Get your Free HomepageFrom: Jon-Paul
Now- here's my thought for the Day... (I only ever have one...)
Dave produced GW McLennans albums (both of them!- theres an update to the discography already- thanks Katie, Thanks Bob...).
How is the production?
It it feasible for DD to produce his own album. Why isn't that done more (eg Neil Finn gets Froom / Youth- why not do it himself?).
Is an outside influence really necessary to encourage / edit / the artists ideas?
And how much actual influence does a producer have- I know someone on this list doesn't like Mitchell Froom's production- but WHAT does he do which is "wrong"? How much blame must go to the Artist for tinny / poor sounding albums etc.
JP.
From: Katie Harrar
Hi JP et al:
JP wrote:
>Now- here's my thought for the Day... (I only ever have one...)
>Dave produced GW McLennans albums (both of them!- theres an
update to
> the discography already- thanks Katie, Thanks Bob...).
>How is the production?
Well, I can only comment on the first album, Watershed, which I own and love. I've heard the second album a few times, but not enought to comment on the production.
DD produced, engineered, and played on Watershed along with Paul Kelly, members of the Blackeyed Susans, and other Melbourne music luminaries. I really like the production because it's spare and very organic. Most of the songs are acoustically based, with a few backing vocals and not a whole lot of strange keyboards or other sounds. It's very basic and clear, with the vocals mixed up front, which is how I prefer this kind of music. Many of the tracks seem to be first takes, or fairly spontaneous affairs. One of my favorite songs, "Easy Come, Easy Go" sounds like it was recorded live, thought I don't actually know if that's the case. [I guess I can ask Dave when he gets on this list! ;-) ]
>It it feasible for DD to produce his own album. Why isn't that
done
>more (eg Neil Finn gets Froom / Youth- why not do it himself?).
I think it's very feasible for Dave to produce his own stuff, if the record company allows it. He certainly has the talent. In Neil's case, I think he had no choice for the first three CH albums [i.e Capitol Records appointed Froom], and then he chose Youth for the fourth album as a reaction to the perfectionist Froom. [Youth had a rep as a spontaneous type, which is what Neil wanted. Unfortunately, Neil's a perfectionist, which sort of negates that process! ;-) ]I think in some cases an artist prefers to be produced by someone else, so he/she can concentrate on the writing and playing. This involves a high degree of trust.
>Is an outside influence really necessary to encourage / edit / the artists ideas?
I think the producer adds some objectivity to a project, which is why many artists don't produce themselves. They want that third eye because they are too close to their own material. Also, sometimes the artist wants to make a record that sounds a certain way and can' t figure out how to get what they want. (I hate to bring up the Beatles since they seem to be persona non grata on one nameless list, but George Martin fulfilled this role brilliantly.) Having said all this, I don't really know what the role of a producer IS, so perhaps I'm completely off base.
>And how much actual influence does a producer have- I know
someone on
> this list doesn't like Mitchell Froom's production- but WHAT does he
> do which is "wrong"? How much blame must go to the Artist for tinny
>/ poor sounding albums etc.
Mea culpa, mea culpa! I admit I'm the one who doesn't appreciate Mr. Froom's productions. I don't particularly care for the pristine nature of his productions and the way the Froom "sounds" seem to always appear. I love the Chamberlain, but do we have to always hear them on every album? Also, sometimes a song needs to be left alone, aka be more organic, and Froom always has to put a frill, riff or processed vocal in there to obscure the basic track. (This is all my opinion! I like certain Froom albums, so don't flame me.) I just tend to like production that frames a song, rather than embellishes it.
As far as apportioning blame is concerned. Well, it depends on who's pulling the strings in a recording session. If a record company has appointed a producer, and the producer is the final word, then the producer is to blame. However, I have a feeling in Neil's case, he's as much a perfectionist as Mitchell Froom is, so the blame can be shared. Twist seems to me to be a good balance of artist and producer, and from what Dave said about the recording, Neil was basically a framer in the process rather than a dictator.
That's all for now,
Katie
From: Colleen M.
Hi,
JP asked a series of questions about production and producers and Katie supplied some answers:
> >Is an outside influence really necessary to encourage /
edit / the
> >artists ideas?
>
> I think the producer adds some objectivity to a project, which is
> why many artists don't produce themselves. They want that third eye
> because they are too close to their own material. Also, sometimes
> the artist wants to make a record that sounds a certain way and
> can't figure out how to get what they want.
For example, think of these two [*warning*, U2 reference ahead] U2 albums: The Joshua Tree and Achtung Baby (2 absolutely brilliant albums, IMHO). The credit for these must go to Daniel Lanois and Brian Eno and real testimony to the power of the producer.
> >And how much actual influence does a producer have- I know
someone
> >on
> > this list doesn't like Mitchell Froom's production- but WHAT does
> > he do which is "wrong"? How much blame must go to the Artist for
> > tinny / poor sounding albums etc.
Sticking with my U2 example, (as I don't feel Mitchell Froom can do any wrong :-^) ), just look at Zooropa. Subtract Lanois and add U2, and the Eno-directed production meanders aimlessly (as it is want to do). In this case, it's band's fault for not speaking up and saying "hey, this sucks."
Colleen.
From: Robbie B.
Hi Y'all,
Quoth JP:
> It it feasible for DD to produce his own album. Why isn't that
done
> more (eg Neil Finn gets Froom / Youth- why not do it himself?).
Because most people stuff it up when they do themselves. Leave production to producers, they are usually better at it. Producing your own album is often an indulgence, just as when playing all the instruments on your own album when you could easily hire someone who was good at it. You don't listen to the FINN album for the production (or for the rhythm section). Lenny Kravitz is one of the few people I can think of who self-produces (and plays many of the instruments) and does a reasonable job.
Dave may have talent as a producer (I haven't heard G.W.McLennan's stuff), though the production isn't the strength of the album Loyal, and I think he co-produced.
Katie spoke unto the list:
> I think the producer adds some objectivity to a project, which
is
> why many artists don't produce themselves. They want that third eye
> because they are too close to their own material.
I agree with the sentiment here. It does, however, conjure up visions of producers with eye patches...
Robbie.
From: Elizabeth S.
Hey all,
American lurker surfacing whose recent trip to NZ combined with her citizenship causes her to hear "health," yet also "looking for." in the great Whaling debate. But at any rate, my point...
Said JP:
>>For those of you not on the Crowdie list, a report from the
people at Thursdays Finn concert in Auckland mentioned DD was about to
go into the studio with Bic Runga. Hopefully Nicole will post more
details here when she gets the chance.<<
Well, no, she probably won't, as she was already on her merry way back to Melbourne when we came across that tidbit in the Sunday paper.
'Twould be Dave playing on Miss Bic's sessions and somehow I had the impression he was producing, although I don't think that was stated explicitly.
Unfortunately, that's all there was to it. Sorry I can't provide more exciting news, but I just wanted to take the pressure off Nicole, who has had a very difficult week...
E.
From: Jon-Paul
Hi,
I found a full report about DD's upcoming journey into the studio- its below (all about Bic Runga).
JP
Bic Runga wins Silver Scroll
Bic Runga takes big prize at industry awards
Ray Columbus, Don McGlashan, Dave Dobbyn, Shona Laing...and now, Bic Runga. She's only 21, but the Auckland musician has already been recognised by the local music industry as one of the country's best songwriters.
Bic has picked up the APRA award for "Best Musical Composition" for her first single 'Drive', an achievement many local musos don't see in a lifetime of songwriting. She took the award over 100 other entries, a sign that the local industry sees her as a real prospect.
Bic comes from a family where music plays a big part. Her mother was a singer in Malaysia and her father plays piano. Bic's sister Boh plays with another Auckland musician, Greg Johnson.
Her second single 'Bursting Through' entered the local charts last week at number 33. Next month Bic will enter the studio to record her debut album with Dave Dobbyn producing. This much anticipated long-player is slated for an early '97 release date.
Other winners in the APRA awards included Pauly Fuemana and Alan Johnson, writers of the OMC worldwide hit, How Bizarre. The song won the pair the award for "Most Performed Work Overseas".
Dominic Waghorn
From: Jon-Paul
Hi Gavin, and other Ummers,
As a sad follow up to yesterdays post about Bic Runga and DD going into the studio soon, this appeared in the NZ Hearalds entertainment suppliment... JP
Bic Runga isn't doing her planned gig tonight- or any for quite a few weeks due to injuries sustained in a weekend car smash.
After leaving Saturday's Michael Jackson show, the car carrying the rising local singer-songwriter and boyfriend Nick Jones collided head -on with a vehicle which had apparently headed the wrong way up the wellesly street off-ramp in central Auckland. Runga, the passenger in her vehicle sustained a broken collar bone and chest injuries with Jones suffering a serious leg injury.
The former presenter of Music Nation who last week won a Silver Scroll Award for a song ironically titled Drive, Runga has had to postpone the recording of her debut album with producer Dave Dobbyn until she recovers.
Charges are pending against the driver of the other car.
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