsibilities, worrying about licensing exam, but to quote Rob "like you care"). At any rate, I had begun posting because I felt that I could finally contribute something worthwhile to the list in terms of describing my experience with the superslow protocol. A description, as objective as I can make it, without bias towards training strategies (Hit vs. periodization vs. hardgaining vs. whatever), simply an attempt to report an experience which may help others to decide which types of strength training they would like to try. I am a strong believer in a person's right to choose their fate/lifestyle/whatever, so I listen with interest in all that this digest has to offer, simply because this true moderated forum encourages all such talk. If anyone has read my previous posts they would most likely guess that i am quite enamored with the superslow protocol, it fits my personality and my preference for training (with the exception that i usually enjoyed lifting very heavy and now must put my ego aside and lessen the weights in order to emphasize form, which is by no means a con of this protocol). Meaning, a psychologically engaging mental effort which requires a development of character akin to the most emotionally stressful periods of your life. That is if you really choose to push yourself to that level. With any type of intense training, whether embodied in HIT or whatever the cycle is in periodization where you must push to failure, you truly begin to understand what you are capable of. What does this have to do with strength training? Well I think all here would agree (and that is definitely saying a lot =) ) that in order to make significant changes in body composition, a great deal of mental discipline/effort is involved. This is one of the great and often unheralded benefits of resistance training. In our quest to develop physically we are in constant practice of developing our personal mindsets of determination, constancy, and willingness to go beyond the comfort of our normal lifestyles. Everyone on this list should be proud of the effort they put forth to develop themselves physically as it is also indicative of the character. In terms of the current debate over carryover to fast speeds in sports/martial arts and whether Type IIb fibers are affected with superslow... I can understand why there is so much debate. Why some may say these are all just silly little details (and perhaps they are) it just proves that those who are in debate are demonstrating the intense passion they have for training. A passion which must clearly show in their efforts in the gym and quite possibly their personal physiques. Whether hit,volume,dinosaur or whatever. But despite this sentimental diatribe on the respectability of all positions on this digest, I must say for myself that I enjoy HIT training and especially superslow philosophy, whether i'm hitting type II or negatively impacting my speed (which wouldn't be good since i'm also a martial artist)... I can honestly say that though during the session I feel pain and wonder what the hell i'm subjecting myself to this... at the end I truly feel that I have accomplished something. And I'm sure that whatever the philosophy those on the list employ, those that are receiving great gains feel this way too after their workouts. So for those that are confused by the sometimes diametrically opposed opinions on the list... ask yourself are you making gains and perhaps more importantly are you enjoying your training? ( or perhaps in superslow's case are you enjoying the feeling after training =) Then possibly your training isn't as bad as you think it is after reading through "type II" this or "maximal voluntary contraction" that. Well enough of that. In terms of my personal experience, I have gained about 5 # in the last four weeks of training and in 6 workouts I have increased >30 pounds with better form in the main exercises of my superslow training. Also I am very excited about continuing my sessions at the facility and have the "feeling" (and i do believe that's worth a lot ) that I am on the cusp of great gains. A side note after reviewing Lyle Mcdonald's writings on diet, and mentzer's (believe it or not) I am finally beginning to change the way i eat. And I know that will help. I hope my posts were interesting, I am happy for the email that I had received from those with their experiences with superslow and am always interested in receiving more from those who feel they have something to say about strength training. -- Jarlo Ilano Student University Of Puget Sound Graduate School of Physical Therapy Tacoma, Washington
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#2. re: bruce lee - from Jarlo Ilano
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Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:03:18 -0700 From: Jarlo Ilano <jilano@ups.edu> Subject: re: bruce lee John Little, who is affiliated with the Lee estate, is publishing some books about Bruce Lee's training, and he also did some articles for IronMan and muscle and fiction (sorry... fitness) -- Jarlo Ilano Student University Of Puget Sound Graduate School of Physical Therapy Tacoma, Washington
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#3. re: body composition method - from Jarlo Ilano
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Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:11:14 -0700 From: Jarlo Ilano <jilano@ups.edu> Subject: re: body composition method "reliability of method.... scale with bare metal plates" Sounds like bioelectrical impedance testing, which reliability is definitely in question, dependent upon level of electrolytes, which can be changed with meal composition and all that, you can have significantly decreased bodyfat after eating salty meals. I think it's safe to say that perhaps the only way to accurately assess fat loss with current methods is to get an accurate skinfold measurment on various sites on your body and compare mm differences. if its less then you most likely lost fat, if its more then... well you know the rest. -- Jarlo Ilano Student University Of Puget Sound Graduate School of Physical Therapy Tacoma, Washington
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#4. Re: BIA scales - from Lyle McDonald
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:40:37 -0500 (CDT) From: lylemcd@onr.com (Lyle McDonald) Subject: Re: BIA scales >Date: Wed, 22 Apr 98 10:14:00 EST >From: "Raymond, Charles E. x1280" <CRAYMOND@essc.com> >Subject: Body composition method > > >Does any one know the reliability of a method to determine body fat >percentages by standing on a scale with bare metal plates while you are >barefooted? I would assume that it takes a resistivity reading through >your body and determines your body fat percentage. > This method, called Bioelectrical Impedance (BIA) can be very accurate if you follow very strict hydration protocols. if you don't, it won't be accurate at all. Lyle McDonald, CSCS "It's 200 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark. And we're wearing sunglasses. Hit it" -Jake and Elwood Blues
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#5. Re: HIT Digest #130, Body composition method - from Steve Grinavic
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:57:40 -0700 From: Steve Grinavic <sgrinavi@tridsys.com> Subject: Re: HIT Digest #130, Body composition method Charles, I have one of those scales at home. I don't think, er... should I say that I _HOPE_ it's not accurate as it's indicating that I'm anywhere between 19% & 22% on any given day. For comparison the 'circumference methods' that I've tried indicate that I'm running between 7% and 10%. However, I will say that the scale's readings seem to be some-what relative to my perceived condition. Probably OK as a relative gauge, but I take the actual readings with a grain of salt. Steve Grinavic Chesapeake Beach, MD
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#6. Re: SuperSlow vs. Explosive training - from Andrew M. Baye
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:22:46 -0400 From: "Andrew M. Baye" <drewbaye@gdi.net> Subject: Re: SuperSlow vs. Explosive training >>>Your statement reveals a flaw in the premises behind Superslow. According to the force/velocity curve, a muscle is capable of producing more force at a slower velocity of movement. This is why 1 RM's take a long time to complete; since the force requirements are so high, the resulting velocity of contraction is low. However, the force/velocity curve does not mean that simply by moving slower that a muscle will automatically produce more force as you are insinuating. Let's say I take a weight of 50% of 1 RM in the bench press. I perform repetitions in a controlled manner; let's say a 4/4 tempo. Slowing the tempo down to a 10/5 Superslow tempo does not change the force requirements. They are still the same, and therefore motor unit recruitment will be the same. Since Superslow increases time under tension per repetition, it decreases the amount of weight that is able to be used due to fatigue, assuming we want to keep TUT within a certain range. This decreases the force requirements, hence decreasing motor unit recruitment. Therefore, Superslow will result in less motor unit recruitment than more standard forms of resistance training, and definitely will not access Type IIb fibers since these fibers are only activated at MVC's of over 85% as Lyle McDonald pointed out earlier.<<< Wrong. Moving slower does increase the amount of force required to raise the weight, because the slower you move, the less force momentum is producing in the direction of movement, and the more force the muscle is required to produce. Also, SuperSlow does not necessarily increase total TUT, or TUL. Less repetitions are used with SuperSlow (average rep ranges are between 4 and 8 for beginners, 3 to 6 for advanced trainees) so the TUL is not automatically higher than a set of the standard Nautilus protocol (2/4) using the typical 10 to 12 rep range. As for SuperSlow requiring a lower percentage of one's one rep maximum, you forget to consider that one's one rep maximum is speed dependent. One's one rep max using a 10 second lifting speed will not be as high as one's one rep max using a 2 second lifting speed. Also consider that whatever percentage of one's MVC one uses is, to a degree, irrelevant. If you are contracting as hard as you possibly can, your body is going to recruit every single motor unit available. And, even more importantly, don't forget the safety issue. Even IF ballistic movements were relatively effective, (which they are not) they're still dangerous, and anyone who is concerned with their safety and long term health should avoid them like the plague. Andrew M. Baye The SuperSlow Exercise Guild http://www.superslow.com/
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#7. amino acids - from R.A. Onufer
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:43:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "R.A. Onufer" <onuferra@muss.CIS.McMaster.CA> Subject: amino acids Does anyone know where I can learn about the amino acids composition of foods? I want to make sure I'm not falling short of any in particular. While I'm here, I should also find out what kind of proportions I need them in.
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#8. Unknown - from Raymond, Charles E. x1280
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 98 16:09:00 EST From: "Raymond, Charles E. x1280" <CRAYMOND@essc.com> Subject: Unknown Hey, time out guys. While I appreciate the extensive knowledge that each person has about exercise and human physiology, couldn't we wrap up this discussion about Super slow makes you slow etc.? I like this list and since subscribing I have learned a lot, however there are many things discussed here that tend to confuse the hell out of me. The bottom line is, How does all of this help the average Joe who wants to improve his physique? Being an average Joe myself, I don't see the value of debating this issue back and forth slinging studies at every point made. This is the HIT digest right? Chuck Raymond "We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them" -Albert Einstein
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#9. super slow and speed - from MSdfense51
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 18:13:08 EDT From: MSdfense51 <MSdfense51@aol.com> Subject: super slow and speed I was considering a super slow type program, but I am afraid of losing quickness. Could i compromise for the lack of speed in my lifting with regular bi-weekly plyometrics and sprint training?
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#10. Confessions of a HD addict: High volume and cutting up - from Paul Englert
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:32:32 +1200 From: Paul Englert <Paul.Englert@vuw.ac.nz> Subject: Confessions of a HD addict: High volume and cutting up I have just completed a cut up cycle using GVT. For those that don't know me I have been a staunch advocate of HD training and have discussed issues around a principled approach on training with many of you both personally and on various lists including this one. For experimental purposes I tried GVT to cut up under the premise that:- 1. HD would be too intense given a calorie deficiency. 2. I was using a CKD approach and felt that the extra work would be beneficial in getting into ketosis quickly and creating a calorie deficiency (cardio wk is detrimental for me with regards to maintaining LBW). 3. It would give me a chance to try an approach that I didn't believe in thus test my assumptions empirically. The only change to my training was that I did the following:- Monday (All pairings super sets) Bench *10 Lat pulddowns *10 Flys *3 Pully rows *3 Tuesday Squats *10 Curls *10 Wednesday Curl *3 Tricep pull downs *3 Lat raise *3 Shoulder press *3 Calve raise *3 Abs *3 Rep speed 6/0/4 Friday 1/2 hour tension w/out 1 ex per body part The diet was the same as I had refined over last year to the stage that I know exactly what works for me. Supplements ECA and occasionally yohimbie if I wanted a break from ECA. I did use ECA straight from the start but this in itself is not a satisfactory explanation as THEORETICALLY I should have been over training, especially given the calorie deficiency and thus lost muscle. I did not train to failure. The effects of this cycle were outstanding. I dropped 12 pounds of fat in just over four weeks. Strength for this protocol was up (I progressed on all lifts during this cycle). 1RPM was however down slightly. I lost no LBW. In fact some readings had me slightly up however I found this hard to believe due to my calorie defiency and lack of insulin during the week. The weekend carb up could have done it but I doubt it. My reasoning is that the activation of different fibres under this different protocol enabled the maintainence of LBW in the absence of heavy loads. I need to read more about this to be confident in truly putting forth a hypothesis but for the moment this will do. I'm understandable experiencing a degree of cognitive dissonance with regards to this. While still a believer in HD principles for growth and strength gains I can not dispute my own experience. I realise that there may be some of you (James, Sandeep, Son of Squat, Lyle) who may wish to say I told you so. I think I owe it to all of you to make my experience known. How effective alternate approaches to HD are for growth I can not at this stage say. I can however say that this has been a most profitable way to cut up. KiwiPaul PS That said I can't wait to start my next HD cycle in two weeks!!!!!!
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#11. Tabata's references on interval cardio training - from David Wood
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 22:39:48 -0400 From: "David Wood" <davidjwood@sprintmail.com> Subject: Tabata's references on interval cardio training Richard Winett runs a very good site at: http://www.ageless-athletes.com In two of his training articles on that site, he goes into his own thinking on this issue extensively (and good, clear thinking it is). He provides the following references in this subject area, including Tabata's: Anderson, O. (1997) More mitochondria mean more PB's, but what do you have to do to get them? Peak Performance, 189, 7-9. Cooper, K. H. (1982) The aerobics program for total well-being.New York: M. Evans and Co. Robinson, J. & Carrino, F. (1993) Max O2: The complete guide to synergistic aerobic training. Los Angeles: Health for Life Fox, E.L. et al. (1973) Intensity and distance of interval training programs and changes in aerobic power. Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise, 5, 18-22 Tabata, I.et al. (1996) Effects of moderate-intensity endurance and high-intensity intermittent training on anaerobic capacity and VO2 max. Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise, 28, 1327-1330. Tabata, I. Et al. (1997) Metabolic profile of high intensity intermittent exercises. Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise, 29, 390-395. I'll add one more: O'Shea, John P., Bicycle Interval Training for Cardiovascular Fitness. The Physician & SportsMedicine 10:156-162, October, 1982. You can read an interview with O'Shea on this subject at Clarence Bass's "Ripped" site at: http://www.cbass.com/interval.htm
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#12. Realistic expectations for growth. - from Paul Englert
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:48:20 +1200 From: Paul Englert <Paul.Englert@vuw.ac.nz> Subject: Realistic expectations for growth. What are some thoughts on realistic expectations for growth? The reason I ask this is that we seem to have established parameters for weight loss using different methods and supplements. However while there is a lot of talk about the merits of various training philosophies little has been mentioned on the quanatative differences between these methods. Colgan talks about a max gain of 18 lbs (LBW) a year. Let us say we have a person who has stopped maturing, ie. is not going to grow taller. Has been training for two years with steady progress. My thoughts and experience with clients is that a 5-10lb gain is possible. I realise that supplement companies would have different figures but what are your thoughts. Realistic expectations are vital for goal setting and important for dispelling myths and propaganda. Thoughts?? Kiwi Paul
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#13. Fatigue and muscle growth - from Paul Englert
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:40:47 +1200 From: Paul Englert <Paul.Englert@vuw.ac.nz> Subject: Fatigue and muscle growth Lyle wrote:- A lot of people (I'm one of them) feel that fatiguing a given muscle fiber is at least part of the stimulus for adaptation (see Zatsiorsky "Science and Practice of Strenght Training"). So, assuming maximum loads a set lasting 30 seconds will fatigue (and hence cause adaptation) in a different population of motor units (primarily Type IIb) than a set lasting 70 seconds (primarily Type IIa) than a set lasting 2 minutes (primarily Type I). Assuming the 30" set is at 85% of 1RM (say it's a 5RM load), you will get full recruitment of all motor units (as per Sale) from the first rep of the set. You will NOT get adaptation of all motor units since there will be populations of Type IIa and Type I fibers with longer fatigue times that won't be exhausted/adapt. This is why single rep sets don' cause as much hypertrophy as higher rep (longer time) sets. Yes you get full recruitment but the set is too short to exhaust a considerable amount of motor units. On this topic I would be interested on your thoughts on accumulative fatigue/benefits of multiple sets. You note that as As tension reqs. go up, fatigue goes down since the set times must be shorter. However if we were to use multiple sets the set starts from a point where there is all ready a degree of inroad/fatigue call it what you will. Thus tension could be high by using a relatively heavy weight AND fatigue will also be relatively high. KiwiPaul
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#14. Re: HIT Digest #130 - from DejaGroove
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 22:51:44 EDT From: DejaGroove <DejaGroove@aol.com> Subject: Re: HIT Digest #130 Re: HIT #130 Lyle- So according to you, can you develop increased explosive power through superslow training? Eytan Koch, CSCS
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#15. ABCDE - from MSdfense51
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 11:51:24 EDT From: MSdfense51 <MSdfense51@aol.com> Subject: ABCDE Has anybody tried Bill Phillip's ABCDE diet program? Does it work? what were some results?