The Morning Dawns... well, it never really darkened... hehehe The smell of fried potatoes wafts through the house causing a faint rumble in a few bellies as Hexla comes out carrying three plates piled high with potato slices cooked with onions and peppers. Darrin's face lights up to see her, and she hands him a plate first and then hands off the other two to the dwarves saying, "Cheerfully, be right back." She emerges with a loaf of fresh baked bed and three more plates. "Now, you boys and gal, eat up and then you must be on your way. A day wasted is an eternity in Avernus. I wish you all the best of luck finding your way off this plane. The Pillar can help you more than I." I hope Hexla isn't offended, and I will tell her if she asks, but I cannot bring myself to eat anything in Hell I didn't prepare myself. My distrust of her may have lessened some, but I still can't do it.<> I will prepare my own breakfast from my rations, though hers smells much better. After eating I will pack and prepare to leave. We should try to make good time, I don't much like the idea of spending too much time travelling in the open through hell.<> Darrin wolfs down his food and then eyes Jeath's uneaten portions. FOLDIS, Foldis takes the offered food, thanks Hexla and starts to eat. The speed she can shovel her food down is probably a surprise to all but Onyx. Once she has eaten Foldis returns her plate to Hexla, complements her on her cooking, moves to the entrance of the cave and starts to sharpen her axe (she has not had time to do this since sticking it in the Zombie and it needs a good clean). She then waits for the rest of the party to finish eating. This time Christeel excepts the offered food and makes sure that he cleans his plate of all food. "Hexla, I can supply you with some clean fresh water if you would like, It would be a small thank you for you aid." "Oh...that's so kind... but I have a small well out back... came with the house and garden. It's how I've been able to survive here at all," Hexla replies. -- I will eat the food and then pack up and get ready to leave. "Thank you for the information and hospitality, Hexla. Are you sure you don't want to come with us? After all of your help taking you home with us is the least we can do." "Thank you, but I really should stay here. I know if it's possible for you to find the things I need you will get them to me somehow. But, I am old and would slow you up, endangering you all," Hexla says with a warm smile. After we receive her answer I will finish getting ready to leave. On the way out (If Hexla is not coming with us) I will give Hexla a smooch on the cheek. "Thank you again for all of your help."<> Hexla graciously blushes and pats the dwarf on the shoulder. After pating Onyx on the shoulder, Christeel will thank hexla with a kiss on the back of her hand, "I thank thee for your hospitality Hexla, I doubt that many other in this land will extend the same to us. If I find the items that you are looking for I will find a way to get them to you" Christeel then heads out with the party for the pillar Darrin looks glum as he walks out the door, looking over his shoulder a few times at Hexla's retreating figure. Erilyx asks Hexla the following once he's alone with her: "Hexla," He speaks in a calm, thoughtful tone. "Is there anything you can give us... that may help in our journey? Any magical tidbits or weapons, persay? Your ... abode seems to be filled with such wonders." "I'm sorry, young one... but I have need of what I have to fend off the powerful fiends that would otherwise torture and make my nights excruciating," Hexla says with a sad smile. You all step back out into the red landscape, leaving Hexla's sanctuary behind. "Let's take stock of our provisions before we go too far. I assume everyone who has waterskins has them full, and I have several days worth of food. I say we move as fast as we can for as long as we can so we can get out of here as fast as possible. It would be nice to get some sweetgrass and batwings and bring them back to Hexla, but I kind of doubt any of us will be willing to come back here once we get home. I know I don't want to come back." Onyx Let's head out. I'm for finding these pillar things and getting out of here. I just wish we didn't have to make a deal with them first. Dealing in hell I'm afraid we'll end up with eights and aces...<> I remove my piccolo, strike up a happy tune (Follow the Yellow Brick Road?) and start off in the direction of the pillars.<> Christeel adds "We still need to find A.J. don't we? I have been giving this some thought as to how he was able to travel to this layer and able to get past the creature that we encountered when we arrived here. Let me see, he could have gotten transfered to a diffrent place than the one that we arrived at, but if he did wouldn't Darrin and Erilyx have gotten transfered to a diffrent place than the one that we came to. So this would mean that it is highly probable the A.J. came to this place also. Now how was he able to get past the guard posted there. He would have had to know the creature possible, and the creature had lied to us about A.J., but why send us to the Helxa, perhaps he thought that the witch would do us in. FOLDIS, "Christeel, much as I would like to part A.J.'s head from his shoulders if letting him live is the only way to get home I am willing to let the demons here do our work for us" With this Foldis moves closer to Darrin and says, "Sorry Darrin but I'm sure you would also rather see Zeptha again than continue to persue her attacker if we have a way home" Darrin nods a couple of times... though his eyes roam towards the blood river. His feet seem intent on finding things to trip over, though in general his steps are keeping him far from the river. Christeel states, "I agree that finding A.J. on this layer would be quite an undertaking, our best chance of finding him would to find some scrying device to help locate him, cause asking aroud in hell won't do much but bring us alot of trouble. but my thinking is that A.J. is not the human he appeared to be but rather a deamon of some kind himself. He seemed to know exactly where he was headed after we started tracking him toward the home in the mound. He may have come here for reenforcements or something of the like? Of course I'm sure that the penalty for failure is not a good one here in hell" "There are a couple of other possibilities as well. Maybe he knew how to work the circle and was able to use it to go somewhere else. It is possible that the circle brought us here as sort of a default location since we didn't know how to use it. It is also possible that AJ never entered the room that brought us here. I don't remember if there were other footprints in there or not, but it is possible he avoided the room and eluded us. Does anyone remember if there were other footprints in the room before we arrived?<> As the crew shuffles out of Hexla's... abode... Erilyx takes a customary position, following the others like an unguided sheep. After the food and the sleep, his eyes are back to their cheerful, sunken sharpness, and his lip seems even more tightly shut than before. He still wears his heavy cloak half way over his body, and despite the heat, doesn't seem to take its trim out of his clenched, bony hands. His raven black hair drips lines of sweat in a chaotic pattern down his face as he plods along... lost in silence. The raining fireballs seem to be farther off in the distance, and there seems to be less troops training in the distance. Nothing grows however, not even cactus, and from previous fireballs the ground is still dug up enough to make walking difficult and perilous. Surprisingly, you come to a shallow set of hills after a long morning's trek... taking you past the mountain you think you originally entered this world upon. Taking a break for sustenance, Darrin sits as far from the river as he is able... as the morning progressed towards noon, you are able to hear a louder wailing from the river's occupants. You can see a set of falls up ahead, and the the bodies seem to crunch up against the rocks... I will keep an eye out for trouble while we are eating. I will watch the sky as well as the ground. As soon as we are done eating I think we should get moving so we can get as far as possible.<> Christeel will continue to keep a close watchful eye on Darrin, making sure that whenever the party gets near the river, Darrin doesn't start acting funny. "I agree with Onyx, we should get moving again as soon as possible" Along with the rest of the group, I'm for making our stop short, if not sweet. As we travel I'll try to keep an eye on everyone for anything unusual. I sincerely doubt Hexla did anything to us, but as I understand it I'm the only one who didn't eat her proffered breakfast. Call me paranoid.<> Passing through the hills, you start to wonder at the lack of any type of creature. Not even any demons are to be found. Just broken up landscape of red sand, a red flowing river of blood with wailing voices and a red sky lit by the occasional red fireball. The going is a little slower through the hills as the day drags into afternoon, but soon you are amongst a plains area again surrounded by a ring of hills, just as Hexla told you. Up ahead is a bend in the river, where it heads to the right up a narrow cleft. It will force you all to walk along the river's edge, narrowing even further up ahead where you just might have to slog through it. Darrin is shaking like a leaf... odd when you haven't seen any trees. "Obviously, after Darrin's experience, wading through the river is out of the question. Why don't we all keep going and hopefully we will be able to stay on dry land. If it becomes too narrow we will have to think of a way past without getting into the river."<> If it becomes apparent that the party has to cross the river again, Christeel will offer to carry Darrin across on his sholders if need be. Let's look and see if there's a way to avoid this narrow passage. Things have been to quiet around here, and a place like this is ripe for an ambush. If not let's try to come up with a creative way to traverse it, preferably one avoiding contact with the river, the further away the better. Depending on how high this is, maybe we can do the feather fall/unseen servant bit and get a lookout up on top. I'll volunteer if no one else is interested.<> Christeel, "I agree Jeath, we should be on our guard for an ambush" Christeel will put his elvin ears to the task of keenly listening to any odd noises Darrin says quickly, his voice trembling, "I'm okay, Onyx. I can walk through it...if it's really shallow. I can. Hexla," just saying her name calms him a little, "She said we had to come this way... so we can get out of this place." "I don't want to get lost, here," Darrin adds in a whisper. "I say we just keep going and see if we can find a way around the narrow spot so we don't have to wade in the river. If that is not possible, I say we should cross the river one at a time and have a rope tied to us. If the voices start to get to us everyone else can pull us out of the water. Since I am probably the strongest among us, I will cross first so I can pull everyone else across if they need the help. If I start having too much trouble you will all have to pull me back to shore and I will just have to keep trying until I make it across. Darrin, I hate to ask you to talk about it, but when the voices were talking to you did you feel like you wanted to go with them? I only ask because if you did then we need to take precautions. Whoever is crossing will have to have their hands tied so they can't untie the rope from around themselves."<> Darrin thinks carefully before answering. "They wanted me to stay... but, I just wanted out... as fast as I could get out. I can hear them now, calling to me, but I... I don't want to go back in. I just want to get to this pillar and... get away from this place." Christeel will start looking around paying close attention to any areas that might possible look like a place of ambush or any possible loose rock deposit that is located above the group position. OOC:don't want to get caught in a rock slide, that coudld hurt, also if we need to cross the river, we might be able to cause a rock slide ourself to make crossing the river eaiser. I think Onyx's rope idea sounds good, if the water is shallow enough. If not we'll have to work out something else.<> Do you think a horse or a mule might pull us through, or would they be to skittish? I guess we can always try and see what happens.<> "A horse or mule could pull us through easily as long as they didn't touch the water. I do see one problem, however. We don't have a horse or mule."<> FOLDIS, "I think the rope idea will work but how do we find out how deep the 'water' is without going in, also, as we don't actually need to cross the river why don't we wait until we see how far we would need to wade on this side before trying to cross over." When the group decides to enter the cleft walking between the sharp angled cliff and the water's edge they are able to go a good distance. But then it narrows, where the cliff comes right down to the waters' edge. The span of water is only about ten feet across. Almost as a test of will Darrin places one foot halfway in the water, but then he pulls it out as a floating body comes near the edge, a look of agony on it's face. Darrin's pale, but he hasn't backed away from the water yet. I will get my rope out. "I have an idea on how to figure out how deep the water is. I will tie a good sized rock to my rope and drop the rock into the river. When the rock hits bottom I will pull it back out and we will the rope will tell us how deep the river is. After finding out how deep the river is we need to decide who will cros first. I can't swim, but I can get across by swimming under water, and I can push off the bottom to break the surface for more air if I can't get across with one breath. When I do that, I will want you all to have a rope tied to me so you can pull me back if it becomes necessary. Since Darrin didn't want to stay with the voices, I don't think it will be necessary to tie my hands, and if the water is over my head I will probably need them to swim under water. I would suggest that Foldis come across after me, since we are probably the strongest people here and will have the best chance to pull the rest of you across if we need to. Also, we will want to mace absolutely certain our food and water are sealed well before we cross so the water doesn't get into them." I will find a large rock and tie one end of my rope to it and then I will see how deep the water is.<> Onyx tosses the rope out about five feet and kerplunk, after only a second or so, the rope goes limp, the rock hit bottom. While the rope is wet up to the length of the distance to the middle, after drawing the rope in, you speculate that the water level is at most two feet high. I untie the rock and tie the rope around myself. "Okay, here goes nothing. If I start to go nuts or if something happens and I am in trouble, pull me back and I can try again. Otherwise I will get ready to pull in Foldis or whoever comes next if I have to. However, judging by the effect the river had on Darrin, I may need a few minutes to pull myself together after I get out of the water." I make sure someone has the other end of the rope and then I start wading in the river. I will, of course, try to get out of the way of any floating bodies that happen along.<> Christeel pipes up, "I'll cross first, I should be strong enough and tall enough to fight off the current and not get in over my head so to speak, as far as tying my hands you can forget that, I don't want to have to fight anything with my hands tied. Onyx you are the probably the strongest of us. It would be best if you were holding rope instead of crossing. I can check as I cross that the river remains the same depth. Christeel will tie the rope around his waist and slowly make his way up to the edge of the river. "Hold the rope tight, I do not plan on becoming part of this river" "You definately don't want to dip your head under there... the screaming's a lot louder," Darrin whispers. Christeel will lower himself into the river, and test the strength of the current and the depth of the river before letting go of the side of the bank and slowly make his way across the river. Christeel will watch the upstream for any coming heads in the river not wanting to get hit by any. Even as Christeel entered, the wailing increases, though it sounds like wordless screams is all, and not like anything specific. Christeel has to make a quick step to avoid being hit by one of the floating heads, He comments trying to make light of his current situation, "I wonder what kind of fishing can be done here, probably catch a blood bass" Darrin blanches at the obscene humor, his body rocking a little weakly. Once on the other side Christeel will climb up the other bank and quickly find a spot to anchor the rope or himself for the rest of the members to cross. From the cross just made, all could see that the water went only up to Christeel's thighs and aside from looking relieved to be across, nothing seems unbalanced about him. The height now seems to be just fine for either dwarf, and Onyx chooses to go next, still seething a little at not going first. As he crosses, hands seem to grab at him from bodies under the water and once or twice he feels his boot crunch down on something more than sand, accompanied by a rather virilent screaming. Darrin seems to be muttering under his breath, his words undiscernible. I will throw my end of the rope back to the next person and let them come across. "I suggest we get moving again as soon as we get everyone across and we take a few minutes to recover if we need it." FOLDIS, Foldis volunteers to cross last and suggests Jeath crosses somewhere near the centre of the group. Jeath heads across the river next, leaving Erilyx, Darrin and Foldis. Darrin draws close to Erilyx and whispers in his ear, "I can't go across there. I just can't. You understand... right. I can see a little into you now..." he trails off, his emerald eyes holding shadows in them that had never been there before yesterday. At the sight of Darrin's eyes, Erilyx's darken as well, forcing a stern lock between the two of them. Quietly he speaks, but his voice holds steady. "If not to cross then, brother, where do we go?" He keeps close to Darrin and never lets a flicker of uncertainty or question cross his eyes... even when they cross his mind. Waiting. Darrin licks his lips and begins to shake his head slowly. "I don't know. She told me last night... Hexla whispered to me that... we have to leave here... The Pit Fiend Bel will be after us because we let Halitsu go warn him. Bel doesn't like visitors... I'm just scared. I don't want to walk through there alone... I can hear them calling from here... They're saying we can join them just by surrending to the darkness... to the deep. One voice stands out... it told me you would understand the terror and the embrace of darkness." Erilyx's steel grey eyes harden, this time with resolve more than anything. (It's only 10 feet across, right?) Undoing his backpack, the bony youth tosses it over to the other side, and turns to Darrin. "Hop on, I'll carry you over. We _will_ make it." The tone of his voice carries a determination to not fail... or at least it should sound that way. Darrin follows suit, and tosses his belongings across. If it's only ten feet, I could probably give him a piggyback across, and if it's only two feet deep, I could probably keep him out of it easily enough. Gulp. Darrin then slowly clambers on to Erilyx's back, piggyback style. Erilyx starts across, Darrin's arms clenched tightly around his chest. Darrin whispers one last thing to Erilyx. "I forgive you for Zeptha. I think I even understand a little now..." he trails off and then he gasps as Erilyx takes his first step into the water. Unlike the previous crossers, it's clear that bodies almost swarm towards the Erilyx and his passenger. Hands tear at them, even rising out of the water to grip anything they can. Darrin whimpers but kicks out at anything that comes close. The voices pick up in intensity and cry out loudly one after the other, "Come... Join us! You are one with us!" Eri'lyx is unsure whether the voices are for Darrin, himself or both. A hand grasps hold of Eri'lyx's ankle only a foot from the shore, and it seems to be quite persistant in it's efforts to keep him from stepping out of the river. With the shore so near, Phearez falls down to his knees, and basically falls foreward, splatting Darrin on the 'beach' and a good 4 feet from the waters edge. Darrin slithers as far from the water as he can get before collapsing in a heap of trembling limbs. Once in this prone position, I figure Darrin will clamber off Erilyx, and for a brief second, he will leave his leg in the river, and not struggle... trying for a feel to see what it's pull is like uninhibited. Searching in his mind for any familiar voices . . . The hand actually caresses you, as it's joined by other hands seeking to entice you to come further in... "Yes... come my dark child," you hear just one voice now... the voice of your dreams and nightmares. The other voices almost cease completely as your dark guardian whispers to you seductively. "Come just a little further in... come...I am here to protect you, Phearez." With THAT, Phearez kicks furiously free of the water (while trying to maintain that cool demeanor) and stands before the others. [assuming he can.] "Sons of Tarterus, this has to have been the worst, hydra sucking idea I've ever had!" Erilyx exclaims as he rises to his feet. FOLDIS, On seeing the trouble the last 2 had crossing the river Foldis backs away from it with a very worried look on her face. She then starts scanning the cleft we are in to see if she can see a way across the river without actually touching it. "If you can find a way across without wading we will wait for you, but I think the trouble Darrin and Erilyx had was due to the fact that Darrin was in the river before. I think it recognized him in some manner and tried harder to get him this time. They had a much harder time crossing than the rest of us did. I think you will be fine, but then again this is all just speculation." I toss the rope over in case Foldis needs to wade across.<> Christeel grins and speaks to Foldis, "I'll come get you sweety if you would like to be carried across also. A woman should never have to do anything she doesn't want to" If Foldis wants, Christeel will cross the river and bring Foldis back with him. FOLDIS; On hearing Christeel calling her "sweetie" Foldis stops looking around and, ignoring the rope, wades into the river and heads straight for Christeel her axe held rather more securely than usual and with a look of fury on her face that would make most people quake in their boots. In her anger, Foldis doesn't even feel the hands that grab for her or the body that bumps into her from behind, not even jostling her. Christeel notices the anger in Foldis face and raises an eyebrow in alarm of perhaps saying to much to Foldis After Foldis gets across the river I will step between Foldis and Christeel. (Why do I do stupid things like this?) I also do not have my axe in my hand. "Please wait a moment, Foldis. You have every right to be angry at Christeel, but we may need his talents to escape this dark realm. Could you maybe let his remarks pass? Besides, I think he was just trying to goad you into crossing the river quickly so we could leave this place as fast as possible." I will turn to Christeel: "Isn't that right, Christeel."<> Christeel grins, winks ans nods. "Tis right" Christeel will pull forth his sword hilt first, holding the long sword by the blade and the hilt toward Foldis, "twas only words. You are across the river now" and then Christeel grins a very broad grin at Foldis. "Isn't there enough blood around here anyway, I would much rather share a keg of Dwarven Sprites then draw a weapon against you. Christeel will drop the sword he holds in his hands to the ground and offer a hand of friendship to Foldis Foldis, Foldis slightly relaxes her grip on her axe, side-steps Onyx, pushes Christeels offered hand away and growls into his face,(well more likely his chest); "I told you at that damned portal I wasn't your sweetie. If I didn't think we needed to stick together to get out of this hellhole you would be wishing you hadn't dropped this.", glancing down Foldis places her foot on the hilt of Christeel's sword and grinds it into the ground, she then carries on, "The next time you call me sweetie I would suggest you keep ahold of your weapon." Christeel only stands there and watches as the dwarven princess Foldis vents her anger. He cast his head down as foldis is scolds him like a child. He doesn't move as Foldis stomps off toward Onyx. Foldis then turns to Onyx and in a low voice says in Dwarven (as I don't know who speaks it I will post here and those who don't, or are to far away, can ignore it). "Why do so many of these tall folk have so little respect for others." Without even stopping to wipe the remaining fluid from her legs Foldis then heads off in Jeath's direction. As Foldis and the rest head out after Jearth, Christeel head slowly rises and he looks toward the blood river. Talking to the river "I do understand the dwarven lanuage and there ways, and does she not realize that she insults all that are not dwarven when she speaks there tounge in front of those that do not understand." Christeel bends back down picking up a rock, muttering a few words over the rock (bless). Christeel tosses the blessed rock into the river. Christeel watches as the rock hits the river hopping in some small way the he could do more for the people of the river. Christeel then reaches out with his right foot sliding it under his sword with a praticed grace kicks the sword up into his hand with the hilt of the sword snapping into the palm of his hand. Christeel flips the sword around twice and quickly sheaths his long sword. He pulls forth a clean green cloth from inside his vest and slowly starts cleaning the hilt of the sword as he follows after the group. "Damm, she didn't have to grin my sword into ground" Christeel notices a few new nicks in the hand of his sword. Christeel after he has cleaned up the hilt of his sword, well enough to his shinny liking will offer up a few words to his goddess Mystra, "Greater Goddess Mystra do watch over us, especially the dwarfs" Once everyone is safely across the river, Jeath will wander off a short distance alone, though not out of sight, and throw a mount spell. Once the horse arrives, I will mount up, tell the group, "I'll be back in a bit," and ride ahead for about an hour and scout out the terrain. After an hour I will return to the group, release the horse and report my findings. After he rides off, Onyx is able to get everyone to edge up the ravine more and get a touch further from the river as the gorge begins to widen again. Darrin huddles at the edge of the cliff, curled up in a ball, his arms covering his ears. While we await the return of the elf, and Darrin cowers in the corner, Erilyx, keeping his cloak around the half of his body, sits beside Darrin silently. He will not comfort Darrin in any way other than his silent presence... (if that can be seen as comforting). Quietly and with utmost patience he will sit his post before the shepards decide where to push to next. Erilyx could swear that Darrin quickly glancing to see who sits near him, then breathes just slightly easier, his legs kicking out just slightly. Erilyx can still hear a muttering from the river, a few voices calling to him, telling him of great power and wealth that awaits him. Whether or not Darrin hears these same voices or others is unknown. The horse is terribly skittish near the river with it's smell and horrible screaming, but it holds steady enough for Jeath to ride. The river holds no further surprises up the cleft as the hills break into another plains area with another set of hills in the distance. The wonderful thing about the terrain is that it's no different than the terrain behind you. But up ahead when you near the distance you would turn around at, you begin to hear quarreling voices and you can see in the hazy distance, a tall wide pillar, but it's features are indistinguishable. I ride a little closer. I want to try to get a look at whatever it is. And try to figure out why I here voices when I see but one pillar. I would attempt to approach by the least noticeable route, but since there is nothing on the terrain to hide behind I guess I'll settle for riding up slowly. Unusual for me I know, but I will not speak unless is talks to me first. <> I ride up to the pillar. Morbid, I know, but I look to see if I recognize any of the skulls, especially the elven ones. None look familiar. I still wait to be spoken too. If they never speak to me, I will look it over for a few minutes, then ride back to the group.<> None speak to you... Off I go. I'll return to the group the way I came. I don't particularly want to get into trouble, I like to get others into trouble. Hard to do that solo.<> It's more than an hour... almost closer to two hours, but Jeath returns looking okay. "Okay Jeath, I assume you went on a scouting trip. did you happen to see anything useful, or is there just a lot more of what we have been walking through?<> <> "Hi guys. You're still here? I thought you'd at least keep moving. Sit around all day and we'll never get out of here. Pillar of skulls is dead ahead. Sorry, poor choice of words. Can't miss it. Big ol' pile of skulls. Most of 'em won't shut up. I was sorely tempted to strike up a conversation, but I thought I'd best wait for the rest of you. "Not that I make a habit of thinking of others very often, but it did seem best to try and get out of here together. Not a sign of sweetgrass for miles. Or much of anything else for that matter. "Christeel, glad to see you're still in only one piece. Foldis, my hats off to you, I didn't think anyone could exercise that much self restraint. Not that I ever wear a hat, but you know what I mean. "C'mon, Darrin, Erilyx, quit your moping. We've got a big pile of Deadheads to talk to. (OOC: Would Dead Heads be a good place to find Sweet Grass, or isn't that the same thing?) This is just starting to get fun. C'mon, let's go. Last one there's an orc's lover." With the return of Jeath, Erilyx stands, and offers a hand to Darrin to get him to stand up. Lead on, we follow. Darrin glances up at Erilyx, and then with the dark youth's help, he rises shakily and keeping as close to the cliff as he can he begins to walk after Jeath, keeping his head down to watch where he steps. Jeath takes off running till he's about a hundred yards ahead. Then he stops to wait for the rest of the group to catch up. The river holds no further surprises up the cleft as the hills break into another plains area with another set of hills in the distance. The wonderful thing about the terrain is that it's no different than the terrain behind you. But up ahead when you near the distance you would turn around at, you begin to hear quarreling voices and you can see in the hazy distance, a tall wide pillar, but it's features are indistinguishable.