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Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 14:59:04 +0100 (BST)
From: Stu
Subject: Re: btlist: Thanks for the welcome!

Hi Jamie

Stu here, and thanks for the comments from the previous letter.

I'm sorry it's difficult finding a society in your area, and I wouldn't go
to the toilets up the road, either.

I too am finding it difficult to get involved in societies, but hopefully
when I go back to uni, in september (bad news, I've to resit an exam,
before progressing onto an honours degree in Business iNformation Systems)
I'm hopefully gonna be a full time student, and will be able to join the
lgb societies there, AGAIN. Last year I was part time, and was unable to
make the meetings,and join in all the fun.

If you've got the latest edition of Gay Times, then there's a list at the
back, with societies, that may be local to you. I've found a couple , for
example, I live in BRentwood, and therefore, have soceities in Essex,
being, in Harlow, Chelsmford, not close, but ok to travel too.

Check it out. there may also b some news of societies,
www.gaytimes.co.uk

see you later mate.

stu.

On Mon, 13 Jul 1998, Jamie G wrote:

> Hi Stu!
> My school have a LGB society! No bloody way! All the teachers are
> homophobic and it is a shit hole! As for local groups, well i went to
> one once but it was 20 minutes away by train, cost me a fortune to get
> there and wasn't really worth it. It would be great to set one up, but
> almost impossible... no where to have it, no one to come etc! The
> nearest thing to a gay meeting place around here is the toilets up the
> road and no way am i going there!! i wish i lived in london or
> something. Thanks for your help though Stu, sounds like you had an even
> worse time at school than i do.
> Loads of love and hopefully speak to you again soon,
> jamie
> XXX
>
>
>
> >Hey Jamie, and hello all.
> >
> >
> >Sorry it's taken a while to respond to this email, but i've been busy
> >working.
> >
> >Jamie, some advice, if it helps or not.
> >
> >I'm sure that a person with our whit and charm, and looks will get a
> bf,
> >sooner, than later. I feel that there must be hundreds if not, half
> the
> >amount of students at school, who are gay, but haven't let the cat out
> of
> >the bag, so to speak. I was wondering if you'd checked out the clubs
> and
> >event that the school holds, and whether there was a lgb (lesbian gay
> and
> >Bisexual) society within your school ? or outside, locally to you.
> >
> >This would benefit both yourself, and them. As there may be others who
> >are gay, but haven't told anyone, and have joined a society such as the
> >lgb. Usually you can find out if these societies exist or not, through
> a
> >local paper, or from word of mouth.
> >
> >If all goes according to plan, you'll be joining a club/society in no
> >time!!
> >
> >If however there isn't one in your school/area, then why not find some
> >people who are also gay, and forming your own society, and get approval
> >from an organisation like stonewall.
> >
> >
> >I remember my days at school. Unfortunately I wasn't aware of society
> in
> >full. When I was 16 I was kept inside, because of my mental age, being
> 12
> >at that time, and it affected my studies and my social life. I wasn't
> >good at sports, I was small for my age, and I had problems learning to
> >read and write and do simple arithmetic. I didn't even know about
> being
> >gay, and was being called it, at school, and i didn't understand. One
> >thing which hit me by surprise was that the way i spoke, which was well
> >spoken english, and also the pitch of my voice, which was high at that
> >time, made them believe I was gay, and I wasn't, at that time. Unreal
> >isn't it, but it's true, I tell you.
> >
> >Today I understand fully what it's all about, and wish I could have
> turned
> >back the clocks, and been a bit more mature, but it's not possible.
> >
> >To you, I wish you every success, and anyone else.
> >
> >
> >with reguards.
> >
> >
> >
> >stu.
> > x
> >
> >
> >On Thu, 9 Jul 1998, Jamie G wrote:
> >
> >> Hi there William,
> >> Thanks for your support. Maybe things will work out in the end. Once
> i
> >> get a Boyfriend i will be happy. the rest can just get lost then. I
> >> really wish i had a gay friend at school, that would be so great, but
> it
> >> just isn't going to happen i don't think. :-(! I can keep on hoping
> >> though i guess!
> >> Thanks again,
> >> Jamie
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >Hi Jamey & all you wonderful people out there.
> >> >
> >> >School can be a bitch. I was lucky because I had one gay school
> friend
> >> who went
> >> >through it all with me. We were no Ste and Jamie but we had our
> >> moments.
> >> >
> >> >As to my family: My mother confronted me about it too. I was 21 and
> I
> >> had got
> >> >involved with the gay group at University. I usually wore gay
> badges
> >> and forgot
> >> >to take one off before throwing a shirt in the washing. My mother
> >> found it and
> >> >we had the "It's probably all my fault" scene with both of us (but
> >> mainly me)
> >> >ending up in tears. Unlike your mum she didn't tell my father. I
> told
> >> him
> >> >myself a few years later (in retrospect I have no idea why I waited)
> >> and he was
> >> >okay about it. Not happy, but accepting.
> >> >
> >> >My mother's way of coping with it was to ignore the whole matter.
> It
> >> was never
> >> >discussed. If it came up the subject was changed. Jian and I had
> been
> >> together
> >> >for eight years before they met him and then it was over my body in
> >> intensive
> >> >care after a car accident. I nearly had to die before they accepted
> >> that he even
> >> >existed.
> >> >
> >> >Now they do accept him and I am getting on with them better than
> ever
> >> before.
> >> >
> >> >My brother on the other hand has always been on side and is now
> >> planning to
> >> >arrange a family gathering for our tenth anniversary next year.
> >> >
> >> >Which is all a way of saying stick in there - things can get better.
> If
> >> your
> >> >family can't accept you then remember there are a lot of people in
> the
> >> world who
> >> >will and who will love you.
> >> >
> >> >William
> >> >
> >> >Jamie G wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Hi there Tom!
> >> >> thanks, school is so bad but it is great when you realise that it
> >> isn't
> >> >> just you who has to go through it all. They don't know, they just
> >> take
> >> >> the piss! Ok i don't go out with girls so maybe i am giving the
> game
> >> >> away just a little! I am so glad i have got the internet, if i
> >> couldn't
> >> >> talk it through with you lot i would go mad! my mum is all right
> >> about
> >> >> it so i guess that is something. I live with my mum you see.
> Actually
> >> >> she confronted me with it just like Sandra confronted 'Jamie' in
> the
> >> >> film! I see my dad sometimes and my mum told him. He refuses to
> >> believe
> >> >> it, goes mad at the suggestion that his son may be a 'fucking
> >> pufter',
> >> >> and on the few occasions that he does see me, tries to convert me
> to
> >> >> being 'A real man'! There you go.. what are dads for!
> >> >> Speak soon,
> >> >> Jamey
> >> >
> >> >

*****************************************************

From: "Jamie G"
Subject: Re: btlist: Thanks for the welcome!
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 14:39:29 PDT

hi Stu!
Thanks for the help. I have read the back of Gay Times and checked them
all out but there is nothing! it would bebetter if public transport
around here was cheap and half decent!! Never mind hey, university
soon... i hope! Well a year away at any rate!
loads of love,
jamie

>Hi Jamie
>
>Stu here, and thanks for the comments from the previous letter.
>
>I'm sorry it's difficult finding a society in your area, and I wouldn't
go
>to the toilets up the road, either.
>
>I too am finding it difficult to get involved in societies, but
hopefully
>when I go back to uni, in september (bad news, I've to resit an exam,
>before progressing onto an honours degree in Business iNformation
Systems)
>I'm hopefully gonna be a full time student, and will be able to join
the
>lgb societies there, AGAIN. Last year I was part time, and was unable
to
>make the meetings,and join in all the fun.
>
>If you've got the latest edition of Gay Times, then there's a list at
the
>back, with societies, that may be local to you. I've found a couple ,
for
>example, I live in BRentwood, and therefore, have soceities in Essex,
>being, in Harlow, Chelsmford, not close, but ok to travel too.
>
>Check it out. there may also b some news of societies,
>www.gaytimes.co.uk
>
>see you later mate.
>
>
>
>stu.
>
>
>
>
>On Mon, 13 Jul 1998, Jamie G wrote:
>
>> Hi Stu!
>> My school have a LGB society! No bloody way! All the teachers are
>> homophobic and it is a shit hole! As for local groups, well i went to
>> one once but it was 20 minutes away by train, cost me a fortune to
get
>> there and wasn't really worth it. It would be great to set one up,
but
>> almost impossible... no where to have it, no one to come etc! The
>> nearest thing to a gay meeting place around here is the toilets up
the
>> road and no way am i going there!! i wish i lived in london or
>> something. Thanks for your help though Stu, sounds like you had an
even
>> worse time at school than i do.
>> Loads of love and hopefully speak to you again soon,
>> jamie
>> XXX
>>
>>
>>
>> >Hey Jamie, and hello all.
>> >
>> >
>> >Sorry it's taken a while to respond to this email, but i've been
busy
>> >working.
>> >
>> >Jamie, some advice, if it helps or not.
>> >
>> >I'm sure that a person with our whit and charm, and looks will get a
>> bf,
>> >sooner, than later. I feel that there must be hundreds if not, half
>> the
>> >amount of students at school, who are gay, but haven't let the cat
out
>> of
>> >the bag, so to speak. I was wondering if you'd checked out the
clubs
>> and
>> >event that the school holds, and whether there was a lgb (lesbian
gay
>> and
>> >Bisexual) society within your school ? or outside, locally to you.
>> >
>> >This would benefit both yourself, and them. As there may be others
who
>> >are gay, but haven't told anyone, and have joined a society such as
the
>> >lgb. Usually you can find out if these societies exist or not,
through
>> a
>> >local paper, or from word of mouth.
>> >
>> >If all goes according to plan, you'll be joining a club/society in
no
>> >time!!
>> >
>> >If however there isn't one in your school/area, then why not find
some
>> >people who are also gay, and forming your own society, and get
approval
>> >from an organisation like stonewall.
>> >
>> >
>> >I remember my days at school. Unfortunately I wasn't aware of
society
>> in
>> >full. When I was 16 I was kept inside, because of my mental age,
being
>> 12
>> >at that time, and it affected my studies and my social life. I
wasn't
>> >good at sports, I was small for my age, and I had problems learning
to
>> >read and write and do simple arithmetic. I didn't even know about
>> being
>> >gay, and was being called it, at school, and i didn't understand.
One
>> >thing which hit me by surprise was that the way i spoke, which was
well
>> >spoken english, and also the pitch of my voice, which was high at
that
>> >time, made them believe I was gay, and I wasn't, at that time.
Unreal
>> >isn't it, but it's true, I tell you.
>> >
>> >Today I understand fully what it's all about, and wish I could have
>> turned
>> >back the clocks, and been a bit more mature, but it's not possible.
>> >
>> >To you, I wish you every success, and anyone else.
>> >
>> >
>> >with reguards.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >stu.
>> > x
>> >
>> >
>> >On Thu, 9 Jul 1998, Jamie G wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi there William,
>> >> Thanks for your support. Maybe things will work out in the end.
Once
>> i
>> >> get a Boyfriend i will be happy. the rest can just get lost then.
I
>> >> really wish i had a gay friend at school, that would be so great,
but
>> it
>> >> just isn't going to happen i don't think. :-(! I can keep on
hoping
>> >> though i guess!
>> >> Thanks again,
>> >> Jamie
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >Hi Jamey & all you wonderful people out there.
>> >> >
>> >> >School can be a bitch. I was lucky because I had one gay school
>> friend
>> >> who went
>> >> >through it all with me. We were no Ste and Jamie but we had our
>> >> moments.
>> >> >
>> >> >As to my family: My mother confronted me about it too. I was 21
and
>> I
>> >> had got
>> >> >involved with the gay group at University. I usually wore gay
>> badges
>> >> and forgot
>> >> >to take one off before throwing a shirt in the washing. My
mother
>> >> found it and
>> >> >we had the "It's probably all my fault" scene with both of us
(but
>> >> mainly me)
>> >> >ending up in tears. Unlike your mum she didn't tell my father.
I
>> told
>> >> him
>> >> >myself a few years later (in retrospect I have no idea why I
waited)
>> >> and he was
>> >> >okay about it. Not happy, but accepting.
>> >> >
>> >> >My mother's way of coping with it was to ignore the whole matter.
>> It
>> >> was never
>> >> >discussed. If it came up the subject was changed. Jian and I
had
>> been
>> >> together
>> >> >for eight years before they met him and then it was over my body
in
>> >> intensive
>> >> >care after a car accident. I nearly had to die before they
accepted
>> >> that he even
>> >> >existed.
>> >> >
>> >> >Now they do accept him and I am getting on with them better than
>> ever
>> >> before.
>> >> >
>> >> >My brother on the other hand has always been on side and is now
>> >> planning to
>> >> >arrange a family gathering for our tenth anniversary next year.
>> >> >
>> >> >Which is all a way of saying stick in there - things can get
better.
>> If
>> >> your
>> >> >family can't accept you then remember there are a lot of people
in
>> the
>> >> world who
>> >> >will and who will love you.
>> >> >
>> >> >William
>> >> >
>> >> >Jamie G wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Hi there Tom!
>> >> >> thanks, school is so bad but it is great when you realise that
it
>> >> isn't
>> >> >> just you who has to go through it all. They don't know, they
just
>> >> take
>> >> >> the piss! Ok i don't go out with girls so maybe i am giving the
>> game
>> >> >> away just a little! I am so glad i have got the internet, if i
>> >> couldn't
>> >> >> talk it through with you lot i would go mad! my mum is all
right
>> >> about
>> >> >> it so i guess that is something. I live with my mum you see.
>> Actually
>> >> >> she confronted me with it just like Sandra confronted 'Jamie'
in
>> the
>> >> >> film! I see my dad sometimes and my mum told him. He refuses to
>> >> believe
>> >> >> it, goes mad at the suggestion that his son may be a 'fucking
>> >> pufter',
>> >> >> and on the few occasions that he does see me, tries to convert
me
>> to
>> >> >> being 'A real man'! There you go.. what are dads for!
>> >> >> Speak soon,
>> >> >> Jamey
>> >> >
>> >> >

*****************************************************

From: "Kent ."
Subject: RE: btlist: Great things about being Gay
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 19:51:17 PDT

On Wed, 15 Jul 98, Hannes wrote:
>Hi all (and Another big Hi! to all the newcomers - there are so many, I
might
>leave a name out)

Ditto, oone and all! You're most welcome!!

RE: Steve's idea of posting something from "501 Great Things About
Being Gay", Hannes voted as follows:

>Personally, I wouldn't mind! I'd actually enjoy it. But what you the
others
>think?
>
>Hannes

I also vote "yes" to Steve's suggestion-- a Positive Thought for the Day
sounds nice to me. :)

Kent
who thinks it's great being gay, if being Gay is how you found out about
BT!

>-----Original Message-----
>Subject: btlist: Great things about being Gay
>
>
>I picked up a tiny book today called "501 Great Things About Being
Gay." They
>are actually quite amusing, and in most cases, true. If anyone would
like, I
>could post 1 or 2 every day to the list, just for S&G's. Let me know.
>luvs,
>Steve
>

*****************************************************

Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 21:28:25 -0700
From: Jenny
Subject: btlist: My story

Hi everyone. For those of you on the Fan Fiction list, I will be
sending out a story I wrote to that list as soon as I figure out where
I'm supposed to send it to. Am I supposed to send it to this list or
what?

Thanks,
Jenny

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:40:42 -0700
From: tom
Subject: Re: btlist: Great things about being Gay

I wouldn't mind the list either. I think it's superb.

RE: suits

psychic commercials are the best. I don't believe in the occult or
psychic hotlines, but they are entertaining infomercials. They're a
helluva lot better than that guy with the bow tie who's always jumping
around like he's on crack.

If you can get some free psychic time I want some. I wanna know if they
can give me some Luv advice.

All the gay people here in FW indiana are like attached. It sucks.

JPG

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 23:33:49 +1000
From: Andy
Subject: Re: btlist: My story

Jenny Jo  writes:
>Hi everyone. For those of you on the Fan Fiction list, I will be
>sending out a story I wrote to that list as soon as I figure out where
>I'm supposed to send it to. Am I supposed to send it to this list or
>what?
>
>Thanks,
>Jenny

Hi Jenny,

Instructions for joining the Stories List are on the BT-Stories web site
To save you the hassle of going there, I've just copy that in here...

To subscribe to btfanlist do the following:

send a message to

leave the subject line blank, or put a single . on it (actually, you can
put virtually ANYTHING there, since it is completely ignored)

put in the body of the message the following line:
subscribe btfanlist

Make sure your email program does not add anything before or after that
line (signatures, etc...) If you cannot prevent your email program from
doing so, add 'end' (without the quotes) on a line by itself immediately
after the subscribe line. Send this message and within 2 minutes you should
have a reply telling you that you have been accepted.

So there you have it Jenny. If you don't want to join the list but just
want to send a story you can either send it to this list (I know the others
won't mind that much) or send it to me directly <andy18@netspace.net.au>
and I'll include it on the next update of the BT-Stories Archive.

Cheers,
Andy.

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 09:03:10 -0700
From: Jenny
Subject: Re: btlist: My story

Great, thank you very much. I'll go subscribe to that, and then send my story.
Thanks again Andy,
Jenny

Andy wrote:

> Jenny Jo writes:
> >Hi everyone. For those of you on the Fan Fiction list, I will be
> >sending out a story I wrote to that list as soon as I figure out where
> >I'm supposed to send it to. Am I supposed to send it to this list or
> >what?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Jenny
>
> Hi Jenny,
>
> Instructions for joining the Stories List are on the BT-Stories web site
>
> To save you the hassle of going there, I've just copy that in here...
>
> To subscribe to btfanlist do the following:
>
> send a message to
>
> leave the subject line blank, or put a single . on it (actually, you can
> put virtually ANYTHING there, since it is completely ignored)
>
> put in the body of the message the following line:
> subscribe btfanlist
>
> Make sure your email program does not add anything before or after that
> line (signatures, etc...) If you cannot prevent your email program from
> doing so, add 'end' (without the quotes) on a line by itself immediately
> after the subscribe line. Send this message and within 2 minutes you should
> have a reply telling you that you have been accepted.
>
> So there you have it Jenny. If you don't want to join the list but just
> want to send a story you can either send it to this list (I know the others
> won't mind that much) or send it to me directly <andy18@netspace.net.au>
> and I'll include it on the next update of the BT-Stories Archive.
>
> Cheers,
> Andy.
>

*****************************************************

Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 16:31:58 +1000
From: Andy
Subject: btlist: [UPDATE] BT-Stories Fan Fiction Archive

Hi everyone!

The BT-Stories Fan Ficiton Archive nearly burst at the seams this week with
eleven new stories. Yes that's right, we have an abundance of new and
exciting stories that explore many avenues. A mixture of fiction and
fantasy, some that elaborate more on the screenplay and those that take us
through entirely different scenarios.

In our EXCLUSIVE series "The Gloucester" we're up to #5, with Jamie and Ste
attracting more attention around the bar. Written by Jean, these are
vignettes based on scene 82 of the screenplay.

Sandra's version of the "PFL Scene" discribes the screenplay's scene 50 in
more detail. This week read parts two and three.

Graham starts a new series this week with "Changing Room Dream". As an
added bonus read part two while your at it!

A treat from Joshy this week with four of his short stories including "A
woman's heart is a deep ocean...". With a title like that, one expects Ste
out there on the bow of the Titanic! The other titles are "Beautiful
Lament", "Young Ste", "Claire, Ste, Jamie and Sandra" (which are four
character interpretations from scenes I & II of the screenplay).

William sends in his third story "My Little Git of a Son". Just what was
Sandra thinking when she secretly followed Jamie?

David (from England, not the French one!) has sent a charming story called
"Dream a Little Dream". Have you ever said "Nah, that would never happen in
real life" when you reached the end of the film? Then you must read this.
Don't forget you can pick up cheap copies of the Beautiful Thing Screenplay
and Stageplay in the BT-Stories Bookstore. I said a few weeks back I was
going to include the video, unfortunately, the Amazon Associates program
only offers it as pre-order and very expensive (over $90). So I'll forego
my referal fees on this, in favour of giving you the best deal. The place
to pick up a copy of the video is at <www.reel.com>. While it's in the top
10 best sellers (last time I looked it was #4) you can get it for less than
$20. Both PAL and NTSC versions are available.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Visitors to the BT-Stories site will notice a slight visual difference this
week. I've embedded some "Mouseover" JavaScript in the HTML code. The link
buttons should change slightly when you move the mouse over them. This may
not work on older browers (and Webtv) and in some cases cause slow loading
of the page. The actual links should still work, even if they don't
animate. If not, all the links are at the end of the page...
ie: Stories/ Writers/ Mailing List/ Guestbook/ Awards/ Bookstore/ Chatroom

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

What a busy week...and already I'm building a backlog of stories for next week!

Happy reading,
Andy

*****************************************************

From: ep
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 09:46:56 -0400
Subject: btlist: Web update

A small update today. A Big Kiss to Andre for sending me a copy (via Kent!)
of the Netherlands BT video. The cover looks pretty much like the
Netherlands poster. See it in the Pix section... Video (it's the one all
the way to the right). Click on it for a bigger view.

Of course, there's more to come. I soon hope to have the Canadian and
Italian videos, and there are other treats in store.... but no fair
guessing! ;-)

-Eric

*****************************************************

Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 10:56:18 -0500
From: Brian
Subject: Re: btlist: Web update

At 09:46 17/07/98 -0400, you wrote:
>A small update today. A Big Kiss to Andre for sending me a copy (via Kent!)
>of the Netherlands BT video. The cover looks pretty much like the
>Netherlands poster. See it in the Pix section... Video (it's the one all
>the way to the right). Click on it for a bigger view.
>
>Of course, there's more to come. I soon hope to have the Canadian and
>Italian videos, and there are other treats in store.... but no fair
>guessing! ;-)
>

Hi Eric, and thanks. From your website I just noticed that the cover
on the U.S. CD (which I have :)) differs from the U.K. version. Does
anyone know if the tracks on the C.D. differ at all?

Cheers,

Brian.
(whoose leaving for Chicago in 3 hours, to see the play.. :) )

>-Eric

*****************************************************

From: ep
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 12:56:07 -0400
Subject: Re: btlist: Web update

>Hi Eric, and thanks. From your website I just noticed that the cover
>on the U.S. CD (which I have :)) differs from the U.K. version. Does
>anyone know if the tracks on the C.D. differ at all?
>

The CD's, except for the covers, are the same. The videos, in many cases,
are not:

1st UK release: Widescreen
2nd (current) UK release: Pan & Scan
US release: Pan & Scan (but not as well done as the UK P&S)
Spanish release: Full frame, dubbed in Spanish

There are more, but I haven't researched it all yet!

-Eric

*****************************************************

Date: Sat, 18 Jul 1998 19:49:07 -0400
From: MGB
Subject: btlist: Re: THE BEAUTIFUL CHICAGO PRODUCTION

Sorry, Matt but I dont live in the Chicago area, I live is sw Georgia.
About 7 of us from all over met up there awhile back to see the play and
several of them are definates for a return trip Aug 8-9. One of our number
does live there in Chicago and 2 others live just up the road in Wisconsin,
but Ill leave it up to them to tell you about themselves as I dont feel at
liberty to do so as I dont know them real well.

I loved the humor in the stage play and wonder why so much of it was either
cut or not as understandable in the movie. I realize some scenes (Leah
trying to look into Ste's bathroom) were not possible due to the way the
flats are setup. I loved the whole Cagney and Lacey bits!!!!!! And though
it was far from humorous, I though the PFL scence from the play was just
soooooo much better! When Jamie laid his head on Ste's back...........Oh
sweet memories!!!!
Anyway!
Cheers all!
MGB

matthew  wrote:

> Good comment, MGB. Do you live in Chicago or the Chicago area? I just
> bought a new home out in the suburbs and will move there permanently in
> about 4 years -- for now it's a vacation home. So I would be glad to
> meet a fellow BT fan in the area if you would like to meet me.
>
> It is interesting that the Chicago production is sponsored by the
> British Tourist Authority which is running a contest throught the play
> -- the prize is a trip to England. I filled out an application. It would
> be nice to win.
>

*****************************************************

From: "Neil
Subject: btlist: Thamesmead
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 18:00:56 +0100

Hi all,

I took a trip to Thamesmead on my motorbike this afternoon, my first. The
weather was really hot and sunny as in the film. Anyway, I new vaguely
where Tavy bridge was by looking in my AtoZ before I left home (Brixton).
When I got to Thamesmead I easily found the Tavy Bridge area. It was like I
had already been there, like a second home. It was amazing being there,
seeing all the sites from the film. I eventually located the three flats
and strolled down the balcony. As I passed what was Jamie and Sandra's flat
a little girl went in and I got a peek inside. It seemed to have completely
changed since the film - not as bright and colourful. The "peek" was only a
couple of seconds so I really can't be too accurate or tell you anymore. I
then went to the Gloucester had a quick drink (yes I saw the poster).

If anybody has not been to Thamesmead I would strongly recommend a visit.
Maybe the next BT meeting would be an ideal opportunity. I will definitely
go!

Happy, happy, happy. :)

Love

Neil
xxx

P.S. I have just watched the film again in a completely new light!

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 15:02:16 -0200
From: wabana
Subject: btlist: new

Hi All,

I am new to the list. I only saw BT on video recently when I was in the
city and on holidays from my job. I had seen it in a flyer and hoped the
local video stores would carry it here but they did not.

Anyway, when I saw the movie, I was in awe. I cried, laughed, etc. I tried
to purchase it but could not find a copy anywhere so I taped it before I
returned home. I have watched it another 2 times since. I would also love
to own the soundtrack.

I think it is the first honest movie about being gay and the issues
surrounding it. It is also the first movie I have seen that was absent of
sterotypes. Hollywoood movies also seem to focus in on sterotypes or
negative themes. I am tired of movies about AIDS or screwed up gay people.

Now I cannot get the movie out of my head. When I returned to my home town,
I discovered all of these sites and was so pleased. I have been on mirc
also on #Beautiful-Thing. I have not tried the Dutch site yet as I have
been uncertain about the language being used. I can only speak English. I
attempted to join two of the lists and have managed to only get on this
one. I have recieved no response from the other.

As for myself. I am 32 and live in Newfoundland, Canada. I work as a mental
health counsellor in a hospital and am also studying my masters in social
work part-time. I am off from my masters for the summer. This week I am
house/dog sitting for a friend until next Sunday but am trying to get back
to my pc as much as possible.

I know this is a long email and I am not usually as long winded :).
However, I just wanted to say a few things where it is my first. I really
look forward to participating on here and I am ever so happy to meet other
fans of the movie. Also, as I have discovered, BT fans seem to be world
wide and I can't wait to get to know others from different countries.

Hope to correspond with you soon.

Scott

*****************************************************

From: "Jamie G"
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 11:24:33 PDT

Hi Neil!
I too have made the trip to Thamesmead! How did you find the three
flats? What numbers are they?!!
Speak soon,
Jamie

*****************************************************

From: "Neil
Subject: RE: btlist: Thamesmead
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 20:18:48 +0100

Hi Jamie,

I recognised some stairs leading above the shops there (where Jamie is
sitting drinking wine/champers when Ste comes down the said stairs just
before they dance at the end of the film.) I also remembered that someone
had said that the flats were above the shops. So up I went and hey presto I
came out by the rubbish chute and then on to the flats. I can't remember
the flat numbers but I don't think that they relate to the same numbers as
used in the film. Can somebody clarify this?

Welcome Scott. You'll never meet a nicer bunch of people, even if I do say
so myself :)

Bye

Love

Neil
X

-----Original Message-----
Jamie G
Sent: 19 July 1998 19:25
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead

Hi Neil!
I too have made the trip to Thamesmead! How did you find the three
flats? What numbers are they?!!
Speak soon,
Jamie

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 20:33:34 +0100
From: w
Subject: Re: btlist: new

Hi Scott

As an Australian who lives in London may I say Welcome to the List
Yes this is a truly international list, it may seem unusual but a beautiful
and honest story about being a teenager on a normal english housing
estate,has actuaually affected the lives of soo many people both gay and
straight around the planet. Its amazing how we realise that our lives are
so similar that we recognise things that happen in Beautiful Thing in our
own lives.
Once again welcome

Warwick

At 15:02 19/07/98 -0200, you wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>I am new to the list. I only saw BT on video recently when I was in the
>city and on holidays from my job. I had seen it in a flyer and hoped the
>local video stores would carry it here but they did not.
>
>Anyway, when I saw the movie, I was in awe. I cried, laughed, etc. I tried
>to purchase it but could not find a copy anywhere so I taped it before I
>returned home. I have watched it another 2 times since. I would also love
>to own the soundtrack.
>
>I think it is the first honest movie about being gay and the issues
>surrounding it. It is also the first movie I have seen that was absent of
>sterotypes. Hollywoood movies also seem to focus in on sterotypes or
>negative themes. I am tired of movies about AIDS or screwed up gay people.
>
>Now I cannot get the movie out of my head. When I returned to my home town,
>I discovered all of these sites and was so pleased. I have been on mirc
>also on #Beautiful-Thing. I have not tried the Dutch site yet as I have
>been uncertain about the language being used. I can only speak English. I
>attempted to join two of the lists and have managed to only get on this
>one. I have recieved no response from the other.
>
>As for myself. I am 32 and live in Newfoundland, Canada. I work as a mental
>health counsellor in a hospital and am also studying my masters in social
>work part-time. I am off from my masters for the summer. This week I am
>house/dog sitting for a friend until next Sunday but am trying to get back
>to my pc as much as possible.
>
>I know this is a long email and I am not usually as long winded :).
>However, I just wanted to say a few things where it is my first. I really
>look forward to participating on here and I am ever so happy to meet other
>fans of the movie. Also, as I have discovered, BT fans seem to be world
>wide and I can't wait to get to know others from different countries.
>
>Hope to correspond with you soon.
>
>Scott
>Stephenville, NF (Canada)
>
>
>This message was brought to you by the Beautiful Thing mailing list (btlist)
>
>
Warwick

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 17:33:41 -0200
From: wabana
Subject: RE: btlist: Thamesmead

At 08:18 PM 19/07/98 +0100, you wrote:
>
>Welcome Scott. You'll never meet a nicer bunch of people, even if I do say
>so myself :)
>
>Bye
>
>Love
>
>Neil
>Speak soon,
>Jamie

Thanks Jamie....I feel welcome already.

Love Scott

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 17:35:11 -0200
From: wabana
Subject: Re: btlist: new

At 08:33 PM 19/07/98 +0100, you wrote:
>Hi Scott
>
>As an Australian who lives in London may I say Welcome to the List
>Yes this is a truly international list, it may seem unusual but a beautiful
>and honest story about being a teenager on a normal english housing
>estate,has actuaually affected the lives of soo many people both gay and
>straight around the planet. Its amazing how we realise that our lives are
>so similar that we recognise things that happen in Beautiful Thing in our
>own lives.
>Once again welcome
>
>Warwick

Yes you are right re: similarities.

Scott

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 17:42:16 -0200
From: wabana
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead

At 03:42 PM 19/07/98 -0400, you wrote:
>I guess I'll finally introduce myself after lurking about for a couple of
>months. My name is Chris, and I live and work in Washington, D.C. I
first saw
>BT last summer when it first came out on video in the US. I watched it at
least
>once a day for a month and have probably seen it around 50 times (I know
that it
>is no record among this group:). It was the first time I had ever seen a gay
>relationship between kids relatively close to my own age (I was still in
college
>at the time - I just graduated!) portrayed normally, and it blew me away. By
>normal I mean that it didn't trot out any of the stereotypes that fuel
>homophobic sentiment in this country and around the world. It was just
two kids
>who fell in love. It finally made being gay seem very real and normal to me,
>and I finally decided to come out to my friends. Though it did take me
another
>five months to do that, I am very glad that I did. All have been
supportive to
>different degrees. My family will have to wait however.
>
>I was on the very first discussion list but lost track after it crashed. I'm
>glad I happened to run accross this one. I also used to get on IRC, but this
>last year at school was incredibly busy. In any case, a big hello to
everyone!
>
>Now what propmted me to finally write. I seem to remember that either
Jamie's
>or Ste's flat number in the movie was 69 which I found humorous for obvious
>reasons. Were the numbers on the flats you saw different, Neil?
>
>Later guys,
>
>Chris

Chris,

I feel the same way as you did about the stereotypes etc. that have been in
other movies. I wish this movie was available to me when I was a teen. We
need more role models like this.

Take care,
Scott

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 15:42:18 -0400
From: Christopher
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead

I guess I'll finally introduce myself after lurking about for a couple of
months. My name is Chris, and I live and work in Washington, D.C. I first saw
BT last summer when it first came out on video in the US. I watched it at least
once a day for a month and have probably seen it around 50 times (I know that it
is no record among this group:). It was the first time I had ever seen a gay
relationship between kids relatively close to my own age (I was still in college
at the time - I just graduated!) portrayed normally, and it blew me away. By
normal I mean that it didn't trot out any of the stereotypes that fuel
homophobic sentiment in this country and around the world. It was just two kids
who fell in love. It finally made being gay seem very real and normal to me,
and I finally decided to come out to my friends. Though it did take me another
five months to do that, I am very glad that I did. All have been supportive to
different degrees. My family will have to wait however.

I was on the very first discussion list but lost track after it crashed. I'm
glad I happened to run accross this one. I also used to get on IRC, but this
last year at school was incredibly busy. In any case, a big hello to everyone!

Now what propmted me to finally write. I seem to remember that either Jamie's
or Ste's flat number in the movie was 69 which I found humorous for obvious
reasons. Were the numbers on the flats you saw different, Neil?

Later guys,

Chris

Neil  wrote:

> Hi Jamie,
>
> I recognised some stairs leading above the shops there (where Jamie is
> sitting drinking wine/champers when Ste comes down the said stairs just
> before they dance at the end of the film.) I also remembered that someone
> had said that the flats were above the shops. So up I went and hey presto I
> came out by the rubbish chute and then on to the flats. I can't remember
> the flat numbers but I don't think that they relate to the same numbers as
> used in the film. Can somebody clarify this?
>
> Welcome Scott. You'll never meet a nicer bunch of people, even if I do say
> so myself :)
>
> Bye
>
> Love
>
> Neil
> X
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Jamie G
> Sent: 19 July 1998 19:25
> Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead
>
> Hi Neil!
> I too have made the trip to Thamesmead! How did you find the three
> flats? What numbers are they?!!
> Speak soon,
> Jamie
>

*****************************************************

From: "Jeff"
Subject: btlist: Thamesmead Numbers
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 15:00:09 -0500

If my foggy memory is working correctly: In real life, 19, 20 and 21. In
our movie fantasy world, 68, 69 and 70. (Debating point: They really knew
they were playing on the 70 minus 1 thing) In the Chicago play, 15, 16 and
17. (Get it? 16 going on 17.)

Call me the queen of BT Numerology.

Jeff

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 21:17:29 +0100
From: w f
Subject: btlist: BT in Birmingham UK

Im Sending this again I dont know if it made it last week

Hi all you Beautifull Things

I have just been mailed by Peter  about the performances at the Wellington Hotel in Birmingham.
He Said
Yes, the shows are on Wed and Thurs, 5th/6th August, at 8pm in the
Wellington Hotel (well pub) on Bristol St, Birmingham, opposite the
dome nightclub. Simply a pre-Edinburgh show in the intimacy of a pub
backroom, therefore the set has had to be cut down a little (as has
the stage space - watch the actors fall over each other - only
kidding!) Tickets cost 5 pounds, and will be on sale on the door.

As I work in Birmingham during the week Im definatly going, I was just wondering if any one else is planning

to go. Perhaps we could meet up peter has said that he may be able to hold tickets at the door if I want

Warwick

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 21:23:00 +0100
From: w f
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead

Wow
Sunday night and closet doors are flying open around the world.
This is the only list to be on, Welcome Chris this movie has been having
the same effect every where

Warwick

At 15:42 19/07/98 -0400, you wrote:
>I guess I'll finally introduce myself after lurking about for a couple of
>months. My name is Chris, and I live and work in Washington, D.C. I
first saw
>BT last summer when it first came out on video in the US. I watched it at
least
>once a day for a month and have probably seen it around 50 times (I know
that it
>is no record among this group:). It was the first time I had ever seen a gay
>relationship between kids relatively close to my own age (I was still in
college
>at the time - I just graduated!) portrayed normally, and it blew me away. By
>normal I mean that it didn't trot out any of the stereotypes that fuel
>homophobic sentiment in this country and around the world. It was just
two kids
>who fell in love. It finally made being gay seem very real and normal to me,
>and I finally decided to come out to my friends. Though it did take me
another
>five months to do that, I am very glad that I did. All have been
supportive to
>different degrees. My family will have to wait however.
>
>I was on the very first discussion list but lost track after it crashed. I'm
>glad I happened to run accross this one. I also used to get on IRC, but this
>last year at school was incredibly busy. In any case, a big hello to
everyone!
>
>Now what propmted me to finally write. I seem to remember that either
Jamie's
>or Ste's flat number in the movie was 69 which I found humorous for obvious
>reasons. Were the numbers on the flats you saw different, Neil?
>
>Later guys,
>
>Chris
>
>Neil  wrote:
>
>> Hi Jamie,
>>
>> I recognised some stairs leading above the shops there (where Jamie is
>> sitting drinking wine/champers when Ste comes down the said stairs just
>> before they dance at the end of the film.) I also remembered that someone
>> had said that the flats were above the shops. So up I went and hey
presto I
>> came out by the rubbish chute and then on to the flats. I can't remember
>> the flat numbers but I don't think that they relate to the same numbers as
>> used in the film. Can somebody clarify this?
>>
>> Welcome Scott. You'll never meet a nicer bunch of people, even if I do say
>> so myself :)
>>
>> Bye
>>
>> Love
>>
>> Neil
>> X
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> Jamie G
>> Sent: 19 July 1998 19:25
>> To: btlist@tenr.com
>> Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead
>>
>> Hi Neil!
>> I too have made the trip to Thamesmead! How did you find the three
>> flats? What numbers are they?!!
>> Speak soon,
>> Jamie
>>
>
>
Warwick

*****************************************************

From: DLawr
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 16:24:52 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead Numbers

Apparently, the numbers are 268, 269 and 270.

269 has no sexual significance, it's the number of the bus that Jonathan
Harvey used to take to work.

If you look closely on the doors (as we did back in June!) you can still see
the holes in the door where the extra digit used to be.

I like the idea of 15, 16, 17 though!

Love from David,
who's a Maths teacher and so feels that he HAS to know about these things!

*****************************************************

From: "Jeff"
Subject: btlist: Trivia
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 16:13:27 -0500

Thanks for the correction. I should have known.

So, here are some tidbits of trivia about BT gleaned from the movie, the
play and from a visit to Thamesmead. A lot of the old timers are going to
know these, especially Eric, since I was peppering him with these questions
as we walked around Thamesmead in October. Email me, if you wish, with your
answers. Otherwise, keep them to yourselves.

1) What nationality is Ronnie Pearce? (No, not British)

2) What were the three flats in the film used as until just before BT was
filmed? (Hint: Not as flats.)

3) What is the notable thing about Sophie Stanton, who played Louise in the
movie?

4) What does Johnny Lee Miller of "Hackers" and "Trainspotting" fame have
to do with BT?

5) What British crime serial (that shows in the United States) featured
Glen Berry AND Scott Neal AND Linda Harvey AND John Benfield (Rodney Barr,
the brewery official)?

6) What shows are Glen Berry and Scott Neal currently appearing in? Extra
credit: What two movies feature Ben Daniels in a role this summer?

7) What are the tall buildings in Thamesmead called?

8) How much was each bystander supposedly paid during the Dance With Me
scene?

9) The chase and kiss scene supposedly took place in Abbey Wood, above
Thamesmead, but the actual filming took place in what other Wood? (Spelling
counts here, especially for Eric.)

10) Who is the editor of the Thamesmead Gazette, the online newspaper?

11) In the movie, Miss Chuahan keeps calling to report on Jamie, but in the
play, what is her name?

12) What is Ste's favourite football team?

There are more... I'm only now beginning to collect

Jeff

-----Original Message-----
From: DLawr
Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 3:26 p.m.
Subject: Re: btlist: Thamesmead Numbers

>Apparently, the numbers are 268, 269 and 270.
>
>269 has no sexual significance, it's the number of the bus that Jonathan
>Harvey used to take to work.
>
>If you look closely on the doors (as we did back in June!) you can still
see
>the holes in the door where the extra digit used to be.
>
>I like the idea of 15, 16, 17 though!
>
>Love from David,
>who's a Maths teacher and so feels that he HAS to know about these things!
>

*****************************************************

From: Donald
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 18:17:29 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: Trivia

HEY, no fair, testing us with no intention to deliver any answers is just not
right. Please let us know what the correct answers are...PLEASE???
Thanks,

*****************************************************

From: "Jeff"
Subject: btlist: Good things come to those who wait
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 17:45:11 -0500

Ask Neil. He played, and I sent him the answer key. One will be sent on
the list when sufficient time has elapsed. Resume testing.

Be told!

Jeff
-----Original Message-----
From: Donald
Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 5:23 p.m.
Subject: Re: btlist: Trivia

>HEY, no fair, testing us with no intention to deliver any answers is just
not
>right. Please let us know what the correct answers are...PLEASE???
>Thanks,
>

*****************************************************

From: Donald
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 19:14:55 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: Good things come to those who wait

aaaack
I am racking my brain on a fwe of them. LOL
You have selected some difficult questions.
:-)

*****************************************************

From: merm
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 19:25:08 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: btlist: Greetings BT lovers

I just rejoined the list after several long business trips that lasted
since early May.

I saw the new BT production in Chicago, not once but twice. I wrote a
very positive review on the newsgroup. Unfortunately a few comments in
the review were taken as an insult to Thamesmead. I think that is sad.

Nevertheless, I loved the play -- it was even more enjoyable than the
film, which is hard to believe. Part of the power, of course, comes from
the fact that the live play puts you right there with the characters.
Another reason is that the dialogue is so much clearer on the stage. And
a third reason is that the humor of the play comes across in this
production.

So many of the really funny lines are lost in the film because of the
thick accents or the dour way in which the lines are delivered. Perhaps
the film director wanted to emphasize the pain of the characters. But
there really is a great deal of humor in the story. At the same time,
the touching nature of the relationships still comes across.

And, as I said in the newsgroup review, I am glad that the first
American production is in my old hometown of Chicago. MATT

*****************************************************

Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 18:25:36 -0500
From: Brian
Subject: Re: btlist: Gay Christianity

Hi Everyone,

Just a quite note. I thought a couple of acticles on the BBC News website
might interest some. There is a big international conference of Anglican
bishops in Canterbury and one of the issues is homosexuality. The following
acticles may be worth a read.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_135000/135188.stm
Extracts:
<<Canon Elizabeth Kaeton, from Newark, New Jersey,
USA, has become the first (openly Ed.) lesbian priest to
celebrate
the Eucharist in the UK, at a service in central London.>>

<<Christina Sumners, a curate at Holy Trinity and St
Mary's in Guildford, edited the book, Lesbian and Gay
Christians Called to Full Humanity: Letters to the
Lambeth Bishops.

She said: "The bishops should recognise that lesbians
and gays are full members of the Church, not the
second-class citizens that they are treated as now." >>

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_135000/135344.stm
Extract:
<<Anglican brethren meet among divisions>>

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/newsid_134000/134465.stm
Extract:
<<The Lambeth Conference happens once every 10
years. At the last Lambeth Conference women
priests was the main talking point, this time it is
likely to be attitudes to homosexuality.

The church in the United States has gone further in
accepting gays and in particular gay priests than
anywhere else in the world. The BBC's religious
affairs correspondent Emily Buchanan has been to
the diocese of Newark near New York. >>

Brian.

*****************************************************

From: "Jeff"
Subject: Re: btlist: Beautiful things come to those who wait
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:55:15 -0500

I tragically misspoke on question No. 10. I should say, which Thamesmead
resident and also an editor of the Thamesmead Gazette gives wonderful tours
of the town with his lovely wife? Extra credit for the name of his lovely
wife.

Jeff
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff
Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 5:48 p.m.
Subject: btlist: Good things come to those who wait

>Ask Neil. He played, and I sent him the answer key. One will be sent on
>the list when sufficient time has elapsed. Resume testing.
>
>Be told!
>
>Jeff
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Donald
>Date: Sunday, July 19, 1998 5:23 p.m.
>Subject: Re: btlist: Trivia
>
>
>>HEY, no fair, testing us with no intention to deliver any answers is just
>not
>>right. Please let us know what the correct answers are...PLEASE???
>>Thanks,
>>

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 02:37:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Neil
Subject: btlist: Accents in the Film

Hi Matthew

You wrote:
>So many of the really funny lines are lost in the film because of the
thick accents or the dour way in which the lines are delivered. Perhaps
the film director wanted to emphasize the pain of the characters

The accents are true to that part (south East) of London. If a
clearer dialect was required then the film would have had to be
located in somewhere less working class (working class accents in
England are generally very strong). If this was so, the theme of it
being possible to come from a normal background and be gay and
experience love being a Beautiful Thing would have been lost. This
along with the unequal age of consent (then) in the UK were apparently
up most in Jonathan Harvey's mind when writing the play. Also, the
director of the film is the original director of the play and Jonathan
was very pleased with the outcome of the film.

I hope this helps.

Love

Neil
xxx

---matthew wrote:
>
> I just rejoined the list after several long business trips that lasted
> since early May.
>
> I saw the new BT production in Chicago, not once but twice. I wrote a
> very positive review on the newsgroup. Unfortunately a few comments in
> the review were taken as an insult to Thamesmead. I think that is
sad.
>
> Nevertheless, I loved the play -- it was even more enjoyable than the
> film, which is hard to believe. Part of the power, of course, comes
from
> the fact that the live play puts you right there with the characters.
> Another reason is that the dialogue is so much clearer on the stage.
And
> a third reason is that the humor of the play comes across in this
> production.
>
> So many of the really funny lines are lost in the film because of the
> thick accents or the dour way in which the lines are delivered.
Perhaps
> the film director wanted to emphasize the pain of the characters. But
> there really is a great deal of humor in the story. At the same time,
> the touching nature of the relationships still comes across.
>
> And, as I said in the newsgroup review, I am glad that the first
> American production is in my old hometown of Chicago. MATT
>

*****************************************************

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