Part Four

Nicky

10cc, I mean, I used to snigger at school, as the conventional wisdom on the name. That used to be the average male ejaculation - I'm still sniggering about it, actually

Graham

I know, I noticed that. Actually the average male ejaculation is 9cc

Nicky

Aahh, hence one better.

Graham

But I hate to disillusion people, I mean, obviously that's the most popular one because it's the most terribly shocking version, but in fact, er, the name was thought up by Jonathan King, who ran the first label that we were on, and er, he was coming up to see us to listen to some stuff that we'd recorded, and we didn't have a name and he said "I've got a name for you. I had a dream last night, and"

Nicky

What sort of dream was it then?

Graham

Not the sort of dream you're referring to, and er, he said he was standing in front of Hammersmith Odeon, and up there it said 10cc, so we said "Oh, we'll have that"

Nicky

Hmm, he was your Svengali, wasn't he?

Graham

Yes

Nicky

Before you actually...

Eric

We'd recorded a track called Waterfall, which was the B-side to Rubber Bullets and taken it round to every record company we could find, and they all turned it down, and we also had Rubber Bullets in the background too, and Jonathan King used to want to manage the Mindbenders back in the '60s and he'd just started UK Records. I rang him and said "Would you like to listen to these tracks?" I played him the tracks and he said "It's a smash, Rubber Bullets is a hit record" and then the story about the name, what's the group called, it was all true.

Graham

In fact there's a very interesting story connected to what Eric has just said, because we were a very democratic band. So, whoever wrote the A-side, the other writers would write the B-side. So Eric and I had written Waterfall but we didn't have a B-side and because we thought there was another record label that was interested in it, we thought we should do a B-side, and the B-side of that record was... Donna

Nicky

Donna, Oh Donna

Graham

Our first single

Nicky

Which was the sort of rock 'n roll pastiche

Graham

Yes

Nicky

I always thought it sounded a bit like Oh Darling by the Beatles

Graham

Quite right. It wasn't a rip-off, it was more a sort of nod in their direction, a token of great, um, what's the word I'm looking for?

Nicky

Respect?

Graham

Respect, yes

Eric

I remember going to see Wings at the Free trade Hall in Manchester, and we were talking to Paul afterwards and he said, er, I know where you got that Donna from!

Nicky

Well, a nod's as good as a wink. Can you spot the difference?

Donna - Oh, Darling

Nicky

It's Graham Gouldman and Eric Stewart with me tonight. After it all sort of '82, '83, through until well, you did your stuff Graham, with Wax, it was a lean time for 10cc, wasn't it?

Graham

Well, it was about as lean as you can get - it didn't exist

Nicky

Very meagre, very meagre

Graham

It was pencil thin

Nicky

Yes it was. You didn't exist and you did all that bit with Wax. I mean, some good songs came out of that. Not too much commercial success certainly this side of the Atlantic

Graham

Erm, Bridge To Your Heart did, that did very well.

Nicky

Right Between The Eyes was a very good song

Graham

Actually that did very well. It was number one in Spain for 6 months

Nicky

Number one for six months?

Graham

It was unbelievable

Nicky

That was Bryan Adams proportions

Graham

It wouldn't go away

Right Between The Eyes

Graham

We did three albums as Wax and, um, it was getting increasingly difficult to work together because Andrew was living in LA and I was living in London. It was hard to sort of pop over with an idea for a song, and, er, in fact, right before the idea of doing a new 10cc album came up, we decided that if we didn't have a big hit from the last album that we did, then we would call it a day as Wax, and that in fact happened. So it was a kind of coincidence that finished and then the offer of doing a 10cc album came along.

Nicky

And all this time, Eric, you were doing quite a lot of work with Paul McCartney

Eric

Yes, I did. I guested on two of his albums, Tug Of War and Pipes Of Peace, and then wrote most of the songs with him on Press To Play

Nicky

And you were in Give My Regards To Broad Street, weren't you?

Eric

Yes, I acted in that

Nicky

Yes

Eric

But they cut my word out though

Nicky

But you didn't get an Oscar though?

Graham

What was the word you said?

Eric

"Excuse me" See? Brilliant, wasn't it! Still sounds good, very original.

Nicky

Maybe if it had been left in, the film would have been more kindly reviewed by the critics 'cause it was slashed to pieces, wasn't it?

Eric

It was, yes. We had fun making it

Nicky

Do you think it was a good film?

Eric

I don't think the story was very good, the music was fabulous, some of the filming was brilliant but the story was very shallow.

Nicky

Have you seen it, Graham?

Graham

Yes I saw it in LA actually, when it came out.

Nicky

You enjoy it?

Graham

No. I think it was a mistake, we all know that.

Nicky

It brings us nicely to a track you both wrote with Paul on the new album, Don't Break The Promises. Is that the first time? I mean, I know you, Eric, you've worked with him a lot but was that the first time you've worked with him, Graham?

Graham

Well, actually, I never actually worked with him, because it was a song that Eric and Paul had started during the Press To Play period

Nicky

Oh right

Graham

Obviously Eric's always liked it but it was unfinished, and, um, Eric played it to me and said "what do you think?". It sounded fantastic, it obviously needed some work doing to it which I was very glad to do

Don't Break The Promises

Nicky

Eric Stewart and Graham Gouldman are with me tonight. So Lol and Kevin are back on this album, 10cc...meanwhile, albeit in a backing vocal, and on one occasion lead vocal, capacity but when they actually split from you in 1976 and the whole of this schism happened, er, they went off to do their Gizmo thing, didn't they?

Graham

Yes

Nicky

Well, there must have been more to it than that, there must have been some acrimony and there must have been differences?

Graham

There was no real acrimony. I think it wasn't just the Gizmo, I think they were kind of, my feeling is that they got kind of bored with the sort of writing - recording - touring thing.

Nicky

Although they did continue to make records though

Graham

Yeah, but it was really the record Consequences which turned out to be a three album set that was really like a huge demo' for the Gizmo

Nicky

Was it, did you think it was any good?

Graham

Oh it had some fantastic things on it, that record. Unbelievable.

Nicky

Any bits of it that stick out, that you can think of?

Graham

There's Da dum bum bum bum bum - clap clap clap clap - ba bum bum bum bum bum. That was a good bit.

Nicky

Oh, you mean this bit?

Plays an assortment of Consequences music

Nicky

There's a little bit of Godley & Crème, and your relationships with them, obviously they've been working on this album with you, singing, but are they still good? Do you think there could still be that coming together again whereby they write songs and you write songs and it's the old 10cc, you think that could ever happen

Graham

It would be very nice if that were to happen, I think it would be great, it would be nice to record together properly, be in the studio together, but whether it will or not, you know, they have their own commitments, but it would be nice.

Nicky

They've got all their video bit, haven't they?

Graham

Yes and Lol directed a film that is out here called "The Lunatic"

Nicky

Well it's been fascinating having you in here to speak tonight, Eric and Graham, and I think I'll play another one off the new album to finish with. Anything you particularly like that I haven't played so far?

Eric

Yeah, there's a track which is going to be our next single from the new album called Welcome To Paradise. It's another sneak into the reggae field for us.

Nicky

Well, I tell you what, we could do a little segue here with Dreadlock Holiday, couldn't we?

Graham

Excellent idea

Nicky

Would that work?

Graham

Yes

Nicky

Eric and Graham, thanks a lot

Eric

Thank you

Graham

Thank you

Welcome To Paradise - Dreadlock Holiday

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