Manual heads reviewed in Practical Sailor's 9/2000 issue.
From the live-aboard mailing list:
1) The Lectra/San is designed to treat individual flushes of the toilet
each time the toilet is flushed. After treatment, it is intended to go
overboard.
2) If you send it to a holding tank instead of discharging it over-
board, you have one of two choices on what to do with the contents:
A. Dockside pumpout.
B. Going 3 miles out into the ocean, then discharging the
holding tank overboard.
3) The holding tank, regardless of whether the sewage has been
treated or not, may not be discharged in any of your local bays
(Honker, Grizzly, San Pablo, Richardson or San Francisco Bay),
waterways or in the ocean inside the 3 mile limit. The Lectra/San's
certification only allows up to 1 1/2 gallons to be discharged in any
given place. In order to discharge 55 gallons at a time, you'll have
to be 3 miles out in the ocean or at a dockside pumpout.
4) The Lectra/San does not kill every single germ and bacteria, and
if the sewage remains in the holding tank long enough, bacteria
colonies can begin to grow again. If the holding tank isn't pumped
fairly often, you can still wind up with a putrid mess.
The best way to convert the system would be to install a selectable
"Y" valve between the toilet and the Lectra/San treatment unit,
with one position directing the flow to the Lectra/San, then over-board,
and the other position directing the flow to the holding tank.
That way, most of the time you would be able to treat and discharge
with each flush of the toilet. In areas that are zero discharge, such
as much of Southern California, you can pump into the holding tank
then discharge it in the ocean or utilize a dockside pumpout.
... Regards, Raritan Engineering Company, Inc.
G. Victor Willman, Manager, Technical Services
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From Ed Young on the SailNet liveaboard-list:
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I wonder if anyone has had the same experience with Lectra Sans that we
have? The first few months after install (professional) were
great. Everything ran perfectly. Then we started getting longer and
longer processing cycles and for the last few months, we are getting a lot
of red lights. All the electronics and power source have been thoroughly
checked out and I have run
a full cleaning using muriatic acid per the instructions in the
manual. After asking around in nearby marinas, I am hearing that others
are having similar problems with their units. We live aboard in coastal SC
so we have pretty good salinity. We have also added table salt (from a
little to a lot) during test runs to gauge that impact but with inconsistent
results. Does anyone else have the same problem with red lights on their
Lectra San?
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From Banff on the SailNet liveaboard-list:
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The only solution to your problem that I am aware of is to tear it out and
throw it overboard. I was considering putting one into my boat when I first
bought it and was told by several dealers of the unit not to buy it.
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From Gary Elder on the Morgan mailing list:
|
... on a previous boat, I installed a Lectra San, used it for several
years, and it worked quite well. However, it was a battery killer. The 50
amps, or so, that it draws for about 90 seconds really caused havoc with my
12v system. Even after I dedicated a battery to it, used the largest cable
available, and kept the cables as short as possible, I ended up running the
engine to prevent killing the battery. It didn't seem to matter whether I
used a deep cycle or a starting battery, that 50 amps was a killer. Would I
do it again? No way! ...
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From Don Thomas on the Morgan mailing list:
|
... Regarding battery "killer" ... seems overdramatic based on my prior
experience ... had a LectraSan on my Pearson 28 for years ... had a battery
meter to keep track of remaining amps ... no problem for 2 people ... never
killed a battery. But for a larger boat with frequent guests I can see how
you would need to be careful about keeping the battery charged. Also, you
don't absolutely have to use it every time you pee ... it has a small holding
tank such that you can turn it on after some accumulation.
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From letter by Scott Kearney in 1/2003 issue of Southwinds magazine:
If anti-siphon valve on outlet hose fails, solid column of
outgoing water can form a conductive path from Lectra/San electrodes
through the through-hull, causing serious electrolysis.
From Peggie Hall on
Cruising World message board,
in response to question about getting a new manual head:
... Neither the Bryden nor the Jabsco have ever been top
quality toilets, btw ... BoatU.S. has a comparable Jabsco model
on sale right now for $99 -- a "disposable" toilet ... cheaper
to replace every few years than to maintain.
However, if you want something a bit more durable, the
Raritan PH II -- as well as its predecessor the PH -- has been
around forever and is consistently been rated the best manual
marine toilet in its price range (under $500). It's durable
and manages to survive more abuse and neglect than any other
toilet I've ever seen (including the Lavac).
You can't go wrong with it.
The Cricket is relatively new -- only about 5 years old.
Instead of the usual piston/cylinder "bicycle" pump
beside the bowl, it has a diaphragm pump directly
beneath the bowl (which is why it looks weird).
Diaphragms have no moving parts to wear and require
new seals, gaskets etc, so it needs virtually no
maintenance ... in fact, the "repair kit" for the Cricket
is the entire pump assembly except for the housing ... you
shouldn't need one any more often than you'd have to
replace the whole pump assembly on any other toilet.
It's also exceptionally landlubber/child friendly
compared to other manual marine toilets. IMHO, the
Cricket offers all the advantages of the Lavac -- diaphragm
pump, low maintenance, low flush water usage ... it is,
however, a weekender's marine toilet ... not one I'd
recommend to live-aboards.
You'll find all the specs for the PH II and the Cricket
on the Raritan website.
Blue water cruisers like the Lavac for its simplicity:
it's just a toilet bowl that seals when you close the
lid ... the pump is a Henderson diaphragm bilge pump
mounted on a bulkhead somewhere within reach.
Fine for blue water cruisers who like for everything
on the boat to do double duty (in an emergency the pump
can be a bilge pump or dump a holding tank) ... fine for
seasoned adult salts who understand marine machinery
and appreciate a Spartan life aboard. Not so fine for
the average "weekend warrior's" kids and landlubber
guests aboard his floating condo.
So ... you have a bunch of choices, and there is
no "one size fits all RIGHT" choice ... the right
toilet for your boat depends upon your budget, and your needs.
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From David Romasco on the SailNet liveaboard-list:
|
The Raritan PHII is a nice balance between cost and
robust design. The folks at Raritan seem to be trying to push their
newer Cricket model, which is a diaphragm type (and looks much cheaper
to manufacture), but we thought it would be a maintenance nightmare:
you have to unbolt the toilet and INVERT IT to clear a clogged pump.
Not in MY boat ... The PHII, by comparison, is easily maintained and
parts are readily available if needed. We love ours ...
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From Rick and Donna Cass on the SailNet liveaboard-list:
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Well, we've had both a Cricket and a PHII, and the PHII wins hands down. The
Cricket is a nice idea, but the head flushes back and can hit you in the face
while you are pumping. I think the design needs some work, as there is
too much room for the discharge to kick back out of the pump. I think we're
going to keep the PHII in the aft head and go with a Groco KH for the forward
head. Anybody want an almost new Cricket ?
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From Peggie Hall on Cruising World message board:
In a perfect world, the head should be rebuilt every spring as a
part of the entire boat's recommissioning. But nobody seems willing
to do ANYthing to a toilet till it breaks (I can't help wondering
if they apply the same reasoning to preventive maintenance
on their cars). So in the REAL world, toilets should be rebuilt
at least every 3 years ... every other year is better. However --
If you have what I call a "disposable" toilet (the 2 or 3 low-end
models -- Par/Jabsco, W-C "Headmate" or the Groco HF), two rebuild
kits can cost just about as much as a new toilet. In which case,
the hell with rebuilding ... use it till it spits in your eye and
replace it. But if you have any toilet that'll cost you $200 or
more to replace, it's definitely worth rebuilding.
Don't ever just replace a single failed part. If one has failed,
all the others are badly worn. Bite the bullet and rebuild the
head while you can do it ALL on your terms -- when the bowl is
empty and the system is clean.
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From Peggie Hall on Cruising World message board:
A lot of cruising sailors like the Lavac for its simplicity,
and therefore the lack of need for any maintenance.
However, it's never really caught on with anybody else in
the US, so if you're on inland waters or even in coastal
waters where they haven't caught on, parts when you DO
need 'em can be hard to find ... along with anyone who knows Lavac heads.
The Par/Jabsco manuals ... the W-C "Headmate" and the Groco HF
are what I often refer to as "disposable toilets." All piston/cylinder
type manual toilets need rebuilding every few years ... two rebuild kits
cost about as much as a new toilet, so you might as well forget
rebuilding and just replace it every few years instead ... less
labor and about the same cost.
My two favorites are the Raritan PH II and the Raritan Cricket.
The PH II is a piston/cylinder toilet that's long been rated
the best manual toilet in its price range (under $500) ... I've
seen 'em go 10 years with so little maintenance that, if it
were a car, it would have fallen apart long ago. The Cricket
is only a few years old ... instead of the usual piston/cylinder
pump, there's a diaphragm pump directly under the bowl. It
doesn't ever need "rebuilding" ... in fact, the "repair kit" is
actually a whole new pump assembly except for the housing.
They're both around $200.
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From FelixU on Cruising World message board:
I put a Cricket into my boat last Spring. Within a week,
my 85-pound sister broke the thin plastic
elbow that connects the pumping lever to the base.
My wife, who is no engineer, took a quick look
at the elbow and declared it too flimsy.
Throughout our Spring cruise in the Bahamas, the thing was
very inconsistent in its operation. Sometimes it would
work well and sometimes it barely worked at all.
Upon our return to the Keys (fortunately) the lever
that switches from dry to wet bowl just
fell out of the base. By the way, this lever is at the
very bottom of the base and was universally
felt to be extremely inconvenient to use.
I tore the Cricket out. To Raritan's credit, they were
extremely truthful about the Cricket. They described it
as working great in many installations,
but not working in others -- for reasons that they
couldn't explain. They took the Cricket back
after about 10 months of use so they could analyze the problem.
And all of this was in a plumbing system that had no
problems of this type before the Cricket. It
was simply a decision to "upgrade" an old head for
a Bahamas trip. "If it ain't broke...".
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From Peggie Hall on Cruising World message board:
Your experience was unusual.
OTOH, that they wanted it back to "analyze" the problems
says a lot about Raritan -- and that IS why
they wanted it back. They want to see what's causing
failures, so they can make whatever mods are
necessary to prevent 'em. They had a lot of problems
with the earliest production models -- some
tooling wasn't right ... so I wonder if you got one
that had been on the retailer's shelf that long.
Unlikely if you bought it from WM, but could have
happened if you bought it from a small local
yard or store -- or if it was a re-furb from the FL location.
However, Raritan admits that the Cricket is not
a live-aboard toilet. It's designed for light
duty on smaller boats by people who haven't -- and may
never -- figured out that everything on a boat
needs some maintenance. However, you shouldn't have had
the problems with it that you had.
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From AlanJ on Cruising World message board:
We also had problems with the plastic elbow that connects
the pumping lever to the base. I am an
engineer and consider the elbow design to be really poor.
The plastic elbow fits onto a square SS
shaft that operates the pump. The plastic wears and/or
cracks as the pump is operated. After a
little while (our experience is that the elbow lasts
about 3-4 months), the square opening in the
elbow becomes enlarged and will not operate the pump properly.
We chose the Cricket due to good ratings and because
of space limitations (over the Lavac). The
Cricket works great at first, but after a while ...
Until Raritan fixes this major design flaw,
I would not recommend the Cricket. If you do get a Cricket,
I would recommend getting spare pump
lever elbow(s). Raritan is really proud of the elbows
as they are about $25 each (seems ridiculous
for a small, cheap piece of plastic). Our failure
to have a spare elbow ended up costing us about
$100 last year in the Bahamas for shipping and phone
calls (it's a long tale of frustration).
Wish we had gotten the Lavac ...
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From John Mason on The Live-Aboard List:
One difficulty with the Lavac is installation. The connections require large
sweeping loops of big stiff hose, not always easy to fit. I spent a long
time siting the big waste pump and coming up with an arrangement that worked
in our Fast Passage 39's small head.
A second problem is the fragility of the toilet lid. We did not have
breakage but I have heard of them breaking off, and splitting in half. If
the lid is broken, the toilet cannot be used for lack of a vacuum seal. We
carried a spare.
Parts are not a problem.
The Lavac is, as advertised, very simple and worth installing if you can fit
it in. We liked it.
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Lavac: "... the seat is always wet
because of the way they operate, lid down to flush. Also since the lid
is down you don't know how much to flush and can put lots of water in the
holding tank."
From Ken McKelvie on The Live-Aboard List:
We have the Lavac heads, two of them actually - both electric, and are very
pleased. Very reliable now for about 6 years with low maintenance. Points
to consider:
1. Whether manual or electric, make sure the pumps are readily accessible -
they don't need too much attention, but make life easy on yourself.
2. They will take a lot of "foreign object" abuse, but they really don't
like Kleenex type tissue (ie the "man-size wet strength" ones for blowing
your nose!) The "wet strength" feature means they form a nice plug in the
pump valves - the pressure the pump generates is substantial! So beware and
insist on guests using the toilet paper provided. Because they look more
like a land-based toilet than the normal marine heads, it is easy for land
based people to forget.
3. Wet seat - we haven't had a problem with this except when at sea when the
water that is left in the bowl tends to splash up onto the seat - easy to
cure - after use, remember to pump out the residual water with the lid open
to get rid of excess water.
4. The ladies, who tend to all want to visit the facility in quick
succession for some reason, find very frustrating the fact that you have to
wait for a few minutes after the previous flush to allow the vacuum to
release the lid.
5. If in daily use, the lid seems to eventually develop small cracks around
the edge after about three years - this eventually means reduced vacuum and
failing flush efficiency. Watch for the cracks to appear and order a
replacement lid - it takes ours about two months from first noticing the
cracks till they extend far enough to affect the vacuum.
6. Amount of water - on the electric version, the timer switch is adjustable
to vary the amount of pump strokes. Trial and error with various "loads"
and you will get a reasonably effective flush for the minimum amount of
water. Same thing for the manual pump - try different numbers of pump
strokes till it seems to work well, and stick the rules on the wall next to
the pump - ours were supplied with a printed sticker advocating 8-10 steady
pump strokes, pause 5 seconds then 5 - 6 additional strokes. We found we
needed to increase this a little as we have a long pipe run to the holding
tank. There is an "interesting" alternative of getting a clear lid so you
can assess the effectiveness of the action ... Not sure I could
handle that before breakfast!! Local television is very dull in Hong Kong,
but a clear lid is perhaps overdoing the alternative
entertainment ... Seriously, though, they do put more water through the
system than a traditional head and this will mean more frequent holding tank
pump outs.
7. Make sure the holding tank breather does not get blocked - as mentioned
before, the pressure these things create is enormous and could easily blow a
pipe off the fitting if the breather is not clear. Our breather pipes are
too small and are easily blocked - our holding tanks are stainless steel,
and we get a noisy warning "clang!!!) as the sides expand (or contract on
pump out).
8. With a simple, but good quality, diverter valve, they are very efficient
emergency bilge pumps!
I think they are excellent - the minor issues are far outweighed by the low
maintenance and reliability advantages.
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From Peggie Hall on live-aboard mailing list:
... Cricket: an excellent toilet -- the first
new design to come along in at least 50 years. It's a full-size
toilet -- available with either the smaller "standard" bowl or the larger
"high-boy" size ... but fits in the same space as a compact model because
instead of the usual piston/cylinder pump beside the bowl, it has a
diaphragm pump below the bowl ... so there are no moving parts in the pump
to wear and require regular rebuilding. In fact, it needs so little
maintenance that the "repair kit" is the entire pump assembly except for
the housing ... and is only necessary about as often as it would be
necessary to replace the entire pump assembly on any piston/cylinder
pump. Nor is it a "cheapo" ... it's about $100 more than the "disposable"
(any toilet you can replace completely with the identical model for
about the price of two rebuild kits for it) Jabsco, Wilcox or Groco
models.
...
Replacing one part at a time that's in a rebuild kit usually only means
that you just get to take the toilet apart more often ... 'cuz when one
part has failed, the others are likely to be badly worn and they will
continue failing one at time. The only exception is the joker valve,
which should be replaced at least annually whether the entire toilet is
rebuilt (which should be done every 2-3 years as preventive maintenance) or not.
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From Lorraine on the SailNet liveaboard-list:
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... The company who my liveaboard neighbor bought his "odorless" composting
toilet from is called Sun-Mar Corp.
I read "everything" in the glossy brochure. Even the great "testimonial"
from Captain Magic, Ketch Inca, Somewhere on the High Seas. Our brother -
that ought to convince us right?
Bottom line is - they tell us it's odorless.
There is one mention that - "since some models may be vented at deck level
- there is a place for zeolite and carbon filters in the fan box, if
needed". To which Captain Magic responds that he feels "the filters in the
stack are overkill".
Well - the filters DON'T manage the venting/outside odors worth a damn. A
rose is still a rose for all that. And the wind best be blowing (and
preferably from the right direction) if YOU'RE planning on hanging out on
deck for any reason.
Odorless INSIDE your boat (if that's all you care about)?
That should work as long as you have your portlights and hatches closed and
(again) the wind is blowing from the right direction.
We are not impressed and urge you to look to other companies, ask more
questions, get money back guaranties etc.
From this standpoint I can tell you - you won't be welcome in marinas if
you buy this particular product.
My neighbors have no choice but to trash the unit, buy a marine head and
hook up to the system. ...
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Response from Spirit-of-Bear on the SailNet liveaboard-list:
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I've used compost toilets for years {almost 20} ... all note in remote cabins
all 12V-powered ... they do smell !! Filters do help somewhat but don't get it all.
I would not want one on our boat ... no way ...
Let me clearly state all the ones we have have all been UL listed ...
The ones that state "no power required" have to have chemicals added to speed up
the breakdown process ...
I would really hate to have one on a boat, there is no way they can be odorless. ...
They all require either power stirring or a occasional manual turning of the
digestor to speed the process ...
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From Peggie Hall on
Cruising World message board:
Composting heads:
First of all any self-contained unit that actually works as advertised has
to be too big to fit in the head on most boats. Too small, and there isn't any
air space left in the drum, without which material can't compost ... it
rots ... and stinks. The Sun-Mar self-contained unit -- which needs a
space about 3' x 3' by 2.5' high (allowing for room to pull out the
finishing drawer to empty it and room for the handle that rotates the drum),
and that's the smallest they've been able to make one that still works.
Then there's the matter of excess liquids. Even with power to run the
evaporating plate and fan, there are typically more liquids than the
evaporator can handle ... but they still have to drained off because
wet soggy organic material doesn't compost, it rots ... and stinks.
Excess liquids cannot legally be drained overboard, they have to go
into a holding tank ... and there goes any advantage to spending
about $1200 for a composting toilet, even if it would fit in your
head and you have the power resources to run the evaporator.
And finally there's the dry organic matter that has to be added
to every flush ... peat moss is the material of choice because
it's highly water absorbent and breaks down quickly ... but you
have to carry it aboard to use it, and enough peat moss to
provide a cupful every time two adults use the head takes
up a good bit of storage space.
On the plus side, when installed, operated and maintained according to
mfr's specs, composters DO work as advertised -- no odor, and the
finished compost is a sanitary loam-like "dirt" ... much like the
bagged fertilizer available from garden supply stores.
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From Procyon on
Cruising World message board:
|
I know you know your, well uh stuff, but Sunmar recomends 1 cupful
of filler per day per adult, not per use. Real life filler is 1 cup
every other day or so for 2 adults. I didn't know the marine or 12 volt
versions had an evaporator plates. If they do then there are no excess
fluids, it has no problem at all keeping up with 2 adults 2 kids and more.
I would be more concerned about having enough power to run it while at anchor.
I do agree it is iffy at best for use on a boat. I kinda like that $25,000
head I read about in Sail this month. Burns your crap in the engine exhaust.
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From Craig Poole on The Live-Aboard List:
I installed a composting toilet (Sunmar) on my old houseboat (which I sold
back in 99). From my experience, I would NOT recommend the experience again.
If I lived in a warm climate it would have probably worked, but installing in
NY Harbor area (think cold winters) just didn't do the trick. The compost
really never took - probably because of the cold - and it was a real mess to
clean out. In addition, the heating element never kept up with the fluid
volume and needed to be drained off into a separate tank.
All in all - not a good idea.
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From Pierre S. on The Live-Aboard List:
I don't have a direct experience as an everyday user. But
some months ago I was the next sleep of a composting
toilet user in a marina.
For the first 10 days I was there, I thought there was a
kind of industrial horse or cow farm close of the marina.
It was strong, but I love animals. Then I discussed with
my neighbor who explained me the process of composting on
his boat. I paid a visit to the inside installation: a
nice homemade cake perfume from the oven of the boat,
that's was all. Very interesting.
On my wife urgent request we finally moved to an other
marina across the creek.
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"Air Head" composting head info at FAQs about Sarana
From Maurice on the live-aboard mailing list:
Vacuflush heads: We have two of them and I did the
first rebuild after nearly 7 years of trouble free use, including several
years of living aboard by the first owner and several months of the same by
the two of us. The rebuild consisted of replacing four duckbill valves in
one of the two S-pumps (the one that does the flushing) and two in the
T-pump (the one that pumps the holding tank overboard). We did not touch
the second S-pump because it is still going strong. I have a stock of
various parts just in case but thus far have had no need of them. I did
have one other small problem, but it was due to a bad installation (and yet
the head worked fine for over 6 years).
Maintenance is simply a quarter-cup of laundry detergent brushed around the
bowl and then flushed through the system, followed by a pail or so of flush
water. It takes all of 5 minutes every month or two.
These heads take from a pint to a quart of fresh water (depends on how long
you hold the pedal down) so the holding tank takes a long time to fill up.
During the day we just flush as needed; at night we follow the old adage, if
it’s yellow let it mellow, if it’s brown flush it down. This saves water
and they do make a whooshing sound (somewhat like the heads on some
aircraft) that would wake the dead at night. Because the flush water is
fresh, there is no urine/saline crystal build-up like you get with salt
water; also this means no saltwater smell in the head. Other than the
noise, the only downside I can think of is that they are a bit costly;
however, I don’t have to rebuild the pump (or replace it) every year or two.
Since the hose is full of air, not s**t, the smell is negligible even after
seven years of use.
For the uninitiated, they are simple. The head is connected to a pressure
vessel a little bigger than a football, which is connected to a vacuum pump,
which discharges to the holding tank. The pressure vessel has a vacuum
switch connected to the vacuum pump; that’s it. When switched on (we never
shut them off), the pump pulls the hoses and pressure vessel down to a
partial vacuum. When you step on the pedal, a valve opens and everything is
sucked through a tiny hole below, breaking up all the solids. Flush water
(from your pressure system) is automatically drawn in at the same time, some
of which remains in the bowl after letting up on the pedal. Then the pump
continues to run until everything is expelled to the holding tank and a
fresh vacuum is drawn; it takes only a minute or so for the cycle to
complete.
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From Peggie Hall on the live-aboard mailing list:
You're on the right track, but you should do a little more than that. I
have a VacuFlush on my boat, and had one on my previous boat, so I'm
intimately acquainted with it.
The VacuFlush doesn't macerate ... waste is sucked through the system by
accumulated vacuum when that vacuum is released. That splatters waste in
various size pieces all over the inside of the hoses and vacuum
accumulator tank. That highly touted "only one pint of flush water"
isn't enough to rinse it out, and the flush water flow is so weak that
flushing longer doesn't accomplish much either. So unless you fill the
bowl completely a couple of times and flush that through at least once a
day, you'll not only have permeated hoses in a very short time (only
took two months on my current boat), which is why SeaLand had no choice
but to develop a "bullet proof" hose -- their "OdorSafe" brand, but if
you're lucky enough to avoid that, urine crystal buildup in the hoses
can reduce the diameter to less than an inch in a year or two.
To prevent that, back off on the detergent -- it cleans the hose, but it
won't touch urine crystals -- and instead put two cups of undiluted (turn
off the water at the breaker first) white vinegar down it once a
week -- after you've run two bowls full of water through it.
However, the VacuFlush IS a toilet that needs no other preventive
maintenance ... and 99% of problems with it are due to operator error -- the
most common being just "popping" the pedal (releasing it the second the
bowl is empty) instead of leaving it down for at least 3 seconds to
allow flush water to rinse solids and paper out of the pump.
And it's a fine toilet -- the one I chose to put on my own boat 4 years
ago. However, since then, advances in macerating electric toilets,
especially the capability to use a fresh water solenoid instead of a sea
water intake pump, now offer the same low water use / low power -- in fact
even lower -- consumption advantages that the V/Flush offers, plus
maceration, for a MUCH lower price.
...
It's an excellent toilet. However, with the improvements in macerating
toilets, I don't think it's worth what it costs any more. It's ONLY
available from "Authorized VacuFlush Service Centers" at list price
(around $1100 ... it's hard to tell any more, since SeaLand no longer
publishes "list" prices) ... and unless the "authorized" dealer also
installs it -- another $1000 average -- the warranty is void. Otoh, several
macerating toilets which offer all the same advantages are available
from West Marine, BOAT/US, Defender etc for $700-$800, and their mfrs
have no problem with owner installation. And -- all the "guts" are
contained within the pedestal ... no need to eat up valuable storage space
with pumps, etc.
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From Lou Hunt:
Well, I'm still working on my ******* septic system. I re-did all the
fittings yesterday and changed the seals in one toilet. I also caulked
everything ... had to wait 24 hours to fire the system up to see if it
works. I'll do that in a few hours more. With the fittings re-done, I'll be
able to isolate any air leaks (this is a vacuum system) and epoxy them
until their ears pop. I've had it with working on this septic system.
Please let me advise you to never, never get a vacuum toilet system in your
boat. What a pain! :o(
The entire system ... from the two toilets to the holding tank ... is a sealed
vacuum system. Somewhere ... and trust me, I have been chasing it down forever ... there
is an air leak not allowing the vacuum to build enough to evacuate the toilets.
And now that I have a girlfriend here ... toilets are C-R-I-T-I-C-A-L! The system is a
VacuFlush system made by Dometic Sanitation/Sealand Technology.
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From Don Dement on the live-aboard mailing list:
... the two Microphors on my boat
would be described almost the same as the Vacuflush. However, they
operate by air pressure instead of vacuum. The waste and 2 quarts of
fresh water it leaves in the bowl are dropped into a small chamber, the
flap closes, and air pressure tosses it all into the hose to the holding
tank. There are no wires at all to the head -- just a small hard plastic
air hose from an air tank. The compressor runs about twice a day and
holds enough air for perhaps two flushes. The heads are porcelain, clean
easily. The "innards" look to be high-quality gear.
Mine work flawlessly. From the aft head to the tank is at least 25 feet
of hose running through the engine room. No odor whatever and no
blockage. I haven't had to do any maintenance, and I haven't seen any
items in the manual about maintenance. ...
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From Peggie Hall on
Cruising World message board:
In Response To: Dump the Grocos ...
Advising anyone to dump a $500+ toilet is bad advice ...
Based on the comments I've read over the years, the ONLY reason many people prefer the Lavac is
the lack of maintenance it requires. It's not landlubber guest friendly ... it's not child
friendly ... you can't add water to the bowl ahead of solids ... it just doesn't require any
maintenance.
I'm NOT knocking it ... it's a fine head. Just putting it into perspective. Different folks want
different strokes. And to those folks, a little maintenance may be a small price to pay to have
'em.
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From Peggie Hall on
Cruising World message board:
Only one caveat re Groco -- any Groco:
Unless the pump shaft seals are replaced annually, they have a disconcerting tendency to spit
flush water at you (if you have one that doesn't, you're one in a million).
The Model K is an excellent toilet ... and the price -- over $500 -- reflects it. So are the W-C
Imperial and Skipper for nearly $1000 each. Whether to spend that much on a toilet depends upon
how long you plan to keep the boat. If the rest of your life, any of these toilets are built to
last a lifetime -- several lifetimes ... but if only a few years, I wouldn't do it.
If convenience and water in the bowl when you need it is the main issue, consider going to an
electric macerating toilet with the fresh water solenoid option ... the water useage is minimal, and
the amperage draw is a pittance. In that case, take a look at the new Raritan Sea Era for about
$400. OTOH, macerating electric toilets can't be converted to manual in a crunch ... and they DO use
SOME of your potable water supply ... so if you're heading for open seas where either one could
become an issue, that might not be the best option.
There's no such thing as THE "best toilet" ... only the best toilet for any owner's wants, needs and
budget.
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- Good heads: Groco's Model K, Wilcox Crittenden's Skipper.
- Raritan Engineering, maker of the Lectra/San.
"... it draws about 45 amps for each 2-minute cycle ..."
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