1. stabilizers, lordotic lifting
by: Jarlo Ilano <jilano@ups.edu>
2. More tone less bulk
by: Turner, Darius <dturner@anatec.com>
3. Re: Full Squats
by: Don Pendergraft <dpendergraft@beckett.com>
4. Dorian Yates
by: <bszymanski@minolta.com>
5. Stabilizer muscles
by: Boxcar6969 <Boxcar6969@aol.com>
6. Re: John, chinning
by: DrewBaye <DrewBaye@aol.com>
7. Re: Spotting during chins
by: DrewBaye <DrewBaye@aol.com>
-------------------- 1 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 05:02:28 -0800
From: Jarlo Ilano <jilano@ups.edu>
Subject: stabilizers, lordotic lifting
hello,
well, as a committed lurker, here is something to which i would like to
add my two cents to this very big pot of a fine digest...
>Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:44:21 -0600 (CST)
>From: lylemcd@onr.com (Lyle McDonald)
>Subject: Re: Stabilizers
>>At 5:39 AM 12/11/97, cyberpump@geocities.com wrote:
>>Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 12:20:47 +1000
>>From: Teri Pokere <T.Pokere@mailbox.uq.edu.au>
>>Subject: Re: Stabilizers
>>I'm quite aware of the above. The point I'm trying to get across is
>>that there are only stabilisers in respect to a certain exercise
>>performance and not to the human body in general.
>What about the mulifidus and other deep spinal muscles? The are >generally
>spinal stabilizers. Yes, it's primarily during axial loading but they >have
>a role during movement in all planes. The only way to really challenge
>these muscles is to force them to actively stabilize the spine.
Lyle is very correct in his point. There are indeed muscles in the body
whose main job is to stabilize joint, most particularly his example of
the deep spinal musculature i.e. multifudi, rotatores,
intertransversarii.. when they are not being activated, as in the case
of wearing a lifting belt, then they become weaker while the muscles
that you are more aware of get stronger...
>
>>Putting a joint, muscle etc. in a position of potential injury seems
>>like the best way to rehabilitate it to me as well [not].
well, of course not... however the proper use of a therapy ball does not
place a person's joint or muscle etc., in this position of potential
injury, as Lyle stated, work on the ball progresses in such a manner as
to never allow a position/movement that would be dangerous to the
patient... at least this is the case when a qualified rehabilitation
specialist is supervising the exercise, this may not be so when people
begin to buy these therapy balls and begin to perform advanced stability
exercises or use them to lift weights too heavy to be safely used, which
I hope will not happen. However this is a danger which may happen,
because Teri is also correct that dangerous positions can be attained if
this were to occur.
>For example, we always hear to lift with a slightly arched (lordotic) >back.
>Why? Because it puts relatively more stress on the lumbar erectors and
>relatively less on the posterior ligaments of the spine. A muscle
> Lack of ligament strength causes an injury. Whereas
>training the posterior ligaments through controlled progressive >overload would have prevented it.
Another reason that it is advised to lift in a lordotic posture (back
arched) is that when lifting or compressing the spine (as in a squat)
the load causes an increased intradiskal pressure. This pressure is
what causes the common diagnoses of a "disc bulge" or "blown disc". A
lordotic posture, (which I should also relate is the normal spinal curve
for the lumbar spine) reduces this pressure, thus reducing the chance of
"blowing a disc".
Lyle's point of atrophy of posterior ligaments is interesting, i had not
thought that lifting in lordosis would cause atrophy of certain
ligaments... i had not thought that ligaments would atrophy.
A good discussion from all involved.
Jarlo Ilano
Student
University of Puget Sound
School of Physical Therapy
-------------------- 2 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 09:37:22 -0600
From: "Turner, Darius" <dturner@anatec.com>
Subject: More tone less bulk
>I'm about 6 ft. tall about 260-265. I'm pretty well built, but I would
>like to trim down to about 250. In addition I would like to trim down
>around the abs. I'm aware of the fact the dieting is very important,
>but how can a HIT program aid me. If you have any suggestions I would
>really like to here them. I want more tone and less bulk.
Darius
-------------------- 3 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 09:54:05 -0600
From: dpendergraft@beckett.com (Don Pendergraft)
Subject: Re: Full Squats
My advice? DON'T DO THEM! At least that's my opinion. There is no need to
go down below parallel. It will simply make the squat more dangerous due to
much greater shearing forces on the knees. Bad idea.
Don P.
>Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 17:45:41 +0100 (MET)
>From: mvweteri@wi.leidenuniv.nl (M.E.B.vandeWetering)
>Subject: Full Squats
>
>Hello
>
>Starting next year I want to try doing the full-squat instead of the
regular
>(thighs to parallel) squat. Since I never done the full-squat before I'm
not
>sure on the differences bewteen the regular and the full squat. For
instance
>should I change my stance compared to the regular squat, what reduction in
>poundage should I (approximately) expect, what are the differences in
targeted
>muscles etc.
>Are there people on this digest who have performed full-squats and can
give me
>advice on them?
>
>Elbert
-------------------- 4 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 15:24:15 -0500
From: bszymanski@minolta.com
Subject: Dorian Yates
Hi.
It has been written on a couple of favored well-known websites that
Dorian Yates uses HIT. Well, I have Dorian's Blood & Guts video,
showing him work out for an hour or so. One thing I can say is, he
ain't HITting! He's pumping through a grueling workout of multiple
sets, multiple exercises, and normal rep speeds.
Which brings me to my point. I would like to see a video offered
showing REAL HIT training as described in this digest, in Cyberpump,
and by Mike Mentzer. Throw in some Super-Slow stuff, too.
I'd like to see some real people with real results which they really
got from HIT.
I wonder if anyone else on this digest would be interested in a video
like this?
Whaddaya think?
Bill
-------------------- 5 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 21:46:39 EST
From: Boxcar6969 <Boxcar6969@aol.com>
Subject: Stabilizer muscles
Ok, for all you stabilizer peeps. If incline presses hit the lats, people who
use a back and biceps one day and chest and triceps another day split would be
overworking the back... Because if the stabilizer muscles for presses are in
the back, you would work the back muscles twice and too often.. What do you
all have to say about that??
-------------------- 6 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 21:48:57 EST
From: DrewBaye <DrewBaye@aol.com>
Subject: Re: John, chinning
I would recommend a slower negative movement, 10 seconds or more. Stop when
you can not lower yourself slower than 3 seconds.When you can perform 10
negative chins like this, you should be able to perform at least one regular
chin up at a 10/10 cadence.
Andrew M. Baye
www.superslow.com
-------------------- 7 --------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 22:01:20 EST
From: DrewBaye <DrewBaye@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Spotting during chins
Regarding the Charles Poliquin quote about spotting a subject during chin ups
by holding the ankles: this is NOT a good idea. To spot a person during a chin
up, hold them only by the waist, NEVER the ankles. To spot a person from the
ankles during a chin up can force the subjects spine into an extremely
extended position, possibly causing an injury to the lower back. To spot them
by only one ankle only makes this worse, possibly forcing the subjects spine
into an extended, and somewhat rotated and laterally flexed position. If you
actually try this you'll appreciate how truly awkward and impractical this is.
Again, when spotting a subject during chin ups, spot them by holding them at
the waist.
If the subject can not perform regular body-weight chins, have them perform
them on a machine that provides assistance, or have them perform slow
negatives, or, just have them perform front grip pulldowns until they have the
strength to perform the chin ups.
Andrew M. Baye