Stego's FAQ on India travel (Itineraries and places to see 3/3)

Subject:

Date: 8 Jul 95

From: ud877@freenet.victoria.bc.ca (Susan Z. Martin)

As someone with a fair amount of experience of India (14 months there in the past 48 - most recent trip Oct 94 - April 95) I feel partially qualified to answer although the last time I ventured down south was in late 1993 - early 1994 and was in the company of my Indian husband which greatly changes the reactions you get from people.

>

>Who can answer the following questions:

>- can you give a brief description of your impressions of the north and the south?

North - Hindu belt (Rajasthan, UP, MP, Gujarat, Bihar etc) can be very smug, condescending and prejudiced. They make it quite obvious (IMO) that they consider you a promiscuous, cow-eating, degenerate westerner. And as you realize they are into you for your money a lot of the time. On the other hand there is a lot of scope for peaceful solitary pleasures in Gujarat and Rajasthan and there are a few places - like Chitoor (Raj) and Bhuj (Gujarat) that still don't see a lot of tourists. I would highly recommend Palitana and Junagadh in Gujarat as the Jain temples are magnificent, the walks up the hills are enjoyable and the locals are still fairly unspoiled.

South - much friendlier and less money grabbing except in the touristy places. People were a lot less nosey and abusive to my husband and I when we travelled there and even he commented on the cleanliness of Kerala (it was tough for him to swallow his Northern pride but he managed). More English spoken and prettier, softer scenery than the rather harsh north. I just felt a lot less harassed and stared at and bothered - and believe me that was a real problem for a mixed couple like us. I suspect that if this holds true for us it is true for other tourists too. And there didn't seem to be as many foreigners. I would especially recommend Hampi.

>-

what is the temperature like in december? What clothes did you bring?

I lived with my husband in Raj from Nov 94 - April 95 and in the winter it is quite cool (maybe 5 or 6 degrees at night). So you want to have something fairly warm for sleeping in - say jogging pants and a t-shirt - because of course no where has heating. And get a hotel with hot water - it's hard to take a cold shower when you can see your breath :) Day time temperatures were pleasant - low to mid 20s. Never been in the South that time of year but I would expect it to be milder with less extremes. Take a towel - Indian guesthouses (even better places) don't usually supply towels.

>- what special places/cities can you recommend (north and south)?

>- any very special guesthouses/hotels?

>

North - Bhuj, Junagadh, Palitana (for the temples - Inever stayed there), Pushkar (as a place to cheaply drop out, relax, chat with other travellers, read and eat more westernized food - my husband and i spent our honeymoon there and he became very fond of brown bread and french fries :) ). Fatepur Sikri.

South - Cochin, Hampi (I stayed in Hospet). Badami, Aihole and Pattadakal (nothing as cities but lovely ruins). Mysore - relaxing, nice scenery, good food and spectacular palace. Madurai - Shree Menakshi temple is marvellous. Trichy - again - great temple although they get a bit wearing after the first 100 :)

Guesthouses - nothing that really stands out except staying with my husband in our house in Eklingji (just outside Udaipur in Rajasthan - if you are interested in staying with him or having him introduce you to the real Rajasthan let me know and I'll send you his address and some more details) and the neato Nilambaugh Palace Hotel in Bhavnagar, Gujarat. In my mind it was the only bearable place to stay in the whole town and I lucked out and got a fabulous single room (bathtub!!!!, shower, western toilet, toilet paper, hot and cold water, towels, wonderful period furniture etc) for a massive 165 Rs a night. Everything else was at least 400 Rs (in the hotel) but if there were 3 or 4 of you it would be well worth investigating as the rooms were like houses - they were huge and well furnished with beds, couches etc. Beautiful place. The Pushkar Palace in Pushkar is nice too - we stayed in a pleasant double room, again very tastefully decorated and with full functioned bathroom (and towels I think) for 350 on our honeymoon. Just one night though and then my frugal husband suggested we move to a 100 Rs per night place.

Hope this helps - I've got a bunch of stuff that I prepared for someone else on many of the places I've visited but as it is so long I don't like to send it to the unprepared. Let me know if you'd like it - it gives ideas of what to see, eat, do and where to stay in different cities like

Agra, Udaipur etc.

Susan

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Subject:

From: rhoes@perth.DIALix.oz.au (Raymond Hoes)

Date: 8 Jul 95

I spent 7 months travelling around India last year. Fantastic stuff !

My top 10 spots were: Disappointments:
Hampi Goa
Darjeeling Madras
Manali Trichy
Varanasi Jaipur
Puri Ahmedabad
Pushkar Bombay
Mahabalipuram
Udaipur
Mysore
Khajuraho
I would recommend the lonely planet travel survival kit. We found it invaluable. Do take the trains ( you need to book at least a few days ahead ) It's the best way to see India and you do see some amazing things on the trains themselves. Avoid the buses. Avoid Air India. Always establish a price with taxi and autorickshaw drivers before you get into them. Dont let the touts take you to their "friend's" hotel unless you want to experiment.

Take your own pillowcase and lightweight sleeping bag. A mosquito net can be very useful. A small broad spectrum medical kit is a good idea.

A little judicious use of baksheesh can smooth many a problem.

Wear OLD shoes :)

You'll love it.

Subject:

From: ganesh@zonk.geko.com.au (Ganesh)

Date: 12 Jul 95

India is really like a number of nations sharing one geographic space. This explains, in a very generalised way, the intercommunal conflict whihc occurs on accasion.

In the north the people tend to be more influence by the various waves of muslim who established the Moghul empire. As a conseqeunce the architetcure, food & way of life is different to the south. In the south you have a further difference between the Dravidian east and the people of the west who were subject to continual trading/colonial links for thousands of years with palces as diverse as Arabia and Portugal.

Climate also plays a large part in the style of life. In the south the climate ensures fertility and many growing cycles. Whilst not flush with money people seem to be less "pressed".

The complexion of your trip depends on; time, budget and personal tatses. If you don't mind train travell and can spend about 5 weeks it is possible to start in the north, head south and then leave from Madras. I would recommend a first class train ride from Delhi to Cochin ( a wonderfully rich and historic place) then on to a stretch of lying on Kovalum Beach via the "Backwater" trip. From there on to Madras via the temple city of Madurai. Madurai is my least favourite India city but you will find enough to keep you busy for a couple of days.

In the north definitely include Varanasi, Agra, Delhi & Jaipur. (Jaisalmere is straight out of the "Stories from the Arabian Nights" but it's a long way away from any where else.)

... ...

Paul

Subject:

ud877@freenet.victoria.bc.ca wrote:

First of all I would say don't worry about being safe - you'll be fine. I presume you are male and that goes a long way in protecting you from unwanted attention that us ladies sometimes suffer in India. The smaller the place the safer you'll be - it is the cities that are dangerous. Of course your expensive equipment will be tempting so try not to flash it around too much and of course always lock your room when leaving it and don't leave anything of value in it. Carry your own padlock for doors that use them. Lock your door from inside when your in the room too.

... ...

> - is it advisable to take long distance transportation such as over

> night bus or train? Can you easily get a seat in short notice?

> - how about the internal flight, the `air pass'? Are thery good

> value?

> - what kind of accomodation I should stick to?

It's hard to answer these questions as I don't know what you are used to - if you are used to fairly luxurious hotels and conditions then India is going to seem grimy, horrible, dirty, cheap and tedious to you. Sure long distance bus and train travel is great (for me) but it may be awful for you. It is difficult to get seats on the train at short notice and busses are usually faster and around the same price and easy to get a seat on but dangerous too. I always thought the Indrail pass (for the train) sounded like a big ripoff but then I never travel first class on Indian trains. I've never flown within India - the flights are relatively expensive (for instance I asked about Bombay to Udaipur by Indian Airlines and it was $100 U.S. while to do it by bus is about 150 Rs (about 5 dollars US)) and the safety is dubious.

... ...

I've mentioned some photo details above. Taking pictures of people depends on whether they are tourist types (snake charmers, touts, people who dress in traditional costume and hang round events like the Pushkar fair) or regular people. The first will ask for money if you want to take their pictures and may get nasty if you don't supply it. Please don't take pictures of people bathing (I've met some unscrupulous male tourists who have used telephoto lens to get pictures of half-naked Indian ladies), funerals, prayers and temples (not all temples of course are restricted to photography but usually functioning ones don't allow it but there will rarely be a sign telling you so and you'll just get dirty looks or shouted at).

... ...

Just gesturing with your camera and asking OK in villages will show you whether or not they mind pictures. If you can find someone who speaks English and if you would like to 'give something back' to these people you could send them copies of the pictures. Many villagers are too poor to ever afford pictures and having one that you have taken of them or their children would be precious to them and much appreciated.

... ...

I don't know about beautiful landscapes etc for photography - I of course live in a very naturally beautiful country and I can't really think of many places in India that even come close. Most of the Deccan Plateau is incredibly monotonous - it all looks the same, scrubby trees, flat fields, red earth and everywhere the mark of people. Rajasthan is very beautiful in a harsh way. I have some pictures taken from the top of a hill that Shyam (husband) took me to that are quite breathtaking. But in the cities or on the edges of them the landscape is just dreary, dusty and depressing.

Because most ruins are of temples few of them are 'crumbling' and so far gone that you can't tell what they were. The rural people in any area of India would make fascinating photo material and if you could talk to someone like Shyam he might be able to get you really into their lives and you could photograph something like 'a day in the life' and give people at home a real idea of what a rural peasant's life is like. There are an abundance of birds in India and if you have a good lens (which I'm sure you do) a trip to Bharatpur (bird sanctuary on the Rajasthan-Uttar Pradesh border) would be very worthwhile.

Fatehpur Sikri would be worth photographing and you shouldn't miss it anyway - its carving is magnificent. Jaisalmer is romantic and fairy-tale but is a long way out. Bhuj in Gujarat is well worth a trip and the temple towns of Palitana and Junagadh are fantastic - both have these hilltop Jain temple complexes that when I went were misty, mysterious and other-wordly. And the views of the surrounding area are magnificent too.

Susan

Subject:

Markku.Verkkoniemi@stat.fi wrote:

>- as a solo traveller:

> - are the places (cities, tourist sites, villages, etc.) there

> generally safe for solo travel? what are the precautions I

> should take?

Yes, they are. If you compare them to cities of the same size in Europe or the Americas. I've been to Singapore once, and I found it really, really safe (if boring), so you must expect some more *Asian* things in India. More likely you'll encounter problems with your digestion than anything else.

> - is it advisable to take long distance transportation such as over

> night bus or train? Can you easily get a seat in short notice?

It is fairly easy to get a ticket for trains, because they have a tourist quota. It might be most difficult during Christmas or similar festivals. Buses have heavy competition, and it's easy to have a seat. But, even 2nd class in trains is much more comfortable, so take the train whenever you can.

> - how about the internal flight, the `air pass'? Are thery good

> value?

IA is not so reliable, so again I prefer the train to planes, even if you had the money. Note that the planes are usually more delayed than the trains, so you could end up spending _more_ time with airports than overnight trains.

> - what kind of accomodation I should stick to?

There are all varieties. I always prefered not the cheapest shoestring pits, but a little more upmarket, around $2-$5 (depends on your ability to bargain).

Still very cheap compared to Europe (and Singapore, I guess). Actually, I feel safer when my door is locked with my own reliable padlock, than having the key in the reception.

> >- photography:

> - is it advisable to carry so many camera equipment?

Why not, if that's your hobby, and you can carry that much with you. There are people traveling around India with their surfboard equipment, too.

> - how do you generally take care of your equipment? (from theft

> or other hazard).

Get an insurance for your equipment, not really for theft, but for damage. It's very unlikely that an Indian would come and downright rob you on the spot, but please be careful when you leave a piece of your equipment laying on the table etc. Some hotel room windows are not that safe, so you should keep your cameras beneath the bed, for instance, so nobody can pick them up with an aid of a longish stick from outside your window.

> - what is your experience when come to taking pictures of the local

> people (kids, old people, women..., in the cities, country side...)

> there? should I ask for permission before I take?

> You should always ask for permission, as anywhere. A nod is usually enough as an answer. There might be some military installations that are sensitive, but you should notice that by then. I especially enjoy taking photos of children and their pets.

>- others:

> - what are the `must see' places in your opinion?

Oh God, there are so many. Topmost, as photogenic as anything are Varanasi, and Taj Mahal in Agra.

> - when is the best time to go to such plases?

Out of the rainy season, and hot pre-rainy season. November to March would be optimal weatherwise, but it is the high season (crowded, prices higher likewise). I like traveling 'shoulder season', like October or April, most.

> - how do you find the people there? are they generally friendly

> and approachable?

One of the secrets of India. When you're totally exhausted by all the creepy salesmen surrounding you, you usually come across with a genuine common man that is friendly just for friendliness' sake.

> - any recommendations on itinerary

If this is your first time in India, you should see the big cities (Delhi, Bombay, Calcutta, Madras) too, but otherwise I would give them a miss. They are of course important travel hubs, so you can't avoid them altogether. If you have the chance, stay there for 6 months, get a multiple-entry visa, so you can have a break and visit neighbouring Nepal, Bangladesh, and/or Sri Lanka as well. Keep your eyes and ears open, and read the LP book.

Let's assume that you left in early November. You should follow the climatic patterns, and start from the north (the must places, look above). Then head south and relax for a while. In April, when it's hot in other places, go to the Himalayas, Himachal Pradesh, and maybe even Ladakh. Every itinerary is right in its own way, and it is very hard to advice another traveler. You can always change your mind, and take the train from Madras to Darjiling in a couple of days' time, for instance.

>

>I'll be glad if any one of you can give me your opinion on any of

>the question. Or any other things you think I should know. I'll also

>be appreciated if you can give me a brief description of your

>itinerary and how much money spend.

I always budget $25 a day for India, which includes everything except flying there. That allows me some luxury every now and then, and I could get along with lots less. But the sound advice I was given once still holds: take half the baggage and twice the money that you first planned.

Markku

Subject: Interesting train rides.

From: rbedi@envirolink.org (Rahul.Bedi)

India sure has quite a few hilly train tracks which offer some really spectacular views. Most of these were built by the British in the late 1800's.

Some of then are:

i) Kalka - Shimla: This was built near the end of the nineteenth century and has about 101 tunnels. The longest being about 1.1 KM in length. The journey starts from Kalka on the foothills of the Shiwalik ranges of the Himalyas, and ends at Shimla, one time summer capital of India, and the present day capital of the state of Himachal Pradesh. The journey takes about 6 hours and covers a distance of about 96 Kms.

The journey can either be undertaken on a normal narrow gauge train or a rail car, which is like a largish truck fitted with train wheels.

Kalka is about 300 KM from New Delhi, towards the north.

ii) Pathankot - Jogindernagar:

I've not travelled on this line, but this too is on the same gauge as the Kalka - Shimla, and as what I've heard it too is blessed with equally great views.

Pathankot is also connected thro the broadgauge rail network to Delhi and other areas. Otherwise buses can also be taken either from Delhi or Chandigarh (the capital of Punjab and Haryana).

iii) Siliguri - Darjeeling:

This is in the state of West Bengal. This track was steam driven till some time back, don't know what is it now. Due to the high gradient this track has another track in the middle on which a special toothed wheel on the engine fits in, to stop the train from sliding down !! This is like a true toy train and the speed at most of the places is so less that u can get off and walk along the train.

iv) Metupalayam - Ooty:

Again a narrow gauge track.

Situated in the state of Tamil Nadu, on the Western Ghats, north of the Palghat Gap, in the Nilgiri hills. Not travelled on this line, but from the photos I've seen, this line has some great views of the tea gardens on these slopes of the ghats.

Generally western ghats have some really great views.

In addition to these lines there are some other tracks which too are equally beautiful though not being on the narrow gauge routes. Some of these existing and coming up tracks are:

i) Bombay - Pune: This crosses the northern part of Western Ghats. And is really pretty good especially after the rains.

ii) Nagpur - Itarsi:

I don't know how many people will agree with me on this, but personally I consider this route (it falls of the Madras-Delhi route) to be good. It crosses the Satpura and the Vindhya ranges. Which though not very high compared to the Western Ghats or the Himalayas, have some quaint rock formations. Small stretch of the track near towards north from a small station called Budni, is really beautifull (for a walk along the track).

Though I don't really feel u shud take this journey if u don't have ample time, but in case u do pass this stretch, do look around !! :-)

iii) Konkan Railway:

This track is NOT yet ready, but if the Indian Railway is to be believed, passenger traffic should start from the 26th of January 1996. (The Indian Republic Day). This line, skirts the slopes of the Western Ghats from Mangalore on the Western Coast to Goa and beyond and is supposed to be an engineering marvel (it sure has costed a massive figure !!). Engineering marvel or no marvel, it sure is *supposed* to be a beautiful journey. Though I haven't travelled on this yet (I don't think I possibly can, this year), but mebbe if you chose to travel this track in Jan next, you might find me on it. :-) There are a lot of books on Indian Railways available, Bill Aitken happens to be my favourite Indian Travel writer.

Anyway before I close this file, just a small tip. Travelling on the Indian Railways is a great way to see and feel India, so when u travel, unless u are ill or something try to travel by the Second/Sleeper class or First class, u'll really see the country.

Most of the air conditioned classes on the trains have an irritating "feature" of having heavily tinted window glasses, which give u a coloured view of India :-).

(this is just a personal opinion, no harm meant to people who think otherwise).

In case any more info on India is needed, feel free to email.

-- Rahul

Joe Luttrell


Subject: What to see (Kodai instead of Ooty, etc.)?

From: meyerbos@shellx.best.com (Meyer Boswell Books Inc.)

Date: 4 May 96

We bought into the Lonely Planet hype, and chose Kodai over Ooty; WELL, if Kodai is untouristic, I would hate to see Ooty! However, there is a great hostel just out of town, with a gorgeous view that is magical in the morning especially. And a walk nearby will have you encountering dozens of monkeys gamboling thru the trees. Just bring a blanket or two if you go when we did, in January, as it is *cold*.

For train travel, you might get the 'Bible', Royston Ellis' 'Indian by Rail'.

Have a great trip!

Joe Luttrell


Subject: What to see (Mysore, Bangalore, Agra, Ooty, Johdpur)?

From: Lawrence Dressman

Date: 4 May 96

>...

...

In my opinion Mysore was better than Bangalore (the Mysore palace was beautiful) and Agra was better than Dehli (the Taj is a must see of course).

However, most (many) people stay in Delhi/Bangalore and make day trips to Agra/Mysore. If I had it to do over I would stay in Agra/Mysore and do the reverse. Ooty is nothing special except for the train ride up/down the mountain which I would like to go on again (but I'm biased as I like trains). However the countryside around Ooty is pretty. If you are in Johdpur do not let the rickshaw drivers talk you into a trip to Lake Kialani (sp?). It is worthless and far out of town so that they get a big fare.

LJD >...

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