Email Archive Page 83

From: Tea1cup
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 19:05:55 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: Re: curious

Hey Stu,

Great letter!! Mr. Clinton is very gay positive, but he has a Congress that is
not. But your letter was beautiful! Thanks.

cheers, Bert

*****************************************************

Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 20:48:37 -0800
From: Bruce
Subject: btlist: Re: curious/age of consent laws

Stu, on behalf of my fellow Americans I thank you for writing that letter!
The U.S. has a patchwork of age of consent laws, from 14 in states like
Hawaii to 18 in states like California. It's extremely confusing but I
believe the states think it is within their power to decide what the age
should be, not the federal government. And I think that's the way it will
stay in the foreseeable future.

What's even worse, though, is that many states still have sodomy laws on
the books. Some apply specifically to homosexual acts while others target
gays and straights. Technically they are rarely enforced, but they could
be used to harass and intimidate gays if the local authorities really
wanted to. That's why many people are trying to get the laws repealed.

I have a question for the UK folks: now that the age of consent for gay
males has been lowered does this mean that 16 and 17-year-olds can appear
nude in magazines and videotapes? In the US they have to be 18 regardless
of the local age of consent but someone told me that in Germany, where the
age of consent is supposed to be 14, someone of age can legally pose nude
in magazines and perform in "adult" videos.

I'm just curious about this. Sorry to veer sharply off the subject!

cheers,

Bruce

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 2 Jul 1998 14:19:02 +0100 (BST)
From: Stu
Subject: Re: btlist: Re: curious

Hi Bert, and all.

Thanks for the comments, with the letter I sent to Mr Clinton. He will be
happy, I'm sure.

I can't write letter's well enough to say what I mean, but It's good
enough.

Thanks once again.

love

stu
x

On Wed, 1 Jul 1998 Tea1cup wrote:

> Hey Stu,
>
> Great letter!! Mr. Clinton is very gay positive, but he has a Congress that is
> not. But your letter was beautiful! Thanks.
>
> cheers, Bert
>

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 2 Jul 1998 14:22:15 +0100 (BST)
From: Stu
Subject: Re: btlist: Re: curious/age of consent laws

Hi Bruce and fellow Americans.

Well it seems that the letter I wrote to the President was ok, after all.
And I thought people would criticise me on how I wrote it, which they
didn't and I therefore thank you all from the bottom of my heart.

I am deeply in thanks for your comments, and hope that the states and many
other countries in the same scene, can spread equality to all.

Thanks

love

stu.
x

On Wed, 1 Jul 1998, Bruce wrote:

>
> Stu, on behalf of my fellow Americans I thank you for writing that letter!
> The U.S. has a patchwork of age of consent laws, from 14 in states like
> Hawaii to 18 in states like California. It's extremely confusing but I
> believe the states think it is within their power to decide what the age
> should be, not the federal government. And I think that's the way it will
> stay in the foreseeable future.
>
> What's even worse, though, is that many states still have sodomy laws on
> the books. Some apply specifically to homosexual acts while others target
> gays and straights. Technically they are rarely enforced, but they could
> be used to harass and intimidate gays if the local authorities really
> wanted to. That's why many people are trying to get the laws repealed.
>
> I have a question for the UK folks: now that the age of consent for gay
> males has been lowered does this mean that 16 and 17-year-olds can appear
> nude in magazines and videotapes? In the US they have to be 18 regardless
> of the local age of consent but someone told me that in Germany, where the
> age of consent is supposed to be 14, someone of age can legally pose nude
> in magazines and perform in "adult" videos.
>
> I'm just curious about this. Sorry to veer sharply off the subject!
>
> cheers,
>
> Bruce
>
>

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 2 Jul 1998 17:57:08 +0100 (BST)
From: Chris
Subject: Re: btlist: Re: curious/age of consent laws

On Wed, 1 Jul 1998, Bruce Fairbanks wrote:

> I have a question for the UK folks: now that the age of consent for gay
> males has been lowered does this mean that 16 and 17-year-olds can appear
> nude in magazines and videotapes? In the US they have to be 18 regardless
> of the local age of consent but someone told me that in Germany, where the
> age of consent is supposed to be 14, someone of age can legally pose nude
> in magazines and perform in "adult" videos.

For the UK, to pose in and buy "adult" magazines is 18. Regarless of
gender. In germany you have to be 18 to pose for them if someone other
than the model takes the pictures , but pictures taken by the model (they
have the canera release on a long cord) i think you only have to be 14.

--
Chris

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 2 Jul 1998 16:16:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: CARMEN
Subject: btlist: movies...

Hi all!

Tory here...:-) I'm another one of those "lurkers" in the group... I just
haven't really had time to write... but I have been reading since this
newest list started up!:-)

Anyways... Tuesday, I went to the movies to see Mulan, cause I'd been told
it was really *really* good (it is).. and I looked at the marqee, and it
had Mulan in 2 theatres, three other films that I recognised, ( but now
for the life of me can't remember!) and one that I didn't.. Called Passion
in the Desert... and I went... gee... I wonder what that's about... so I
bought my ticket for Mulan, went in.. and since I was a bit early... I
looked at soe of the posters.. and saw one for "passion in the Desert...
so I went to see... and went "Oh my God!" because Guess who was smack in
the middle of the poster...:-) I had *completely forgotten about Ben
Daniels' latest movie!

Anyways... I was just wondering what it was about if anyone happened to
know, or if anyone had seen it yet...
Thank you all!
tory

*****************************************************

Date: Thu, 02 Jul 1998 18:55:07 -0400
From: Eric
Subject: Re: btlist: movies...
a>

I had *completely forgotten about Ben
>Daniels' latest movie!

Passion in the Desert is a very good movie... I saw it a few weeks ago.
It's about an officer (Ben) in the French military in the 1800's in Egypt.
He becomes lost in the desert and becomes verrrrry friendly with a leopard.
Fascinating stuff. Ben also spends quite a bit of time totally naked, if
totally naked men appeal to any o' ya!

For more info, visit their website at http://www.flf.com

-Eric

*****************************************************

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 11:23:18 +1000
From: William
Subject: btlist: Age of Consent

Now that the Commons has approved the change to the Age of Consent how
long is likely to be before it goes to the Lords. Can they reject it?

William

*****************************************************

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 18:44:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: Donald
Subject: Re: btlist: Re: curious/age of consent laws

Since both the UK and Canada have similar laws likely the UK law for
appearing nude is the same as in Canada. The age of consent here is 14 for
male/female and 16 for the rest of us but to do anything in the nude it's
18 and a video or magazine company must have proof on file. Although I've
seen some guys in videos who would be hard pressed (no pun) to be able to
prove they are over 14 let alone 16. Oh well, it's nice to look at all
that young flesh.

On Wed, 1 Jul 1998, Bruce wrote:

*****************************************************

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 19:08:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Donald
Subject: Re: btlist: Age of Consent

British Common Law does state the House Of Lords can reject a bill passed
by the House of Commons. It is quite uncommon but like the UK, it's been
done in Canada and just recently. The Lords should be disbanded as should
the Senate in Canada. A useless bunch of old twits.

On Fri, 3 Jul 1998, William wrote:

> Now that the Commons has approved the change to the Age of Consent how
> long is likely to be before it goes to the Lords. Can they reject it?
>
> William
>

*****************************************************

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 23:04:46 -0400
From: Keith
Subject: btlist: Beautiful Thing Email Archive

Hey all,

I have finally gotten a chance to up load ALL emails from the original
list's begining in January
of 1997, up until where I left off at the end of June 1997. Tory was kind
enough to supply the emails
from the list's beginning, up until I joined in May of 1997, so now that
gap has been filled. I have
numbered these pages Email Archive A-M, and then the numbered pages cover
the period just before
I joined, courtesy of Sandra, and then the time period I have been on the
list.

I realize the utiltiy of the Archive is limited without being able to
search it for certain topics, or for
emails from certain authors, but given the limits of a free web page, I'm
not sure what I can do. They
are in chronological order, though, and as far as I can tell, the archive
is as complete as possible.

So stop by, and Enjoy!

Keith

*****************************************************

Date: Sat, 4 Jul 1998 15:08:46 +0100
From: Gavin
Subject: btlist: Yes I'm at home!

Hi all,

I just thought I'd send my first email from home to the list, it feels
so good to be doing it as well.

For those of you who have my addy in there address book please note my
new home addy.

gavin.

You can still email me at work if you like i'll still be reading that
mail as well, but i can now answer you all 24 hours a day.

Frightening thought eh!

Sorry to flood everyone else with this but it seemed the easiest way to
let people know.

Laters then,

Take care,

XXX.
--
Gavin

*****************************************************

From: "Neil
Subject: btlist: UK Pride 98
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 00:15:44 +0100

All,

Well UK Pride 98 (eventually) went well. I saw a few people wearing BT
t-shirts. I didn't know they were available!

To see some photos from the event visit:

I'm the one in the blue cap.

Love

Neil.
xxx

*****************************************************

From: "Neil
Subject: RE: btlist: UK Pride 98
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 00:29:13 +0100

Sorry I meant:

love and hugs

Neil
x

-----Original Message-----
Neil
Sent: 06 July 1998 00:16
Subject: btlist: UK Pride 98

All,

Well UK Pride 98 (eventually) went well. I saw a few people wearing BT
t-shirts. I didn't know they were available!

To see some photos from the event visit:

I'm the one in the blue cap.

Love

Neil.
xxx

*****************************************************

From: "Jamey
Subject: btlist: Merchandise etc!
Date: Sun, 05 Jul 1998 16:46:47 PDT

Hi everyone!
Well this is my first go at this! Just joined the list! Pride looks
really cool, i wanted to go this year but had no one to go with! Oh and
while i am at it... can anyone tell me how i can get hold of any
Beautiful Thing Merchandise, i am sure it would have done really well if
anything had ever come about it. Is there any chance of reviving it? i
would also like to get hold of some foreign BT posters if anyone can
help.
Thanks,
Jamie

*****************************************************

From: Tea1cup
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 00:33:09 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: UK Pride 98

Hey Neil,

I went to the People-Like-Us web site to see the pictures of UK pride and got
zip. What I mean is that I found the web site, but there were no pictures in
the galleries, of any type. In fact there was not much in that web page at
all. Any way, glad it was a fun event. Tampa's pridefest went real well, with
Chastity Bono as grand marshall and Greg Louganis making an appearance.

cheers, Bert

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 22:47:17 +1000
From: Andy
Subject: RE: btlist: UK Pride 98

Hey Neil,

I saw your Pride 98 pictures OK. Thanks for sharing that with us. Looks
like you had alot of fun.

Andy.

>Sorry I meant:
>
>
>love and hugs
>
>Neil

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 16:36:08 +0100 (BST)
From: Stu
Subject: btlist: Neil & Stu have met !

Hi al

It's stu here, and alongside me, is Neil also, aka Neil .

And for some reason, we decided to meet up, as the time I have off from
work is a little too far ahead, and not so sooner, and as we've been
phoning each other for the past 1 week, this week, we decided to meet.

Sorry Icouldn't make it to Pride, and also to the BT gathering, but this
is better, as I'm actually talking to the guy I wanted to know, first
time, irl.

see you all's around.

with love always

stu, and Neil.

*****************************************************

From: "Tim
Subject: btlist: BT Video Release
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 02:33:57 -0500

Hi.. I'm new here :) My name is Tim.. and I loved BT. i noticed that at
www.reel.com and other internet sources that the price to purhase BT went
down from $99 to like $14.95 but is listed as "pre-order". I'm assuming this
is becuase Sony is planning to finally release BT..but I was wondering if
anyone new a definate date as to when we'll be able to purchase it.

Thanks alot in advance,
Tim

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 00:24:03 +0200
From: Martijn
Subject: btlist: BT Products

Hiya All,

For those who placed an order at the 3th meeting
for some Beautiful Thing Products, the are at this
moment in production.More info will follow.

Luv,

Martijn
Dutch Beautiful Thing Fanclub

*****************************************************

From: Sven
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 20:00:14 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: Merchandise etc!

Welcome to the list, Jamie. I'm sure you'll have a bang-on time.
Luvs,
Steve

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 17:18:53 -0700
From: Jean
Subject: btlist: WELCOME

to the list, JAMIE! Please feel free to tell us a little about yourself if
you'd like, how you came to join the list or anything at all (or nothing for
that matter if that's your style!), any which way, we're very happy to have
you here. Jean.

*****************************************************

From: "Kent ."
Subject: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 17:27:25 PDT

Hi, Gang!

I have a question which arose in thinking about the scene
where Jamie tells Sandra that he knows Ste is "in love".
In the screenplay, Jamie is said to be going off to
school ["Jamie exits for school", page 61 of the Methuen edition], yet
Ste is obviously busy doing the family
laundry. It is implied that this scene may have happened as soon as
the day after the infamous party, where Ste was outed by Leah. In any
event, it happens the day after Sandra had a good night for tips, which
would more likely be the case on a Friday (payday, right?) or Saturday,
I suppose. A teenager's late night party is more likely to happen on
those days than on a Sunday, for example. For argument's sake, lets'
say the party was Friday night. Do English schools usually have
Saturday sessions? And even if so, isn't it a bit odd that Ste is
taking the day off school? For the *laundry*? (It sure doesn't seem
as if he is doing the laundry before going on his way to school.)

The reason this is curious is because the play has this same scene take
place in a bit more logical way-- Jamie and Ste are both said to be
going to school, and it is only because Ste sees Jamie, whom he just
treated so badly the preceding night (in the play, the two scenes
definitely take place one day after the other) that he retreats indoors,
eventually skipping school for that day (Act Two, Scene Three). No
washing mentioned as his reason for not being in school. So, what day
of the week was the party on? Do you think (in the movie of BT) it was
the day after the party when Jamie tells Sandra he knows Ste is in love?

Now, I have a vague feeling our Email Master Archivist, Keith, has done
the research on this (I feel it was mentioned in old emails, but can't
recall for certain). But, even so, does anybody have any thoughts on
this?

Kent
perplexed, even by the *simplest* of things at times!:)

*****************************************************

From: Tea1cup
Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 20:55:55 EDT
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Dear Kent,

In reference to the scene you are referring to.... Coincidentally, I just
finished watching the movie (again) and was doing calculations on when the
various scenes took place. That particular one, where Jamie tells Sandra that
Ste's in love, is definitely the day after the party thus it is Saturday
morning. At least by my calculations, that's what it seems to be.

cheers, Bert

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 21:20:05 -0400
From: Eric
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Hate to be a fly in the oinment, but I don't think you'll figure out
exactly what day the party was on, or what day the "little bird tells
me..." scene is (or that it is the next morning), because Jonathan never
really says. However, the morning scene *is* a schoolday, as both Jamie and
Ste are wearing their school kit. There is no reason why Ste shouldn't be
doing some laundry before heading off to school.

-Eric

At 08:55 PM 7/6/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Dear Kent,
>
>In reference to the scene you are referring to.... Coincidentally, I just
>finished watching the movie (again) and was doing calculations on when the
>various scenes took place. That particular one, where Jamie tells Sandra that
>Ste's in love, is definitely the day after the party thus it is Saturday
>morning. At least by my calculations, that's what it seems to be.
>
>cheers, Bert
>

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 22:32:15 -0400
From: Joe
Subject: btlist: Hello all..

HI... My name is Joe and I just subscribed to the list... I would like to
say that this is easily the BEST movie I had ever seen... My old all-time
favorite was Jeffrey, but this is awesome...
A little bio on me: I'm 19 (soon to be 20), a Junior at Penn State
University (in the USA), and very happily and gladly GAY :)

This movie pulled so hard on my heart strings... Just seeing the love
between Ste and Jamie... when they share glances... Sorry, I'll stop going
on, because you all know what I am talking about already (why else would
you have joined this list?? :) )

Anyway, I'm glad to be a part of the list...

One more thing.. where can i get posters and stuff? :)
thanks for any info in advance..

Talk to you all soon,
Joey :)

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 6 Jul 1998 23:36:12 -0400
From: "Carlos
Subject: btlist: Chicago bound!

Comrades,

Thanks for the advice you all have sent regarding hotels in the Chicago
area this coming weekend. As luck would have it, a friend of mine was here
in Washington this week and offered me her place to stay, so the
accommodation thing is taken care of.

I reserved my ticket to the play on Saturday night, July 12, so if any of
you are gonna be there, I'd love to get together. Otherwise y'all will just
have to bear with my review when I get to a place with a phone line I can
hook up my PowerBook to a few days later.

Many thanks,
/carlos

*****************************************************

Date: Mon, 06 Jul 1998 22:59:54 -0700
From: Jean
Subject: Re: btlist: Hello all..

Wow, I'm amazed at how this phenomenon continues:

>HI... My name is Joe

As with Jamie a few hours ago, again I'll say welcome to the list!

>Sorry, I'll stop going
>on, because you all know what I am talking about already (why else would
>you have joined this list?? :) )

Please don't be sorry and feel free to "go on" about this film, that's what
this list is for!

Jean.

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 17:11:04 +1000
From: William
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Dear Kent

I've always thought that the party was on Saturday and the 'Ste's in love' scene
the following Monday.

The party happens the same day that Jamie knicks the issue of Gay Times, which
doesn't seem to be a school day. The 'Ste's in love' scene is definitely a
weekday as Jamie is off to school, Ste is dressed for school and there has been a
mail delivery. Are there Saturday mail deliveries in the UK?

Sandra didn't work the night of the party but in the Nolene scene says she's had a
good night for tips. Not that I think this matters as she could be making an
excuse to give Ste some money but if it were the next day Ste would have known she
hadn't worked the previous night. Also she is doing the week's rota for the pub
which would be likely to be a Monday job.

William

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 01:52:46 -0700
From: tom
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Hi everyone. New to the list, but I had to throw in my two cents.

I don't think the coinciding of the party and the Nolene scene is
planned. It cannot be the next day because Sandra "had a good night for
tips" but wasn't working the night of the party. On the other hand, she
could just be giving Ste money out of pity/ because she is a nice
person.
But then he would know because Ste saw her at the party when she
wolloped Leah. The Nolene scene is not the day after the party. I hate
to bring everyone off. But there is a definite gap.

Tom

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 01:58:20 -0700
From: tom
Subject: btlist: Welcome to the world of love and laugter baby!

Hi my name is Tom from Fort Wayne, IN. I work at Target and I
have
now been out and proud for over two years. I recently bought BT and
have watched it three times since getting it six days ago. I hope I
don't wear out the tape.

I want to thank Eric Perkins for telling me about the list.

My love to all BT and Mama Cass fans.

Tom

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 02:14:59 -0700
From: tom
Subject: Re: btlist: BT Video Release

You can order BT for 1995 from Wolfe Video NOW!!

1800 getwolfe or www.wolfevideo.com

the net doesn't have a secure server.

*****************************************************

From: "Kent ."
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 02:24:04 PDT

On Tue, 07 Jul 1998,tom
wrote:

>Hi everyone. New to the list, but I had to throw in my two cents.

Thanks twice, then, for joining us, and for the "cents"! Welcome!
Also, welcome Jamey, Joey, Tim-- whew, it's hard keeping up-- but
everyone new here is definitely Welcome, Welcome, Welcome!

>I don't think the coinciding of the party and the Nolene scene is
>planned. It cannot be the next day because Sandra "had a good night
for
>tips" but wasn't working the night of the party. On the other hand,
she
>could just be giving Ste money out of pity/ because she is a nice
>person.

It's too early for BT research, (racing to get ready for work, but
couldn't ignore these responses to my query), but why is it definite
that Sandra didn't work the night of the party? In the UK, pubs close
at 11, but couldn't the party have started after that, meaning Sandra
had time to work, get loads of tips, come home to find Jamie going out,
need that nice bath, etc, all on the same night? Anyway, you are right
(both you and William) that maybe Sandra just gave Ste the money because
she is a nice person, of course.

>But then he would know because Ste saw her at the party when she
>wolloped Leah. The Nolene scene is not the day after the party. I
hate
>to bring everyone off. But there is a definite gap.

Not "brought off" at all-- if I wasn't interested in opinions, I
wouldn't have asked my question, and every voice is nice to hear.
Thanks, Bert, Tom and William (and the ever-wise Eric-- hi, Eric! :))
for taking the time to respond! :)

Kent

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 20:23:09 +1000
From: William
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Hi there

Kent . wrote:

> It's too early for BT research, (racing to get ready for work, but
> couldn't ignore these responses to my query),

Hope it will be/was a good day at work.

I've been thinking about it and you're right - Sandra could well have worked
that night.

Ste and the others were on their way to the party in daylight. The rest of the
events happen after sunset. If sunset in the UK in summer is fairly late (8pm
or later?) then Sandra would have had plenty of time to go to work, come home
etc.

William

*****************************************************

From: "D K
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 12:46:50 +0100

Hello William,

My name is David and I recently joined the bt fanlist. Your
query re the party sceene will have to wait a while for me to follow it
through but I couldn't resist letting you know that summer in the UK this
year has been cancelled. June was one of the wettest months on record and
July is rapidly turning into October. Now I've got the weather off my
chest, Hello to everyone at btlist.

----------
> From: William
> Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
> Date: 07 July 1998 11:23
>
> Hi there
>
> Kent . wrote:
>
> > It's too early for BT research, (racing to get ready for work, but
> > couldn't ignore these responses to my query),
>
> Hope it will be/was a good day at work.
>
> I've been thinking about it and you're right - Sandra could well have
worked
> that night.
>
> Ste and the others were on their way to the party in daylight. The rest
of the
> events happen after sunset. If sunset in the UK in summer is fairly late
(8pm
> or later?) then Sandra would have had plenty of time to go to work, come
home
> etc.
>
> William
>
>

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 08:07:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Eric
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

>It's too early for BT research, (racing to get ready for work, but
>couldn't ignore these responses to my query), but why is it definite
>that Sandra didn't work the night of the party? In the UK, pubs close
>at 11, but couldn't the party have started after that, meaning Sandra
>had time to work, get loads of tips, come home to find Jamie going out,
>need that nice bath, etc, all on the same night?

OK, Kent.... not likely that Jamie would be going out after 11:00. For
Sandra to have been home from work already before Jamie went out, it would
have to be pushing midnight. When Jamie (in the previous scene) looks out
his window and sees Ste and his friends heading toward the party (one might
assume they were heading to the party) it was still light out. Also, on
Jamie's exit to the party he says "I won't be late" and Sandra says "I
know." If it was 11:00 - 12:00 it would *already* be late! And remember,
when Jamie comes in late from the Gloucester it's "half one" and she is
angry he was out so late. Therefore, I doubt that she would allow him to go
out after 11:00.

I think it perfectly reasonable to assume that the "Nolene" scene is not
the next morning after the party. Jamie seems to have had some time to
adjust to Ste's vicious "Get your fucking queer hands off me!" and put it
in proper perspective, and both boys are definitely dressed for school. It
does seem unlikely that the party would be on a school night.

-Eric

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 13:57:58 +0100 (BST)
From: Stu
Subject: Re: btlist: Hello all..

Hi Jo, and welcome to the Btlist.

It's an honour to see so many new folks, joining this list, and you never
know, maybe there will be a sequel to the BT film. I think there should
be one, as all the talent that has been put into the stories, from the
writers, from this list is too much to ignore. I've read almost every one
of the stories, and love them all, and sure you will also.

If Jonathan does read this btlist, maybe he should think of writing a
sequel, using the work of the bt story writers.

Any ideas ??? / comments ???

To me, BT is my life, and I'd never have come out, if it wasn't for the
film.

with hugs and love

stu.
x

On Mon, 6 Jul 1998, Joe wrote:

> HI... My name is Joe and I just subscribed to the list... I would like to
> say that this is easily the BEST movie I had ever seen... My old all-time
> favorite was Jeffrey, but this is awesome...
> A little bio on me: I'm 19 (soon to be 20), a Junior at Penn State
> University (in the USA), and very happily and gladly GAY :)
>
> This movie pulled so hard on my heart strings... Just seeing the love
> between Ste and Jamie... when they share glances... Sorry, I'll stop going
> on, because you all know what I am talking about already (why else would
> you have joined this list?? :) )
>
> Anyway, I'm glad to be a part of the list...
>
> One more thing.. where can i get posters and stuff? :)
> thanks for any info in advance..
>
> Talk to you all soon,
> Joey :)
>
>
>

*****************************************************

From: "Joshua
Subject: btlist: Umm... The timing of the party and a few other tidbits of my opinions...
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 09:01:33 -0400

I'm totally one to say that the party was on Saturday evening and that
Sandra didn't work for various reasons, but that she'd worked Sunday instead
(maybe covering for someone). That would definitely mean the "Nolene" scene
took place on Monday because, as most of us can see, the two boys are off to
school (or something school-related). I think that when Ste sees Jamie, he
realizes how hard it would be to make an appearance in school and decides to
bunk off. I do know that Jamie was probably happy because he was expecting
to see Ste in school, and that may explain his optimism (at having an
opportunity to excuse speaking to Ste).

That's my opinion on that... but I did have something else I'd noticed in
the readings ...

Somehow along the way we all came to the conclusion (via the movie scene
where Leah says Trevor heard them) that the boys' rooms are snug together...
but this is impossible. At least it's impossible in the movie... My
reasoning for this is because in the scene where Ste is awaiting Trevor's
discovery of the scuff marks on his shoes, you see the door behind Trevor,
making the stairwell on the (if the rooms were next to each other) wrong
side of the flat. See all the flats I could see were made completely the
same; Leah's and Jamie's weren't mirror images, yet were the exact same
layout... hence so would Ste's be. Thus, according to the movie, Ste's bed
would actually be VERY far from Jamie's and there would be no way, unless
Trevor was in his father's room, that he could have heard Ste and Jamie
together. It is possible that Leah meant that Trevor heard from Ronnie, or
that Trevor had just been saying it... and that's why she could say it
wasn't true (because Trevor wouldn't really know)... I'm not sure, but it's
been irking me for a long time that we all think this yet it doesn't seem
possible. If I'm wrong, someone PLEASE tell me how I'm looking (in the
movie) wrong and seeing this =o)

Thanks all,
Joshy

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 09:37:09 -0400
From: "Keith
Subject: Re: btlist: Hello all..

Joe,

Welcome to the list! Here's where I got my copy of a movie poster from:
(as far as I know they still have them in stock)

Which campus of Penn State do you go to? I didn't go there myself, but half my
family either works there or attended there, and since I live in Philadelphia, we sometimes
get up there for football games.

Movie Poster Warehouse
1875 Leslie St.
North York, Ontario Canada M3B 2M5

1-416-391-0133

They also have a website that you can order from.

www.movieposter.com

The price is 30.00 + shipping.

Keith
(yes, I'm still alive...)

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 09:36:19 -0500
From: Gary
Subject: Re: btlist: Welcome to the world of love and laugter baby!

tom wrote:
>
> Hi my name is Tom from Fort Wayne, IN. I work at Target and I
> have
> now been out and proud for over two years. I recently bought BT and
> have watched it three times since getting it six days ago. I hope I
> don't wear out the tape.
>
> I want to thank Eric Perkins for telling me about the list.
>
> My love to all BT and Mama Cass fans.
>
Welcome to the list, Tom! The BT phenomenon keeps growing and growing.
I'm trying to get together a "postscript" for the paper I presented in
April about the BT internet phenomenon, mainly dealing with response to
the paper _and_ the degree to which the "phenomenon" continues.

Having some new folks just recently join the list and seeing continuing
new contributors to the BT-Stories list indicates that this film and the
online community it has created will apparently endure for some time.

Gary

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 09:43:44 -0500
From: Gary
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

D K wrote:
>
> Hello William,
>
> My name is David and I recently joined the bt fanlist. Your
> query re the party sceene will have to wait a while for me to follow it
> through but I couldn't resist letting you know that summer in the UK this
> year has been cancelled. June was one of the wettest months on record and
> July is rapidly turning into October. Now I've got the weather off my
> chest, Hello to everyone at btlist.

Sorry to hear about your weather. The folks down in Florida would have
appreciated a month like y'all just had. In fact, so would we in
Tennessee. It rained last Saturday night for about 20 minutes, the first
rain in four weeks. Now it's back to about 99 degrees (F) with a heat
index of 115. Good weather for staying indoors and watching BT. :)

Question for the Brits on the list: If pubs close at 11, are there any
places (dance clubs, etc.) that are open later that still serve alcohol?

I was in Atlanta weekend before last for Pride and we didn't hit the
clubs until after 11, because nobody goes out until at least 11.
Closing time is 4 a.m. except Saturday night (Sunday morning) when it's
3 a.m. One club we went to is open 24 hours a day. We quit both nights
about 4 a.m. Surely British nightlife doesn't end at 11 p.m.

Gary

*****************************************************

From: "Neil
Subject: RE: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 15:59:50 +0100

Gary,

English opening hours are a bit strange. However in a metropolis like
London there are many pubs open until well after 11pm particularly in Gay
Soho and on weekends. Then most of the clubs are open until 5am or 6am
(some don't open until 4am and go on till God knows when) although it is
generally illegal to sell alcohol after 2am. The culture in Britain is to
start out earlier particularly in the provinces.

Hope this helps.

Neil.

-----Original Message-----
Gary
Sent: 7 July 1998 15:44
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

D K wrote:
>
> Hello William,
>
> My name is David Kilgallon and I recently joined the bt fanlist. Your
> query re the party sceene will have to wait a while for me to follow it
> through but I couldn't resist letting you know that summer in the UK this
> year has been cancelled. June was one of the wettest months on record and
> July is rapidly turning into October. Now I've got the weather off my
> chest, Hello to everyone at btlist.

Question for the Brits on the list: If pubs close at 11, are there any
places (dance clubs, etc.) that are open later that still serve alcohol?

Gary

*****************************************************

From: "Gray"
Subject: btlist: Hello to the new guys
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 16:14:44 +0100

I'd just like to add my welcomes to the one's that have allready been =
sent and to say, it's great to have all these new people on board. So =
big hello to:

Jamie, Joey, Tom, Tim and David K

You'll probably find that you'll really love this list, it's great, the =
people here are so,so nice! So once again WELCOME!

Gray

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 10:23:46 -0500
From: Brian
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Hi all,

At 09:43 07/07/98 -0500, you wrote:
>
>Question for the Brits on the list: If pubs close at 11, are there any
>places (dance clubs, etc.) that are open later that still serve alcohol?
>

Oh no of course not, we all are all in bed by 11:30. Sorry I mean ...

Yes there are places to go, as I understand it anywhere, that is a private
club is ok, I.e. anywhere that charges an
entrance fee, which covers night clubs. Some pubs, especially in rural
areas, get around the law by having a "lock in",
that is locking the door of the pub, and declaring it a private party,
which is fine. Also on special occasions pubs
can apply for extended licencing hours, e.g. New Years Eve.

The 11pm closing law, is left over from World War I. The authorities did
not want the workers in the munition factories
not to give their best due to excesses of the previous evening! So there
passed a law forcing pubs to close at 11pm.
But the law was never repealed after the war!

But fear not, good old Tony (Blair PM) is reviewing the law and hopefuly it
will be repealed next year.

All is not lost, however, the law only applies in England and Wales and not
in Scotland (I am not sure about N. Ireland)
So you can always cross the border.

>Gary
>

Hope this helps,

Brian.

(A Brit abroad)
P.S. Hi all, I'm new to the list as well.

*****************************************************

From: jmcs
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 17:06:33 +0000
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

Hi everybody again!

Kent and then Eric wrote:

> >It's too early for BT research, (racing to get ready for work, but
> >couldn't ignore these responses to my query), but why is it definite
> >that Sandra didn't work the night of the party? In the UK, pubs close
> >at 11, but couldn't the party have started after that, meaning Sandra
> >had time to work, get loads of tips, come home to find Jamie going out,
> >need that nice bath, etc, all on the same night?
>
> OK, Kent.... not likely that Jamie would be going out after 11:00. For
> Sandra to have been home from work already before Jamie went out, it would
> have to be pushing midnight. When Jamie (in the previous scene) looks out
> his window and sees Ste and his friends heading toward the party (one might
> assume they were heading to the party) it was still light out. Also, on
> Jamie's exit to the party he says "I won't be late" and Sandra says "I
> know." If it was 11:00 - 12:00 it would *already* be late! And remember,
> when Jamie comes in late from the Gloucester it's "half one" and she is
> angry he was out so late. Therefore, I doubt that she would allow him to go
> out after 11:00.

After a few hundred times of watching it, I'm familiar with every frill,
poster, pic, picture, plant, wallpaper and small thing that appears in BT,
and that includes clocks. When Jamie arrives at the party it's 21:08
hours. How do I know? Watch carefully when Jamie's searching for Ste in
the crowd and once he's located him, he starts moving between people;
there's a clock hanging up the wall. It's 21:08 hours.

Take care.

A hopeless Sandra.

*****************************************************

From: jmcs
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 17:08:43 +0000
Subject: btlist: Lotsa happy things!!

Hi everybody!

First of all, Joey, Tim, Tom, welcome to the list!!!! And it's getting
better, fellas!!! This is GREAT!!!!

Kent, about your question, well, I think the party tooks place a Friday
night. It's quite possible Jamie knicked the Gay Times after school and
he's reading it in his bedroom when Ste passes by with his mates when the
sun's already setting. Sandra may have the Friday off (these kind of jobs
don't usually stick to the usual free weekends). About the balcony scene,
I think it's pretty obvious it's a school day, but beats me if I know
which day it is. If it's Monday, maybe Sandra is referring to last
Saturday night when she got all the tips and she slipped. Who knows?
Errrr... not much of a help, am I? :(

I did my best, I swear!!!

Again, to all the new members (and to the ones we still don't know about,
but are here in lurker mode!) welcome!!

Take care,

Sandra.

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 12:32:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: Eric
Subject: Re: btlist: Umm... The timing of the party and a few other
tidbits of my opinions...

>Somehow along the way we all came to the conclusion (via the movie scene
>where Leah says Trevor heard them) that the boys' rooms are snug together...
>but this is impossible. At least it's impossible in the movie...
If I'm wrong, someone PLEASE tell me how I'm looking (in the
>movie) wrong and seeing this =o)

You're not seeing it wrong. In fact, Ste & Trevor's room couldn't be on the
*other* end either! It's not right *either* way if all the flats are the
same. I had heard that Ste & Trevor's room was actually a set, and this
makes the most sense, as far as the room's orientation is concerned.
However, the rooms *are* supposed to be back to back, even if, in reality,
they could not have been.

-Eric

*****************************************************

From: "Warwick
Subject: Re: btlist: Merchandise etc!
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 17:39:16 +0100

Jamie
Im sure that loads of us would have loved to take you to Pride
Never be afraid to ask.
If you in London on the 1st of August we will take you to Summer Rites

Warwick

----------
> From: Jamey
> Subject: btlist: Merchandise etc!
> Date: 06 July 1998 00:46
>
> Hi everyone!
> Well this is my first go at this! Just joined the list! Pride looks
> really cool, i wanted to go this year but had no one to go with! Oh and
> while i am at it... can anyone tell me how i can get hold of any
> Beautiful Thing Merchandise, i am sure it would have done really well if
> anything had ever come about it. Is there any chance of reviving it? i
> would also like to get hold of some foreign BT posters if anyone can
> help.
> Thanks,
> Jamie
>
>

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 09:42:48 -0700
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
From: "DJK"

Gary,
You have sun??! Send me some, PLEASE.....Re your question about
quintessential British nightlife. Speaking as a provincial (though I
do live in a city) 32 year old has been it is true to say that there
are clubs which open when the pubs close. Many of them stay open
until 2 am and if you're over 25 then you tend to stick out like a
vicar at a tarts party. Most people hit the clubs at the weekend
and though I hate to admit it the times that I do venture out
clubbing I tend to go to London or Paris. The clubs in the
provincial cities are normally overpriced, over-rate and one often
sticks to the carpet if you remain still for more than 30 seconds.
Aren't you just desperate to visit some? ;-)
Re: BT : Did Jamie and Ste go to Hampstead H (Make your own kind
of music)?
Don't forget, you send me sun, I'll send you rain.
Cheerio

>From: "Gary"
>Date: 07/07/98 09:43:44
>Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
>
>D K wrote:
>>
>> Hello William,
>>
>> My name is David and I recently joined the bt fanlist.
>Your
>> query re the party sceene will have to wait a while for me to
>follow it
>> through but I couldn't resist letting you know that summer in the
>UK this
>> year has been cancelled. June was one of the wettest months on
>record and
>> July is rapidly turning into October. Now I've got the weather
>off my
>> chest, Hello to everyone at btlist.
>
>Sorry to hear about your weather. The folks down in Florida would
>have
>appreciated a month like y'all just had. In fact, so would we in
>Tennessee. It rained last Saturday night for about 20 minutes, the
>first
>rain in four weeks. Now it's back to about 99 degrees (F) with a
>heat
>index of 115. Good weather for staying indoors and watching BT. :)
>
>Question for the Brits on the list: If pubs close at 11, are there
>any
>places (dance clubs, etc.) that are open later that still serve
>alcohol?
>
>I was in Atlanta weekend before last for Pride and we didn't hit the
>clubs until after 11, because nobody goes out until at least 11.
>Closing time is 4 a.m. except Saturday night (Sunday morning) when
>it's
>3 a.m. One club we went to is open 24 hours a day. We quit both
>nights
>about 4 a.m. Surely British nightlife doesn't end at 11 p.m.
>
>Gary
>

*****************************************************

From: "Jamey
Subject: btlist: Thanks for the welcome!
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 10:21:53 PDT

Hi everyone!
Well it is great to have such a welcome! You all seem really nice
People! Anyway I guess the reason i joined this list is because i am mad
about 'Beautiful Thing'! Totally mad. It has helped me sort a lot of
things out, i am only young myself (i turned 17 on the 5th of July). I
too have gone through shit at school like jamie in the film. School is
so bad! I just need to find a Ste, then i will be happy whatever!

Anyway you know a bit about me now, anymore questions just ask me! Oh
and i can't wait to get my hands on some more BT merchandise (i have
already got 8 posters in my bedroom!). This list seems really great.
Thanks for the welcome,
Jamie/Jamey

(as you prefer! (i was christened Jamey but everyone spells it the other
way.. including me most of the time!))

*****************************************************

From: "Jamey
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 10:26:41 PDT

Hi there!
Some schools in England have lessons on Saturday, but they tend to be
the Public, Grammer, Private schools. I doubt if jamie would be going to
school on a Saturday!
Hope that helps a bit! If it doesn't ask me again!
Jamie

*****************************************************

From: "Jamey
Subject: Re: btlist: Welcome to the world of love and laugter baby!
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 10:31:22 PDT

Hi there Tom!
Well i have worn two tapes out! I have just bought another one today
because they are in the sales :-)!
Jamie

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 12:37:04 -0500
From: Brian
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?

At 10:26 07/07/98 PDT, you wrote:
>
>Hi there!
>Some schools in England have lessons on Saturday, but they tend to be
>the Public, Grammer, Private schools. I doubt if jamie would be going to
>school on a Saturday!
>Hope that helps a bit! If it doesn't ask me again!
>Jamie
>

A note of speakers of American English. A public school in the British
sense is a type of private school. (Yeah
its crazy I know.) A grammar school is a high school with an entrance exam
(mostly privately run, these days.)
Public schools in the American sense are called "State schools."

appologies if you knew all that already,

Brian.

*****************************************************

From: "Jamie
Subject: btlist: Sorry about the change of address!!!!!
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 13:50:59 PDT

Hi there all!
Well it is Jamie/Jamey with a new e-mail address! Sorry about the
confusion but my other account couldn't take all the mail!!! I wasn't
expecting so many people to be fans of BT just like me! Anyway this one
will be my 'BT' only address!! :-). I am not sure why i joined from the
other one anyway! I normally reserve that one for people i have known
for sometime and aren't about to check me out! I must trust all BT fans
or something!
Jamie

*****************************************************

From: jmcs
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 21:35:16 +0000
Subject: btlist: Errrr...

Hi again!!!

Sorry for so many messages in one day, but I love it!!! Besides, I *HAD*
to say it:

Jamie/Jamey and Brian, welcome to the list!!!! Oh, it's so great to see
so many people here!!!! I'm curious to know how many of us are in the
lists. One hundred, maybe?

You're amongst friends here, welcome and join the joyride!!

Take care,

Sandra.

*****************************************************

Date: Tue, 7 Jul 1998 15:28:36 -0700
Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
From: "DJK"

Ummm, THAT party?

Is there a day by day follow through from the night Ste goes to the
boxing with his dad and brother through to the infamous party? If
so, boxing Saturday night. Ste stays with Jamie the same night
(Sat) and Leah sees Ste leave early Sunday morning when she returns
early Sunday from having painted the town red the previous night.
Party Sunday night. Sandra can't have worked. By the time Sandra
arrives at the house to "crown" Leah she has just got out of the
bath (her hair is more or less still wet) and no way would she go to
work at post 10 pm on Sunday night, esp. considering the pubs close
at 10.30/11.00. Re: Jamie's purchase of gay times in the corner
shop. Corner shops open on Sunday for the Sunday papers, so no
problem there. Call me old-fashioned but Ste was probably doing the
washing because, as every good housewife knows, Monday is wash day!
Sandra's comment about "tips last night". Who knows, with her
working hours it's no surprise she was confused! Though I agree
that she probably said it just to get Ste to take the money. A
throw-away phrase. Not that all this is particularly important.
The essence of the film certainly doesn't lie in its timing.
Interesting though. Thank you Kent and everyone who contributed.

"You have to know cold to appreciate warmth" Said by Jeanne Moreau
(my fav. actress on Rub Wax (BBC2 last night"

David.

>From: "Eric
>Date: 07/07/98 08:07:25
>Subject: Re: btlist: When Did The Party Happen?
>
>
>>It's too early for BT research, (racing to get ready for work, but
>>couldn't ignore these responses to my query), but why is it
>definite
>>that Sandra didn't work the night of the party? In the UK, pubs
>close
>>at 11, but couldn't the party have started after that, meaning
>Sandra
>>had time to work, get loads of tips, come home to find Jamie going
>out,
>>need that nice bath, etc, all on the same night?
>
>OK, Kent.... not likely that Jamie would be going out after 11:00.
>For
>Sandra to have been home from work already before Jamie went out,
>it would
>have to be pushing midnight. When Jamie (in the previous scene)
>looks out
>his window and sees Ste and his friends heading toward the party
>(one might
>assume they were heading to the party) it was still light out.
>Also, on
>Jamie's exit to the party he says "I won't be late" and Sandra says
>"I
>know." If it was 11:00 - 12:00 it would *already* be late! And
>remember,
>when Jamie comes in late from the Gloucester it's "half one" and
>she is
>angry he was out so late. Therefore, I doubt that she would allow
>him to go
>out after 11:00.
>
>I think it perfectly reasonable to assume that the "Nolene" scene
>is not
>the next morning after the party. Jamie seems to have had some time
>to
>adjust to Ste's vicious "Get your fucking queer hands off me!" and
>put it
>in proper perspective, and both boys are definitely dressed for
>school. It
>does seem unlikely that the party would be on a school night.
>
>
>

*****************************************************

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